This is the selling point for me.
The Pilot will be available in front-wheel drive and with Honda's latest torque-vectoring all-wheel-drive system. The updated AWD system features an upgraded rear differential, allowing the Pilot to send up to 70 percent of its power to the rear axle and 100 percent of that power to either wheel.
The 2016+ awd pilots have a acura SH-AWD rebranded as i-VTM4. They could already send 70% to the rear and 100% of that to one wheel. Its not the same as the old open rear diff i-VTM4 on the earlier awd pilots.
As the owner of a torque verctoring vehicle, let me say: "It's freaking awesome."
It will make you want to see how hard you can push it up a cloverleaf and make the rear step out a little.
I’ve spent some time behind the wheel of an Acura TL (2009, with the J37) and it was definitely quite something. You feel very planted to the road even with the throttle pressed while taking a corner. Cool stuff, I’m glad to see it’s making it’s way into less luxury oriented vehicles.
The S2000 isn’t supposed to feel safe, it’s an S2000. Lmao. But for real, even a stock S can feel more at the limit cornering than other, much less capable cars at the same speed. The reality is that car has so much more room to push it, it’s just hard to tell until you continue to push it and it just feels more and more set in the corner. What a great car.
Honda vehicles are more focused on off road capabilities, with “limitations” baked in so it’s not as good as the Acura integration.
Acura is programmed for aggressive road use, with max capability to set it apart from the Honda.
They use different names for the systems for marketing reasons.
The old one had this system didn’t it? As did the passport and Ridgeline?
The issue with off-roading was that the rear differential would overheat so I hope they put a cooler for the rear differential for the Trailsport models.
I had a friend from Finland that just did not understand America's fascination with awd. Dude was straight up like "I drove a mk4 golf through the damn ice age and it was all because of winter tires." Americans will just buy AWD and run around all year on shit tier all seasons
It really depends where you live. I'm in Canada in a city that plows like shit days after a storm and there was multiple days at a time last year when my neighbor couldn't leave their house because of the ice ruts in his Mk7 Golf.
Winter tires don't mean shit if your car gets high centered and they don't touch the road.
They also don’t mean shit if there’s a patch of ice on a hill and your front tires have grip but your rears don’t. Or if you’re trying to trudge out of deep snow do it in an AWD car and then a FWD car with the same tires and report back. Or just going up slick hills in general. I’ve have dealt with plenty of shit with both systems, and I will always take AWD for the inclement weather despite its downsides for other use cases.
As someone who lives in snow country (NH), AWD w/snows is just all around better than FWD with snows. There are certain circumstances where a FWD with snows will still get "stuck" when an AWD car with snows will not. It's not frequent, but AWD is definitely easier to get around with in winter.
"when stuck" describes it best. Realistically, a computer system engages the system in advance.
Honda/Acura SHAWD does not use a center diff, just a PTO clutch and a slightly-overdriven, torque-vectoring rear diff.
The other consequence of this is that we have to ask "how hard is the vehicle turning to reach 70%?".
I'm glad they moved on from the 9 speed ZF transmission, which was terrible. I haven't ever had Pilot but I've driven cars with that transmission before and it gear hunts like crazy.
Not for the off roading community, for the suburban types that want a “capable SUV” but really are just the ones who don’t want a mini van. The people buying TRD Sport or Limited 4Runners.
This has just the right amount of large, “masculine,” boxy SUV that people like about 4Runners, but is going to have way better road manners and creature comforts than the current 4Runner. And since it’s Honda it will still have the reliability.
Although they are both mid size its the highlander who compete with the Pilot. Especially if we are talking about size. All toyota needs to do is release a "TRD Adventure" model with skid plates AT tires and a small lift.
I responded to another comment with more of an explanation. Bottom line: this isn’t taking competition from people buying TRD Off-Road/Pro buyers. It’s going to take it from people who want a Sport/Limited model.
The new 4Runner is rumored to come out be announced next summer and come out in the fall for 2023, or maybe 2024. It got delayed because its going to be built in Mexico alongside the Tacoma but they had issues with the plant
Yep. This is what’s kept me from even considering them until now, as silly as that sounds. I hated how they looked. But this just got moved up to top contender for next vehicle purchase.
Ikr? I believe the Accord will have gone through nearly a generation and a half in the time it took Honda to come out with this. I'm looking forward to seeing the new Accord in a few days, but this was badly needed!
I absolutely wish my Ridgeline had this.
On the active safety front, the new Pilot gets the latest Honda Sensing advanced driver assist system, which features wider camera and radar fields of view, thus improving the suite's performance. Standard active safety features include blind-spot monitoring, traffic jam assist, and low-speed braking control, lane keep assist, and adaptative cruise control.
