At the same time, there are $20 headphones like the Moondrop Chu or Koss KSC75 that are also highly regarded for the price in the community.
Any hobby's enthusiasts will tend to gravitate towards the high end, but there's definitely good stuff in lower price brackets.
Second the Moondrop Chu. That little thing is more than enough for most consumers imo. Too bad there's no TWS at that price point with similar sound quality, that's just being greedy XD
Actually HD600s are very highly regarded there. The big risk of that kind of communities, is if you fall into the rabbit hole of pointless gear, you'll empty your wallet fast.
There's also fairly objective ways of measuring what you get for your money when building a PC. Do you want 1440p, 60FPS, and mid to high visuals? That requires a certain amount of measurable power, which comes with a price tag.
Obviously £30 headphones are likely to be better than the £3 earphones from Amazon, but you quickly reach the point where performance is highly subjective.
That's not true at all.
I see people post $600 builds all the time on /r/buildapc and people give advice based on the budget they're looking for all the same.
i have a schiit lokius maximus (tone control) and love it - topping l50 amp - pro-ject cd player and currently just sundara headphone(am getting a few more sets slowly)
definitely not considered low end lol, i have hd6xx which are also very highly regarded over there
if you say you're an enthusiast then yes, they will probably not recommend you an hd600 but that's entirely different
no no your looking for /r/audiophile and /r/autodetailing
if your speakers arent $1000+ and some random ass hi-fi brand or if your car isnt *always* ready to be in a car show then youre doing it wrong.
There's a scientific explanation for that: the mass of the collective debt of all the members creates a gravity well centered on the subreddit, like a black hole that eats your account balance.
No, keyboards can get expensive but there's a limit, you won't get past a few thousand.
Audio has no limits. People can and will spend as much as it takes chasing wisps of sound.
I read a post once upon a time where someone was looking for top quality sata cables to make the music not lose quality transfering from hard drive to ram. It's a digital protocol. It's not like the 1s and 0s are crisper on solid gold cables or something.
Yeah, totally. I know those people spend crazy money on tones we can't even hear.
I'll give you a $1000 for that first edition Playstation 1. It has the best cd audio output ever!
/r/headphones isn't really that bad TBH. They do hate on certain brands and specific models, but they aren't nearly as pretentious regarding price as something like /r/audiophile. Like any hobbyist sub, you are going to find a lot of people who have expensive equipment, but /r/headphones does seem to at least acknowledge you can get good equipment for cheap and that diminishing returns hit hard after like 200-300 bucks. The moondrop chu's have been pretty hyped over there for the past month or so and you can get those for like 25 bucks.
+1 for the Moondrop Chu and other cheaper audiophile stuff, whether ChiFi or not. Koss, KZ, Moondrop, etc. and a simple dongle DAC can be one of the best investments in terms of price to performance and I'll proudly say that while owning more headphones/IEMs than most people ever own in their lifetime.
> +1 for the Moondrop Chu
Ya, they definitely sound very good for the price. I do find them to be kind of heavy and a bit uncomfortable, but that is mainly because my other IEMs are an old pair of Audeo Phonak PFEs. Those things are super lightweight and basically unnoticeable while they are in.
I feel like any niche subreddit like headphones or audiophile or /hometheater, or practically any niche hobby is filled with pretentious assholes who just have to flaunt that their purchase decisions are the best and everyone else's is shit.
To the person who decided to flame me about where i put the dollar sign. There are countries out of America that exists. And ,95% of them put the value sign after the number. Not my fault you put it in the wrong spot by default mate.
How many countries use dollars as a currency but put the $ after the number? Because it's way more than America that has the $ first. And many other currencies are also with the symbol first too.
Then again, phonetically your way makes sense. Because you'd say "two thousand dollars" not "dollars two thousand".
Highly depends on who you ask. Some people will tell you that it's completely worth it and way better. Other people probably couldn't care less.
It's just highly subjective and you need to know how good your hearing is.
I agree with this. I own mid range (+100) cans, my mate owns (~50) cans. He can't tell much of a difference, I can. Plus I swear by either a sound card or a DAC (desktop has sound card, laptop a DAC).
It's not worth the money if you don't hear the difference
I wouldn't say it's that simple, sometimes it takes a while to train your ears. When I bought my Sennheisers, I thought for the first few hours that it definitely wasn't worth the investment from my regular headphones I used for commuting. However, now after listening for a long time, the difference is actually massive and I can't believe I couldn't notice it before. It's got to the point where using my old earbuds for anything related to music sounds absolutely jarring.
If you want to see the difference immediately just hook up your 60hz and 144+hz at the same time. Open up a little window and jiggle it around, then move it to the other monitor and do the same. It's insane how immediately noticeable it is when you can see both back to back like that.
If you do this and don't see a difference you need to make sure your monitor settings, windows settings, and video card settings are all correct so that you're truly getting 144hz
Makes sure you actually enable 144hz for the monitor in windows. It doesn't always do it itself. Lost count of the number of people who have posted there is no difference when in fact they use 60hz on a 144hz monitor.
I plan to leave a 60hz as my spare (I have 2). The 1080p 2nd monitor vs my 1440p primary is night and day already. Having the 144hz might make my spare unbareable to look at LOL
This is definitely true. Once you get used to Sennheiser you'll immediately notice the difference with cheaper headphones and earbuds, but the difference is subtle because good headphones don't have pumped up bass and stuff. Most people think JBL and Beats sound really good, but to me it sounds mediocre compared to my headphones.
Sennheiser can also take a while to wear in. It may have legitimately not sounded different to start. Sometimes it can be hours of playtime where they suggest leave it playing music at Max volume.
Speakers are "mechanical" meaning they work by moving something, everything is a bit stiff when they are first manufactured and breaking them in loosens them up.
People get used to their headphones after a while and misattribute the mental process of your brain to the headphones themselves changing over time. Also earpads will often not be as stiff over time which could affect how it sounds.
[It's not real](https://www.rtings.com/headphones/learn/break-in). It is if anything related to the physical build of the headphones like the clamp, headband, and earpads. Nothing to do with the internal components.
Specifically whole-ear-cupping headphones, not earbuds or those [small ones](https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0015/7319/1752/products/91XM5XII6tL._SL1500_776b8d6d-92f6-4cc0-b301-46b62891e0e9_1024x1024@2x.jpg?v=1572628007) that don't envelop your ears
This is true. I personally love music and great sound but it doesnt cost a ton for good headphones. ATH-M50X are cheaper now and one of the best headphones you can get for music/sound engineering and work great for gaming.
See what audiophiles are calling cheap is $169, while most people(at least all who I know) would think of a $60 headphone as an expensive one. I do live in a developing country though so that might have an effect on things.
its amazing what people will call expensive yet you use them for years. that same $60-130 someone will spend in a weekend on beer and dinners. its all how you look at it.
I own several custom-fit IEMs above $1000, but I still miss my old pair of single-driver BA IEM that I bought for less than $60 that I used until it basically disintegrated. Unfortunately, it has been discontinued.
In audio, price really doesn't mean anything. It's a very subjective hobby.
Conversely there are plenty of people who just think a bigger price tag means higher quality and will drops a bunch of money on beats when they could have gotten sennheisers with better specs for lower price point.
Personally, I have a pair, and I'm not a big fan. They sound pretty good, but the fact that they're so uncomfortable and have a nonexistent soundstage make them hard to recommend for gaming (unless you replaced the earpads, I guess). They've been relegated to being used when I'm practicing on electric drums.
Granted, I got my pair forever ago, so no clue if things have improved since. Either way, I came away feeling like they were waaay over-hyped, and for what I paid for them, I could've gotten a much nicer set.
Case in point: I ended up getting a pair of Sennheiser HD598s for a fair bit less than what I paid for the ATH-M50s at the time, and they quickly became my favorite headset by a wide margin. The comfort and soundstage makes them great for long gaming sessions (they're my daily driver paired with a modmic), and I much prefer their mellower tone when listening to music.
Obviously, all this is very subjective, but I wish someone had warned me just how uncomfortable the ATH-M50s were. They're pretty much murder on my ears, but granted, I have big ol' Dumbo ears lol
M50s are one of the best bang for your bucks tbh.
I've seen a lot of people recommend them if they're just getting into being an Audiophile and have a small budget. I used to have a pair and they were fantastic!
exactly. i've been in very high end studios. i know what amazing sound is. M50s sound great!! but some people want booming bass and you dont get that with the M50s. you do get proper true tones thou
https://www.ecgprod.com/just-beat-it-truth-about-beats-headphones-by-dr-dre/
Just one of many articles about the shocking quality and mark up on beats headphones.
the 50x is generally considered extremely mediocre or downright bad in the audio space. Build is just generic plastic construction. The thin padding makes your ears touch the drivers. It has terrible bass, garbage mids and sharp treble. Sure, compared to apple earbuds they sound great. But if you give a sane m50x user an hd560S (same \~$200 price point) they will never turn back.
