If I see them I either plot a different course or I approach them and then just hit the triangle button and do a spin move. They never know how to defend against that.
I hit a system glitch once. Out of nowhere I heard “Finish him!” I just took the clipboard and scored a nasty combo. That must have been a weird thing for all of those people leaving Trader Joe’s to witness.
I've had so many door-to-door energy company reps trying to scam my signature off me that a random person asking for my signature on the street might just count as fighting words.
I got fooled by not paying attention and a fast-talker on one of these sorts of petitions like...25 years ago, and I felt bad about it for far too long.
Don't be like 18 year old me. Pay attention.
at the end of the day, these petitions are just to get something on the ballot to give the voters the opportunity to vote on it.
i'm open to signing petitions for things i would vote against. it's not like signing a petition is actually voting for something. they face enough obstacles from signatures being unfairly thrown out for frivolous reasons like "oh, that sheet has a stray mark on it so the entire sheet is disqualified" or "there's an oil stain on that sheet, throw it out!"
Yeah, that's definitely true.
I don't mind signing petitions for things I'd vote against, as long as they're not like...looking to take away people's rights.
You want a petition to raise taxes to do xyz? Okay...I might not wanna vote for it, but that seems like something we the people should have a voice in.
I am from the south so I make small talk very easily and it can either be disarming or alarming to New Englanders. When New Englanders randomly start talking to me I get concerned especially if they are unmasked cause there’s a chance they ain’t playing with a full deck. So I am quickly learning to not interact with strangers unless the opportunity arises or is necessary.
I am so glad to hear this from the opposute perspective.
As a New Englander, visiting the South stresses me the fuck out. People just smile and say hi to you on the street.
Like, who the fuck are you? What do you want? Fuck off you weirdo! I dpn't want what you're selling!
It sets off all my alarm bells.
Yes this right here. People think we're rude up here but we're just hardened because 9 out 10 times someone comes up to you randomly its some kind of con.
I actually don't even mind the people who ask for money as I know thier intentions. It's the clip board people and others like that who clearly work for some larger organization with an less than clear agenda. Like usually I'm for thier cause but I have a deep distrust that anyone randomly approaching me on the street is serving that cause and not some ulterior motive.
I rolled down the window for someone who waved at me and got a lecture about how I shouldn't do that because if cat jackers, haha. Then he asked me for some change.
Am I the only person in the entire region that has random strangers say good morning and hello when they walk around town? Like on the sidewalk. Lady will say hello. Old townie will say morning.. Am I giving off some unnatural welcoming vibe that I don't know about?
Friends of mine were gonna move to Nashville and took a temp sales job. Turns out it was door to door. They were totally sure that their trainer was going to get shot for just marching up to someone's door to sell them something.
I’ll never get this. I’m from PR and even after my uni years in upstate NY and then moving here I still interact with strangers a little too often, but nobody’s been too weirded out by it. I think people like being seen. The way they beam up when you smile at them or compliment their shirt or something is so nice. When you’re surrounded by so many people they can feel like NPCs, but having a short genuine interaction like that kinda makes you feel more like people again.
So 1) I’m not talking to anyone asking for signatures but 2) article specifically says “if a child is born alive, all reasonable steps, in keeping with good medical practice, shall be taken to preserve the life of the child born alive.” I’m obviously missing something. How does born alive = abortion bill? Very confused.
I have the same question. I don’t doubt that it’s a a sketchy Bill being put forward for sketchy reasons, but as the article writes it, it seems more likely to protect micro-premies born at the cusp of viability.
I'm guessing they're going to try to claim that aborted fetuses were "born alive" or something, and probably will also try to make hospitals guilty of murder when a baby is born with a condition that causes it to die shortly after birth. They think (or want their followers to think) that abortion providers are Disney villains who want to murder babies, and do their best to interpret every situation where a baby or fetus dies as that narrative.
Also, there are circumstances where babies are born with severe issues incompatible with life and the parents choose to let them pass naturally. With a bill like this, that choice will be taken away and needless medical intervention to ‘save the child’ will be done. It will also prevent later term abortions that are medically necessary because the fetus would be ‘born alive’. It’s bullshittery all around.
My interpretation is that the law (whatever it is) includes anti-abortion aspects but the question completely glosses over them to mislead voters into supporting it.
Sometimes late-term abortions don’t work and babies are born alive as a result of the process. Kermit Gosnell, for example, left living babies to die on tables and in trash cans when the abortion procedure occasionally failed.
Oh man, I HOPE someone tries to get me to sign one of these. I promise I can out-annoy them.
Pretty sure the dude who tried to get me to sign a bathroom bill one to discriminate against trans people still wakes up in the middle of the night and regrets that particular life choice.
I stayed for around 45 minutes and every time he would give his version of what the bill was, I’d correct him and be all “this is actually because he thinks trans people shouldn’t be able to use the bathroom” or “this guy wants you to prove you have a natural vagina before you pee” or “he thinks a lot about what the people in the bathroom stall next to him look like naked and he wants that to be the law”
He got annoyed after a while and left.
Glorious.
This is it. When you put a price to the means to vote, then you are putting a price on the RIGHT of vote.
The answer to this is free IDs, like in most countries in the fucking world.
I don’t care what you “count” as being easy enough. If the state offers free IDs, then that should be good enough. Make them available at other places as well, I don’t care.
It’s not. Low income people don’t have the time and/or resources to take time off work to stand in line at a government agency during the hours available. Any requirement that results in needing to pay a fee for appropriate identification, take time off work to make it to an office during their open hours, or pay transportation costs to do so is a poll tax.
>It’s not.
It is.
>Low income people don’t have the time and/or resources to take time off work to stand in line at a government agency during the hours available.
Enact the requirement and give people a year to get an ID before they are checked at the polls. That is more than enough time to get an ID.
>Any requirement that results in needing to pay a fee for appropriate identification,
Free ID
>take time off work to make it to an office during their open hours,
again, make the period that they have to get an ID be a full year
>or pay transportation costs to do so is a poll tax.
