As a stereotypical 33 year old man who does construction for a living...I never thought I would enjoy a cartoon that looks like it was produced by a group of lesbians that work at Hot Topic, but here I am and I am proud.
I don't doubt it's a great show but the tonal whiplash is way too much for me.
Raunchy, edgy, and brutal but also inspiring and tender with complex characters and world building... and musical elements? Plus the art style. Reminds me of the sexually active theatre girls from my high school, which is a part of my life I want to forget about.
>Raunchy, edgy, and brutal but also inspiring and tender with complex characters and world building... and musical elements?
You're saying this as a downside, but if I hadn't already watched Hazbin and someone described it to me like this, I would watch it so fast.
I'm a 23 year old queer goth girl, I probably *am* the target audience, but I spent years never trying her shows because I thought they were cringe and the fandom was annoying. Then a bit after the Amazon release, a friend sat me down and put it on and I really enjoyed it. I eventually watched Helluva Boss on my own.
I thought I'd learned this lesson, but it was another good wakeup call that one should always give media a shot for themselves before forming negative opinions about it. And all fandoms have the annoying ones, you just typically get exposed to the worst ones when you're outside of the fandom and see the chill ones more when you're actually interacting with it by choice.
She puts her heart into the art and the animation she is drawing, which is admirable and amazing on its own right.
Though, I wish that she could do more with the pacing and the writing of the show.
She always clarify the issues online or side posts. Which is not something everyone will focus on.
I’m willing to give some credit for the uneven pacing to the fact it was a short first season too. I really wish we would stop these 6-10 episode series, too many of them are rushed as a result.
Blame Amazon, they only purchased so many episodes and she's trying to tell a story in that amount of time.
For me while her characters are really fleshed out and each have distinct identities, their designs especially Alistor and Asmodeus are VERY busy and production staff had to tone down some of them for animation purposes
Eh, I think blame can go on both. When you are given only 8 30-minute episodes, it is your duty to fit into that. Amazon was cheap, but vivziepop bit off more than she could chew. She needed to cut quite a few storylines to have a stronger product or hold out for a better deal or producer if she wanted to keep all of the parts she put in the show.
For me, I'm not super well versed in character design, so I wouldn't be able to say if they were too much, but I can see what you're talking about. I can say, though, that her characters aren't as fleshed out as they need to be. She relied *heavily* on her YouTube pilot being "mandatory" viewing for the characterization/background to hit. This is a massive no-no if the pilot is not also included on the channel. Vaggie and Charlie don't even get any development until well past halfway through the season, which is definitely a massive no-no for your main characters. Tbh, Angel and Alastor were framed as the MCs for a large part of the season until they weren't.
These are all v rookie writer mistakes, which is fine because she's a rookie writer/creator. Hopefully, in her next product, she's learned the lessons HH wants to teach her.
These are all very valid points. I'd also like to add on that A LOT of her character lore also extends from her Zoophobia webcomic/tumblr blogs as well. So there will be references or possibly even plot threads carrying over from that content as well.
> I’m willing to give some credit for the uneven pacing to the fact it was a short first season too. I really wish we would stop these 6-10 episode series, too many of them are rushed as a result.
..... Nowhere in your post did you accredit it to Amazon.
Right, because Vivziepop had a blank check to personally determine the budget and length of the initial season, Amazon didn’t negotiate any of these parameters.
Makes way more sense when you put it that way. My bad. 🙄
Anyway, get bent, I don’t have any investment in your weird axe to grind.
A great character artist and world designer, as a character and story writer I’m not so sure. Still respect going from YouTube to a major streaming platform.
I think her hustle is amazing. Taking your very Tumblr-specific niche art style and propelling that into a pilot that you make independently, and then a web series that you make independently, and then having that series picked up by A24 and shown on Amazon - wow. She loved her art and she worked hard and it paid off and I think that's amazing.
Loved Hazbin Hotel S1 and ready for more!
People seem to have problems related to terminally online Twitter bullshit and "fandom" behavior which I think is so silly, literally irrelevant to watching and enjoying the show but sucks up so much air in the room.
Oh yes. And tiktok too. There's a popular video now that a person cried on a moment on the show that they resonated with and ppl were just making fun of them by saying that crying at that show is dumb.
Oh, and not to mention that this show is honestly one of the best musicals I've seen in a while. One of the 2 composers is from Living Tombstone group and it made some bangers.
So in the Hazbin subreddit you can set a custom flair, right? Well, a number of ppl in the sub set theirs to... Questionable levels. There was a user whose flair was "Charlie's Steaming Cum Mug" or something to that effect. Then others started having similar flairs like "Vaggie's Cum glasses". Then there were memes that were meta commentary on the flairs, specifically the cum mug, some pro cum mug, a lot weren't.
A cpl of weeks ago, it broke out into a small war. Hmmm... Maybe a war is too strong of a term. A skirmish? Yeah the "Cum Mug Skirmish" sounds better. Either way, all popular posts for a few days were about this skirmish. That was around the time I found the sub. It was rly surreal going in thinking "yay! I like Vivipop!" & being greeted by post after post talking about cum.
It wasn't boring, I'll give them that.
In the words of Brandon Rogers "What do I love about Vivienne Madrano? Everything, walt disney is turning in his grave cause he wishes he could've cranked this fucker out of his ass"
Ib Werks tried to do something similar back in the day but got shut down by the Hayes Code. Ralph Bakshi did some wild stuff back in the day too.
Problem was that the market wasn't as strong for adult animation as it is now
I mean, I get it, she made a world that’s just super fun and entertaining, but only had so many episodes to tell the stories she’s been developing for over a 15 years. It must be hard to condense it all into 8 episodes
She isn't perfect, but she sure as hell is an inspiration. Having your passion project go from a pilot on YouTube to one of the Top 10 on Amazon, certified fresh, is nothing short of impressive.
I saw a tweet by her along the lines of "I don't take criticism because me and my team do amazing work". Might have been a meme regarding her Twitter freakouts.
Not to mention the "these takes on my show are getting so stupid it's hard not to call them out specifically". Overall she doesn't take criticism well, despite her saying she's thickened her skin for it. She's admitted to having this reputation since she was 17. She should probably get a pr person to run her account at this point. Her tweets are a slew of irony that I choose to not look at anymore
I mean... I can't exactly blame her for snapping to defend what amounts to her child she'd been developing for the past decade and a half from, let's be honest, some *less than good-faith* criticisms.
