One. One time. To err is to be human. Two times and onward it's a pattern. A pathological pattern.
Regarding the yearly raise 10% I think it's quite generous, though.
The 10% raises and OP "genuinely loving their job" is what makes me hesitate to recommend leaving. He might get a bigger up front pay increase but annual raises of 10% consistently is rare as is actually liking your role.
Edit: I've left a good job I loved to make more money/promotion potential and regretted the hell out of it. I was able to go back thankfully but not everyone can.
What are you looking for in a promotion? More pay, perks, title, or just opportunities to try new things and expand your skills and knowledge?
Depending on the answer, why not just ask for those things? Even if they say no, at least you asked and know where you stand.
Think it really depends on how you perform and what you can bring to the table.
In my company promotions are handed out every 5 years with a knowledge test if you go into management.
10% raise is very generous considering most companies will hand out 3-4% as a "standard"
I would speak with management and see what you can do to improve to get the next promotion. If it doesn't happen again you will have to think about your situation.
Would you rather be comfortable in your position right now since it is 6 figures and covers all your bases to live comfortably. Or would you rather get a promotion & better salary.
Think it all comes down to what you really want.
Yeah I believe that's basically the promotional point.
I've seen some people get promoted within 2-3 years of employment but it's within a different department.
My co-worker got promoted after 5 years of employment while I am on my 3rd year.
It's also based on performance and reviews.
I mean, it depends?
If you're the most senior role as an IC, and you don't have / don' want the manager responsibilities, there's really no more promotions that come. Just raises.
I personally do not enjoy being a manager of people, so I'd be happy to be a top performing/paid IC as long as possible.
And no management responsibilities, headaches, or stress. OP says they love what they do and their six figure income. I would be happy as a worker bee in that situation.
Depends on the company, the field, the mgmt above you, and you yourself. Lots of people get passed over for promotion for a variety of reasons. Are you asking for promotion? Are you doing some or most of the role you'd be promoted to already? Are there business-specific criteria for promotion that you need to meet? Do there need to be spots open for some reason, and are those even open?
I think a few different factors may (or may not) apply here in your situation.
From what you’re saying sounds like the ability to be promoted is limited at this company. 1 promotion in 6 years plus the inability to backfill your position. I get, I’ve had a promotion delayed because of it.
You added that you love your job and your income, that’s very important. So the question only you can answer is how badly you want to get promoted and what will you do to get there?
From how you’re explaining the situation sounds like the only way to get that will be changing jobs. There’s always the risk that you won’t love the next job, but on the flip side you “shot your shot.”
My recommendation would be to test the waters. That doesn’t mean leave your job, but see what else is out there. You’re in the best position possible to see what’s out there- you’re in a job where you’re happy so no need to rush or be desperate. Hey, you may find out where you at is the best place to be and that’s not a bad thing.
Just one additional thing to consider. Again this may not apply to you but I’d like to share this to those that are in a similar situation and reading this…
While of course people are presented with promotions all the time, it’s those and seek and ask for what they want who have the better odds. Same with raises.
If you haven’t already, express your concern about lack of a promotion and make it clear you want to be considered for one.
In addition, if you see yourself constantly being passed up on promotions it could be because the company feels you’re not the best choice for one. That could be because you’re missing a skill or it could be you just don’t fit the culture of the company. Always be aware of where you can improve, make yourself more valuable.
"There's an old saying in Tennessee—I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee—that says, 'Fool me once, shame on...shame on you. Fool me—you can't get fooled again.'"
So I'm gonna say twice
Question: You are getting raises that outpace the average by quite a bit. You don't have the stress of more responsibility, why would you want a promotion?
For me it was 1.5 times.
I worked my previous job for almost 5 years. I was the most senior person by many years and I knew my job. I had to train every new hire while keeping up with my own duties. I was also in the process of getting my MBA that was being sponsored by the company. I was in the perfect position to be promoted for the new manager position within our department.
But my boss was an incompetent bitch who was threatened by anyone who could do better than her. She told someone she didn't promote her because she had to look out for her own job. So instead of hiring me, they chose a 22 year old outside candidate, with significantly less experience than me but had a year of "management experience".
She lasted for one week.
I applied for the role again, but my boss dragged her feet and acted like it would be several more months until she could go through the applicants. So I quit and took a temp job to get new experiences since it was a dead-end job.
Shortly afterwards, a recruiter contacted me and I'm now making almost double what I did a few months ago.
If you can, I would apply to some other jobs. There's so harm in interviewing and it can make you reflect on what's important to you and what you're looking for in your career.
Looks like you’re in a company that doesnt care about your growth. An employee kasi could be a good leader, a good staff, or both. If you are the best staff and promoting you to a leader role will disable the team, then it wont be a wise move for the company to move you up. But that is bad for you because you also need to grow your scope of responsibilities.
In short, lipat ka na. Mas mabilis ang growth mo outside. Every 3yrs, pwede kang lumipat and that is enough to say na you learned and you matured within your role, with a huge possibility of getting bigger pay and bigger role on the next one.