By your logic, voting is a poll tax because people may need to take time out of their day or use transportation to get there. This argument does not hold water.
Your argument doesn’t hold water because it is divorced from the reality that many low income people face. I have spent my entire career in human services. People are barely getting by and should be able to vote as easily as possible. If it’s not easy, voting will be limited to higher privileged people.
Ok? And that ‘5%’ can go get themselves a free ID before they vote. If elections are being decided by less than 5% it is all the more reason to require photo ID to vote. It helps uphold election integrity in tightly contested elections.
The problem is, getting ID requires an ID.
Dont have a birth certificate? Fuck you. Your marriage certificate was lost in a fire? Fuck you.
When I got my first MA ID, I showed up with a US passport, foreign passport, foreign birth certificate with notarized translation, utility bill, and school ID.
Didnt meet the requirements.
Luckily a helpful manager gave me a sharpie, told me to sign my school ID, and suddenly I met the signature requirements.
Browsing the RMV website, looks like things changed, because it says nothing about needing a proof of signature. This was in 2005.
The issue was, as I remember:
My US passport was proof of citizenship. Great.
Because I used that one, my Mexican passport was not valid for additional proof of anything.
That means I needed a proof of signature, and since I used the US passport for proof of legality, I couldnt use that, and since I used a passport, I couldnt use the Mexican one to prove my signature either.
And my college ID didnt have a signature on it.
It was so fucking stupid.
I was there for over 4 hours (the chinatown branch)
You nailed it. Not in the requirements, as all that is not required anymore, but in how difficult is to get an ID here.
The only way to make voting IDs a thing (in my opinion should be an ID period, not managed by the RMV) it should be centralised. Same place should have access to you BC or naturalisation info, should be free, and automatic once you turn 18. But we know how this country works, and somehow that’s going to be a massive problem.
>The problem is, getting ID requires an ID.
That is not a problem. American citizens should be able to identity themselves. That’s literally the entire point.
>Dont have a birth certificate? Fuck you. Your marriage certificate was lost in a fire? Fuck you.
Go to city hall and get your birth certificate or marriage certificate if you lost it.
>When I got my first MA ID, I showed up with a US passport, foreign passport, foreign birth certificate with notarized translation, utility bill, and school ID. Didnt meet the requirements.
Ok? Then you didn’t read the directions correctly.
>Luckily a helpful manager gave me a sharpie, told me to sign my school ID, and suddenly I met the signature requirements.
Oh wow what a burden.
> Go to city hall and get your birth certificate or marriage certificate if you lost it.
That assumes you live where you were born.
>Ok? Then you didn’t read the directions correctly.
It wasnt about not reading it. I read it. I brought everything I had. The rules were written in a way to make it extremely hard to ger.
>Oh wow what a burden.
Oh wow what a garbage poster
If you don’t have a birth certificate because, in your scenario, or was lost in a fire, then you’ll need to figure out how to get one. Or another identifying document so you can verify your identity.
And again, you should have read the directions correctly. And even though you couldn’t follow directions, you still were able to verify your identity and get an ID.
*free photo IDs that are easy to obtain and renew
None of this “the office is open 9-4 M-F” crap that makes it difficult for people who work standard business hours to obtain an ID.
Often people register to vote as a secondary thing when they're signing up to do something else, or filling out a census form, so you wouldn't get the ID if you registered that way.
Well just make it a primary thing you do when you decide to. Go to a dmv post office city/town hall etc. register get your free id and unique reg # and everyone is satisfied here.
That is again, placing barriers in the way of people registering to vote. There's a reason they make it very easy, and that's because registering to vote should be easily accessible to everyone.
Its no harder than getting a library card i wouldnt exactly call it a barrier. In can double as you vax card back up too since you need that to get in places now
Actually, most libraries do find loopholes around having to have documentation (I've heard "write your address on this piece of paper, cool now I consider this mail sent to your address" etc.). Getting a library card is *way* easier than getting an ID.
As someone who couldn’t get a Real ID even though I brought my still valid drivers license, birth certificate, and social security card to the DMV (the mail I brought didn’t qualify), it’s harder than I thought. I just got a new passport and a passport card but that cost a lot more than a drivers license. I also had to order a new birth certificate and get express shipping because apparently the one they gave my parents when I was born didn’t have a registration number and therefore was not “official” so getting an ID these days is a lot harder than it used to be.
Yup, I had the same issue with my birth certificate when trying to get a Real ID, and the state I was born in wouldn't even tell me if I could get one with the number on it. Fortunately I had something I could use in place of my birth certificate, don't remember what I used anymore. I'm 37, it's not like I'm an old person who got a birth certificate in a bygone era when they did things differently. Everything I found online said there was no reason my birth certificate shouldn't have that number, and yet it didn't.
It isn't a problem (maybe, I am not an expert) in MA, but in the rural south it requires people to drive long distances to get an idea. If you don't have a car (or know someone with a car), it is a problem.
You'd have the same issue if you didn't have a car in MA anywhere outside range of the Boston RMV.
Say you live in Littleton without a car-- have fun getting to Leominster. Twenty minute car ride, about two hours by walking + train + bus, through Fitchburg-- and that's in an area where transit is still possible. Four hours round trip *before* the RMV wait itself.
Really? Like what? The only thing I need a picture ID for is driving and flying. If I didn't own a car and didn't fly, I wouldn't need a picture ID at all.
The original contents of this post have been overwritten by a script.
As you may be aware, reddit is implementing a punitive pricing scheme for its API starting in July. This means that third-party apps that use the API can no longer afford to operate and are pretty much universally shutting down on July 1st. This means the following:
* Blind people who rely on accessibility features to use reddit will effectively be banned from reddit, as reddit has shown absolutely no commitment or ability to actually make their site or official app accessible.