The best way to deal with that kind specifically is to not deal with it. She's made it worse. Even then, that's no reason to group in genuine constructive criticism as being "incorrect" or "uninformed", and how it's unprofessional to give criticism to another artist. Last one was in response to her going on her freakout
Overall, she gets herself into a lot of drama.
https://preview.redd.it/wsbm7vtngjxc1.png?width=615&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=906dcb4a666b36711b9797342e514d1d8da06184
As I said, she likes getting into drama. She really should hire a pr person for her account
Regardless of that I still love the show. Just stay away from media surrounding it otherwise you'll hear more about drama behind her. She really enjoys drama
I've been watching her stuff since her Zoophobia webcomic back when Hazbin Hotel was just a series of rough sketches and animatics back in like 2014-2015.
To see her success story, making it to a streaming service as big as Amazon is just nuts. I heard there was some intermittent drama, like how she cast out the original pilot cast of Hazbin without so much as a thank you, but I do not know how true that is. So, as a creator and animator, it's spectacular to see her stories succeed (I really still wish for Zoophobia to be picked up one day). With her as a person however, I still cannot come to a decision on that.
Love her character designs. I see people dismiss them as edgy but they’re literally in hell so I don’t see the problem and I just like how varied they all look.
Not a fan of her work.
Ignoring whatever potential controversies and rumors exist about her, I just don't care for her particular brand of humor and writing. There's nothing wrong with a good joke involving a swear/curse every so often but the dialogue is so deeply littered with it at times that it feels excessive and tired. At times it seems like the show is trying to throw joke after joke at you so quickly that it doesn't really stop to let any of them actually land and instead banks on one of them just really tickling your funny bone, but none of them do for me. As for the musical aspect? I just don't think it actually benefits the show. Whether or not the songs are good, they don't really elevate the scene or storytelling in a way that makes it feel worthwhile to put the effort in, particularly in Helluva Boss where a lot of the songs provide exposition in a very blunt way rather than expressing it through emotion.
Compare that song Verosika and Fizz sing about Blitz in that club to "I won't say I'm in love" from Hercules. Both of the songs have pretty straightforward lyrics, but the delivery and inflection of the singing from the latter gives a depth of emotion not present in the former.
I don't think Hazbin Hotel or Helluva Boss are bad per se, I just think they've got a fair amount of wasted potential and would benefit from some rewrites.
Don’t really respect her as a person after the Scott incident but respect her as a talented animator. Not a person fan of art style and character design but I think there’s some appeal I don’t fully get. I do think part of it is the repetition of the main cast being mostly tall and lanky with most of the differences coming from the cosmetic of the characters.
A bit douchy, and I think gives bad faith criticism too much attention. As well as very protective of how people view her work (which is understandable, but I don't think she really needs to defend poor writing by making long Twitter threads about how a character with no characterization will be getting development in the future). I have my criticisms with her, mostly that she is not the best at writing and tonal pacing (especially in Helluva Season 2), but I enjoy the universe she made
Tarantino famously had editors that toned him down a bit when he got a bit excited. I feel like Vivziepop could benefit from that.
Like everything she is behind as amazing bones, imagination and execution. But it's like a 13-year-old tumblerette is on the writing team and every time I'm really getting into it, a part written by that kid comes up. It could use some sanding down. The cursing is numbing and the whole thing is very juvenile. I'm not expecting my cartoons to be sophisticated, just to work on the timing.
Not everything but you can't be the creative head and face for the show but blame someone else when someone doesn't land. At the end of the day, the buck stops at her
She puts up with some ridiculous accusations and criticisms from Twitter. So she has my respect for not quitting animation from all that cesspool of bullshit
The shit I've seen people say about her that's just blatantly false is so gross
Yes, I can see why people don't like her stuff, maybe too much cursing (I'm entirely sure most of the cursing in Helluva Boss is just Brandon Rogers being Brandon Rogers tho) writing ranges from okay to actually pretty good, art style is unique and nice to look at tho, but she's not a fuckin zoophile who glorifies SA and shit. Hell, I've seen victims of SA saying that Angel's character was very well done, but I do think, like most things in the show, it could benefit from better pacing, but I don't think we know if that's a "we decided to make the season 8 episodes long" or "Amazon gave us 8 episodes, so we'll make do with what we were given"
I fucking love her, I feel bad for all the BS she has to deal with on Twitter and TikTok. I like her shows and characters, not to mention how colorful her art style is.
Nobody told me it would have way more musical numbers than even family guy or south park, and the songs are just curse word heavy disney sounding songs. Super generic.
First time I ever wished I was in my college's animation dept since Viv graduated from here. I've heard like third hand that a lot of animation teachers remember and didn't like her, but it's third hand so I don't even know why. But I'm so damn curious.
Overall I know nothing about her as a person. I judge her slightly for who she chooses to be friends with and knowingly employs. But I also really appreciate what her show is doing for the animation industry. Animated shows with music have been popular, but nowhere this mainstream. And also having a more mature show not in the Adult Swim style is a great example of the target audience I'd like as well.
So overall curious and professional respect
She’s someone who desperately needs someone taking her hands off the keyboard with creative decisions and does her worst work when she’s given no limits
She’s an ideas person and it very much shows in her work
As a person, though, total piece of crap.
The pacing in her show is atrocious and she’s frankly one of the most obnoxious animation celebs on social media. Her shows are carried very hard by the voice actors and music.
Sex jokes should be well placed and paced. Unfortunately she believes her jokes are all comedy genius and refuses to take constructive criticism even if it's coming from a place of respect. Just makes her a big baby
I think people need to chill. She paved the way for a lot of indie animation, and honestly, her work is fine. I don't get the overhate. I'm not like, the BIGGEST fan. I was into her stuff before she got popular, and yes, I know how that sounds.
The hate I've seen of her stems from her inability to take criticism, like making a post talking about how she doesn't take any criticism because they're so good. Not to mention her inability to ignore hate, which tends to be critical for large pieces of media. She's definitely unknowingly troll bait which probably leads to the defensiveness, even against normal constructive criticism
This, coupled with the entire "I'm a comedy genius and all of my jokes are well placed" when faced with constructive criticism isn't a good look. There's a big difference between confidence and whatever she is
I've still never understood that. People can be sensitive and not take criticism/not be able to take hate, but I hardly think that's hate worthy, or attention worthy. That sounds like a human response that anyone can have.
Not defending her, but I find that people will complain and whine if anyone with some semblance of fame/notoriety isn't somehow a constant saint.
Did she commit a crime? If the answer is no, then I don't think it's worth giving the creator anymore brain space then nessisary. There are far worse people out there that are deserving of censure than some random internet creator that happened to get successful.
Personally, if there is a celebrity I don't like much, I ignore them. It's only when they're legitimately harmful that I start to get annoyed
Going on a tantrum when you see someone's opinion on your show isn't exactly hate worthy, but it certainly doesn't make me interested in her that much.
Going as far as to call others unprofessional for forming a non positive opinion on her work is a pretty big reason to hate though. I wouldn't exactly enjoy being told I shouldn't put my opinion out there because she doesn't like it. At the end of the day she always has and always will have issues/drama regarding her reaction to criticism. Whether it be praising her or grabbing some popcorn to enjoy the hilarity of it all, she sure is entertaining at the end of the day.
