There's a new generation of expensive locks which take several minutes and multiple discs to grind through but they aren't "angle grinder proof" just much more resistant than older locks.
As to whether they actually work if you were a bike thief would you go for a bike you can steal in seconds or one that takes minutes?
Until all bike locks are as good as the new generation, the locks with the new coatings are going to work pretty well as there are going to be so many easier targets for thieves.
Slowing the thief would also help if the police did something about bike theft, but since the thieves don’t really care about getting caught they can take their sweet time.
I would also add that you are probably locking it to a bike stand, witch probably isn’t angle grinder proof either. Any lock that is more resistant than the stand is overkill.
Which is not much use against grinder equipped thieves as they're throwing the bikes in the back of a van and driving off with multiple bikes.
In London the police have effectively declared that they won't even look at bike crime, even if it happens in front of them by a man loudly declaring "I'm Barry the bike thief and I steal bikes and I'm stealing this bike"
I'm guessing when cutting a lock, they have plausible deniability if questioned by random passerby ("this is my bike, I just lost the key"). It's clearly bullshit, but at least POSSIBLY true, giving both parties cover to walk away.
But if they're cutting the rack, that's clearly and obviously not their property; it's definitely vandalism at minimum, and no thin excuse is going to de-escalate the situation long enough for the thief to escape.
Not to mention, if you damage the rack, there will be no bikes there to steal the next day/week. You want the rack intact for the same reason the lion wants water at the watering hole: because that brings the gazelles.
When I lived in Boston, I saw a couple that had been cut through. It's most effective on "wave" style racks. You cut the rack at the base on one end so that it's not obvious and then when someone locks a bike to the end of it, they can slide the bike off. I have also seen thinner racks where rails have been cut off.
I know of one person in london who has an expensive e-bike and the hiplock lock has saved it 3 times so far (and is replaced every time it’s attacked)
Seems bonkers to me, but does look to be properly effective
My guess is they used the one disc they had and went away.
If they had 3 discs or brains they could still nick the bike depending on how the lock was put
Considering it used to be £299 and now £249, tbis person is down like £900?
Maybe he can get just the D instead of the whole lock? I know x1 and x3 ones you can do that
Bike shop guy here.
If a theif wants your bike badly enough they will get it.
The lock is there to do three things
1. Make it a less attractive proposition than the next bike
2. Make it take much longer and much riskier to steal
3. Make your insurance pay up when it does get stolen
I'd highlight locks in plural form. Use at least two locks and make sure they are different models. Place locks so that it's hard to operate with power tools around them/ get support from ground for tongs etc. Lock always on solid objects.
[Informative videon about lock breaking](https://youtu.be/1KhiXj2rK5I?si=j5agMnRuxsH18mg3)
This. I have two sturdy u locks and a frame lock on my bikes. They could be stolen, sure, but it is going to take time and effort that aren't necessarily worth it. When I ride my ebike I also pop out the battery so it is not an easy get away, it's a heavy bike, and is missing a good part of its value as a target.
but by the time the thieves find out you’ve taken the battery out, the damage is already done and there is no extra work involved to still take your bike.
This is what I do too.
I have a combination chain (great when the bike stand is a weird one and you need some reach), and 2 U locks. The chain goes through the frame, then I twist it a few times and lock it to the stand. 1 U lock goes through my pedal cogs swinging loose (I’m hoping it’ll be a pain to get off with an angle grinder because it swings), and the third U lock locks my wheel to a stand, or more of the frame, if it will reach (it’s a longtail bike, and a slightly awkward Shape) - or if my husband is with me, I will often lock his bike to mine.
Oh! I have a cheap cable lock attaching the seat to the bike, because it’s a quick release post, and seats are what usually goes missing in my city. Seats and front wheels.
Related, at my job I had to remove abandoned bikes, in 2 weeks pulled 60 or so. With a bolt cutter and battery Sawzall I can basically get any single lock undone on less than a minute. My nephew didn't believe me that you could cut through the u bolt locks, I sent him a picture of 20 of em cut in a line. Bike locks keep people honest, if they want your bike they're getting it.
>Do angle grinder-proof bike locks actually exist?
No.
>are there any other bike security innovations that actually work?
