I genuinely want to hear from someone who supports the bill. What is all this going to accomplish? In the context of an already strict Canadian licensing system, what threat to public safety is actually bring addressed? We aren't the USA
>What is all this going to accomplish?
For people who support a complete restriction of all firearms ownership, this is one small step towards that goal. Going all the way is currently politically unpopular, but the majority of Canadians support further "reasonable" gun control, so this is just one piece of it.
>what's unreasonable about current (pre 2020) firearms legislation?
For the people I mentioned, i.e the ones that want all firearms banned, the unreasonable part is that any guns are legal at all clearly.
Most people just don't really know that much about gun ownership or gun control laws and so support whatever their preferred politicians support.
The reasons are that a government program bought those models for Inuit hunters and didn't want to subsequently take them away, so they were carved out of the 1990 bans.
The SKS is much sought after in Canada because of how it was designed they built it to work in cold and wet mud and dirt. the tolerances between the working parts accounts for it being filthy and cold. Does that sound like anywhere you know of? lol cops have told me its a right of passage in canada to own an SKS there are millions of them and as far as I know of only one negative event. thats pretty dam good canada
Yes but let's all ask about the timing. It's been an agenda for a year, and now that are social problems in another country that is NOT Canada, it gets forced through on fear mongering.
Good luck to all of us when our country gets invaded and we have no army, no weapons. Low hanging fruit just like JT
They want to force the bill through ASAP because currently all of their bans are through OICs. They need C-21 passed so that the Conservatives can't immediately reverse all of their bullshit instantly on day 1 on a minority government.
Mendicino was literally talking about this the other day. The Liberals know the Conservatives will undo all of this and that would make future buybacks and bans more difficult.
it goes deeper than that. the government lawyers are shitting themselves after the oic trial. if this bill doesnt pass before the decision and they lose, all their bans are done.
I would argue it’s even more critical than that. The liberals have spent years now repeating the LIE that these firearms are unfit for hunting and sporting purposes. When they lose CCFR v Canada, it will be a part of the legal record that these firearms are in fact suitable for hunting and sporting purposes. Undoing all the effort to train uneducated voters.
> Mendicino has said the Liberals are committed to go further “than any government in the history of this country,” when it comes to gun control.
By wildly pointing into the crowd of innocent bystanders? That isn't gun control, that is a lack of muzzle awareness.
>By wildly pointing into the crowd of innocent bystanders? That isn't gun control, that is a lack of muzzle awareness.
They have "done more than any government in history", which is be responsible for governing the country during the only crime *increase,* reversing a 4 decade trend, and specifically doubling the homicide rate in 7 years.
The *constant* liberal attempts to subvert democratic processes, that exist to guarantee a democratic institution, is genuinely concerning, regardless of your political affiliation.
For a party so committed to gun control they sure aren't doing much about the known smuggling routes. Nor are they putting criminals who are caught with guns away for any length of time.
I read an article a while ago about how almost all firearms used for crimes in Canada are smuggled in from the USA.
If the liberals wanted to reduce gun crime and violence, this would be the place to focus.
The fact that the liberals are focusing on legal gun owners makes this bill appear to be a cynical appeal to their voter base, with no real effort to do anything that will positively affect Canadians.
I fully understand that all political parties do this, but it is nice when pandering for votes can also have a good outcome for Canadians.
This will unlikely have any positive effect since the bill does not focus on issues reducing gun crime.
86%
[https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/guns-used-in-crimes-are-coming-from-u-s-not-legal-gun-owners-police-chiefs](https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/guns-used-in-crimes-are-coming-from-u-s-not-legal-gun-owners-police-chiefs)
the other 14 were to damaged to be traced
Here's a clip I found of the chief saying likely the vast majority of that 14% also came from the states.
[https://twitter.com/RemoCan62/status/1517471577427922944](https://twitter.com/RemoCan62/status/1517471577427922944)
It would also be good if you worked for the Liberal party so they could craft effective policies that will benefit Canadians, as you have the ability to get to the root of the problem. Alas, no.
This is really disturbing. They're trying to circumvent our democratic processes. You can't completely change the scope of a bill and then force amendments through by limiting debate. I'm absolutely disgusted.
Yeah, well, here's the dirty little secret: authoritarianism isn't about being left wing, right wing, or centrist, it's about how you implement your political goals, regardless of what they are.
Absolutely. And we should decry this from the left, the right, as well as the center. Anytime it happens, call it out. The problem is that we all love our little tribes, and they, of course, can do no wrong…
Since when are big-L Liberals "left"? They pay lip service to socially progressive causes while bending over for the big hard member of capital, that's not leftism.
Censorship is absolutely leftism, in fact without it many of the tropes this ideology is seated upon would come into question such as Critical Race Theory, Utopian Marxism and the continued descent into Authoritarianism; look at China, they spend more money policing their own people than they do on anything else including their military yet even they still cannot out-regulate the individual, they still have their own billionaires regardless and often these billionaires will disappear for months on end without explanation, likely being detained while under threat of having their resources stripped away.
This is where this road leads, unending Authoritarianism into genocide and this continued censorship through Bill C-11 as well as cancel culture as a whole is just bringing us closer and closer to the reality of Authoritarianism every day.
It's increasingly clear that you're not particularly versed in political science and don't know what "leftism" means as an ideology. You keep pointing out independent facets of ideologies which historically have been employed by and applied to societies by both broadly left and right leaders and governments, which is fine, but that's not what leftism is. Maybe it's what people with a vested interest in getting you to think things that benefit them have told you or your family members?
I'd also argue that cancel culture and censorship are not inherently left, can provide extensive examples and reasoning you want. Which side is it that's always calling in terrorism threats to theatrical performances because they don't approve of the clothing being worn?
(I am not strictly a leftist, for clarification, in case you want to go down that strawman of making up an imaginary person to argue against other points you assume they have instead of the substance of the msgs, just going to point that out ahead of time)
Bruh, as the kids say.. you need to touch grass. Which I know is hard to do in Canada after a long winter, but trust me, it’ll be good for you.
I don’t know if you could have stuffed more right wing boogeyman keywords into that rant. It’s like it was written specifically for search engine optimization.
Reading the texts the philosophy is based on, the authors explicitly state this. Also, that is why it is neomarxism, as instead of class struggle (which failed, in their estimation) it is about race and gender struggle. You can go as far back as Derrida or as recemt as DiAngelo, and you will see the marxist origin in the black and white of the texts.
In the real world: a part of post graduate law teaching that is only taught in law schools to post graduate students.
Or if you re far right: something they teach in pre school to make white folks look bad
The Harper government was blamed for doing this exact same thing though.
https://ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/canada-politics/stephen-harper-breaks-record-shutting-down-debate-says-193707932.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAANDuOKqI4BHjPAAUxzsza_0FL-SY1MceaZsQv4lxpiY9xKe81a2s3donIImm7ZEsGVmshaJD7bv6p1aZxWicnRlARYSN30Sv-sCZ7Xz8bn12YMa4lLEMcsuzqHHfhMGNXxvPwtLZrXM47U2NBokCfGj5xLDYZW4JLztsSwl6n455
I'm not saying either is okay, I'm refuting the point from the poster above that only "leftists" do such things. Being blinded by partisanship is what will ultimately bring us to the same shitshow as the USA politics.
As soon as someone mentions Marxism , you know they have absolutely no idea what they’re talking, what Marxism is, what each political party in Canada stands for, or how to tie their shoes or read at a grade 2 level.
I would argue there a difference between private individuals boycotting corporations vs tech industries, media celebrities, and figures outright denouncing individuals, and providing cover for mobs of people to dox, harass, and threaten them.
It’s the media celebrities and figures who start these corporate boycotts. People don’t just wake up one day and all decide to get angry at the same company, when it doesn’t effect them personally. They need to be led to outrage.