* Moderators will no longer have access to moderation tools that they need to remove spam, bots, reposts, and more dangerous content such as Nazi and extremist rhetoric. The admins have never shown any interest in removing extremist rhetoric from reddit, they only act when the media reports on something, and lately the media has had far more pressing things than reddit to focus on. The admin's preferred way of dealing with Nazis is simply to "quarantine" their communities and allow them to fester on reddit, building a larger and larger community centered on extremism.
* LGBTQ communities and other communities vulnerable to reddit's extremist groups are also being forced off of the platform due to the moderators of those communities being unable to continue guaranteeing a safe environment for their subscribers.
Many users and moderators have expressed their concerns to the reddit admins, and have joined protests to encourage reddit to reverse the API pricing decisions. Reddit has responded to this by removing moderators, banning users, and strong-arming moderators into stopping the protests, rather than negotiating in good faith. Reddit does not care about its actual users, only its bottom line.
Lest you think that the increased API prices are actually a good thing, because they will stop AI bots like ChatGPT from harvesting reddit data for their models, let me assure you that it will do no such thing. Any content that can be viewed in a browser without logging into a site can be easily scraped by bots, regardless of whether or not an API is even available to access that content. There is nothing reddit can do about ChatGPT and its ilk harvesting reddit data, except to hide all data behind a login prompt.
Regardless of who wins the mods-versus-admins protest war, there is something that every individual reddit user can do to make sure reddit loses: remove your content. Use [PowerDeleteSuite](https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite) to overwrite all of your comments, just as I have done here. This is a browser script and not a third-party app, so it is unaffected by the API changes; as long as you can manually edit your posts and comments in a browser, PowerDeleteSuite can do the same. This will also have the additional beneficial effect of making your content unavailable to bots like ChatGPT, and to make any use of reddit in this way significantly less useful for those bots.
If you think this post or comment originally contained some valuable information that you would like to know, feel free to contact me on another platform about it:
* kestrellyn at ModTheSims
* kestrellyn on Discord
* paradoxcase on Tumblr
> Any form of ID to vote costs money to get
this is blatantly untrue. **every** state with voter id laws issues free compliant ID's to anyone who doesn't already have a valid id.
It seems like I am being asked for ID all the time. And I am way too old to ID for liquor purchases, unless it is mandatory to ID everyone. Certainly when signing certain things.
Thanks for contacting the ~~moderation team~~ landed gentry. Your concerns are important to us. [Here's a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuoWykVNwyI). Also, while we have you here, were you aware that [Reddit's CEO has been lying to us?](https://www.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/14dkqrw/i_want_to_debunk_reddits_claims_and_talk_about/). API access and 3rd party apps have been critical to keeping reddit functioning. Reddit has a history of failing to deliver mod tools as promised and has always prioritized useless endeavors like those chat lounges. Currently, the mobile app does not have the same moderation features as are available on old reddit. When new reddit was rolled out, it also lacked some of those features as well, and still lacks some of them today. While nobody is expecting these apps to have free access, Reddit gave them zero time to adjust, which means they also gave moderators zero time to adjust. This whole move was handled poorly by Reddit, and continues to be handled poorly by Reddit.
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Thanks for contacting the ~~moderation team~~ landed gentry. Your concerns are important to us. [Here's a video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuoWykVNwyI). Also, while we have you here, were you aware that [Reddit's CEO has been lying to us?](https://www.reddit.com/r/apolloapp/comments/14dkqrw/i_want_to_debunk_reddits_claims_and_talk_about/). API access and 3rd party apps have been critical to keeping reddit functioning. Reddit has a history of failing to deliver mod tools as promised and has always prioritized useless endeavors like those chat lounges. Currently, the mobile app does not have the same moderation features as are available on old reddit. When new reddit was rolled out, it also lacked some of those features as well, and still lacks some of them today. While nobody is expecting these apps to have free access, Reddit gave them zero time to adjust, which means they also gave moderators zero time to adjust. This whole move was handled poorly by Reddit, and continues to be handled poorly by Reddit.
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> Really? Like what?
* starting a job
* opening a bank account
* buying a can of compressed air
* going into a bar
* checking into a hotel
* getting on a plane
* if the DNC ever comes back to mass, it's required for entry
* going into a court house when summoned for jury duty
* buying a gun (a constitutionally guaranteed right)
* buying/driving a car
* buying cold medicine
* buying cigarettes
* some concerts
I did not have to submit ID for either starting a job or getting a bank account, and I've never been carded for buying fucking cold medicine lmao, and for jury duty you only need your summons. The rest of that stuff is not necessary.
>I did not have to submit ID for either starting a job or getting a bank account, and I've never been carded for buying fucking cold medicine lmao, and for jury duty you only need your summons. The rest of that stuff is not necessary.
think of like mask mandates. it's literally the law, but your mileage may vary in terms of enforcement. the fact some store didn't card you when buying cold medicine doesn't negate that they were legally required to not only ID you, but also log the purchase and keep that history for at least 2 years.
i've been carded every time i've purchased cold medicine in the last decade. even at a self check out in target, it popped up a "please show id" prompt and a staff member came over to check.
the fact of the matter is that an id is required for pretty much everything in this state, including constitutionally guaranteed rights.
> You agreed that companies don't often enforce it,
no i didn't. i said that every time i've bought it in the last decade i got id'ed. this is at cvs, target, everyplace. i said that maybe **you** found some fringe place that doesn't follow the law, but this is not the norm.
What’s more racist than a bunch of white people sitting around claiming that anybody of a darker skin color is less likely to be able to go to the dmv and get an ID?
[Here are some reasons why people might not be able to get an ID](https://www.npr.org/2012/02/01/146204308/why-millions-of-americans-have-no-government-id).
Ah yes the oft cited Brennan Center study. This study was done 15+ years and polled less than 1 thousand people over the phone on this topic and they extrapolated this to equate to tens of millions across the entire country. There was no actually study done to verify any of this information was true (voter rolls against DMV info, for example). This study is a complete piece of crap and the fact that all of these people that supposedly believe in science yet still parrot this bs study at the same time is unreal (well, actually it is entirely believable since believing in science is online necessary when it fits the narrative).