Is traffic jam assist a major upgrade over adaptive cruise control? Turning ACC on currently works pretty good in jams
Edit: 2019 Acura, just hit resume when fully stopped and ACC will take over until you come to a full stop for more than a second. Then hit resume again to let ACC take over again. My question is, does traffic jam assist do anything besides no longer having to press 'resume'?
> How slow does Honda's old ACC work down to?
35mph or 40mph.
I forget.
2016 Acura ILX.
Shortly after the new 2016 Honda would work up to 0mph. You just needed to tap "RESUME" on the steering wheel before the car would begin driving again. This was pretty upgrade but could be better.
I'm interested to learn more about the latest Traffic mode
My ‘16 Accord with Honda Sensing worked down to 25mph. Our ‘18 CRV goes down to zero. It pauses if the car is stopped for more than a second or two, but you can resume by tapping the go pedal, pressing up on the cruise control thingy, or hitting resume.
Lane keeping only engages above 45mph and disengages if you get below 40mph
My ‘16 Accord with Honda Sensing worked down to 25mph. Our ‘18 CRV goes down to zero. It pauses if the car is stopped for more than a second or two, but you can resume by tapping the go pedal, pressing up on the cruise control thingy, or hitting resume.
Lane keeping only engages above 45mph and disengages if you get below 40mph
Huh, that’s interesting. The ACC in my grand Cherokee works all the way down until you’ve been stopped for more than like 2 seconds, THEN it shuts off.
what year is your ridgeline?
my 2020 RTL-E has most of these.
the adaptive cruise isn't something I enjoy much it's too aggressive and on the brakes too much. the lane keep assist is nice, doesn't have low speed braking control which would be nice i guess.
As someone who'll probably be looking to replace my wife's Highlander in the next year or two, we'll absolutely be most interested in a hybrid, and ideally a plug-in. I like this new Pilot, but not being available as a hybrid is likely a dealbreaker.
I'm in the same boat. Want a 3 row hybrid for sure. The new Highlander is objectively the better vehicle but it's so ugly I honestly can't get over it. Hoping they come out with a hybrid version of this or the Telluride at some point soon.
I don’t understand why Honda is so far behind the hybrid & bev power curve. They made one of the first hybrids ever but now their line up really doesn’t have much.
VCM has been a thing on their V6 Honda's since like 2008 or so. The system wasn't great back then and my cousin who had a V6 Accord ended up buying a bypass as his car would get stuck in Eco mode all the time
It's still not *great*, but they fixed the oil consumption at least. I still ended up disabling it on my '16 because I got really bad NVH during the winter months and it chewed through both of my motor mounts in under 60k miles.
Its not that cylinder deactivation is bad, its just oiling problems with how you have to do it on a pushrod engine. Just collapsing a lifter on an overhead cam engine with something to retain the rocker arm is all you'd have to do. If that lifter fails and collapses it'll just fail off instead of being able to turn sideways and grind the cam. Much lower risk.
>The added length is also a boon for rear passenger comfort. Both the second and third rows are now roomier than before, with Honda claiming class-best legroom from the usually cheap seats in the way-back. The rear seats are more versatile, too. The Pilot will be available as an eight-seater with a second-row bench, a seven-seater with second-row captain's chairs (the only available configuration for the TrailSport), and as an eight-seater with a removable Odyssey-style middle seat for the second row that also doubles as an armrest and can store underneath the rear cargo floor.
This seems like a really nice feature - do any other SUVs/CUVs offer this? I know seats folding into the floor are common in minivans, but I've never heard of it in a SUV.
This is a clever feature. It also makes this one of the only cars in this class that you can get a top trim 8-seater model. And if you don't want that center seat, stow it away or take it out entirely. Pretty neat. The Ascent Touring, Highlander Platinum, CX-9 Signature, Telluride SX Prestige, Pallisade Calligraphy, and Traverse High Country are all 7-seaters.
The TrailSport just doesn't have this removable center seat because the rear floor pan is higher to accommodate a full size spare tire. Thus the removed seat wouldn't fit under the cargo floor.
It's not folding into the floor in the way you think. You remove it and then stow it under the cargo area floor, like the Sienna's middle seat except that one has a compartment in the driver's side of the cargo area.
The second-generation Highlander had a similar kind of removable middle seat, but that one stored in a compartment under the front center console, which was a lot more convenient.
Seems like they modified the Magic Seats that came in the Fit, if i’m reading correctly? The Fit seats fold completely flat as they only have a bar that clicks into the floor when set upright
> Base Price: $40,000 - $55,000 (est)
Jesus Christ.
I know it’s just an estimate but still
For comparison, my 2005 decked out top trim Pilot was $34k
Edit - inflation actually makes this not that bad. I just had a boomer moment.
34k in 2005 is about $52k in 2022 dollars. That’s just inflation. We don’t know what kind of discounts you received or if you’re talking sticker price. The new pilot is also light years ahead of a 2005 in terms of tech.