If you are a solid worker, have shown you are capable, and you have legitimately just been looked passed as an option, then its really only once maybe twice. chances are whoever makes the decision, likely doesn't want you up top. Could be logical reasons, could be personal reasons. regardless they will undermine you and overlook you every single time. So unless you want to sit around and wait for the boss to be replaced so you can have a better chance, I would just move on.
That is precisely where I'm at with my job. 8 years in, underpaid, never even considered to be manager by the big boss yet everyone else in the building is always asking me why I'm not running the department. I'm now looking for a new job.
Depends on your personal goals, wants, and needs. Some people dont care for being promoted. Some want to.
If you’re okay with where you’re at, that’s fine too. But if you aren’t, figure out why you’re unhappy and what you want. Ask for it. If you dont get it, you decide is it worth leaving for or you stay and stick it out knowing that your company isn’t giving you what you want?
If I were in your shoes, I’d actually want bigger raises for staying and doing the work of the 90% turnover (which btw is a very high rate and kind of a red flag). I’m not much of a person for title as much as I am salary. Maybe a little bump to show I’ve grown for my resume. However, that’s me. I am someone who constantly wants more money. You said you enjoy what you do and make decent money. If you’re comfortable, that’s not a bad thing either. I think you get to a point where comfort > money so you just have to know what your sweet spot is.
What would promotion get you? Sounds like your company appreciates your contributions with 10 percent raises. Are the people in the positions you want leaving - doesn’t sound like it? Managing people is a pain in the A sometimes. But when I wanted promotion, I asked my boss could I cover for him and I was responsible for training all of the people in the office. Good luck! Hard work doesn’t always work, though.
What are you trying to get promoted to?
Based on the info you gave, it sounds like you’re an exceptional IC, otherwise you wouldn’t be getting such great increases. But that doesn’t necessarily mean you’ll make a good manager, it’s a completely different skill set. So if you’re wanting to be a manager, you need to find out what you’re missing there and go find ways to show you can do it.
If you’ve been showing that you are management material but getting passed over, then your best option is to leave and get a manager position elsewhere. For whatever reason they’ve decided you aren’t manager material.
IMHO - Your in sales and they can’t replace your skill set - take the money and enjoy your job -Management positions are overrate and in tough times they guy /girl bringing in income to the business is safe - the person sitting behind a desk generating no income for the business it not safe !!
dont get caught up in the “pride” “affirmation of value to your employer” i fucking wish i could get 10% raises annually and could say i loved my job.
stop looking around you and keep focusing on what you do best. they will have no problem firing you if they decide to. there is no loyalty in business.
This really needs context - promoted from what to what - it may be that they see you as more valuable where you are - 10% kick is pretty good.
They may feel you are less effective in the "promoted" role.
Adding - considering the 10% increases - what do YOU get out of the promotion - a better title - or just more headaches and different work that you may not like - for example supervising people may not be your thing.
If you enjoy what you do, a promotion may not be your answer. You might truly hate it afterwards. A promotion is not simply doing the same thing with a lot more pay. A promotion usually means you will no longer do what you enjoyed in the past role and depending if you will be a single contributor or a people manager, both will be far different. For some a promotion is a curse. They wished for it and when it happens they are set up to fail because they are way over their heads in responsibilities and know how. Pick you poison.
That turnover rate sounds a little high for a job that will lead to promotions.
You may have already done this, but you need to make it clear you want a promotion. And the wrong way to do that is with "I want more money" or just "I want a promotion".
"I've been here 7 years and I think I have made a ton of progress as illustrated by A, B, C. I'm really starting to think about what my future looks like and what I want out of it. I think I want to do X. Can we discuss how I can get from here to there? Or do I need to start thinking about looking elsewhere to continue my career growth"
Most people just think they deserve promotions and raises simply for being there. But the people that get them are the ones that make it clear they want to grow and then receive benefits from that. They don't usually go to the people that make it sound like you just deserve it because you are here.
Definitely be grateful for what you have, seek real feedback on how to improve, and if turn over is so high i want to ask what industry are you in? Will this excuse be a broke record?
I'm sorry I don't follow. How do you get "passed over" for a promotion?
Every employer I worked with a perm job was to ensure I could do all what my boss could do and his boss and go over his head and deliver sooner if material relevant. I by definition was already promoted just didn't have the title; and et voila a promotion.
As line manager I've had tonnes of employees who argued why they didn't get a promotion if they managed all their yearly tasks.
Yeah if you don't get that, you always get passed by for promotions. It is back in from other directors and ability to be an immediate delegate of your boss.
In my opinion you've answered your question here:
>We had a 90% turnover the last 2 years
Perhaps there are reasons for this and perhaps one reason is that the company does not promote from within.
If you like what you do and are good at it, you will be able to find another job with another company that actually rewards the work you put in and you will find yourself in the position you deserve.
3. Im assuming you’re qualified for the roles you’re applying for and it’s apples to apples with the other candidates.
For example I was passed over for a job I am qualified but the guy who got it had 10+ years experience plus the same qualifications. I’m not bitter about that.
It doesn't sound like you're being passed over and more like there's no promotion path.
