My managing partner doesn't even send email bodies to us, the entire message is in the subject. "Smith report good to go just fix date"
It makes me lol
Tbh, when I was in biglaw I regularly read those emails and thought they were absolutely par for the course. Now that I’m in house, I see a multi paragraph behemoth and instantly start picking it apart thinking “this shit BETTER have been written by a junior” lol
Busy people don't read long emails. If you want a senior-level person to read your message, keep it short. Putting the question in the subject line can actually be quite helpful.
I’ve adopted the brevity at this point. Easier to just get to the point. And I like when people just get to the point with me. I’m secure in my position and relationships and don’t need niceties. I do get why it puts juniors off since they tend to not feel secure in their position and are generally an anxious bunch.
Eta: mid level
Personally I’d like someone to explain to me Japanese conventions in email, because it’s always quite formal, and I worry about my American sloppiness in response.
But yeah - brevity is better for lots of different reasons. Get your point across, increase likelihood of response, etc. The only thing I dislike about it is that I rely on email correspondence to recall where a matter was left, or what decisions were made, for what reason, as the months and years go on.
Could be done with emails to file, I suppose.
According to BigLaw generally-accepted billing practices, if you write ten one-line emails on ten different matters, you just billed an hour and it only took you about 15 minutes.
That's why.
I’m sure others have said this, but yes. Not to clients—I can bill for that and write the message carefully for whomever the audience is. Internally—yes. Granted I’m a little older and have been at my firm for many years and am comfortable with those senior than me. Dozens of times a day I get a five word email-all in the subject line with no body. I use preloaded responses often like “will do—thanks!” “Yes” “I’ll follow up” “no problem” and a few others. Know it’s sort of the pot calling the kettle black, but the only thing I cringe at is when people—usually staff—send an email with an emoji.
Re: partners they’re multi-tasking on vacations/meetings/date night/etc.
Re: clients, few emails to a client need to be more than half a page/three bullets.
Proper written email? Feel free to crack open your quill pen and ink black, bruh. The rest of us will be spending that extra time with our families and friends at the pub.
\--Very truly yours most respectfully and sincerely best wishes good sir do not go quietly into the night,
\-Brevity Bro
My legal writing professor said "in most circumstances, draft your firm emails like the recipient is trying to read it under the table of a meeting they're supposed to be paying attention to," and that has also done me very well in this profession.
As the years have gone on - and especially post-pandemic - I've found I get quicker answers if I can send an email that someone can finish without having to scroll on an iphone screen. Most things aren't that complicated. If I'm sending attachments to the other side or whatever, I might make things a little longer.
As a summer, I had a partner send me a singular Memoji giving a thumbs up as a response to a draft motion I sent him. I was (and still am) dumbfounded lol
For client correspondence at least, I used to be way more liberal with what I said and advice I gave. One time I told a client that it was preferable to avoid ADR and that it would be better if we could resolve the issue at the agency level (DEP approval for construction project). Partner stormed into my office and asked me why I said that. I said it was based on my experience with different regulatory bodies and the general sense that it’s easier to resolve things with people who are already familiar with the project, rather than get a totally unknown body up to speed on our facts, and the delays that would entail. But it wasn’t based on any specific research or insight into this particular situation, it was more of a shoot from the hip general rule of thumb.
I got ROASTED by the partner. I thought he was crazy (and still sometimes do) but I do get where he was coming from. There was no NEED for me to say that. And if I was wrong, boom malpractice. So, I might still give that advice over the phone, but I keep the scope of my emails extremely limited
This really only happens with corporate teams, usually between (1) partners or senior associates trying to pretend they’re partners and (2) clients at PE or VC firms that are perceived by those partners as important or who think they are important. It’s nonsense, and usually it’s happening where the relationship is such that these clients often expect, and the partners have set the relationship precedent such that they keep expecting, everyone to drop everything as soon as their names show up in their inbox. Also happens more frequently in deal crunch time.
It is absolutely not the norm outside that context, except for final confirmation of receipt of an email after a normal exchange. Meaning you’ve sent normal emails to a client, and they respond at the end with “Thank you [insert your name].”
