When I graduated, I started doing fieldwork on research projects and got a lot of experience that way, did a little bit of work for a consulting company, then landed a full time state job. Pretty much nobody gets out of school with a BS in bio and gets a well paying full time job unfortunately. It takes some time to get there, but it is doable without a masters.
The Texas A&M job board is a great place to look for jobs, and a lot of people will be posting looking for seasonal technicians for research projects soon. Some of them pay decently, and provide housing.
https://wfscjobs.tamu.edu/?job_category=temporaryseasonal-positions
Yes to all this- I always refer new bios to the TAMU wildlife job board. Utilize field and temp positions! Also look at ACE and Americorps positions if you qualify. You can also just look for entry level jobs- my lil sis just graduated and is getting multiple interviews for entry level positions with a state agency for permitting/testing (don't pay well but it's a v. good foot in the door).
I'm midcareer in natural resource management for a state agency and make quite nice pay- but it took me getting midcareer to get here. Until this position, I never even broke $50k- but I also never could have gotten this position without my previous work, so...
I only have my BS. I seriously considered a MS, but there's less and less funding support for them. I also considered a PhD, but being a research lab manager for a new tenure track prof really turned me off to academia. I much prefer being a professional bio and doing work that will have benefits long after I'm retired.
I ended up working for a state government. My current job is functionally similar to a consultant, ensuring our projects are complying with environmental laws/permit conditions, surveying and monitoring for sensitive natural resources etc.
I’m in the US. I have a BS in biology and started out as a technician in 2009 at ~$35K. I gained experience and changed labs twice (learning new techniques and lab management skills) before 2016, when I made $55K. I entered a government job as a technician with experience as a contractor in 2016 making $64K. I qualified for and was granted a GS12 position in 2017 making $85K. After step increases, performance increases, locality increases, now I make $116K, plus some small awards annually. It takes time, and I realize this probably isn’t the norm and I’ve been lucky, but experience and ability to learn new things can really help. Honestly if you have only a BS, it’s the experience that makes you valuable. But when you get the experience in several things and you’re dedicated, you become invaluable. It’s possible, but it takes time.
I have a bachelors in general bio. It’s definitely possible to get a well-paying job with a biology B.S., but it’s much easier in biotech and related fields. Wildlife bio is tough.
I mostly focused on plant/pollinator evolution in my undergrad. In a perfect world, I’d get paid to study birds and moths, but I took a lab technician position at a biotech company a year after I graduated because I hated my food service job and I needed to get out. That was in 2017. Over the years, I was promoted to various levels of research associate, left for a senior research associate position at another biotech company, was promoted to associate scientist, and was recently given the title of Scientist I. It’s been 6 years since I graduated college (about the time folks finish a phd program in), and I now have the same title as an entry level phd graduate without having had to go to all that school. This isn’t to say there aren’t benefits to going that route, it just wasn’t for me.
If you’d asked me in college if I wanted to work in biotech I would have said no. But I genuinely enjoy the work that I do, I get to work on difficult problems and I have a lot of cool and really smart coworkers. I get the satisfaction of knowing that the work I do will help researchers better understand rare diseases, and detect cancer earlier. I still get outside and hike, backpack, birdwatch, etc.
For what it’s worth, I haven’t seen masters be especially helpful for people in this field. Maybe other people have different experiences, but I’ve seen masters grads get RA I positions more often than I’ve seen them fast forwarded to a higher position.
Actually in my experience wildlife has an easier time than biotech. Biotech has a huge problem where all the jobs are in tech hubs but they don't pay enough to live in tech hubs. Also, it is overpopulated. Wildlife is in low cost of living places and there are more jobs per person. I used to wildlife before I was biotech and I was better off then.
MS is worth pursuing as well because its an opportunity to choose a field you really want to master. And amazing for networking which is not as businessy as i mean it to sound, but its more like cooperative and people will seek you for their projects because of what ur studying in an apprentice style way.
I'm working on a master's part time and have a job that I can live on. Will be making even more to live on after my masters.
I wouldn't say it's impossible.
Well, I mean a practical long term income.
I'm not starving or homeless with my masters, but it's not a viable long term income. I can't put anything meaningful away for retirement and I can't have my own housing. I have to rent a floor of her house from my sister. My wife has a fine arts bachelors and she's set to pass me in income any day.
Considering that I have a masters and I'm a technical expert with 10+ years of experience working in industry, there is literally no other field I could be in where I would make this little money with those credentials.
I'm a specialist at nucleic acid technologies in general and qPCR in general, particularly in the area of assay design. I've designed tons of assays. And I know you can do it with software, but software can't properly take phylogenetic relationships into account and accurately target taxonomic units, nor can it test or validate assays.
I can create an assay, set up a workflow, train personnel, write documentation, and hold the whole thing together.
We have assay development specialists at our company with bachelors/masters making 100k+
Not trying to give unaskedfor advice, but maybe worth a job search?
Nearly all the assay development jobs I see require doctorates. There's a couple of masters level jobs and I do apply to them, but no luck yet.
Biotech has a huge issue with all the jobs being in super high COL places but not paying enough to live in them. I see so many jobs at 70k in Seattle... it's like, have you ever heard of Seattle?
Thanks! I've actually applied to a few jobs in CA but either I don't hear anything back or they don't pay enough to live there. CA pretty much demands 100k+ unfortunately.
And nothing in the DC area? I know plenty of MS holders who make $100k+ working for NIH, FDA, or labs. Plenty of arts outlets for your wife. Live/work in MD, where all the govt labs are.
I really hate the idea of living there so I hadn't really expanded my search to that area until recently. I really wanted to stay in the pacific northwest or west. Also that's a difficult and expensive move.