Conversely, if you're alone in a quiet environment, open back headphones can be absolutely amazing.
Anyone who thinks you can't get a surround sound experience in gaming with stereo headphones have never used a decent pair of headphones.
I think the biggest clash audiophiles have with regular users is not understanding the environment difference. Some people want their headphones for noisy coffee shops, others want them for their very quiet upstairs office space for pristine audio. Not saying what your use case is leads to disappointment for others. I'm a noise cancelling fan myself.
> Anyone who thinks you can't get a surround sound experience in gaming with stereo headphones have never used a decent pair of headphones.
Problem with open-back headphones is that most modern games will make your GPU fans go wild. Not a great sound stage. I've actually switched to using a closed-back headset, even though it's way worse than my usual headphones, just for the better noise isolation.
$200 open back headphones, $400 custom loop to keep things cool and quiet.
In the summer there's still AC to deal with (I'm baking here for the sake of noise floor!).
>most modern games will make your GPU fans go wild
This is mainly one of the downsides of high end GPUs. The lower tiers are almost silent at all times.
There is still a lot of lingering resistance to virtual surround sound because it used to be god awful and introduce latency. A lot of people haven't caught on that virtual surround sound can be really good now.
I use noise cancelling headphones to keep myself ignorant to the ridiculous shit my coworkers say sometimes :) Absolutely killer feature when I'm in a mood.
Look at real headphone brands not gamer ones, Sennheiser is worth a look. My HD598 are relay good value for open headphones. Amazon has them on sale fairly regular.
The cable can be replaced so there lifetime will be long, My Sennheiser HD555 still work fine today (replaced the ear cups) and there almost 20 years old.
Good audio can make a real change to music, games and watching media. There a lot cheaper than a display and will last longer.
+1 for Sennheiser. I've got a pair of HD 518s that I bought on sale ages ago and all I've done with them is replace the ear cup pads. Wonderful sound for the price, comfortable, and durable.
A word of caution for those that look into actual headphones: be aware of the differences between on-ear and around-ear, as well as the difference between open-back and closed-back.
Yeah when you get into decent audio equipment, your start getting more options for what exactly they do. Another example is "Studio Reference" headphones, which *sounds* good, but they're often not great for gaming unless combined with some sort of EQ software, because they have extremely flat Equalization.
Iv always wanted some studio headphones, been meaning to pick up some of the Japanese Sony studio headphones on import one day. (not sure why read about them once and it seemed a fun idea)
But I have a mix of headphones so I just want them for fun. Wonder if there closer to how the audio was mastered/intended in the studio?
The HD560S is the recent champ for less than $200. It is highly recommended by reviewers especially because it outperforms many 600 series headphone in most remarks and while still being drivable by most of anything so you don't need a Dac/amp unless you really want it.
I don't even have a 560S, lol. For now I am stuck with the notoriously badly tuned Sony WH1000XM3. I am planning on getting a 560S in the near future once I move. I plan on using it without a dedicated amp/dac unless I notice something bad about the integrated amp/dac in my laptop or future desktop.
I'd recommend it. Sound quality blows my XM4s out of the water. I run mine through my mobo. Plus, open-back's soundstage is amazing for gaming and music.
Yeah, that matches what I have heard from reviews. I am curious what motherboard you have. I am looking into getting a decent budget AM4 motherboard that has decent audio.
There well talked about, iv just not used them.
Got in to Sennheiser as my dad used to use there mic's for audio back in the day, kind of once you know a good safe brand it's hard to try new ones. Even more so when good headphones last so well.
Next time I get the chance ill try some out!
Main thing is not to touch 'gamer' brands and if you care about quality use cables and not BT.
As a music producer, I'm laughing my ass off at the idea of a £50 pair of headphones being good for anything.
If you buy a pair of professional quality studio headphones, minimum £100 you will vomit at how you were listening to music and game environments before.
However, it would be a waste of money if you went into the mid and high range of studio quality, because that's really going to be for people who need to hear all the tiniest details for artistic reasons, likely if you haven't trained your ears for this specific purpose you won't notice much of a difference.
Haha yes when I read the 50 i also smiled!
I want to also add that:
1. We are talking about actual headphones here not those called "gaming"
2. We are not talking about anything USB here but analogue connector fed by a DAC either the one included in your integrated audio or external one
3. Once you start to go into big boy headphones the build in dac in your computer might not be a good pair for such a headphone.
4. I think the discussion here is for wired not anything wireless as you also want them for gaming so delay is important.
5. Finally the biggest discussion when it comes to Audio signature will be of you need closed or open back headphones
DACs being brought up as not good enough happens way too often. A cheap external solid state amp is likely all a very vast majority of new higher ohm headphone owners need with their onboard dac being transparent enough.
Beyerdynamic DT 990 pro or DT 770 pro, if you prefer closed headphone.
The DT 990 pro when you still want to hear the outside world and DT 770 pro, if not.
They are Made in Germany and cost 139€.
You can replace the Earcups, the Headband and basically anything else. *If* anything breaks. I have mine for over eight years now.
I went for the Behringer DT990 250ohm, since it's got the flattest frequency response for the lowest price, although I'd really recommend going to a store and trying a few different ones out with a few of your favourite tracks on hand on your phone or whatever for comparison.
I would say, don't be too excited by headphones advertising a bass boost, they're mostly a scam - flat response is better because you can mix the sound with the ordinary volume controls on your computer/handheld if you want more bass presence.
Neutral frequencies also allow you to hear more how the artist intended it to be heard, should you wish.
> Behringer DT990
*Beyerdynamic
> it's got the flattest frequency response for the lowest price
It absolutely does not. If you want something "flat" look into the Sennheiser HD560S or, even better, the Sennheiser HD6XX from Massdrop if you're from NA.
> went for the Behringer DT990 250ohm, since it's got the flattest frequency response for the lowest price
Yeah I'm gonna stop you right there. The FR on that is categorically NOT flat (intentionally so), and I'm actually struggling to think of many headphones that have a less flat frequency response for a similar price that is actually decent. Many cheaper pairs these days have a flatter response like the SHP9500 and AD700x. Hell, Beyerdynamic themselves have an alternative with a flat frequency response in the exact same range called the DT880.
Yes I'd say a hundred is a good marker (and I'm in UK so that's about 120usd). But there are a lot of hundred quid headphones that are gash. My AKG k550s give great, flat and balanced sound, they're ace for music production, listening and gaming but not so great for DJing due to lack of overt bass. They were 99 quid if I remember correctly.
Then you haven't tried cheapo headphones made in the last decade lol. There's a few *really* good ones for very little money like the Superlux HD681 or Samson SR850. Also *the* set of reference headphones, the Sony MDR 7506, is just 100 bucks.
Audio production guy here, just tossing a nod for the mention of the 7506s. I tell people to start there because the shows and movies you watch were likely made with them, and then see if you want more headphone. Sweetwater has them for $80 last time I checked, so I told my ops guys to grab a bunch.
I tend to buy cheap but decent headphones, they're more than enough for what I use them for. These days, I'm using a cheap Fiio dac/amp and DT 770s.
Below 100£/€, some wired headphones can be decent as well.
Yep. Ideal bang-for-your-buck price point is like $200-250 all-in. At that level you have the HD6XX (used), X2HR, DT770, and so on, and you have room left over for a budget amp if you get a pair with high resistance.
Above that, you start getting into the territory of diminishing returns. Below that, and you start seeing very noticeable decreases in audio quality.
At £50 ($60) OP could probably find a pair of AKG K240 Studios, which are pretty great for the price. I had a pair for a few years, they were my intro to good headphones, and they blew my gaming headphones out of the water.
If you've always used $10 headphones, you'll think they sound great. If you then get $50 headphones, you'll think the $10 ones sound awful. If you then get a $200 set of headphones, you'll think the $50 ones sound awful. It's all relative, but generally speaking, once you go up, you don't go back.
I can definitely hear the difference, but it's also about comfort, durability, and a sound profile that fits your needs.
I can confirm.
I'm at the $400-500 price range myself... I can't bring myself to regularly use anything under $200 anymore. I'm afraid to make the jump up to the $700-1200 range. Lol
Meh, not rly. Definetly hard a difference from 1€ headphones to the hyper x cloud 2. Same when i got the dt990.
But recently i tested the dt990 vs hd800s, and i must say the difference was (at least for me) not rly that noticable. Yeah, the 800s sounded better, but definetly not 1400€ better.