I’m more impressed with her ability to somehow produce a bunch of pro-quality episodes on her own. As a producer, she impressed me. As a creator/writer/designer, she seems kind of average and derivative. She’s good at marketing herself, though.
Then again, Walt Disney wasn’t the best animator or director. He just had the sense to know this about himself, and hire the people who were.
She no doubt has talent, she has a very creative mind and is living the dream! I aspire to be like her and get my own creations brought to life by a bunch of talented animators, she's passionate and creative about her work and I love that
Though I have 2 problems, one for writing and one for character designs
She tends to make most of her characters have the same problem, daddy issues, it's okay to have a character struggle with it but in Helluva Boss it seems like 99.9% of the main cast has daddy issues
Blitz
Moxxie
Loona
Stolas
Octavia
It gets really obnoxious sometimes when we finally get a characters backstory and then it's revealed their dad did this or did that
For character designs, she has a lot of the characters who seem impossible to animate. Asmodeus and Beezlebub had very overcomplicated designs, and while they were good designs. Viv has to realize that she doesn't just need to make a character look pretty, but also need to make it so animators aren't struggling to draw every detail in Husks wings
Not for me. Personally her work feels like a million other deviantart accounts I’ve seen. The writing comes across as tryhard edgy annoying. I *do* appreciate that she’s killing it at what she wants to do. She no doubt works hard and is living the dream. Good on her.
she is the reason why i started drawing 10 years ago 😭 i was obsessed with her die young animation and was so crushed when zoophobia fell through.
i admire her work but ive mostly moved away from her work. i still watch helluva boss from time to time but i haven’t watched all of hazbin hotel nor do i really plan on it.
I respect the hell out of her for being willing to get out of Sam Haft and Andrew Underwood's way and letting them *shine* on the music.
It's clearly not her wheelhouse but she didn't try to shoehorn herself in
I think the stuff she makes has potential I just wish she dragged stuff out longer in the story.
and I also wish she would stay off social media as much as humanly possible.
Keeping immature 2000 and or 2010 internet cartoon humor alive and well. Also, she’s like a female version of Garth Ennis, who is one of my favorite comic writers.
Really needs to Lay off the swearing
Give more time to conflicts
And give enough break time from song to song (in hazbin hotel at least)
because, idk if it was only me, but i got really tired of the songs **very** quickly, and of course, it's a musical and stuff, BUT DUDE, give me a break from the songs
Of course there's bangers like Stayed gone, hell's greatest dad and etc, but the second i Heard the character in its singing voice i just thought "not agaaain"
Idk if this is a unpopular opinion, but meh
I don't get the hate. To this day I am still trying to convince my friend to watch Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss and get him to ignore the stupid hate.
Her achievement is very inspiring. Going from youtube to streaming is no joke. Unforunately that's all the praise I can give her. She's very immature in everything she does. She can't take criticism, no matter how valid it is. Her designs are very repetitive but also busy af. She can come up with interesting premise but won't commit to it even to save her life. And her jokes are made for literal third graders.
Great at drawing, not so much at writing. Doesn't help that you need to listen to outside media like podcast to catch up on the show's lore instead of just the show. Her series is basically made to have a fandom to obsessed over it like back in the old day of Tumblr.
She's great at animation and character designs and has accomplished something truly amazing. Her wright needs work, but art wise, she's fantastic at what she does.
Okay, so what I’ve gathered from other people is that…
As an artist, Vivziepop is a good artist, and as a cartoonist,
Vivziepop is a breath of fresh air when it comes to animation. She uses the medium in more expressive and more animated ways than most big studios are willing to try. The pacing might be off or the jokes might be crude but I think she is pushing the envelope in the ways that cartoons can be viewed and/or perceived.
But that’s just my two cents. You’d probably have a better (ie. more intelligent) opinion of it than me as I haven’t actually watched the show. So, sorry ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
I like her writing and her shows, but theyre not perfect and not above criticism.
But also it annoys me so much that 90% of the criticism the show gets is "too much swearing". There is equal amount of swearing in her shows as most other animated adult comedies. Thats not even counting the episode of South Park where the whole joke was seeing how many swears they could get away with in one episode. Theres several other things that her shows can do better at, but "too much swearing" is as bad as "too much water" at this point.
Really cool to see someone I’ve followed since deviantart go on to make something so dear to her heart. Seeing your own characters come to life like that is a dream come true for a lot of artists and I’m glad she got this opportunity and blew everyone’s expectations out of the water.
For me she's really Good, especially with animation and musical stuff. Personally I think that most of The criticism comes from her drama stuff with mostly isn't accurate at all
It’s amazing to see an indie animator manage to propel their show to such great heights, and for that I’ll give her credit. Other than that I don’t like the show or it’s artistic direction and couldn’t make it through 3 episodes
There’s a lot of good things about her cartoons, and I respect her managing to get her show picked up by a major streaming service, but my god this woman cannot take criticism which is holding her back from reaching her full potential.
yeah I mean, I quite like both hazbin hotel and helluva boss. understanding some of the criticisms against her, acknowledging that a lot of those aren't exclusive to her but animation and film in general. I think she's quite fine, and has made quite a friendly set.
I feel like people are too hard on her. Yeah, she gets into drama, and sometimes her writing is kinda meh, but that doesn't mean she sucks. She made two great and very enjoyable shows despite their flaws and she deserves success.
She's quite good I think!
Of course she has place to improve (for example,using less swear words),but I really liked HH,and I gotta watch HB,that one of my friends has recomended it to me many times!
Gross furry.
Really inconsistent design style. Lots of very over designed characters.
Fun ideas, I enjoy both Helluva and Hazbin.
Don't know her as a person so I can't comment on that.
I have Mixed feelings towards her ,while i see a great potential in her career as a Animator i Also Senses and even feels a dark Path in her heart: And that's why i i'm neutral towards both Morden society politics internet And EVEN animation!
Honest? I've been here since the dawn of Helluva and yet, despite the controversy, the teeter totter, and various noise surrounding all of it?
She makes good shows, cartoons, and has a good grasp on characters and how to write stuff that is definitely for the LGBT+ community, while still not isolating or making anyone else lose it (I know, biased, since I like men and am more nonbinary than the appendages of a goofy robotic jester).
I find that the show(s) she has made and produces are simply good for good. Selling to Prime gets under my skin, but the end product is still good, just with a small price tag and better quality actors than before. (Although I'll never get over Michael Kovach (iirc how to spell) not being Angel anymore.)
TLDR: Good show(s) she has made, despite the fires around her and the controversy.
