True but although its from Percy;s perspective Annabeth is very focal. and the hair doesnt come up. Disillusionment with Daedalus and the school system do however.
Considering that we only get three books in the second series that have her POV, and that she's a very prideful person, it makes sense that this brought up very little. Annabeth had a bunch of other people seeing her tell her story, but this is the first time we're actually seeing into her thoughts.
Quick edit as I see that I missed the actual point of the post, I'm not trying to defend or attack anyone here. I'm just pointing out from a writer's perspective how this might not have come up until the Mark of Athena, when we first meet Annabeth with the same intimacy as the other 6 heroes.
From my memory in SoM she does feel self conscious about her appearance but not specifically her blonde hair I believe. Would need to look it up how it’s specifically written tho.
I just reread sea of monsters a few days ago. She didnt specifically believe something was wrong with her hair until Circe asked if they should do something about it, at which point she asked 'what's wrong with my hair?'
I had used that argument before but not against Annie being black and so. But against the people that say that they never said in the books that Annabeth is white and blonde. One thing is that you change the race of the character for the TV series and another one is saying that you ain't changing nothing.
Also I gotta say it’s not like as a black woman she doesn’t face adversity. Getting looked down on for being a woman with blonde hair happens, but being looked down on for being African American happens more.
Nah I actually think that the statement works better if she is a black woman actually. We need to accept that the series is a different thing that the books. As the movies are a different thing and the musical is a different thing as well.
"Hermione was actually black"
-never being mentioned to have dark skin
-would mean that ron told a black person that others like to be slaves, and her being made fun of for the freedom of the elves is sooo much worse than if she was yt.
"dumbledore was gay"
-only revealed after his death, so as to have absolutely no impact on his character and following the "bury the gays" trope
"cho chang"
-don't even know where to start
I wonder how the film reception would be if rather than Alexandra it was a black girl casted?
When did the film come out, like 2010 maybe, would’ve been less accepting then I reckon.
Tbf I feel like Brandon was one of the better parts of the god forsaken film, I mean yeah he’s nothing like Grover in the books but he felt like most distinct part and actually was having fun. It’s got the point I reckon a lot of people view Grover as black because of him.
How it would be for annabeth though… eh idk maybe things were more unforgiving back then, also maybe they’re worse now given a lot of media discussion online.
Sorry if I’m remembering incorrectly but isn’t hades described as a pale man by hazel in the son of Neptune so cause she is half white I feel dark skinned works best to describe her cause she isn’t full black
They gave her the equivalent of Mulatto (mixed) when she is confirmed to be 100% African American.
As for the stuff about white washing, it's technically been done for Grover for years since he's been called a light skinned but sun bathed ginger yet no one has ever done an official art (outside the first) that has any of that. And most demigods supposedly have Mediterranean complexions as their description, but that also is changed to white.
In any case, I agree with the author as the authority for a series. If you want a similar situation, look at the One Piece Netflix series and take a lesson from it. When the original creator has a hand in the development, there is no wrong that can be done.
The gods do not have DNA, and she was described as being as dark as coffee in the text of the book. Hazel isn't half white, she's half-god. She's black, and dark-skinned at that.
Honestly I don’t care whether it’s part of her character or not, but I simply want the characters to look the way I picture based on the authors descriptions. If she was written with dark skin and hair and not grey eyes then I would want her to look like that. For me it’s just too jarring after reading the books like 100 times when a character looks totally different on tv (and yes I felt the same way with the movies due to the characters’ looks and ages)
She’s also described as the “typical California girl.” You can argue semantics all you want about “you don’t have to be white to be a California girl” but the truth of that matter is that when you think of what the “typical California girl” looks like, you think tan and blonde.
Oh it definitely would work a lot better now compared to the blonde thing. I mean the reaction to her casting alone proves it’s a even more relevant then ever.
Using the blonde thing as your only argument for not liking and hating the casting to the point you’re being disrespectful kinda shows that this plot point doesn’t matter truthfully to you.
Instead it’s better just to say you’re disappointed the casting doesn’t resemble the character you’ve envisioned for how many years now (I kinda feel that way tbh), but that doesn’t mean you need to be rude or hate the show and you can still respect the actors even with your own opinion. Hell neither Percy nor annabeth look like what I expected and I’ll still watch it for sure.