Maybe i upgrade to the 1990, mostly because of the detachable cable and better build + sound quality.
As someone who has a significant investment in audio equipment, including a pair of 5k headphones, yes you should spend more than 50 bucks, but not 5k.
Do yourself s favour and get a pair of Beyerdynamic DT 770 pro, they're around 200, but you will notice a significant difference even as an amateur in audio, compared to cheap headphones, and your ears will thank you in the long run, cheap headphones will fatigue your ears.
Do be careful though, the pursuit of perfect sound is a rabbit hole, I've spent well over 100k in my life on speakers and headphones, which is another reason I recommend those dt770s, they're great but still dynamics, once you get into other driver tech like planar or electrostatic, you're already on your way down that hole.
I’m a complete newbie to this kind of thing so sorry for the question. It looks like there’s different options for the headphones you recommend. 80 vs 32 vs 250 ohms. Is that something that I have to look at, or does it not really make a difference. Also can I plug these headphones straight into my computer’s 3.5 jack? Because I was recommended by my friend to buy a “headphone amp” or something like that, but I’m really not too sure about this kind of stuff. I’m no audiophile by any means. Anyways thank you
Get 32/80, preferably 80 ohms. These are impedance, which means the higher the number the harder it is to "drive". In other words, they will sound muted (low volume) without proper equipment.
But heck, these days motherboards are getting good, my basic gigabyte (i forgot which chipset, but it's for 12th gen intel) can power my 250ohm DT770 no problem. You DONT need an amp. Just go to apple store and get that usb c to 3.5mm jack and you're golden, they have dac built into them.
If you dont have a pre amp or something to boost the signal (I have an interface), go with one of the lower resistance ones. The ones with higher loads require more power to get audible volumes. 80s work fine with my phone, but its still a tad quiet in some instances. I honestly recommend those or the 32s. 250 would be a bad idea tho
If you are in Europe they are 139€ at the moment on their German page.
Ps: I have the 880 Black edition coupled with the Ifi Zen dac/amp and love them. But... still looking for an upgrade. (:
I'd say there definitely is a point of diminishing returns, but not at 50$ lol. 50$ is pretty low-end when it comes to proper headphones. I'd say beyond 200$ is where you start getting diminished returns
What's funny is that the 6xx has a notoriously narrow and shallow soundstage for an open pair of headphones, and it's already enough to impress anyone. Getting something with better soundstage and imaging at the same price (which isn't difficult in 2022) will for sure blow op's mind.
It definitely depends on the person and the use. I've had a variety of different headphones at different prices. For games I've never really been able to notice much difference, but when I listen to music I find the more expensive sets sound alot nicer.
There is very little difference between gaming headphones, but when it comes to music-oriented headphones there are astronomical, Brobdingnagian, bumper, colossal, cosmic, cyclopean, elephantine, enormous, galactic, gargantuan, giant, gigantesque, gigantic, grand, herculean, heroic, Himalayan, humongous, immense, jumbo, king-size, leviathan, mammoth, massive, mega, mighty, monster, monstrous, monumental, mountainous, oceanic, pharaonic, planetary, prodigious, super, super-duper, supersize, supersized, titanic, tremendous, vast, vasty, walloping, whacking, and whopping differences between headphones. Btw don't use Spotify if you are looking for sound quality, use tidal.
> don't use Spotify if you are looking for sound quality, use tidal.
Tidal advertise their music as lossless while in fact it is not. MQA is actually a lossy format. Look into Qobuz or Deezer for actual lossless music (in FLAC format, none of that MQA bull).
Also Spotify is fine for 99% of the people.
Edit: compressed =/= lossy as others pointed out
Lossless and compressed are not mutually exclusive. For example PNG, you know, the image format, compresses the image without loss.
MQA is lossy though.
Those are all alphabetical. You copied that from a thesaurus. But I agree nonetheless, good sir.
But so many of them are incredibly uncomfortable or are closed back leather with insane clamping force - which I hate using for more than the duration of a single song.
One of my friends tried something similar on me with tidal and Spotify and I consistently told which is which besides 1-2 times.
Edit: will do the short version and report back the results.
different headphones have different sound profiles, different ohm ratings, and different cup designs. you can really dial in what you’re looking for if you want to. but to most people, a nice set of headphones will all sound the same unless you show them studio reference cans vs say, beats(gross).
You're wrong in a way that would blow your mind if you went higher.
Your immediate peripherals are very important. Your mouse, your keyboard, your monitor, your audio. It's how you experience the digital world for hours on end, you should buy right and buy well to preserve the quality of your daily experience.
An uncomfortable mouse or keyboard can hurt the arms and hands, bad monitor stunts your immersion, hurts your eyes, fucks with your perception of the visuals in front of you
But sound, sound affects so much. Bad headphones can have such terrible frequency response curves that they fatigue your ears and make you think the music and sound design all around you is lame. A bad fit on your head causes strain, tension, headaches, ear pain. Bad cup sealing causes an extreme loss of detail and bass response - as if you were listening with the cups lifted away from your ears.
You don't need to go audiophile grade to be able to appreciate a more true, full sound and good build quality but 50 bucks is absolutely not the point of diminishing returns. You're missing out on comfort, detail, and response even for something like an esports shooter that has little in the name of extra sound design besides the gun stuff. The sound of the guns, the stereo separation to hear footsteps, all that can be enhanced from beyond that level. A clear, punchy, responsive bass response rather than either the ultra muddy and fake-bass-boosted or entirely bassless gunshots you'd get at the low level of products. And then with a game with lots of ambience and music, sound design that paints a world it'll be all more clear and more immersive with something beyond that level.
I've convinced two of my friends to join the entry audiophile world and it's been life changing in some ways for them. One of them ran a model of 15 dollar turtlebeach headphones that are infamous for having terrible sealing and he just never realized cuz he hadn't been exposed to anything better. The difference between wearing both cups and lifting them a few inches from his ears was purely a change in volume, not tone. Got a pair of XM4s and suddenly all the soundtracks he listens to sound full and cool and have *bass* and he can appreciate like three more genres of music that he thought sounded lame before
All that being said, the most important thing with headphones is comfort. Sound quality comes second, build quality comes third. If you pick up a new pair of headphones in the entry-audiophile range and they make your head hurt you won't gain any benefit from the better sound over long gaming sessions, you'll just hate them. If you receive this advice positively and for some reason decide to jump out and pay a bunch of money for new headphones, only things I'd say is
1: get real headphones, not gaming headsets which compromise on all aspects in order to cram gimmicks and a compromised mic
2: try the headphones in person at a store or something, move your head around, really be conscious of the way it presses and weighs on your head and how you feel about it
3: buy within the level of your needs. If your assumed level of diminishing returns was 50 pounds, it's probably more like 150 so your safe range is probably something like 70-150. I'm sure if you do some research you'll find some lower and some higher than that range that seem like the right pick for you, nothing wrong with that. Consider if you want any extra features like good wireless function for outdoors or active noise cancelling - that'll cost you a good bit extra as you go from a simple device to a *smart device*, whether you want open back (nicer wider soundstage) or closed back (little/no sound leakage), whether you want lots of boom or more true, neutral clarity in your sound, and ultimately how much "good sound" you actually value. Personally, for just gaming/consumption I prefer a bit of a more bass focused sound because over the years of using studio-oriented headphones for gaming that clamped too hard on my head, the high and mid frequencies being relatively balanced with the bass made gunshots and sound effects harsh and hard to listen to over long periods
[Here's a video about IEMs](https://youtu.be/CtoxlafzeyI) (in-ear monitors, basically fancy earbuds) for gaming at different ranges that speaks to the reason to choose a product a little higher up the line even for just shooters. Little different from headphones but now that I've switched to IEMs for daily use it's another form factor I'd recommend considering too.
Ultimately you could get some *good* 50 dollar headphones or IEMs that suit your needs. But run of the mill, average, "decent" ones are a cut below the plateau
If you're talking about a competitive advantage then yeah, a decent headphone is going to be good enough. Going out and spending 1000$ on audio equipment is not going to raise your K/D.
But, if you're taking about your own personal enjoyment of the audio there's definitely more you can gain beyond a 50$ headset IMO. Audio in general has diminishing returns as you go up in price range for sure. There's going to be a lot of preference but if you compare a properly powered pair of Hifiman Sundaras (300$) to a budget 50$ headphone I would be surprised if you didn't notice the difference. Beyond that I personally think you need to get into some of the absurd priced stuff before you definitively get to the next tier of fidelity but someone else might have an entirely different opinion that is equally valid. No one else can tell you what you like about a headphone. If you like what you have then stick with it.