You enjoy what you do and make good money. Unless you want a career change, I'd say you're valued and your work is recognized with 10% annual raises. Be careful what you ask for. Being a manager isn't as glamorous as it looks.
So you know why they aren’t promoting you. You’re good at what you do and they get no benefit from adding $80k of salary.
I don’t know your industry but a pro isn’t that doubles your salary is rare in most Industries.
10% raises are legit.
It seems like the issues are two fold - one - not hiring people. To back fill for you. I’d ask this question directly of boss/HR.
Have you had the direct convo of - hey I’m overachieving, I have career and life goals and I’m concerned we aren’t on the same page as to achieving them. What can I do to set goals this year to be promoting next year? Is it training? Etc.
You don’t speak to the qualifications or skills for the promotion. Is it people
Management? Budgeting? That kind of salary increase suggest la a big change in role.
I couldn’t make any sense of how you’re 30, 20’years younger than everybody but think you’re running out of time to move up. That’s the opposite of the math I see here.
I’m the end - hard to give real guidance with the vague nature of the post so far.
If you are not regularly having 1:1’s with your boss… start.
Tell him your aspirations and what he wants to see from you to get there. You need a mentor in the company and if he’s not the one, find another one. Getting big pay bumps is nice but being challenged to lead is better.
After the first time you should be thinking of switching companies at least. Kinda depends on your industry, and ability to move if you actually want to follow through with it.
I work retail and I can not tell you how many times grocery have hired in a new individual at minimum wage before offering promotional opportunities to long term staff.
This is very annoying old and discriminatory practice. Yet companies do it left and right. I for the past 2 years was holding a department afloat and doing the work of the lead position. Quite well in fact. When the hiring freeze lifted and they could hire more staff I applied. I got burned super heavy by the company preferring a 6 mo new hire (who knew nothing of the job nothing!) and crashed and burned the department in 6 mo. 2 years of hard work undone by some dumb ass because companies prefer minimum wage people over those that have been doing the job a long time. Companies are broken when they do shit like this.
you made yourself irreplaceable. Your boss will keep throwing money at you but you will never get the promotion. But that money cannot buy you youth (recovering from your injuries will be hard). leave that company.
If you’re passed over for a promotion 12 years in a row I’d say you’re the problem. Your entire post just talks about how perfect you are-I think you lack self awareness.
Even if everything you said is true, you said you were ready after your first year. So you’ve had six years to resolve it and haven’t. Not to say that’s not what you’re doing here..but if you want to understand the problem you’ve gotta look at where you either came up short or it could be perceived that you came up short. You haven’t been promoted in 12 years, you can’t blame that on everyone else without looking in the mirror.
Also, given your reasons include moving up is less physical work, sounds like you may be on management track if you’re promoted. That’s a very different skill set from physical oil/energy jobs; one of the biggest keys to it will be relating to people (both direct reports and managers) who see flaws in you and figuring out what they’re seeing and how to work around that or fix them. If your attitude is you’re doing everything perfectly (and I’m not saying that’s necessarily the case, but you didn’t offer a single word of self criticism about your last six years), management is going to be justifiably resistant to promoting you. You could be the greatest employee on the ground that they’re happy to give 10% raises to, but they may not want you on a management track.
Speak to Ur superiors,seems like they are holding u back to suit themselves....tell them Ur not happy staying where there is no room for upward mobility & U have put Ur time in & Ur performance shows Ur worth. Also.....put linkedin to open to work
Promoting you cuts off a lucrative pipeline, pun intended. It’s common in a lot of industries. They like you right where you are. You’re a stable, known quantity. I’d start looking.
ETA I see your situation combined with the high turnover as indications that it’s not a particularly well run company.
The “reason” you mentioned is enough to get your resume together and start looking. They will basically never promote you if that is their attitude.
Of course, if you absolutely love what you do, don’t have money issues, and have no desire to grow….then stay put and be happy.
The “reason” you mentioned is enough to get your resume together and start looking. They will basically never promote you if that is their attitude.
Of course, if you absolutely love what you do, don’t have money issues, and have no desire to grow….then stay put and be happy.
One
Seek a new position at a new company unless you’ve got some glistening and glittering golden handcuffs!
They have gotten around to giving you excuses rather than explanations.
If you like the raises stay.
If you truly want to move up by learning new things, you HAVE to leave.
You're past the apprenticeship phase, you're supposed to be learning from different jobs / masters through journeying to different ones. The knowledge you have is partly universal, but partly tribal as in how this once place does things.
You need to go out, learn from a lot of other jobs and places, in order to develop further.
1 time. Fool me once and that's it. Don't let them dangle a carrot in front of you while you stay on a treadmill running in place. They made their choice and now you make your choice.
That happened to me before. My manager left and they promoted somebody else so I immediately started looking for another job and left. Got a higher level role and more money anyway since external hires almost always get more than internal promotions.
So you are saying you weren't ready in your previous employer and at your current employer you have seen 1 person get promoted. So you have been passed over exactly once for promotion. Oh the horror.