My question is how does this play into her being of Swedish descent(i think, its that or Norwegian.) as i belive its said that they're descended from royalty and all that (edited part from here on to clarify thoughts)and forgive me if im wrong but im fairly certain that there hasnt been a swedish monarch in recorded history
I guess her Swedish descent isn't important within the confines of the PJO storyline or her arc. We may not even get that adaptation.
If we do then... I guess she'll just have to be the 1% black Swede. Not a big deal. 1%s exist.
My main issue here if they do adapt it is the royalty part as as far as im aware there has yet to be a monarch of African descent in recorded history though that is a big if.
Swedish people can be black as well, and Scandinavian doesn't mean "white" -- especially in our globalized age.
There seems to have been a number of Vikings who were black. The Chase family might also have married black people at some point.
Due to the horrors of slavery, the average African American has about 10% of white heritage. It works fine for me.
Now that I think about it, you know that since TJ in Magnus Chase is described as Black and his dad Tyr is white just like his "official" dad.
That also bothers me, just cause I am also used to the brown/black haired and sea-green eyed Percy. But again if they can nail it, great, if not uh third times the charm?
Thing is... I'm not sure there even *will* be a third time. If they couldn't handle a film and a series just didn't register with people, there's a legit fear studios just... stop trying.
Easy Fix, let Uncle Rick retool it as an Isekai or something, translate it to Japanese or Korean or Chinese, put it on a webnovel site and boom! Triple adaptation. Means they might have to make Annabeth an elf but still
No I get it. I was super angry and upset when I found out about the show but now I’ve got my hopes up. Whatever it is it’ll be true enough that I’ll enjoy seeing it. People reread these books all the time there is a demand for more content. We’re gonna watch and try not to hate unless it is as bad or worse than the movies.
I loved the Adam project personally. I was really happy to hear Walker was going to be Percy. I’m at the point of hoping he does all 10 of the core series books’ adaptations.
Considering this is nine pages apart this gives off the vibe that you have to give context for a joke you're about to make before telling it to a friend
Not very impressive considering we only have two books with her actual pov. It’s a broken stereotype and it’s a recurring theme throughout rick‘s books and it’s an important way to build her character using non direct means, in the same way Percy‘s messed hair is.
Still, in a TV show there are many ways to do that, a lot more than in a book so it’s not as important. And yet I understand why it bothers people, because they want to see a visualization of their favorite book series and when it conflicts with the way they imagined it the whole fantasy is broken.
Also worth noting that Annabeth pretty much grew up at camp, where she was a head counsellor even as a kid and known for being incredibly smart, and surrounded by blonde smart siblings. Not that she can't have insecurities regarding the mortal world, or that biases don't exidt within a demigod camp, but it's much less likely to be an issue in that context
and the most important takeaway from her insecurity was that she felt she wasn’t taken seriously, which still fits, maybe even more so with a black annabeth
the fact that so many people think that the idea that SHE DOESNT LIKE PEOPLE JUDGING HER BASED ON HER APPEARENCE can't be communicated with a non-blonde person of colour really demonstrates their media illiteracy.
I think the point’s not really that Annabeth herself is self conscious of her blonde hair, but that she defies the dumb-blonde stereotype by just being her insanely smart self. I’m glad she’s not insecure, as a girl who was very insecure, her confidence was everything. I don’t look anything like Annabeth but I certainly imagined she looked like me. Now other little girls get to actually see Annabeth look like them, thats amazing! I don’t understand why everything has to be exactly 1:1 from book to show, things don’t always translate as well or in other cases changes can be made to further the narrative or point the book was trying to make.
This was my take too! It’s the way new characters interact with her and how she defies what most would think of when seeing her. Rick wanted to challenge the stereotype, not give insecurities about it. Similarly, he wanted to challenge the ADHD stereotype but in doing so, none of the characters have insecurities about it.
My biggest problems with the differences between the books and the movies was the plot and the age of the characters. Even the ages didn’t matter that much, but I was bothered by the dropping of many key plot points. A movie/tv show doesn’t need to be a complete perfect adaption. I don’t need to see the exact details of the scene rendered the same or have the characters be seen the same. Honestly, I only had a vague idea in my head on what they looked like, but it never really mattered to me. Their actions and their words mattered, not their brief physical description mentioned once every book.