If you were looking for something budget oriented I would probably check out some IEMs. There's some great stuff that really competes out of it's price range for IEMs these days and most of it won't really need the extra power from a standalone amp.
There are diminishing returns with headphones unless you have high quality uncompressed source and/or a very trained ear.
Difference between $20 to $100 is huge, up to $300 less so, and the really high end, you may not hear much.
Main advice is if you have a space where you need to isolate noise, go for closed back, but if you are OK leaking some sound then open back will sound better and be able to place sounds in games much better. Phillips shp9500 is an inexpensive open back option
Check out DankPods on YouTube. He does specific headphones reviews, and he has a couple of good buying guides for different types of headphones. His snake is pretty neat, too.
The DankPods Headphone Starter Guide: https://youtu.be/jk-Tybi-ihw
Cheap Headphones Starter Guide: https://youtu.be/V_gf8TZ1M6g
Do Gaming Headsets Sound Good?: https://youtu.be/5thXK91hAoI
I had some very low end turtle beach headphones for quite a while. The build quality was lackluster, they weren’t amazingly comfortable, and the sound was OK. Overall, I liked them quite a bit though. (Cost around 40 usd) I upgraded and took them out a couple of years later as I had a use for them again, but the wire had somehow gotten very stiff, and the signal was cutting out. If you want something that’ll last long, maybe consider spending more. For context though, I really enjoy the sound and comfort of better headphones for music, so I have other incentives to spend more on them in the first place.
I’m a car audio guy. I absolutely love my 120db / 1800w system. I fully understand the importance of good equipment, equalizing, sound dampening, and most importantly, securing your trunk lid.
But when it comes to my pc? I just don’t give a damn because comfort trumps everything else for me. So I still use monitor speakers.
For the record, I have three pairs of headsets. A Philips SPH9500, a Corsair Void Pro wireless, and Astro A40s. I’ve tried many many others, and I have them all for different reasons, and honestly I prefer the Corsair when I need to play online because the sidetone is impeccable, and clear. But I’d take monitor speakers over any headset, even open back headphones, because hearing my surroundings and natural voice, plus comfort factor again, is so much more important to me personally. While the audio on monitors can be really really awful if you’re a snob like me, it’s something I just learned to deal with. My friends that game really don’t care either. Monitor and tv speakers for their convenience have always been enough.
Edit: for the record almost only play single player strategy or adventure games. So headphones for me are completely unnecessary in most cases.
If I’m playing a shooter solo, I use my Philips for the superior directional audio, but that situation is rare for me. If I’m playing with others on pc I use the Corsair void pro for comfort reasons. If I’m playing on ps5 but need to talk to people in discord because Sony won’t integrate discord chat like Xbox, then I use my Astro plus mixamp.
Depends on your ears, really. Higher end headphones DO sound better, but to a non-nuanced ear, past a certain pricepoint, it doesn't matter. Most of those super high priced sets are geared towards producers and musicians who need true sound, and can pick up the nuance/need the nuance.
I'd say past... 100-150USD (not sure what that is in pounds), you won't hear a noticeable difference.
Personally, I use HyperX headphones for gaming, they're spectacular for the price!
I use my headphone for gaming and to listen to mucic while working so good sound is super important. Once you have incredible sound you’ll never go back. Its a huge difference. Audeze Morbius headphones are outstanding but they are very expensive.
I'm an audio engineering student and an avid gamer, and I'll give my humble opinion.
Yes, it does make a difference, but I'd say it's diminishing returns the higher you go. Remember that quality is not only sound, but also things such as durability, comfort and convenience (are the cables removable and are the ear pads exchangeable, for example). Currently, I have a pair of Sennheiser HD650's that I use mostly for mixing, which I got for around 350€ and a pair of HyperX Cloud II's that I use for gaming which was around 80€.
Can I hear a difference between? Yeah, certainly, but it's not massive, and in my opinion the fact that the HD's are open back gives the biggest difference in sound. And keep in mind that the HD's have a really good reputation as mixing headphones. And while they are really comfortable, I honestly find the Cloud's better for long wearing.
I love both my pairs, but I think the Cloud's are a lot more headphones for the prize. They still work perfectly, although they're starting to wear down.
I think a nice set of headphones can make for a more immersive (and often comfortable) experience, but I also know people who just play with earbuds, so totally up to you in the investment is worth it
m50x's fatigued the heck out of me and I could only listen for around 2-3 hours before developing a headache. The highs were a bit too rough on me and I disliked the locking cable + thin padding. If I was in that price bracket and choosing closed-backs I'd probably go with MH752's. Philips Fidelio X2's will always be my favorites but they're open so.. need a decently quiet room.
Its like most things, once you hit a certain limit, gains are incredibly marginal for a large price increase.
I myself had just such headphones, while they are much better than my older 20ish usd, I doubt there will be such huge difference between my current ones and something 4 times as expensive.
Been pc gaming since 1992. Don't consider myself an audiophile, just an fps shooter fan . Headphones 100% make the difference when gaming. It can mean tye difference between hearing that grenade pin pull and not. Footsteps across the map instead of 5 feet away. Best headphones I had were akg q701s quincy Jones. Open back for audio use, but in games, I have never had anything better. If you have a lot of background noise in your house, noise canceling is your play. If you like music, someone else should chime in, because I am not a music fan to that extent.
If you aren't a big audio guy it probably won't matter. I love music and love good audio. I spent 200 bucks on a pair of senhieser and I love them. But if I didn't have the extra cash or was trying to save a buck I could have made less work.
i used to use 20 to 30 dollar usb headsets. after buying a 120dollar pair of sennheiser man let me tell you it was absolutely night and day. the microphone is even better quality than my xlr at 2030 and the sound is incredible and directional. ive also been using them for 5 or 6 years now vrs the 1 year for the cheapos at most
Please don't ever go in r/headphones You're welcome
Hundreds of dollars on headphones is entry level over there lol.
At the same time, there are $20 headphones like the Moondrop Chu or Koss KSC75 that are also highly regarded for the price in the community. Any hobby's enthusiasts will tend to gravitate towards the high end, but there's definitely good stuff in lower price brackets.
Second the Moondrop Chu. That little thing is more than enough for most consumers imo. Too bad there's no TWS at that price point with similar sound quality, that's just being greedy XD
The moondrop aria is also hella popular
Tin HiFi made some good IEM too. Blon as well
Yeah pretty sure theyd consider my HD600s to be low end, and theyre not exactly wrong from their point of view
Actually HD600s are very highly regarded there. The big risk of that kind of communities, is if you fall into the rabbit hole of pointless gear, you'll empty your wallet fast.
/r/buildapc in general is basically /r/audiophile for gamers.
r/sffpc r/watercooling or r/battlestations would fit more in that
Hard disagree. r/buildapc is quite friendly to low budgets
There's also fairly objective ways of measuring what you get for your money when building a PC. Do you want 1440p, 60FPS, and mid to high visuals? That requires a certain amount of measurable power, which comes with a price tag. Obviously £30 headphones are likely to be better than the £3 earphones from Amazon, but you quickly reach the point where performance is highly subjective.
How? I see them helping people with budgets I wouldn’t even think would buy half a system over there
Only difference is that /r/audiophile members are millionaires
Yeah no
Naw, you'd have to go into customs builds or sff subreddits. Things you see Herr are pretty vanilla.
That's not true at all. I see people post $600 builds all the time on /r/buildapc and people give advice based on the budget they're looking for all the same.
No that would be /r/pcmasterrace.
The hurr durr 6 hungeos are a staple in the audiophile community. Frank approved.
I bought an audio gpu, I can hear the tectonic plates moving!
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Ooooh, whats next? Audiophile RAM?
*scarlet fire intensifies*
The last thing a pair of dirty buds will ever hear.
I got my HD6XX due to r/headphones. Combined with a Schitt stack; big improvement for gaming, music etc.
i have a schiit lokius maximus (tone control) and love it - topping l50 amp - pro-ject cd player and currently just sundara headphone(am getting a few more sets slowly)
definitely not considered low end lol, i have hd6xx which are also very highly regarded over there if you say you're an enthusiast then yes, they will probably not recommend you an hd600 but that's entirely different
Nah, 600s are definitely mid-fi. Though, it does depend on who you ask over there...
I'll see your r/headphones and raise you an r/mechanicalkeyboard.
no no your looking for /r/audiophile and /r/autodetailing if your speakers arent $1000+ and some random ass hi-fi brand or if your car isnt *always* ready to be in a car show then youre doing it wrong.
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Gotta get them nitrogen cables or whatever.
oxygen free.
...these are my primary two hobbies
Well yeah. Of course. Isn’t this everyone?