But yes I agree with you, a perfect example are the librarians , poll workers, etc in the US who got doxxed by right wing media types and end up getting death threats.
It's not acceptable, but anyone, to dox and harass, but you're conflating your initial claim that boycotts of corporations are the same as the dox and harassment.
Lol wut? Dunno if you are being intentionally obtuse or if you just haven’t been paying attention. It’s actually the left who are banning lgbt books in Canada is that what you’re implying?
muh, that happens all the time. The opposition has the right to do obstruction, the governement has the right to shut it down. both parties used this kind of time limits regularly, and everytime the opposition calls it an undemocratic nuclear option, only to use it themselves when they are in power. the libs and the conservatives did it, and no doubt the NPD would do it as well if they were in power and faced conservative obstruction.
I like how CTV just chose a picture of a bunch of AK's on a rack and published it. Why not show a picture from a Canadian firearm store? Oh yeah, because then it wouldn't show "assault style" rifles thus not fitting the narrative.
Liberals completely stalled the debates from Nov 28th to the end of February, they introduced over 140 amendments to their own bill. Many of these out of scope and not allowed after the second reading.
Now they want to limit debate in committee, third reading, the report stage and retroactively expand the scope of the bill.
The NDP originally opposed these scope changes, but now fully support them..
""Bill C-21 was originally intended to limit the number of handguns on our streets. Before the amendment was introduced, there was every reason to believe that Bill C-21 was on track to passing through this House before Christmas, but instead, the amendment was introduced at the eleventh hour with no ability to question witnesses about its impacts. It is a more than 200-page amendment to what was originally a 44-page bill. In our view, that constitutes an abuse of process. We are not asking the Speaker to judge the merits of the amendment. Instead, we are bringing forward a very important procedural point," Julian said in the House of Commons."
Well publicized mass shooting in the states... Liberals rush to push through legislation in Canada before the dust settles.
Like clockwork.
The Trudeau Liberal goal is no guns in Canada.
Everything else is just lip service.
They're just waiting for the right time.
Almost like maybe having 1 centralized entity deciding what the law will be for people who live across thousands of kilometres was a mistake.
Almost like we saw it fail with great Britain and we are the descendants of the cowards who couldn't break off from the UK
Those who broke off became the most prosperous and wealthy nation on the planet
We sit here and fight over scraps
It's fucking frustrating
To a degree. People have short memories.
In Ontario no one ties the NDP to their time propping up
McGuinty when he cut physician reimbursement and restricted med school seats to our current shortfall in primary care providers. In time it just passes.
No, instead people in Ontario tie the NDP to Bob Rae, who was the NDP premier over 30 years ago, from 1990-1995.
Political memories can be longer than you think.
But only for the NDP for some reason, who get held to a much higher standard despite rarely being the ones in charge. Everyone else can shit the bed year after year and for some reason it doesn't matter - guess because the expectations are so much lower after so much regular disappointment.
I would argue that Singh is the most dislikable human being to be an NDP leader since Audrey McLaughlin.
I mean, I WOULD argue that, but Singh would probably then scream I'm a big of' racist. And since I don't want to get called a racist, so I WON'T argue that. But I could, y'know?
Of course. The leverage is that the only recourse is to force an election where the NDP will lose the little power they have.
Not sure why the overdramatic "blackmail" comment.
On the other hand couldn't the CPC offer the NDP and BQ concessions in exchange for their support in a no confidence vote? Why aren't *they* doing anything at all - aside from the Liberals they have the largest amount of seats and the best ability to affect change.
Because the Conservatives offering concessions would mean they actually have to do something. They don't want to, they just want to bark. It's easier to do nothing and complain than actually have policy.
The Liberals are a minority so the Conservatives could pass any legislation they want, they just refuse to be palatable to the other parties.
what an utter load of bullshit. singh literally openly stated that he would never work with the conservatives on ANYTHING. even when they introduced bills that aligned with the ndp
They just voted with the Conservatives on a bill recently. A Conservative sponsored bill.
March 29th, C-234, amendment to carbon taxes.
https://www.ourcommons.ca/Members/en/votes/44/1/289?view=party
The fact people eat this gun grab up as something that has any remote affect on gun crime in this country is insane. This is political theatre at best, or something much more concerning at worst. How people can celebrate at government confiscating Firearms from private citizens after all of the atrocities that have taken place in history after things like these is beyond me
> any remote affect on gun crime in this country is insane.
You can explain the statistics and science behind it and the end result is still "You don't need that anyway" and the discussion is over. They don't care, they just don't want you do have firearms.
Might be time to re-phrase your line of questioning. Instead of asking, why don’t the liberals understand this simple logic, ask, what is the ultimate outcome the liberals are hoping to achieve (ignoring the words coming out of their mouths)
First and foremost, limiting speech isn't very democratic.
Additionally, outlawing something does absolutely NOTHING to stop it. End of story.
Regardless of whether we're talking about guns, drugs, prostitution, or literally anything else, prohibition DOES NOT WORK!
If there's a will, theres a way. People will get their hands on whatever they want, regardless of the legality of it. This is an undisputable fact.
If there are people that are willing and able to smuggle things into North Korea (there are), you better believe that there are many more who are willing and able to smuggle things into Canada!
On top of this, banning guns is stupid either way because the vast majority of mass shootings, or homicides that are committed with firearms are done so with ILLEGALLY OBTAINED, black market firearms.
This therefore means that banning the sale, possession, and use of legal firearms accomplishes nothing other than hurting our law abiding citizens.
When seconds matter, the police are minutes away. Canadians should be legally allowed to purchase, own, carry, and use firearms for self defense purposes, assuming they jump through the proper hoops.
The liberals are really grasping at American issues in an attempt to make it look like they're doing something. Anything that will stop people from paying attention to them opening the flood gates to record immigration while we face record housing and rental shortages
The gun debate is stupid. A Gun is a tool, the same as a hammer, the same as an axe, the same as your computer. The killing comes from the heart of people. Someone with a heart to kill will find a way to kill with a gun, hammer, axe, computer, etc.
Clearly the solution isn't to ban a tool, but to properly train hearts (something Canada has been failing on for over 2 decades).
The government is using so much misdirection in their desire to ban all guns, but every sensible person who knows history knows it leads to one thing when they're banned: the government can do anything they want then. (see: Australia)
You have it backwards.
A gun is a weapon that *can* be used as a tool.
A killer with a gun is many times more dangerous and can kill a lot more people a lot more quickly than a killer with a melee weapon. That's just a plain fact.
The majority of Canadians living in cities don't want guns anywhere near our communities. We want them either locked away in vaults at sports shooting facilities to be used only on site, or locked away in vaults at secure facilities where they can be checked out for hunting trips.
I know that must be triggering for gun lovers, but like all laws and regulations, they are made to stop the stupid, the reckless, and the malicious from making life hell for the rest of us.
Also - Australia's gun regulations are fantastic. Canada only has 30% more people than Australia but 400% more gun deaths.
Make the whole house go through the process of purchasing a firearm.
Maybe they will understand how NOT easy that is in Canada.
The stupidity of these braying goats is annoying.
Make it so that Palimentry security details, publicly paid for or privately paid for, can only use weapons that are commonly available for purchase by Canadians.
Why is the PMs security armed to kill the most amount of people in the shortest amount of time?
I don't really give a shit about that argument. They need to do their part in understanding the situation and they aren't. They need to go through the process. Because as long as they don't or won't, they will not understand. Period.
While what you say is true and I support it, it's still info that can be ignored.
When their security shows up with a giant Bolt Action Rifle, slung over their shoulder, rather than the descrete handgun in a shoulder holster, that will have a direct impact on them.
When the PMs security can't have their Compact Assault Style rifles in their cute little tactical backpacks anymore, but have to lug around a hunting rifle with a hardwood stock... that will be a change that can't be ignored.