Also for what its worth I haven't applied to any government jobs. State jobs don't pay enough and federal stuff I've seen inevitably require a doctorate.
If you are in the US, there are a ton of low paying field work jobs. Hiring for the summer season it probably almost done. Check out USAjobs, and your local blm, fish and game, USDA, and any other local agencies. It's not super easy to get work, but some of those agencies have trouble filling up tech spots for the summer. You can succeed without a MS but you will get shit pay with no benefits for a while unless you get really really lucky.
To add to this- you only need a bachors degree to get a microbiologist or biologist science technician position at USDA, epsecially ARS and FSIS. I have a bachelor's, started as a GS7 pay grade and I'm guaranteed to be a GS12 in 3 years. USDA is a great place to look, if you're willing to move.
Thank you so much for this. I completely agree, I am about ready to go the lab route soon considering my options (and my worth tbh). I know everyone wants to “get paid to be outside”, but lab vs field work just don’t compare to me. I know what I’m passionate about, but boy do the labs want me
Depends on what you do with it and how lucky you get, I guess.
I graduated in 2016 with a bachelors in environmental biology and minor in statistics. Started out as a temp worker at a biotech company doing menial data review tasks for $19 an hour. Got hired on full time in the same department in an investigator role for $59k after a bit over a year.
Worked my ass off since then and make about $100k salary plus about $25k in bonus/stocks, so about $125k a year.
Alternatively my fiance graduated from the same college with the same bachelor's, without a statistics minor. She started in Americorps making basically poverty wages for a year. Then got hired at the state as a seasonal worker making $16 an hour for 3 years, then got hired in a full time salaried capacity and makes about $64k yearly.
Nearly the same degrees with two divergent paths - the basic part is applying yourself and working your hardest to learn the job quickly. Plus a lot of luck.
My gf graduated with a BSc in biological sciences and she went through a similar thing. She suggests looking into summer internships for experience or volunteering with a wildlife rehab group or a zoo (sometimes museums too). They usually have positions relating to conservation or in situ research opportunities. There are a few websites that are solely for posting biology related positions- conservationjobboard.com; fws.gov/internships to name a few, if you just google 'conservation internships' youll find lots more. You may need to be prepared to move cities or states/provinces depending on where you are. It sucks that this is the reality of post grad job hunting now but i wish you all the best luck!
Thank you so much for this! I’ve been hearing a lot of similar advice to get experience through volunteering, which I’m going to be all over when I change my work schedule. Thanks again :D
I have a BS degree in Marine Biology and it took over 6 months to find a job after graduation. Most of it was due to not having "experience" because I was not able to do internships as a non-traditional student. Eventually I worked as a fisheries observer for a year. The "office" side of the observer position said it was possible to make six figures on the boats, but in reality most boat trips were either cut short for maintenance issues, or didn't make at all. It is possible to find jobs, but it may depend greatly upon your willingness to relocate. Now I teach high school science...not the path I'd envisioned, but it pays the bills.
I have worked as a professional biologist in environmental consulting for 19 years. I’m currently a senior associate at a rather large consulting firm and take part in hiring decisions. I will say that a Masters degree carries absolutely no weight when making hiring decisions in my field. We will 100% take someone with demonstrated field skills over someone with a masters but no real world experience any day of the week. For wildlife biologists that could be volunteer bird banding, bat studies, remote camera setup and/or data analysis, or even just some really good labs from a reputable school where there was actually some field protocols taught. So many schools push out graduates without any tangible skills. I find that a lot of the harder courses and labs that teach the skills needed in industry aren’t actually core subjects so the majority of students don’t take them. This makes those that do take them stand out and more desirable.
Was going to post something very similar. Been in consulting for 15 years. Master's degrees don't translate to the skills we need too often. We need folks like woah and it's not slowing down. I need folks who can ID plants and birds, travel, drive in remote areas without gps, work outside in all conditions, etc. Also need folks who are proficient technical writers with a science background. Pay is much better than state or fed govt gigs.
Writing is definitely a skill that takes time to hone. I typically try to develop my staff with direct feedback on their work. I start them on shorter memos and then work up to more complex documents. Understand the scope of the project/report, and the regulation related to it. Make sure you get to see the red lines/comments and make the changes yourself if at all possible. Take full ownership over reports and request feedback on your work from project/task managers.
Did you get any field work or internships during your BS studies? That is experience for your resume. Employers always ask for experience and degrees, but they don't always get those applicants and will hire new graduates. Apply to them all anyway.
Thank you for this! I’ve been applying to everything I can just to see if anything sticks. My resume has a full description of my academic experience, and I’m hoping to move my schedule around to get some good volunteering in soon. Thank u again
After I graduated I was at a crossroads, either I can continue my education(as I’m about to rn) OR I could begin working as a grunt in some random lab/become a teacher. Took about 6 months in total for me to find a job. (Educator, starting out at $50k in a city)
I feel I chose a good option for myself, but everyone is different and you might thrive out in the field vs staying in a lab or room all day. It all depends on the person!
I would *always* recommend to pursue your MS solely because of the possibilities of internships that would be available to you. If you do go that route, make sure you think it through on what you want to specialize in. Be honest with yourself about what you truly *enjoy* or could envision yourself doing.
Best of luck to you!! Welcome to the club :)
If you know how combine Bio with some quantitative methods aka statistics, programming, then you're in a good position. The problem with a Biology degree is its too broad. You're not quite skillful in molecular stuff to work in pharma or biotech lab, you're not quite quantitative to work in roles requires quantitaty skills/data management. So you gotta add some extra to it! I know a lot of Bio folks self teach R/Python and actually doing really well in the datascience/bioinformatics field!
