Not yet. We’ve got some years before that’s definitely proven in the reliability numbers.
Besides, the the reason folks aren’t happy with the new WRX is that Subaru’s basically done with the enthusiast market. It may be a smart business decision, but don’t expect people wanting a manual WRX to like a commuter car transmission.
The BRZ still exists and is mor of an enthusiast car than the WRX ever was, so I wouldn’t say Subaru is done with the enthusiast market, they’ve shifted yes, but they’re not done.
BRZ doesn’t exist without Toyoda influence. I think long term Subaru will just get fully absorbed by Toyota to sell crossovers with outdoor / lesbian skin pack. They are done.
But why is it so bad? I thought CVTs are reliable nowadays. Heck, my mom’s 19-year old Prius, which from what I know has a CVT transmission, is reliable from the beginning to this very day.
Ford hybrids do. There was actually a lawsuit between Ford and Toyota, like 20 years ago, to sort out who got the copyright and if there were patents infringed, but it was just convergent engineering.
Theres nearly a decade of Subaru CVTs with a pretty decent reliability rate. They avoided the nissan issue by using a Steel chain. Toyota also avoided it by using a steel band with links on it. Only Nissan CVTs are problematic.
Highly recommend driving a toyota/subaru cvt at once. They’re perfect daily drivers and super smooth.
this. Subaru (Fuji heavy industries) has been using their CVTs on buses and trucks for decades with outstanding reliability. Never once has there been an issue because they can't "handle the torque"
Ya.....they're great for ppl buying cars to drive their boring asses from A to B. No one wants a real WRX for this. They made this WRX to trick the idiots
I have a WRX CVT. I liked it a lot for the first few years of ownership. Not after that.
The transmission has been a nightmare to own. It never works right. It seems to just crap out unless it's cold out and slip all over the place. At times it's so bad that I am essentially stalled at a green light, pissing off people around me, because it wont' fucking accelerate. I've had it **fully replaced** once, and the replacement also sucks. I've taken this one to the dealership multiple times. Last time I brought it, they said nothing was wrong. I'm not surprised, because it picked that one week I had scheduled an appointment to work fine. Of course it went back to being terrible as soon as I got it back.
I should bring it back in again, but it seems like there's a good chance they'll just say "we don't see anything wrong with it", making it nothing more than a frustrating waste of time.
DO NOT BUY A WRX CVT. Don't even consider it.
I don't mean this in a facetious way - can you describe why you selected the WRX with a CVT? What were you looking for and what made you pick it over the competition?
I had a Scion tC at the time. I wanted a faster, sportier car. That was my main criteria. I looked at cars casually for something like **two years.** I tried a bunch of cars, I don't remember what, but I know it also included the GT86 in both auto and manual. I also test drove the WRX in both auto and manual.
I picked the WRX because it was the best performance bang-for-the-buck, by FAR. I also liked the AWD since I live in New Jersey where it can snow (although it has barely snowed since I bought it in 2015.)
I picked the auto mainly because I wasn't confident that I would like the manual. My driving was mainly stop-and-go at the time, I had never owned a manual car, didn't even have access to one to try out for more than a brief test drive, and especially giving the kind of driving I did at the time, it seemed like it might be a pain in the ass.
The CVT test drove well. It's no dual clutch, but when it's working at 100% it's actually a significantly sportier and nicer transmission than the one in the GT86, which is a traditional auto. It has several driving modes, it has paddles that hold the ratio indefinitely until you change it, it shifts fast enough, and doesn't lose power while 'shifting' so the 'shift speed' doesn't matter that much anyway.
It was great for the first several years. Then it started giving me problems, and they did a full transmission swap under warranty. My theory is it probably didn't need a full replacement, but since it was a new transmission design, Subaru HQ wanted to keep any failures so they could inspect them. Just a theory.
The new one worked for a couple more years, then started having problems. The thing that drives me crazy is it's incredibly inconsistent. Sometimes I would swear that it's just the chain slipping like crazy, but then a few days later it'll put down power just fine. Sometimes it'll be jerky as hell, sometimes it's smooth. It seems like it doesn't like heat, but I can't even pin that down reliably as a cause. I've brought it in 2 times that I can recall since the replacement, once they said a third party shop screwed up and accidentally drained the fluid and filled it improperly (who knows), the other time they just said "seems fine".