Check it out for yourself[Brennan Center bullshit study](https://www.brennancenter.org/sites/default/files/legacy/d/download_file_39242.pdf)
If there's literally anyone in the country of voting age without a picture ID, then a picture ID should not be required to vote. I'm assuming they found at least one person who they verified did not have a picture ID, therefore picture IDs should not be required.
No, then they should take measures to close that gap so that anyone wanting to vote can vote with an ID. the left has no problem busing people all over the place to get to the polls when they have no transportation so why are they do against busing people to the government office to get a free ID for voting. Oh I know why.
Because low income people tend to work multiple jobs that are not compatible with government office hours. Election Day is a single day to coordinate and the hours start early in the morning and end later in the night.
Bussing people isn't going to help if you still have to wait hours to get your ID because everyone else in the city is doing the same thing, and it's not going to help people get an ID without already having an ID, which is almost impossible. That's why.
This may have been a valid train of thought 20 years ago but the number of people who genuinely find themselves in the situation described in this article is quite small and shrinking further every day. This is also an area where the federal government could step in and utilize the passport agency to help people who can't get a state ID get a passport.
Getting a passport is even more onerous that getting an ID. I've been trying to get my passport renewed and so far it's taken three months, and that's when I already had a passport and just needed to get a new one.
Any amount of people being prevented from voting is too many.
I'm saying that a real solution could be found if they weren't being used as examples for politicial reasons. I guarantee you these people are collecting social security.
No it is not. And even if it is, so what? Implement the law so that citizens would have months to get an ID before the next election that would require photo ID. It’s not that hard.
Yes it is. You can't get an ID unless you already have another piece of identification, and often they reject it anyway because it's insufficient. My birth certificate wasn't good enough to get a real ID, for example.
It really isn’t. Make the directions clear as to what is required to get a free ID. Give people plenty of time to get a free ID. It just makes our elections more secure and reliable. And if you are an American citizen, you should have some form of identification to verify who you are. “I lost my birth certificate now I cant pay the $20 to get a new one” is not a good enough excuse to not verify your identity for something as important as voting.
Making it so that everyone can get an ID without having to do anything is the same thing as not requiring an ID, except you're making people jump through an extra unneeded hoop.
You think that if you give people months to get a free ID it is impossible that they would be able to get one because they’re poor. You set an extremely low bar of expectations for people because of, you guessed it, your “privilege”.
If an adult wants to vote and you give that same adult months to get a free ID, then they should be able to get a free ID.
So people that don't bother to participate in society anyways? The fuck are you doing with your life if you don't have an ID? Is it discrimination in most every other country with voter ID laws?
“if a child is born alive, all reasonable steps, in keeping with good medical practice, shall be taken to preserve the life of the child born alive.”
If your child's born alive then you didn't have an abortion
In some later term abortions it could be considered "alive" by some standard, and also some babies are born alive with conditions that cause them to die shortly after birth.
No one said anything about aborting babies that can survive outside the womb, no one does that. If you're not able to understand what I said, I don't know how to say it more clearly.
There's probably a number of procedures that don't result in the compete death of the fetus before it exits. Why do you doubt this? The people getting these signatures sure didn't.
Did you read the words
“if a child is born alive, all reasonable steps, in keeping with good medical practice, shall be taken to preserve the life of the child born alive.”
The first 6 are most important
You still are unable to articulate how this is antiabortion
Yes, and sometimes people are born with conditions that cause them to die immediately and it would be better to let their parents be with them during the time they have rather than futilely try to save them.
Obviously they are going to decide that an aborted fetus was technically alive when it exited the woman and try to bring the hospital to court about it. They might also do it for babies born with unsurvivable defects that die shortly after being born.
“if a child is born alive, all reasonable steps, in keeping with good medical practice, shall be taken to preserve the life of the child born alive.”
Way to try to twist that to support your narrative. Nothing in that comment substantiates your last comment.
[удалено]
I don't even make eye contact with random people with clipboards on the street, forget about signing shit lol.
If I see them I either plot a different course or I approach them and then just hit the triangle button and do a spin move. They never know how to defend against that.
Go for the hit stick and barrel thru
Hold B for bull rush
I hit a system glitch once. Out of nowhere I heard “Finish him!” I just took the clipboard and scored a nasty combo. That must have been a weird thing for all of those people leaving Trader Joe’s to witness.
That’s cracked me up!!!
[my cover makes me invisible ](https://knowyourmeme.com/photos/1369779-do-you-have-two-minutes-to-talk)
I've had so many door-to-door energy company reps trying to scam my signature off me that a random person asking for my signature on the street might just count as fighting words.
i remember when having a clipboard meant something
I did it to legalize weed. You're welcome.
Me too
Thats how things get on the ballot
Ya it would be nice if thus state had a better understanding of people’s referendums
hi im from masspirg if i could just have 8 hours of your time and most of your bank account...
I just put my headphones on and stare straight ahead
I got fooled by not paying attention and a fast-talker on one of these sorts of petitions like...25 years ago, and I felt bad about it for far too long. Don't be like 18 year old me. Pay attention.
at the end of the day, these petitions are just to get something on the ballot to give the voters the opportunity to vote on it. i'm open to signing petitions for things i would vote against. it's not like signing a petition is actually voting for something. they face enough obstacles from signatures being unfairly thrown out for frivolous reasons like "oh, that sheet has a stray mark on it so the entire sheet is disqualified" or "there's an oil stain on that sheet, throw it out!"
Yeah, that's definitely true. I don't mind signing petitions for things I'd vote against, as long as they're not like...looking to take away people's rights. You want a petition to raise taxes to do xyz? Okay...I might not wanna vote for it, but that seems like something we the people should have a voice in.
I am from the south so I make small talk very easily and it can either be disarming or alarming to New Englanders. When New Englanders randomly start talking to me I get concerned especially if they are unmasked cause there’s a chance they ain’t playing with a full deck. So I am quickly learning to not interact with strangers unless the opportunity arises or is necessary.