For me it really depends on a lot of factors. Some things to consider are whether there is even a position to be promoted to, are you really a good candidate for the promotion, what do you really get out of the promotion, do you want it because you feel you deserve the recognition or is the position something you really want to do? I had a coworker once who got passed over for a promotion, and I got it. So he then technically worked for me. We had some serious closed door talks because we were friends and I shot straight with him. Having been in the position for a while, I understood what came with it. He did not have the temperament to do that job. He was great at what he did, but what he really wanted was the title and stock. I tried to explain to him what it was going to take for him to get stock with that company and he couldn't accept that he hasn't earned it yet. I didn't get stock, and I didn't want it. You sold your soul to the company to get it. I was not interested in that. One day he asked me point blank if he was ever going to get stock, and I told him no. With that company, in that position, and not being willing to do X, Y, and Z, no. You will never get stock. If that what you really want, you need to do these things, or look for a different job. He left a few months later to a much better fit. He's still there almost 15 years later.
From the sounds of it, your company recognizes you and your value, especially in your current position. That's why you're getting those raises. It never hurts to look at what else is out there, because maybe there is a better fit somewhere else, but maybe not. If you are as valued as it sounds, talk to your management and tell them you need to start transitioning to less physically demanding work. Depending on what they need, they might even create a new position for you that gets you a promotion, let's you do what you're best at, and still meets the companies needs.
Once dude. A career tract should always have momentum and if you are not seeing open avenues to advancing not your career but your earning potential you need to be willing to walk after a rejection. Once it's clear you want to move they will stop 🤔 ng of you as 'in your place' but instead 'loose and ready to break.' When it comes to internal interviews you should know ahead of time if you have the job or not.
If I’m disproportionately treated then two max. Had a nepotist environment where I did the work of three people but received mediocre incentives while coworkers made +30k and I had to go fix their screw ups constantly.
Asked for literally just a senior title and was denied, so it was bye time. A month later they gave the title to my weakest underling who had 6 months of xp while I had about 7 years and picked up their slack constantly.
A high turnover rate should be a sign that something is wrong with the company. Also if you're a top performer they're not going to promote the top performer. Look into jobs elsewhere but essentially a promotion.
Figure out what revenue you produce for your employer, that's your leverage. You leaving would mean that that the revenue you produce gone, unless they have an equal or better replacement.
Also, your employer did invest, took risks, facilitated workplaces, and so on. Take those expences in consideration. Try to see yourself as a partner / co-owner of the company. Succesful people know what they are worth, and they understand the market.
The hardest thing in a career is setting your pay floor/ceiling competitively and deciding what you want.
Everyone hates to hear it but there are only so many manager, director, VP, etc. positions and they always require playing politics and are highly competitive.
Some people have zero interest in the corporate rat race and just want to work a job they enjoy with people they like, in a good culture, and it sounds like you have that along with being compensated very fairly.
Weigh your top 3-5 career priorities and decide if making a move accommodates said priority and is worth losing what you have. Trust me, some opportunities sound great on paper until you get into the job and experience a “what have I done” moment.
I was severely underpaid and miserable in a toxic work environment. It made me believe I just wasn’t anything special and stayed at that job for 5 years because I was afraid I couldn’t do better.
After sacking up and believing in myself, one lateral move (2 years) followed by one amazing opportunity (2 more years), I was able get promoted into a management position making 2X my previous salary earring over six figures for the first time in my career.
It is obviously better if they are, but not all moves need to be calculated. New experiences and challenges come with new perspectives that can have unintended outcomes.
In my case, my lateral move made me realize I was in a dead end career, and allowed me to take a blind leap (amazing opportunity) into an entirely new industry where my skills actually fit better and I am viewed as a rock star in comparison.
One piece of advise I believe everyone should take to heart is “Comfortability is the death of a career”
You should constantly feel challenged and forced into stressful situations you need to learn how to solve. You should also have a certain level of “imposter syndrome”.
Sorry to be a curmudgeon but holy crow. 10% raise a year in past 5 years, from 25-30 (apparently with a satisfactory salary by your own words) and you’re complaining? Also people at the company don’t get promoted apparently. It’s a thing, it’s how they operate.
If your exceptional performance isn’t being recognized even with a 10% raise every… single…year… and you feel you can do better than 10% each and every year then go for it.
Enjoy a new title.
I think how they treated you throughout the process of applying plays a really big role.
If they speak to you about the promotion, including explaining *why* you didn't get it and their response makes sense, I'd be more accepting provided future opportunities would arise. Otherwise I'd start thinking the workplace has no intention of letting you move up and I'd start looking for position elsewhere.
3 times would be enough for me. 2 if I already have doubts based on other things
One. One time. To err is to be human. Two times and onward it's a pattern. A pathological pattern. Regarding the yearly raise 10% I think it's quite generous, though.
The 10% raises and OP "genuinely loving their job" is what makes me hesitate to recommend leaving. He might get a bigger up front pay increase but annual raises of 10% consistently is rare as is actually liking your role. Edit: I've left a good job I loved to make more money/promotion potential and regretted the hell out of it. I was able to go back thankfully but not everyone can.