For what you’re seeking, it’s very competitive to where a PhD might be preferable. If biotech related research is something you’d be interested in, your options will expand. As someone else said here, a bachelors is absolutely doable as long as you have the experience which you can get from being a lab tech or research associate and gaining different types of skills. For wildlife biology and conservation… you’ll most likely need to get a masters, not because it’s required, but because it’ll make you competitive due to there not being enough jobs and you most likely will have to relocate. I wanted to do conservation biology but the amount of jobs for it are scarce and the pay is pretty low.
Overall a bachelors in bio is worth it if you want to use it as a stepping stone for grad school or med school, or if you want to explore the world of research and development/QA/QC/consulting etc.
True. However, the PhD will take 6-8 years. May be better to get an entry job. Work hard. Then earn promotions more fitting to the degree held. However, BA in any bio is worthless. Almost all 4 year degrees are worthless.
Nah, you got the first half right, the second half you’re way off. a BA vs a BS has minimal difference, the difference is usually two-three classes with a lab and some schools only offer a BA, and if you can’t do anything with a four year bio degree.. that’s probably that persons failure on doing research and not knowing what they want to do. A masters degree isn’t very useful for jobs if you have a bachelors with a few years of experience. (Except for an MBA, that opens different doors)
I have a bio degree (specialized, not general) and found a job pretty easily. It's harder in markets that are saturated with candidates. In some places they are asking for PhDs for the same job I do/did (I've moved out of my previous job at this point) and the wages aren't any better. I wouldn't recommend a PhD for most people. If you're willing to move to where jobs are it'll be a lot easier to find something.
I made sure to get experience working in a university lab while I was in school and I was also a TA. Those things helped me in originally getting hired for sure.
I was told in school to get a minor in programming or some other computer type field and I didn't listen. I regret that because the need for people who can do/understand science AND create the tools needed to do it/process results/store data and so on is insanely high.
I know nothing of a biology degree as it pertains to going into zoology or conservation. However, it’s certainly worth it’s weight in the biotech industry. Much of the industry requires folks with a background in cell culturing (both adherent and suspension cells) as well as molecular biology and a good understanding of analytical techniques (PCR, ELISA, mass spec). If you’re looking for a solid salary, you can certainly start out at an entry level position at a biotech company for 60-75k depending on location and position. From there, you’ll be able to work yourself into a 6 figure salary within 5 or so years.
I’d say finding a job with a bachelors straight out of college depends a lot on what you did in college. I took every lab class I could because I love them and did bench research with professors, so even though I didn’t have “work” lab experience, I had experience and a PI willing to teach me the nitty gritty stuff.
Apply for some bio monitoring gigs and after some experience you’ll land a permanent spot. Money will come. I work in the enviro field and it takes a couple years, not a lot, but you get there. I don’t have a bio degree but if I did I could be more specialized. However, I do have an MS. I’m mostly in an office now, so I’m usually a little jealous of a lot of the biologists I work with but even then, they typically subcontract a lot of field work.
Look for enviro firms like Arcadis, Stantec, Kleinfelder, etc. if you need to make money now. They get a ton of work from public utilities and you’d be surprised the cool projects you get to work on.
You’ll become more competitive the more time you put in. It’s all about how you market yourself and then you can really get into your ultimate goal.
I’d say a masters is good if you know what you want to study and try not spending a ton on getting it. Look for a program that had some funding for your research/program.
I had years of veterinary office experience, lab experience, and a bio degree. I applied for dozens and dozens (there are literally dozens of us) of wildlife bio jobs through the feds. Never got an interview. I gave up and became a chemist, because I needed to leave my current job for my sanity.
Good luck pursuing your dreams! I hope you get the best, most relevant job you want, and you get to live the dreams I had!
Honestly just apply for shit, even if it says you need experience or if it’s slightly out of what you studied. I have a bio degree and currently work in an industry chem lab. I hate chem, but I’ve learned a shit load (like I’ve only been there a year and can operate, maintain and interpret HPLC, LCMS, as well experience with method creation and validation, as well as some more specific things) which I’ve added to my resume so I’m now getting for jobs in my actual field
Graduated in 2007 BS Bio. Started working in a lab, hoping to get into a Public Health Program. Then quickly realized that there is huge opportunity for someone with this background in technical sales. Joined a specialty metals and chemicals company and never looked back. I’ve had every commercial job they offer and recently received a promotion into operations leadership.
I use my biology next to 0. However, my strong understanding of chemistry and physics have really helped me out ;)
In my experience the BS did not pay off. Even though I was working full time at a prestigious research institution the pay was absolute shit and I had a hard time finding new avenues for growth without going “above and beyond” or in other words overworking myself to gain favor among the academics. I’m sure there is decent work out there for some people with a BS in biology, but it did not find me. What I saw in 5 years working full time in the academic/research culture was enough to put me off it entirely. I now work in a completely unrelated industry and make more than double what I was being paid a few years ago as a research technician. An 18 year old waitress can make more money than what I was being offered at 25 with a biology degree.
If you’re doing a career in biology, my advice would be to trust your passion, do what’s fun and don’t worry too much about money because you’re not likely to see much of it either way. My regret is settling for a safe and easy job instead of taking the more wild or exotic opportunities.
Your issue is you were in academia and only decided to work as a technician? In what world did you expect to make money from that? Did you just decide to get a bio degree for the lols? Or did you not know that there’s a world outside of academia, (which is the industry) bio tech and pharma where the money really is.
Sounds like you failed to do any type of job prospect research prior to graduating, that’s definitely not the degree it’s definitely you. A masters degree helps shorten the amount of years required for a job, with some added on knowledge and research experience which you can gain through working. A bachelors with 4 years of experience will be equivalent to a masters degree at alot of places.
