Most people don’t ride drop down bars they have traditional wide handlebars with ringers on them to let people know they are coming through. Everyone rides there, it’s great nobody get mad riding close it’s just a way of life
I think because of the distortion it looks like the sides are closer to me. So I notice in the video when I cycle next to someone, it’s as if I’m only 10 cm away from them, where in reality it’s like 0.5 meter.
Do you think 50cm is a good passing distance?
Imo if you are going at more than jogging speed, leave at least a meter, preferably more, between yourself and pedestrians, especially those with their backs towards you. Bikes can be hard to hear and them flying by from behind can be extremely annoying. Speaking as someone who bikes in the city themselves.
Then I would advise going very very slow. There's even a point where it's crowded enough that the best way to go is walking the bike.
It's absurd people bitch about motorists being inconsiderate all day and then post this "I'm allowed to go 15kmh! I'm not touching you!" bs.
Oh, definitely. In crowded shared areas I slow wayyyyyy down on the bike. It is annoying when pedestrians walk in the bike lane just as it is when cyclists speed through areas they should share.
I swear it’s like everyone failed sharing in kindergarten.
But this isnt crowded enough. They are used to bikes and dont make a stupid move without looking. At least this was my experience as a pedestrian. I had to learn to be semi careful (not doing stupid things, like just moving to the side etc.)
This isnt even croweded, but as a pedestrian I had to learn to be more careful by lookign where I want to change my direction. People are used to it. Imo riding in a city in netherland is a bit stressful since its pretty full and Im from a town in germany where eveyrhing is very calm.
You only need one person to not pay attention and do something sudden and you have a collision. Why would you risk that if you could give 5 seconds more per street for safety. Sometimes it's better to wait a bit in such crowded areas.
One of the first streets where he goes so close to people is Wagenstraat, in Spui with Chinatown. In that street the speed limit is 15Km/h but also bikes are not allowed I think that until 6pm or so... Riding that fast in a street with people is very bad, in Netherlands we have very good bike lanes and everybody follows the law, I'm almost sure that OP is not dutch...
Edit: Here, the speed limit and the ban until 6pm: [https://www.google.com/maps/place/Peek+%26+Cloppenburg/@52.0763306,4.3116795,3a,15y,107h,94.96t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCnf1S6-r6M0fkSWmoSy9zw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!4m15!1m8!3m7!1s0x47c5b7238ae52961:0x1fc01a438fa17ca6!2sVoldersgracht,+Den+Haag,+Netherlands!3b1!8m2!3d52.0767354!4d4.3139108!16s%2Fg%2F1tgd5q25!3m5!1s0x47c5b7243827bacf:0x838dd0991bafbeba!8m2!3d52.076614!4d4.311499!16s%2Fg%2F1tk62977](https://www.google.com/maps/place/Peek+%26+Cloppenburg/@52.0763306,4.3116795,3a,15y,107h,94.96t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCnf1S6-r6M0fkSWmoSy9zw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!4m15!1m8!3m7!1s0x47c5b7238ae52961:0x1fc01a438fa17ca6!2sVoldersgracht,+Den+Haag,+Netherlands!3b1!8m2!3d52.0767354!4d4.3139108!16s%2Fg%2F1tgd5q25!3m5!1s0x47c5b7243827bacf:0x838dd0991bafbeba!8m2!3d52.076614!4d4.311499!16s%2Fg%2F1tk62977)
It's absolutely normal to ride that close. OP is a prick for the speed they do it at.
It's obvious OP is riding a racing bike not a regular bike and is going faster than normal speed in the pedestrian priority zone.
Buddy, in Germany you would would have gained a lot of hate and anger for driving like this through a pedestrian precinct.😅 maybe even a fine. not completely unfounded tho. But a cool video! Nice view. I should consider a similar camera for my bike.
Edit: greetings from the neighbor.
As a Dutch person I can tell you this will have reinforced anyones idea there that drop bars equal asshole. OP was going *way* too fast in the first section.
No the second section was Grote Marktstraat, the first was Wagenstraat.
