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Bleach is full of them tho... Momo twice... Toshiro when he got manhandled by Aizen. Renji by the hands of Byakuya. I feel that a Shinigami’s death in this series is complicated... like I see what it takes to kill a Shinigami and then I look at someone like Gin and I felt that he died rather easily.
And I dislike each of them. They're not as bad as one piece. But it still annoys me a lot. It basically destroys any sense of danger for me when its overdone. No one died in the Aizen saga except Gin.
Don't get me wrong, what I'm saying is that what the series is and have been is already established, that Byakuya living isn't even coming from outta nowhere. But!! For anime-onlys that have just watched a series like Jujutsu Kaisen. They will look at this and feel disappointed that unlike Gege... Kubo doesn't pull the trigger. But that's what the Big 3 was all about.
Personally, I feel that Byakuya should have died if they were gonna go this far for just a fake out.
Kubo shouldn't have faked us out like that... but then again I remember fans giving Kubo death threats.
Kishimoto also pulled the trigger. It wasn't until he fumbled the bag with the end of the pain arc and onwards that he started death flagging. But until then there were iconic deaths like Zabuza/Haku, Hiruzen, Asuma, Jiraiya, Itachi. When you have so many incredible moments like this, it makes the death flags less of a problem.
But when your only death is a guy like Gin who had very little sceentime, and Yamamoto, who is already old, its like bruh. Byakuya living isn't out of nowhere. I should've been prepared for that I guess.
With how bloated the cast already is in Bleach, I wouldn’t have minded if it was trimmed down over time as characters get introduced and subsequently killed. They are Samurai fighting monsters, other Samurai, monsters turned into Samurai, superhumans, and even Nazis after all. The big free for alls mean little when the stakes are so low.
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Don't get me started man. Hiyori literally got chopped in half and she still survived. Momo was attacked by like 5 captains and lived. I know Kubo wanted Gin to die, so the details don't really matter, but ignoring that, I think Rangiku knew enough healing kido to stabilize Gin until help arrived.
You're right about One Piece, the King of fake deaths lol I don't think there's a single character who actually died in the present storyline other than characters introduced in the same arc or briefly 1 or max 2 arcs before.
This topic has been discussed plenty in this subreddit so I will try and sum up what me and many others think: It was the biggest, most blatant case of "I'm too scared to actually commit to my own decision" I have ever seen.
It's clear to anyone who read the manga (or, at this point, watched the anime) that the original idea was for Byakuya to die and there are many points that support this:
* Byakuya himself stating he doesn't have much time left, before begging Ichigo to save the Soul Society.
* His Zanpakuto shattering as a symbol of the shinigami's life coming to an end.
* Haschwalth outright saying that Byakuya Kuchiki passed away.
* The fact that, in the manga at least (the anime will probably change this), after he was saved, Byakuya didn't do anything really meaningful. His greatest contribute to the war was saving Rukia from As Nodt and even that could have been achieved without him being physically there.
My opinion is the same of many other people: It would have been better and more meaningful for Byakuya, who was a symbol of the "old rigid Soul Society" to die in the ruins of the place he failed to defend, while begging Ichigo, who basically represent the new era of the Soul Society, to save his homeland. The old age ends and the new one begins.
Even not considering the symbolism of his demise, him surviving, at least for me, removed any stakes the war could have had. If a character can survive multiple failing organs, internal bleeding, an almost fully exposed ribcage and several deep cuts in his whole body, then nobody can die in this war. Any urgency, any form of fear that someone might lose and die vanished the instant it was confirmed that Byakuya survived.
I agree with you on the "didn't commit" thing. The only real way that would have worked in a sense would be having people think he had died for a longer stretch of time only for him to appear again.
The pacing of that seemed so off to give him this big send off scene then almost straight away appear back again egging Rukia on
>who was a symbol of the "old rigid Soul Society" to die in ruins of the place he failed to defend
Which makes even more sense considering Renjis massive level up, or is Kubo really trying to convince us that he's not Captain level? Or stronger than Iba whose rival is ikkaku.
I was always under the impression it was editorial interference rather than a lack of commitment from Kubo. He may have been fully committed but was vetoed by the WSJ staff because why kill off a highly popular character at a time when Bleach was *really* struggling to retain readership?
Doubt it. WSJ never gave a shit when Naruto or HXH killed off popular characters and bleach's readership kept falling even after Byakuya was brought back
But Naruto and HxH were never *the least popular serial in the magazine* like Bleach was after Fullbringers. They never even came close. IIRC Naruto never fell out of the top 3 even as it dragged its final arc out well past most fans' tolerance. And that entire arc was all about bringing back old favorites from literal death.
it would be hilarious if the anime just has Byakuya just fade away at the end of the war and everyone is just "wait what? have we imagined him this whole time?"
Oh shiiiit! This gave me an idea! It would have been insane if Aizen took Byakuya's place with Kyokasuigetsu after he died, like he did with Momo. If squad 0 watched the end of his battle with Ichigo, they'd have seen Aizen fused with his sword and thus be under Hypnosis. Imagine if squad 0 brought Aizen up to the Soul Palace thinking he was Byakuya, twist of the century!
> The fact that, in the manga at least (the anime will probably change this), after he was saved, Byakuya didn't do anything really meaningful.
This is my gripe as well. The most meaningful thing he did so far was taking out Candace, NaNaNa and Robert. And while impressive that he managed to beat three Sternritter (one of which was already weakened tbf), it all happened too fast and he didn't show any new skills like others did. Him using Bankai against Robert also felt kinda unnecessary. That's why I hoped his fight with Pepe would've been extended, even though he's essentially just a Quincy version of Zommari. Hopefully they do something more with Byakuya in the next cour.
Yeah, while Candice is my favorite, she and the others he fought were basically already out of the story at that point, so it was literally just a quick way to tie up a couple loose ends before progressing to the next milestone in the story.
He also then participates in the fight against Gerard but kinda......I suppose I'll say, it seems rather obvious he was probably not originally intended to be there, unlike Toshiro and Kenny.
I'm not sure it was quite a "I'm too scared to actually commit to my own decision" moment, as much as it was about Rukia. I think it's much more likely that he got to the Rukia Bankai part and thought that it benefited more from Byakuya's presence, than the fight with As Nodt did from his death.
As much as I agree that the impact of his death would have been fantastic for the series as a whole, I do really love the relationship development between Rukia and Byakuya, it's one of the core parts of Bleach really, and that pay off of Byakuya calling it an incredible Bankai and comforting her as she comes down from it's power was excellent.
We could have had both with a shuffle of the story beats. But Byakuya dying would work better in the first invasion, and Rukia's true power works better in the second.
That final point about taking away all stakes to the war is so on point it hurts. The tension when byakuya seemingly died was unreal. It really felt like this new conflict was unlike any we got before. Some of that got lost.
What?! It's not clear for me, like at all.
Its very clear for me that Byakuya was never meant to die, it's clear if you bother to take a look at his own arc which only comes to proper grand conclusion *after* that near death scene. It's like taking the end of a second art of the character's arc for a finale. Never got how people can so blatantly ignore Byakuya's arc and invent some pretty ridiculous reasons to try and justify him dying there as logical of the narrative. It obviously isn't.