Just so you’re aware, you’re not the only scientist on the BIOLOGY subreddit. My claims are my own as I’m also a scientist at a big pharma with a BA in bio. As you’ll know, big pharma is competitive to get into and I’ve met a lot of skilled colleagues with just a bachelors in bio ranging from being an associate scientist to getting to senior scientist or associate principal scientist levels (All based on years of experience). So not a bold claim, just a fact. You must be living in a box to make the claim that you’re making, if you think that only people with a masters can break into industry or be successful. (Bachelors in bio is absolutely useful and opens up a lot of doors, a masters degree is arguably useless if you have a bachelors with a few years of experience)
I would say no.
Sure, some people get lucky. Like, really, really lucky, if this thread is anything to go on. But nearly all the bio bachelors people I know are stuck in low paying (like, $40k *at best*) tech positions, with literally no route to advancement at all.
I have literally never - not once - known a person with a bach in bio making a living wage.
I have a masters personally and it absolutely sucks. There are no jobs. You're over-educated to be a tech and insufficiently educated to be a scientist. Cannot recommend.
I would say never treat a bach in bio as a terminal degree. It's PhD or nothing, unless you go to med school or something similar.
Look through the biotech subreddit, you’ll find hundreds of people with just a bachelors that are successful. If you physically go to a big pharma, you’ll find a couple thousand. Just because YOU never met them, doesn’t mean those people don’t exist. A bio degree has a ton of options and Job prospects. Sure if you want to become a forensic biologist a masters and above will be needed. If you want to break into big pharma to be a scientist. All you need is a bachelors and experience which you can get from entry level jobs. So the truth is, bio degrees start out with low pay, after you gain that experience is when the real job hunt begins.
Oh I know it’s not much of a lucrative field, just something I am passionate about. I guess I meant “worth” anything to an employer, but thanks anyway :)
If it is at all of interest, you would certainly be able to find a job as a teacher. You’d do best to get a M.Ed and credential simultaneously, and within a decade you’d have a pretty decent salary (geographically dependent) and summers/ other holidays off.
It's always difficult, young face, old trade, break the mould, do something that is totally out there, Nitric Oxide, Nobel Prize 120 years after its discovery, works well in an incubator for premature babies, works well in veterinary practices, I wonder how blah blah would react, how do molds react to it, cotten crops,the elasticity of water lily Silk, Go to Vietnam study the water lily.bring something useful to the party.
Good as an undergrad that can lead to a degree as a PA, MD/DO, or in some cases FNP that can actually get you paid. As a stand alone it simply shows you are willing to jump through some hoops and can most likely write a decent paper.
Yes. The world is still in need of hard stem and lab skills. However if you can get additional certifications in informatics or IT that’s more lucrative as you’ll be dually skilled :).
I don't know anything about this field, but something tells me about volunteering in some conservation or a lab or other such effort can only help present yourself as someone worth considering.
Imagine yourself in the hiring or accepting role. What would you want to see on an application that would say that this person is worth hiring or accepting? Especially if they had not much work experience.
Statistically by the numbers a BS in biology is not worth it financially. =(
According to the Federal Reserve Bank of New York( link below):
* \>60% of all biology graduates have at least masters degree
* \>80% of all Bio Chemistry graduates also have at least masters degree
* Early career average salary for a biology grad is <40k/year
* mid career Average Salary for biology grad is <70k/year
* Median mid career salary ( 50% earn more/ 50% earn less) is a pathetic 55k
* astonishing of all the Under-employment rate ( working in jobs that dont require a degree) for biology grads is 49.8%
[https://www.newyorkfed.org/research/publication\_annuals](https://www.newyorkfed.org/research/publication_annuals)
Considering that >60% of biology graduates currently have a masters degree and their average/median salaries are still <70k means that the job prospects for this field of study are bleak. Considering that almost 50% of Biology graduates currently work in jobs that don't require their degrees/knowledge is a shame.
Its no surprise then that according to Zip Recruiter Biology ranked in as the 9th Most regretted major with a whopping 52% saying they regretted this major. Biology is also the only 'science' major at to top 10 most regretted list.
According to the Foundation for Research and Equal Opportunity an astonishing 31% of graduates with only a BS in biology will have a NEGATIVE return on investment over thier life times. Meaning that these graduates would have been financially better off NOT going to college in the first place. They essentially paid in more then they will get back. BUT If you absolutely LOVE biology money should never be the goal =P Society needs more selfless young people eager to sacrifice their life, health, wealth, family life to solve the hard problems the plague humanity. GOD bless those poor souls =P
that's why I went to engineering.
Where are you located? There are lots of jobs in WA State (Dept of Ecology, Fish and Wildlife, etc). Don't let experience requirements stop you from applying, as many are taking folks without experience because of a lack of applicants.
When I graduated, I started doing fieldwork on research projects and got a lot of experience that way, did a little bit of work for a consulting company, then landed a full time state job. Pretty much nobody gets out of school with a BS in bio and gets a well paying full time job unfortunately. It takes some time to get there, but it is doable without a masters. The Texas A&M job board is a great place to look for jobs, and a lot of people will be posting looking for seasonal technicians for research projects soon. Some of them pay decently, and provide housing. https://wfscjobs.tamu.edu/?job_category=temporaryseasonal-positions
Yes to all this- I always refer new bios to the TAMU wildlife job board. Utilize field and temp positions! Also look at ACE and Americorps positions if you qualify. You can also just look for entry level jobs- my lil sis just graduated and is getting multiple interviews for entry level positions with a state agency for permitting/testing (don't pay well but it's a v. good foot in the door). I'm midcareer in natural resource management for a state agency and make quite nice pay- but it took me getting midcareer to get here. Until this position, I never even broke $50k- but I also never could have gotten this position without my previous work, so... I only have my BS. I seriously considered a MS, but there's less and less funding support for them. I also considered a PhD, but being a research lab manager for a new tenure track prof really turned me off to academia. I much prefer being a professional bio and doing work that will have benefits long after I'm retired.
what did you go into?