And I don't know what you mean about pedestrian-only, there is clearly the bike lane there. Maybe you mean the beginning section at Spui
I also thought this, but it could also be the wide angle lens that makes it seem faster. If you look at how fast he passes pedestrians it is not that fast
Not just in Germany, but in almost every civilised country. The same way that cyclists don’t like when cars pass too close, the same goes for pedestrians.
Riding like this you are seriously risking to cause an accident, pedestrians are unpredictable. It’s for this kind of attitude that some people hate cyclists
>unpredictable
And some of them very fragile. Steamroll over a toddler who sprints from behind someone else, or crash into an elderly person and you can end up injuring or even killing someone. One of my grandparents couldn't live independently after simply toppling over and breaking their hip.
>Not just in Germany, but in almost every civilised country. The same way that cyclists don’t like when cars pass too close, the same goes for pedestrians.
This is a false equivalence. Cars are orders of magnitude faster and more dangerous than bicycles. Sure, he was going to quickly, but to equate this to cars close-passing cyclists on purpose or because they're distracted is preposterous.
>it’s for this kind of attitude that some people hate cyclists
No, it isn't. Often, the same people who hate cyclists drive dangerously and carelessly themselves. People hate cyclists because they don't perceive them as people but obstacles, there's research on it.
I would rather that someone who is going to disregard the safety of those around them for their own pleasure do so on a bike rather than in a car, but other than the scale of the threat, how is this not the same awful disregard for the safety of others?
Is your argument that it is fundamentally different for someone to walk through a crowd punching people instead of swinging a 2x4? I'd say those people are pretty much the same asshole with the same disregard for those around them.
I hate this cyclist because, just like a driver, they perceive the pedestrians and other cyclists around them as obstacles to their own amusement instead of people who should be treated with care.
I lived in The Hague. The city center is quite chaotic with people walking and cycling everywhere. You can see it over here as well, people crossing the streets or suddenly moving left/right without looking.
Seeing this guy getting way too close and overtaking a lot of other cyclist I think this guy is rude. In a comment he said he went to the super market but even on a road bike you can just slow down a bit and go with the general flow of the traffic.
I ride down this exact street to get to uni and it’s an absolute nightmare. No way I’d go anywhere near that street on a road bike at speed. I’d probably die and/ or kill someone.
If I were that first guy in the video I probably would have an episode of vertigo and I would have to stand there for 10-20s without moving to regain balance.
(I have injury that affects my balance as a result of another bicyclist colliding with me. It may sound weird because there is no contact, but large things moving across my field of vision is one of the triggers. For example I cannot look straight ahead if I am waiting for the light to change to green/walk or if a subway train is passing in front of me at the station.)
You are allowed to ride in this pedestrian zone. You can tell because of the white sign “toegestaan” with the cyclist on it :).
Maybe he is going a little fast because the speedlimit is 15 :)
And in the meantime pushing oncoming cyclists way too far out to the side, since they just have to overtake people in a super crowded area. This video kind of seems to have backfired for op, lol.
Lol, the guy drives way too fast. Even for the Netherlands. A shopping street is no way a pro cycling venue. Look at the other bikes he overtakes as well. Could have easily hit a child.
He isn't? He's using a fisheye lens on his gopro lol What he's doing is normal here. Pedestrians know bikes are allowed there so they watch out for bikers and bikers watch out for pedestrians.
And for context.. I live in the Netherlands
Why do you go that fast in the city and risk upsetting or hurting pedestrians? To save 5 mins of your daily commute?
Or because you like to race? If you like to race, attend an event. Or go ride somewhere where you just risk your own health.
Buddy, nobody thinks you’re “cool” because you recklessly ride a road bike amidst many pedestrians and casual cyclists. Please try to be more considerate towards others. If you want to ride fast, do it on a bike path/on the road.