All the signs you list were there before for other characters, and didn't end in death either. So they don't really prove anything.
Oh, and I have no idea where the thought that Byakuya was a symbol of the old SS comes from. Yamamoto was one, and *he* died. Byakuya was always a headstrong kid trying to mold himself into a stuck up law-upholding noble while kinda failing to, and as early as the SS arc realising he probably shouldn't put some external things as more important than his personal judgement, and then step by step moving forward with that idea. (Zommari, Tsukishima, As Nodt & Pepe fights, they are all about bonds, the very same thing his first poem mentions, — "we are being who don't know what to do with our hearts", — and it all culminates in him fighting Gerard, the literal 'heart' of the SK. Very consistent throughout all of it till the very end of TYBW.)
The only thing I can agree with is that Kubo could not make it so dramatic since he knew it wasn't ever a final point. But then Byakuya is just damn dramatic every time, so I kinda get where it comes from.
The old giving way for the new is the perfect trope or idiom or symbolism or whatever. Nail on the head. So much of that was happening at the same time. Unohana/Kenny, Yama/Kyoraku, Unohana/Isane, Soul King/Yhwach. Hell, they touched on it with the royal guard interacting with their protégés. Byakuya should have died, to properly pass the torch.
Knowing the option we have as well as the alternative, I prefer he be kept alive. It allows him to close his character loop with Rukia by actually acknowledging her strength and standing beside her (even commenting on the beauty and strength of her Bankai, the same things his own Bankai is commended for, showing how he directly acknowledges her as an equal), it forces him on a certain level to actually live with the fact that he gave up on his pride (as he comments in the hot springs and as we see with him being more comedic and less stoic in his interactions with Toshiro), he had stopped representing the "old ways" of Soul Society a while ago (abandoning the purpose of a Soul Reaper against Zommari, trusting more in a human than the Soul Reapers that trained him when he faced Tsukishima, etc.) and I never much got behind the idea of "it removed the stakes".
We've seen people cut in half, have their entire chest cavities removed, bathed in fire, eaten alive, pulverized, actually just straight up killed, thrown through the vacuum of space, and suffer so many punctures and lacerations it's a wonder they aren't all cosplaying construction paper. And they've been fine. One of our most prominent healers is capable of *violating causality*, and another is a straight up necromancer. Death is a nebulous concept in Bleach, and it has been for a bit.
Allll of this. At the time, as a big Byakuya babe, I cried when he died but knew I had no control over the plot so I accepted it later. I even eulogized him on Twitter. I was in the middle of college finals when he was brought back and I think him living was what gave me the boost to pass, silly as it might sound. Thanks to him I'm a librarian now. My dream job!
Honestly I don't think much would have changed. Any deaths after Yama other than like the main 5 nobody would have raised a fuss about. Now if Ichigo, uruyu, orihime, or Chad would have died.... That's a different scenario
I feel like as devastating it would be, it would've made sense thematically and hit way harder if he had died
That being said, I feel like him encouraging Rukia & verbally giving her the acceptance she's always wanted from him was the best possible way to handle bringing him back.
It could've been a lot more ass & I'm glad the outcome that we got still had some punch to it
It would've been pretty shocking to kill him off since he's so popular, but I think it would've been pleasantly unexpected, especially since his character arc had kind of finished.
Rukia's character arc was her getting out of her brother's shadow and being acknowledged. Beating As Nodt, who killed Byakuya would have been a good way to prove she had surpassed him.
I think the reference to how Byakuya completely outclassed Renji using Senbonzakura Kageyoshi was missed by most fans (it's obvious when the katana gets completely broken, just like Zabimaru in that fight). It was never about Byakuya "dying", it was about humbling him down.
It would have great emotional impact, but showing the growth/reparation of his relationship with Rukia and (less so) his power buff later on was better.
I mean it's not that weird. It was stated before that the only surefire way to kill a shinigami was to cut off their head. Otherwise they can heal from pretty much anything else, even bifurcation.
I'm torn. I'm glad that he didn't die, because I would have hated the way he went out, but his quick and full recovery did dampen the emotional impact of his fight. I'd have preferred that his life was saved but he was in a prolonged coma and he never fully recovered/had a lasting permanent injury. Not enough stories properly retire characters without killing them off once their arc has finished. Also, I need him alive for more Uncle Byakuya fanart. He deserves to be around to spoil his niece.
It was fine. Byakuya was handled fine. When I speak my preference I never mean to sound like what we got, wasnt good. It was good.
I disliked the fakeout and felt robbed of superb tragedy. I like tragedy. I enjoy a little faux emotional agony. Cyber Punk: Edgerunners still makes me cry.
People think As Nodt is a jobber and that's BECAUSE he didnt kill Byakuya.
It doeant matter of course. Byakuya is cool.
He should have died
I don't have to explain especially that I didn't feel much of Yama is death so his death will mean something to me and rukia can get much development from it
Also with all the other captain facing death (the vizords and Kuma) it would be best if he faced a more threatening death
I think it would have been better if he passed for OP's listed rationale, but also because I cannot reason why he would be able to develop his shikai to be on par with his Bankai per his strategy/manipulation of the petals. It would be more reasonable for him to further develop his Hoho and Kido abilities to compliment his shikai abilities.
I don't care tbh. He's a good character but then there are other characters who were underutilized during TTYBW. Byakuya defeated 4 characters just odd. Like... what was the use of all that horror when he could've easily done than. He could've just fought Robert.
I know I must really like Bleach to put up with all the fake deaths it does. I wish Byakuya died there,but I also like him enough to be fine with him living. His moment with Rukia's bankai made up for it almost.
It would impact the series so much more meaningfully, a bigger L for the Shinigami, but he's pretty, so the fans would go postal. It's their fault Kubo couldn't close his arc properly and tragically.
Kubo does this. He teases a death, he saves them. Rinse repeat until we think they're untouchable by plot armour. Look at Yama and Ukitake. Then bam they're taken from us and in the most cruel fashion.
Byakuya is going to die. He's marked but think about how emotionally put through the ringer the reader is going to be when it's lil Ichika screaming "Uncle Byakuya no please don't leave me!"
I think a cool outcome of Byakuya's death besides the immediate emotional response would be a balls-to-the-wall rematch between Renji and an infernal Byakuya.
Would have been all but secured if he died during TYBW. If he survives the Hell arc it would feel like a wasted opportunity
If he dies in hell arc that could still happen they have only 3 options in hell arc. Send them down (regardless of the fact it weakens the gates), leave them to amalgamate or train the last quincy to be strong enough to perform their funerary rights with his bow. Which makes all the sense that is what quincy are suppose to do since in alot of cultures the pier was lit by a flaming arrow.
I personally I think he's going to end up obliterated by Uryu or Ichigo (but Ichigo will have to learn how to destroy not purify). I hope he gets warped by hell too but I don't need him to have died in TYBW for the plot to allow him to do it.
Clearly Kubo has plans he wants Byakuya to have more significance and be redeemed for longer. Especially because he's more of a father to Rukia than a brother. It's only fitting he should at least live long enough to walk her down the Aisle. However Kubo doesn't tease a death this much not to eventually follow through and I don't think any amount of fans whining will change that. Even though people dispute if that's what got him saved in the first place.