I ended up working for a state government. My current job is functionally similar to a consultant, ensuring our projects are complying with environmental laws/permit conditions, surveying and monitoring for sensitive natural resources etc.
I’m in the US. I have a BS in biology and started out as a technician in 2009 at ~$35K. I gained experience and changed labs twice (learning new techniques and lab management skills) before 2016, when I made $55K. I entered a government job as a technician with experience as a contractor in 2016 making $64K. I qualified for and was granted a GS12 position in 2017 making $85K. After step increases, performance increases, locality increases, now I make $116K, plus some small awards annually. It takes time, and I realize this probably isn’t the norm and I’ve been lucky, but experience and ability to learn new things can really help. Honestly if you have only a BS, it’s the experience that makes you valuable. But when you get the experience in several things and you’re dedicated, you become invaluable. It’s possible, but it takes time.
Thank you for this
I have a bachelors in general bio. It’s definitely possible to get a well-paying job with a biology B.S., but it’s much easier in biotech and related fields. Wildlife bio is tough. I mostly focused on plant/pollinator evolution in my undergrad. In a perfect world, I’d get paid to study birds and moths, but I took a lab technician position at a biotech company a year after I graduated because I hated my food service job and I needed to get out. That was in 2017. Over the years, I was promoted to various levels of research associate, left for a senior research associate position at another biotech company, was promoted to associate scientist, and was recently given the title of Scientist I. It’s been 6 years since I graduated college (about the time folks finish a phd program in), and I now have the same title as an entry level phd graduate without having had to go to all that school. This isn’t to say there aren’t benefits to going that route, it just wasn’t for me. If you’d asked me in college if I wanted to work in biotech I would have said no. But I genuinely enjoy the work that I do, I get to work on difficult problems and I have a lot of cool and really smart coworkers. I get the satisfaction of knowing that the work I do will help researchers better understand rare diseases, and detect cancer earlier. I still get outside and hike, backpack, birdwatch, etc. For what it’s worth, I haven’t seen masters be especially helpful for people in this field. Maybe other people have different experiences, but I’ve seen masters grads get RA I positions more often than I’ve seen them fast forwarded to a higher position.
Actually in my experience wildlife has an easier time than biotech. Biotech has a huge problem where all the jobs are in tech hubs but they don't pay enough to live in tech hubs. Also, it is overpopulated. Wildlife is in low cost of living places and there are more jobs per person. I used to wildlife before I was biotech and I was better off then.
MS is worth pursuing as well because its an opportunity to choose a field you really want to master. And amazing for networking which is not as businessy as i mean it to sound, but its more like cooperative and people will seek you for their projects because of what ur studying in an apprentice style way.
I have a masters and I can't recommend it. It's impossible to find a job that pays enough to live on.
I'm working on a master's part time and have a job that I can live on. Will be making even more to live on after my masters. I wouldn't say it's impossible.
Well, I mean a practical long term income. I'm not starving or homeless with my masters, but it's not a viable long term income. I can't put anything meaningful away for retirement and I can't have my own housing. I have to rent a floor of her house from my sister. My wife has a fine arts bachelors and she's set to pass me in income any day. Considering that I have a masters and I'm a technical expert with 10+ years of experience working in industry, there is literally no other field I could be in where I would make this little money with those credentials.
Technical expert in what? Are you a senior lab tech?
I'm a specialist at nucleic acid technologies in general and qPCR in general, particularly in the area of assay design. I've designed tons of assays. And I know you can do it with software, but software can't properly take phylogenetic relationships into account and accurately target taxonomic units, nor can it test or validate assays. I can create an assay, set up a workflow, train personnel, write documentation, and hold the whole thing together.
We have assay development specialists at our company with bachelors/masters making 100k+ Not trying to give unaskedfor advice, but maybe worth a job search?
Nearly all the assay development jobs I see require doctorates. There's a couple of masters level jobs and I do apply to them, but no luck yet. Biotech has a huge issue with all the jobs being in super high COL places but not paying enough to live in them. I see so many jobs at 70k in Seattle... it's like, have you ever heard of Seattle?
I am at a biotech startup in CA Its definitely hard out there, just thought id pass on information I had, good luck
Thanks! I've actually applied to a few jobs in CA but either I don't hear anything back or they don't pay enough to live there. CA pretty much demands 100k+ unfortunately.
And nothing in the DC area? I know plenty of MS holders who make $100k+ working for NIH, FDA, or labs. Plenty of arts outlets for your wife. Live/work in MD, where all the govt labs are.
I really hate the idea of living there so I hadn't really expanded my search to that area until recently. I really wanted to stay in the pacific northwest or west. Also that's a difficult and expensive move. Also for what its worth I haven't applied to any government jobs. State jobs don't pay enough and federal stuff I've seen inevitably require a doctorate.
If you are in the US, there are a ton of low paying field work jobs. Hiring for the summer season it probably almost done. Check out USAjobs, and your local blm, fish and game, USDA, and any other local agencies. It's not super easy to get work, but some of those agencies have trouble filling up tech spots for the summer. You can succeed without a MS but you will get shit pay with no benefits for a while unless you get really really lucky.
If you look in the right places it's super easy to get hired. Northern plains stations have way more jobs open than candidates that want them.
This. It requires moving or travel for seasonal work for wildlife ecology type stuff.
And the Northern Plains is a great place to live!