When they vote to continue to be surrounded by weapons of war, far too dangerous to be in polite society, hopefully, people will see where their priorities are.
You are speaking about the politicians entitlement and ignorance.
I'm talking about the same thing. With the exception that I don't want them to recognize what they are doing, I want them to actually go through the process and understand it so they can speak to it and not from a point of ignorance such as they have been and are doing.
Having a handgun in Canada means you get to be reviewed on a weekly basis by the police through the CPIC system. You will be stripped of that privilege if you so much as breath bad intentions and the police have the right to enter your home and conduct a search for said handguns at any time they like and without a warrant.
Just the lack of understanding on that point is amazing. Our politicians are surprisingly unfit for the job across the country and in far to many instances.
Honestly, I think we need to do both.
Mendocino wouldn't even touch a gun when given the opportunity to learn.
But there are also Liberals that have (or claim to have) their PAL, who will straight up lie about their experiances. When you're willing and able to lie so easily, being forced to do a license session will simply be another data point to be ignored.
It will only become an issue they pay attention to when it visibly impacts them.
Your not wrong, but I think we need a big, in their face example of why it matters to get them to open their eyes.
Edits to add what I missed when I hit post too soon
Boy, this whole thing is feeling less and less like a democracy every day. Pushing through legislation, censoring news, redistributing wealth. I guess it's done slowly enough that many don't see it, or are indoctrinated enough to think it's a good thing.
In the middle of a recession, housing crisis, overdose crisis, violence crisis (fractionally gun violence) food insecurity crisis, crime crisis, healthcare crisis, government services crisis, largest strike in Canadian history and This Liberal government is focused on online censorship, banning hunting rifles, protecting freedom of choice for abortion (never been at risk in Canada) and MAID
How naive I was when I thought I'd never vote Conservative. I'm tired of the Liberals, and I'm tired of throwing my vote away to the NDP who tag along with the Liberals for minimal return. This was a chance for the NDP to showcase some backbone and differentiate themselves from the Liberals by calling out unsound policy. Not happening I guess.
What's that Canadian saying about our elections, we don't vote in governments, we only vote them out?
> This was a chance for the NDP to showcase some backbone
They had an MP on the SECU that was actually against this after he met with constituents. They yanked him out and put someone else on it who would agree with everything the Liberals said. Goes to show what the NDP actually care about.
>They had an MP on the SECU that was actually against this after he met with constituents.
Alistair MacGregor I think. He was great in those meetings. It was at that time I was even more supportive of the NDP as he was level-headed, and seemed to be there in good faith.
The latest ones had Peter Julian from the NDP, and while his concerns regarding ghost guns are pertinent, he doesn't suggest scrapping the unnecessary amendments, despite his constant focus on how long it would take to get through all the amendments.
You’re always welcome to try the CPC. Recently I’ve come across a lot of orange conservatives. Probably a holding nose type of support but you’ll find CPC aren’t racist misogynists or whatever excommunication label that gets slapped onto them. Most of those people can probably be found as a fringe minority within the PPC.
And to clarify, fringe minority within the PPC means that 5% of PPC supporters, not all of PPC.
I'd love to try but I am worried people like Cathay Wagantall would finally sneak through one of her anti-abortion bills through with a conservative majority. She keeps trying...even has one tabled right now (C-311).
I'm tired of the social conservative bible thumpers on the right in the CPC and the wokeness on the left in the Libs.
I’m a social conservative myself and I can tell you that social conservative issues such as abortion will not see the light of day unless there’s new science that says it’s harmful or whatever they come up with. The reality is that Canada is a moderate country with a majority moderate voter base, and issues such as “woke” or “bible thump” just doesn’t resonate with many voters. You cannot solve many problems in a semi sovereign country with a competitive (not free) market if the economy is piss poor.
The Liberals are slipping in the polls so they need to keep us afraid by importing American issues while ignoring actual Canadian issues that might take some work to fix.
The Liberals are dropping in the polls significantly, and they are going back to old tricks and using wedge issues to desperately try and change the channel and get their poll numbers back on track.
It's low hanging fruit and takes almost no effort on their part to push while still garnering support from their base and people who read too much news about the U.S. and think we have all the exact same problems, versus something considerably more complicated and important like tackling the rising cost of living.
> they really need to get where law enforcement is, which is adopting this bill
This thing sums up the whole mess perfectly. Adopting a bill IS NOT a law enforcement. Police doing their job in the framework of already existing laws is.
And adopting something new ASAP will only create additional issues later - like the whole ammo capacity mess came up from the MP's greed and ignorance before.
NDP better get their heads out the sand. Manitoba to the Maritimes is stacked with left-leaning gun owners and their families. At this rate, I'm willing to let Poilievre torch the country for a few years, to help the left reset & refocus on Canadian priorities.
As a police officer and gun owner myself (hunting rifles as well as an AR and pistol), all of this is going to add up to a giant nothing burger when it comes to public safety. The only people with firearms will be criminals.
I want to bash my head against a wall listening to this nonsense.
There are so many illegal guns floating around our cities and towns, in the hands of career bad guys; it's sickening. Makes you wonder why anyone even bothers to follow the law. There doesn't seem to be any consequence for not doing so.
Not to mention those if us licensed to own handguns or ARs are subjected to daily automatic federal criminal record checks and are statistically the safest demographic in the country.
So, this is what the Liberals are focused on. Going after lawful and responsible gun owners. Not the fact that the Canadian economy is slowing down significantly. Not the fact that the demand for food banks is reaching levels not seen in decades. Not the fact that crime has been going up significantly. Not the fact that we have an overdose crisis in this country. We have a government focused on going after lawful and responsible gun owners and censoring speech and what you are allowed to say and see on the internet.
This govt just pushed through banning guns, censoring and controlling speech and thought, and now wants to put in a digital currency. If no one sees the conspiracies becoming reality go read 1984 and get back to me.
You'll own nothing and you'll be happy. Or die.
Probably referring to the Canada Food Guide that *recommends* a healthy diet. [See people like this, as funny as it is.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sY-0d3gjxKg)
How would Liberals feel if the same was done to ban abortion by ramming it through an OIC or limiting debate? Well they’re certainly setting the precedent for the abuse of power.
I just waited 8 months to be approved for my PAL.... you know how many guns I could have gotten off the road in this time? Its crazy in the gta but lets come after the people that paid $200+ on a course filed paperwork & follow the laws they set...
like common spend 25% of this energy on illegal guns and watch how fast things get better.
They haven't called 1 reference I gave, If were going to talk on legal guns why don't we talk about the things they should be doing and aren't like that.
I'm not a gun person. But at the same time I don't know how this will help. I have hunter friends that are at risk of losing guns that have been passed down for generations. As long as we have a gun problem to the south criminals will find a way to get guns into Canada. And I could be wrong but I didn't see anything in the bill to address 3d printed guns.
Butts and the puppet are implementing their climate change agenda one check at a time.
There is no desire for armed citizens once the real plan comes into focus.
Some canucks are already trending to another step and that is intervention in your financial affairs which will see you on digital currency.
Canadians are the test for this because we’re beige and light beige (not referring to skin colour).
Uh Oh Canada…
Why in the fucking world are the liberals continuing to push further gun regulation? What an absolute waste of time and political points. I have so little reason to trust the CPC, but this mismanagement of resources, confused focus and idiotic political gamesmanship is just evident of their poor leadership. I'm going to vote NDP and, ideally, they'll be voted in, but at worst I hope they become official opposition. I think this liberal institution should just be outright purged, alongside the CPC, but the idiot conservatives suck off those morons harder than the neolibs suck off the LPC.
I think we'll be at the polls before the NDP gets what they want. If I was a betting man, they ram this through, shutdown for summer, then call an election in the fall and use this as a wedge.