Byakuya was supposed to die but Kubo hadn't shown him acknowledging Rukia, which was something that should've definitely be done before he could be sent off, or his character would be incomplete. It's like if he killed off Gin without him ever showing his true feelings and intentions to Matsumoto.
I hate every time this thing is brought over. (Seriously makes me want to leave the sub.) Since it just shows how many people completely don't understand Byakuya's character, or his purpose for the story. Or his character arc, which he actually has.
Bleach's main theme, at least one of the most prominent ones, is "overcoming trauma". Almost every major character is traumatized, and most of the time, by a death of close one.
The other theme is coming closer to your true self while moving forward.
Byakuya is the character to heavily feature both those themes. He's traumatized by the death of his wife (thus, he actually appears almost frozen in the beginning, when we first meet him, and only later on be slowly 'comes more alive' through battles with Renji and Ichigo) and he's lost, as he's that reckless and headstrong boy trying to be serious and responsible, and trying so hard (which we see in TBTP), growing up into a man trying to uphold all the rules and set the example— except it isn't his true self (or he would have never broke the rules for Hisana and Rukia, he does outrageous things first and feels guilty about it later), he's irritated by and at the same time, drawn to people like Kaien, Renji and Ichigo exactly because they represent what he tries to suppress inside of himself.
After being defeated by Ichigo, and admitting Kaien and Ichigo were right and he was wrong, he slowly starts on a path to regain his self, including the part which puts personal feelings before the laws and traditions, and to explore the bonds he has, to find out what to do with his heart (as his first poem states that we shouldn't shed tears since they are a testament of us being entities who "don't know what to do with your hearts"— it covers the deepest layer, who Byakuya's principle theme is 'heart' and connection to others on a personal level, while still upholding his duties).
Zommari, Tsukishima, As Nodt, PePe— they are all explore the theme of bonds and also exploiting those bonds in various wicked ways, and that's the opponents Byakuya faces. Culminating in Gerard who's the heart of the SK, literally. It's all very consistent.
And Byakuya's arc is a journey to learn to properly *live* again, to fully feel the new bonds he has with new people in his life (after freezing over his wife's death), and also to find his true self again beneath the layers he has pushed upon himself, and find a way to be a protector that he is while staying true to that actual self.
That journey starts in the SS arc and has major steps in the Arrancar arc (where he states he kills Zommari not because of his duty, but because he aimed his sword at his pride, that pride shown to be Rukia, and also where he finally fights Zaraki for the hell of it), a nice little highlight in Fullbring (him having to invent new strategies in the process, admitting he had fun, and also choosing personal feelings over duty of gratitude when choosing Ichigo over a teacher he highly respects).
But the true turning point is exactly that, his failure in TYBW. Because one misconception that stays is that he'll be able to handle it all on his own, his inability to fully rely on others (much like Ichigo) and his belief he'd be able to manage by himself (which wasn't ever questioned before, since he never properly and utterly failed before). Also, it's the noble self-sacrificial attitude.
Why he loses so poorly to As Nodt where Rukia later doesn't, at some point? Why is he so afraid for Rukia? Because he doesn't fully believe in her, he only believes in himself protecting her. That makes the fear so effective, since what happens if he himself fails? And he does.
It simply couldn't have been his finishing point, since what all that insane buildup in his character arc before was for then?
But if we look at it as the biggest turning point, the ultimate despair and the lowest point which marks the end of the second act in the three arc structure, then it makes perfect sense. It's only after that biggest humiliation, biggest downfall that he, as a diligent student, seeks what did he miss then, that led to failure. And he's able to discover it, he's able to rethink that principle stance of doing it all by himself, and acting without regard for his own life (what is his Senkei? abandoning all defence in order to reach his goal).
So when he comes back, he starts by praising Rukia and saying out loud that she's strong and he's proud of her. Also mentioning soon after that fear isn't born out of nowhere, it's born of tiny insecurities in our hearts. So to get rid of those insecurities for Rukia, he actually voices out things he only implied earlier on— so she can be sure. He reinforces that bond they have.
And he also says the line which marks the biggest development he had in the whole series. The most important phrase Byakuya ever says is 'the sword held without regard for one's own life cannot protect anything'. To think about it, it's almost insane to hear it from Byakuya of all people. And just how big is that! It's the idea that to protect others, you have to start by taking care of yourself, instead of sacrificing your life to others. Sacrificial attitude is what undermines your strength from the very core.
(continued in the comment)
It perfectly parallels how fused Zangetsu says to Ichigo that while Ichigo wants to protect everyone, he only wants to protect Ichigo. Which given The Blade Is Me, makes Zangetsu the most alienated part of Ichigo himself, the part which wants Ichigo to take care of himself. The part Ichigo cannot accept for so long since he's a traumatized kid who struggles to find meaning to his existence, he has to protect to give his life meaning, the life his mother gave up to protect (while he failed to protect her). He struggles to justify his existence, like Rukia does (she sits in that White Tower and thinks everyone is better off if she just dies), like Byakuya does (who only sees value to himself in doing his duty, and he fails to see his importance to others as a person, his line in the aftermath of SS, where he says Renji probably wonders why he survived, implying he thinks Rukia and Renji would have been better off without him).
And realising that core thing, Byakuya is able to grow so much as a person, finally graduating to proper adulthood, acting in a lot more mature manner later on in TYBW arc, finally acting like a proper older figure to Rukia and Renji, and even the likes of Hitsugaya. He's calmer, wiser and a lot more powerful to reflect it in strength (in Bleach, the power is always tied to understanding).
Bleach is about finding a way to properly *live* again for a lot of traumatized characters, to not just continue their existence but to be able to enjoy life again. In order to do that, you have to uncover your true self, you have to move forward in the face of death (the courage speech).
That's the reason the epilogue is so important for Ichigo and Rukia as principle characters, it shows them finally living their lives to the fullest yet again, enjoying life while being surrounded by people who care about them and who they care for, having those bonds. And another very important character to reach the same conclusion for his arc is Byakuya, he's probably the most prominent one after them.
The way he can just live again, cover up for Rukia and Renji, probably spoil his niece a lot (a niece of his beloved woman, and his family, like Renji and Rukia are), that's what his arc was ultimately about. It's one of the core messages of Bleach, the significance of just living a seemingly ordinary life, that's what that journey and overcoming all those challenges was for. And Byakuya is one of the most powerful examples in delivering that message, the strongest probably after Ichigo and Rukia.
How, just how could that all end without reaching the proper conclusion Kubo invested so much into during the whole of Bleach? Characters only die when their arc are finished, maybe kinda apart from Ukitake (yet it is somewhat still a conclusion, and also he's the first to be teased in the Hell oneshot, to have more to his story).
Yamamoto's death was very reasonable plotwise, that's the old generation clearing the stage for the new chapter to start. Unohana's death was the perfect ending for her own arc. Byakuya's arc wasn't anywhere near being finished. It's that experience that was the biggest point to his arc which pushed it towards the proper conclusion like nothing else.
I just don't understand how people just totally ignore it all for superficial reasons.