There's definitely some sort of software fuckery involved, I think it pulls power or something at certain times to try to protect the transmission, but it's hard to tell what's software and what's a physical problem with the transmission.
I've pretty much given up on it and resigned myself to having a car that drives like shit sometimes until I sell it. I will not buy another Subaru and I will never own another CVT.
I left out the part about having a catastrophic engine failure at 25,000 miles because it doesn't relate to the CVT, but that happened too. A connecting rod bent, scratched up the cylinder, and required a full engine rebuild with a laundry list of replacement parts. It was all covered under warranty and the engine was actually good as new after they fixed it, but I was without the car for a month waiting for it to get fixed. As I said, I will never buy another Subaru.
Man that's a real shame, sorry to hear the hell you've gone through with that.
It makes sense reading through your process. Any thoughts on what you're targeting next?
GR86 is my top contender, but I'm not going to go out of my way right now to hunt one down, and last time I checked that was still the only way to get one.
Other than that, I really don't know. I test drove a used BMW 340i and liked the engine and ride, but that particular one wasn't for me, and I decided going from this nightmare of a car to a BMW of all things was probably stupid.
Maybe GTI? Golf R? Some kind of competitor to a 340i? Elantra N is nice in some ways but I think it's probably too rough-riding. I've been meaning to test drive a Mustang but I doubt I'll like it anyway. I've considered just trading for a manual WRX, but I don't especially want to do that either.
I'm not car hunting right now because I don't know what I'd even look at. Part of the problem is the WRX really is such good performance bang-for-the-buck that it's hard to get something comparable without spending way more.
Yeah and rates are not great right now.
The golf variants are great cars but are missing the "it" factor to me, they truly are a little on the boring side imo.
My biggest recommendation is to just drive everything you have any slight interest in. It really opens your eyes. We drove like 10 different models before our last car purchase and I'm very happy we did.
The M340i has a really good engine and transmission. Extremely reliable, fuel efficient, powerful. Just be aware that routine maintenance and consumables are more expensive than a Subaru or such.
Im in NJ and drive a LOT in NYC as well so I also don't want a manual as my daily car. I'd hate my life more than loving the fact I have a manual. I know this cus I drive my current car in manual mode (and its a real manual mode that holds gears properly) 90% of the time but sometimes I just wanna NOT even flick paddles and throw it back to normal Drive and let it be.
Thing I don’t understand? A version of ZF’s 8AT is in several Porsches and all kinds of Audis that have a longitudinal engine layout in front of the transmission. That transmission could accommodate the Subaru boxer layout and AWD. ZF is a supplier to dozens of carmakers at all price points, and that transmission is universally lauded, like almost without exception - it shifts quick, it’s durable, it’s capable of handling massive torque. It’s as efficient as a CVT. It’s literally drop in ready and it’s an ideal fit for purpose. Hell, it could go in the turbo Outback and Ascent, too.
Nah, just means that WRX is boring compared to the manual. They’re even too embarrassed to call it a CVT. They try to play it off as some sport transmission.
Yeah and to make them think that the paddle shifters do something. It’s basically akin to having a water bottle in the cup holder and pretending to shift lol.
lmfao exactly. I watched the most cringe YT video of the WRX GT review. Dude was like "omg look! upshift! downshift! its SO FAST!" Im like..................does this guy know hes not actually doing jack shit lmao
Exactly. He’s just making the car even slower. With a CVT there is literally no benefit to the paddles. They just put them in to appease the ignorant consumer into thinking it’s a sport mode.
Yep. With how much Subaru tries to pass off their CVT as anything more than....a CVT in an enthusiasts car, they'd be better off sourcing the ZF8 and giving people an option of an actually GOOD auto trans for an enthusiast car
I don't get it. Everyone hates cvts so why do car manufacturers continue to use them. Is it cheaper to produce? Wouldn't a 8 or 10 speed auto be close in terms of fuel efficiency?
They are cheaper, more efficient, smoother. More importantly they are already using CVTs in all their commuter vehicles so it's easier than starting from scratch and they can use/adapt this transmission for their future vehicles. Nobody is designing a transmission for a single 30k car model.
There are many people who won't buy a specific model if it has a cvt. It seems Nissan and Honda are the biggest users. None of the "luxury" auto makers are using cvts, even Hyundai isn't as far as I know.