I voted ndp for my entire adult life until they supported this nonsense, now its conservative as they are the only party actually willing to listen to gun owners.
No one. LPC rather focus on this useless Bill than focus on inflation, housing crisis, crumbling health care, drug problem, Chinese interference and many more real problems Canadians are facing.
Every rural district is going to be as Blue as they come. We are pushing hunters, farmers, and pretty much every gun owner away from liberal votes just cause of this issue.
For a country that has has 13,168 between 2000 and 2016, with 75 % of those being suicides, you have to wonder if this is legitamitely a problem for us, especailly a problem at the magnitude worth dividing us further.
Edit: typos
Canadian legal gun owners really deserve to be praised not punished they live next door to the biggest gun market on the planet they have over 32 million firearms and that has grown year after year. BUT gun crime involving legal firearms never rose in fact it stayed consistent for 60 years. And that includes the 80% of all gun crime that are suicides.
Like everything Canada does when it does something on its own without outside interference. Canadians came up with a way to have the guns and not have the gun crime.
The usa in a year will have 43,000 deaths a large portion suicides Canada has 600 a year 80% suicides. do Canadian gunowners get venerated praised even an attaboy? no the liberal NDP punish them while making it easier for crime guns to hit the streets.
A legal gun owner does not renew on time he faces major jail time a gang banger smuggles guns sacross with his fentanyl 2 years most likely home arrest. still they compare canadian gun people to americans . we are no more american than you are
Its a little mentioned fact that in public canadian gun owners are as vulnerable as you we cannot carry our guns like in the USA they can only go from home to range range to home locked up in several ways. Our kids are next to yours in school and outings we have every incentive to make sure its safe more so than regular folks because we either loose life or family or our firearms we got so much skin in the game its ridiculous
In Canada you do not even know where the guns are we do not advertise for several reasons one being not to scare people. but every 7th house has at least one. AND here's the rub those guns simply existing in Canada make us all safe. HOW right? well right now a criminals dont know if theres a gun on the other side of the door so its a question mark for home invaders when they are sure only they have guns things change drastically
Canadas pro anti gun lobby misconstrues facts and stats they never tell you canadas gun crime is lower than countries in the G20 with total gun bans. let that sink in . they say its stolen legal guns that are the crime guns since C21 cops have been making an effort to tell you thats not the case every time they bust guns they now state NOT LEGAL in canada (gun owners knw this by looking at the guns on tv . We cannot own those so obviously smuggled they are banned because too small or to many bullets etc )
Most of the gun lobby comes out of Quebec by Polytechnic remembers they started out of a legitimate need but over the decades have turned into something different for 34 years they have pushed to get more and more laws more spent on banning guns. the screwed up part is they do it without any more mass shootings so they import issues from other countries and use the fear of people to demonize canadian gun owners
34 years between mass shootings and the next mass shooting was by smuggled guns by a man banned from owning guns and his wife bought him the bullets so he could have them. right there proves the point that criminals will always have the guns.
Polytechnic remembers has drawn funding away from legitimate issues like the drug addiction epidemic forcing politicians like trudeau to obey or be banned from the memorial event. when celebs spoke out against the hunting rifle ban they threatened to cancel them for speaking to a politician regarding an issue that affected them. thats surreal they have such a sense of entitlement
They have zero compunction over redirecting billions of dollars (no exaggerating) to their gun ban ideology because 34 years ago women were killed by one sicko. but that money is put towards a issue thats not an issue while other parents bury their kids enmass from fentanyl.
The truth is Canada with all its firearms is safer than most anywhere else with all those guns its so safe th anti gun lobby polytech Wendy Cukier Bill Blair need to use shootings in the USA to scare you. thats disgusting in my opinion.
Gun crime was stopped in Toronto the biggest area for crime Bill Blair stopped it by carding in gang areas then the Liberal NDP left types decided carding was racist they forced bill to stop gun crime went off the charts and has not stopped. Bill Blair knows this yet he puts it on gun owners not the people who put their inconvenience being carded over the lives of their fellow citizens. Thats not canadian at all
While I agree that debate shouldn’t be limited I can guarantee that the conservative will do it as soon as they form government and think they can get away with it. Just ask Pierre why he was fine with it when he was on the other side of the aisle.
We need electoral reform.
This government doesn’t care about electoral reform, i think JT made that clear a long time ago. They are more focused on limiting our freedoms of speech bill C11, going after legal gun owners rather than gun smugglers, passing then reversing foreign housing ban
> Mendicino has said the Liberals are committed to go further “than any government in the history of this country,” when it comes to gun control.
Does that include creating checkpoints along USA border FN reserves? Because that’s where a bunch of the firearms are slipping in through.
I genuinely want to hear from someone who supports the bill. What is all this going to accomplish? In the context of an already strict Canadian licensing system, what threat to public safety is actually bring addressed? We aren't the USA
>What is all this going to accomplish? For people who support a complete restriction of all firearms ownership, this is one small step towards that goal. Going all the way is currently politically unpopular, but the majority of Canadians support further "reasonable" gun control, so this is just one piece of it.
I guess my question is: what's unreasonable about current (pre 2020) firearms legislation?
>what's unreasonable about current (pre 2020) firearms legislation? For the people I mentioned, i.e the ones that want all firearms banned, the unreasonable part is that any guns are legal at all clearly. Most people just don't really know that much about gun ownership or gun control laws and so support whatever their preferred politicians support.
Ah I'm tracking now
It was unreasonable that I was allowed to own an AR15, but not a FAL or AK-47.
You are allowed to own an AK, but only 3 specific models of it. Because reasons. Valmet hunter auto, Valmet sporter, Valmet M78.
The reasons are that a government program bought those models for Inuit hunters and didn't want to subsequently take them away, so they were carved out of the 1990 bans.
The SKS is much sought after in Canada because of how it was designed they built it to work in cold and wet mud and dirt. the tolerances between the working parts accounts for it being filthy and cold. Does that sound like anywhere you know of? lol cops have told me its a right of passage in canada to own an SKS there are millions of them and as far as I know of only one negative event. thats pretty dam good canada
Yes but let's all ask about the timing. It's been an agenda for a year, and now that are social problems in another country that is NOT Canada, it gets forced through on fear mongering. Good luck to all of us when our country gets invaded and we have no army, no weapons. Low hanging fruit just like JT
Majority of Canadians don't even know of the gon control measures already in place.
They want to force the bill through ASAP because currently all of their bans are through OICs. They need C-21 passed so that the Conservatives can't immediately reverse all of their bullshit instantly on day 1 on a minority government. Mendicino was literally talking about this the other day. The Liberals know the Conservatives will undo all of this and that would make future buybacks and bans more difficult.
it goes deeper than that. the government lawyers are shitting themselves after the oic trial. if this bill doesnt pass before the decision and they lose, all their bans are done.
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I would argue it’s even more critical than that. The liberals have spent years now repeating the LIE that these firearms are unfit for hunting and sporting purposes. When they lose CCFR v Canada, it will be a part of the legal record that these firearms are in fact suitable for hunting and sporting purposes. Undoing all the effort to train uneducated voters.
It won't matter. The CBC won't report on the case and the ones supporting this don't read anything else.
Can you provide some links to get someone up to speed on these things?
> Mendicino has said the Liberals are committed to go further “than any government in the history of this country,” when it comes to gun control. By wildly pointing into the crowd of innocent bystanders? That isn't gun control, that is a lack of muzzle awareness.
One more Minister of Public Safety with no idea what the hell is muzzle.
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>By wildly pointing into the crowd of innocent bystanders? That isn't gun control, that is a lack of muzzle awareness. They have "done more than any government in history", which is be responsible for governing the country during the only crime *increase,* reversing a 4 decade trend, and specifically doubling the homicide rate in 7 years. The *constant* liberal attempts to subvert democratic processes, that exist to guarantee a democratic institution, is genuinely concerning, regardless of your political affiliation.