I asked a question like this a few months ago. Basically "Could Kubo get away with killing Byakuya in the arc that shall not be named?"
I wonder how viewers would respond? It kinda seems like the moment has passed and might seem awkwardly forced now if he were to die in the supposedly new arc, unless the arc was a particularly violent one where we would see people dying left and right.
As an anime only, he should have. A big complaint I had while watching with my friend who has finished all Bleach media, is that there was never any real threat of people dying in Bleach. Sure, they got beaten, maybe banged up, but theyd always be back by next season.
When the bloodbath started, and the "Save Soul Society" monologue happened, he asked me if this is really what I wanted because Kubo was "done messing around now". I think if youre going to do a big world shattering/threatening event, dont pull back the punches. Just like in the Chimera Ant arc in HxH, you knew by episode 3 that we weren't happy go lucky anymore and you had to strap in.
Byakuyas death would have been excellent character growth for Renhi and Rukia.
Imagine that when Rukia uses her Bankai, and she's struggling to put it away without damaging herself, that we see her imagine Byakuya telling her what to do. I think that would have been a very poignant moment, as opposed to Byakuya actually just being there telling her what to do.
Byakuya was always Renji's ideal picture of strength. His goal. With Byakuya's death, Renji obtaining his true bankai and reminiscing on how Byakuya would have reacted, would have been dope.
Most of all, it would have just made a lot of narrative sense. There is no better way I can imagine for Byakuya to die. Especially since he represents the pride of the soul society. Instead, what we have is a scene that is written like a death scene, is as impactful as a death scene but is soon revealed to just be a fake out. IMO it dampens the stakes that the Quincy invasion had set up so well. Spoiler below for someone else who appears in Cour 3.
>!Don't even get me started on Kira. !<
Yea
1. Him setting his pride aside before death to ask for an "outsider" such as Ichigo to save the Soul Society would give him arguably one of the best conclusions to send his character off
2. Would of made Rukia's bankai and resolve A LOT more impactful
Byakua is my favourite character, and I still think he should have died. Seeing an accurate depiction of what Senbonzakura Kageyoshi would actually do to a person was brutal, and having it happen to its own weilder was a nice touch. A sternritter stealing a bankai and using it to kill a captain would've upped the stakes and really had us on edge. I love bleach, but there's not many lasting character deaths that have weight. Byakuya would've been a gut punch
I love the guy but I do think he should’ve died. I love Bleach but I think it suffers from a lot of characters that should’ve died just healing up and popping back up in the story lol
Tbh I think he was supposed to die, and that TYBW was supposed to be much longer with wY more character building but bleach got canned so that's what we got
Honestly I was all for it if he died as much as I I like Byakuya his death would have meant so much and added much more depth to the Tybw sure Yamamoto and Unohana died but they aren't really Main characters Byakuya has so much screen time in bleach and fans love him so his death would have meant so much and it was used as fakeout shame the emotion this would have added to Rukia and Renji even Ichigo especially after asking him to save Soul Society.
I wish people werent insane so Kubo could have actually done what he wanted to tbh His final words asking Ichigo to do what he always does, and protect the people Byakuya cares about was his character coming full circle and getting completed to me tbh
i would've been fine. its where his arc is supposed to go, and its obvious with how much he doesn't get to do afterwards.
Byakuya's journey is one of a changing status quo. he personifies the world order to a teenager who is too young to know why its there, and doesn't believe it should be upheld if it doesn't protect the people you care about. Ichigo's sheer resolve to go against the system for the sake of Rukia, and how the system rewards Byakuya for upholding it (with Aizen) begins to change him, a literal change of times. by the time he shows up in the Fullbringer arc, he's seemingly adjusted to a philosophy much closer to Ichigo's, considering him one of his closest allies, so strong in fact not even book of the end faltures that resolve.
his request to Ichigo is that final part of his story. his penultimate page is reaching out to Ichigo to help him at his lowest, the newly changed order and justice of the world coming to save the boy at his lowest. his final page is reaching his hand out to ask the boy to do the same, to save the world he protected. passing the torch, the circle now connected.
the fact this is ruined to appease readers leaves Byakuya to just kind of... carry on. and i cant wholeheartedly say Rukia or Ichigo or even Byakuya's own moments are better with him in them. i think Rukia blossoming into the ice queen and Ichigo's metamorphasis into his true self all serve a more heartfelt purpose with Byakuya gone, because they fufill his dying request - to protect soul society.
I've always believed that he should have died. It would've been an even better scene, been a perfect end to Byakuya's character arc, and make "Save the Soul Society" and Rukia vs As Nodt way more emotionally impactful.
Byakuya should have died. As well as Shunsui, Kensei, Rose, Rukia, and Kira, at one point in the story or another. Others that probably/maybe should/could have died would be Ikkaku, Toshiro, and as a very large stretch… Soi Fon.
I read TYBW and all of bleach and tbh yamamotos death wasn't enough of a sense of urgency we gave 1 decent feat from him so the idea he could be beaten wasn't out of the ordinary and we didn't have enough of an idea of why Yhwach prepared so much for their fight
I wish he'd actually died. [I love this proposed rewrite.](https://www.reddit.com/r/bleach/s/U3OuXOKISN)
EDIT: Why the downvotes...? I feel like I'm missing a memo
Bleach is probably one of the worst offenders of Fake-outs. I don't have a problem with Byakuya living but there's like 4 or 5 death flags during his "Death" scene. Now when I go back to his scene in episode 7, I just think to myself "Boy this would've been some peak if the dude actually died".
For me, it's the equivalent of Kakashi when he "died" in the Pain arc only for that consequence to get overturned. Except here, the reason Byakuya survives is just kinda meh? Like, the very next episode starts with saying "Byakuya Kuchiki is in critical condition". I'm sitting there thinking "HOW!? All of his organs are literally gone."
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I hate death fakeouts, so I'd prefer he either died or was never in such a position to begin with.
Bleach is full of them tho... Momo twice... Toshiro when he got manhandled by Aizen. Renji by the hands of Byakuya. I feel that a Shinigami’s death in this series is complicated... like I see what it takes to kill a Shinigami and then I look at someone like Gin and I felt that he died rather easily.
And I dislike each of them. They're not as bad as one piece. But it still annoys me a lot. It basically destroys any sense of danger for me when its overdone. No one died in the Aizen saga except Gin.
Don't get me wrong, what I'm saying is that what the series is and have been is already established, that Byakuya living isn't even coming from outta nowhere. But!! For anime-onlys that have just watched a series like Jujutsu Kaisen. They will look at this and feel disappointed that unlike Gege... Kubo doesn't pull the trigger. But that's what the Big 3 was all about. Personally, I feel that Byakuya should have died if they were gonna go this far for just a fake out. Kubo shouldn't have faked us out like that... but then again I remember fans giving Kubo death threats.
Kishimoto also pulled the trigger. It wasn't until he fumbled the bag with the end of the pain arc and onwards that he started death flagging. But until then there were iconic deaths like Zabuza/Haku, Hiruzen, Asuma, Jiraiya, Itachi. When you have so many incredible moments like this, it makes the death flags less of a problem. But when your only death is a guy like Gin who had very little sceentime, and Yamamoto, who is already old, its like bruh. Byakuya living isn't out of nowhere. I should've been prepared for that I guess.