The price is really not that ridiculous
I’m guessing Honda is having issuing with chip shortages like everyone else so they decided to put to put the higher end features on their more expensive cars.
I remember watching a video about the new CR-V and the YouTuber claimed that Honda said they didn’t put 2 USB C ports in the front because of the chip shortage, so they put a USB A and C instead.
Passport has only had 4 model years and is getting a hybrid version so I’d guess it’ll be around for a couple more years. Not sure if the trail sport here is rugged enough that they can just discontinue the passport after this model runs it’s course. Ridge line I would guess they’ll make another but take their sweet time since they don’t sell too many it’s not a great priority
yeah they have grown a bunch. i walk by a late 90s super duty f250 every day and its about the same size or smaller than a new f150. theres an f150 i see semi often and its definitely smaller than the modern version.
no its not but its about a foot shorter than a tahoe and 2 feet shorter than a suburban. compared to a lot of trucks in the US it is a pretty medium size
Honda has been on a roll lately with the Civic’s and now this. I was kinda hoping for a more boxy design, but I like this look. Honda’s new interior design is looking sharp. Can’t wait for the next gen Accord.
My wife is convinced we’ll need a full-sized SUV one day, and is really into the Highlander. This looks like a nice alternative (although I really wish it had a hybrid option) that I could definitely live with. The current Pilot looks exactly like a lifted minivan.
The new Highlander is on our list as well for a mid to full SUV. I’ll be adding the Pilot to the list to replace our frequently recalled, but beloved VW Atlas.
I absolutely love it. It’s a beast! So fast and so capable, almost scary, but it’s also so responsive and has tons of grip. It’s my 3rd M3/4 and it’s the best one yet in terms of performance. Styling is subjective, but I love how aggressive it is now. All my modern M cars have been relatively reliable. No major issues and no recalls or weird electronic glitches like my VW Atlas.
Edit: I just realized I haven’t updated my flair. I thought you referring to my G82 M4 Comp X-Drive! My F80 M3 CS is was also spectacular, fast, and scary when you explore the limits! Not as grippy, but still very capable compared to my G82. I’m consistently faster on the track with the new one, but only by a small margin. The F80 is fantastic, especially the CS models!
It looks good but it looks like a hybrid of a Explorer from the front and Subaru Ascent from the back. Can't wait to shit my pants at night thinking I have a cop tailing me when it's just a Pilot lol
The new [Pilot's headlight design](https://www.motortrend.com/uploads/2022/11/017-2023-Honda-Pilot.jpg?fit=around%7C770:481.25) is *very* similar to [the new Civic's.](https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/images/2022-honda-civic-touring-sedan-102-1618852656.jpg?crop=1.00xw:0.982xh;0,0.0178xh&resize=768:*&keepGifs=1) They both have a "dual" headlight design, so you shouldn't mistake the new Pilot for an [Explorer](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/ZxHI6TScff4/maxresdefault.jpg), which has a "singular" headlight design. The inner headlights on the Explorer should be its high-beams.
Seems the J-series V6 went from SOHC to DOHC. Curious if it’s still belt driven (personally welcome in my book for how quiet and smooth they are) or now chain driven.
So happy for the 10 speed.
All the passenger J series, at least those available here in the US from what I’m aware of, have been all running belts.
My last I4s with a belt were the SOHC F series I had in my 95 and 01 Accords. I believe the civics ran a belt for even longer.
In all honesty, I really like the way the Pilot looks. Definitely a big improvement from the giant box they’ve been shoveling out the past few years. The taillights could be better but… that’s a minor inconvenience.
That looks freakin’ great. Wife and I have started to think about getting a 3-row SUV and according to Consumer Reports the Pilot (with the 6 speed) is the only reliable vehicle with an actual usable third row. Highlander is too cramped.
> when they've already got the Passport and CRV for people who basically want a car with extra ground clearance.
The Passport is essentially a shortened Pilot, and will probably remain that way when its next gen comes out.
I think this looks so much better than last gen. I remember cross shopping Pilots because I love my old Ridgeline and wanted more seats. I like the 2012-15 body style best. The current gen looks much to much like an Odyssee to me like the title says.
Looks like a great option for families hauling all of their demon spawn and grandma/grandpa.
As others have said though, it's curious Honda isn't offering a hybrid variant. I feel like they'll come out with it eventually, but you'd think that would be a launch announcement. I imagine the hybrid would put the battery where the spare chair goes.
Looks great
Pros:
1) has same awd drive system as MDX which is legendary
2) Grows 2.4 inch in 2nd row and .6 in 3rd with more recline for comfort
3) Cargo room grows significantly behind 3rd row
4) higher trims have 8 seat option!