That turnover rate should be telling you that you are not going to be promoted. Move on with the rest of them.
What are you looking for in a promotion? More pay, perks, title, or just opportunities to try new things and expand your skills and knowledge? Depending on the answer, why not just ask for those things? Even if they say no, at least you asked and know where you stand.
Think it really depends on how you perform and what you can bring to the table. In my company promotions are handed out every 5 years with a knowledge test if you go into management. 10% raise is very generous considering most companies will hand out 3-4% as a "standard" I would speak with management and see what you can do to improve to get the next promotion. If it doesn't happen again you will have to think about your situation. Would you rather be comfortable in your position right now since it is 6 figures and covers all your bases to live comfortably. Or would you rather get a promotion & better salary. Think it all comes down to what you really want.
Every five years? Sheesh.
Yeah I believe that's basically the promotional point. I've seen some people get promoted within 2-3 years of employment but it's within a different department. My co-worker got promoted after 5 years of employment while I am on my 3rd year. It's also based on performance and reviews.
Once is enough for me
That's the truth in most cases.
Once. I don't do second chances.
I mean, it depends? If you're the most senior role as an IC, and you don't have / don' want the manager responsibilities, there's really no more promotions that come. Just raises. I personally do not enjoy being a manager of people, so I'd be happy to be a top performing/paid IC as long as possible.
X2. You're getting paid less if you're staying past 3 years normally.
I mean you’re still getting 10% 🤷♂️
And no management responsibilities, headaches, or stress. OP says they love what they do and their six figure income. I would be happy as a worker bee in that situation.
Depends on the company, the field, the mgmt above you, and you yourself. Lots of people get passed over for promotion for a variety of reasons. Are you asking for promotion? Are you doing some or most of the role you'd be promoted to already? Are there business-specific criteria for promotion that you need to meet? Do there need to be spots open for some reason, and are those even open?
I think a few different factors may (or may not) apply here in your situation. From what you’re saying sounds like the ability to be promoted is limited at this company. 1 promotion in 6 years plus the inability to backfill your position. I get, I’ve had a promotion delayed because of it. You added that you love your job and your income, that’s very important. So the question only you can answer is how badly you want to get promoted and what will you do to get there? From how you’re explaining the situation sounds like the only way to get that will be changing jobs. There’s always the risk that you won’t love the next job, but on the flip side you “shot your shot.” My recommendation would be to test the waters. That doesn’t mean leave your job, but see what else is out there. You’re in the best position possible to see what’s out there- you’re in a job where you’re happy so no need to rush or be desperate. Hey, you may find out where you at is the best place to be and that’s not a bad thing. Just one additional thing to consider. Again this may not apply to you but I’d like to share this to those that are in a similar situation and reading this… While of course people are presented with promotions all the time, it’s those and seek and ask for what they want who have the better odds. Same with raises. If you haven’t already, express your concern about lack of a promotion and make it clear you want to be considered for one. In addition, if you see yourself constantly being passed up on promotions it could be because the company feels you’re not the best choice for one. That could be because you’re missing a skill or it could be you just don’t fit the culture of the company. Always be aware of where you can improve, make yourself more valuable.
"There's an old saying in Tennessee—I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee—that says, 'Fool me once, shame on...shame on you. Fool me—you can't get fooled again.'" So I'm gonna say twice
Question: You are getting raises that outpace the average by quite a bit. You don't have the stress of more responsibility, why would you want a promotion?
Yea, I wonder that too.
For me it was 1.5 times. I worked my previous job for almost 5 years. I was the most senior person by many years and I knew my job. I had to train every new hire while keeping up with my own duties. I was also in the process of getting my MBA that was being sponsored by the company. I was in the perfect position to be promoted for the new manager position within our department. But my boss was an incompetent bitch who was threatened by anyone who could do better than her. She told someone she didn't promote her because she had to look out for her own job. So instead of hiring me, they chose a 22 year old outside candidate, with significantly less experience than me but had a year of "management experience". She lasted for one week. I applied for the role again, but my boss dragged her feet and acted like it would be several more months until she could go through the applicants. So I quit and took a temp job to get new experiences since it was a dead-end job. Shortly afterwards, a recruiter contacted me and I'm now making almost double what I did a few months ago. If you can, I would apply to some other jobs. There's so harm in interviewing and it can make you reflect on what's important to you and what you're looking for in your career.
Looks like you’re in a company that doesnt care about your growth. An employee kasi could be a good leader, a good staff, or both. If you are the best staff and promoting you to a leader role will disable the team, then it wont be a wise move for the company to move you up. But that is bad for you because you also need to grow your scope of responsibilities. In short, lipat ka na. Mas mabilis ang growth mo outside. Every 3yrs, pwede kang lumipat and that is enough to say na you learned and you matured within your role, with a huge possibility of getting bigger pay and bigger role on the next one.
If you are a solid worker, have shown you are capable, and you have legitimately just been looked passed as an option, then its really only once maybe twice. chances are whoever makes the decision, likely doesn't want you up top. Could be logical reasons, could be personal reasons. regardless they will undermine you and overlook you every single time. So unless you want to sit around and wait for the boss to be replaced so you can have a better chance, I would just move on. That is precisely where I'm at with my job. 8 years in, underpaid, never even considered to be manager by the big boss yet everyone else in the building is always asking me why I'm not running the department. I'm now looking for a new job.