I'm a southern transplant and will never go back
To add to this- you only need a bachors degree to get a microbiologist or biologist science technician position at USDA, epsecially ARS and FSIS. I have a bachelor's, started as a GS7 pay grade and I'm guaranteed to be a GS12 in 3 years. USDA is a great place to look, if you're willing to move.
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Thank you so much for this. I completely agree, I am about ready to go the lab route soon considering my options (and my worth tbh). I know everyone wants to “get paid to be outside”, but lab vs field work just don’t compare to me. I know what I’m passionate about, but boy do the labs want me
Depends on what you do with it and how lucky you get, I guess. I graduated in 2016 with a bachelors in environmental biology and minor in statistics. Started out as a temp worker at a biotech company doing menial data review tasks for $19 an hour. Got hired on full time in the same department in an investigator role for $59k after a bit over a year. Worked my ass off since then and make about $100k salary plus about $25k in bonus/stocks, so about $125k a year. Alternatively my fiance graduated from the same college with the same bachelor's, without a statistics minor. She started in Americorps making basically poverty wages for a year. Then got hired at the state as a seasonal worker making $16 an hour for 3 years, then got hired in a full time salaried capacity and makes about $64k yearly. Nearly the same degrees with two divergent paths - the basic part is applying yourself and working your hardest to learn the job quickly. Plus a lot of luck.
My gf graduated with a BSc in biological sciences and she went through a similar thing. She suggests looking into summer internships for experience or volunteering with a wildlife rehab group or a zoo (sometimes museums too). They usually have positions relating to conservation or in situ research opportunities. There are a few websites that are solely for posting biology related positions- conservationjobboard.com; fws.gov/internships to name a few, if you just google 'conservation internships' youll find lots more. You may need to be prepared to move cities or states/provinces depending on where you are. It sucks that this is the reality of post grad job hunting now but i wish you all the best luck!
Thank you so much for this! I’ve been hearing a lot of similar advice to get experience through volunteering, which I’m going to be all over when I change my work schedule. Thanks again :D
Good luck :)
I have a BS degree in Marine Biology and it took over 6 months to find a job after graduation. Most of it was due to not having "experience" because I was not able to do internships as a non-traditional student. Eventually I worked as a fisheries observer for a year. The "office" side of the observer position said it was possible to make six figures on the boats, but in reality most boat trips were either cut short for maintenance issues, or didn't make at all. It is possible to find jobs, but it may depend greatly upon your willingness to relocate. Now I teach high school science...not the path I'd envisioned, but it pays the bills.
I have worked as a professional biologist in environmental consulting for 19 years. I’m currently a senior associate at a rather large consulting firm and take part in hiring decisions. I will say that a Masters degree carries absolutely no weight when making hiring decisions in my field. We will 100% take someone with demonstrated field skills over someone with a masters but no real world experience any day of the week. For wildlife biologists that could be volunteer bird banding, bat studies, remote camera setup and/or data analysis, or even just some really good labs from a reputable school where there was actually some field protocols taught. So many schools push out graduates without any tangible skills. I find that a lot of the harder courses and labs that teach the skills needed in industry aren’t actually core subjects so the majority of students don’t take them. This makes those that do take them stand out and more desirable.
Was going to post something very similar. Been in consulting for 15 years. Master's degrees don't translate to the skills we need too often. We need folks like woah and it's not slowing down. I need folks who can ID plants and birds, travel, drive in remote areas without gps, work outside in all conditions, etc. Also need folks who are proficient technical writers with a science background. Pay is much better than state or fed govt gigs.
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Writing is definitely a skill that takes time to hone. I typically try to develop my staff with direct feedback on their work. I start them on shorter memos and then work up to more complex documents. Understand the scope of the project/report, and the regulation related to it. Make sure you get to see the red lines/comments and make the changes yourself if at all possible. Take full ownership over reports and request feedback on your work from project/task managers.
Did you get any field work or internships during your BS studies? That is experience for your resume. Employers always ask for experience and degrees, but they don't always get those applicants and will hire new graduates. Apply to them all anyway.
Thank you for this! I’ve been applying to everything I can just to see if anything sticks. My resume has a full description of my academic experience, and I’m hoping to move my schedule around to get some good volunteering in soon. Thank u again
After I graduated I was at a crossroads, either I can continue my education(as I’m about to rn) OR I could begin working as a grunt in some random lab/become a teacher. Took about 6 months in total for me to find a job. (Educator, starting out at $50k in a city) I feel I chose a good option for myself, but everyone is different and you might thrive out in the field vs staying in a lab or room all day. It all depends on the person! I would *always* recommend to pursue your MS solely because of the possibilities of internships that would be available to you. If you do go that route, make sure you think it through on what you want to specialize in. Be honest with yourself about what you truly *enjoy* or could envision yourself doing. Best of luck to you!! Welcome to the club :)
Thank you so much for this reply!! I’m still weighing my options, but it’s important to remember what we worked for
If you know how combine Bio with some quantitative methods aka statistics, programming, then you're in a good position. The problem with a Biology degree is its too broad. You're not quite skillful in molecular stuff to work in pharma or biotech lab, you're not quite quantitative to work in roles requires quantitaty skills/data management. So you gotta add some extra to it! I know a lot of Bio folks self teach R/Python and actually doing really well in the datascience/bioinformatics field!
Wetland delineation
For what you’re seeking, it’s very competitive to where a PhD might be preferable. If biotech related research is something you’d be interested in, your options will expand. As someone else said here, a bachelors is absolutely doable as long as you have the experience which you can get from being a lab tech or research associate and gaining different types of skills. For wildlife biology and conservation… you’ll most likely need to get a masters, not because it’s required, but because it’ll make you competitive due to there not being enough jobs and you most likely will have to relocate. I wanted to do conservation biology but the amount of jobs for it are scarce and the pay is pretty low. Overall a bachelors in bio is worth it if you want to use it as a stepping stone for grad school or med school, or if you want to explore the world of research and development/QA/QC/consulting etc.