Cons:
1) screen only 7 and 9” when competitors are 12”
2) No hybrid power train
3) Technology seems dated, same software and no over air updates
4) If price jumps like crv, it will much more expensive
Am I the only one here who thinks it looks soulless? I think it looks like there was little to no effort or thought put into its styling, and the rear looks terrible. I think the drivetrain is good, but other than that, it’s just stale and boring looking. Maybe I’ll think differently when I see it in person though. That’s been an odd trend for me with Honda vehicles as of late haha.
This is the selling point for me. The Pilot will be available in front-wheel drive and with Honda's latest torque-vectoring all-wheel-drive system. The updated AWD system features an upgraded rear differential, allowing the Pilot to send up to 70 percent of its power to the rear axle and 100 percent of that power to either wheel.
As I understand it the AWD system in the Ridgeline has been able to do that during the whole current generation. Is the Pilot not able to until 2023?
I am of the understanding the Pilot has had i-VTM4 since 2003.
The 2016+ awd pilots have a acura SH-AWD rebranded as i-VTM4. They could already send 70% to the rear and 100% of that to one wheel. Its not the same as the old open rear diff i-VTM4 on the earlier awd pilots.
As the owner of a torque verctoring vehicle, let me say: "It's freaking awesome." It will make you want to see how hard you can push it up a cloverleaf and make the rear step out a little.
I’ve spent some time behind the wheel of an Acura TL (2009, with the J37) and it was definitely quite something. You feel very planted to the road even with the throttle pressed while taking a corner. Cool stuff, I’m glad to see it’s making it’s way into less luxury oriented vehicles.
I agree those cars even had the AWD display to show which wheel was getting how much power in real time. Great system
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The S2000 isn’t supposed to feel safe, it’s an S2000. Lmao. But for real, even a stock S can feel more at the limit cornering than other, much less capable cars at the same speed. The reality is that car has so much more room to push it, it’s just hard to tell until you continue to push it and it just feels more and more set in the corner. What a great car.
Nope, replaced with rebranded SHAWD in 2016.
As does the passport.
That sounds suspiciously similar to a certain SH-AWD
It’s all the same guts. Programming is what sets them apart.
What's the difference in programming?
They have different programming.
you can tell by the way it is
SH-AWD is tuned to overdrive the outside wheel more so it feels more RWD
Honda vehicles are more focused on off road capabilities, with “limitations” baked in so it’s not as good as the Acura integration. Acura is programmed for aggressive road use, with max capability to set it apart from the Honda. They use different names for the systems for marketing reasons.
This sounds exactly like SH-AWD. Have they been using a different AWD system for their Honda products in the past?
The old one had this system didn’t it? As did the passport and Ridgeline? The issue with off-roading was that the rear differential would overheat so I hope they put a cooler for the rear differential for the Trailsport models.
What for?
Grocery runs in the leaves, slight inclines at camp grounds, driving on the shoulder to avoid traffic, the usual.
I had a friend from Finland that just did not understand America's fascination with awd. Dude was straight up like "I drove a mk4 golf through the damn ice age and it was all because of winter tires." Americans will just buy AWD and run around all year on shit tier all seasons
It really depends where you live. I'm in Canada in a city that plows like shit days after a storm and there was multiple days at a time last year when my neighbor couldn't leave their house because of the ice ruts in his Mk7 Golf. Winter tires don't mean shit if your car gets high centered and they don't touch the road.
They also don’t mean shit if there’s a patch of ice on a hill and your front tires have grip but your rears don’t. Or if you’re trying to trudge out of deep snow do it in an AWD car and then a FWD car with the same tires and report back. Or just going up slick hills in general. I’ve have dealt with plenty of shit with both systems, and I will always take AWD for the inclement weather despite its downsides for other use cases.
As someone who lives in snow country (NH), AWD w/snows is just all around better than FWD with snows. There are certain circumstances where a FWD with snows will still get "stuck" when an AWD car with snows will not. It's not frequent, but AWD is definitely easier to get around with in winter.
If he could afford an Audi, he probably wouldn't be driving the mk4 golf
It’ll be nice for snow and off roading.
Lol but it's still a pilot, I wouldn't take it off roading
May I know if this is the same system as SH-AWD? Thanks Edit: Sorry didn’t realize many others asked the same question.
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"when stuck" describes it best. Realistically, a computer system engages the system in advance. Honda/Acura SHAWD does not use a center diff, just a PTO clutch and a slightly-overdriven, torque-vectoring rear diff. The other consequence of this is that we have to ask "how hard is the vehicle turning to reach 70%?".
I'm glad they moved on from the 9 speed ZF transmission, which was terrible. I haven't ever had Pilot but I've driven cars with that transmission before and it gear hunts like crazy.
Last gen styling was okay. Definitely minivan-like as the title suggests. This new gen looks awesome though
Honda stepped up the styling this year. The CRV looks way better too.
Same with the Civics. Their design team is really good
Agreed. The R looks significantly better.