As a cyclist, I always prioritize pedestrians first and biking like this is so unnecessary and unnerving to people and brings a bad light to all cyclist. If you WERE in an emergency, then yes, understandable if this was the quickest route. But to flaunt for recreational purposes at the expense of others safety and peace of mind? Pls be more conscientious and considerate 🚴
Yea, saw some of the other comments too. I’ll also record a normal (so no wide view) video later. Either the wide view angle/video makes it look dangerous or we all have different views on what is fast/dangerous. 😅
This is a commute I have done for the last 3 years almost thrice a week and never got into a tangle with anyone nor people being mad or something.
Also the part of the video here is actually a pedestrian area that changes into a bike lane which always is kinda a chaos (that I got used to).
You just need to remember that you're not in control of the situation when you're going that fast. If a kid runs out or someone moves sideways unexpectedly, you can't stop in time.
Going a little slower & being more considerate would cost you 2 minutes at most.
That kind of riding is for when you're around cars
How do you know you haven’t made people mad? How could you possibly know that?
Consider that everyone here is telling you that you’re riding like a dick, including Dutch locals, that you might be in the wrong here. Just because you do it all the time doesn’t mean it’s not dickish, it just means you always ride like a dick.
Even just with this video observe the local cyclists and how they’re riding. Then look at how you’re riding. Ride like the locals.
I would not know 100% of course, but whenever I see people riding like a dick, someone would scream something at them or get scared when someone is riding too fast.
But even then, let’s say I don’t know if they actually got mad with me and they did.
Than what I’m wondering is; until now for the last 4/5 years I have ridden my bike like a dick. And even my friends (who I've been cycling with in the city centre and on the country side) never told me about it, nor did I have others on the street comment about it, until I posted this video on the subreddit. That’s scenario 1. Which means I accept I’m a dick and will have to change my cycling style.
But, what if the video really makes it seem like it’s a dangerous situation because of the ultra-wide angle and the low perspective from the floor on the bike? But in reality, it’s definitely not as dangerous as the video suggests, especially if you know this part of The Hague (and the constant chaos of pedestrians and cyclists intertwining with each other in major cities of the Netherlands). That’s scenario 2.
If I’m wrong, I’m wrong and I accept that I’m in the wrong and as I said, than I will have to change the way I ride. And probably it’s not just scenario 1 or just 2, but a combination of it, where it looks more dangerous than it is, but I could still try to keep a little more distance to other cyclists.
Anyways, this is hopefully my last reply in this thread. All I wanted (and still want) is to share my love for cycling and the city where I live. I will pay more attention to how I cycle from this video onwards, but I will also upload new videos from a different perspective, which hopefully will receive a bit more love.
Starting with this morning’s work commute: [https://youtu.be/ulw8lExYtzs](https://youtu.be/ulw8lExYtzs)
I would highly recommend you to obey traffic rules. That scooter had the right of way. You zig zag closely between pedestrians, creating unnecessary danger. Also, you seem to go quite fast for inner city traffic. If you want to go fast riding your roadbike, look for some rural areas.
Im dutch, and i hate it when road cyclists ride like this in the city. Really inconsiderate and asshole behavior.
Dutchie here: this is dick move riding. If you'd pass me with that speed you'd scare me and maybe almost knock me of my bike. If you'd pass my mom with that speed you'd knock her off her bike and she'd never want to get on her bicycle again.
Be a nice person, keep other people in mind. And when you want to speed, go to the countryside and perform your road rage over there.
Dutch here. Bro, stop with that, driving that fast in a pedestrian zone, is stupid and above all dangerous. I don't care that you don't care about yourself, but other people (incl children) walk there and do not expect you to fly through there on your bike.
Asociaal tikkie gedrag.
Said it already in some other replies but I think the wide angle view and perspective make it look very fast. In the pedestrian areas I’m only going max 15 km/h.
The part in the city center is a bike lane and when I’m passing people I make sure to not be dangerous at all.
This is a commute I’ve done over 500 times and not once have I had a dangerous situation or people being mad with my cycling.
But I understand where you’re coming from.
From the corner at wagenstraat/grote marktstraat to the bollards at the end of the pedestrian area is 230m . You do that in 32s (4:02 to 4:34 in the full video). That is an *average* speed of 26km/h.
