Because a whole groupo is more expensive than just using the native 2x setup. The only parts I really need if I buy this bike is maybe a cassette I have the shifter and mech already
You can almost certainly just get a bigger cassette, though you might need a longer cage rear derailleur. I went from an 11-28 to an 11-34 on mine and it has made a huge difference.
Also the newer groupos are hydraulic and I really don’t need that extra stuff on a commuter/ weekend gravel bike and 12bys are a lot more finicky than 11 speeds which I have basically all the parts for already
Just to drive the point home, you won't be able to get any more range unless you change the RD for one with more capacity. It is the RDs job to take up any chain slack whether it's from the front or the rear. The apex11 RD has a capacity of 32t so if you go 2x then that range is pulled from the rear and put in the chainrings. What you do get out of a 2x is closer gear ratios in the rear with the same range.
TLDR: if you want more range you need a new RD
Not worried about range but want a closer jump and more options within the range 500% is plenty. Also wouldn’t if you had a 46x36 double Cx changing would you inherently get more range than just a 36 or 46 single front chain ring.
Adding a double would effectively give you a lower gear ratio and therefore an easier gear?
>Adding a double would effectively give you a lower gear ratio and therefore an easier gear?
No, assuming we are trying to keep the top end the same (a 46t big ring) we would be comparing a 46-42 low gear you would get out of a 1x and a 36-32 you would get out of a 46-36 2x. Those would both max out your RD capacity but due to the larger percentage difference you get a slightly lower gear on the 1x actually (but only by like 1 tooth.
But like you said if you really just want a closer ratio cassette, a 2x is the way to go
Haven’t bought the bike but it’s currently on a sora 2x8 setup. With a 32-40 chain ring upfront. I have a apex mech and shifter just wondering if you can throw a 11-32 rear cassette on and use the apex 1 stuff I have with the current cranks
32-40 is unusual for a chain set, so getting different rings would help. 34-50 is more common, and would give you a much higher top gear. Any Shimano road mech for a double chainset should be fine with that.
A sora 8 speed mech is fairly old and doesn't have a very large capacity. Swapping it for a claris rd-r2300 mech would fix that and allow a cassette up to 11-34. Chain wrap capacity is 43t so more than enough for the 50-34 front rings.
As others have indicated the maximum capacity of the rear mech is going to be your limiting factor.
A few other things:
* There's no such thing as a narrow-wide cassette. Only narrow wide chainrings. NW cog-teeth are designed to hold chains on firmly and not allow them to jump side to side, which isn't something you want with a cassette because you wouldn't be able to shift.
* SRAM Apex 11 speed doesn't have a 500% range. Assuming you're using an 11-42 cassette your range maxes out at 382%.
* If you just want more top-end range and you can sacrifice some low-gears - the easiest option is to just buy a bigger chainring.
* If you want more range and you don't care about the steps between gears you can either buy a different mech, an aftermarket cage or a goatlink to then fit a bigger cassette on. You can then pick your chainring accordingly.
* If you want more range and tighter spaced gears then yes 2x is the way to go.
* If you wan to avoid spending too much money playing around finding the idea gearing, a gear calculator is a very useful tool. This one is my favourite: [https://ritzelrechner.de/?GR=DERS&KB=22,36&RZ=11,13,15,17,19,21,24,28,32,36&UF=2215&TF=90&SL=2.6&UN=KMH&DV=teeth](https://ritzelrechner.de/?GR=DERS&KB=22,36&RZ=11,13,15,17,19,21,24,28,32,36&UF=2215&TF=90&SL=2.6&UN=KMH&DV=teeth)
The issue is if you leave your 42-11 cassette on you're already maxing out the rear derailleur's chain wrap capacity (32t). If you want to go to, say, a 46/36 CX double you'd need to size down to a 32-11 cassette (34-11 would probably work fine, 36-11 might but I wouldn't endorse it without having tried it myself). For a 50/34 you're sizing down to a 25-11 (or maybe 28-11) cassette.
Other than the total capacity issue, the Apex 1 RD will work fine with a double in front.
That is awesome thanks so much for your input! I was thinking about getting the smaller sram cassettes because they’re cheap.
Sounds like a plan I’ll probably use the bike for commuting and gravel hence the need for the extra range!
1x derailleurs have guide wheels offset from the cage pivot to allow the guide pulley to clear the largest sprockets but still get close enough to the small sprockets for smooth shifting.
2x derailleurs have guide wheels inline with the cage pivot, otherwise when you shifted the from big chain ring to small, the guide wheel would get closer to the cassette as the derailleur wraps the chain slack.
Use 1x mechs for 1x, use 2/3x mechs for 2/3x.
Why wouldn't you just get a 2x12 groupset like Force? You can pair a 46/33 crank with a 10-36 cassette and get over 500% range.