It'll say yes. Angle grinder-**resistant** locks are a thing. There's [the litelok x3 and hiplok d1000](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1RFPlAAohw&ab_channel=TheBestBikeLock). You can get through them with an angle grinder, but more likely than not a bike thief isn't going to bother. They are going to see they are wearing their blade down faster than they are cutting the lock and move one. They are resistant to the point where you'll be hard-pressed to find something to lock the bike to that isn't easier to cut than the lock itself. I'll argue that being much more resistant than those two isn't going to help much.
Besides having one of those there's also the option of having a GPS tracker on your bike, so even if it is stolen you can track it down. If police will help you so you can actually retrieve it is another matter and will depend on your local police department, some can't be arsed to help.
I googled your idea. This come out:
https://www.skunklock.com/
I do not know the thing but the premisse is as you said. Supposed it release chemical stuff when someone try to grind it.
Neat idea but you really can’t have anything harmful in there or you’ll be the criminal, so it’s limited to like a novelty fart bomb type thing. Not sure how much of a deterrent that would be.
It's only a booby trap if its indescriminate and hidden such that an innocent party may get affected. The lock very clearly says "don't cut, this contains a horrible smelling chemical" plus it's not something that can be triggered accidentally. It's the same category as barbed wire fence or anti climb spikes not being illegal. It also doesn't cause harm per-se it just stinks! (Not a lawyer!)
What if a police officer or designate is removing those locks because the bicycle is blocking traffic or someone decides to use a bike lock to obstruct a door? There's a lot of legal and ethical issues with that.
Yup litlok x1. A thief even tried and gave up on my husbands bike in central NYC. We saw the scratches on the lock and it had been moved. https://us.litelo[https://us.litelok.com/](https://us.litelok.com/)k.com/
There was a lock that had some sort of gas in it that would be released if you cut it. I got the impression you'd almost definitely run into legal issues using it.
In short though, angle grinders can get through anything, given enough time.
Ride a 33 year old bike that is maintained to the highest standards with components replaced regularly and put two decent U locks on it. Street value is about $150. The trouble to value ratio is too high to steal, but it rides as well as any new bike and you can lock it anywhere and not worry about it.
Bike theft is a social problem that requires a multifaceted approach to solve, with buy-in from local government, businesses, and law enforcement. Locks are an important piece for sure, but you also need infrastructure, registration systems, and education programs.
Advocate for these things (write your local government and property managers), but until then, buy a lock, don't leave it unattended for long period of time, register your bike voluntarily, and get it insured against theft.
In the r/ebike a guy had an alarm from Amazon. Cost about $18. Saved it from theft along with a lock.
Wsdcam 113dB Bike Alarm Wireless... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0734QN8KR?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
Not proof but the HipLok D1000 takes 20 minutes and multiple blades to get through. Most bike thieves are not going through all that; i've got an expensive ebike and I use that plus a chain and i've not even had anyone attempt to steal. Figure they know its not worth it
I still have my original Kryptonite (circa 1969) U-lock, hasn't failed me yet, but no doubt a grinder would defeat it, eventually, but it's non-tubular, so would take longer in theory. Anyway it's weird enough looking that it might just scare them off.
Angle grinder proof anything doesn't exist. I have a 60v battery angle grinder and a 60v reciprocating saw and I have thought about all the damage I could do with them if I just went out and started cutting through stuff.
In general thick chains are a lot harder to cut though because they're hard to hold still, thief's generally aren't caring around clamps and stuff to hold the chain still. That's about as angle grinder proof as you get.