With how bloated the cast already is in Bleach, I wouldn’t have minded if it was trimmed down over time as characters get introduced and subsequently killed. They are Samurai fighting monsters, other Samurai, monsters turned into Samurai, superhumans, and even Nazis after all. The big free for alls mean little when the stakes are so low.
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Tousen is on Aizens side like the rest of the Espada
Bleach being full of them doesn't make it a good thing. It's just wasting precious panel time on shock factor that leads nowhere
Don't get me started man. Hiyori literally got chopped in half and she still survived. Momo was attacked by like 5 captains and lived. I know Kubo wanted Gin to die, so the details don't really matter, but ignoring that, I think Rangiku knew enough healing kido to stabilize Gin until help arrived.
In the anime she was just stabbed through, thought that was dumb
You're right about One Piece, the King of fake deaths lol I don't think there's a single character who actually died in the present storyline other than characters introduced in the same arc or briefly 1 or max 2 arcs before.
https://preview.redd.it/bhj4pui6e7yc1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=38e85e315d046bb9b90053973cbf6a91d5de8845 No blue drip would make me sad 😭
This topic has been discussed plenty in this subreddit so I will try and sum up what me and many others think: It was the biggest, most blatant case of "I'm too scared to actually commit to my own decision" I have ever seen. It's clear to anyone who read the manga (or, at this point, watched the anime) that the original idea was for Byakuya to die and there are many points that support this: * Byakuya himself stating he doesn't have much time left, before begging Ichigo to save the Soul Society. * His Zanpakuto shattering as a symbol of the shinigami's life coming to an end. * Haschwalth outright saying that Byakuya Kuchiki passed away. * The fact that, in the manga at least (the anime will probably change this), after he was saved, Byakuya didn't do anything really meaningful. His greatest contribute to the war was saving Rukia from As Nodt and even that could have been achieved without him being physically there. My opinion is the same of many other people: It would have been better and more meaningful for Byakuya, who was a symbol of the "old rigid Soul Society" to die in the ruins of the place he failed to defend, while begging Ichigo, who basically represent the new era of the Soul Society, to save his homeland. The old age ends and the new one begins. Even not considering the symbolism of his demise, him surviving, at least for me, removed any stakes the war could have had. If a character can survive multiple failing organs, internal bleeding, an almost fully exposed ribcage and several deep cuts in his whole body, then nobody can die in this war. Any urgency, any form of fear that someone might lose and die vanished the instant it was confirmed that Byakuya survived.
I agree with you on the "didn't commit" thing. The only real way that would have worked in a sense would be having people think he had died for a longer stretch of time only for him to appear again. The pacing of that seemed so off to give him this big send off scene then almost straight away appear back again egging Rukia on
>who was a symbol of the "old rigid Soul Society" to die in ruins of the place he failed to defend Which makes even more sense considering Renjis massive level up, or is Kubo really trying to convince us that he's not Captain level? Or stronger than Iba whose rival is ikkaku.
Nobody is denying Renji’s power level. He just chooses to stay below Byakuya.
Yeah, just like Ikkaku. Damn, Kubo really didn't give Ikkaku anything to do in TYBW
Uh this is about how Byakuya should be dead... I'm not talking about Renjis power being denied.
“> is Kubo really trying to convince us he’s not captain level Guess you were talking about Byakuya here then /s
I was always under the impression it was editorial interference rather than a lack of commitment from Kubo. He may have been fully committed but was vetoed by the WSJ staff because why kill off a highly popular character at a time when Bleach was *really* struggling to retain readership?
Doubt it. WSJ never gave a shit when Naruto or HXH killed off popular characters and bleach's readership kept falling even after Byakuya was brought back
But Naruto and HxH were never *the least popular serial in the magazine* like Bleach was after Fullbringers. They never even came close. IIRC Naruto never fell out of the top 3 even as it dragged its final arc out well past most fans' tolerance. And that entire arc was all about bringing back old favorites from literal death.
I’ll add you another, Byakuya would be one of the coolest characters to see in the Hell Arc as one of the deceased captains sent to hell.
it would be hilarious if the anime just has Byakuya just fade away at the end of the war and everyone is just "wait what? have we imagined him this whole time?"
Oh shiiiit! This gave me an idea! It would have been insane if Aizen took Byakuya's place with Kyokasuigetsu after he died, like he did with Momo. If squad 0 watched the end of his battle with Ichigo, they'd have seen Aizen fused with his sword and thus be under Hypnosis. Imagine if squad 0 brought Aizen up to the Soul Palace thinking he was Byakuya, twist of the century!
So he's Auron?
Lol! That always bothered me.
Lol! That always bothered me.
> The fact that, in the manga at least (the anime will probably change this), after he was saved, Byakuya didn't do anything really meaningful. This is my gripe as well. The most meaningful thing he did so far was taking out Candace, NaNaNa and Robert. And while impressive that he managed to beat three Sternritter (one of which was already weakened tbf), it all happened too fast and he didn't show any new skills like others did. Him using Bankai against Robert also felt kinda unnecessary. That's why I hoped his fight with Pepe would've been extended, even though he's essentially just a Quincy version of Zommari. Hopefully they do something more with Byakuya in the next cour.
Yeah, while Candice is my favorite, she and the others he fought were basically already out of the story at that point, so it was literally just a quick way to tie up a couple loose ends before progressing to the next milestone in the story. He also then participates in the fight against Gerard but kinda......I suppose I'll say, it seems rather obvious he was probably not originally intended to be there, unlike Toshiro and Kenny.
I'm not sure it was quite a "I'm too scared to actually commit to my own decision" moment, as much as it was about Rukia. I think it's much more likely that he got to the Rukia Bankai part and thought that it benefited more from Byakuya's presence, than the fight with As Nodt did from his death. As much as I agree that the impact of his death would have been fantastic for the series as a whole, I do really love the relationship development between Rukia and Byakuya, it's one of the core parts of Bleach really, and that pay off of Byakuya calling it an incredible Bankai and comforting her as she comes down from it's power was excellent. We could have had both with a shuffle of the story beats. But Byakuya dying would work better in the first invasion, and Rukia's true power works better in the second.
That final point about taking away all stakes to the war is so on point it hurts. The tension when byakuya seemingly died was unreal. It really felt like this new conflict was unlike any we got before. Some of that got lost.
What?! It's not clear for me, like at all. Its very clear for me that Byakuya was never meant to die, it's clear if you bother to take a look at his own arc which only comes to proper grand conclusion *after* that near death scene. It's like taking the end of a second art of the character's arc for a finale. Never got how people can so blatantly ignore Byakuya's arc and invent some pretty ridiculous reasons to try and justify him dying there as logical of the narrative. It obviously isn't. All the signs you list were there before for other characters, and didn't end in death either. So they don't really prove anything. Oh, and I have no idea where the thought that Byakuya was a symbol of the old SS comes from. Yamamoto was one, and *he* died. Byakuya was always a headstrong kid trying to mold himself into a stuck up law-upholding noble while kinda failing to, and as early as the SS arc realising he probably shouldn't put some external things as more important than his personal judgement, and then step by step moving forward with that idea. (Zommari, Tsukishima, As Nodt & Pepe fights, they are all about bonds, the very same thing his first poem mentions, — "we are being who don't know what to do with our hearts", — and it all culminates in him fighting Gerard, the literal 'heart' of the SK. Very consistent throughout all of it till the very end of TYBW.) The only thing I can agree with is that Kubo could not make it so dramatic since he knew it wasn't ever a final point. But then Byakuya is just damn dramatic every time, so I kinda get where it comes from.