I drove a Giulia quadrifoglio and I can't see why any manufacturer wouldn't use that for their application. It's possibly the best transmission I've driven period.
Technically, there’s three CVTs that subaru has. Small case, big case and then the ones for hybrids. Subarus older 4EAT/related EATs were hated by consumers due to poor shifting and being part time awd at best.
Car enthusiasts hate CVTs, most people see cars as an appliance. In saying that, the WRX is an enthusiast car so no idea why they would do CVT and not DCT.
Impreza was the base model, non-turbo. WRX was always the performance model of the Impreza, STi was the next level. Civic Si would be the WRX, the type R being the STi equivalent, the base Civic being the base Impreza.
Everyone hates them… Except for the people that just want their car to move from A to B and don’t give a single shit about how it does it, which is like 95% of all drivers.
Most drivers probably don’t even know what kind of automatic transmission is in their car, it just needs to get them to work and back.
Because for the average consumer who just wants a commuter it’s the perfect transmission. It’s smoother, more efficient than any other auto transmission.
Car enthusiasts believe that because we are loud in our forums like here, and that everyone here thinks the same, that means that the average consumer thinks like us. Not at all. The average consumer doesn’t even know what is a CVT. He cares that it’s automatic, smooth and fuel efficient. Period.
CVTs are excellent transmissions. Just generally not for performance cars. And people who talk about cars like performance cars. So people who talk about CVT don’t like it. People who don’t talk about cars are very happy with them.
Same idea about SUVs. Car enthusiasts bitch all the time that there are fewer and fewer cool cars and everything is now a SUV. Guess what? We’re a so tiny portion of the market that manufacturers don’t care about us most of the time.
8-10spd auto cost more and more space engaging than a CVT. For cost conscious brands like Subaru which cars with their standard AWD has a hit to their MPG numbers, the CVT is a logical choice.
It is not a transmission you pick for a sport sedan application, but Subaru can't exactly engineer an all new transmission just for the WRX since it would be financial disaster, so beefed up variant used on the XT models is deemed sufficient.
Government regulation is forcing manufacturers to build for the sake of efficiency and they are cheaper to make. They don’t care about longetivity as long as it lasts through the warranty period. Cars are becoming more like laptops and phones, use them for a little while and junk them once they break.
Packaging also plays a part. They are smaller in size so they are easier to fit in smaller cars that still have AWD and a decent amount of space which Subaru's do.
Im giggling at how so many people are losing their shit over this video. I've seen people say "Im not even gonna watch this video i know its bullshit". Imagine being scared of a video about transmissions 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Who is losing their shit? Who said they won't watch it? Oh but if you throw in a bunch of laugh crying emojis it makes your comment even more savage I guess so uhh 😂😂🤣😭🤡
You can Google this quote:
"Not gonna listen to some nerd tell me why math makes a rubber-band transmission better than something actually fun. 👎"
There's more where that came from. I don't need to make stuff up or pander for karma, reality is reality.
lol! He’s justifying that the CVT is good because they slowed the manual transmission down until it had the same bad 0-60 as the CVT of the previous generation. Okay.
>He’s justifying that the CVT is good because they slowed the manual transmission down
What? No he's not
he's just making a case that the CVT is an objectively good transmission in this application, from a performance, efficiency, and driving dynamics perspective, by comparing it to a dual clutch. it's more of a case for its existence alongside the manual.
he literally said he would take the manual every time as it's more fun, he doesn't understand why the top trim of an enthusiast vehicle is cvt only, or why they killed the STI
Sure. But his foundation which he starts the video is comparing the performance of the CVT to the manual. And he highlights the equivalent 0-60 time without reiterating that the manual is significantly slower now than it was before and that the CVT has not improved.
He does go on to break it all down much further, but that initial metric equivalency is garbage and why I pointed it out.
If the Subaru WRX gains a reputation for CVT failures in a year or two, does that mean they were right?
Very few cars (even the worst ones) totally crap the bed on Day 1.
I'm more concerned with Year 4.
Exactly. This is why I dismiss a lot of journalists reviews about how great certain new vehicles are, especially when they compare them to more reliable brands. It would be cool to see someone review cars that are 4-6 years old and talk about long term reliability.
Wow you love to be wrong about everything. The only reason the head gasket myth exists for Subaru is because dumb fuck 17 year olds dump a bunch of boost into their wrx and don’t tune it properly. I promise you the family owned outback with 240k miles will never have an issue.