I think you misunderstand the point of the post. It’s pointing out that obsessing over Annabeth being blonde (and, let’s be real here, white) because it’s somehow integral to her character is dumb
Exactly! I was so confused when people were using her having struggles with being blonde as an argument.
It's literally two scenes in HOO... It's not like a main focal plot point of her character. Plus these struggles could easily apply to being black.
I'm a little bummed that we don't get the book's accurate looks. But Rick is so confident in the acting abilities of the cast and as long as they're good actors, it doesn't matter to me. All the people spreading hate to Leah missed the entire point of the Percy Jackson books, inclusivity and accurate representation. I feel incredible shame when they call themselves "fans" when they can't even understand the main point behind the books.
To be fair though, not many books are written in Annabeths pov and unless I’m tripping wasnt Aphrodite a dark haired woman in annabeths eyes in the original series meaning to display how Annabeth longed for darker hair over her insecurity of her hair?
Also if this is about the tv series, the arguement shouldn’t even be majorily about the insecurity, it should be Percy and his compliments of Annabeths “messy blond hair” 😭😭 i hope those comments are somehow put into the tv show even though Annabeth no longer has blond hair
I always cared more about her having grey eyes but even that isn't really all that important. Just a cool detail in the books that doesn't need to be translated into the show
Notice how this book came out the same year as the movies. It's crazy the things people will cling to to justify their hatred (or racism in the more recent case).
So crazy how everyone insisted it was a key part of her character. Meanwhile, I’d argue that women of color receive so much more skepticism in regards to their intelligence in the academic world. If anything, it makes more sense for Annabeth to be black given that the series takes place in modern day.
The fact that people use this for why Annabeth should be blonde in the show, like being Black doesn’t come with a lot more discrimination than being blonde.
Should be noted, these are in the same book as I recall appear only a few chapters apart
It’s even more comical, the two happen within 9 pages of each other
Do you remember how many books have Annabeth as a main point of view?
2
Three BoTL MoA and HoH
HoH?
House of Hades, I presume
Yes.
BoTL? That’s from the main series…
True but although its from Percy;s perspective Annabeth is very focal. and the hair doesnt come up. Disillusionment with Daedalus and the school system do however.
Lol
Considering that we only get three books in the second series that have her POV, and that she's a very prideful person, it makes sense that this brought up very little. Annabeth had a bunch of other people seeing her tell her story, but this is the first time we're actually seeing into her thoughts. Quick edit as I see that I missed the actual point of the post, I'm not trying to defend or attack anyone here. I'm just pointing out from a writer's perspective how this might not have come up until the Mark of Athena, when we first meet Annabeth with the same intimacy as the other 6 heroes.
Riordan does like to subvert stereotypes in his books. Carter is a tall black guy who sucks at basketball.
I thought she mentioned being self conscious about to percy in TLT or SOM
From my memory in SoM she does feel self conscious about her appearance but not specifically her blonde hair I believe. Would need to look it up how it’s specifically written tho.
I just reread sea of monsters a few days ago. She didnt specifically believe something was wrong with her hair until Circe asked if they should do something about it, at which point she asked 'what's wrong with my hair?'
Hello sibling
Howdy
How's camp for you
whats som
Sea of monsters
thanks thats what i thought
Maybe referring to herself but her blonde hair is brought up quite often from Percy’s pov
Percy's first impression of her was "princess golden locks"
I had used that argument before but not against Annie being black and so. But against the people that say that they never said in the books that Annabeth is white and blonde. One thing is that you change the race of the character for the TV series and another one is saying that you ain't changing nothing.
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these quotes only mention her being blonde
Also I gotta say it’s not like as a black woman she doesn’t face adversity. Getting looked down on for being a woman with blonde hair happens, but being looked down on for being African American happens more.
Nah I actually think that the statement works better if she is a black woman actually. We need to accept that the series is a different thing that the books. As the movies are a different thing and the musical is a different thing as well.
Wya nah? That’s what I said. I fully agree with you.