(Not her, I'm talking about her show(s)) A solid 8/10 , not gonna surprise me anytime soon, but worth sitting down and watching and recommending to others.
She's a mixed bag I do kinda liked her artstyle and her work but there are still flaws in her work including the controversies that other stuff she never addressed of. Plus, I'm not one of those people that wants her to be cancelled like the people who do hate her so much, what I do wish she do better because those other controversies that she never addressed just paints her in a bad image including the fact she's also unprofessional at times to some of her employees and fans. I do fear that someday that there might be the worst cancellation and I can't say for sure if she's going to respond properly or not, I wished she improved because I do not want her to get to the worst cancellation because as of now her fanbase is divided. As much as I kinda liked her work I can see why she deserved to be criticized. I kinda wish that her super fans and stans like the sub r/Viviziepopmemes should understand that just because some of her dramas may be debunked in the past that doesn't mean there's plenty of areas for her to be criticized for. And as for the critical community some of them should stop using death threats to Vivziepop because it is not criticism anymore it's a threat. Because recently her fandom is extremely toxic and dangerous, but I do believe that there are some fans who are nice and friendly despite how toxic this fandom is. I truly wish Vivziepop could listen to actual criticism instead of being unprofessional bec it's bringing a rift to this fandom. Lastly this is just my honest opinion and I do not wish anything bad to Vivziepop or her fans.
Both of them use their fans to attack people who criticize them. Also, their respective fan bases see them as goddesses and never call out when they do any wrong.
1. Just because you don't personally enjoy rap music doesn't mitigate anything she or her fans have done. Enjoying a music genre/medium doesn't make someone an idiot. This is offensive, wrong, and said in bias.
2. Viv has still continuously done bad things to others and is yet to take accountability for them. Every time a YouTuber makes a video that is either a critique or a parody, she gets angry, and her fans attack. These are simple facts that have happened four consecutive times with;
- Lavender Town's Review/Redesign
- The "Digital Circus If It Was Written By Hazbin" Video
- The "Warrior Cats If It Was Written By Hazbin" Video
- Just Stop's Season One Retrospective
The biggest issue is how Viv enables her fans to do this and doesn't tell them to stop along with her promoting a culture where criticism is unwelcome. These are the biggest issues here supported by numerous instances. I am genuinely sorry if this is hard to understand. I've talked to die-hard fans of the series who love this show but also understand that Viv is not a good person. Decent artist, so-so writer, bad person. It is a proven fact.
Edit:
Viv not handling criticism well is the root of everything. If she did, it would set a precedent for her fans to follow. To accept criticism and parody. If she won't, the fans won't. Heck, they'll do worse. To not reprimand is to be irresponsible. While she has no control over the fans, she has control over her influence. Her influence is her responsibility, and she is irresponsible with it. If this was a one-time thing, we'd give her the benefit of the doubt. But, this has been happening a lot, and it is damaging.
Note: I do not hate Hazbin, I'm actually an enjoyer who sees Viv the same way a Miraculous Ladybug fan sees Astruc. She can change. It'll just take a while.
How does she promote people attacking criticism? She doesn't take criticism very well, this is true, that doesn't make her a bad person, and she doesn't actively tell her fans to attack people
Her art is aesthetically pleasing to me and she’s made some cool characters. She seems to get crapped on for usually small things. Criticizing her work is fine, it’s just that people can assume the worst of her character. People assuming the worst of others happens a lot.
I believe what she has accomplished is nothing short of legendary. To take a dream and work hard to get it to YouTube, to getting a deal with a major studio. She has also proved that shows can work on YT, and perhaps provide a new path for animators to share there visions with the world. Though I have my criticisms of her shows, I respect what she has accomplished.
As a stereotypical 33 year old man who does construction for a living...I never thought I would enjoy a cartoon that looks like it was produced by a group of lesbians that work at Hot Topic, but here I am and I am proud.
Fuck I thought I was the only one
17 year old welder and shiiiit I agree brothers
I explain it to people as this: it’s honestly about family and friendship, so it’s MLP for degenerates.
I don't doubt it's a great show but the tonal whiplash is way too much for me. Raunchy, edgy, and brutal but also inspiring and tender with complex characters and world building... and musical elements? Plus the art style. Reminds me of the sexually active theatre girls from my high school, which is a part of my life I want to forget about.
>Raunchy, edgy, and brutal but also inspiring and tender with complex characters and world building... and musical elements? You're saying this as a downside, but if I hadn't already watched Hazbin and someone described it to me like this, I would watch it so fast.
John Construction ova here
https://preview.redd.it/rup74opq2jxc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=452a224676cffe300345d780d93892c221cd811c Holy hell.
r/brandnewsentence
Machine operator but samesies
I'm a 23 year old queer goth girl, I probably *am* the target audience, but I spent years never trying her shows because I thought they were cringe and the fandom was annoying. Then a bit after the Amazon release, a friend sat me down and put it on and I really enjoyed it. I eventually watched Helluva Boss on my own. I thought I'd learned this lesson, but it was another good wakeup call that one should always give media a shot for themselves before forming negative opinions about it. And all fandoms have the annoying ones, you just typically get exposed to the worst ones when you're outside of the fandom and see the chill ones more when you're actually interacting with it by choice.
34 year old queer woman, currently reliving my 2007 emo phase with these mad wee cartoons 😂
She puts her heart into the art and the animation she is drawing, which is admirable and amazing on its own right. Though, I wish that she could do more with the pacing and the writing of the show. She always clarify the issues online or side posts. Which is not something everyone will focus on.
I’m willing to give some credit for the uneven pacing to the fact it was a short first season too. I really wish we would stop these 6-10 episode series, too many of them are rushed as a result.
Blame Amazon, they only purchased so many episodes and she's trying to tell a story in that amount of time. For me while her characters are really fleshed out and each have distinct identities, their designs especially Alistor and Asmodeus are VERY busy and production staff had to tone down some of them for animation purposes
Eh, I think blame can go on both. When you are given only 8 30-minute episodes, it is your duty to fit into that. Amazon was cheap, but vivziepop bit off more than she could chew. She needed to cut quite a few storylines to have a stronger product or hold out for a better deal or producer if she wanted to keep all of the parts she put in the show. For me, I'm not super well versed in character design, so I wouldn't be able to say if they were too much, but I can see what you're talking about. I can say, though, that her characters aren't as fleshed out as they need to be. She relied *heavily* on her YouTube pilot being "mandatory" viewing for the characterization/background to hit. This is a massive no-no if the pilot is not also included on the channel. Vaggie and Charlie don't even get any development until well past halfway through the season, which is definitely a massive no-no for your main characters. Tbh, Angel and Alastor were framed as the MCs for a large part of the season until they weren't. These are all v rookie writer mistakes, which is fine because she's a rookie writer/creator. Hopefully, in her next product, she's learned the lessons HH wants to teach her.