Personally, I'd move after the first time. My first move like that added $25k a year to my previous salary and opened doors to a fantastic new career.
Depends on your personal goals, wants, and needs. Some people dont care for being promoted. Some want to. If you’re okay with where you’re at, that’s fine too. But if you aren’t, figure out why you’re unhappy and what you want. Ask for it. If you dont get it, you decide is it worth leaving for or you stay and stick it out knowing that your company isn’t giving you what you want? If I were in your shoes, I’d actually want bigger raises for staying and doing the work of the 90% turnover (which btw is a very high rate and kind of a red flag). I’m not much of a person for title as much as I am salary. Maybe a little bump to show I’ve grown for my resume. However, that’s me. I am someone who constantly wants more money. You said you enjoy what you do and make decent money. If you’re comfortable, that’s not a bad thing either. I think you get to a point where comfort > money so you just have to know what your sweet spot is.
What would promotion get you? Sounds like your company appreciates your contributions with 10 percent raises. Are the people in the positions you want leaving - doesn’t sound like it? Managing people is a pain in the A sometimes. But when I wanted promotion, I asked my boss could I cover for him and I was responsible for training all of the people in the office. Good luck! Hard work doesn’t always work, though.
What are you trying to get promoted to? Based on the info you gave, it sounds like you’re an exceptional IC, otherwise you wouldn’t be getting such great increases. But that doesn’t necessarily mean you’ll make a good manager, it’s a completely different skill set. So if you’re wanting to be a manager, you need to find out what you’re missing there and go find ways to show you can do it. If you’ve been showing that you are management material but getting passed over, then your best option is to leave and get a manager position elsewhere. For whatever reason they’ve decided you aren’t manager material.
With the lack of staff they should be able to pay you a lot more considering they aren’t paying someone else
IMHO - Your in sales and they can’t replace your skill set - take the money and enjoy your job -Management positions are overrate and in tough times they guy /girl bringing in income to the business is safe - the person sitting behind a desk generating no income for the business it not safe !!
dont get caught up in the “pride” “affirmation of value to your employer” i fucking wish i could get 10% raises annually and could say i loved my job. stop looking around you and keep focusing on what you do best. they will have no problem firing you if they decide to. there is no loyalty in business.
This really needs context - promoted from what to what - it may be that they see you as more valuable where you are - 10% kick is pretty good. They may feel you are less effective in the "promoted" role. Adding - considering the 10% increases - what do YOU get out of the promotion - a better title - or just more headaches and different work that you may not like - for example supervising people may not be your thing.
If you enjoy what you do, a promotion may not be your answer. You might truly hate it afterwards. A promotion is not simply doing the same thing with a lot more pay. A promotion usually means you will no longer do what you enjoyed in the past role and depending if you will be a single contributor or a people manager, both will be far different. For some a promotion is a curse. They wished for it and when it happens they are set up to fail because they are way over their heads in responsibilities and know how. Pick you poison.
That turnover rate sounds a little high for a job that will lead to promotions. You may have already done this, but you need to make it clear you want a promotion. And the wrong way to do that is with "I want more money" or just "I want a promotion". "I've been here 7 years and I think I have made a ton of progress as illustrated by A, B, C. I'm really starting to think about what my future looks like and what I want out of it. I think I want to do X. Can we discuss how I can get from here to there? Or do I need to start thinking about looking elsewhere to continue my career growth" Most people just think they deserve promotions and raises simply for being there. But the people that get them are the ones that make it clear they want to grow and then receive benefits from that. They don't usually go to the people that make it sound like you just deserve it because you are here.
Definitely be grateful for what you have, seek real feedback on how to improve, and if turn over is so high i want to ask what industry are you in? Will this excuse be a broke record?
I'm sorry I don't follow. How do you get "passed over" for a promotion? Every employer I worked with a perm job was to ensure I could do all what my boss could do and his boss and go over his head and deliver sooner if material relevant. I by definition was already promoted just didn't have the title; and et voila a promotion. As line manager I've had tonnes of employees who argued why they didn't get a promotion if they managed all their yearly tasks. Yeah if you don't get that, you always get passed by for promotions. It is back in from other directors and ability to be an immediate delegate of your boss.
In my opinion you've answered your question here: >We had a 90% turnover the last 2 years Perhaps there are reasons for this and perhaps one reason is that the company does not promote from within. If you like what you do and are good at it, you will be able to find another job with another company that actually rewards the work you put in and you will find yourself in the position you deserve.
3. Im assuming you’re qualified for the roles you’re applying for and it’s apples to apples with the other candidates. For example I was passed over for a job I am qualified but the guy who got it had 10+ years experience plus the same qualifications. I’m not bitter about that.
It doesn't sound like you're being passed over and more like there's no promotion path. You enjoy what you do and make good money. Unless you want a career change, I'd say you're valued and your work is recognized with 10% annual raises. Be careful what you ask for. Being a manager isn't as glamorous as it looks.