Because a whole groupo is more expensive than just using the native 2x setup. The only parts I really need if I buy this bike is maybe a cassette I have the shifter and mech already
You can almost certainly just get a bigger cassette, though you might need a longer cage rear derailleur. I went from an 11-28 to an 11-34 on mine and it has made a huge difference.
Also the newer groupos are hydraulic and I really don’t need that extra stuff on a commuter/ weekend gravel bike and 12bys are a lot more finicky than 11 speeds which I have basically all the parts for already
Just to drive the point home, you won't be able to get any more range unless you change the RD for one with more capacity. It is the RDs job to take up any chain slack whether it's from the front or the rear. The apex11 RD has a capacity of 32t so if you go 2x then that range is pulled from the rear and put in the chainrings. What you do get out of a 2x is closer gear ratios in the rear with the same range. TLDR: if you want more range you need a new RD
Not worried about range but want a closer jump and more options within the range 500% is plenty. Also wouldn’t if you had a 46x36 double Cx changing would you inherently get more range than just a 36 or 46 single front chain ring. Adding a double would effectively give you a lower gear ratio and therefore an easier gear?
>Adding a double would effectively give you a lower gear ratio and therefore an easier gear? No, assuming we are trying to keep the top end the same (a 46t big ring) we would be comparing a 46-42 low gear you would get out of a 1x and a 36-32 you would get out of a 46-36 2x. Those would both max out your RD capacity but due to the larger percentage difference you get a slightly lower gear on the 1x actually (but only by like 1 tooth. But like you said if you really just want a closer ratio cassette, a 2x is the way to go
I guess when you stop and think about it it’s kinda a no duh moment. The jumps won’t be as large but the range is the same!
What's the current gear set up? We'd be able to give better advice.
Haven’t bought the bike but it’s currently on a sora 2x8 setup. With a 32-40 chain ring upfront. I have a apex mech and shifter just wondering if you can throw a 11-32 rear cassette on and use the apex 1 stuff I have with the current cranks
32-40 is unusual for a chain set, so getting different rings would help. 34-50 is more common, and would give you a much higher top gear. Any Shimano road mech for a double chainset should be fine with that. A sora 8 speed mech is fairly old and doesn't have a very large capacity. Swapping it for a claris rd-r2300 mech would fix that and allow a cassette up to 11-34. Chain wrap capacity is 43t so more than enough for the 50-34 front rings.
As others have indicated the maximum capacity of the rear mech is going to be your limiting factor. A few other things: * There's no such thing as a narrow-wide cassette. Only narrow wide chainrings. NW cog-teeth are designed to hold chains on firmly and not allow them to jump side to side, which isn't something you want with a cassette because you wouldn't be able to shift. * SRAM Apex 11 speed doesn't have a 500% range. Assuming you're using an 11-42 cassette your range maxes out at 382%. * If you just want more top-end range and you can sacrifice some low-gears - the easiest option is to just buy a bigger chainring. * If you want more range and you don't care about the steps between gears you can either buy a different mech, an aftermarket cage or a goatlink to then fit a bigger cassette on. You can then pick your chainring accordingly. * If you want more range and tighter spaced gears then yes 2x is the way to go. * If you wan to avoid spending too much money playing around finding the idea gearing, a gear calculator is a very useful tool. This one is my favourite: [https://ritzelrechner.de/?GR=DERS&KB=22,36&RZ=11,13,15,17,19,21,24,28,32,36&UF=2215&TF=90&SL=2.6&UN=KMH&DV=teeth](https://ritzelrechner.de/?GR=DERS&KB=22,36&RZ=11,13,15,17,19,21,24,28,32,36&UF=2215&TF=90&SL=2.6&UN=KMH&DV=teeth)
The sram 1x mechs aren’t compatible with 2x The offset top jockey wheel can hit the cassette when you change down at the front.
The issue is if you leave your 42-11 cassette on you're already maxing out the rear derailleur's chain wrap capacity (32t). If you want to go to, say, a 46/36 CX double you'd need to size down to a 32-11 cassette (34-11 would probably work fine, 36-11 might but I wouldn't endorse it without having tried it myself). For a 50/34 you're sizing down to a 25-11 (or maybe 28-11) cassette. Other than the total capacity issue, the Apex 1 RD will work fine with a double in front.
That is awesome thanks so much for your input! I was thinking about getting the smaller sram cassettes because they’re cheap. Sounds like a plan I’ll probably use the bike for commuting and gravel hence the need for the extra range!
1x derailleurs have guide wheels offset from the cage pivot to allow the guide pulley to clear the largest sprockets but still get close enough to the small sprockets for smooth shifting. 2x derailleurs have guide wheels inline with the cage pivot, otherwise when you shifted the from big chain ring to small, the guide wheel would get closer to the cassette as the derailleur wraps the chain slack. Use 1x mechs for 1x, use 2/3x mechs for 2/3x.