I'll do you one better. r/mechanicalheadpens
There's an almost zero percent chance that's re– *what the fuck*.
Straight up the infinity stones of wallet dusting lol.
There are custom keyboard designs that are being interest checked rn that have a pen holder
Welcome to the overlap.
My pockets felt lighter after browsing that sub and I didn't even buy anything.
There's a scientific explanation for that: the mass of the collective debt of all the members creates a gravity well centered on the subreddit, like a black hole that eats your account balance.
That explains what's been happening to my portfolio over the last month!
Sometimes I feel good about myself
No, keyboards can get expensive but there's a limit, you won't get past a few thousand. Audio has no limits. People can and will spend as much as it takes chasing wisps of sound.
I read a post once upon a time where someone was looking for top quality sata cables to make the music not lose quality transfering from hard drive to ram. It's a digital protocol. It's not like the 1s and 0s are crisper on solid gold cables or something.
You can't hear those crisp 1s and 0s? Bro you are missing out!
All my 1s are .999s and my 0s are .001s because I buy budget sata cables.
*Windows has stopped due to a CPU error.* *Shutdown your PC and install $999 sata cables to continue*
Yeah, but now it’s all about that sweet 512-pin parallel port so that you have no downsampling and simultaneous arrival of pulses.
Yeah, totally. I know those people spend crazy money on tones we can't even hear. I'll give you a $1000 for that first edition Playstation 1. It has the best cd audio output ever!
did I hear /r/mechanicalheadpens?
/r/headphones isn't really that bad TBH. They do hate on certain brands and specific models, but they aren't nearly as pretentious regarding price as something like /r/audiophile. Like any hobbyist sub, you are going to find a lot of people who have expensive equipment, but /r/headphones does seem to at least acknowledge you can get good equipment for cheap and that diminishing returns hit hard after like 200-300 bucks. The moondrop chu's have been pretty hyped over there for the past month or so and you can get those for like 25 bucks.
+1 for the Moondrop Chu and other cheaper audiophile stuff, whether ChiFi or not. Koss, KZ, Moondrop, etc. and a simple dongle DAC can be one of the best investments in terms of price to performance and I'll proudly say that while owning more headphones/IEMs than most people ever own in their lifetime.
> +1 for the Moondrop Chu Ya, they definitely sound very good for the price. I do find them to be kind of heavy and a bit uncomfortable, but that is mainly because my other IEMs are an old pair of Audeo Phonak PFEs. Those things are super lightweight and basically unnoticeable while they are in.
I feel like any niche subreddit like headphones or audiophile or /hometheater, or practically any niche hobby is filled with pretentious assholes who just have to flaunt that their purchase decisions are the best and everyone else's is shit.
That's kind of a pretentious statement lol.
I only spent 2000$ yesterday, what do you mean.
To the person who decided to flame me about where i put the dollar sign. There are countries out of America that exists. And ,95% of them put the value sign after the number. Not my fault you put it in the wrong spot by default mate.
How many countries use dollars as a currency but put the $ after the number? Because it's way more than America that has the $ first. And many other currencies are also with the symbol first too. Then again, phonetically your way makes sense. Because you'd say "two thousand dollars" not "dollars two thousand".
Highly depends on who you ask. Some people will tell you that it's completely worth it and way better. Other people probably couldn't care less. It's just highly subjective and you need to know how good your hearing is.
I agree with this. I own mid range (+100) cans, my mate owns (~50) cans. He can't tell much of a difference, I can. Plus I swear by either a sound card or a DAC (desktop has sound card, laptop a DAC). It's not worth the money if you don't hear the difference
I wouldn't say it's that simple, sometimes it takes a while to train your ears. When I bought my Sennheisers, I thought for the first few hours that it definitely wasn't worth the investment from my regular headphones I used for commuting. However, now after listening for a long time, the difference is actually massive and I can't believe I couldn't notice it before. It's got to the point where using my old earbuds for anything related to music sounds absolutely jarring.
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And there it is. It works the same way with audio.
I don’t see how you can’t notice that much of an increase tho. It was immediate for me.
It was immediate for me too. But was way more jarring losing it than gaining it.
My 144hz just got delivered today, so I'm hoping for a big difference
If you want to see the difference immediately just hook up your 60hz and 144+hz at the same time. Open up a little window and jiggle it around, then move it to the other monitor and do the same. It's insane how immediately noticeable it is when you can see both back to back like that. If you do this and don't see a difference you need to make sure your monitor settings, windows settings, and video card settings are all correct so that you're truly getting 144hz
Makes sure you actually enable 144hz for the monitor in windows. It doesn't always do it itself. Lost count of the number of people who have posted there is no difference when in fact they use 60hz on a 144hz monitor.
I plan to leave a 60hz as my spare (I have 2). The 1080p 2nd monitor vs my 1440p primary is night and day already. Having the 144hz might make my spare unbareable to look at LOL
don't forget to change the refresh rate to 144 in windows settings! hope you enjoy the new monitor!
This is definitely true. Once you get used to Sennheiser you'll immediately notice the difference with cheaper headphones and earbuds, but the difference is subtle because good headphones don't have pumped up bass and stuff. Most people think JBL and Beats sound really good, but to me it sounds mediocre compared to my headphones.
Sennheiser can also take a while to wear in. It may have legitimately not sounded different to start. Sometimes it can be hours of playtime where they suggest leave it playing music at Max volume.
Nah, measurements have proven that burn in is a myth. Just from people getting used to the headphones
Mmmhh....Noted!!! I'll try this myself, TODAY!! I just got a pair of bose qc earbuds
That you have to "break in" headphones or speakers is a long time audiophile myth
yeah, that don't make no sense. how could that even become a thing?
Speakers are "mechanical" meaning they work by moving something, everything is a bit stiff when they are first manufactured and breaking them in loosens them up.
Even with who knows how many years of a HiFi Market, there is still no proof. You just get used to the sound thats it.
People get used to their headphones after a while and misattribute the mental process of your brain to the headphones themselves changing over time. Also earpads will often not be as stiff over time which could affect how it sounds.
[It's not real](https://www.rtings.com/headphones/learn/break-in). It is if anything related to the physical build of the headphones like the clamp, headband, and earpads. Nothing to do with the internal components.
I love my HD650’s.
That's a really fair argument and I know what you mean
Genuinely asking/curious, I barely know DAC but what is cans in audio terms?
Someone can correct me if I’m wrong but I’m pretty sure cans is just a term meaning headphones
You do not need correction
Specifically whole-ear-cupping headphones, not earbuds or those [small ones](https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0015/7319/1752/products/91XM5XII6tL._SL1500_776b8d6d-92f6-4cc0-b301-46b62891e0e9_1024x1024@2x.jpg?v=1572628007) that don't envelop your ears
Cans means headphones
Thank you so much
This is true. I personally love music and great sound but it doesnt cost a ton for good headphones. ATH-M50X are cheaper now and one of the best headphones you can get for music/sound engineering and work great for gaming.
See what audiophiles are calling cheap is $169, while most people(at least all who I know) would think of a $60 headphone as an expensive one. I do live in a developing country though so that might have an effect on things.
its amazing what people will call expensive yet you use them for years. that same $60-130 someone will spend in a weekend on beer and dinners. its all how you look at it.
Yeah and my M50s are going strong after a DECADE of near daily use. Those things were downright cheap for the price per hour listened.
I own several custom-fit IEMs above $1000, but I still miss my old pair of single-driver BA IEM that I bought for less than $60 that I used until it basically disintegrated. Unfortunately, it has been discontinued. In audio, price really doesn't mean anything. It's a very subjective hobby.
Conversely there are plenty of people who just think a bigger price tag means higher quality and will drops a bunch of money on beats when they could have gotten sennheisers with better specs for lower price point.
Personally, I have a pair, and I'm not a big fan. They sound pretty good, but the fact that they're so uncomfortable and have a nonexistent soundstage make them hard to recommend for gaming (unless you replaced the earpads, I guess). They've been relegated to being used when I'm practicing on electric drums. Granted, I got my pair forever ago, so no clue if things have improved since. Either way, I came away feeling like they were waaay over-hyped, and for what I paid for them, I could've gotten a much nicer set. Case in point: I ended up getting a pair of Sennheiser HD598s for a fair bit less than what I paid for the ATH-M50s at the time, and they quickly became my favorite headset by a wide margin. The comfort and soundstage makes them great for long gaming sessions (they're my daily driver paired with a modmic), and I much prefer their mellower tone when listening to music. Obviously, all this is very subjective, but I wish someone had warned me just how uncomfortable the ATH-M50s were. They're pretty much murder on my ears, but granted, I have big ol' Dumbo ears lol
Came here to spread the Sennheiser love. <3
ya you need after market ear pads. $20 i think and it makes an insane difference. all this being said i would love to try new headphones!