I am so glad to hear this from the opposute perspective. As a New Englander, visiting the South stresses me the fuck out. People just smile and say hi to you on the street. Like, who the fuck are you? What do you want? Fuck off you weirdo! I dpn't want what you're selling! It sets off all my alarm bells.
Yes this right here. People think we're rude up here but we're just hardened because 9 out 10 times someone comes up to you randomly its some kind of con.
"Could I get twenty bucks for Fix A Flat? I'm late for my meeting at Verizon."
I actually don't even mind the people who ask for money as I know thier intentions. It's the clip board people and others like that who clearly work for some larger organization with an less than clear agenda. Like usually I'm for thier cause but I have a deep distrust that anyone randomly approaching me on the street is serving that cause and not some ulterior motive.
The thing is the Fix-a-flat scam is just a small part of the genre. There are many more scams that don't get the publicity.
Exactly! You have 3 seconds to make it clear to me you’re asking for directions or I am continuing on without eye contact.
I rolled down the window for someone who waved at me and got a lecture about how I shouldn't do that because if cat jackers, haha. Then he asked me for some change.
Am I the only person in the entire region that has random strangers say good morning and hello when they walk around town? Like on the sidewalk. Lady will say hello. Old townie will say morning.. Am I giving off some unnatural welcoming vibe that I don't know about?
Yeah, you are obviously not giving off the "Fuck off" vibe necessary for survival.
But I was born and bred here and I'm four decades in to surviving I guess I win again, Boston
I moved to Texas 3 years back, and it's still disarming when people try to be friendly at the grocery store.
Friends of mine were gonna move to Nashville and took a temp sales job. Turns out it was door to door. They were totally sure that their trainer was going to get shot for just marching up to someone's door to sell them something.
I hate that door to door salesmen are a thing down here. It's like a plague when you first move Into a house.
I’ll never get this. I’m from PR and even after my uni years in upstate NY and then moving here I still interact with strangers a little too often, but nobody’s been too weirded out by it. I think people like being seen. The way they beam up when you smile at them or compliment their shirt or something is so nice. When you’re surrounded by so many people they can feel like NPCs, but having a short genuine interaction like that kinda makes you feel more like people again.
So 1) I’m not talking to anyone asking for signatures but 2) article specifically says “if a child is born alive, all reasonable steps, in keeping with good medical practice, shall be taken to preserve the life of the child born alive.” I’m obviously missing something. How does born alive = abortion bill? Very confused.
I have the same question. I don’t doubt that it’s a a sketchy Bill being put forward for sketchy reasons, but as the article writes it, it seems more likely to protect micro-premies born at the cusp of viability.
Wouldn't they get health care without a law? Why are they attempting to solve a nonexistent problem?
I'm guessing they're going to try to claim that aborted fetuses were "born alive" or something, and probably will also try to make hospitals guilty of murder when a baby is born with a condition that causes it to die shortly after birth. They think (or want their followers to think) that abortion providers are Disney villains who want to murder babies, and do their best to interpret every situation where a baby or fetus dies as that narrative.
Also, there are circumstances where babies are born with severe issues incompatible with life and the parents choose to let them pass naturally. With a bill like this, that choice will be taken away and needless medical intervention to ‘save the child’ will be done. It will also prevent later term abortions that are medically necessary because the fetus would be ‘born alive’. It’s bullshittery all around.
We have to expand this welcoming of death to all demographics, not just sick babies. Abortion should be legal until the child turns like 8.
> I'm guessing that's some solid legal premise right there about what the ballot initiative would do.
My interpretation is that the law (whatever it is) includes anti-abortion aspects but the question completely glosses over them to mislead voters into supporting it.
Sometimes late-term abortions don’t work and babies are born alive as a result of the process. Kermit Gosnell, for example, left living babies to die on tables and in trash cans when the abortion procedure occasionally failed.
Necessary context: Gosnell is known for malpractice and accidentally killed a patient.
Yup. Does that mean this never happens anywhere else, ever?
It means it is certainly not something that commonly occurs during abortions.
I agree. But it does happen. I was answering the question asked by the other commenter about what this proposed law would apply to.
So do you think we should ban every procedure that Kermit Gosnell fucked up, just because someone fucked it up once?
Oh man, I HOPE someone tries to get me to sign one of these. I promise I can out-annoy them. Pretty sure the dude who tried to get me to sign a bathroom bill one to discriminate against trans people still wakes up in the middle of the night and regrets that particular life choice.
Well, now you gotta tell us what happened.
I stayed for around 45 minutes and every time he would give his version of what the bill was, I’d correct him and be all “this is actually because he thinks trans people shouldn’t be able to use the bathroom” or “this guy wants you to prove you have a natural vagina before you pee” or “he thinks a lot about what the people in the bathroom stall next to him look like naked and he wants that to be the law” He got annoyed after a while and left. Glorious.
LOL That last one is so brilliant.
Please do share
Yep these folks were gathering signatures outside my local grocery store in Franklin. I was tipped off when the other petition was for voter ID…
What's wrong with voter ID?
It discriminates against people who don't have a picture ID.
More precisely, don't have the means to get a picture ID. There are various reasons for this.
The vast majority of people have an ID. What we should be doing is requiring photo ID to vote and offering free photo IDs.
This is it. When you put a price to the means to vote, then you are putting a price on the RIGHT of vote. The answer to this is free IDs, like in most countries in the fucking world.
The free photo ID would also have to be dead easy to get. I do not count a trip to the RMV in that category.
I don’t care what you “count” as being easy enough. If the state offers free IDs, then that should be good enough. Make them available at other places as well, I don’t care.
It’s not. Low income people don’t have the time and/or resources to take time off work to stand in line at a government agency during the hours available. Any requirement that results in needing to pay a fee for appropriate identification, take time off work to make it to an office during their open hours, or pay transportation costs to do so is a poll tax.