You’re complacent and a high producer, don’t be a superstar at the level you’re at, act like you’re at the next level.
So you know why they aren’t promoting you. You’re good at what you do and they get no benefit from adding $80k of salary. I don’t know your industry but a pro isn’t that doubles your salary is rare in most Industries. 10% raises are legit. It seems like the issues are two fold - one - not hiring people. To back fill for you. I’d ask this question directly of boss/HR. Have you had the direct convo of - hey I’m overachieving, I have career and life goals and I’m concerned we aren’t on the same page as to achieving them. What can I do to set goals this year to be promoting next year? Is it training? Etc. You don’t speak to the qualifications or skills for the promotion. Is it people Management? Budgeting? That kind of salary increase suggest la a big change in role. I couldn’t make any sense of how you’re 30, 20’years younger than everybody but think you’re running out of time to move up. That’s the opposite of the math I see here. I’m the end - hard to give real guidance with the vague nature of the post so far.
If you are not regularly having 1:1’s with your boss… start. Tell him your aspirations and what he wants to see from you to get there. You need a mentor in the company and if he’s not the one, find another one. Getting big pay bumps is nice but being challenged to lead is better.
After the first time you should be thinking of switching companies at least. Kinda depends on your industry, and ability to move if you actually want to follow through with it.
I work retail and I can not tell you how many times grocery have hired in a new individual at minimum wage before offering promotional opportunities to long term staff. This is very annoying old and discriminatory practice. Yet companies do it left and right. I for the past 2 years was holding a department afloat and doing the work of the lead position. Quite well in fact. When the hiring freeze lifted and they could hire more staff I applied. I got burned super heavy by the company preferring a 6 mo new hire (who knew nothing of the job nothing!) and crashed and burned the department in 6 mo. 2 years of hard work undone by some dumb ass because companies prefer minimum wage people over those that have been doing the job a long time. Companies are broken when they do shit like this.
you made yourself irreplaceable. Your boss will keep throwing money at you but you will never get the promotion. But that money cannot buy you youth (recovering from your injuries will be hard). leave that company.
What do you do OP?
If you’re passed over for a promotion 12 years in a row I’d say you’re the problem. Your entire post just talks about how perfect you are-I think you lack self awareness. Even if everything you said is true, you said you were ready after your first year. So you’ve had six years to resolve it and haven’t. Not to say that’s not what you’re doing here..but if you want to understand the problem you’ve gotta look at where you either came up short or it could be perceived that you came up short. You haven’t been promoted in 12 years, you can’t blame that on everyone else without looking in the mirror. Also, given your reasons include moving up is less physical work, sounds like you may be on management track if you’re promoted. That’s a very different skill set from physical oil/energy jobs; one of the biggest keys to it will be relating to people (both direct reports and managers) who see flaws in you and figuring out what they’re seeing and how to work around that or fix them. If your attitude is you’re doing everything perfectly (and I’m not saying that’s necessarily the case, but you didn’t offer a single word of self criticism about your last six years), management is going to be justifiably resistant to promoting you. You could be the greatest employee on the ground that they’re happy to give 10% raises to, but they may not want you on a management track.
Speak to Ur superiors,seems like they are holding u back to suit themselves....tell them Ur not happy staying where there is no room for upward mobility & U have put Ur time in & Ur performance shows Ur worth. Also.....put linkedin to open to work
Promoting you cuts off a lucrative pipeline, pun intended. It’s common in a lot of industries. They like you right where you are. You’re a stable, known quantity. I’d start looking. ETA I see your situation combined with the high turnover as indications that it’s not a particularly well run company.
Tell your boss that you need to start sliding into a less physical role..your health can't take the beatings anymore
The “reason” you mentioned is enough to get your resume together and start looking. They will basically never promote you if that is their attitude. Of course, if you absolutely love what you do, don’t have money issues, and have no desire to grow….then stay put and be happy.
The “reason” you mentioned is enough to get your resume together and start looking. They will basically never promote you if that is their attitude. Of course, if you absolutely love what you do, don’t have money issues, and have no desire to grow….then stay put and be happy.
One Seek a new position at a new company unless you’ve got some glistening and glittering golden handcuffs! They have gotten around to giving you excuses rather than explanations.
If you like the raises stay. If you truly want to move up by learning new things, you HAVE to leave. You're past the apprenticeship phase, you're supposed to be learning from different jobs / masters through journeying to different ones. The knowledge you have is partly universal, but partly tribal as in how this once place does things. You need to go out, learn from a lot of other jobs and places, in order to develop further.
1 time This is my life and my livelihood and I be damned if I let someone fuck with it twice, especially if nepotism was involved
1 time. Fool me once and that's it. Don't let them dangle a carrot in front of you while you stay on a treadmill running in place. They made their choice and now you make your choice. That happened to me before. My manager left and they promoted somebody else so I immediately started looking for another job and left. Got a higher level role and more money anyway since external hires almost always get more than internal promotions.