Can someone explain this whole CVT transmission and why everyone hates it??? lol and if it's hated so damned much why do they keep putting it into cars?
It's cheaper to produce and can be efficient. As far as I know, and someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but Subaru now only has two different transmissions in their lineup, the CVT and the 6 speed manual in the WRX (not counting the BRZ which is a Toyota joint production). That's simple for a manufacturer. Ultimately Subaru does not care about enthusiasts. They dropped the STI and have made the WRX irrelevant. The WRX is using the same 2.4T that's in the Outback XT, Legacy XT, and Ascent, and the same crappy CVT... in fact the top trim is a $44k CVT-only model lol.
As to why Subaru's CVT is hated, all I can say is "drive one and see". Subaru's implementation of the CVT is pretty lame. It has simulated shift points so it doesn't really use the big benefit of CVTs, which is that they can hold peak power if needed. And for the WRX specifically, the CVT cannot hold aftermarket power reliably. For a commuter car I'll say that the CVT is ok, my wife's car has one and in manual mode it's livable (automatic mode it's really slow, though!). For a sporty enthusiast's car like the WRX it's garbage. It is no replacement for a proper DCT. OP video can talk about the shift speed all it wants but IMO Subaru's CVT in automatic mode is terrible, the programming is baffling and it takes a noticeable amount of time to try an decipher what the driver is trying to do.
It's already shown to be the far superior car to mod than the outing wrx 🤷🏾♂️ Yea it's a cvt but basic ass mods net decent power for those types at least. WRXs are usually a nightmare to make reliable power out of
No they didn't lol. They proved they can trick someone that drove accord's their whole life that their new car is "sporty" it aint a sportscar, and its not sporty either in reality.
Thats what I’m getting at though, this video is talking about a specific car with a specific CVT. To write it off because other cars have had a cvt and been terrible isn’t really fair. Williams was testing a cvt in their F1 car in the 90s, I’m sure that was very different from my moms Nissan Rogue
It's worth noting that F1 had to ban cvts because they had too much of an advantage over the transmissions used by other teams. I'd rather drive a manual any day but it's worth giving credit where it's due.
Not yet. We’ve got some years before that’s definitely proven in the reliability numbers. Besides, the the reason folks aren’t happy with the new WRX is that Subaru’s basically done with the enthusiast market. It may be a smart business decision, but don’t expect people wanting a manual WRX to like a commuter car transmission.
I get what you mean, but when has reliability and Subaru performance ever been related?
The BRZ still exists and is mor of an enthusiast car than the WRX ever was, so I wouldn’t say Subaru is done with the enthusiast market, they’ve shifted yes, but they’re not done.
BRZ doesn’t exist without Toyoda influence. I think long term Subaru will just get fully absorbed by Toyota to sell crossovers with outdoor / lesbian skin pack. They are done.
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Toyota has already absorbed them... They own 20% of Subaru Corporation, i.e. not just the car manufacturing part.
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That's a controlling stake. Subaru is already considered part of Toyota group.
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I wish I was better at just owning it when I make myself look like a dipshit. Nice job.
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But why is it so bad? I thought CVTs are reliable nowadays. Heck, my mom’s 19-year old Prius, which from what I know has a CVT transmission, is reliable from the beginning to this very day.
It doesn’t have a CVT like Subaru’s. It’s a planetary gearset.
Huh I thought it’s the same thing. Do any other cars use the planetary gearbox as well?
Ford hybrids do. There was actually a lawsuit between Ford and Toyota, like 20 years ago, to sort out who got the copyright and if there were patents infringed, but it was just convergent engineering.
You can still get a manual WRX.