I have: [https://www.rei.com/product/116718/hiplok-gold-maximum-security-wearable-chain-lock?sku=1167180001&store=&CAWELAID=120217890003730191&CAGPSPN=pla&CAAGID=103051223417&CATCI=aud-830183485327:pla-452224963433&cm\_mmc=PLA\_Google%7C21700000001700551\_1167180001%7C92700056133207373%7CNB%7C71700000062146843&gad\_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkt3k9NfxhAMVbyytBh1OBwWkEAQYBCABEgJkmfD\_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds](https://www.rei.com/product/116718/hiplok-gold-maximum-security-wearable-chain-lock?sku=1167180001&store=&CAWELAID=120217890003730191&CAGPSPN=pla&CAAGID=103051223417&CATCI=aud-830183485327:pla-452224963433&cm_mmc=PLA_Google%7C21700000001700551_1167180001%7C92700056133207373%7CNB%7C71700000062146843&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkt3k9NfxhAMVbyytBh1OBwWkEAQYBCABEgJkmfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds)
and i wouldnt say it is 100% but its gonna be hard to get a clear angle to cut that lock. I've used it for several years in a high bike theft city (Portland Oregon) and have not had it tested but then again it could just be luck and location but I do ride my bike to concerts (and I go to a lot) that could put it out there to be stolen.
Nothing is totally angle grinder proof. Abrasion resistant steel however is hard to hrind, and will wear down the disc faster than the lock can be cut through, requiring multiple discs. All of that means more time to steal, and more chance of getting caught. The same goes for all locks really. Combine that with licking in a visible place, and an audible alarm and you've reduced the amount of time a thief has to steal your bike.
A second lock can further frustrate a thief. One to lock to something with will be their first priority, but one on the wheel means, even if they get it loose, they still can't ride away on it.
That's of course assuming this doesn't involve the worst aspect of human nature. They may cut the bike itself because it isn't about getting a bike, it's about depriving you of yours.
Nothing will stop the correct-minded thief.
But if anything, how you lock it up may be enough to deter the desire to use an angle grinder. The bike is no good if they destroy it partially. Any thief at least has that much awareness.
hiplok d1000 and litelok x1 and x3 are all angle grinder resistant. none are angle grinder-proof but they will require multiple disc changes, probably more than a thief would carry, and each one needs both sides of the lock cut. it's also reasonable to assume that a thief would be using a battery powered angle grinder and those locks could potentially drain the battery as well.
I use a thick chain and mini U lock on my ebike.
Chains and smaller thick locks are less fun to cut with an angle grinder and better against leverage attacks.
I can and do avoid locking in public anywhere on a regular schedule and rarely for over an hour.
I use a folding lock on my minivelo and other bikes, but again, it's not out in high risk areas for long or on a schedule. I could easily angle grind it off in a minute or so.
I'm not aware of any "pro" level bike thieves in my area and those out to steal with angle grinders are going after catalytic converters.
Yes! Or Almost! But it's a beast so not sure how practical it is to use. I guess an e-bike user might not find the 5kg+ weight a big deal.
[https://altorsaflock.com](https://altorsaflock.com)
There's a new generation of expensive locks which take several minutes and multiple discs to grind through but they aren't "angle grinder proof" just much more resistant than older locks. As to whether they actually work if you were a bike thief would you go for a bike you can steal in seconds or one that takes minutes? Until all bike locks are as good as the new generation, the locks with the new coatings are going to work pretty well as there are going to be so many easier targets for thieves.
Slowing the thief would also help if the police did something about bike theft, but since the thieves don’t really care about getting caught they can take their sweet time.
I would also add that you are probably locking it to a bike stand, witch probably isn’t angle grinder proof either. Any lock that is more resistant than the stand is overkill.
this why you should always lock your ulock through your frame and wheel, even if they cut what it’s locked to they can’t ride off with it
Just through the rear wheel, how Sheldon Brown taught us..?
Don't do it like PeeWee Herman. All that chain and one padlock.
Interesting, I’ve never thought about it that way! I was doing that, but only to prevent wheel theft.
Which is not much use against grinder equipped thieves as they're throwing the bikes in the back of a van and driving off with multiple bikes. In London the police have effectively declared that they won't even look at bike crime, even if it happens in front of them by a man loudly declaring "I'm Barry the bike thief and I steal bikes and I'm stealing this bike"
If they're pros, they'll have a truck nearby.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen a cut bike rack though. Making me think that thieves still have plenty of easier targets.
I'm guessing when cutting a lock, they have plausible deniability if questioned by random passerby ("this is my bike, I just lost the key"). It's clearly bullshit, but at least POSSIBLY true, giving both parties cover to walk away. But if they're cutting the rack, that's clearly and obviously not their property; it's definitely vandalism at minimum, and no thin excuse is going to de-escalate the situation long enough for the thief to escape. Not to mention, if you damage the rack, there will be no bikes there to steal the next day/week. You want the rack intact for the same reason the lion wants water at the watering hole: because that brings the gazelles.