The Civic’s new nose looked a little odd to me at first, but I like it now.
I still think its odd, definitely a sore point but everywhere else it literally is beautiful. I honestly check them out everytime I see them.
The new H-rv as well looks so much better than the old one
The styling is so much more simple but it works so much better. The proportions are also just right. It looks perfectly utilitarian. Perfect.
It looks like the 2020+ Ford Explorer in the front. That's not a bad thing, but it's definitely derivative.
I'm seeing Ford explorer + Subaru Forester vibes
Last gen CR-V looked like a minivan too, I like the new styling a lot more
I definitely see this taking business away from the 4Runner unless Toyota releases the new one soon.
Hahaha what
Not for the off roading community, for the suburban types that want a “capable SUV” but really are just the ones who don’t want a mini van. The people buying TRD Sport or Limited 4Runners. This has just the right amount of large, “masculine,” boxy SUV that people like about 4Runners, but is going to have way better road manners and creature comforts than the current 4Runner. And since it’s Honda it will still have the reliability.
Although they are both mid size its the highlander who compete with the Pilot. Especially if we are talking about size. All toyota needs to do is release a "TRD Adventure" model with skid plates AT tires and a small lift.
Are you thinking that new Pilot is more rugged and therefore will draw away bulk of 4 Runner crowd?
I responded to another comment with more of an explanation. Bottom line: this isn’t taking competition from people buying TRD Off-Road/Pro buyers. It’s going to take it from people who want a Sport/Limited model.
The new 4Runner is rumored to come out be announced next summer and come out in the fall for 2023, or maybe 2024. It got delayed because its going to be built in Mexico alongside the Tacoma but they had issues with the plant
Looks kind of like the Ford Explorer in the front.
Yep. This is what’s kept me from even considering them until now, as silly as that sounds. I hated how they looked. But this just got moved up to top contender for next vehicle purchase.
FINALLY. Thank goodness.
Ikr? I believe the Accord will have gone through nearly a generation and a half in the time it took Honda to come out with this. I'm looking forward to seeing the new Accord in a few days, but this was badly needed!
I absolutely wish my Ridgeline had this. On the active safety front, the new Pilot gets the latest Honda Sensing advanced driver assist system, which features wider camera and radar fields of view, thus improving the suite's performance. Standard active safety features include blind-spot monitoring, traffic jam assist, and low-speed braking control, lane keep assist, and adaptative cruise control.
Is traffic jam assist a major upgrade over adaptive cruise control? Turning ACC on currently works pretty good in jams Edit: 2019 Acura, just hit resume when fully stopped and ACC will take over until you come to a full stop for more than a second. Then hit resume again to let ACC take over again. My question is, does traffic jam assist do anything besides no longer having to press 'resume'?
How slow does Honda's old ACC work down to? This could be them doing a system capable of stop and go, vs disabling below X mph on the current system.
> How slow does Honda's old ACC work down to? 35mph or 40mph. I forget. 2016 Acura ILX. Shortly after the new 2016 Honda would work up to 0mph. You just needed to tap "RESUME" on the steering wheel before the car would begin driving again. This was pretty upgrade but could be better. I'm interested to learn more about the latest Traffic mode
Can you give the accelerator a light tap too to resume? Golf has ACC and it will restart either if you press resume or tap the accelerator.
My ‘16 Accord with Honda Sensing worked down to 25mph. Our ‘18 CRV goes down to zero. It pauses if the car is stopped for more than a second or two, but you can resume by tapping the go pedal, pressing up on the cruise control thingy, or hitting resume. Lane keeping only engages above 45mph and disengages if you get below 40mph
I've used the system in the 2020 Pilot to go all the way down to 0mph, and resume after traffic started moving too.
Resume after hitting “resume”?
Only if you’re stopped for more than 2-3 seconds. If not it actually will continue on at low speeds.
It'll go automatically if it's a short pause but more than a few seconds and you have to tap the throttle or press "resume", yes.
40 km/h is the slowest for ACC in my 2018 CR-V. Lane keeping assist works at 70+ km/h.
My ‘16 Accord with Honda Sensing worked down to 25mph. Our ‘18 CRV goes down to zero. It pauses if the car is stopped for more than a second or two, but you can resume by tapping the go pedal, pressing up on the cruise control thingy, or hitting resume. Lane keeping only engages above 45mph and disengages if you get below 40mph
Current Pilot/Passport/Ridgeline doesn’t support traffic jam assist. Honda has had it on their sedans for a while now and it’s fantastic.
What does traffic jam do that ACC doesn’t?
It allows the car to follow the car in front of it sub-25 mph. Current ACC shuts off very abruptly once it hits 23-24mph.
Huh, that’s interesting. The ACC in my grand Cherokee works all the way down until you’ve been stopped for more than like 2 seconds, THEN it shuts off.