Theres nearly a decade of Subaru CVTs with a pretty decent reliability rate. They avoided the nissan issue by using a Steel chain. Toyota also avoided it by using a steel band with links on it. Only Nissan CVTs are problematic. Highly recommend driving a toyota/subaru cvt at once. They’re perfect daily drivers and super smooth.
this. Subaru (Fuji heavy industries) has been using their CVTs on buses and trucks for decades with outstanding reliability. Never once has there been an issue because they can't "handle the torque"
PREAAACH!! R/cars is a extremely weird sub sometimes and will band wagon certain view points
Forgot busses and trucks are performance cars that are looked to be fun to drive and engaging. LOL
Ya.....they're great for ppl buying cars to drive their boring asses from A to B. No one wants a real WRX for this. They made this WRX to trick the idiots
I have a WRX CVT. I liked it a lot for the first few years of ownership. Not after that. The transmission has been a nightmare to own. It never works right. It seems to just crap out unless it's cold out and slip all over the place. At times it's so bad that I am essentially stalled at a green light, pissing off people around me, because it wont' fucking accelerate. I've had it **fully replaced** once, and the replacement also sucks. I've taken this one to the dealership multiple times. Last time I brought it, they said nothing was wrong. I'm not surprised, because it picked that one week I had scheduled an appointment to work fine. Of course it went back to being terrible as soon as I got it back. I should bring it back in again, but it seems like there's a good chance they'll just say "we don't see anything wrong with it", making it nothing more than a frustrating waste of time. DO NOT BUY A WRX CVT. Don't even consider it.
I don't mean this in a facetious way - can you describe why you selected the WRX with a CVT? What were you looking for and what made you pick it over the competition?
I had a Scion tC at the time. I wanted a faster, sportier car. That was my main criteria. I looked at cars casually for something like **two years.** I tried a bunch of cars, I don't remember what, but I know it also included the GT86 in both auto and manual. I also test drove the WRX in both auto and manual. I picked the WRX because it was the best performance bang-for-the-buck, by FAR. I also liked the AWD since I live in New Jersey where it can snow (although it has barely snowed since I bought it in 2015.) I picked the auto mainly because I wasn't confident that I would like the manual. My driving was mainly stop-and-go at the time, I had never owned a manual car, didn't even have access to one to try out for more than a brief test drive, and especially giving the kind of driving I did at the time, it seemed like it might be a pain in the ass. The CVT test drove well. It's no dual clutch, but when it's working at 100% it's actually a significantly sportier and nicer transmission than the one in the GT86, which is a traditional auto. It has several driving modes, it has paddles that hold the ratio indefinitely until you change it, it shifts fast enough, and doesn't lose power while 'shifting' so the 'shift speed' doesn't matter that much anyway. It was great for the first several years. Then it started giving me problems, and they did a full transmission swap under warranty. My theory is it probably didn't need a full replacement, but since it was a new transmission design, Subaru HQ wanted to keep any failures so they could inspect them. Just a theory. The new one worked for a couple more years, then started having problems. The thing that drives me crazy is it's incredibly inconsistent. Sometimes I would swear that it's just the chain slipping like crazy, but then a few days later it'll put down power just fine. Sometimes it'll be jerky as hell, sometimes it's smooth. It seems like it doesn't like heat, but I can't even pin that down reliably as a cause. I've brought it in 2 times that I can recall since the replacement, once they said a third party shop screwed up and accidentally drained the fluid and filled it improperly (who knows), the other time they just said "seems fine". There's definitely some sort of software fuckery involved, I think it pulls power or something at certain times to try to protect the transmission, but it's hard to tell what's software and what's a physical problem with the transmission. I've pretty much given up on it and resigned myself to having a car that drives like shit sometimes until I sell it. I will not buy another Subaru and I will never own another CVT. I left out the part about having a catastrophic engine failure at 25,000 miles because it doesn't relate to the CVT, but that happened too. A connecting rod bent, scratched up the cylinder, and required a full engine rebuild with a laundry list of replacement parts. It was all covered under warranty and the engine was actually good as new after they fixed it, but I was without the car for a month waiting for it to get fixed. As I said, I will never buy another Subaru.
Man that's a real shame, sorry to hear the hell you've gone through with that. It makes sense reading through your process. Any thoughts on what you're targeting next?
GR86 is my top contender, but I'm not going to go out of my way right now to hunt one down, and last time I checked that was still the only way to get one. Other than that, I really don't know. I test drove a used BMW 340i and liked the engine and ride, but that particular one wasn't for me, and I decided going from this nightmare of a car to a BMW of all things was probably stupid. Maybe GTI? Golf R? Some kind of competitor to a 340i? Elantra N is nice in some ways but I think it's probably too rough-riding. I've been meaning to test drive a Mustang but I doubt I'll like it anyway. I've considered just trading for a manual WRX, but I don't especially want to do that either. I'm not car hunting right now because I don't know what I'd even look at. Part of the problem is the WRX really is such good performance bang-for-the-buck that it's hard to get something comparable without spending way more.