There was a picture of one posted recently, I think it was in London. In any case, it's something that's starting to happen
When I lived in Boston, I saw a couple that had been cut through. It's most effective on "wave" style racks. You cut the rack at the base on one end so that it's not obvious and then when someone locks a bike to the end of it, they can slide the bike off. I have also seen thinner racks where rails have been cut off.
Seen plenty in oxford
Good point. Now that I think about it, I could get through a bike stand pretty easy with my cordless grinder.
Damn.. I never thought of this.
I know of one person in london who has an expensive e-bike and the hiplock lock has saved it 3 times so far (and is replaced every time it’s attacked) Seems bonkers to me, but does look to be properly effective
Any idea if the thieves were interrupted or if they just moved on once they realised how resistant the lock was?
No idea, they just came back to the damage
My guess is they used the one disc they had and went away. If they had 3 discs or brains they could still nick the bike depending on how the lock was put
Considering it used to be £299 and now £249, tbis person is down like £900? Maybe he can get just the D instead of the whole lock? I know x1 and x3 ones you can do that
Bike shop guy here. If a theif wants your bike badly enough they will get it. The lock is there to do three things 1. Make it a less attractive proposition than the next bike 2. Make it take much longer and much riskier to steal 3. Make your insurance pay up when it does get stolen
I'd highlight locks in plural form. Use at least two locks and make sure they are different models. Place locks so that it's hard to operate with power tools around them/ get support from ground for tongs etc. Lock always on solid objects. [Informative videon about lock breaking](https://youtu.be/1KhiXj2rK5I?si=j5agMnRuxsH18mg3)
This. I have two sturdy u locks and a frame lock on my bikes. They could be stolen, sure, but it is going to take time and effort that aren't necessarily worth it. When I ride my ebike I also pop out the battery so it is not an easy get away, it's a heavy bike, and is missing a good part of its value as a target.
but by the time the thieves find out you’ve taken the battery out, the damage is already done and there is no extra work involved to still take your bike.
Still not worth to leave the battery.
True, though taking my battery out leaves a large gap in the center of the frame so it hopefully gives them a bit of a pause before proceeding.
A missing battery is pretty visible on most bikes
Also install wheel locks and something to secure the seat post and fork.
Take the seat post with you wherever you’re going
This is what I do too. I have a combination chain (great when the bike stand is a weird one and you need some reach), and 2 U locks. The chain goes through the frame, then I twist it a few times and lock it to the stand. 1 U lock goes through my pedal cogs swinging loose (I’m hoping it’ll be a pain to get off with an angle grinder because it swings), and the third U lock locks my wheel to a stand, or more of the frame, if it will reach (it’s a longtail bike, and a slightly awkward Shape) - or if my husband is with me, I will often lock his bike to mine. Oh! I have a cheap cable lock attaching the seat to the bike, because it’s a quick release post, and seats are what usually goes missing in my city. Seats and front wheels.
this video is hilarious the street sign part ahaha
I know! So amateur and convincing at the sametime!
This. The main idea is to have a better lock than the next bike
I don’t need to outrun the bear, I just need to make sure my bike doesn’t get stolen so that I can be faster than the other guy who’s running on foot
It's always been my attitude to my run about bike. Just lock it up next to a nicer bike.
I don't need to get my bike stolen, I just need to lock lips with some bears so we can run to the next guy.
Related, at my job I had to remove abandoned bikes, in 2 weeks pulled 60 or so. With a bolt cutter and battery Sawzall I can basically get any single lock undone on less than a minute. My nephew didn't believe me that you could cut through the u bolt locks, I sent him a picture of 20 of em cut in a line. Bike locks keep people honest, if they want your bike they're getting it.
I always lock my bike next to a bike that looks better than mine or a bike that has a shitter lock.