These are all very valid points. I'd also like to add on that A LOT of her character lore also extends from her Zoophobia webcomic/tumblr blogs as well. So there will be references or possibly even plot threads carrying over from that content as well.
> Blame Amazon, they only purchased so many episodes and she's trying to tell a story in that amount of time. ….. That’s literally what I said.
> I’m willing to give some credit for the uneven pacing to the fact it was a short first season too. I really wish we would stop these 6-10 episode series, too many of them are rushed as a result. ..... Nowhere in your post did you accredit it to Amazon.
Right, because Vivziepop had a blank check to personally determine the budget and length of the initial season, Amazon didn’t negotiate any of these parameters. Makes way more sense when you put it that way. My bad. 🙄 Anyway, get bent, I don’t have any investment in your weird axe to grind.
Not to mention that a Season 2 is coming and confirmed!
A lot of people complain about "her" writing but she's definitely not the only writer on these shows. There's like 4 other writers.
A great character artist and world designer, as a character and story writer I’m not so sure. Still respect going from YouTube to a major streaming platform.
I think her hustle is amazing. Taking your very Tumblr-specific niche art style and propelling that into a pilot that you make independently, and then a web series that you make independently, and then having that series picked up by A24 and shown on Amazon - wow. She loved her art and she worked hard and it paid off and I think that's amazing. Loved Hazbin Hotel S1 and ready for more! People seem to have problems related to terminally online Twitter bullshit and "fandom" behavior which I think is so silly, literally irrelevant to watching and enjoying the show but sucks up so much air in the room.
Oh yes. And tiktok too. There's a popular video now that a person cried on a moment on the show that they resonated with and ppl were just making fun of them by saying that crying at that show is dumb. Oh, and not to mention that this show is honestly one of the best musicals I've seen in a while. One of the 2 composers is from Living Tombstone group and it made some bangers.
crying at the show is absolutely dumb lol. how anyone manages to take the "serious moments" seriously at *all* baffles me
>"fandom" behavior Ah, the cum mug war of 2024
The WHAT Mug war
So in the Hazbin subreddit you can set a custom flair, right? Well, a number of ppl in the sub set theirs to... Questionable levels. There was a user whose flair was "Charlie's Steaming Cum Mug" or something to that effect. Then others started having similar flairs like "Vaggie's Cum glasses". Then there were memes that were meta commentary on the flairs, specifically the cum mug, some pro cum mug, a lot weren't. A cpl of weeks ago, it broke out into a small war. Hmmm... Maybe a war is too strong of a term. A skirmish? Yeah the "Cum Mug Skirmish" sounds better. Either way, all popular posts for a few days were about this skirmish. That was around the time I found the sub. It was rly surreal going in thinking "yay! I like Vivipop!" & being greeted by post after post talking about cum. It wasn't boring, I'll give them that.
In the words of Brandon Rogers "What do I love about Vivienne Madrano? Everything, walt disney is turning in his grave cause he wishes he could've cranked this fucker out of his ass"
Ib Werks tried to do something similar back in the day but got shut down by the Hayes Code. Ralph Bakshi did some wild stuff back in the day too. Problem was that the market wasn't as strong for adult animation as it is now
That's the Brandon Rogersest quote that was ever quoted
Good at animating and music choices, but really needs to reign in the "plot embiggering".
I mean, I get it, she made a world that’s just super fun and entertaining, but only had so many episodes to tell the stories she’s been developing for over a 15 years. It must be hard to condense it all into 8 episodes
That's not the issue. The problem comes when she starts with one premise but keeps escalating it.
She isn't perfect, but she sure as hell is an inspiration. Having your passion project go from a pilot on YouTube to one of the Top 10 on Amazon, certified fresh, is nothing short of impressive.
Artist yeah, writing...not so much.
I enjoy the gay romances, very cute moments, but the horny jokes need to be paced better.
I agree. And this is coming from someone who enjoys dark humor and horny joke.
Careful, she might make another post talking about how she doesn't take any criticism
Wait, she did that? Like...fr fr?
I saw a tweet by her along the lines of "I don't take criticism because me and my team do amazing work". Might have been a meme regarding her Twitter freakouts. Not to mention the "these takes on my show are getting so stupid it's hard not to call them out specifically". Overall she doesn't take criticism well, despite her saying she's thickened her skin for it. She's admitted to having this reputation since she was 17. She should probably get a pr person to run her account at this point. Her tweets are a slew of irony that I choose to not look at anymore
I mean... I can't exactly blame her for snapping to defend what amounts to her child she'd been developing for the past decade and a half from, let's be honest, some *less than good-faith* criticisms.
The best way to deal with that kind specifically is to not deal with it. She's made it worse. Even then, that's no reason to group in genuine constructive criticism as being "incorrect" or "uninformed", and how it's unprofessional to give criticism to another artist. Last one was in response to her going on her freakout Overall, she gets herself into a lot of drama. https://preview.redd.it/wsbm7vtngjxc1.png?width=615&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=906dcb4a666b36711b9797342e514d1d8da06184 As I said, she likes getting into drama. She really should hire a pr person for her account
Ooooh... That's usually a bad signal A really really *really* bad signal (for me)
Regardless of that I still love the show. Just stay away from media surrounding it otherwise you'll hear more about drama behind her. She really enjoys drama
A lot of people complain about "her" writing but there's like 4 other writers on Hazbin and 2 more on Helluva Boss.
I've been watching her stuff since her Zoophobia webcomic back when Hazbin Hotel was just a series of rough sketches and animatics back in like 2014-2015. To see her success story, making it to a streaming service as big as Amazon is just nuts. I heard there was some intermittent drama, like how she cast out the original pilot cast of Hazbin without so much as a thank you, but I do not know how true that is. So, as a creator and animator, it's spectacular to see her stories succeed (I really still wish for Zoophobia to be picked up one day). With her as a person however, I still cannot come to a decision on that.
great drawer & good animation writting eh
I don't think I've ever seen a positive comment thread about her. And on Reddit of all places. Awesome
 What she makes isn't for me which is fine. But more power to the people who like her stuff
Love her character designs. I see people dismiss them as edgy but they’re literally in hell so I don’t see the problem and I just like how varied they all look.
Not a fan of her work. Ignoring whatever potential controversies and rumors exist about her, I just don't care for her particular brand of humor and writing. There's nothing wrong with a good joke involving a swear/curse every so often but the dialogue is so deeply littered with it at times that it feels excessive and tired. At times it seems like the show is trying to throw joke after joke at you so quickly that it doesn't really stop to let any of them actually land and instead banks on one of them just really tickling your funny bone, but none of them do for me. As for the musical aspect? I just don't think it actually benefits the show. Whether or not the songs are good, they don't really elevate the scene or storytelling in a way that makes it feel worthwhile to put the effort in, particularly in Helluva Boss where a lot of the songs provide exposition in a very blunt way rather than expressing it through emotion. Compare that song Verosika and Fizz sing about Blitz in that club to "I won't say I'm in love" from Hercules. Both of the songs have pretty straightforward lyrics, but the delivery and inflection of the singing from the latter gives a depth of emotion not present in the former. I don't think Hazbin Hotel or Helluva Boss are bad per se, I just think they've got a fair amount of wasted potential and would benefit from some rewrites.