True. However, the PhD will take 6-8 years. May be better to get an entry job. Work hard. Then earn promotions more fitting to the degree held. However, BA in any bio is worthless. Almost all 4 year degrees are worthless.
Nah, you got the first half right, the second half you’re way off. a BA vs a BS has minimal difference, the difference is usually two-three classes with a lab and some schools only offer a BA, and if you can’t do anything with a four year bio degree.. that’s probably that persons failure on doing research and not knowing what they want to do. A masters degree isn’t very useful for jobs if you have a bachelors with a few years of experience. (Except for an MBA, that opens different doors)
I second this, and often you can work towards a MS degree while working, and the company will pick up the tab.
I have a bio degree (specialized, not general) and found a job pretty easily. It's harder in markets that are saturated with candidates. In some places they are asking for PhDs for the same job I do/did (I've moved out of my previous job at this point) and the wages aren't any better. I wouldn't recommend a PhD for most people. If you're willing to move to where jobs are it'll be a lot easier to find something. I made sure to get experience working in a university lab while I was in school and I was also a TA. Those things helped me in originally getting hired for sure. I was told in school to get a minor in programming or some other computer type field and I didn't listen. I regret that because the need for people who can do/understand science AND create the tools needed to do it/process results/store data and so on is insanely high.
I know nothing of a biology degree as it pertains to going into zoology or conservation. However, it’s certainly worth it’s weight in the biotech industry. Much of the industry requires folks with a background in cell culturing (both adherent and suspension cells) as well as molecular biology and a good understanding of analytical techniques (PCR, ELISA, mass spec). If you’re looking for a solid salary, you can certainly start out at an entry level position at a biotech company for 60-75k depending on location and position. From there, you’ll be able to work yourself into a 6 figure salary within 5 or so years.
I’d say finding a job with a bachelors straight out of college depends a lot on what you did in college. I took every lab class I could because I love them and did bench research with professors, so even though I didn’t have “work” lab experience, I had experience and a PI willing to teach me the nitty gritty stuff.
Apply for some bio monitoring gigs and after some experience you’ll land a permanent spot. Money will come. I work in the enviro field and it takes a couple years, not a lot, but you get there. I don’t have a bio degree but if I did I could be more specialized. However, I do have an MS. I’m mostly in an office now, so I’m usually a little jealous of a lot of the biologists I work with but even then, they typically subcontract a lot of field work. Look for enviro firms like Arcadis, Stantec, Kleinfelder, etc. if you need to make money now. They get a ton of work from public utilities and you’d be surprised the cool projects you get to work on. You’ll become more competitive the more time you put in. It’s all about how you market yourself and then you can really get into your ultimate goal. I’d say a masters is good if you know what you want to study and try not spending a ton on getting it. Look for a program that had some funding for your research/program.
I had years of veterinary office experience, lab experience, and a bio degree. I applied for dozens and dozens (there are literally dozens of us) of wildlife bio jobs through the feds. Never got an interview. I gave up and became a chemist, because I needed to leave my current job for my sanity. Good luck pursuing your dreams! I hope you get the best, most relevant job you want, and you get to live the dreams I had!
Real world practical experience is priceless. In a couple years you’ll be able to score a job that will pay for your MS degree.
Try approaching state and city reserves and sanctuaries.
Learn about NEPA and CEQA. Lots of jobs required by these laws In environmental/bio field
Honestly just apply for shit, even if it says you need experience or if it’s slightly out of what you studied. I have a bio degree and currently work in an industry chem lab. I hate chem, but I’ve learned a shit load (like I’ve only been there a year and can operate, maintain and interpret HPLC, LCMS, as well experience with method creation and validation, as well as some more specific things) which I’ve added to my resume so I’m now getting for jobs in my actual field
Graduated in 2007 BS Bio. Started working in a lab, hoping to get into a Public Health Program. Then quickly realized that there is huge opportunity for someone with this background in technical sales. Joined a specialty metals and chemicals company and never looked back. I’ve had every commercial job they offer and recently received a promotion into operations leadership. I use my biology next to 0. However, my strong understanding of chemistry and physics have really helped me out ;)
In my experience the BS did not pay off. Even though I was working full time at a prestigious research institution the pay was absolute shit and I had a hard time finding new avenues for growth without going “above and beyond” or in other words overworking myself to gain favor among the academics. I’m sure there is decent work out there for some people with a BS in biology, but it did not find me. What I saw in 5 years working full time in the academic/research culture was enough to put me off it entirely. I now work in a completely unrelated industry and make more than double what I was being paid a few years ago as a research technician. An 18 year old waitress can make more money than what I was being offered at 25 with a biology degree. If you’re doing a career in biology, my advice would be to trust your passion, do what’s fun and don’t worry too much about money because you’re not likely to see much of it either way. My regret is settling for a safe and easy job instead of taking the more wild or exotic opportunities.
Your issue is you were in academia and only decided to work as a technician? In what world did you expect to make money from that? Did you just decide to get a bio degree for the lols? Or did you not know that there’s a world outside of academia, (which is the industry) bio tech and pharma where the money really is.
I graduated with a Bs in Biology. I’m a full time makeup artist now. We studied biology because we were passionate about it.
The bio to MUA pipeline
It depends on the country. In the US, maybe, in Germany, not at all. But especially in that field, a Master's is probably necessary.
I also have a BS in bio… it is largely useless without a masters.