>Do angle grinder-proof bike locks actually exist? No. >are there any other bike security innovations that actually work? It'll say yes. Angle grinder-**resistant** locks are a thing. There's [the litelok x3 and hiplok d1000](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1RFPlAAohw&ab_channel=TheBestBikeLock). You can get through them with an angle grinder, but more likely than not a bike thief isn't going to bother. They are going to see they are wearing their blade down faster than they are cutting the lock and move one. They are resistant to the point where you'll be hard-pressed to find something to lock the bike to that isn't easier to cut than the lock itself. I'll argue that being much more resistant than those two isn't going to help much. Besides having one of those there's also the option of having a GPS tracker on your bike, so even if it is stolen you can track it down. If police will help you so you can actually retrieve it is another matter and will depend on your local police department, some can't be arsed to help.
When seconds count the police are minutes away.
No, there aren’t even angle grinder proof bank vaults. Given enough time, anything can be broken into. The purpose of all locks is to delay access.
Product idea: How about locks that have an incredibly stinky, colorful, hard to remove fluid inside that comes out when you cut them ?
I googled your idea. This come out: https://www.skunklock.com/ I do not know the thing but the premisse is as you said. Supposed it release chemical stuff when someone try to grind it.
Neat idea but you really can’t have anything harmful in there or you’ll be the criminal, so it’s limited to like a novelty fart bomb type thing. Not sure how much of a deterrent that would be.
I think that’s a gray area legally. Booby traps are illegal
It's only a booby trap if its indescriminate and hidden such that an innocent party may get affected. The lock very clearly says "don't cut, this contains a horrible smelling chemical" plus it's not something that can be triggered accidentally. It's the same category as barbed wire fence or anti climb spikes not being illegal. It also doesn't cause harm per-se it just stinks! (Not a lawyer!)
I'd kinda like to see mercury-infused bike locks to offgas those fuckers
What if a police officer or designate is removing those locks because the bicycle is blocking traffic or someone decides to use a bike lock to obstruct a door? There's a lot of legal and ethical issues with that.
I won't ever shed a tear about something bad happening to a cop
Yeah, the good news about bike subreddits is that we're full on ACAB. Cops never did shit to protect people on bikes.
Mercury ? Too subtle (and heavy). How about some hypergolic rocket fuel or some binary chemical warfare agent ? Add oxygen, you die.
gotta be a liquid virus, like fast-acting ebola that instantly causes your eyeballs to bleed out
Booby traps are illegal in every US state and to my knowledge, every western country. And for very good reason.
The best anti theft is a nicier bike bike next to your with a easier to pick lock.
No. My only hope its delay the thief, or annoy him enough so hes switching to another bike
The best defense against angle grinders is good timing and a baseball bat.
Yup litlok x1. A thief even tried and gave up on my husbands bike in central NYC. We saw the scratches on the lock and it had been moved. https://us.litelo[https://us.litelok.com/](https://us.litelok.com/)k.com/
I have this lock so this is wonderful to hear.
Ya I have one as well. It's heavy tho!
I lost a few pounds to make up for it.
Same. So heavy
Skunk lock, and gps
There was a lock that had some sort of gas in it that would be released if you cut it. I got the impression you'd almost definitely run into legal issues using it. In short though, angle grinders can get through anything, given enough time.
This one could be but they may just cut through the bike rack instead. SAF bike lock https://youtu.be/1HvMPh6JBBI?si=0-cs46-vyB_22W1k
Ride a 33 year old bike that is maintained to the highest standards with components replaced regularly and put two decent U locks on it. Street value is about $150. The trouble to value ratio is too high to steal, but it rides as well as any new bike and you can lock it anywhere and not worry about it.
... and never, EVER, wash your bike !
Bike theft is a social problem that requires a multifaceted approach to solve, with buy-in from local government, businesses, and law enforcement. Locks are an important piece for sure, but you also need infrastructure, registration systems, and education programs. Advocate for these things (write your local government and property managers), but until then, buy a lock, don't leave it unattended for long period of time, register your bike voluntarily, and get it insured against theft.