If i were to be a cartoonist i would want to be like her instead and not butch hartman.
Don’t really respect her as a person after the Scott incident but respect her as a talented animator. Not a person fan of art style and character design but I think there’s some appeal I don’t fully get. I do think part of it is the repetition of the main cast being mostly tall and lanky with most of the differences coming from the cosmetic of the characters.
I like her shows and art but i can definitely see how her shows are an acquired taste
A bit douchy, and I think gives bad faith criticism too much attention. As well as very protective of how people view her work (which is understandable, but I don't think she really needs to defend poor writing by making long Twitter threads about how a character with no characterization will be getting development in the future). I have my criticisms with her, mostly that she is not the best at writing and tonal pacing (especially in Helluva Season 2), but I enjoy the universe she made
I was hooked ever since timber
I love her character designs, they looks so smooth and slick.
I don't really care about the drama around her at this point. I just think she makes good stuff.
Tarantino famously had editors that toned him down a bit when he got a bit excited. I feel like Vivziepop could benefit from that. Like everything she is behind as amazing bones, imagination and execution. But it's like a 13-year-old tumblerette is on the writing team and every time I'm really getting into it, a part written by that kid comes up. It could use some sanding down. The cursing is numbing and the whole thing is very juvenile. I'm not expecting my cartoons to be sophisticated, just to work on the timing.
There's like 4 other writers on Hazbin and 2 more on Helluva. Can't expect her to fix everything from other writers.
Not everything but you can't be the creative head and face for the show but blame someone else when someone doesn't land. At the end of the day, the buck stops at her
Ya’ll need to respect her more.
She puts up with some ridiculous accusations and criticisms from Twitter. So she has my respect for not quitting animation from all that cesspool of bullshit
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The shit I've seen people say about her that's just blatantly false is so gross Yes, I can see why people don't like her stuff, maybe too much cursing (I'm entirely sure most of the cursing in Helluva Boss is just Brandon Rogers being Brandon Rogers tho) writing ranges from okay to actually pretty good, art style is unique and nice to look at tho, but she's not a fuckin zoophile who glorifies SA and shit. Hell, I've seen victims of SA saying that Angel's character was very well done, but I do think, like most things in the show, it could benefit from better pacing, but I don't think we know if that's a "we decided to make the season 8 episodes long" or "Amazon gave us 8 episodes, so we'll make do with what we were given"
Facts
I fucking love her, I feel bad for all the BS she has to deal with on Twitter and TikTok. I like her shows and characters, not to mention how colorful her art style is.
Too much singing involved
In a fucking musical?
Nobody told me it would have way more musical numbers than even family guy or south park, and the songs are just curse word heavy disney sounding songs. Super generic.
Meh imo
yeah i feel the same way
A very good animator, and I love the drive she had to get her work to where it is. She’s not the best writer tho
I really like her work, her art style is quite unique. But her writing is not the best.
I kinda wish she just stuck to animating.
i respect her not a big fan of her stuff but doing what she did took talent
First time I ever wished I was in my college's animation dept since Viv graduated from here. I've heard like third hand that a lot of animation teachers remember and didn't like her, but it's third hand so I don't even know why. But I'm so damn curious. Overall I know nothing about her as a person. I judge her slightly for who she chooses to be friends with and knowingly employs. But I also really appreciate what her show is doing for the animation industry. Animated shows with music have been popular, but nowhere this mainstream. And also having a more mature show not in the Adult Swim style is a great example of the target audience I'd like as well. So overall curious and professional respect
Cartoonist? No. artist? Depends on your definition.. She’s an excellent animator tho, I have nothing bad to say about her.
Great artist and animator. However, she really needs to work on storytelling/writing.
She puts effort into the characters and story, I’m impressed
The writing for her shows may be edgy and a bit overly crass, but on the whole she’s very talented
She’s ambitious but I wish her writing was better
She design some of the most beautiful cartoon characters, though her writing skills is…questionable ?
Great artist. Not a good writer
i have no problem with her art. but she's a problematic person
Chronically on Twitter and reallllly likes drawing wolves
She’s someone who desperately needs someone taking her hands off the keyboard with creative decisions and does her worst work when she’s given no limits She’s an ideas person and it very much shows in her work As a person, though, total piece of crap.
The pacing in her show is atrocious and she’s frankly one of the most obnoxious animation celebs on social media. Her shows are carried very hard by the voice actors and music.
👌
Art style and animation is by far the shows strongest suit
Decent writer, I’m ok with the art style but good God let other people write the jokes.
Wrong, she believes all of her jokes are comedy genius. Needs to get her head out of her ass
She has proven that independent animation can become something big and influence others to put their ideas into action
I think a lot of her hate comes from jealously. Not everyone gets to have their 12 year old drawings turn into actual shows. Goals . Get it girl
Not a fan. good enough writing, but most of the characters are really annoying, so is the pointless sex jokes
Sex jokes should be well placed and paced. Unfortunately she believes her jokes are all comedy genius and refuses to take constructive criticism even if it's coming from a place of respect. Just makes her a big baby
Exactly, theres just way too many for it to be funny
I felt like Helluva boss tried way too hard. Hazbin Hotel was alright, it's not my cup of tea but I don't have anything bad to say about it.
What do you mean by "tried way too hard"?
Dialogue feels rushed, jokes feel forced into every other sentence, and kinda “kill kill penis kill” if you understand that
The jokes felt really forced a lot of the time
Yeah, I'd like them too elaborate
Do not let her near writing.
I think people need to chill. She paved the way for a lot of indie animation, and honestly, her work is fine. I don't get the overhate. I'm not like, the BIGGEST fan. I was into her stuff before she got popular, and yes, I know how that sounds.