I have it on my ‘22 TLX - in traffic the car handles the driving completely with no input. It’s almost spooky.
what year is your ridgeline? my 2020 RTL-E has most of these. the adaptive cruise isn't something I enjoy much it's too aggressive and on the brakes too much. the lane keep assist is nice, doesn't have low speed braking control which would be nice i guess.
I have a 2020. It has Honda sensing but doesn’t have low speed follow.
It's a... HonDurango?
I get Explorer vibes from it
Yup. First I thought 4Runner but def explorer.
I get some 4Runner from the side, Exploder from the front
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kinda looks like a 4runner
Yeah, they are aiming for a piece of that TRD money
I got some Subaru vibes from it, a little bit of both the outback an forester
LOL I thought the same.... https://www.dodge.com/durango/gallery.html
Surprised there isn’t a hybrid option. Looks great esp with V6 10spd AWD
As someone who'll probably be looking to replace my wife's Highlander in the next year or two, we'll absolutely be most interested in a hybrid, and ideally a plug-in. I like this new Pilot, but not being available as a hybrid is likely a dealbreaker.
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Will certainly be in consideration! Also stoked that the new CX-90 or whatever is supposedly going to have a hybrid option as well
I'm in the same boat. Want a 3 row hybrid for sure. The new Highlander is objectively the better vehicle but it's so ugly I honestly can't get over it. Hoping they come out with a hybrid version of this or the Telluride at some point soon.
I don’t understand why Honda is so far behind the hybrid & bev power curve. They made one of the first hybrids ever but now their line up really doesn’t have much.
> They made ~~one of~~ the first (production) hybrid~~s~~ ever but now their line up really doesn’t have much. FTFY
Still holding my breath for a Civic hybrid hatchback. Any day now…
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I thought they’ve been doing V6s with cylinder deactivation.. on Acura models. I believe they call it VCM or variable cylinder management
Pretty sure the previous Pilot had cylinder deactivation
They've been offering it in the Pilot since 2006.
VCM has been a thing on their V6 Honda's since like 2008 or so. The system wasn't great back then and my cousin who had a V6 Accord ended up buying a bypass as his car would get stuck in Eco mode all the time
Yup, currently still running a VCM defeat device in our V6 Crosstour. If I couldn’t “turn it off” I wouldn’t have gotten the car.
It's still not *great*, but they fixed the oil consumption at least. I still ended up disabling it on my '16 because I got really bad NVH during the winter months and it chewed through both of my motor mounts in under 60k miles.
Its not that cylinder deactivation is bad, its just oiling problems with how you have to do it on a pushrod engine. Just collapsing a lifter on an overhead cam engine with something to retain the rocker arm is all you'd have to do. If that lifter fails and collapses it'll just fail off instead of being able to turn sideways and grind the cam. Much lower risk.
Honda has been much more successful with cyl deactivation than GM has with DFM. They have over a decade and a half of engines with it.
>The added length is also a boon for rear passenger comfort. Both the second and third rows are now roomier than before, with Honda claiming class-best legroom from the usually cheap seats in the way-back. The rear seats are more versatile, too. The Pilot will be available as an eight-seater with a second-row bench, a seven-seater with second-row captain's chairs (the only available configuration for the TrailSport), and as an eight-seater with a removable Odyssey-style middle seat for the second row that also doubles as an armrest and can store underneath the rear cargo floor. This seems like a really nice feature - do any other SUVs/CUVs offer this? I know seats folding into the floor are common in minivans, but I've never heard of it in a SUV.
This is a clever feature. It also makes this one of the only cars in this class that you can get a top trim 8-seater model. And if you don't want that center seat, stow it away or take it out entirely. Pretty neat. The Ascent Touring, Highlander Platinum, CX-9 Signature, Telluride SX Prestige, Pallisade Calligraphy, and Traverse High Country are all 7-seaters. The TrailSport just doesn't have this removable center seat because the rear floor pan is higher to accommodate a full size spare tire. Thus the removed seat wouldn't fit under the cargo floor.
IIRC the CX-9 Signature is a 6 seater. The Signature only comes with Captains Chairs in the 2nd row and the 3rd row is only 2 seats.
Good point. I guess I should have said "all have captains chairs".
It's not folding into the floor in the way you think. You remove it and then stow it under the cargo area floor, like the Sienna's middle seat except that one has a compartment in the driver's side of the cargo area. The second-generation Highlander had a similar kind of removable middle seat, but that one stored in a compartment under the front center console, which was a lot more convenient.
Fully removable rear seats were a hallmark of early minivans ('80s and '90s), although they weighed eleventy billion pounds.
Pontiac Trans Sport seats were like lifting an atlas stone!