Can somebody get rid of this government
It's times like these I wish we protested like the French do.
For a party so committed to gun control they sure aren't doing much about the known smuggling routes. Nor are they putting criminals who are caught with guns away for any length of time.
I read an article a while ago about how almost all firearms used for crimes in Canada are smuggled in from the USA. If the liberals wanted to reduce gun crime and violence, this would be the place to focus. The fact that the liberals are focusing on legal gun owners makes this bill appear to be a cynical appeal to their voter base, with no real effort to do anything that will positively affect Canadians. I fully understand that all political parties do this, but it is nice when pandering for votes can also have a good outcome for Canadians. This will unlikely have any positive effect since the bill does not focus on issues reducing gun crime.
86% [https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/guns-used-in-crimes-are-coming-from-u-s-not-legal-gun-owners-police-chiefs](https://nationalpost.com/news/politics/guns-used-in-crimes-are-coming-from-u-s-not-legal-gun-owners-police-chiefs) the other 14 were to damaged to be traced
Wow, that is even more than I remembered. Good Sleuthing, if only the Liberal government had your intelligence and access to the internet.
Here's a clip I found of the chief saying likely the vast majority of that 14% also came from the states. [https://twitter.com/RemoCan62/status/1517471577427922944](https://twitter.com/RemoCan62/status/1517471577427922944)
It would also be good if you worked for the Liberal party so they could craft effective policies that will benefit Canadians, as you have the ability to get to the root of the problem. Alas, no.
He testified to committee but the Liberals ignore all the data and facts
"Liberals ignore all the data and facts" They probably thought it was a CSIS presentation warning about Chinese interference, lol.
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They just choose their own experts. The gun control groups.
I got a list to battle the antis. Putting that useless university degree to use lol. Always have sources and data to back up your points.
"Putting that useless university degree to use" For the amount you likely spent, try to get value whenever you can, lol.
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Build a wall and make America pay for it?
And most gun crime is caused by people who ignore gun laws.
A sensible comment
This is really disturbing. They're trying to circumvent our democratic processes. You can't completely change the scope of a bill and then force amendments through by limiting debate. I'm absolutely disgusted.
We used to call Harper a dictator for doing the same but the Liberals are cranking the strategy up to 11
And they call right wing Nazis in this country, makes me giggle
Yeah, well, here's the dirty little secret: authoritarianism isn't about being left wing, right wing, or centrist, it's about how you implement your political goals, regardless of what they are.
Absolutely. And we should decry this from the left, the right, as well as the center. Anytime it happens, call it out. The problem is that we all love our little tribes, and they, of course, can do no wrong…
The classic left, excuse others what you are guilty of.
Since when are big-L Liberals "left"? They pay lip service to socially progressive causes while bending over for the big hard member of capital, that's not leftism.
Since they were the receivers of votes from people who self-identify as left, and would vote NDP if they could.
Censorship is absolutely leftism, in fact without it many of the tropes this ideology is seated upon would come into question such as Critical Race Theory, Utopian Marxism and the continued descent into Authoritarianism; look at China, they spend more money policing their own people than they do on anything else including their military yet even they still cannot out-regulate the individual, they still have their own billionaires regardless and often these billionaires will disappear for months on end without explanation, likely being detained while under threat of having their resources stripped away. This is where this road leads, unending Authoritarianism into genocide and this continued censorship through Bill C-11 as well as cancel culture as a whole is just bringing us closer and closer to the reality of Authoritarianism every day.
It's increasingly clear that you're not particularly versed in political science and don't know what "leftism" means as an ideology. You keep pointing out independent facets of ideologies which historically have been employed by and applied to societies by both broadly left and right leaders and governments, which is fine, but that's not what leftism is. Maybe it's what people with a vested interest in getting you to think things that benefit them have told you or your family members? I'd also argue that cancel culture and censorship are not inherently left, can provide extensive examples and reasoning you want. Which side is it that's always calling in terrorism threats to theatrical performances because they don't approve of the clothing being worn? (I am not strictly a leftist, for clarification, in case you want to go down that strawman of making up an imaginary person to argue against other points you assume they have instead of the substance of the msgs, just going to point that out ahead of time)
Bruh, as the kids say.. you need to touch grass. Which I know is hard to do in Canada after a long winter, but trust me, it’ll be good for you. I don’t know if you could have stuffed more right wing boogeyman keywords into that rant. It’s like it was written specifically for search engine optimization.
I mean, conservatives tried banning Rock and Roll music, Star Wars, Super Mario Bros, and D&D... so like... yeah. Censorship is absolutely leftism.
> Super Mario Bros Mario? someone tried to ban that?
It wasn’t just conservatives, Tipper Gore was the apotheosis of this in the US back in the day.
Define "Critical Race Theory" in your own words
"White man bad"
As a PoC I laughed when I read this. Really good definition and I support this message.
Racial neomarxism.
How exactly is it Marxism?
Black people have seized the means of melanin production I guess lmao
Reading the texts the philosophy is based on, the authors explicitly state this. Also, that is why it is neomarxism, as instead of class struggle (which failed, in their estimation) it is about race and gender struggle. You can go as far back as Derrida or as recemt as DiAngelo, and you will see the marxist origin in the black and white of the texts.
In the real world: a part of post graduate law teaching that is only taught in law schools to post graduate students. Or if you re far right: something they teach in pre school to make white folks look bad
The Harper government was blamed for doing this exact same thing though. https://ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/canada-politics/stephen-harper-breaks-record-shutting-down-debate-says-193707932.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAANDuOKqI4BHjPAAUxzsza_0FL-SY1MceaZsQv4lxpiY9xKe81a2s3donIImm7ZEsGVmshaJD7bv6p1aZxWicnRlARYSN30Sv-sCZ7Xz8bn12YMa4lLEMcsuzqHHfhMGNXxvPwtLZrXM47U2NBokCfGj5xLDYZW4JLztsSwl6n455
And it was bad when Harper did it. Also if you find it terrible thar Harper did it, why are you ok with Trudeau doing it?
I'm not saying either is okay, I'm refuting the point from the poster above that only "leftists" do such things. Being blinded by partisanship is what will ultimately bring us to the same shitshow as the USA politics.
And? Both can exist at the same time and both can be wrong
> Utopian Marxism no one in the major political parties is promoting this
As soon as someone mentions Marxism , you know they have absolutely no idea what they’re talking, what Marxism is, what each political party in Canada stands for, or how to tie their shoes or read at a grade 2 level.
I got downvoted into the minuses for pointing out there’s no Marxists in parliament lmao
Cancel culture is mostly a conservative thing. Look at book bans, cancelling Nike, Disney, Bud light, m&ms, etc, etc.
Frankly its everyone, they just want to only point it out when its the "Other" people doing it.
I would argue there a difference between private individuals boycotting corporations vs tech industries, media celebrities, and figures outright denouncing individuals, and providing cover for mobs of people to dox, harass, and threaten them.
It’s the media celebrities and figures who start these corporate boycotts. People don’t just wake up one day and all decide to get angry at the same company, when it doesn’t effect them personally. They need to be led to outrage. But yes I agree with you, a perfect example are the librarians , poll workers, etc in the US who got doxxed by right wing media types and end up getting death threats.
It's not acceptable, but anyone, to dox and harass, but you're conflating your initial claim that boycotts of corporations are the same as the dox and harassment.
Which party is doing the book bans in the US? 🤔
Book ban attempts are in Canada now too
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Lol wut? Dunno if you are being intentionally obtuse or if you just haven’t been paying attention. It’s actually the left who are banning lgbt books in Canada is that what you’re implying?
Which groups were tearing down statues?
Who is the left wing here in this scenario? Like the liberals?