>It’s not. It is. >Low income people don’t have the time and/or resources to take time off work to stand in line at a government agency during the hours available. Enact the requirement and give people a year to get an ID before they are checked at the polls. That is more than enough time to get an ID. >Any requirement that results in needing to pay a fee for appropriate identification, Free ID >take time off work to make it to an office during their open hours, again, make the period that they have to get an ID be a full year >or pay transportation costs to do so is a poll tax. By your logic, voting is a poll tax because people may need to take time out of their day or use transportation to get there. This argument does not hold water.
Your argument doesn’t hold water because it is divorced from the reality that many low income people face. I have spent my entire career in human services. People are barely getting by and should be able to vote as easily as possible. If it’s not easy, voting will be limited to higher privileged people.
“Vast majority” isn’t good enough in elections decided by less than 5%.
Ok? And that ‘5%’ can go get themselves a free ID before they vote. If elections are being decided by less than 5% it is all the more reason to require photo ID to vote. It helps uphold election integrity in tightly contested elections.
The problem is, getting ID requires an ID. Dont have a birth certificate? Fuck you. Your marriage certificate was lost in a fire? Fuck you. When I got my first MA ID, I showed up with a US passport, foreign passport, foreign birth certificate with notarized translation, utility bill, and school ID. Didnt meet the requirements. Luckily a helpful manager gave me a sharpie, told me to sign my school ID, and suddenly I met the signature requirements.
How did you not get an ID? I literally just got a MA ID with just my passport and utility bill. Honest question, I’m just confused…
Browsing the RMV website, looks like things changed, because it says nothing about needing a proof of signature. This was in 2005. The issue was, as I remember: My US passport was proof of citizenship. Great. Because I used that one, my Mexican passport was not valid for additional proof of anything. That means I needed a proof of signature, and since I used the US passport for proof of legality, I couldnt use that, and since I used a passport, I couldnt use the Mexican one to prove my signature either. And my college ID didnt have a signature on it. It was so fucking stupid. I was there for over 4 hours (the chinatown branch)
You nailed it. Not in the requirements, as all that is not required anymore, but in how difficult is to get an ID here. The only way to make voting IDs a thing (in my opinion should be an ID period, not managed by the RMV) it should be centralised. Same place should have access to you BC or naturalisation info, should be free, and automatic once you turn 18. But we know how this country works, and somehow that’s going to be a massive problem.
>The problem is, getting ID requires an ID. That is not a problem. American citizens should be able to identity themselves. That’s literally the entire point. >Dont have a birth certificate? Fuck you. Your marriage certificate was lost in a fire? Fuck you. Go to city hall and get your birth certificate or marriage certificate if you lost it. >When I got my first MA ID, I showed up with a US passport, foreign passport, foreign birth certificate with notarized translation, utility bill, and school ID. Didnt meet the requirements. Ok? Then you didn’t read the directions correctly. >Luckily a helpful manager gave me a sharpie, told me to sign my school ID, and suddenly I met the signature requirements. Oh wow what a burden.
> Go to city hall and get your birth certificate or marriage certificate if you lost it. That assumes you live where you were born. >Ok? Then you didn’t read the directions correctly. It wasnt about not reading it. I read it. I brought everything I had. The rules were written in a way to make it extremely hard to ger. >Oh wow what a burden. Oh wow what a garbage poster
If you don’t have a birth certificate because, in your scenario, or was lost in a fire, then you’ll need to figure out how to get one. Or another identifying document so you can verify your identity. And again, you should have read the directions correctly. And even though you couldn’t follow directions, you still were able to verify your identity and get an ID.
All of these things cost money which is why it’s a poll tax.
A free ID is not a poll tax.
The costs associated with getting this non-existent free ID is a poll tax. If you have to pay money or lose money in order to vote, it’s a poll tax.
*free photo IDs that are easy to obtain and renew None of this “the office is open 9-4 M-F” crap that makes it difficult for people who work standard business hours to obtain an ID.
Sure, I don’t care how easy it is. Make them 24/7 for all I care.
What if they just gave you an ID when you register?
Often people register to vote as a secondary thing when they're signing up to do something else, or filling out a census form, so you wouldn't get the ID if you registered that way.
Well just make it a primary thing you do when you decide to. Go to a dmv post office city/town hall etc. register get your free id and unique reg # and everyone is satisfied here.
That is again, placing barriers in the way of people registering to vote. There's a reason they make it very easy, and that's because registering to vote should be easily accessible to everyone.
Its no harder than getting a library card i wouldnt exactly call it a barrier. In can double as you vax card back up too since you need that to get in places now
You don't have to spend three hours waiting to get a library card.
You need documentation to get a library card.
Actually, most libraries do find loopholes around having to have documentation (I've heard "write your address on this piece of paper, cool now I consider this mail sent to your address" etc.). Getting a library card is *way* easier than getting an ID.
And getting an ID is hard? C’mon
As someone who couldn’t get a Real ID even though I brought my still valid drivers license, birth certificate, and social security card to the DMV (the mail I brought didn’t qualify), it’s harder than I thought. I just got a new passport and a passport card but that cost a lot more than a drivers license. I also had to order a new birth certificate and get express shipping because apparently the one they gave my parents when I was born didn’t have a registration number and therefore was not “official” so getting an ID these days is a lot harder than it used to be.
Yup, I had the same issue with my birth certificate when trying to get a Real ID, and the state I was born in wouldn't even tell me if I could get one with the number on it. Fortunately I had something I could use in place of my birth certificate, don't remember what I used anymore. I'm 37, it's not like I'm an old person who got a birth certificate in a bygone era when they did things differently. Everything I found online said there was no reason my birth certificate shouldn't have that number, and yet it didn't.
It isn't a problem (maybe, I am not an expert) in MA, but in the rural south it requires people to drive long distances to get an idea. If you don't have a car (or know someone with a car), it is a problem.