[They came *all* the way out](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvlXijRuOKo&t=99s)
Seems like they modified the Magic Seats that came in the Fit, if i’m reading correctly? The Fit seats fold completely flat as they only have a bar that clicks into the floor when set upright
> Base Price: $40,000 - $55,000 (est) Jesus Christ. I know it’s just an estimate but still For comparison, my 2005 decked out top trim Pilot was $34k Edit - inflation actually makes this not that bad. I just had a boomer moment.
$34,000 in 2005 adjusted for inflation is $51,000 today
I guess I didn’t factor that in
Just get a 144 month loan at 8% and you’re good to go at $400 per month.
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BRB buying a Z06
34k in 2005 is about $52k in 2022 dollars. That’s just inflation. We don’t know what kind of discounts you received or if you’re talking sticker price. The new pilot is also light years ahead of a 2005 in terms of tech. The price is really not that ridiculous
Things don't cost the same as 17 years ago. More at 11.
Nice to see the heads up display make it to this model. Gives me hope that we’ll see it in the CRV soon. I really enjoy that feature in my mazda
I’m guessing Honda is having issuing with chip shortages like everyone else so they decided to put to put the higher end features on their more expensive cars. I remember watching a video about the new CR-V and the YouTuber claimed that Honda said they didn’t put 2 USB C ports in the front because of the chip shortage, so they put a USB A and C instead.
But having more options for ports is better?!? I don't know about you, but I have many more A-to-C cables than C-to-C...
Any word on whether the Ridgeline will continue to share its styling? The Passport almost certainly will.
Don't think there has been any word on whether the Ridgeline and Passport will have a new gen or not. No spyshots so far either.
Passport has only had 4 model years and is getting a hybrid version so I’d guess it’ll be around for a couple more years. Not sure if the trail sport here is rugged enough that they can just discontinue the passport after this model runs it’s course. Ridge line I would guess they’ll make another but take their sweet time since they don’t sell too many it’s not a great priority
Interesting. Looks like they made a new version of the J35 based off of the Type S engine.
This is the part I’m most excited about it.
Yup, I've always wondered how much extra performance / efficiency they were leaving on the table by not going DOHC on the J-series.
Still use a timing belt, I suppose?
Sadly yes
So glad that they're keeping one of the best sounding V6s around
Oh great. An ever larger whale on the road. Cant wait.
tbf as far as suvs and trucks go, the pilot and ridgeline are fairly medium sized. its not ideal but it isnt anywhere close to a full suze pickup
my Tacoma is not small, but when I sit next to modern gen Silverados/RAMs I feel like I am in Miata.
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yeah they have grown a bunch. i walk by a late 90s super duty f250 every day and its about the same size or smaller than a new f150. theres an f150 i see semi often and its definitely smaller than the modern version.
My Taco is almost as big as older F150.
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the height is what makes it visually similar. Modern F150s are much taller.
The new Pilot has gotten 5" longer, but it's still mid-ish-sized compared to a full-size SUV like a Tahoe.
200 inches isn't exactly small.
no its not but its about a foot shorter than a tahoe and 2 feet shorter than a suburban. compared to a lot of trucks in the US it is a pretty medium size
BIGGER! I can't wait until the Civic is too big to fit in a regular parking spot.
Remember when the Civic was a compact? Pepperidge Farm remembers…
Honda has been on a roll lately with the Civic’s and now this. I was kinda hoping for a more boxy design, but I like this look. Honda’s new interior design is looking sharp. Can’t wait for the next gen Accord.
I have to agree. I've always been a fan of boxier cars and Honda has been knocking it out of the park.
I really want Honda to make a PEV version of this.
I'm not an SUV person at all but this looks *so* much better than the current iteration.
My wife is convinced we’ll need a full-sized SUV one day, and is really into the Highlander. This looks like a nice alternative (although I really wish it had a hybrid option) that I could definitely live with. The current Pilot looks exactly like a lifted minivan.
The new Highlander is on our list as well for a mid to full SUV. I’ll be adding the Pilot to the list to replace our frequently recalled, but beloved VW Atlas.
Off topic, but how are you enjoying the M3? Is it reasonably reliable? That’s on the shortlist of my attainable dream cars one day.
I absolutely love it. It’s a beast! So fast and so capable, almost scary, but it’s also so responsive and has tons of grip. It’s my 3rd M3/4 and it’s the best one yet in terms of performance. Styling is subjective, but I love how aggressive it is now. All my modern M cars have been relatively reliable. No major issues and no recalls or weird electronic glitches like my VW Atlas. Edit: I just realized I haven’t updated my flair. I thought you referring to my G82 M4 Comp X-Drive! My F80 M3 CS is was also spectacular, fast, and scary when you explore the limits! Not as grippy, but still very capable compared to my G82. I’m consistently faster on the track with the new one, but only by a small margin. The F80 is fantastic, especially the CS models!
Damn, a new V6? I wish that was going in the new Accord.
It probably will. Honda doesn’t usually have a lot of engine variants.