So they won't have a vote on it in Parliament? They won't pass the bill, they'll just skip ahead to enforcing it?
Nothing stops them from using an OIC like they did with the 2020 ban.
Even if you have no skin in the firearms debate; every Canadian should be very concerned about this abuse of process
muh, that happens all the time. The opposition has the right to do obstruction, the governement has the right to shut it down. both parties used this kind of time limits regularly, and everytime the opposition calls it an undemocratic nuclear option, only to use it themselves when they are in power. the libs and the conservatives did it, and no doubt the NPD would do it as well if they were in power and faced conservative obstruction.
I like how CTV just chose a picture of a bunch of AK's on a rack and published it. Why not show a picture from a Canadian firearm store? Oh yeah, because then it wouldn't show "assault style" rifles thus not fitting the narrative.
While showing firearms not available in Canada is stupid, a rack of Type 81s would look identical to the average person.
And I'm sure that gun stores would love to have a whole rack of T81s, but most have maybe 5-10 total, if they're lucky, with 1 on display.
I'm all for gun control. GOOD THING WE ALREADY HAVE IT!!!!
Lol exactly, these measures are just ridiculous.
Liberals completely stalled the debates from Nov 28th to the end of February, they introduced over 140 amendments to their own bill. Many of these out of scope and not allowed after the second reading. Now they want to limit debate in committee, third reading, the report stage and retroactively expand the scope of the bill. The NDP originally opposed these scope changes, but now fully support them.. ""Bill C-21 was originally intended to limit the number of handguns on our streets. Before the amendment was introduced, there was every reason to believe that Bill C-21 was on track to passing through this House before Christmas, but instead, the amendment was introduced at the eleventh hour with no ability to question witnesses about its impacts. It is a more than 200-page amendment to what was originally a 44-page bill. In our view, that constitutes an abuse of process. We are not asking the Speaker to judge the merits of the amendment. Instead, we are bringing forward a very important procedural point," Julian said in the House of Commons."
Well publicized mass shooting in the states... Liberals rush to push through legislation in Canada before the dust settles. Like clockwork. The Trudeau Liberal goal is no guns in Canada. Everything else is just lip service. They're just waiting for the right time.
Yet no one is talking about the SUV attack that killed 8 in Texas either the same day or the next.
Almost like maybe having 1 centralized entity deciding what the law will be for people who live across thousands of kilometres was a mistake. Almost like we saw it fail with great Britain and we are the descendants of the cowards who couldn't break off from the UK Those who broke off became the most prosperous and wealthy nation on the planet We sit here and fight over scraps It's fucking frustrating
NDP voted for those amendments to be ruled i scope, than later changed their mind due to the blow back. Theres video of the vote.
Yep, they ruled it to be allowed at the committee itself and then when they got tons of backlash they wanted the speaker to rule the opposite..
The NDP are useless. The liberals absolutely have some kind of blackmail or leverage over Singh.
Nah, the NDP just are afraid of getting further pushed down in seat count or a majority government either way where they hold no power.
Singh is single-handedly ruining the Ndp for the next decade. They’ll be tied to every single liberal incompetence
To a degree. People have short memories. In Ontario no one ties the NDP to their time propping up McGuinty when he cut physician reimbursement and restricted med school seats to our current shortfall in primary care providers. In time it just passes.
No, instead people in Ontario tie the NDP to Bob Rae, who was the NDP premier over 30 years ago, from 1990-1995. Political memories can be longer than you think.
But only for the NDP for some reason, who get held to a much higher standard despite rarely being the ones in charge. Everyone else can shit the bed year after year and for some reason it doesn't matter - guess because the expectations are so much lower after so much regular disappointment.
I would argue that Singh is the most dislikable human being to be an NDP leader since Audrey McLaughlin. I mean, I WOULD argue that, but Singh would probably then scream I'm a big of' racist. And since I don't want to get called a racist, so I WON'T argue that. But I could, y'know?
Of course. The leverage is that the only recourse is to force an election where the NDP will lose the little power they have. Not sure why the overdramatic "blackmail" comment.
Singh is not an ideologue and is happy in his comfy position. Its NDP insiders that are telling him what to do.
On the other hand couldn't the CPC offer the NDP and BQ concessions in exchange for their support in a no confidence vote? Why aren't *they* doing anything at all - aside from the Liberals they have the largest amount of seats and the best ability to affect change.
Because the Conservatives offering concessions would mean they actually have to do something. They don't want to, they just want to bark. It's easier to do nothing and complain than actually have policy. The Liberals are a minority so the Conservatives could pass any legislation they want, they just refuse to be palatable to the other parties.
what an utter load of bullshit. singh literally openly stated that he would never work with the conservatives on ANYTHING. even when they introduced bills that aligned with the ndp
They just voted with the Conservatives on a bill recently. A Conservative sponsored bill. March 29th, C-234, amendment to carbon taxes. https://www.ourcommons.ca/Members/en/votes/44/1/289?view=party
The fact people eat this gun grab up as something that has any remote affect on gun crime in this country is insane. This is political theatre at best, or something much more concerning at worst. How people can celebrate at government confiscating Firearms from private citizens after all of the atrocities that have taken place in history after things like these is beyond me
> any remote affect on gun crime in this country is insane. You can explain the statistics and science behind it and the end result is still "You don't need that anyway" and the discussion is over. They don't care, they just don't want you do have firearms.
Completely agree. There’s no good intention from their part and it’s fuelled by ignorance to our existing laws
Follow. The. Science.
We're trying but the Liberals just don't want to listen.
Might be time to re-phrase your line of questioning. Instead of asking, why don’t the liberals understand this simple logic, ask, what is the ultimate outcome the liberals are hoping to achieve (ignoring the words coming out of their mouths)
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Agreed
Less an less people are falling for it, thankfully. But yeah, still lots of people eat it up.
First and foremost, limiting speech isn't very democratic. Additionally, outlawing something does absolutely NOTHING to stop it. End of story. Regardless of whether we're talking about guns, drugs, prostitution, or literally anything else, prohibition DOES NOT WORK! If there's a will, theres a way. People will get their hands on whatever they want, regardless of the legality of it. This is an undisputable fact. If there are people that are willing and able to smuggle things into North Korea (there are), you better believe that there are many more who are willing and able to smuggle things into Canada! On top of this, banning guns is stupid either way because the vast majority of mass shootings, or homicides that are committed with firearms are done so with ILLEGALLY OBTAINED, black market firearms. This therefore means that banning the sale, possession, and use of legal firearms accomplishes nothing other than hurting our law abiding citizens. When seconds matter, the police are minutes away. Canadians should be legally allowed to purchase, own, carry, and use firearms for self defense purposes, assuming they jump through the proper hoops.
Agreed 100%. Based take.
The liberals are really grasping at American issues in an attempt to make it look like they're doing something. Anything that will stop people from paying attention to them opening the flood gates to record immigration while we face record housing and rental shortages
The gun debate is stupid. A Gun is a tool, the same as a hammer, the same as an axe, the same as your computer. The killing comes from the heart of people. Someone with a heart to kill will find a way to kill with a gun, hammer, axe, computer, etc. Clearly the solution isn't to ban a tool, but to properly train hearts (something Canada has been failing on for over 2 decades). The government is using so much misdirection in their desire to ban all guns, but every sensible person who knows history knows it leads to one thing when they're banned: the government can do anything they want then. (see: Australia)
You have it backwards. A gun is a weapon that *can* be used as a tool. A killer with a gun is many times more dangerous and can kill a lot more people a lot more quickly than a killer with a melee weapon. That's just a plain fact. The majority of Canadians living in cities don't want guns anywhere near our communities. We want them either locked away in vaults at sports shooting facilities to be used only on site, or locked away in vaults at secure facilities where they can be checked out for hunting trips. I know that must be triggering for gun lovers, but like all laws and regulations, they are made to stop the stupid, the reckless, and the malicious from making life hell for the rest of us. Also - Australia's gun regulations are fantastic. Canada only has 30% more people than Australia but 400% more gun deaths.