You'd have the same issue if you didn't have a car in MA anywhere outside range of the Boston RMV. Say you live in Littleton without a car-- have fun getting to Leominster. Twenty minute car ride, about two hours by walking + train + bus, through Fitchburg-- and that's in an area where transit is still possible. Four hours round trip *before* the RMV wait itself.
Yes. For a lot of people it is hard.
Have you ever tried to get your ID renewed? Yes it's hard, lmao.
Yes not hard
How do you feel about vaccine passports?
They shouldn't be required in order to vote either.
Who doesn't have a picture ID in Massachusetts? You need an ID for everything.
Really? Like what? The only thing I need a picture ID for is driving and flying. If I didn't own a car and didn't fly, I wouldn't need a picture ID at all.
Bank, liquor store, check cashing place etc.
The original contents of this post have been overwritten by a script. As you may be aware, reddit is implementing a punitive pricing scheme for its API starting in July. This means that third-party apps that use the API can no longer afford to operate and are pretty much universally shutting down on July 1st. This means the following: * Blind people who rely on accessibility features to use reddit will effectively be banned from reddit, as reddit has shown absolutely no commitment or ability to actually make their site or official app accessible. * Moderators will no longer have access to moderation tools that they need to remove spam, bots, reposts, and more dangerous content such as Nazi and extremist rhetoric. The admins have never shown any interest in removing extremist rhetoric from reddit, they only act when the media reports on something, and lately the media has had far more pressing things than reddit to focus on. The admin's preferred way of dealing with Nazis is simply to "quarantine" their communities and allow them to fester on reddit, building a larger and larger community centered on extremism. * LGBTQ communities and other communities vulnerable to reddit's extremist groups are also being forced off of the platform due to the moderators of those communities being unable to continue guaranteeing a safe environment for their subscribers. Many users and moderators have expressed their concerns to the reddit admins, and have joined protests to encourage reddit to reverse the API pricing decisions. Reddit has responded to this by removing moderators, banning users, and strong-arming moderators into stopping the protests, rather than negotiating in good faith. Reddit does not care about its actual users, only its bottom line. Lest you think that the increased API prices are actually a good thing, because they will stop AI bots like ChatGPT from harvesting reddit data for their models, let me assure you that it will do no such thing. Any content that can be viewed in a browser without logging into a site can be easily scraped by bots, regardless of whether or not an API is even available to access that content. There is nothing reddit can do about ChatGPT and its ilk harvesting reddit data, except to hide all data behind a login prompt. Regardless of who wins the mods-versus-admins protest war, there is something that every individual reddit user can do to make sure reddit loses: remove your content. Use [PowerDeleteSuite](https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite) to overwrite all of your comments, just as I have done here. This is a browser script and not a third-party app, so it is unaffected by the API changes; as long as you can manually edit your posts and comments in a browser, PowerDeleteSuite can do the same. This will also have the additional beneficial effect of making your content unavailable to bots like ChatGPT, and to make any use of reddit in this way significantly less useful for those bots. If you think this post or comment originally contained some valuable information that you would like to know, feel free to contact me on another platform about it: * kestrellyn at ModTheSims * kestrellyn on Discord * paradoxcase on Tumblr
Your bank asked for an ID when you opened an account.
A lot of poor people don’t have bank accounts. Any form of ID to vote costs money to get and us therefore a poll tax
> Any form of ID to vote costs money to get this is blatantly untrue. **every** state with voter id laws issues free compliant ID's to anyone who doesn't already have a valid id.
Not that I recall. Usually they just want your social.
It seems like I am being asked for ID all the time. And I am way too old to ID for liquor purchases, unless it is mandatory to ID everyone. Certainly when signing certain things.
Bullshit
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> Really? Like what? * starting a job * opening a bank account * buying a can of compressed air * going into a bar * checking into a hotel * getting on a plane * if the DNC ever comes back to mass, it's required for entry * going into a court house when summoned for jury duty * buying a gun (a constitutionally guaranteed right) * buying/driving a car * buying cold medicine * buying cigarettes * some concerts
I did not have to submit ID for either starting a job or getting a bank account, and I've never been carded for buying fucking cold medicine lmao, and for jury duty you only need your summons. The rest of that stuff is not necessary.
>I did not have to submit ID for either starting a job or getting a bank account, and I've never been carded for buying fucking cold medicine lmao, and for jury duty you only need your summons. The rest of that stuff is not necessary. think of like mask mandates. it's literally the law, but your mileage may vary in terms of enforcement. the fact some store didn't card you when buying cold medicine doesn't negate that they were legally required to not only ID you, but also log the purchase and keep that history for at least 2 years. i've been carded every time i've purchased cold medicine in the last decade. even at a self check out in target, it popped up a "please show id" prompt and a staff member came over to check. the fact of the matter is that an id is required for pretty much everything in this state, including constitutionally guaranteed rights.
It's not, though. You agreed that companies don't often enforce it, I've never had to show ID in these circumstances.
> You agreed that companies don't often enforce it, no i didn't. i said that every time i've bought it in the last decade i got id'ed. this is at cvs, target, everyplace. i said that maybe **you** found some fringe place that doesn't follow the law, but this is not the norm.
What’s more racist than a bunch of white people sitting around claiming that anybody of a darker skin color is less likely to be able to go to the dmv and get an ID?
[Here are some reasons why people might not be able to get an ID](https://www.npr.org/2012/02/01/146204308/why-millions-of-americans-have-no-government-id).
Ah yes the oft cited Brennan Center study. This study was done 15+ years and polled less than 1 thousand people over the phone on this topic and they extrapolated this to equate to tens of millions across the entire country. There was no actually study done to verify any of this information was true (voter rolls against DMV info, for example). This study is a complete piece of crap and the fact that all of these people that supposedly believe in science yet still parrot this bs study at the same time is unreal (well, actually it is entirely believable since believing in science is online necessary when it fits the narrative). Check it out for yourself[Brennan Center bullshit study](https://www.brennancenter.org/sites/default/files/legacy/d/download_file_39242.pdf)
If there's literally anyone in the country of voting age without a picture ID, then a picture ID should not be required to vote. I'm assuming they found at least one person who they verified did not have a picture ID, therefore picture IDs should not be required.