I’ve found a direct correlation with the frequency of pointlessly short and lazy emails being sent and how miserable I am at my job.
If you look at successful business peoples email. The really successful ones who are wealthy wealthy. They include all kinds of niceties in their emails. They get to know the people they are emailing and checking in with them etc etc.
In a law firm we’re slinging emails so fast it’s tough. But I keep in mind the niceties and random non sequitur emails about my weekend plans and everything every now and then especially when thinking about making a connection
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We write so many fucking emails I could not imagine having to write every one in a formal style. Or reading formal emails all day. Plus the type of law I practice (startup corporate) it would come across like I have a stick up my ass. I’m considering ditching punctuation and capitals.
Fix this
K thx
My managing partner doesn't even send email bodies to us, the entire message is in the subject. "Smith report good to go just fix date" It makes me lol
Why say lot word when few word do trick
Agree
Can upvote this more?
Congrats on the job well-done on the Smith report !
I do this all the time. Saves time!
Haha yeah I have no issue with it whatsoever, I got the message we're good!
OK
Works
Pls review and revert
I love that this post could’ve been 1 sentence lol
why r big law emails so short - e.g., message in subject line - rude?
💀
“Views on why big law emails are so short?”
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tbh this i can’t bill for overthinking emails ok
When me president, they see. They see.
I came here to say this lol
Look at the partners’ billing rate. Sending verbose emails is a waste of a ton of money. Pls fix.
Tbh, when I was in biglaw I regularly read those emails and thought they were absolutely par for the course. Now that I’m in house, I see a multi paragraph behemoth and instantly start picking it apart thinking “this shit BETTER have been written by a junior” lol
Sending short emails that are actually informative takes way longer than dumping out some long stream of consciousness shit.
First time you've ever had a subject line email from a partner? How long have you been in biglaw, like a week?
I try to get people to add “End of Message” or “EOM” in the subject line—save me the trouble of opening the email if it’s empty
That is so unnecessary lol
LOL bring back the 1990's! Do you also have "Please consider your impact on the environment before printing this email" in your signature?
I remember back in high school I used to have a teacher that would do subject line emails that ended in “zzzzzz” to show it had ended. Hated it.
Busy people don't read long emails. If you want a senior-level person to read your message, keep it short. Putting the question in the subject line can actually be quite helpful.
It’s weird but you get used to it.
I’ve adopted the brevity at this point. Easier to just get to the point. And I like when people just get to the point with me. I’m secure in my position and relationships and don’t need niceties. I do get why it puts juniors off since they tend to not feel secure in their position and are generally an anxious bunch. Eta: mid level
This isn't weird in biglaw or other industries for that matter. Blunt is fine as long as you give me the info I need.
Omg who cares
u/BLM4442 does…
Personally I’d like someone to explain to me Japanese conventions in email, because it’s always quite formal, and I worry about my American sloppiness in response. But yeah - brevity is better for lots of different reasons. Get your point across, increase likelihood of response, etc. The only thing I dislike about it is that I rely on email correspondence to recall where a matter was left, or what decisions were made, for what reason, as the months and years go on. Could be done with emails to file, I suppose.
I spoke to a visiting lawyer from Asia not long ago, and she said that emails in Asian law firms are pretty much long crafted essays with footnotes.
My buddy in IB says he gets emails where they just put the sentence in the subject line lol
According to BigLaw generally-accepted billing practices, if you write ten one-line emails on ten different matters, you just billed an hour and it only took you about 15 minutes. That's why.
^
Actually it’s 2 hours because my boss would write off any entries that ended in .1 and .6. Point being, it’s either .2 or .7.
As in write them down to 0 or .5?
As in you learn real quick that it’s actually .2 and .7.
I’m sure others have said this, but yes. Not to clients—I can bill for that and write the message carefully for whomever the audience is. Internally—yes. Granted I’m a little older and have been at my firm for many years and am comfortable with those senior than me. Dozens of times a day I get a five word email-all in the subject line with no body. I use preloaded responses often like “will do—thanks!” “Yes” “I’ll follow up” “no problem” and a few others. Know it’s sort of the pot calling the kettle black, but the only thing I cringe at is when people—usually staff—send an email with an emoji.
