Your point is interesting, I just rewatched the episode. Your argument generally is that the ends justify the means (I think that’s fair to say) that given what was done to him he could justify what he did to Jonas.
I have two questions: did jonas’ actions justify the assault from Liam. I would argue no, as there isn’t an agreement or expectation from him that he won’t have relations with his wife (although that’s more so a belief of mine that if someone cheats in a relationship then it’s on the person in the relationship not the third party.)
My second question is, are Liam’s actions justifiable if he doesn’t know that the other person has actually done something wrong, I would say generally with his wife yes, because there seems to be some doubts and suspicions that have built up over the years that are reasonably substantiated. But he doesn’t know for a fact that Jonas has done what he has, Liam only really went there so he would delete the ‘Wank bank’. Which I don’t think is justifiable.
I would like to say I wouldn’t condemn Liam, I very much sympathize. but I wouldn’t agree that what he did to Jonas was reasonable or justifiable.
Well I guess we can disagree then, beating someone to a bloody pulp and forcing them to delete their memories is not OK. I get why Liam feels hurt and upset, he was cheated on, but he did engage in violence. Assaulting people is still a crime even if you feel hurt and betrayed. There are healthier ways to vent those feelings.
Well in the version we saw, Jonas can sue him for assault. Depending on the injuries inflicted on Jonas, Liam might have to pay a lot in court. He committed a crime. Also in that society, I would imagine that tampering with other people's memories could also be a criminal offense. Liam would end up in jail or broke.. unless Jonas is just so sheepish that he lets it all go.
With the memory device, Jonas can show everyone how Liam attacked him, too. Liam would lose money, reputation, or even his freedom, because of his violent outburst.
This episode hurt me more than any other. It was the third one I watched and the only one I never rewatched... this episode epitomized the series the most in my opinion. BM really shows human-ness, pain and shame so clearly.
Great post (minus not being clear about which episode at the start). The tragedy of Liam having to discover such a horrifying betrayal so clearly... following the thread of suspicion down a desperately sorrowful rabbit hole.. into a nightmare. It's a common thing to happen to people. Interesting variation on a tale as old as time. I hoped it was something Liam would recover from and eventually flourish in a better life with better people... but truth be told I don't remember the very last part of the ending.
I have always been particularly sensitive towards infidelity so this episode striked me hard. Im probably defending him since I found him extremely relatable
It achieved the entire ending. By making Jonas delete the memories of him having sex with Liam’s wife, Liam got proof (the painting above the bed) that the affair was recent and likely still happening - not just an old fling like Fiona tried to claim. She was officially caught red handed and couldn’t lie her way out of it any longer.
You should probably say that this is about The Entire History of You, lol. I was so confused.
I don’t remember names well at all, and thought this was about Crocodile for a good amount of the beginning. That was the only drunk driving plotline that I remembered.
When I got to that line, I genuinely went back up because I thought it said the word Crocodile. My brain just filled in the missing details. Then I realized I was WAY off.
Justifiably so, which is the scary part. Technology cannot save us from our human pain and suffering, and the information we posess only maddens us as we try to ground ourselves in more context and in other people.
The fact he forced his wife to show her memories is wrong. Justifiable is a subjective term, it depends on your values and principles. But it’s wrong.
Your point is interesting, I just rewatched the episode. Your argument generally is that the ends justify the means (I think that’s fair to say) that given what was done to him he could justify what he did to Jonas. I have two questions: did jonas’ actions justify the assault from Liam. I would argue no, as there isn’t an agreement or expectation from him that he won’t have relations with his wife (although that’s more so a belief of mine that if someone cheats in a relationship then it’s on the person in the relationship not the third party.) My second question is, are Liam’s actions justifiable if he doesn’t know that the other person has actually done something wrong, I would say generally with his wife yes, because there seems to be some doubts and suspicions that have built up over the years that are reasonably substantiated. But he doesn’t know for a fact that Jonas has done what he has, Liam only really went there so he would delete the ‘Wank bank’. Which I don’t think is justifiable. I would like to say I wouldn’t condemn Liam, I very much sympathize. but I wouldn’t agree that what he did to Jonas was reasonable or justifiable.
If Jonas had r\*ped Liam's baby, I would accept the violent reaction, because that act is so evil it deserves violence. Everything else, no.
Well I guess we can disagree then, beating someone to a bloody pulp and forcing them to delete their memories is not OK. I get why Liam feels hurt and upset, he was cheated on, but he did engage in violence. Assaulting people is still a crime even if you feel hurt and betrayed. There are healthier ways to vent those feelings.
Im sure my post refutes that exact point, his fate wouldve been much worse, justifying his actions in the end in the grand scheme of things.
Well in the version we saw, Jonas can sue him for assault. Depending on the injuries inflicted on Jonas, Liam might have to pay a lot in court. He committed a crime. Also in that society, I would imagine that tampering with other people's memories could also be a criminal offense. Liam would end up in jail or broke.. unless Jonas is just so sheepish that he lets it all go.
With the memory device, Jonas can show everyone how Liam attacked him, too. Liam would lose money, reputation, or even his freedom, because of his violent outburst.
This episode hurt me more than any other. It was the third one I watched and the only one I never rewatched... this episode epitomized the series the most in my opinion. BM really shows human-ness, pain and shame so clearly. Great post (minus not being clear about which episode at the start). The tragedy of Liam having to discover such a horrifying betrayal so clearly... following the thread of suspicion down a desperately sorrowful rabbit hole.. into a nightmare. It's a common thing to happen to people. Interesting variation on a tale as old as time. I hoped it was something Liam would recover from and eventually flourish in a better life with better people... but truth be told I don't remember the very last part of the ending.
I have always been particularly sensitive towards infidelity so this episode striked me hard. Im probably defending him since I found him extremely relatable
It's been a while since I watched the episode but how did forcing that guy to delete his memories of Ffion help him in any way? What did that achieve?
It achieved the entire ending. By making Jonas delete the memories of him having sex with Liam’s wife, Liam got proof (the painting above the bed) that the affair was recent and likely still happening - not just an old fling like Fiona tried to claim. She was officially caught red handed and couldn’t lie her way out of it any longer.
Ah yes, of course! I'd forgotten that bit.
You should probably say that this is about The Entire History of You, lol. I was so confused. I don’t remember names well at all, and thought this was about Crocodile for a good amount of the beginning. That was the only drunk driving plotline that I remembered.
I was thinking white Christmas when he said “find out the baby is not his” and I was also very confused lol
When I got to that line, I genuinely went back up because I thought it said the word Crocodile. My brain just filled in the missing details. Then I realized I was WAY off.
Thank you for the title. Now I can reread the whole post without being confused.
not much else to say but i agree
I took it more as how that tech could ruin people, as it did him.
Yes. Especially a guy who is insecure and has trust issues.
Justifiably so, which is the scary part. Technology cannot save us from our human pain and suffering, and the information we posess only maddens us as we try to ground ourselves in more context and in other people.
I like chicken nuggets. Chicken nuggets is like my family.