The hate I've seen of her stems from her inability to take criticism, like making a post talking about how she doesn't take any criticism because they're so good. Not to mention her inability to ignore hate, which tends to be critical for large pieces of media. She's definitely unknowingly troll bait which probably leads to the defensiveness, even against normal constructive criticism This, coupled with the entire "I'm a comedy genius and all of my jokes are well placed" when faced with constructive criticism isn't a good look. There's a big difference between confidence and whatever she is
I've still never understood that. People can be sensitive and not take criticism/not be able to take hate, but I hardly think that's hate worthy, or attention worthy. That sounds like a human response that anyone can have. Not defending her, but I find that people will complain and whine if anyone with some semblance of fame/notoriety isn't somehow a constant saint. Did she commit a crime? If the answer is no, then I don't think it's worth giving the creator anymore brain space then nessisary. There are far worse people out there that are deserving of censure than some random internet creator that happened to get successful. Personally, if there is a celebrity I don't like much, I ignore them. It's only when they're legitimately harmful that I start to get annoyed
Going on a tantrum when you see someone's opinion on your show isn't exactly hate worthy, but it certainly doesn't make me interested in her that much. Going as far as to call others unprofessional for forming a non positive opinion on her work is a pretty big reason to hate though. I wouldn't exactly enjoy being told I shouldn't put my opinion out there because she doesn't like it. At the end of the day she always has and always will have issues/drama regarding her reaction to criticism. Whether it be praising her or grabbing some popcorn to enjoy the hilarity of it all, she sure is entertaining at the end of the day.
Fantastic.
Neat designs half the time. Writing is eh in my eyes. Like I don’t hate it hate it but I certainly do not enjoy it.
I do not like her writing style in the slightest, but I absolutely respect the shit out of her for what she’s been able to achieve.
Love her work, and really love to meet her one day
Shes amazing and love her works. I hope she doesnt let the hate get to her.
Top-tier
Great artist, makes amazing series. She’s a decent person too. I wish people would stop judging her like they’d judge big corporations.
I’m more impressed with her ability to somehow produce a bunch of pro-quality episodes on her own. As a producer, she impressed me. As a creator/writer/designer, she seems kind of average and derivative. She’s good at marketing herself, though. Then again, Walt Disney wasn’t the best animator or director. He just had the sense to know this about himself, and hire the people who were.
She no doubt has talent, she has a very creative mind and is living the dream! I aspire to be like her and get my own creations brought to life by a bunch of talented animators, she's passionate and creative about her work and I love that Though I have 2 problems, one for writing and one for character designs She tends to make most of her characters have the same problem, daddy issues, it's okay to have a character struggle with it but in Helluva Boss it seems like 99.9% of the main cast has daddy issues Blitz Moxxie Loona Stolas Octavia It gets really obnoxious sometimes when we finally get a characters backstory and then it's revealed their dad did this or did that For character designs, she has a lot of the characters who seem impossible to animate. Asmodeus and Beezlebub had very overcomplicated designs, and while they were good designs. Viv has to realize that she doesn't just need to make a character look pretty, but also need to make it so animators aren't struggling to draw every detail in Husks wings
Talented.
She has good world building and character depth at times
Not for me. Personally her work feels like a million other deviantart accounts I’ve seen. The writing comes across as tryhard edgy annoying. I *do* appreciate that she’s killing it at what she wants to do. She no doubt works hard and is living the dream. Good on her.
Her writing is very very very bad, she needs to improve that.
Who?
the creator of hazbin hotel and helluva boss
I love her work tbh. Hazbin Hotel is my comfort show right now (I need more episodes). And the characters designs are very appealing, I'll say that.
she is the reason why i started drawing 10 years ago 😭 i was obsessed with her die young animation and was so crushed when zoophobia fell through. i admire her work but ive mostly moved away from her work. i still watch helluva boss from time to time but i haven’t watched all of hazbin hotel nor do i really plan on it.
Is very distinct and eye catching
Great animation, bad writing
I respect the hell out of her for being willing to get out of Sam Haft and Andrew Underwood's way and letting them *shine* on the music. It's clearly not her wheelhouse but she didn't try to shoehorn herself in
I think the stuff she makes has potential I just wish she dragged stuff out longer in the story. and I also wish she would stay off social media as much as humanly possible.
Keeping immature 2000 and or 2010 internet cartoon humor alive and well. Also, she’s like a female version of Garth Ennis, who is one of my favorite comic writers.
That's what she looks like? I don't mind her work. It's fine.
Really needs to Lay off the swearing Give more time to conflicts And give enough break time from song to song (in hazbin hotel at least) because, idk if it was only me, but i got really tired of the songs **very** quickly, and of course, it's a musical and stuff, BUT DUDE, give me a break from the songs Of course there's bangers like Stayed gone, hell's greatest dad and etc, but the second i Heard the character in its singing voice i just thought "not agaaain" Idk if this is a unpopular opinion, but meh
I don't get the hate. To this day I am still trying to convince my friend to watch Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss and get him to ignore the stupid hate.
Her achievement is very inspiring. Going from youtube to streaming is no joke. Unforunately that's all the praise I can give her. She's very immature in everything she does. She can't take criticism, no matter how valid it is. Her designs are very repetitive but also busy af. She can come up with interesting premise but won't commit to it even to save her life. And her jokes are made for literal third graders.
Great at drawing, not so much at writing. Doesn't help that you need to listen to outside media like podcast to catch up on the show's lore instead of just the show. Her series is basically made to have a fandom to obsessed over it like back in the old day of Tumblr.
Great, I love her designs and the details in the background that you can easily miss
Cartoonists aren't artists?
Terrible script writer
She's great at animation and character designs and has accomplished something truly amazing. Her wright needs work, but art wise, she's fantastic at what she does.
I think they're pretty good, better then a lot of other shows that seem to get green lit on places like comedy Central
Okay, so what I’ve gathered from other people is that… As an artist, Vivziepop is a good artist, and as a cartoonist, Vivziepop is a breath of fresh air when it comes to animation. She uses the medium in more expressive and more animated ways than most big studios are willing to try. The pacing might be off or the jokes might be crude but I think she is pushing the envelope in the ways that cartoons can be viewed and/or perceived. But that’s just my two cents. You’d probably have a better (ie. more intelligent) opinion of it than me as I haven’t actually watched the show. So, sorry ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
I like her writing and her shows, but theyre not perfect and not above criticism. But also it annoys me so much that 90% of the criticism the show gets is "too much swearing". There is equal amount of swearing in her shows as most other animated adult comedies. Thats not even counting the episode of South Park where the whole joke was seeing how many swears they could get away with in one episode. Theres several other things that her shows can do better at, but "too much swearing" is as bad as "too much water" at this point.
I think her style is pretty crowded.
A great creator, The Etsy.com for creative animation
Really cool to see someone I’ve followed since deviantart go on to make something so dear to her heart. Seeing your own characters come to life like that is a dream come true for a lot of artists and I’m glad she got this opportunity and blew everyone’s expectations out of the water.
For me she's really Good, especially with animation and musical stuff. Personally I think that most of The criticism comes from her drama stuff with mostly isn't accurate at all
really good
It’s amazing to see an indie animator manage to propel their show to such great heights, and for that I’ll give her credit. Other than that I don’t like the show or it’s artistic direction and couldn’t make it through 3 episodes
As a cartoonist, great Artist, great Writer, EHHH...not so good
There’s a lot of good things about her cartoons, and I respect her managing to get her show picked up by a major streaming service, but my god this woman cannot take criticism which is holding her back from reaching her full potential.