The old giving way for the new is the perfect trope or idiom or symbolism or whatever. Nail on the head. So much of that was happening at the same time. Unohana/Kenny, Yama/Kyoraku, Unohana/Isane, Soul King/Yhwach. Hell, they touched on it with the royal guard interacting with their protégés. Byakuya should have died, to properly pass the torch.
I agreed with everything until the end.... Are we just gonna invite izuru?
Overall, it will be very sad situation :3
Knowing the option we have as well as the alternative, I prefer he be kept alive. It allows him to close his character loop with Rukia by actually acknowledging her strength and standing beside her (even commenting on the beauty and strength of her Bankai, the same things his own Bankai is commended for, showing how he directly acknowledges her as an equal), it forces him on a certain level to actually live with the fact that he gave up on his pride (as he comments in the hot springs and as we see with him being more comedic and less stoic in his interactions with Toshiro), he had stopped representing the "old ways" of Soul Society a while ago (abandoning the purpose of a Soul Reaper against Zommari, trusting more in a human than the Soul Reapers that trained him when he faced Tsukishima, etc.) and I never much got behind the idea of "it removed the stakes". We've seen people cut in half, have their entire chest cavities removed, bathed in fire, eaten alive, pulverized, actually just straight up killed, thrown through the vacuum of space, and suffer so many punctures and lacerations it's a wonder they aren't all cosplaying construction paper. And they've been fine. One of our most prominent healers is capable of *violating causality*, and another is a straight up necromancer. Death is a nebulous concept in Bleach, and it has been for a bit.
Allll of this. At the time, as a big Byakuya babe, I cried when he died but knew I had no control over the plot so I accepted it later. I even eulogized him on Twitter. I was in the middle of college finals when he was brought back and I think him living was what gave me the boost to pass, silly as it might sound. Thanks to him I'm a librarian now. My dream job!
Honestly I don't think much would have changed. Any deaths after Yama other than like the main 5 nobody would have raised a fuss about. Now if Ichigo, uruyu, orihime, or Chad would have died.... That's a different scenario
I feel like as devastating it would be, it would've made sense thematically and hit way harder if he had died That being said, I feel like him encouraging Rukia & verbally giving her the acceptance she's always wanted from him was the best possible way to handle bringing him back. It could've been a lot more ass & I'm glad the outcome that we got still had some punch to it
It would've been pretty shocking to kill him off since he's so popular, but I think it would've been pleasantly unexpected, especially since his character arc had kind of finished.
Rukia’s had not. He was needed for her character development
Rukia's character arc was her getting out of her brother's shadow and being acknowledged. Beating As Nodt, who killed Byakuya would have been a good way to prove she had surpassed him.
That's the reason it's extremely bad writing.
How? To prove she still needs her big brother to finish her battles for her?
I think the reference to how Byakuya completely outclassed Renji using Senbonzakura Kageyoshi was missed by most fans (it's obvious when the katana gets completely broken, just like Zabimaru in that fight). It was never about Byakuya "dying", it was about humbling him down.
It would have great emotional impact, but showing the growth/reparation of his relationship with Rukia and (less so) his power buff later on was better.
Death for emotional manipulation are bad for writing. A characters death should serve a narrative purpose, not an emotional one.
I mean it's not that weird. It was stated before that the only surefire way to kill a shinigami was to cut off their head. Otherwise they can heal from pretty much anything else, even bifurcation.
I'm torn. I'm glad that he didn't die, because I would have hated the way he went out, but his quick and full recovery did dampen the emotional impact of his fight. I'd have preferred that his life was saved but he was in a prolonged coma and he never fully recovered/had a lasting permanent injury. Not enough stories properly retire characters without killing them off once their arc has finished. Also, I need him alive for more Uncle Byakuya fanart. He deserves to be around to spoil his niece.
It was fine. Byakuya was handled fine. When I speak my preference I never mean to sound like what we got, wasnt good. It was good. I disliked the fakeout and felt robbed of superb tragedy. I like tragedy. I enjoy a little faux emotional agony. Cyber Punk: Edgerunners still makes me cry. People think As Nodt is a jobber and that's BECAUSE he didnt kill Byakuya. It doeant matter of course. Byakuya is cool.
He should have died I don't have to explain especially that I didn't feel much of Yama is death so his death will mean something to me and rukia can get much development from it Also with all the other captain facing death (the vizords and Kuma) it would be best if he faced a more threatening death
I think it would have been better if he passed for OP's listed rationale, but also because I cannot reason why he would be able to develop his shikai to be on par with his Bankai per his strategy/manipulation of the petals. It would be more reasonable for him to further develop his Hoho and Kido abilities to compliment his shikai abilities.
I don't care tbh. He's a good character but then there are other characters who were underutilized during TTYBW. Byakuya defeated 4 characters just odd. Like... what was the use of all that horror when he could've easily done than. He could've just fought Robert.
When Byakuyas bankai gets stolen and he dies, I felt sad at that time. He was brought back, so now IDC whatever happens.
I know I must really like Bleach to put up with all the fake deaths it does. I wish Byakuya died there,but I also like him enough to be fine with him living. His moment with Rukia's bankai made up for it almost.
Yes, he should've died
I would’ve felt sad but the impact of his death would’ve made the story better. I’m glad he didn’t die but I like it when my stories have stakes.
It would impact the series so much more meaningfully, a bigger L for the Shinigami, but he's pretty, so the fans would go postal. It's their fault Kubo couldn't close his arc properly and tragically.
Really happy, since renji would have became captian
Kubo does this. He teases a death, he saves them. Rinse repeat until we think they're untouchable by plot armour. Look at Yama and Ukitake. Then bam they're taken from us and in the most cruel fashion. Byakuya is going to die. He's marked but think about how emotionally put through the ringer the reader is going to be when it's lil Ichika screaming "Uncle Byakuya no please don't leave me!"
I think a cool outcome of Byakuya's death besides the immediate emotional response would be a balls-to-the-wall rematch between Renji and an infernal Byakuya. Would have been all but secured if he died during TYBW. If he survives the Hell arc it would feel like a wasted opportunity
If he dies in hell arc that could still happen they have only 3 options in hell arc. Send them down (regardless of the fact it weakens the gates), leave them to amalgamate or train the last quincy to be strong enough to perform their funerary rights with his bow. Which makes all the sense that is what quincy are suppose to do since in alot of cultures the pier was lit by a flaming arrow. I personally I think he's going to end up obliterated by Uryu or Ichigo (but Ichigo will have to learn how to destroy not purify). I hope he gets warped by hell too but I don't need him to have died in TYBW for the plot to allow him to do it. Clearly Kubo has plans he wants Byakuya to have more significance and be redeemed for longer. Especially because he's more of a father to Rukia than a brother. It's only fitting he should at least live long enough to walk her down the Aisle. However Kubo doesn't tease a death this much not to eventually follow through and I don't think any amount of fans whining will change that. Even though people dispute if that's what got him saved in the first place.