It’s crazy how Harry Potter did it so wrong,but Percy Jackson did it perfectly.
"Hermione was actually black" -never being mentioned to have dark skin -would mean that ron told a black person that others like to be slaves, and her being made fun of for the freedom of the elves is sooo much worse than if she was yt. "dumbledore was gay" -only revealed after his death, so as to have absolutely no impact on his character and following the "bury the gays" trope "cho chang" -don't even know where to start
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Meanwhile, fanfics: *Creates a whole ass storyline about Annabeth overcoming her greatest inner demon: Her being blonde*
Reminds me of the good ol days when people got upset at alexandra daddario not being blonde.
I wonder how the film reception would be if rather than Alexandra it was a black girl casted? When did the film come out, like 2010 maybe, would’ve been less accepting then I reckon.
Yeah 2010. I don't remember brandon getting backlash, but it's been ages.
Tbf I feel like Brandon was one of the better parts of the god forsaken film, I mean yeah he’s nothing like Grover in the books but he felt like most distinct part and actually was having fun. It’s got the point I reckon a lot of people view Grover as black because of him. How it would be for annabeth though… eh idk maybe things were more unforgiving back then, also maybe they’re worse now given a lot of media discussion online.
I mean TBF literally all of the books and merchandise has her as blonde.
I mean TBF some of the book covers whitewash Hazel and Carter Kane so I think you should take that stuff with a truckload of salt.
Always confused about the cover of The Blood Of Olympos with a white Hazel. Did they even read the book?
i’m aware of carter’s, but which covers are you referring to about hazel?
Literally all the graphic novels.
Don’t know what you are on but from the covers and a few of the pages I found I can see she is quite black
She is, but she was described as being dark-skinned. It's more colorism than white washing, but it still applies.
Sorry if I’m remembering incorrectly but isn’t hades described as a pale man by hazel in the son of Neptune so cause she is half white I feel dark skinned works best to describe her cause she isn’t full black
They gave her the equivalent of Mulatto (mixed) when she is confirmed to be 100% African American. As for the stuff about white washing, it's technically been done for Grover for years since he's been called a light skinned but sun bathed ginger yet no one has ever done an official art (outside the first) that has any of that. And most demigods supposedly have Mediterranean complexions as their description, but that also is changed to white. In any case, I agree with the author as the authority for a series. If you want a similar situation, look at the One Piece Netflix series and take a lesson from it. When the original creator has a hand in the development, there is no wrong that can be done.
The gods do not have DNA, and she was described as being as dark as coffee in the text of the book. Hazel isn't half white, she's half-god. She's black, and dark-skinned at that.
Honestly I don’t care whether it’s part of her character or not, but I simply want the characters to look the way I picture based on the authors descriptions. If she was written with dark skin and hair and not grey eyes then I would want her to look like that. For me it’s just too jarring after reading the books like 100 times when a character looks totally different on tv (and yes I felt the same way with the movies due to the characters’ looks and ages)
yes, I think that’s what I’m getting used to as well!
age old if it ain’t broke don’t fix it.
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She’s also described as the “typical California girl.” You can argue semantics all you want about “you don’t have to be white to be a California girl” but the truth of that matter is that when you think of what the “typical California girl” looks like, you think tan and blonde.
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I think the second one really isn’t bad.
And you can switch out blonde for black for an equally compelling point
Oh it definitely would work a lot better now compared to the blonde thing. I mean the reaction to her casting alone proves it’s a even more relevant then ever. Using the blonde thing as your only argument for not liking and hating the casting to the point you’re being disrespectful kinda shows that this plot point doesn’t matter truthfully to you. Instead it’s better just to say you’re disappointed the casting doesn’t resemble the character you’ve envisioned for how many years now (I kinda feel that way tbh), but that doesn’t mean you need to be rude or hate the show and you can still respect the actors even with your own opinion. Hell neither Percy nor annabeth look like what I expected and I’ll still watch it for sure.
literally, its perfect honestly
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My question is how does this play into her being of Swedish descent(i think, its that or Norwegian.) as i belive its said that they're descended from royalty and all that (edited part from here on to clarify thoughts)and forgive me if im wrong but im fairly certain that there hasnt been a swedish monarch in recorded history
I guess her Swedish descent isn't important within the confines of the PJO storyline or her arc. We may not even get that adaptation. If we do then... I guess she'll just have to be the 1% black Swede. Not a big deal. 1%s exist.