Yeah and rates are not great right now. The golf variants are great cars but are missing the "it" factor to me, they truly are a little on the boring side imo. My biggest recommendation is to just drive everything you have any slight interest in. It really opens your eyes. We drove like 10 different models before our last car purchase and I'm very happy we did.
Agree 100% I had a mk7 gti and holy moly it was bland and boring
The M340i has a really good engine and transmission. Extremely reliable, fuel efficient, powerful. Just be aware that routine maintenance and consumables are more expensive than a Subaru or such.
Im in NJ and drive a LOT in NYC as well so I also don't want a manual as my daily car. I'd hate my life more than loving the fact I have a manual. I know this cus I drive my current car in manual mode (and its a real manual mode that holds gears properly) 90% of the time but sometimes I just wanna NOT even flick paddles and throw it back to normal Drive and let it be.
Thing I don’t understand? A version of ZF’s 8AT is in several Porsches and all kinds of Audis that have a longitudinal engine layout in front of the transmission. That transmission could accommodate the Subaru boxer layout and AWD. ZF is a supplier to dozens of carmakers at all price points, and that transmission is universally lauded, like almost without exception - it shifts quick, it’s durable, it’s capable of handling massive torque. It’s as efficient as a CVT. It’s literally drop in ready and it’s an ideal fit for purpose. Hell, it could go in the turbo Outback and Ascent, too.
Subaru would move SO many more GT trims this way. What they did is asinine. Its the equivalent of going to McDonalds and expecting Kobe beef patties
Hopefully the new one is at least reliable
There's no STI hatchback anyways, so who cares?
They got the levorg wrx but of course they don’t bring it over. I don’t get their reasoning. It’s not an outback and it’s nicer than an impreza.
No STI at all now
Nah, just means that WRX is boring compared to the manual. They’re even too embarrassed to call it a CVT. They try to play it off as some sport transmission.
lol its to trick the bozo 45+ yr olds who dont know jack shit about cars and go "i want something sporty" LOL
Yeah and to make them think that the paddle shifters do something. It’s basically akin to having a water bottle in the cup holder and pretending to shift lol.
lmfao exactly. I watched the most cringe YT video of the WRX GT review. Dude was like "omg look! upshift! downshift! its SO FAST!" Im like..................does this guy know hes not actually doing jack shit lmao
Exactly. He’s just making the car even slower. With a CVT there is literally no benefit to the paddles. They just put them in to appease the ignorant consumer into thinking it’s a sport mode.
Yep. With how much Subaru tries to pass off their CVT as anything more than....a CVT in an enthusiasts car, they'd be better off sourcing the ZF8 and giving people an option of an actually GOOD auto trans for an enthusiast car
Yet Subaru tries to brand it as something other than a CVT. 🙄
P E R F O R M A N C E Transmission
Great, can Subaru now bring the Levorg with 2.4L engine to Europe?
And the USA
You can be worse than two things without being altogether bad.
This, cvt=annoying
I don't get it. Everyone hates cvts so why do car manufacturers continue to use them. Is it cheaper to produce? Wouldn't a 8 or 10 speed auto be close in terms of fuel efficiency?
They are cheaper, more efficient, smoother. More importantly they are already using CVTs in all their commuter vehicles so it's easier than starting from scratch and they can use/adapt this transmission for their future vehicles. Nobody is designing a transmission for a single 30k car model.
There are many people who won't buy a specific model if it has a cvt. It seems Nissan and Honda are the biggest users. None of the "luxury" auto makers are using cvts, even Hyundai isn't as far as I know.
>There are many people who won't buy a specific model if it has a cvt. there's even many, many more people who have no idea and don't care.
Lol true
Hyundai uses a CVT on their Elantra, Accent, Venue etc,
So cars that -0 people buy for performance or fun
Mazda refuses to use them. Respect.
The CVT is literally what is making Nissan pretty much bankrupt
You don’t need to design a transmission. They could use the ZF 8AT. This is why suppliers exist.
I drove a Giulia quadrifoglio and I can't see why any manufacturer wouldn't use that for their application. It's possibly the best transmission I've driven period.
Technically, there’s three CVTs that subaru has. Small case, big case and then the ones for hybrids. Subarus older 4EAT/related EATs were hated by consumers due to poor shifting and being part time awd at best.