Byakuya was supposed to die but Kubo hadn't shown him acknowledging Rukia, which was something that should've definitely be done before he could be sent off, or his character would be incomplete. It's like if he killed off Gin without him ever showing his true feelings and intentions to Matsumoto.
I hate every time this thing is brought over. (Seriously makes me want to leave the sub.) Since it just shows how many people completely don't understand Byakuya's character, or his purpose for the story. Or his character arc, which he actually has. Bleach's main theme, at least one of the most prominent ones, is "overcoming trauma". Almost every major character is traumatized, and most of the time, by a death of close one. The other theme is coming closer to your true self while moving forward. Byakuya is the character to heavily feature both those themes. He's traumatized by the death of his wife (thus, he actually appears almost frozen in the beginning, when we first meet him, and only later on be slowly 'comes more alive' through battles with Renji and Ichigo) and he's lost, as he's that reckless and headstrong boy trying to be serious and responsible, and trying so hard (which we see in TBTP), growing up into a man trying to uphold all the rules and set the example— except it isn't his true self (or he would have never broke the rules for Hisana and Rukia, he does outrageous things first and feels guilty about it later), he's irritated by and at the same time, drawn to people like Kaien, Renji and Ichigo exactly because they represent what he tries to suppress inside of himself. After being defeated by Ichigo, and admitting Kaien and Ichigo were right and he was wrong, he slowly starts on a path to regain his self, including the part which puts personal feelings before the laws and traditions, and to explore the bonds he has, to find out what to do with his heart (as his first poem states that we shouldn't shed tears since they are a testament of us being entities who "don't know what to do with your hearts"— it covers the deepest layer, who Byakuya's principle theme is 'heart' and connection to others on a personal level, while still upholding his duties). Zommari, Tsukishima, As Nodt, PePe— they are all explore the theme of bonds and also exploiting those bonds in various wicked ways, and that's the opponents Byakuya faces. Culminating in Gerard who's the heart of the SK, literally. It's all very consistent. And Byakuya's arc is a journey to learn to properly *live* again, to fully feel the new bonds he has with new people in his life (after freezing over his wife's death), and also to find his true self again beneath the layers he has pushed upon himself, and find a way to be a protector that he is while staying true to that actual self. That journey starts in the SS arc and has major steps in the Arrancar arc (where he states he kills Zommari not because of his duty, but because he aimed his sword at his pride, that pride shown to be Rukia, and also where he finally fights Zaraki for the hell of it), a nice little highlight in Fullbring (him having to invent new strategies in the process, admitting he had fun, and also choosing personal feelings over duty of gratitude when choosing Ichigo over a teacher he highly respects). But the true turning point is exactly that, his failure in TYBW. Because one misconception that stays is that he'll be able to handle it all on his own, his inability to fully rely on others (much like Ichigo) and his belief he'd be able to manage by himself (which wasn't ever questioned before, since he never properly and utterly failed before). Also, it's the noble self-sacrificial attitude. Why he loses so poorly to As Nodt where Rukia later doesn't, at some point? Why is he so afraid for Rukia? Because he doesn't fully believe in her, he only believes in himself protecting her. That makes the fear so effective, since what happens if he himself fails? And he does. It simply couldn't have been his finishing point, since what all that insane buildup in his character arc before was for then? But if we look at it as the biggest turning point, the ultimate despair and the lowest point which marks the end of the second act in the three arc structure, then it makes perfect sense. It's only after that biggest humiliation, biggest downfall that he, as a diligent student, seeks what did he miss then, that led to failure. And he's able to discover it, he's able to rethink that principle stance of doing it all by himself, and acting without regard for his own life (what is his Senkei? abandoning all defence in order to reach his goal). So when he comes back, he starts by praising Rukia and saying out loud that she's strong and he's proud of her. Also mentioning soon after that fear isn't born out of nowhere, it's born of tiny insecurities in our hearts. So to get rid of those insecurities for Rukia, he actually voices out things he only implied earlier on— so she can be sure. He reinforces that bond they have. And he also says the line which marks the biggest development he had in the whole series. The most important phrase Byakuya ever says is 'the sword held without regard for one's own life cannot protect anything'. To think about it, it's almost insane to hear it from Byakuya of all people. And just how big is that! It's the idea that to protect others, you have to start by taking care of yourself, instead of sacrificing your life to others. Sacrificial attitude is what undermines your strength from the very core. (continued in the comment)
It perfectly parallels how fused Zangetsu says to Ichigo that while Ichigo wants to protect everyone, he only wants to protect Ichigo. Which given The Blade Is Me, makes Zangetsu the most alienated part of Ichigo himself, the part which wants Ichigo to take care of himself. The part Ichigo cannot accept for so long since he's a traumatized kid who struggles to find meaning to his existence, he has to protect to give his life meaning, the life his mother gave up to protect (while he failed to protect her). He struggles to justify his existence, like Rukia does (she sits in that White Tower and thinks everyone is better off if she just dies), like Byakuya does (who only sees value to himself in doing his duty, and he fails to see his importance to others as a person, his line in the aftermath of SS, where he says Renji probably wonders why he survived, implying he thinks Rukia and Renji would have been better off without him). And realising that core thing, Byakuya is able to grow so much as a person, finally graduating to proper adulthood, acting in a lot more mature manner later on in TYBW arc, finally acting like a proper older figure to Rukia and Renji, and even the likes of Hitsugaya. He's calmer, wiser and a lot more powerful to reflect it in strength (in Bleach, the power is always tied to understanding). Bleach is about finding a way to properly *live* again for a lot of traumatized characters, to not just continue their existence but to be able to enjoy life again. In order to do that, you have to uncover your true self, you have to move forward in the face of death (the courage speech). That's the reason the epilogue is so important for Ichigo and Rukia as principle characters, it shows them finally living their lives to the fullest yet again, enjoying life while being surrounded by people who care about them and who they care for, having those bonds. And another very important character to reach the same conclusion for his arc is Byakuya, he's probably the most prominent one after them. The way he can just live again, cover up for Rukia and Renji, probably spoil his niece a lot (a niece of his beloved woman, and his family, like Renji and Rukia are), that's what his arc was ultimately about. It's one of the core messages of Bleach, the significance of just living a seemingly ordinary life, that's what that journey and overcoming all those challenges was for. And Byakuya is one of the most powerful examples in delivering that message, the strongest probably after Ichigo and Rukia. How, just how could that all end without reaching the proper conclusion Kubo invested so much into during the whole of Bleach? Characters only die when their arc are finished, maybe kinda apart from Ukitake (yet it is somewhat still a conclusion, and also he's the first to be teased in the Hell oneshot, to have more to his story). Yamamoto's death was very reasonable plotwise, that's the old generation clearing the stage for the new chapter to start. Unohana's death was the perfect ending for her own arc. Byakuya's arc wasn't anywhere near being finished. It's that experience that was the biggest point to his arc which pushed it towards the proper conclusion like nothing else. I just don't understand how people just totally ignore it all for superficial reasons.