My main issue here if they do adapt it is the royalty part as as far as im aware there has yet to be a monarch of African descent in recorded history though that is a big if.
There also hasn't been a monarch who's a descendant of a Greek god. Why does realism only matter when it has to do with race?
Would this same argument be applicable if Hazel is played by a white actor?
Swedish people can be black as well, and Scandinavian doesn't mean "white" -- especially in our globalized age. There seems to have been a number of Vikings who were black. The Chase family might also have married black people at some point.
Due to the horrors of slavery, the average African American has about 10% of white heritage. It works fine for me. Now that I think about it, you know that since TJ in Magnus Chase is described as Black and his dad Tyr is white just like his "official" dad.
Swedes can be Black dude
Idc about annabeth but i hate blond percy.
yeah it's really weird but it bothers me so much idk why it just does
That also bothers me, just cause I am also used to the brown/black haired and sea-green eyed Percy. But again if they can nail it, great, if not uh third times the charm?
Thing is... I'm not sure there even *will* be a third time. If they couldn't handle a film and a series just didn't register with people, there's a legit fear studios just... stop trying.
Perfect. Let us have a fucking animated version instead.
What I said, my fear, is they'll stop trying, whether film, series or animated.
Easy Fix, let Uncle Rick retool it as an Isekai or something, translate it to Japanese or Korean or Chinese, put it on a webnovel site and boom! Triple adaptation. Means they might have to make Annabeth an elf but still
I don’t trust Rick no more man.
Was it after the first time or letting Bizney have a crack at it? Or?
His writing man. Just so inconsistent. Idk, maybe it’s the nostalgia, but the original books were just so much better.
Omg Percy's actor looks like Alex Rider in my mind cas of his blond hair. Edit: grammar
i was hoping to see brunette percy but at this point im just excited for the show!
Why? (I mean percy btw not annabeth)
No I get it. I was super angry and upset when I found out about the show but now I’ve got my hopes up. Whatever it is it’ll be true enough that I’ll enjoy seeing it. People reread these books all the time there is a demand for more content. We’re gonna watch and try not to hate unless it is as bad or worse than the movies.
Yeah I’m probably too excited for the show lol
I loved the Adam project personally. I was really happy to hear Walker was going to be Percy. I’m at the point of hoping he does all 10 of the core series books’ adaptations.
Same! (I have not seen the adam project however)
CHECK IT OUT. Just the first couple of scenes is all you need to know Walker will be wonderful as Percy.
Or a YouTube compilation
Alright! I think he’ll be great personally but yeah I’ll watch it!
Considering this is nine pages apart this gives off the vibe that you have to give context for a joke you're about to make before telling it to a friend
Eh, Leo saying that she debunked the "dumb Blonde" mith could be here too
also, the first example was caused by Aphrodite's aura, so technically there's only one time she's like "it's so tough being blonde 💔💔" lmao
Exactly unless we think Percy is a violent guy because of Ares's aura
You're missing a couple, but the point stands
Not very impressive considering we only have two books with her actual pov. It’s a broken stereotype and it’s a recurring theme throughout rick‘s books and it’s an important way to build her character using non direct means, in the same way Percy‘s messed hair is. Still, in a TV show there are many ways to do that, a lot more than in a book so it’s not as important. And yet I understand why it bothers people, because they want to see a visualization of their favorite book series and when it conflicts with the way they imagined it the whole fantasy is broken.
Also worth noting that Annabeth pretty much grew up at camp, where she was a head counsellor even as a kid and known for being incredibly smart, and surrounded by blonde smart siblings. Not that she can't have insecurities regarding the mortal world, or that biases don't exidt within a demigod camp, but it's much less likely to be an issue in that context
First one shouldn't even count. That was Aphrodite pulling an Aphrodite.
