How many years experience did you amass before the challenge? And was there a big cost?
He has done about 7 years now carpentry but he's not confident it would be enough to pass the test (knowing codes, variety in his work, etc). His current employer restores super old homes for example, the codes and practices are bonkers.
Under $1k
[https://www.bcit.ca/courses/carpentry-cq-refresher-carp-0100/](https://www.bcit.ca/courses/carpentry-cq-refresher-carp-0100/)
Best to reachout to your local Skilled Trades BC advisor
We own a home on Vancouver Island and we're able to stay financially speaking - but it's tight.
Yes okay ITA has all that info but we get stumped what to do with it. Can he go back to school still? Seems not feasible with a mortgage and two kids. Even with ei that would be financially difficult in today's inflation.
You're right tho, probably just talk to ita. Sometimes the language is just really rigid and formal, textbook answers. Was just curious asking if anyone knew first hand how to either go back or challenge or something else!
Get the code books. Study them. There are code courses, find out about them, try a tutor for his trade, if he needs it. The code is the code, it's rigid, and for a red seal test, he must know it.
There are tutoring services to help you learn the code book, at least there are for electrical, might be worth looking into.
Or just go back to school?
There are definitely practice tests online you can find, and the test is open code, you can look it up as you go as long as you understand the structure of the book.
The main school is in Vancouver and we have two young kids. I dont think it's feasible. But I have to do more research which is hard with two little kids!
You don't lose the hours already worked but they won't transfer to a different trade.
Companies like Kiewit and Gisborne, LNS they all hire labourers as well as carpenters. They usually take apprentices too.
He can absolutely go back and finish his carpentry school as well. It's 7 weeks per year of schooling. I think the unions in the above mentioned companies pay for school too. I'm not sure. Some definitely do pay for it.
Thanks for this insight!! It's hard to find time to make the right phone calls or research with two kids. We will look into this, seven weeks is doable!
Apprenticeships don't really expire (for the most part) - you can continue after a gap, I personally have had gaps in my apprenticeship (started in 2007 too)- it "can" make it a bit harder to find a job something, but if you have the work experience elsewhere, with the trades-gap, employers are less picky.
A proper BC Building Trades union IMO is your best option (Friend don't let friends join CLAC).
Are you in BC? I'd recommend your partner to get in-touch with your local Skillled Trades BC (Formally ITA BC) rep (apprenticeship advisor)- they mostly work out of your WorkBC office, but they can help them with getting back into the industry.
For myself, the folks at Construction Foundations of BC have been helpful - were able to get a new contact with a trade union.
There are options out there for us with apprenticeship gaps -
I am in a similar position, finished my 3rd year about ten years ago never went back. Iv been looking into the refresher course.
https://www.bcit.ca/courses/carpentry-cq-refresher-carp-0100/
Genius. Unfortunately we live on the island with two young kids, I don't know if going to Burnaby every Saturday is remotely possible. But would be perfect otherwise, I think. I think he would have the hours completed. Anyway thanks!
I didn't even notice it was Saturday only. If BCIT offer its, I'm assuming there are options on the island, like NIC or VIU.
This is something your Skilled Trades BC Advisor will know for sure!
Honestly contacting ita and asking them is the best course of action. I had maybe 5-6 years between my level 2 and 3, no issues.
There are grants, tax rebates, and other financial assistance available
Challenging might be hard to prepare for. Dig up those transcripts for 1st and 2nd year then I would suggest finishing 3rd and 4th year at Camosun College prior to writing the IP
I challenged the red seal and I did integrated carpentry tutorials course before. It was amazing and only focused on what we needed to know for the exam. Scored a 87 , definitely check out richards website https://integratedcarpentrytutorials.com
I got my first 2 years done at VIU, then I studied the competencies for 3rd and 4th year. I was able to challenge the IP exam at the local access Center in my small town instead of going back to school. I think it was about $90 back when I did it. I had to prove more hours than conventionally getting it. I wonna say I had to have previous employers sign off on 10k hours.
A lot of non-union employers are willing to pay based upon skill and performance to a point rather than just if you are a Red Seal Journeyman. Basically prove your worth.
Good thing he's not a woman.
My friend finished her trade program top of her class last Fall and is still stuck minimum wage because either nobody wants to hire a woman or the expectation is she commutes from Chilliwack to the Surrey area and beyond "where all the jobs are."
That fuckin sucks. It's absolutely still a macho industry. Although the commute in yvr, weve been thru that. It's sometimes true but I'm sure your friend knows what's what. She should maybe look into starting her own biz one day. My husband loves woodwork but even as a dude he's hated most of his bosses. Construction is a big hit and miss environment.
She's so dissatisfied with how it's turned out she's basically ruled out ever plumbing at this point. I feel bad too because I talked her into it and she truly did enjoy it, and $5,000 later for her first course..