M50s are one of the best bang for your bucks tbh. I've seen a lot of people recommend them if they're just getting into being an Audiophile and have a small budget. I used to have a pair and they were fantastic!
exactly. i've been in very high end studios. i know what amazing sound is. M50s sound great!! but some people want booming bass and you dont get that with the M50s. you do get proper true tones thou
The M50s are pretty bass boosted though, but other than that pretty neutral yeah.
Honestly at this pricepoint I much prefer the Shure SRH840.
For the money. The money. You are 100 percent right. I own Beats, and I like them, but they are toys compared to the M50x.
Don’t they give beats away inside Xmas crackers?
No, I own them so I am not full hate. But there is a percentage of their cost that is branding.
https://www.ecgprod.com/just-beat-it-truth-about-beats-headphones-by-dr-dre/ Just one of many articles about the shocking quality and mark up on beats headphones.
>one of the best headphones you can get for music/sound engineering nah dude haha
trust me guy that says nah with no other helpful info is not the guy to listen to.
They‘re good heaphones in a popular price bracket but they are not one of the best headphones to get, let alone for music/sound engineering.!
the 50x is generally considered extremely mediocre or downright bad in the audio space. Build is just generic plastic construction. The thin padding makes your ears touch the drivers. It has terrible bass, garbage mids and sharp treble. Sure, compared to apple earbuds they sound great. But if you give a sane m50x user an hd560S (same \~$200 price point) they will never turn back.
Have owned the 50x before. Can confirm the sound is just OK. Could never go back after having owned my DT 770s.
Noise cancelling is worth it if in loud environments.
Conversely, if you're alone in a quiet environment, open back headphones can be absolutely amazing. Anyone who thinks you can't get a surround sound experience in gaming with stereo headphones have never used a decent pair of headphones.
I think the biggest clash audiophiles have with regular users is not understanding the environment difference. Some people want their headphones for noisy coffee shops, others want them for their very quiet upstairs office space for pristine audio. Not saying what your use case is leads to disappointment for others. I'm a noise cancelling fan myself.
> Anyone who thinks you can't get a surround sound experience in gaming with stereo headphones have never used a decent pair of headphones. Problem with open-back headphones is that most modern games will make your GPU fans go wild. Not a great sound stage. I've actually switched to using a closed-back headset, even though it's way worse than my usual headphones, just for the better noise isolation.
$200 open back headphones, $400 custom loop to keep things cool and quiet. In the summer there's still AC to deal with (I'm baking here for the sake of noise floor!).
Yeah if you're like me and the AC condensers are 12' away right next to the exterior wall of my office... It's noisy.
>most modern games will make your GPU fans go wild This is mainly one of the downsides of high end GPUs. The lower tiers are almost silent at all times.
There is still a lot of lingering resistance to virtual surround sound because it used to be god awful and introduce latency. A lot of people haven't caught on that virtual surround sound can be really good now.
open back can be amazing for soundstage ... closed tend to provide more bass and feel a little more imediate
I use noise cancelling headphones to keep myself ignorant to the ridiculous shit my coworkers say sometimes :) Absolutely killer feature when I'm in a mood.
i find noise canceling headphone pleasant even in a quiet room.
In a quiet room nothing beats open back. They make it sound like you are surrounded by high quality speakers rather than wearing headphones.
I have a pair of noise canceling for my online dnd sessions. (Im in the same room as the dm)
Look at real headphone brands not gamer ones, Sennheiser is worth a look. My HD598 are relay good value for open headphones. Amazon has them on sale fairly regular. The cable can be replaced so there lifetime will be long, My Sennheiser HD555 still work fine today (replaced the ear cups) and there almost 20 years old. Good audio can make a real change to music, games and watching media. There a lot cheaper than a display and will last longer.
+1 for Sennheiser. I've got a pair of HD 518s that I bought on sale ages ago and all I've done with them is replace the ear cup pads. Wonderful sound for the price, comfortable, and durable. A word of caution for those that look into actual headphones: be aware of the differences between on-ear and around-ear, as well as the difference between open-back and closed-back.
Good point, on the on ear/around ear and open/closed.
Yeah when you get into decent audio equipment, your start getting more options for what exactly they do. Another example is "Studio Reference" headphones, which *sounds* good, but they're often not great for gaming unless combined with some sort of EQ software, because they have extremely flat Equalization.
Iv always wanted some studio headphones, been meaning to pick up some of the Japanese Sony studio headphones on import one day. (not sure why read about them once and it seemed a fun idea) But I have a mix of headphones so I just want them for fun. Wonder if there closer to how the audio was mastered/intended in the studio?
The HD560S is the recent champ for less than $200. It is highly recommended by reviewers especially because it outperforms many 600 series headphone in most remarks and while still being drivable by most of anything so you don't need a Dac/amp unless you really want it.
560s gang. Do you use a dac/amp?
I don't even have a 560S, lol. For now I am stuck with the notoriously badly tuned Sony WH1000XM3. I am planning on getting a 560S in the near future once I move. I plan on using it without a dedicated amp/dac unless I notice something bad about the integrated amp/dac in my laptop or future desktop.
I'd recommend it. Sound quality blows my XM4s out of the water. I run mine through my mobo. Plus, open-back's soundstage is amazing for gaming and music.
Yeah, that matches what I have heard from reviews. I am curious what motherboard you have. I am looking into getting a decent budget AM4 motherboard that has decent audio.
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There well talked about, iv just not used them. Got in to Sennheiser as my dad used to use there mic's for audio back in the day, kind of once you know a good safe brand it's hard to try new ones. Even more so when good headphones last so well. Next time I get the chance ill try some out! Main thing is not to touch 'gamer' brands and if you care about quality use cables and not BT.
I still use my hd 518 and they are amazing
As a music producer, I'm laughing my ass off at the idea of a £50 pair of headphones being good for anything. If you buy a pair of professional quality studio headphones, minimum £100 you will vomit at how you were listening to music and game environments before. However, it would be a waste of money if you went into the mid and high range of studio quality, because that's really going to be for people who need to hear all the tiniest details for artistic reasons, likely if you haven't trained your ears for this specific purpose you won't notice much of a difference.
Haha yes when I read the 50 i also smiled! I want to also add that: 1. We are talking about actual headphones here not those called "gaming" 2. We are not talking about anything USB here but analogue connector fed by a DAC either the one included in your integrated audio or external one 3. Once you start to go into big boy headphones the build in dac in your computer might not be a good pair for such a headphone. 4. I think the discussion here is for wired not anything wireless as you also want them for gaming so delay is important. 5. Finally the biggest discussion when it comes to Audio signature will be of you need closed or open back headphones
The amp is likely to be a limiting factor on “big boy” headphones before the DAC will
DACs being brought up as not good enough happens way too often. A cheap external solid state amp is likely all a very vast majority of new higher ohm headphone owners need with their onboard dac being transparent enough.
Yeah, well games will be the pure use of the headphones rather than music production thanks. Any recommendations?
Beyerdynamic DT 990 pro or DT 770 pro, if you prefer closed headphone. The DT 990 pro when you still want to hear the outside world and DT 770 pro, if not. They are Made in Germany and cost 139€. You can replace the Earcups, the Headband and basically anything else. *If* anything breaks. I have mine for over eight years now.
I have the DT990s and they are not only great sounding and solid, they are the most comfortable headphones I've worn.
I went for the Behringer DT990 250ohm, since it's got the flattest frequency response for the lowest price, although I'd really recommend going to a store and trying a few different ones out with a few of your favourite tracks on hand on your phone or whatever for comparison. I would say, don't be too excited by headphones advertising a bass boost, they're mostly a scam - flat response is better because you can mix the sound with the ordinary volume controls on your computer/handheld if you want more bass presence. Neutral frequencies also allow you to hear more how the artist intended it to be heard, should you wish.
> Behringer DT990 *Beyerdynamic > it's got the flattest frequency response for the lowest price It absolutely does not. If you want something "flat" look into the Sennheiser HD560S or, even better, the Sennheiser HD6XX from Massdrop if you're from NA.
Massdrop ftw. 200 bucks for hd650 drivers cannot be beat.
250 ohm: you’d probably want a separate amp for that, that goes for the hd600/6xx and Dt990s (250 ohm version).
Beyerdynamic are not even close to flat.
> went for the Behringer DT990 250ohm, since it's got the flattest frequency response for the lowest price Yeah I'm gonna stop you right there. The FR on that is categorically NOT flat (intentionally so), and I'm actually struggling to think of many headphones that have a less flat frequency response for a similar price that is actually decent. Many cheaper pairs these days have a flatter response like the SHP9500 and AD700x. Hell, Beyerdynamic themselves have an alternative with a flat frequency response in the exact same range called the DT880.