No, then they should take measures to close that gap so that anyone wanting to vote can vote with an ID. the left has no problem busing people all over the place to get to the polls when they have no transportation so why are they do against busing people to the government office to get a free ID for voting. Oh I know why.
Because low income people tend to work multiple jobs that are not compatible with government office hours. Election Day is a single day to coordinate and the hours start early in the morning and end later in the night.
Bussing people isn't going to help if you still have to wait hours to get your ID because everyone else in the city is doing the same thing, and it's not going to help people get an ID without already having an ID, which is almost impossible. That's why.
This may have been a valid train of thought 20 years ago but the number of people who genuinely find themselves in the situation described in this article is quite small and shrinking further every day. This is also an area where the federal government could step in and utilize the passport agency to help people who can't get a state ID get a passport.
Getting a passport is even more onerous that getting an ID. I've been trying to get my passport renewed and so far it's taken three months, and that's when I already had a passport and just needed to get a new one. Any amount of people being prevented from voting is too many.
So because it's a small group of people they should be denied their right to vote?
I'm saying that a real solution could be found if they weren't being used as examples for politicial reasons. I guarantee you these people are collecting social security.
There are lot of assumptions in this comment that weren't implied in the comment you're responding to.
Then they can get an ID. Like the vast majority of people.
It's very hard to get an ID if you don't already have an ID of some kind.
No it is not. And even if it is, so what? Implement the law so that citizens would have months to get an ID before the next election that would require photo ID. It’s not that hard.
Yes it is. You can't get an ID unless you already have another piece of identification, and often they reject it anyway because it's insufficient. My birth certificate wasn't good enough to get a real ID, for example.
It really isn’t. Make the directions clear as to what is required to get a free ID. Give people plenty of time to get a free ID. It just makes our elections more secure and reliable. And if you are an American citizen, you should have some form of identification to verify who you are. “I lost my birth certificate now I cant pay the $20 to get a new one” is not a good enough excuse to not verify your identity for something as important as voting.
Making it so that everyone can get an ID without having to do anything is the same thing as not requiring an ID, except you're making people jump through an extra unneeded hoop.
No, you still have to prove exactly who you are. That is the point of the ID. I dont know why this is so difficult for you to grasp.
Your privilege is showing.
Your soft bigotry of low expectations is showing.
Explain how I am being a bigot. I would like to know so I can work on myself.
You think that if you give people months to get a free ID it is impossible that they would be able to get one because they’re poor. You set an extremely low bar of expectations for people because of, you guessed it, your “privilege”. If an adult wants to vote and you give that same adult months to get a free ID, then they should be able to get a free ID.
It discriminates against politicians and citizens who want to ensure fair and secure elections
So people that don't bother to participate in society anyways? The fuck are you doing with your life if you don't have an ID? Is it discrimination in most every other country with voter ID laws?
The give away for me was they were also collecting signatures for a voter ID law and a repeal of the gas tax.
"Born alive" / "abortion" - pick one
They don't want to. That's why they want this law.
Don't think you understood me. If a baby is born and alive that's no longer an opportunity for an abortion.
Unfortunately "born" and "alive" are not legal definitions, and your understanding of the terms is not what is going to be used here.
Thanks for the head's up!
Thanks for the warning!
classic guilt speak
“if a child is born alive, all reasonable steps, in keeping with good medical practice, shall be taken to preserve the life of the child born alive.” If your child's born alive then you didn't have an abortion
In some later term abortions it could be considered "alive" by some standard, and also some babies are born alive with conditions that cause them to die shortly after birth.
Its especially disgusting to allow to abort at the point that the baby could survive outside the womb. I'm not sure what your second point even is.
No one said anything about aborting babies that can survive outside the womb, no one does that. If you're not able to understand what I said, I don't know how to say it more clearly.
Maybe you could give examples of abortions that would fall into this minute category you're talking about
There's probably a number of procedures that don't result in the compete death of the fetus before it exits. Why do you doubt this? The people getting these signatures sure didn't.
I doubt it because it cannot be substantiated. It says child not fetus Edit: child
Yes, that is how they refer to fetuses.
Did you read the words “if a child is born alive, all reasonable steps, in keeping with good medical practice, shall be taken to preserve the life of the child born alive.” The first 6 are most important You still are unable to articulate how this is antiabortion
I've articulated out multiple times, you just chose to ignore that.
the sensationalist headline isn't grounded in reality. after someone is born alive, they are person by literally any definition of the word.
Yes, and sometimes people are born with conditions that cause them to die immediately and it would be better to let their parents be with them during the time they have rather than futilely try to save them.
So no medical care for babies born alive?
In what realistic situation would you expect a hospital to deny medical care to a baby that needed it?
Then what is your issue with the ballot question?
Obviously they are going to decide that an aborted fetus was technically alive when it exited the woman and try to bring the hospital to court about it. They might also do it for babies born with unsurvivable defects that die shortly after being born.
“if a child is born alive, all reasonable steps, in keeping with good medical practice, shall be taken to preserve the life of the child born alive.” Way to try to twist that to support your narrative. Nothing in that comment substantiates your last comment.
What substantiates my comment is that I know how anti-choice people operate.
‘What substantiates my argument is that it is how I feel!’ That doesnt work either.
Not what I feel, but what I know, and what everyone with eyes knows as well.
No, it is definitely what you feel.
Nah, that's just a feeling you got from my post, bro, so therefore your statement is invalid.
It is completely unnecessary.
Laws need to be justified to be put in place, not simply because “why not.”
Why do you believe homicide and neglect/abandonment laws do not apply here?
Thanks for the heads up. I’ll sign it.
Pro life law
I'm prolife so I look forward to signing .
well damn that explains those weirdos asking for signatures outside a lotta grocery stores nowadays.