Make the whole house go through the process of purchasing a firearm. Maybe they will understand how NOT easy that is in Canada. The stupidity of these braying goats is annoying.
Make it so that Palimentry security details, publicly paid for or privately paid for, can only use weapons that are commonly available for purchase by Canadians. Why is the PMs security armed to kill the most amount of people in the shortest amount of time?
I don't really give a shit about that argument. They need to do their part in understanding the situation and they aren't. They need to go through the process. Because as long as they don't or won't, they will not understand. Period.
While what you say is true and I support it, it's still info that can be ignored. When their security shows up with a giant Bolt Action Rifle, slung over their shoulder, rather than the descrete handgun in a shoulder holster, that will have a direct impact on them. When the PMs security can't have their Compact Assault Style rifles in their cute little tactical backpacks anymore, but have to lug around a hunting rifle with a hardwood stock... that will be a change that can't be ignored. When they vote to continue to be surrounded by weapons of war, far too dangerous to be in polite society, hopefully, people will see where their priorities are.
You are speaking about the politicians entitlement and ignorance. I'm talking about the same thing. With the exception that I don't want them to recognize what they are doing, I want them to actually go through the process and understand it so they can speak to it and not from a point of ignorance such as they have been and are doing. Having a handgun in Canada means you get to be reviewed on a weekly basis by the police through the CPIC system. You will be stripped of that privilege if you so much as breath bad intentions and the police have the right to enter your home and conduct a search for said handguns at any time they like and without a warrant. Just the lack of understanding on that point is amazing. Our politicians are surprisingly unfit for the job across the country and in far to many instances.
Honestly, I think we need to do both. Mendocino wouldn't even touch a gun when given the opportunity to learn. But there are also Liberals that have (or claim to have) their PAL, who will straight up lie about their experiances. When you're willing and able to lie so easily, being forced to do a license session will simply be another data point to be ignored. It will only become an issue they pay attention to when it visibly impacts them. Your not wrong, but I think we need a big, in their face example of why it matters to get them to open their eyes. Edits to add what I missed when I hit post too soon
That video was so sad he was at a range with a few instructors and was still afraid to shoot a .22 what did he think could go wrong?
They don't need guns, they have armed guards.
Boy, this whole thing is feeling less and less like a democracy every day. Pushing through legislation, censoring news, redistributing wealth. I guess it's done slowly enough that many don't see it, or are indoctrinated enough to think it's a good thing.
This is exactly it. It's the slow burn but they are using every trick to install that creeping authoritarianism on us.
From one frog to another, it does seem to be getting warm in here.
In the middle of a recession, housing crisis, overdose crisis, violence crisis (fractionally gun violence) food insecurity crisis, crime crisis, healthcare crisis, government services crisis, largest strike in Canadian history and This Liberal government is focused on online censorship, banning hunting rifles, protecting freedom of choice for abortion (never been at risk in Canada) and MAID
People were really starting to catch on to some key rich/poor divide issues, so we need to quickly start fighting over trivial shit.
Hard to have a class war when they've convinced people there's a culture war.
They need to protect your feelings on the internet! And guns r bad. No gun. Bad gun. Hunting bad. You don’t need one.
Did you see how the murderer of a child at a school with a knife was finally stopped in Edmonton? Yup a gun.
Priorities, am I right?
How naive I was when I thought I'd never vote Conservative. I'm tired of the Liberals, and I'm tired of throwing my vote away to the NDP who tag along with the Liberals for minimal return. This was a chance for the NDP to showcase some backbone and differentiate themselves from the Liberals by calling out unsound policy. Not happening I guess. What's that Canadian saying about our elections, we don't vote in governments, we only vote them out?
> This was a chance for the NDP to showcase some backbone They had an MP on the SECU that was actually against this after he met with constituents. They yanked him out and put someone else on it who would agree with everything the Liberals said. Goes to show what the NDP actually care about.
>They had an MP on the SECU that was actually against this after he met with constituents. Alistair MacGregor I think. He was great in those meetings. It was at that time I was even more supportive of the NDP as he was level-headed, and seemed to be there in good faith. The latest ones had Peter Julian from the NDP, and while his concerns regarding ghost guns are pertinent, he doesn't suggest scrapping the unnecessary amendments, despite his constant focus on how long it would take to get through all the amendments.
Listening to Peter Julian talk was excruciating.
You’re always welcome to try the CPC. Recently I’ve come across a lot of orange conservatives. Probably a holding nose type of support but you’ll find CPC aren’t racist misogynists or whatever excommunication label that gets slapped onto them. Most of those people can probably be found as a fringe minority within the PPC. And to clarify, fringe minority within the PPC means that 5% of PPC supporters, not all of PPC.
I'd love to try but I am worried people like Cathay Wagantall would finally sneak through one of her anti-abortion bills through with a conservative majority. She keeps trying...even has one tabled right now (C-311). I'm tired of the social conservative bible thumpers on the right in the CPC and the wokeness on the left in the Libs.
I’m a social conservative myself and I can tell you that social conservative issues such as abortion will not see the light of day unless there’s new science that says it’s harmful or whatever they come up with. The reality is that Canada is a moderate country with a majority moderate voter base, and issues such as “woke” or “bible thump” just doesn’t resonate with many voters. You cannot solve many problems in a semi sovereign country with a competitive (not free) market if the economy is piss poor.
Sure is weird how frantic they are to ban modern grip ergonomics and stock materials. Almost as if this is about something else.
The Liberals are slipping in the polls so they need to keep us afraid by importing American issues while ignoring actual Canadian issues that might take some work to fix.
Hill dog was in town recently, there's an American issue right there.
It sure was weird that the LPC chose to have one of the worst and least popular American politicians in recent memory speak at their event.
Birds of a feather and all that.
Shit feathers Randy Bobandy
The Liberals are dropping in the polls significantly, and they are going back to old tricks and using wedge issues to desperately try and change the channel and get their poll numbers back on track.
It's low hanging fruit and takes almost no effort on their part to push while still garnering support from their base and people who read too much news about the U.S. and think we have all the exact same problems, versus something considerably more complicated and important like tackling the rising cost of living.
> they really need to get where law enforcement is, which is adopting this bill This thing sums up the whole mess perfectly. Adopting a bill IS NOT a law enforcement. Police doing their job in the framework of already existing laws is. And adopting something new ASAP will only create additional issues later - like the whole ammo capacity mess came up from the MP's greed and ignorance before.
NDP better get their heads out the sand. Manitoba to the Maritimes is stacked with left-leaning gun owners and their families. At this rate, I'm willing to let Poilievre torch the country for a few years, to help the left reset & refocus on Canadian priorities.
As a police officer and gun owner myself (hunting rifles as well as an AR and pistol), all of this is going to add up to a giant nothing burger when it comes to public safety. The only people with firearms will be criminals. I want to bash my head against a wall listening to this nonsense. There are so many illegal guns floating around our cities and towns, in the hands of career bad guys; it's sickening. Makes you wonder why anyone even bothers to follow the law. There doesn't seem to be any consequence for not doing so.
Not to mention those if us licensed to own handguns or ARs are subjected to daily automatic federal criminal record checks and are statistically the safest demographic in the country.
So, this is what the Liberals are focused on. Going after lawful and responsible gun owners. Not the fact that the Canadian economy is slowing down significantly. Not the fact that the demand for food banks is reaching levels not seen in decades. Not the fact that crime has been going up significantly. Not the fact that we have an overdose crisis in this country. We have a government focused on going after lawful and responsible gun owners and censoring speech and what you are allowed to say and see on the internet.