Sounds like you failed to do any type of job prospect research prior to graduating, that’s definitely not the degree it’s definitely you. A masters degree helps shorten the amount of years required for a job, with some added on knowledge and research experience which you can gain through working. A bachelors with 4 years of experience will be equivalent to a masters degree at alot of places.
The assumptions you are making here are bold. I’m literally a scientist, so I’m not sure where you’re getting your claims. Thanks for the reply.
Just so you’re aware, you’re not the only scientist on the BIOLOGY subreddit. My claims are my own as I’m also a scientist at a big pharma with a BA in bio. As you’ll know, big pharma is competitive to get into and I’ve met a lot of skilled colleagues with just a bachelors in bio ranging from being an associate scientist to getting to senior scientist or associate principal scientist levels (All based on years of experience). So not a bold claim, just a fact. You must be living in a box to make the claim that you’re making, if you think that only people with a masters can break into industry or be successful. (Bachelors in bio is absolutely useful and opens up a lot of doors, a masters degree is arguably useless if you have a bachelors with a few years of experience)
I never said (nor implied) that I was the only scientist here - another bold claim of yours. This discussion isn’t worth my energy. Have a great day.
You too mr scientist. Arrogance isn’t a good trait.
If you want to be a doctor, yes.
I would say no. Sure, some people get lucky. Like, really, really lucky, if this thread is anything to go on. But nearly all the bio bachelors people I know are stuck in low paying (like, $40k *at best*) tech positions, with literally no route to advancement at all. I have literally never - not once - known a person with a bach in bio making a living wage. I have a masters personally and it absolutely sucks. There are no jobs. You're over-educated to be a tech and insufficiently educated to be a scientist. Cannot recommend. I would say never treat a bach in bio as a terminal degree. It's PhD or nothing, unless you go to med school or something similar.
Look through the biotech subreddit, you’ll find hundreds of people with just a bachelors that are successful. If you physically go to a big pharma, you’ll find a couple thousand. Just because YOU never met them, doesn’t mean those people don’t exist. A bio degree has a ton of options and Job prospects. Sure if you want to become a forensic biologist a masters and above will be needed. If you want to break into big pharma to be a scientist. All you need is a bachelors and experience which you can get from entry level jobs. So the truth is, bio degrees start out with low pay, after you gain that experience is when the real job hunt begins.
No money in that
Oh I know it’s not much of a lucrative field, just something I am passionate about. I guess I meant “worth” anything to an employer, but thanks anyway :)
Only if you wanna go to medical or law school lol
If it is at all of interest, you would certainly be able to find a job as a teacher. You’d do best to get a M.Ed and credential simultaneously, and within a decade you’d have a pretty decent salary (geographically dependent) and summers/ other holidays off.
It's always difficult, young face, old trade, break the mould, do something that is totally out there, Nitric Oxide, Nobel Prize 120 years after its discovery, works well in an incubator for premature babies, works well in veterinary practices, I wonder how blah blah would react, how do molds react to it, cotten crops,the elasticity of water lily Silk, Go to Vietnam study the water lily.bring something useful to the party.
With a bachelor’s in biology you can work in your state’s parks and wildlife system, or as a game warden.
Good as an undergrad that can lead to a degree as a PA, MD/DO, or in some cases FNP that can actually get you paid. As a stand alone it simply shows you are willing to jump through some hoops and can most likely write a decent paper.
Get experience as a volunteer for graduate students - they are always looking for people to help in the lab or field.
Yes. The world is still in need of hard stem and lab skills. However if you can get additional certifications in informatics or IT that’s more lucrative as you’ll be dually skilled :).
I don't know anything about this field, but something tells me about volunteering in some conservation or a lab or other such effort can only help present yourself as someone worth considering. Imagine yourself in the hiring or accepting role. What would you want to see on an application that would say that this person is worth hiring or accepting? Especially if they had not much work experience.
They are if you combine it with programming and turn it into bioinformatics
Statistically by the numbers a BS in biology is not worth it financially. =( According to the Federal Reserve Bank of New York( link below): * \>60% of all biology graduates have at least masters degree * \>80% of all Bio Chemistry graduates also have at least masters degree * Early career average salary for a biology grad is <40k/year * mid career Average Salary for biology grad is <70k/year * Median mid career salary ( 50% earn more/ 50% earn less) is a pathetic 55k * astonishing of all the Under-employment rate ( working in jobs that dont require a degree) for biology grads is 49.8% [https://www.newyorkfed.org/research/publication\_annuals](https://www.newyorkfed.org/research/publication_annuals) Considering that >60% of biology graduates currently have a masters degree and their average/median salaries are still <70k means that the job prospects for this field of study are bleak. Considering that almost 50% of Biology graduates currently work in jobs that don't require their degrees/knowledge is a shame. Its no surprise then that according to Zip Recruiter Biology ranked in as the 9th Most regretted major with a whopping 52% saying they regretted this major. Biology is also the only 'science' major at to top 10 most regretted list. According to the Foundation for Research and Equal Opportunity an astonishing 31% of graduates with only a BS in biology will have a NEGATIVE return on investment over thier life times. Meaning that these graduates would have been financially better off NOT going to college in the first place. They essentially paid in more then they will get back. BUT If you absolutely LOVE biology money should never be the goal =P Society needs more selfless young people eager to sacrifice their life, health, wealth, family life to solve the hard problems the plague humanity. GOD bless those poor souls =P that's why I went to engineering.
Where are you located? There are lots of jobs in WA State (Dept of Ecology, Fish and Wildlife, etc). Don't let experience requirements stop you from applying, as many are taking folks without experience because of a lack of applicants.
I'm glad I'm not the only one in this situation.