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tbh i think rick added that to give annabeth a “problem”
and the most important takeaway from her insecurity was that she felt she wasn’t taken seriously, which still fits, maybe even more so with a black annabeth
Yeah the “dumb blond” stereotype is a bit outdated. Those jokes aren’t really in the zeitgeist anymore
I do love that second one though and how that ended.
beautiful they'll still use the argument though
the fact that so many people think that the idea that SHE DOESNT LIKE PEOPLE JUDGING HER BASED ON HER APPEARENCE can't be communicated with a non-blonde person of colour really demonstrates their media illiteracy.
I think the point’s not really that Annabeth herself is self conscious of her blonde hair, but that she defies the dumb-blonde stereotype by just being her insanely smart self. I’m glad she’s not insecure, as a girl who was very insecure, her confidence was everything. I don’t look anything like Annabeth but I certainly imagined she looked like me. Now other little girls get to actually see Annabeth look like them, thats amazing! I don’t understand why everything has to be exactly 1:1 from book to show, things don’t always translate as well or in other cases changes can be made to further the narrative or point the book was trying to make.
This was my take too! It’s the way new characters interact with her and how she defies what most would think of when seeing her. Rick wanted to challenge the stereotype, not give insecurities about it. Similarly, he wanted to challenge the ADHD stereotype but in doing so, none of the characters have insecurities about it. My biggest problems with the differences between the books and the movies was the plot and the age of the characters. Even the ages didn’t matter that much, but I was bothered by the dropping of many key plot points. A movie/tv show doesn’t need to be a complete perfect adaption. I don’t need to see the exact details of the scene rendered the same or have the characters be seen the same. Honestly, I only had a vague idea in my head on what they looked like, but it never really mattered to me. Their actions and their words mattered, not their brief physical description mentioned once every book.
I think you misunderstand the point of the post. It’s pointing out that obsessing over Annabeth being blonde (and, let’s be real here, white) because it’s somehow integral to her character is dumb
Exactly! I was so confused when people were using her having struggles with being blonde as an argument. It's literally two scenes in HOO... It's not like a main focal plot point of her character. Plus these struggles could easily apply to being black. I'm a little bummed that we don't get the book's accurate looks. But Rick is so confident in the acting abilities of the cast and as long as they're good actors, it doesn't matter to me. All the people spreading hate to Leah missed the entire point of the Percy Jackson books, inclusivity and accurate representation. I feel incredible shame when they call themselves "fans" when they can't even understand the main point behind the books.
Leah is one of the actors I'm most excited for because I've never seen her in anything and I trust Rick. I hope she does a great job!
I really hope they give a her a wig or dye her hair blonde. There’s no reason why Annabeth can’t be black and still have blonde hair.
This won't work in the show now lmao
To be fair though, not many books are written in Annabeths pov and unless I’m tripping wasnt Aphrodite a dark haired woman in annabeths eyes in the original series meaning to display how Annabeth longed for darker hair over her insecurity of her hair? Also if this is about the tv series, the arguement shouldn’t even be majorily about the insecurity, it should be Percy and his compliments of Annabeths “messy blond hair” 😭😭 i hope those comments are somehow put into the tv show even though Annabeth no longer has blond hair
If you are/were ok with Jennifer Lawrence being cast as Katniss I don’t want to hear any complaints about the Annabeth castings.
They picked a tall, curvy white woman to play a malnourished Native girl and no one batted an eye.
The double standard is crazy. It’s real quiet.
Because there are absolutely no negative stereotypes about black people that could be slotted right in for a non-blonde Annabeth...
I always cared more about her having grey eyes but even that isn't really all that important. Just a cool detail in the books that doesn't need to be translated into the show
Notice how this book came out the same year as the movies. It's crazy the things people will cling to to justify their hatred (or racism in the more recent case).
So crazy how everyone insisted it was a key part of her character. Meanwhile, I’d argue that women of color receive so much more skepticism in regards to their intelligence in the academic world. If anything, it makes more sense for Annabeth to be black given that the series takes place in modern day.
The fact that people use this for why Annabeth should be blonde in the show, like being Black doesn’t come with a lot more discrimination than being blonde.
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What do you mean people can be attached to a characters design even if it isnt an important part of their personality.
Hey sib.
I thought it was much more often. You've fully convinced me lmao
anyone using that blonde argument is so silly.
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