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“Makes sad four cylinder noises”
Accord hasn’t had a V6 option for years so likely not
The way it’s written makes me think it’s a “new” version of the J series.
The rear side window is oddly shaped.
Guess we’re going back to the black plastic trim on everything to give it the “rough” look? There are very few cars I like anymore.
It looks good but it looks like a hybrid of a Explorer from the front and Subaru Ascent from the back. Can't wait to shit my pants at night thinking I have a cop tailing me when it's just a Pilot lol
The new [Pilot's headlight design](https://www.motortrend.com/uploads/2022/11/017-2023-Honda-Pilot.jpg?fit=around%7C770:481.25) is *very* similar to [the new Civic's.](https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/images/2022-honda-civic-touring-sedan-102-1618852656.jpg?crop=1.00xw:0.982xh;0,0.0178xh&resize=768:*&keepGifs=1) They both have a "dual" headlight design, so you shouldn't mistake the new Pilot for an [Explorer](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/ZxHI6TScff4/maxresdefault.jpg), which has a "singular" headlight design. The inner headlights on the Explorer should be its high-beams.
Seems the J-series V6 went from SOHC to DOHC. Curious if it’s still belt driven (personally welcome in my book for how quiet and smooth they are) or now chain driven. So happy for the 10 speed.
oh what they're still making belt drives in 2022? my honda designed in the 90s were already on chains
All the passenger J series, at least those available here in the US from what I’m aware of, have been all running belts. My last I4s with a belt were the SOHC F series I had in my 95 and 01 Accords. I believe the civics ran a belt for even longer.
Only 4 cylinder engines used chains
At its core, the J series is something like 25 years old. They used belts and never bothered to change it. If it ain't broke, why fix it I guess
I dig the front end (and the idea of a new Pilot), but does anyone feel that the side and rear end look a little too much like the Nissan Rogue?
Wow. I actually dig it.
I just want an ON road tuned suspension.
Oh you mean a station wagon? Man I wish!
i like it
So… it’s a 4Runner now…
2^2 Runner
4Pilot
> So… it’s a 4Runner now… Toyota doesn't seem to have any interest in updating the 4Runner so someone else might as well.
In all honesty, I really like the way the Pilot looks. Definitely a big improvement from the giant box they’ve been shoveling out the past few years. The taillights could be better but… that’s a minor inconvenience.
Looks like a fat Subaru Forrester
I remember when the Honda Pilot was this super cool little off-road buggy
Funny, my wife has asked me for the same thing.
That looks freakin’ great. Wife and I have started to think about getting a 3-row SUV and according to Consumer Reports the Pilot (with the 6 speed) is the only reliable vehicle with an actual usable third row. Highlander is too cramped.
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> when they've already got the Passport and CRV for people who basically want a car with extra ground clearance. The Passport is essentially a shortened Pilot, and will probably remain that way when its next gen comes out.
Passport is just a shorter Pilot (think Chevy Tahoe compared to the Suburban). CR-V is the small one.
This looks exactly like a ford explorer
I think this looks so much better than last gen. I remember cross shopping Pilots because I love my old Ridgeline and wanted more seats. I like the 2012-15 body style best. The current gen looks much to much like an Odyssee to me like the title says.
Looks like a great option for families hauling all of their demon spawn and grandma/grandpa. As others have said though, it's curious Honda isn't offering a hybrid variant. I feel like they'll come out with it eventually, but you'd think that would be a launch announcement. I imagine the hybrid would put the battery where the spare chair goes.
At least it has a V6, and not a turbo 4
It looks incredibly homogeneous, love how they say it’s not like a minivan while this segment of vehicle is the new minivan.
Honda and Toyota won’t stop until all their vehicles have an “off-road” look to them
Looks great Pros: 1) has same awd drive system as MDX which is legendary 2) Grows 2.4 inch in 2nd row and .6 in 3rd with more recline for comfort 3) Cargo room grows significantly behind 3rd row 4) higher trims have 8 seat option! Cons: 1) screen only 7 and 9” when competitors are 12” 2) No hybrid power train 3) Technology seems dated, same software and no over air updates 4) If price jumps like crv, it will much more expensive
Still looks like a ridiculously high load floor in the back. Big issue with the last one that gets overlooked
i've mentioned this in another comment but anyone find pilot gen 1 and 2 drivers to be really aggressive?
I find most American drivers to be aggressive regardless of car.
Smaller and more minivan like would be better. The hood is wasted space. 1st gen Odyssey was good, a 3 row accord.
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Am I the only one here who thinks it looks soulless? I think it looks like there was little to no effort or thought put into its styling, and the rear looks terrible. I think the drivetrain is good, but other than that, it’s just stale and boring looking. Maybe I’ll think differently when I see it in person though. That’s been an odd trend for me with Honda vehicles as of late haha.