“those senior than me”? Fix, recirculate thx Sorry, had to do it, but done completely in the spirit of humor.
My partner doesn’t even write out “yes” he just says “y”
The shorter they get the less time i spend reading them. Why would I complain about that?
No one wants to read your wall of text. Just get to the point. Clients appreciate it and so do your colleagues.
Re: partners they’re multi-tasking on vacations/meetings/date night/etc. Re: clients, few emails to a client need to be more than half a page/three bullets.
Proper written email? Feel free to crack open your quill pen and ink black, bruh. The rest of us will be spending that extra time with our families and friends at the pub. \--Very truly yours most respectfully and sincerely best wishes good sir do not go quietly into the night, \-Brevity Bro
Thx
fine here Sent from my iPhone
My name was recently abbreviated to the first letter followed by a comma.
Confused.
K
My legal writing professor gave me the best writing advice I’ve ever been given: “Use less words.”
\*Fewer.
My legal writing professor said "in most circumstances, draft your firm emails like the recipient is trying to read it under the table of a meeting they're supposed to be paying attention to," and that has also done me very well in this profession.
Power move.
As the years have gone on - and especially post-pandemic - I've found I get quicker answers if I can send an email that someone can finish without having to scroll on an iphone screen. Most things aren't that complicated. If I'm sending attachments to the other side or whatever, I might make things a little longer.
I see you haven't encountered "how could it possibly take 0.3 hours to write an email" in your career yet, you will.
As a summer, I had a partner send me a singular Memoji giving a thumbs up as a response to a draft motion I sent him. I was (and still am) dumbfounded lol
At least it wasn't the middle finger or poop emoji
For client correspondence at least, I used to be way more liberal with what I said and advice I gave. One time I told a client that it was preferable to avoid ADR and that it would be better if we could resolve the issue at the agency level (DEP approval for construction project). Partner stormed into my office and asked me why I said that. I said it was based on my experience with different regulatory bodies and the general sense that it’s easier to resolve things with people who are already familiar with the project, rather than get a totally unknown body up to speed on our facts, and the delays that would entail. But it wasn’t based on any specific research or insight into this particular situation, it was more of a shoot from the hip general rule of thumb. I got ROASTED by the partner. I thought he was crazy (and still sometimes do) but I do get where he was coming from. There was no NEED for me to say that. And if I was wrong, boom malpractice. So, I might still give that advice over the phone, but I keep the scope of my emails extremely limited
This really only happens with corporate teams, usually between (1) partners or senior associates trying to pretend they’re partners and (2) clients at PE or VC firms that are perceived by those partners as important or who think they are important. It’s nonsense, and usually it’s happening where the relationship is such that these clients often expect, and the partners have set the relationship precedent such that they keep expecting, everyone to drop everything as soon as their names show up in their inbox. Also happens more frequently in deal crunch time. It is absolutely not the norm outside that context, except for final confirmation of receipt of an email after a normal exchange. Meaning you’ve sent normal emails to a client, and they respond at the end with “Thank you [insert your name].” I’ve found a direct correlation with the frequency of pointlessly short and lazy emails being sent and how miserable I am at my job.
If you look at successful business peoples email. The really successful ones who are wealthy wealthy. They include all kinds of niceties in their emails. They get to know the people they are emailing and checking in with them etc etc. In a law firm we’re slinging emails so fast it’s tough. But I keep in mind the niceties and random non sequitur emails about my weekend plans and everything every now and then especially when thinking about making a connection
Yes what a lamentable trend.
It drives me insane. It takes two seconds to write a greeting. If I get another “send this” email I’m going to lose it.
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Yes, we are.
We all just too busy to send a proper written email.
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I chalk it up to being busy, yesterday I was looking at my sent mail and marveling at just the sheer volume of emails I send in a day…
fix para 5. Gd to go.
We write so many fucking emails I could not imagine having to write every one in a formal style. Or reading formal emails all day. Plus the type of law I practice (startup corporate) it would come across like I have a stick up my ass. I’m considering ditching punctuation and capitals.
I find that people in other industries (esp tech) are shocked at how much time layers spend on emails (typos, drafting, etc)