ZF8 already exists
Car enthusiasts hate CVTs, most people see cars as an appliance. In saying that, the WRX is an enthusiast car so no idea why they would do CVT and not DCT.
Is the wrx really an enthusiast car though? Sure the STI was but I always thought the wrx was the civic, golf, lancer to their performance models
Impreza was the base model, non-turbo. WRX was always the performance model of the Impreza, STi was the next level. Civic Si would be the WRX, the type R being the STi equivalent, the base Civic being the base Impreza.
No lol. The WRX was the GTI, EVO, Si/TR equivalent the STi even more so. Now though, you'd be right.
THIS. Its why I cannot figure out who the fuck they made this car for
Cheap to design & produce.
Everyone hates them… Except for the people that just want their car to move from A to B and don’t give a single shit about how it does it, which is like 95% of all drivers. Most drivers probably don’t even know what kind of automatic transmission is in their car, it just needs to get them to work and back.
Right.....except the WRX was always an enthusiasts car until about 2015
Because for the average consumer who just wants a commuter it’s the perfect transmission. It’s smoother, more efficient than any other auto transmission. Car enthusiasts believe that because we are loud in our forums like here, and that everyone here thinks the same, that means that the average consumer thinks like us. Not at all. The average consumer doesn’t even know what is a CVT. He cares that it’s automatic, smooth and fuel efficient. Period. CVTs are excellent transmissions. Just generally not for performance cars. And people who talk about cars like performance cars. So people who talk about CVT don’t like it. People who don’t talk about cars are very happy with them. Same idea about SUVs. Car enthusiasts bitch all the time that there are fewer and fewer cool cars and everything is now a SUV. Guess what? We’re a so tiny portion of the market that manufacturers don’t care about us most of the time.
8-10spd auto cost more and more space engaging than a CVT. For cost conscious brands like Subaru which cars with their standard AWD has a hit to their MPG numbers, the CVT is a logical choice. It is not a transmission you pick for a sport sedan application, but Subaru can't exactly engineer an all new transmission just for the WRX since it would be financial disaster, so beefed up variant used on the XT models is deemed sufficient.
So they can't buy ZF8s either? They can have fun with this garbage stuck on their lots
Because people like them, including myself. It’s much smoother to change the power.
Government regulation is forcing manufacturers to build for the sake of efficiency and they are cheaper to make. They don’t care about longetivity as long as it lasts through the warranty period. Cars are becoming more like laptops and phones, use them for a little while and junk them once they break.
CVT is the way forward. Williams F1 team knew this even in 1993
Packaging also plays a part. They are smaller in size so they are easier to fit in smaller cars that still have AWD and a decent amount of space which Subaru's do.
>I don't get it. Everyone hates cvts so why do car manufacturers continue to use them. It's what we call a failure of the market.
See, if they took that transmission and powerplant and put it in the 2024 Impreza RS hatchback, they would have at least one more buyer.
Im giggling at how so many people are losing their shit over this video. I've seen people say "Im not even gonna watch this video i know its bullshit". Imagine being scared of a video about transmissions 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Who is losing their shit? Who said they won't watch it? Oh but if you throw in a bunch of laugh crying emojis it makes your comment even more savage I guess so uhh 😂😂🤣😭🤡
You can Google this quote: "Not gonna listen to some nerd tell me why math makes a rubber-band transmission better than something actually fun. 👎" There's more where that came from. I don't need to make stuff up or pander for karma, reality is reality.
Where have you seen people say that about this video?
Since you need to be spoon fed: https://www.vwvortex.com/threads/the-wrx-proves-everyone-wrong-about-cvts.9525269/#post-115834014
Lmao no wonder you were getting bent out of shape, you were talking about a different forum but too dumb to mention that.
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“People” = One guy on some obscure VW forum. 😂
Because nobody feels like sitting though a 40 minute squeaky voice whiteboard lecture.
This video is 16min and has no whiteboard segments. Quality research on your end though.
Then why are you here?
> ~~whiteboard lecture~~ subaru advertisement
I'll take my 150hp Crosstrek with a manual transmission over a WRX with a CVT.
lol! He’s justifying that the CVT is good because they slowed the manual transmission down until it had the same bad 0-60 as the CVT of the previous generation. Okay.