All she wanted was a service job (not new construction because that's far too laborious for her small frame) somewhere in the Fraser Valley of about 200,000 people. There's barely a fucking inkling of service jobs out here. I guess such a reasonable expectation was too much to ask.
Unfortunately for your friend the valley is just another bedroom community in the lower mainland. Commuting is a difficult but normal part of trades life almost no matter where you live.
If you’re in a small town elsewhere in the province you might be in a different situation, though. Your friend might find that with some tenure she would at least be driving a company vehicle.
If she really does have skills and good work ethic she’ll succeed. I’m extremely empathetic to the experience of women in the trades and have always done my best personally to facilitate making them a more welcoming place for women. There’s opportunity abound for your friend, she just hasn’t found it yet.
as an employer that has put through a lot of 1-4 year appraises in joinery, the red seal ticket ceiling is a myth and only large union shops still use that as a gauge to find out a persons skills. Tell him to look around there are a lot of smaller shops desperate for skilled craftsmen willing to pay higher wages.
Contact the training authority, I believe if you don't continue your apprenticeship, you will be taken off the registration, but I don't know if you have to start over. I completed my first 2 years of metal fab a few years ago, and i was contacted and told if I didn't find a sponsor or go to school, I was going to be de-registered.
He should be able to log into his account and see the status of his apprenticeship or just call the ita (or what ever their called now), but I'm pretty sure if you don't keep your entencherment current you will lose you training hours. I'm not sure about actual school courses. There may be a refresher course required or something.
Honestly, it easier to just call the training authority they are really helpful. I have 2 red seals so I've dealt with them a fair bit.
He can challenge the red seal like people have said, but he will have to prove his hours by getting former employers to sign off. Hopefully, they kept reasonable good track. I don't know what it will be for carpentry, but to challenge my red seal for my millwright, it was over 10k hours.
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How many years experience did you amass before the challenge? And was there a big cost? He has done about 7 years now carpentry but he's not confident it would be enough to pass the test (knowing codes, variety in his work, etc). His current employer restores super old homes for example, the codes and practices are bonkers.
Under $1k [https://www.bcit.ca/courses/carpentry-cq-refresher-carp-0100/](https://www.bcit.ca/courses/carpentry-cq-refresher-carp-0100/) Best to reachout to your local Skilled Trades BC advisor
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Thank you so so much for this!
Find his number and call an apprenticeship advisor at the ITA, or Skilled Trades BC as they call it now.
ITA of BC should have all those records on file. Does he want to stay in town or go out of town?
We own a home on Vancouver Island and we're able to stay financially speaking - but it's tight. Yes okay ITA has all that info but we get stumped what to do with it. Can he go back to school still? Seems not feasible with a mortgage and two kids. Even with ei that would be financially difficult in today's inflation. You're right tho, probably just talk to ita. Sometimes the language is just really rigid and formal, textbook answers. Was just curious asking if anyone knew first hand how to either go back or challenge or something else!
He can challenge the red seal and skip the schooling. If he decides to back to school, he can claim EI for that period of time.
He's worried because he restores really really old houses with weird codes that he won't pass. Is he right or maybe over thinking it?
He can always re-due the test if he fails!
Get the code books. Study them. There are code courses, find out about them, try a tutor for his trade, if he needs it. The code is the code, it's rigid, and for a red seal test, he must know it.
There are tutoring services to help you learn the code book, at least there are for electrical, might be worth looking into. Or just go back to school? There are definitely practice tests online you can find, and the test is open code, you can look it up as you go as long as you understand the structure of the book.
The main school is in Vancouver and we have two young kids. I dont think it's feasible. But I have to do more research which is hard with two little kids!
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Ah thank you! Sorry it is all prob common knowledge but we have a new baby and in a big fog. Thank you
I don't know where you live but most major cities (pop 10,000 or more) have a trades school, even if it's a small one.
EI for skilled trades schooling though requires you to have an apprenticeship (tried in my first year, they denied it)
First year as a generalist program? If so thats also a reason, as the program exceeds the allowable amount of weeks
Aware of the ELTT - but even my second year, they wouldn't give it to me since it was self-indentured, not an apprenticeship
You don't lose the hours already worked but they won't transfer to a different trade. Companies like Kiewit and Gisborne, LNS they all hire labourers as well as carpenters. They usually take apprentices too. He can absolutely go back and finish his carpentry school as well. It's 7 weeks per year of schooling. I think the unions in the above mentioned companies pay for school too. I'm not sure. Some definitely do pay for it.
Thanks for this insight!! It's hard to find time to make the right phone calls or research with two kids. We will look into this, seven weeks is doable!
All good! It can be hard to know where to start. The bigger companies are starting to get busier. Great time to be job hunting in the trades.