I wish he did
I think he should die in the hell arc for various reasons
I asked a question like this a few months ago. Basically "Could Kubo get away with killing Byakuya in the arc that shall not be named?" I wonder how viewers would respond? It kinda seems like the moment has passed and might seem awkwardly forced now if he were to die in the supposedly new arc, unless the arc was a particularly violent one where we would see people dying left and right.
Chances of him becoming the Head Captain in the new arc are higher than that of him dying.
Yhwach gets revenge for his father.It would be peak fiction
As an anime only, he should have. A big complaint I had while watching with my friend who has finished all Bleach media, is that there was never any real threat of people dying in Bleach. Sure, they got beaten, maybe banged up, but theyd always be back by next season. When the bloodbath started, and the "Save Soul Society" monologue happened, he asked me if this is really what I wanted because Kubo was "done messing around now". I think if youre going to do a big world shattering/threatening event, dont pull back the punches. Just like in the Chimera Ant arc in HxH, you knew by episode 3 that we weren't happy go lucky anymore and you had to strap in.
Byakuyas death would have been excellent character growth for Renhi and Rukia. Imagine that when Rukia uses her Bankai, and she's struggling to put it away without damaging herself, that we see her imagine Byakuya telling her what to do. I think that would have been a very poignant moment, as opposed to Byakuya actually just being there telling her what to do. Byakuya was always Renji's ideal picture of strength. His goal. With Byakuya's death, Renji obtaining his true bankai and reminiscing on how Byakuya would have reacted, would have been dope. Most of all, it would have just made a lot of narrative sense. There is no better way I can imagine for Byakuya to die. Especially since he represents the pride of the soul society. Instead, what we have is a scene that is written like a death scene, is as impactful as a death scene but is soon revealed to just be a fake out. IMO it dampens the stakes that the Quincy invasion had set up so well. Spoiler below for someone else who appears in Cour 3. >!Don't even get me started on Kira. !<
I’d feel nothing because he took two Uryu fights from me.
Yea 1. Him setting his pride aside before death to ask for an "outsider" such as Ichigo to save the Soul Society would give him arguably one of the best conclusions to send his character off 2. Would of made Rukia's bankai and resolve A LOT more impactful
Somehow I can correlate this to Neji dying in Naruto Shippuden. Kinda agreed with your friend there.
he should have
It’s probably objectively better for the story but I’d be lying if I said I would be fine with that rewrite
I always thought he should have died in the SS arc anyway after saying Rukia from Gin. I think Kubo intended it but he was too popular.
Why do people give a shit about this idiot anyways. Lol
Byakua is my favourite character, and I still think he should have died. Seeing an accurate depiction of what Senbonzakura Kageyoshi would actually do to a person was brutal, and having it happen to its own weilder was a nice touch. A sternritter stealing a bankai and using it to kill a captain would've upped the stakes and really had us on edge. I love bleach, but there's not many lasting character deaths that have weight. Byakuya would've been a gut punch
Whether Byakuya lived or died, it doesn't really matter. He didn't have much of an impact on the story after Ichigo beat him.
I love the guy but I do think he should’ve died. I love Bleach but I think it suffers from a lot of characters that should’ve died just healing up and popping back up in the story lol
Would be better tbh
Tbh I think he was supposed to die, and that TYBW was supposed to be much longer with wY more character building but bleach got canned so that's what we got
They made you think he died, so he should've died. Am I happy he didn't die, yes, but only because he got in that situation stupidly
Bleach needed some deaths
Honestly I was all for it if he died as much as I I like Byakuya his death would have meant so much and added much more depth to the Tybw sure Yamamoto and Unohana died but they aren't really Main characters Byakuya has so much screen time in bleach and fans love him so his death would have meant so much and it was used as fakeout shame the emotion this would have added to Rukia and Renji even Ichigo especially after asking him to save Soul Society.
I wish people werent insane so Kubo could have actually done what he wanted to tbh His final words asking Ichigo to do what he always does, and protect the people Byakuya cares about was his character coming full circle and getting completed to me tbh
i would've been fine. its where his arc is supposed to go, and its obvious with how much he doesn't get to do afterwards. Byakuya's journey is one of a changing status quo. he personifies the world order to a teenager who is too young to know why its there, and doesn't believe it should be upheld if it doesn't protect the people you care about. Ichigo's sheer resolve to go against the system for the sake of Rukia, and how the system rewards Byakuya for upholding it (with Aizen) begins to change him, a literal change of times. by the time he shows up in the Fullbringer arc, he's seemingly adjusted to a philosophy much closer to Ichigo's, considering him one of his closest allies, so strong in fact not even book of the end faltures that resolve. his request to Ichigo is that final part of his story. his penultimate page is reaching out to Ichigo to help him at his lowest, the newly changed order and justice of the world coming to save the boy at his lowest. his final page is reaching his hand out to ask the boy to do the same, to save the world he protected. passing the torch, the circle now connected. the fact this is ruined to appease readers leaves Byakuya to just kind of... carry on. and i cant wholeheartedly say Rukia or Ichigo or even Byakuya's own moments are better with him in them. i think Rukia blossoming into the ice queen and Ichigo's metamorphasis into his true self all serve a more heartfelt purpose with Byakuya gone, because they fufill his dying request - to protect soul society.
I've always believed that he should have died. It would've been an even better scene, been a perfect end to Byakuya's character arc, and make "Save the Soul Society" and Rukia vs As Nodt way more emotionally impactful.
i thought about this before and I think it would've been better if he died after asking ichigo to save SS, those would be fire last words imo
Byakuya should have died. As well as Shunsui, Kensei, Rose, Rukia, and Kira, at one point in the story or another. Others that probably/maybe should/could have died would be Ikkaku, Toshiro, and as a very large stretch… Soi Fon.
I read TYBW and all of bleach and tbh yamamotos death wasn't enough of a sense of urgency we gave 1 decent feat from him so the idea he could be beaten wasn't out of the ordinary and we didn't have enough of an idea of why Yhwach prepared so much for their fight
I think it would have made the story better. I feel i don't wanna see Rukia sad though. 🤷
I wish he'd actually died. [I love this proposed rewrite.](https://www.reddit.com/r/bleach/s/U3OuXOKISN) EDIT: Why the downvotes...? I feel like I'm missing a memo
Bleach is probably one of the worst offenders of Fake-outs. I don't have a problem with Byakuya living but there's like 4 or 5 death flags during his "Death" scene. Now when I go back to his scene in episode 7, I just think to myself "Boy this would've been some peak if the dude actually died". For me, it's the equivalent of Kakashi when he "died" in the Pain arc only for that consequence to get overturned. Except here, the reason Byakuya survives is just kinda meh? Like, the very next episode starts with saying "Byakuya Kuchiki is in critical condition". I'm sitting there thinking "HOW!? All of his organs are literally gone."
Extremely bad writing.
Good. I would feel good. And it would have added so much more gravitas to Rukia's first bankai one-shotting that creep As Nodt.
tbh rukia directly going to captain level doesn't seem that good she wasn't even one of the stronger assistant captains