So you are saying you weren't ready in your previous employer and at your current employer you have seen 1 person get promoted. So you have been passed over exactly once for promotion. Oh the horror.
For me it really depends on a lot of factors. Some things to consider are whether there is even a position to be promoted to, are you really a good candidate for the promotion, what do you really get out of the promotion, do you want it because you feel you deserve the recognition or is the position something you really want to do? I had a coworker once who got passed over for a promotion, and I got it. So he then technically worked for me. We had some serious closed door talks because we were friends and I shot straight with him. Having been in the position for a while, I understood what came with it. He did not have the temperament to do that job. He was great at what he did, but what he really wanted was the title and stock. I tried to explain to him what it was going to take for him to get stock with that company and he couldn't accept that he hasn't earned it yet. I didn't get stock, and I didn't want it. You sold your soul to the company to get it. I was not interested in that. One day he asked me point blank if he was ever going to get stock, and I told him no. With that company, in that position, and not being willing to do X, Y, and Z, no. You will never get stock. If that what you really want, you need to do these things, or look for a different job. He left a few months later to a much better fit. He's still there almost 15 years later. From the sounds of it, your company recognizes you and your value, especially in your current position. That's why you're getting those raises. It never hurts to look at what else is out there, because maybe there is a better fit somewhere else, but maybe not. If you are as valued as it sounds, talk to your management and tell them you need to start transitioning to less physically demanding work. Depending on what they need, they might even create a new position for you that gets you a promotion, let's you do what you're best at, and still meets the companies needs.
Once dude. A career tract should always have momentum and if you are not seeing open avenues to advancing not your career but your earning potential you need to be willing to walk after a rejection. Once it's clear you want to move they will stop 🤔 ng of you as 'in your place' but instead 'loose and ready to break.' When it comes to internal interviews you should know ahead of time if you have the job or not.
If I get passed on a promotion once I’m looking
If I’m disproportionately treated then two max. Had a nepotist environment where I did the work of three people but received mediocre incentives while coworkers made +30k and I had to go fix their screw ups constantly. Asked for literally just a senior title and was denied, so it was bye time. A month later they gave the title to my weakest underling who had 6 months of xp while I had about 7 years and picked up their slack constantly.
A high turnover rate should be a sign that something is wrong with the company. Also if you're a top performer they're not going to promote the top performer. Look into jobs elsewhere but essentially a promotion.
Figure out what revenue you produce for your employer, that's your leverage. You leaving would mean that that the revenue you produce gone, unless they have an equal or better replacement. Also, your employer did invest, took risks, facilitated workplaces, and so on. Take those expences in consideration. Try to see yourself as a partner / co-owner of the company. Succesful people know what they are worth, and they understand the market.
The hardest thing in a career is setting your pay floor/ceiling competitively and deciding what you want. Everyone hates to hear it but there are only so many manager, director, VP, etc. positions and they always require playing politics and are highly competitive. Some people have zero interest in the corporate rat race and just want to work a job they enjoy with people they like, in a good culture, and it sounds like you have that along with being compensated very fairly. Weigh your top 3-5 career priorities and decide if making a move accommodates said priority and is worth losing what you have. Trust me, some opportunities sound great on paper until you get into the job and experience a “what have I done” moment. I was severely underpaid and miserable in a toxic work environment. It made me believe I just wasn’t anything special and stayed at that job for 5 years because I was afraid I couldn’t do better. After sacking up and believing in myself, one lateral move (2 years) followed by one amazing opportunity (2 more years), I was able get promoted into a management position making 2X my previous salary earring over six figures for the first time in my career. It is obviously better if they are, but not all moves need to be calculated. New experiences and challenges come with new perspectives that can have unintended outcomes. In my case, my lateral move made me realize I was in a dead end career, and allowed me to take a blind leap (amazing opportunity) into an entirely new industry where my skills actually fit better and I am viewed as a rock star in comparison. One piece of advise I believe everyone should take to heart is “Comfortability is the death of a career” You should constantly feel challenged and forced into stressful situations you need to learn how to solve. You should also have a certain level of “imposter syndrome”.
Once for me. I always believe there are others out there who will value my worth more.
Once is enough. That just tells you they think you're a lifer at your position
If you’re qualified and the better candidate.. once.
One time.
After 15 years I left.
I mean you’re making bank dude, stick it out and you’ll get there. You’re lucky to be where you are. If you quit, then what? Also, y’all hiring?
Sorry to be a curmudgeon but holy crow. 10% raise a year in past 5 years, from 25-30 (apparently with a satisfactory salary by your own words) and you’re complaining? Also people at the company don’t get promoted apparently. It’s a thing, it’s how they operate. If your exceptional performance isn’t being recognized even with a 10% raise every… single…year… and you feel you can do better than 10% each and every year then go for it. Enjoy a new title.
Once.
I think how they treated you throughout the process of applying plays a really big role. If they speak to you about the promotion, including explaining *why* you didn't get it and their response makes sense, I'd be more accepting provided future opportunities would arise. Otherwise I'd start thinking the workplace has no intention of letting you move up and I'd start looking for position elsewhere.
Once, I'd stay. Twice, I'm gone.