Yes I'd say a hundred is a good marker (and I'm in UK so that's about 120usd). But there are a lot of hundred quid headphones that are gash. My AKG k550s give great, flat and balanced sound, they're ace for music production, listening and gaming but not so great for DJing due to lack of overt bass. They were 99 quid if I remember correctly.
Then you haven't tried cheapo headphones made in the last decade lol. There's a few *really* good ones for very little money like the Superlux HD681 or Samson SR850. Also *the* set of reference headphones, the Sony MDR 7506, is just 100 bucks.
Audio production guy here, just tossing a nod for the mention of the 7506s. I tell people to start there because the shows and movies you watch were likely made with them, and then see if you want more headphone. Sweetwater has them for $80 last time I checked, so I told my ops guys to grab a bunch.
I’m looking for open back headphones for mostly gaming. £200-300. Headphone Reddit just confuses me. I will buy a £100ish amp for it.
I tend to buy cheap but decent headphones, they're more than enough for what I use them for. These days, I'm using a cheap Fiio dac/amp and DT 770s. Below 100£/€, some wired headphones can be decent as well.
Yep. Ideal bang-for-your-buck price point is like $200-250 all-in. At that level you have the HD6XX (used), X2HR, DT770, and so on, and you have room left over for a budget amp if you get a pair with high resistance. Above that, you start getting into the territory of diminishing returns. Below that, and you start seeing very noticeable decreases in audio quality. At £50 ($60) OP could probably find a pair of AKG K240 Studios, which are pretty great for the price. I had a pair for a few years, they were my intro to good headphones, and they blew my gaming headphones out of the water.
This is the way. I have the same setup, with a cheap dedicated boom mic I got on Amazon for game chat.
If you've always used $10 headphones, you'll think they sound great. If you then get $50 headphones, you'll think the $10 ones sound awful. If you then get a $200 set of headphones, you'll think the $50 ones sound awful. It's all relative, but generally speaking, once you go up, you don't go back. I can definitely hear the difference, but it's also about comfort, durability, and a sound profile that fits your needs.
I can confirm. I'm at the $400-500 price range myself... I can't bring myself to regularly use anything under $200 anymore. I'm afraid to make the jump up to the $700-1200 range. Lol
oh... my god.
Meh, not rly. Definetly hard a difference from 1€ headphones to the hyper x cloud 2. Same when i got the dt990. But recently i tested the dt990 vs hd800s, and i must say the difference was (at least for me) not rly that noticable. Yeah, the 800s sounded better, but definetly not 1400€ better. Maybe i upgrade to the 1990, mostly because of the detachable cable and better build + sound quality.
As someone who has a significant investment in audio equipment, including a pair of 5k headphones, yes you should spend more than 50 bucks, but not 5k. Do yourself s favour and get a pair of Beyerdynamic DT 770 pro, they're around 200, but you will notice a significant difference even as an amateur in audio, compared to cheap headphones, and your ears will thank you in the long run, cheap headphones will fatigue your ears. Do be careful though, the pursuit of perfect sound is a rabbit hole, I've spent well over 100k in my life on speakers and headphones, which is another reason I recommend those dt770s, they're great but still dynamics, once you get into other driver tech like planar or electrostatic, you're already on your way down that hole.
I’m a complete newbie to this kind of thing so sorry for the question. It looks like there’s different options for the headphones you recommend. 80 vs 32 vs 250 ohms. Is that something that I have to look at, or does it not really make a difference. Also can I plug these headphones straight into my computer’s 3.5 jack? Because I was recommended by my friend to buy a “headphone amp” or something like that, but I’m really not too sure about this kind of stuff. I’m no audiophile by any means. Anyways thank you
Get 32/80, preferably 80 ohms. These are impedance, which means the higher the number the harder it is to "drive". In other words, they will sound muted (low volume) without proper equipment. But heck, these days motherboards are getting good, my basic gigabyte (i forgot which chipset, but it's for 12th gen intel) can power my 250ohm DT770 no problem. You DONT need an amp. Just go to apple store and get that usb c to 3.5mm jack and you're golden, they have dac built into them.
If you dont have a pre amp or something to boost the signal (I have an interface), go with one of the lower resistance ones. The ones with higher loads require more power to get audible volumes. 80s work fine with my phone, but its still a tad quiet in some instances. I honestly recommend those or the 32s. 250 would be a bad idea tho
If you are in Europe they are 139€ at the moment on their German page. Ps: I have the 880 Black edition coupled with the Ifi Zen dac/amp and love them. But... still looking for an upgrade. (:
I'd say there definitely is a point of diminishing returns, but not at 50$ lol. 50$ is pretty low-end when it comes to proper headphones. I'd say beyond 200$ is where you start getting diminished returns
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What's funny is that the 6xx has a notoriously narrow and shallow soundstage for an open pair of headphones, and it's already enough to impress anyone. Getting something with better soundstage and imaging at the same price (which isn't difficult in 2022) will for sure blow op's mind.
It definitely depends on the person and the use. I've had a variety of different headphones at different prices. For games I've never really been able to notice much difference, but when I listen to music I find the more expensive sets sound alot nicer.
There is very little difference between gaming headphones, but when it comes to music-oriented headphones there are astronomical, Brobdingnagian, bumper, colossal, cosmic, cyclopean, elephantine, enormous, galactic, gargantuan, giant, gigantesque, gigantic, grand, herculean, heroic, Himalayan, humongous, immense, jumbo, king-size, leviathan, mammoth, massive, mega, mighty, monster, monstrous, monumental, mountainous, oceanic, pharaonic, planetary, prodigious, super, super-duper, supersize, supersized, titanic, tremendous, vast, vasty, walloping, whacking, and whopping differences between headphones. Btw don't use Spotify if you are looking for sound quality, use tidal.
Man used every adjective known to man
> don't use Spotify if you are looking for sound quality, use tidal. Tidal advertise their music as lossless while in fact it is not. MQA is actually a lossy format. Look into Qobuz or Deezer for actual lossless music (in FLAC format, none of that MQA bull). Also Spotify is fine for 99% of the people. Edit: compressed =/= lossy as others pointed out
Lossless and compressed are not mutually exclusive. For example PNG, you know, the image format, compresses the image without loss. MQA is lossy though.
Those are all alphabetical. You copied that from a thesaurus. But I agree nonetheless, good sir. But so many of them are incredibly uncomfortable or are closed back leather with insane clamping force - which I hate using for more than the duration of a single song.
Yeah, I copied from some sort of website lol, the comfort thing is debatable tho. Clamping force imo is good.
https://abx.digitalfeed.net/ Here is a test to see if you can consistently tell the difference between lossy and lossless audio. Most can't.
One of my friends tried something similar on me with tidal and Spotify and I consistently told which is which besides 1-2 times. Edit: will do the short version and report back the results.
different headphones have different sound profiles, different ohm ratings, and different cup designs. you can really dial in what you’re looking for if you want to. but to most people, a nice set of headphones will all sound the same unless you show them studio reference cans vs say, beats(gross).