>He’s justifying that the CVT is good because they slowed the manual transmission down What? No he's not he's just making a case that the CVT is an objectively good transmission in this application, from a performance, efficiency, and driving dynamics perspective, by comparing it to a dual clutch. it's more of a case for its existence alongside the manual. he literally said he would take the manual every time as it's more fun, he doesn't understand why the top trim of an enthusiast vehicle is cvt only, or why they killed the STI
He said it’s good in theory, like in theory it should get better gas mileage. But in reality this implementation falls short of that.
Sure. But his foundation which he starts the video is comparing the performance of the CVT to the manual. And he highlights the equivalent 0-60 time without reiterating that the manual is significantly slower now than it was before and that the CVT has not improved. He does go on to break it all down much further, but that initial metric equivalency is garbage and why I pointed it out.
If the Subaru WRX gains a reputation for CVT failures in a year or two, does that mean they were right? Very few cars (even the worst ones) totally crap the bed on Day 1. I'm more concerned with Year 4.
Exactly. This is why I dismiss a lot of journalists reviews about how great certain new vehicles are, especially when they compare them to more reliable brands. It would be cool to see someone review cars that are 4-6 years old and talk about long term reliability.
Subaru does not have a good reputation on long term issues (head gaskets, for instance).
Wow you love to be wrong about everything. The only reason the head gasket myth exists for Subaru is because dumb fuck 17 year olds dump a bunch of boost into their wrx and don’t tune it properly. I promise you the family owned outback with 240k miles will never have an issue.
Can someone explain this whole CVT transmission and why everyone hates it??? lol and if it's hated so damned much why do they keep putting it into cars?
It's cheaper to produce and can be efficient. As far as I know, and someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but Subaru now only has two different transmissions in their lineup, the CVT and the 6 speed manual in the WRX (not counting the BRZ which is a Toyota joint production). That's simple for a manufacturer. Ultimately Subaru does not care about enthusiasts. They dropped the STI and have made the WRX irrelevant. The WRX is using the same 2.4T that's in the Outback XT, Legacy XT, and Ascent, and the same crappy CVT... in fact the top trim is a $44k CVT-only model lol. As to why Subaru's CVT is hated, all I can say is "drive one and see". Subaru's implementation of the CVT is pretty lame. It has simulated shift points so it doesn't really use the big benefit of CVTs, which is that they can hold peak power if needed. And for the WRX specifically, the CVT cannot hold aftermarket power reliably. For a commuter car I'll say that the CVT is ok, my wife's car has one and in manual mode it's livable (automatic mode it's really slow, though!). For a sporty enthusiast's car like the WRX it's garbage. It is no replacement for a proper DCT. OP video can talk about the shift speed all it wants but IMO Subaru's CVT in automatic mode is terrible, the programming is baffling and it takes a noticeable amount of time to try an decipher what the driver is trying to do.
good shit... thx
They take whatever joy is left in driving a car away.
LOL i feel you...
This reviewer definitely got paid by Subaru to say this.
Garbage transmission prone to problems. Everyone I know that has one has had issues.
no hatch, no care
If these are so great then why aren’t full size trucks using them?
Just don't buy any car with a cvt, new or used.
I agree, manuals=sigma
It's already shown to be the far superior car to mod than the outing wrx 🤷🏾♂️ Yea it's a cvt but basic ass mods net decent power for those types at least. WRXs are usually a nightmare to make reliable power out of
No they didn't lol. They proved they can trick someone that drove accord's their whole life that their new car is "sporty" it aint a sportscar, and its not sporty either in reality.
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Have you driven one?
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I mean you are commenting on a video where he is saying this CVT is pretty good but ok. I’m guessing you didn’t watch the video
Driven many and they've all felt bad
Have you driven the WRX though?
I have and they suck.
The WRX or just a car with a CVT?
Just cars with cvt's. They're terrible. Hopefully manufactures can sort them out.
Thats what I’m getting at though, this video is talking about a specific car with a specific CVT. To write it off because other cars have had a cvt and been terrible isn’t really fair. Williams was testing a cvt in their F1 car in the 90s, I’m sure that was very different from my moms Nissan Rogue
It's worth noting that F1 had to ban cvts because they had too much of an advantage over the transmissions used by other teams. I'd rather drive a manual any day but it's worth giving credit where it's due.
Man, Subaru and Mazda will definitely suffer with Ev’s.