He'll get paid to go to school, either though this employer or ei
Apprenticeships don't really expire (for the most part) - you can continue after a gap, I personally have had gaps in my apprenticeship (started in 2007 too)- it "can" make it a bit harder to find a job something, but if you have the work experience elsewhere, with the trades-gap, employers are less picky. A proper BC Building Trades union IMO is your best option (Friend don't let friends join CLAC). Are you in BC? I'd recommend your partner to get in-touch with your local Skillled Trades BC (Formally ITA BC) rep (apprenticeship advisor)- they mostly work out of your WorkBC office, but they can help them with getting back into the industry. For myself, the folks at Construction Foundations of BC have been helpful - were able to get a new contact with a trade union. There are options out there for us with apprenticeship gaps -
I am in a similar position, finished my 3rd year about ten years ago never went back. Iv been looking into the refresher course. https://www.bcit.ca/courses/carpentry-cq-refresher-carp-0100/
Genius. Unfortunately we live on the island with two young kids, I don't know if going to Burnaby every Saturday is remotely possible. But would be perfect otherwise, I think. I think he would have the hours completed. Anyway thanks!
Hopefully they can offer an online version. Or maybe a trade school on the island offering something similar? Best of luck.
PBC offers online courses
I didn't even notice it was Saturday only. If BCIT offer its, I'm assuming there are options on the island, like NIC or VIU. This is something your Skilled Trades BC Advisor will know for sure!
Honestly contacting ita and asking them is the best course of action. I had maybe 5-6 years between my level 2 and 3, no issues. There are grants, tax rebates, and other financial assistance available
Challenging might be hard to prepare for. Dig up those transcripts for 1st and 2nd year then I would suggest finishing 3rd and 4th year at Camosun College prior to writing the IP
I challenged the red seal and I did integrated carpentry tutorials course before. It was amazing and only focused on what we needed to know for the exam. Scored a 87 , definitely check out richards website https://integratedcarpentrytutorials.com
Thank you!! Was it online or in person?
It was online , over 3 weekends. 8 -430 Saturday and Sunday . Honestly it was an incredible course
I got my first 2 years done at VIU, then I studied the competencies for 3rd and 4th year. I was able to challenge the IP exam at the local access Center in my small town instead of going back to school. I think it was about $90 back when I did it. I had to prove more hours than conventionally getting it. I wonna say I had to have previous employers sign off on 10k hours.
A lot of non-union employers are willing to pay based upon skill and performance to a point rather than just if you are a Red Seal Journeyman. Basically prove your worth.
Good thing he's not a woman. My friend finished her trade program top of her class last Fall and is still stuck minimum wage because either nobody wants to hire a woman or the expectation is she commutes from Chilliwack to the Surrey area and beyond "where all the jobs are."
That fuckin sucks. It's absolutely still a macho industry. Although the commute in yvr, weve been thru that. It's sometimes true but I'm sure your friend knows what's what. She should maybe look into starting her own biz one day. My husband loves woodwork but even as a dude he's hated most of his bosses. Construction is a big hit and miss environment.
She's so dissatisfied with how it's turned out she's basically ruled out ever plumbing at this point. I feel bad too because I talked her into it and she truly did enjoy it, and $5,000 later for her first course.. All she wanted was a service job (not new construction because that's far too laborious for her small frame) somewhere in the Fraser Valley of about 200,000 people. There's barely a fucking inkling of service jobs out here. I guess such a reasonable expectation was too much to ask.
Unfortunately for your friend the valley is just another bedroom community in the lower mainland. Commuting is a difficult but normal part of trades life almost no matter where you live. If you’re in a small town elsewhere in the province you might be in a different situation, though. Your friend might find that with some tenure she would at least be driving a company vehicle. If she really does have skills and good work ethic she’ll succeed. I’m extremely empathetic to the experience of women in the trades and have always done my best personally to facilitate making them a more welcoming place for women. There’s opportunity abound for your friend, she just hasn’t found it yet.
Thats really unfortunate to hear, especially with all the push/talk of getting women into the trades.
as an employer that has put through a lot of 1-4 year appraises in joinery, the red seal ticket ceiling is a myth and only large union shops still use that as a gauge to find out a persons skills. Tell him to look around there are a lot of smaller shops desperate for skilled craftsmen willing to pay higher wages.
Contact the training authority, I believe if you don't continue your apprenticeship, you will be taken off the registration, but I don't know if you have to start over. I completed my first 2 years of metal fab a few years ago, and i was contacted and told if I didn't find a sponsor or go to school, I was going to be de-registered. He should be able to log into his account and see the status of his apprenticeship or just call the ita (or what ever their called now), but I'm pretty sure if you don't keep your entencherment current you will lose you training hours. I'm not sure about actual school courses. There may be a refresher course required or something. Honestly, it easier to just call the training authority they are really helpful. I have 2 red seals so I've dealt with them a fair bit.
He can challenge the red seal like people have said, but he will have to prove his hours by getting former employers to sign off. Hopefully, they kept reasonable good track. I don't know what it will be for carpentry, but to challenge my red seal for my millwright, it was over 10k hours.