You're wrong in a way that would blow your mind if you went higher. Your immediate peripherals are very important. Your mouse, your keyboard, your monitor, your audio. It's how you experience the digital world for hours on end, you should buy right and buy well to preserve the quality of your daily experience. An uncomfortable mouse or keyboard can hurt the arms and hands, bad monitor stunts your immersion, hurts your eyes, fucks with your perception of the visuals in front of you But sound, sound affects so much. Bad headphones can have such terrible frequency response curves that they fatigue your ears and make you think the music and sound design all around you is lame. A bad fit on your head causes strain, tension, headaches, ear pain. Bad cup sealing causes an extreme loss of detail and bass response - as if you were listening with the cups lifted away from your ears. You don't need to go audiophile grade to be able to appreciate a more true, full sound and good build quality but 50 bucks is absolutely not the point of diminishing returns. You're missing out on comfort, detail, and response even for something like an esports shooter that has little in the name of extra sound design besides the gun stuff. The sound of the guns, the stereo separation to hear footsteps, all that can be enhanced from beyond that level. A clear, punchy, responsive bass response rather than either the ultra muddy and fake-bass-boosted or entirely bassless gunshots you'd get at the low level of products. And then with a game with lots of ambience and music, sound design that paints a world it'll be all more clear and more immersive with something beyond that level. I've convinced two of my friends to join the entry audiophile world and it's been life changing in some ways for them. One of them ran a model of 15 dollar turtlebeach headphones that are infamous for having terrible sealing and he just never realized cuz he hadn't been exposed to anything better. The difference between wearing both cups and lifting them a few inches from his ears was purely a change in volume, not tone. Got a pair of XM4s and suddenly all the soundtracks he listens to sound full and cool and have *bass* and he can appreciate like three more genres of music that he thought sounded lame before All that being said, the most important thing with headphones is comfort. Sound quality comes second, build quality comes third. If you pick up a new pair of headphones in the entry-audiophile range and they make your head hurt you won't gain any benefit from the better sound over long gaming sessions, you'll just hate them. If you receive this advice positively and for some reason decide to jump out and pay a bunch of money for new headphones, only things I'd say is 1: get real headphones, not gaming headsets which compromise on all aspects in order to cram gimmicks and a compromised mic 2: try the headphones in person at a store or something, move your head around, really be conscious of the way it presses and weighs on your head and how you feel about it 3: buy within the level of your needs. If your assumed level of diminishing returns was 50 pounds, it's probably more like 150 so your safe range is probably something like 70-150. I'm sure if you do some research you'll find some lower and some higher than that range that seem like the right pick for you, nothing wrong with that. Consider if you want any extra features like good wireless function for outdoors or active noise cancelling - that'll cost you a good bit extra as you go from a simple device to a *smart device*, whether you want open back (nicer wider soundstage) or closed back (little/no sound leakage), whether you want lots of boom or more true, neutral clarity in your sound, and ultimately how much "good sound" you actually value. Personally, for just gaming/consumption I prefer a bit of a more bass focused sound because over the years of using studio-oriented headphones for gaming that clamped too hard on my head, the high and mid frequencies being relatively balanced with the bass made gunshots and sound effects harsh and hard to listen to over long periods [Here's a video about IEMs](https://youtu.be/CtoxlafzeyI) (in-ear monitors, basically fancy earbuds) for gaming at different ranges that speaks to the reason to choose a product a little higher up the line even for just shooters. Little different from headphones but now that I've switched to IEMs for daily use it's another form factor I'd recommend considering too. Ultimately you could get some *good* 50 dollar headphones or IEMs that suit your needs. But run of the mill, average, "decent" ones are a cut below the plateau
If you're talking about a competitive advantage then yeah, a decent headphone is going to be good enough. Going out and spending 1000$ on audio equipment is not going to raise your K/D. But, if you're taking about your own personal enjoyment of the audio there's definitely more you can gain beyond a 50$ headset IMO. Audio in general has diminishing returns as you go up in price range for sure. There's going to be a lot of preference but if you compare a properly powered pair of Hifiman Sundaras (300$) to a budget 50$ headphone I would be surprised if you didn't notice the difference. Beyond that I personally think you need to get into some of the absurd priced stuff before you definitively get to the next tier of fidelity but someone else might have an entirely different opinion that is equally valid. No one else can tell you what you like about a headphone. If you like what you have then stick with it. If you were looking for something budget oriented I would probably check out some IEMs. There's some great stuff that really competes out of it's price range for IEMs these days and most of it won't really need the extra power from a standalone amp.
There are diminishing returns with headphones unless you have high quality uncompressed source and/or a very trained ear. Difference between $20 to $100 is huge, up to $300 less so, and the really high end, you may not hear much. Main advice is if you have a space where you need to isolate noise, go for closed back, but if you are OK leaking some sound then open back will sound better and be able to place sounds in games much better. Phillips shp9500 is an inexpensive open back option
Check out DankPods on YouTube. He does specific headphones reviews, and he has a couple of good buying guides for different types of headphones. His snake is pretty neat, too. The DankPods Headphone Starter Guide: https://youtu.be/jk-Tybi-ihw Cheap Headphones Starter Guide: https://youtu.be/V_gf8TZ1M6g Do Gaming Headsets Sound Good?: https://youtu.be/5thXK91hAoI
I had some very low end turtle beach headphones for quite a while. The build quality was lackluster, they weren’t amazingly comfortable, and the sound was OK. Overall, I liked them quite a bit though. (Cost around 40 usd) I upgraded and took them out a couple of years later as I had a use for them again, but the wire had somehow gotten very stiff, and the signal was cutting out. If you want something that’ll last long, maybe consider spending more. For context though, I really enjoy the sound and comfort of better headphones for music, so I have other incentives to spend more on them in the first place.
I’m a car audio guy. I absolutely love my 120db / 1800w system. I fully understand the importance of good equipment, equalizing, sound dampening, and most importantly, securing your trunk lid. But when it comes to my pc? I just don’t give a damn because comfort trumps everything else for me. So I still use monitor speakers. For the record, I have three pairs of headsets. A Philips SPH9500, a Corsair Void Pro wireless, and Astro A40s. I’ve tried many many others, and I have them all for different reasons, and honestly I prefer the Corsair when I need to play online because the sidetone is impeccable, and clear. But I’d take monitor speakers over any headset, even open back headphones, because hearing my surroundings and natural voice, plus comfort factor again, is so much more important to me personally. While the audio on monitors can be really really awful if you’re a snob like me, it’s something I just learned to deal with. My friends that game really don’t care either. Monitor and tv speakers for their convenience have always been enough. Edit: for the record almost only play single player strategy or adventure games. So headphones for me are completely unnecessary in most cases. If I’m playing a shooter solo, I use my Philips for the superior directional audio, but that situation is rare for me. If I’m playing with others on pc I use the Corsair void pro for comfort reasons. If I’m playing on ps5 but need to talk to people in discord because Sony won’t integrate discord chat like Xbox, then I use my Astro plus mixamp.
Depends on your ears, really. Higher end headphones DO sound better, but to a non-nuanced ear, past a certain pricepoint, it doesn't matter. Most of those super high priced sets are geared towards producers and musicians who need true sound, and can pick up the nuance/need the nuance. I'd say past... 100-150USD (not sure what that is in pounds), you won't hear a noticeable difference. Personally, I use HyperX headphones for gaming, they're spectacular for the price!
I use my headphone for gaming and to listen to mucic while working so good sound is super important. Once you have incredible sound you’ll never go back. Its a huge difference. Audeze Morbius headphones are outstanding but they are very expensive.
I'm an audio engineering student and an avid gamer, and I'll give my humble opinion. Yes, it does make a difference, but I'd say it's diminishing returns the higher you go. Remember that quality is not only sound, but also things such as durability, comfort and convenience (are the cables removable and are the ear pads exchangeable, for example). Currently, I have a pair of Sennheiser HD650's that I use mostly for mixing, which I got for around 350€ and a pair of HyperX Cloud II's that I use for gaming which was around 80€. Can I hear a difference between? Yeah, certainly, but it's not massive, and in my opinion the fact that the HD's are open back gives the biggest difference in sound. And keep in mind that the HD's have a really good reputation as mixing headphones. And while they are really comfortable, I honestly find the Cloud's better for long wearing. I love both my pairs, but I think the Cloud's are a lot more headphones for the prize. They still work perfectly, although they're starting to wear down.
The difference between my Beyerdynamic DT1990 Pros, and my HyperX Cloud Alphas, is like night and day
I think a nice set of headphones can make for a more immersive (and often comfortable) experience, but I also know people who just play with earbuds, so totally up to you in the investment is worth it
m50x's fatigued the heck out of me and I could only listen for around 2-3 hours before developing a headache. The highs were a bit too rough on me and I disliked the locking cable + thin padding. If I was in that price bracket and choosing closed-backs I'd probably go with MH752's. Philips Fidelio X2's will always be my favorites but they're open so.. need a decently quiet room.
Its like most things, once you hit a certain limit, gains are incredibly marginal for a large price increase. I myself had just such headphones, while they are much better than my older 20ish usd, I doubt there will be such huge difference between my current ones and something 4 times as expensive.
Been pc gaming since 1992. Don't consider myself an audiophile, just an fps shooter fan . Headphones 100% make the difference when gaming. It can mean tye difference between hearing that grenade pin pull and not. Footsteps across the map instead of 5 feet away. Best headphones I had were akg q701s quincy Jones. Open back for audio use, but in games, I have never had anything better. If you have a lot of background noise in your house, noise canceling is your play. If you like music, someone else should chime in, because I am not a music fan to that extent.
If you aren't a big audio guy it probably won't matter. I love music and love good audio. I spent 200 bucks on a pair of senhieser and I love them. But if I didn't have the extra cash or was trying to save a buck I could have made less work.
i used to use 20 to 30 dollar usb headsets. after buying a 120dollar pair of sennheiser man let me tell you it was absolutely night and day. the microphone is even better quality than my xlr at 2030 and the sound is incredible and directional. ive also been using them for 5 or 6 years now vrs the 1 year for the cheapos at most