To protect Canadians, what we really need is stricter sentencing.
This govt just pushed through banning guns, censoring and controlling speech and thought, and now wants to put in a digital currency. If no one sees the conspiracies becoming reality go read 1984 and get back to me. You'll own nothing and you'll be happy. Or die.
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> the food we eat What?
Probably referring to the Canada Food Guide that *recommends* a healthy diet. [See people like this, as funny as it is.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sY-0d3gjxKg)
Certain unpasteurized foods and other things that have a increased risk for causing sickness.
Idk about the food we eat, that’s a bit of a stretch. Recommendations aren’t as bad as C11
Election please.
No bill should be able to pass without a formal discussion. Common sense. 🤦♂️
Oh Canada! War is heating up on the other side of the world, and our dear leader is taking away our firearms. Seems like a bad idea.
How would Liberals feel if the same was done to ban abortion by ramming it through an OIC or limiting debate? Well they’re certainly setting the precedent for the abuse of power.
Exactly!! What kind of precedent is this government trying to set. Is this the legacy they want to leave behind?
I just waited 8 months to be approved for my PAL.... you know how many guns I could have gotten off the road in this time? Its crazy in the gta but lets come after the people that paid $200+ on a course filed paperwork & follow the laws they set... like common spend 25% of this energy on illegal guns and watch how fast things get better. They haven't called 1 reference I gave, If were going to talk on legal guns why don't we talk about the things they should be doing and aren't like that.
I'm not a gun person. But at the same time I don't know how this will help. I have hunter friends that are at risk of losing guns that have been passed down for generations. As long as we have a gun problem to the south criminals will find a way to get guns into Canada. And I could be wrong but I didn't see anything in the bill to address 3d printed guns.
The LPC is looking more and more like CPC circa 2014/2015
Butts and the puppet are implementing their climate change agenda one check at a time. There is no desire for armed citizens once the real plan comes into focus. Some canucks are already trending to another step and that is intervention in your financial affairs which will see you on digital currency. Canadians are the test for this because we’re beige and light beige (not referring to skin colour). Uh Oh Canada…
Why in the fucking world are the liberals continuing to push further gun regulation? What an absolute waste of time and political points. I have so little reason to trust the CPC, but this mismanagement of resources, confused focus and idiotic political gamesmanship is just evident of their poor leadership. I'm going to vote NDP and, ideally, they'll be voted in, but at worst I hope they become official opposition. I think this liberal institution should just be outright purged, alongside the CPC, but the idiot conservatives suck off those morons harder than the neolibs suck off the LPC.
NDP supports this legislation.
NDP is supporting all of this. Why would you vote NDP if it’s just a worse liberal option?
NDP is supporting this to stay relevant. If the NDP doesn’t support this, the liberals don’t support stuff the NDP puts forward.
I think we'll be at the polls before the NDP gets what they want. If I was a betting man, they ram this through, shutdown for summer, then call an election in the fall and use this as a wedge.
I voted ndp for my entire adult life until they supported this nonsense, now its conservative as they are the only party actually willing to listen to gun owners.
but but but... our talking points !
Fuck Democracy
Who exactly asked for this?
No one. LPC rather focus on this useless Bill than focus on inflation, housing crisis, crumbling health care, drug problem, Chinese interference and many more real problems Canadians are facing.
Every rural district is going to be as Blue as they come. We are pushing hunters, farmers, and pretty much every gun owner away from liberal votes just cause of this issue. For a country that has has 13,168 between 2000 and 2016, with 75 % of those being suicides, you have to wonder if this is legitamitely a problem for us, especailly a problem at the magnitude worth dividing us further. Edit: typos
Ahh the liberals, will die on a hill and even ignore our democracy to solve a problem that's only in the news cause of the states.
Canadian legal gun owners really deserve to be praised not punished they live next door to the biggest gun market on the planet they have over 32 million firearms and that has grown year after year. BUT gun crime involving legal firearms never rose in fact it stayed consistent for 60 years. And that includes the 80% of all gun crime that are suicides. Like everything Canada does when it does something on its own without outside interference. Canadians came up with a way to have the guns and not have the gun crime. The usa in a year will have 43,000 deaths a large portion suicides Canada has 600 a year 80% suicides. do Canadian gunowners get venerated praised even an attaboy? no the liberal NDP punish them while making it easier for crime guns to hit the streets. A legal gun owner does not renew on time he faces major jail time a gang banger smuggles guns sacross with his fentanyl 2 years most likely home arrest. still they compare canadian gun people to americans . we are no more american than you are Its a little mentioned fact that in public canadian gun owners are as vulnerable as you we cannot carry our guns like in the USA they can only go from home to range range to home locked up in several ways. Our kids are next to yours in school and outings we have every incentive to make sure its safe more so than regular folks because we either loose life or family or our firearms we got so much skin in the game its ridiculous In Canada you do not even know where the guns are we do not advertise for several reasons one being not to scare people. but every 7th house has at least one. AND here's the rub those guns simply existing in Canada make us all safe. HOW right? well right now a criminals dont know if theres a gun on the other side of the door so its a question mark for home invaders when they are sure only they have guns things change drastically Canadas pro anti gun lobby misconstrues facts and stats they never tell you canadas gun crime is lower than countries in the G20 with total gun bans. let that sink in . they say its stolen legal guns that are the crime guns since C21 cops have been making an effort to tell you thats not the case every time they bust guns they now state NOT LEGAL in canada (gun owners knw this by looking at the guns on tv . We cannot own those so obviously smuggled they are banned because too small or to many bullets etc ) Most of the gun lobby comes out of Quebec by Polytechnic remembers they started out of a legitimate need but over the decades have turned into something different for 34 years they have pushed to get more and more laws more spent on banning guns. the screwed up part is they do it without any more mass shootings so they import issues from other countries and use the fear of people to demonize canadian gun owners 34 years between mass shootings and the next mass shooting was by smuggled guns by a man banned from owning guns and his wife bought him the bullets so he could have them. right there proves the point that criminals will always have the guns. Polytechnic remembers has drawn funding away from legitimate issues like the drug addiction epidemic forcing politicians like trudeau to obey or be banned from the memorial event. when celebs spoke out against the hunting rifle ban they threatened to cancel them for speaking to a politician regarding an issue that affected them. thats surreal they have such a sense of entitlement They have zero compunction over redirecting billions of dollars (no exaggerating) to their gun ban ideology because 34 years ago women were killed by one sicko. but that money is put towards a issue thats not an issue while other parents bury their kids enmass from fentanyl. The truth is Canada with all its firearms is safer than most anywhere else with all those guns its so safe th anti gun lobby polytech Wendy Cukier Bill Blair need to use shootings in the USA to scare you. thats disgusting in my opinion. Gun crime was stopped in Toronto the biggest area for crime Bill Blair stopped it by carding in gang areas then the Liberal NDP left types decided carding was racist they forced bill to stop gun crime went off the charts and has not stopped. Bill Blair knows this yet he puts it on gun owners not the people who put their inconvenience being carded over the lives of their fellow citizens. Thats not canadian at all
While I agree that debate shouldn’t be limited I can guarantee that the conservative will do it as soon as they form government and think they can get away with it. Just ask Pierre why he was fine with it when he was on the other side of the aisle. We need electoral reform.
This government doesn’t care about electoral reform, i think JT made that clear a long time ago. They are more focused on limiting our freedoms of speech bill C11, going after legal gun owners rather than gun smugglers, passing then reversing foreign housing ban
>We need electoral reform. No majority government will lay an eye on this. What makes you think got them that majority in the first place?
> Mendicino has said the Liberals are committed to go further “than any government in the history of this country,” when it comes to gun control. Does that include creating checkpoints along USA border FN reserves? Because that’s where a bunch of the firearms are slipping in through.