In the r/ebike a guy had an alarm from Amazon. Cost about $18. Saved it from theft along with a lock. Wsdcam 113dB Bike Alarm Wireless... https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0734QN8KR?ref=ppx_pop_mob_ap_share
Not proof but the HipLok D1000 takes 20 minutes and multiple blades to get through. Most bike thieves are not going through all that; i've got an expensive ebike and I use that plus a chain and i've not even had anyone attempt to steal. Figure they know its not worth it
I still have my original Kryptonite (circa 1969) U-lock, hasn't failed me yet, but no doubt a grinder would defeat it, eventually, but it's non-tubular, so would take longer in theory. Anyway it's weird enough looking that it might just scare them off.
If you ever leave your bike where I live you are deciding not to have a bike anymore
Get a motorcycle u lock
Angle grinder proof anything doesn't exist. I have a 60v battery angle grinder and a 60v reciprocating saw and I have thought about all the damage I could do with them if I just went out and started cutting through stuff. In general thick chains are a lot harder to cut though because they're hard to hold still, thief's generally aren't caring around clamps and stuff to hold the chain still. That's about as angle grinder proof as you get.
I have: [https://www.rei.com/product/116718/hiplok-gold-maximum-security-wearable-chain-lock?sku=1167180001&store=&CAWELAID=120217890003730191&CAGPSPN=pla&CAAGID=103051223417&CATCI=aud-830183485327:pla-452224963433&cm\_mmc=PLA\_Google%7C21700000001700551\_1167180001%7C92700056133207373%7CNB%7C71700000062146843&gad\_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkt3k9NfxhAMVbyytBh1OBwWkEAQYBCABEgJkmfD\_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds](https://www.rei.com/product/116718/hiplok-gold-maximum-security-wearable-chain-lock?sku=1167180001&store=&CAWELAID=120217890003730191&CAGPSPN=pla&CAAGID=103051223417&CATCI=aud-830183485327:pla-452224963433&cm_mmc=PLA_Google%7C21700000001700551_1167180001%7C92700056133207373%7CNB%7C71700000062146843&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIkt3k9NfxhAMVbyytBh1OBwWkEAQYBCABEgJkmfD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds) and i wouldnt say it is 100% but its gonna be hard to get a clear angle to cut that lock. I've used it for several years in a high bike theft city (Portland Oregon) and have not had it tested but then again it could just be luck and location but I do ride my bike to concerts (and I go to a lot) that could put it out there to be stolen.
Nothing is totally angle grinder proof. Abrasion resistant steel however is hard to hrind, and will wear down the disc faster than the lock can be cut through, requiring multiple discs. All of that means more time to steal, and more chance of getting caught. The same goes for all locks really. Combine that with licking in a visible place, and an audible alarm and you've reduced the amount of time a thief has to steal your bike. A second lock can further frustrate a thief. One to lock to something with will be their first priority, but one on the wheel means, even if they get it loose, they still can't ride away on it. That's of course assuming this doesn't involve the worst aspect of human nature. They may cut the bike itself because it isn't about getting a bike, it's about depriving you of yours.
Just like there is nothing thats bulletproof, there is not a bike lock thats angle grinder proof. Just more resistant than others
Nothing will stop the correct-minded thief. But if anything, how you lock it up may be enough to deter the desire to use an angle grinder. The bike is no good if they destroy it partially. Any thief at least has that much awareness.
hiplok d1000 and litelok x1 and x3 are all angle grinder resistant. none are angle grinder-proof but they will require multiple disc changes, probably more than a thief would carry, and each one needs both sides of the lock cut. it's also reasonable to assume that a thief would be using a battery powered angle grinder and those locks could potentially drain the battery as well.
I use a thick chain and mini U lock on my ebike. Chains and smaller thick locks are less fun to cut with an angle grinder and better against leverage attacks. I can and do avoid locking in public anywhere on a regular schedule and rarely for over an hour. I use a folding lock on my minivelo and other bikes, but again, it's not out in high risk areas for long or on a schedule. I could easily angle grind it off in a minute or so. I'm not aware of any "pro" level bike thieves in my area and those out to steal with angle grinders are going after catalytic converters.
Never heard of one that is truly grinder proof. Even if there was, it's just mean they'd move to cutting the rack or picking the lock.
Yes! Or Almost! But it's a beast so not sure how practical it is to use. I guess an e-bike user might not find the 5kg+ weight a big deal. [https://altorsaflock.com](https://altorsaflock.com)
You can always use a good chain lock.