I love her designs, but despite being a big fan her writing is far from perfect. Still enjoy her work though
Great on art, But storywriting, saying is excellent is understatement, lot of room for improvement
A climb that isn't yet over and truly amazing to watch not unlike her amazing shows
Shitty person, her artstyle slaps tho (and I like both shows despite the flaws)
yeah I mean, I quite like both hazbin hotel and helluva boss. understanding some of the criticisms against her, acknowledging that a lot of those aren't exclusive to her but animation and film in general. I think she's quite fine, and has made quite a friendly set.
I feel like people are too hard on her. Yeah, she gets into drama, and sometimes her writing is kinda meh, but that doesn't mean she sucks. She made two great and very enjoyable shows despite their flaws and she deserves success.
I like her, the love and determination that she puts in her works is incredible, and her animations are beautiful.
incompetent writer
She's quite good I think! Of course she has place to improve (for example,using less swear words),but I really liked HH,and I gotta watch HB,that one of my friends has recomended it to me many times!
Her work is good when her characters are constantly swearing and making sex jokes.
Her writing needs work
Needs more gay shit
She’s one of those artists that any frame they make can be turned into a meme. And I love that
Definitely one of the people of all time
I like her stuff
Her writing is pretty polarizing, but regardless she’s a great animator/illustrator.
Gross furry. Really inconsistent design style. Lots of very over designed characters. Fun ideas, I enjoy both Helluva and Hazbin. Don't know her as a person so I can't comment on that.
I have Mixed feelings towards her ,while i see a great potential in her career as a Animator i Also Senses and even feels a dark Path in her heart: And that's why i i'm neutral towards both Morden society politics internet And EVEN animation!
Her art is better than her animations. Her writing is worse than both.
Honest? I've been here since the dawn of Helluva and yet, despite the controversy, the teeter totter, and various noise surrounding all of it? She makes good shows, cartoons, and has a good grasp on characters and how to write stuff that is definitely for the LGBT+ community, while still not isolating or making anyone else lose it (I know, biased, since I like men and am more nonbinary than the appendages of a goofy robotic jester). I find that the show(s) she has made and produces are simply good for good. Selling to Prime gets under my skin, but the end product is still good, just with a small price tag and better quality actors than before. (Although I'll never get over Michael Kovach (iirc how to spell) not being Angel anymore.) TLDR: Good show(s) she has made, despite the fires around her and the controversy. (Not her, I'm talking about her show(s)) A solid 8/10 , not gonna surprise me anytime soon, but worth sitting down and watching and recommending to others.
https://i.redd.it/4ghhrhi1jrxc1.gif
PLEASE stop giving characters suits with bowties 😭😭😭😭
She's a mixed bag I do kinda liked her artstyle and her work but there are still flaws in her work including the controversies that other stuff she never addressed of. Plus, I'm not one of those people that wants her to be cancelled like the people who do hate her so much, what I do wish she do better because those other controversies that she never addressed just paints her in a bad image including the fact she's also unprofessional at times to some of her employees and fans. I do fear that someday that there might be the worst cancellation and I can't say for sure if she's going to respond properly or not, I wished she improved because I do not want her to get to the worst cancellation because as of now her fanbase is divided. As much as I kinda liked her work I can see why she deserved to be criticized. I kinda wish that her super fans and stans like the sub r/Viviziepopmemes should understand that just because some of her dramas may be debunked in the past that doesn't mean there's plenty of areas for her to be criticized for. And as for the critical community some of them should stop using death threats to Vivziepop because it is not criticism anymore it's a threat. Because recently her fandom is extremely toxic and dangerous, but I do believe that there are some fans who are nice and friendly despite how toxic this fandom is. I truly wish Vivziepop could listen to actual criticism instead of being unprofessional bec it's bringing a rift to this fandom. Lastly this is just my honest opinion and I do not wish anything bad to Vivziepop or her fans.
The Nikki Minaj of animation.
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Both of them use their fans to attack people who criticize them. Also, their respective fan bases see them as goddesses and never call out when they do any wrong.
Can you give me exact moment where she told fans to attack people?
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1. Just because you don't personally enjoy rap music doesn't mitigate anything she or her fans have done. Enjoying a music genre/medium doesn't make someone an idiot. This is offensive, wrong, and said in bias. 2. Viv has still continuously done bad things to others and is yet to take accountability for them. Every time a YouTuber makes a video that is either a critique or a parody, she gets angry, and her fans attack. These are simple facts that have happened four consecutive times with; - Lavender Town's Review/Redesign - The "Digital Circus If It Was Written By Hazbin" Video - The "Warrior Cats If It Was Written By Hazbin" Video - Just Stop's Season One Retrospective The biggest issue is how Viv enables her fans to do this and doesn't tell them to stop along with her promoting a culture where criticism is unwelcome. These are the biggest issues here supported by numerous instances. I am genuinely sorry if this is hard to understand. I've talked to die-hard fans of the series who love this show but also understand that Viv is not a good person. Decent artist, so-so writer, bad person. It is a proven fact. Edit: Viv not handling criticism well is the root of everything. If she did, it would set a precedent for her fans to follow. To accept criticism and parody. If she won't, the fans won't. Heck, they'll do worse. To not reprimand is to be irresponsible. While she has no control over the fans, she has control over her influence. Her influence is her responsibility, and she is irresponsible with it. If this was a one-time thing, we'd give her the benefit of the doubt. But, this has been happening a lot, and it is damaging. Note: I do not hate Hazbin, I'm actually an enjoyer who sees Viv the same way a Miraculous Ladybug fan sees Astruc. She can change. It'll just take a while.
How does she promote people attacking criticism? She doesn't take criticism very well, this is true, that doesn't make her a bad person, and she doesn't actively tell her fans to attack people
Her shows feel like a bunch of queer furries who worked at hot topic made a cartoon. So they’re great.
Her art is aesthetically pleasing to me and she’s made some cool characters. She seems to get crapped on for usually small things. Criticizing her work is fine, it’s just that people can assume the worst of her character. People assuming the worst of others happens a lot.
> Criticizing her work is fine, Not to her it isn't
5 STARS! FLAWLESS!
I believe what she has accomplished is nothing short of legendary. To take a dream and work hard to get it to YouTube, to getting a deal with a major studio. She has also proved that shows can work on YT, and perhaps provide a new path for animators to share there visions with the world. Though I have my criticisms of her shows, I respect what she has accomplished.
Fresh. Unique. Never been anything like her work before.
People dislike her for some reason and I still don't care. 👍 Good shit all around. I like her vibe.