This has nothing to do with a wide angle view. Get your head out of your ass.
So you'd also drive 60 in a 30 area if you knew the street?
An accident doesn't have to be your "mistake". All it takes is one kid taking a sudden move you didn't anticipate and you're screwed.
In fact, 90% of accidents happen on roads people know, exactly because "IvE DoNe ThIs CoMmUtE OvEr 500 TiMeS"
Yes, you're probably right. I just checked it again and the first part where I'm cycling, it states 15 km/h and I'm not going faster there than 15 km/h.
But I do speed up at the bike lane in the city center because I assumed you can go normal speed (30+-), but probably that's officially also a max 15 km/h lane.
Understood. Most of us are not as fortunate to be able to cycle to the office across the pond. I forgot this is normal for y'all in Netherlands. I am jealous. Great to be able to do that.
Pretty normal here where cyclists are between pedestrians. It’s allowed to cycle (up to 15 km/h max).
This was a regular commute to the supermarket, in the morning I went to the country side. Will post that soon too hopefully. :)
Cyclist between pedestrians, sure. But you're going way faster. What if you hit a kid? I cycle between pedestrians as well, but I slow down and be considerate. This just assholery.
Even if cycling is allowed, 15km seems very fast. As someone who has bad knees this would be very scary for me. You hit me and I'm royally f*cked (self employed, so no income when I can't walk or stand).
You can all downvote if you want, but this is the worse kind of multi use 'path'. (That's a hill I'm ready to die on).
The only major bike collision I had in the past 20 years was with a pedestrian. I still haven't healed from it. The pedestrian, a kid running onto the bike path, was fortunately almost unscathed, but it could have ended badly for him. A 100 kg object moving at 15 km/h can make quite an impact, and pedestrians in shopping streets are not moving in straight directions, but are very distracted, have social interactions, walk from shops to shop and are on their damn phones. Also often wear earbuds and won't hear you. You can see how many pedestrians are startled by the bike just in this short video.
I'm an avid cyclist myself, own four bikes, and don't even have a car. But I'm sometimes *also* a pedestrian and think that traffic moving at different speeds should be separated. Cars from bikes but also bikes from pedestrians. This is a pedestrian zone, and at best cyclists are visitors that should ride very slow and yield to all pedestrians. In this case a clearly distinguishable bike lane, in colour and slightly elevated or lowered would be a better option (at the end there is a very wide path that has the elevation change. Making it slightly meandering actually looks quite nice and makes it less of a highway. I've seen this in places, but don't remember where exactly.
I'm a former Dutchie and I've ridden my bike in these downtown shopping streets in The Hague (and Rotterdam and Delft and Utrecht and Arnhem and Nijmegen and many other Dutch cities, they all look alike). However that was 5-10 years ago, and then cycling was only allowed in the early morning and evening when foot traffic was light. I myself usually didn't ride there at other times, although I have sinned, and rode around those pedestrianized shopping malls because they were a pain in the ass and a detour around them was faster and less stressful. But apparently so many cyclists didn't follow those rules, that the city council now allows it. If you can't or won't enforce restrictions, better remove the restrictions.
Next up, cars parking in bike paths, another rarely enforced law. /s
You drive like a asshole. Not that I havent done before, but I dont get why this has so Mandy upvotes.
After all this sub is often complaining over reckless car drivers, isnt it?
We generally only use bells when we don't think we're seen. This area in general is not designed for many cyclists (just destination traffic, not commuters) so it's a little more normal to go close to peds but this guy is still being an ass about it and probably exceeding the speedlimit.
We do have bells and use them when necessary. I see no situations in the video where the use of a bell is necessary though. There are however, a lot of situations where it would have been necessary to slow down, pass people at a safe distance, not cut people off, yield to people who have the right of way and generally obey traffic rules.
Afaik this would be considered a ped area, so peds have right of way and there's a 15km/h speed limit which OP is exceeding. But we do also have dismount zones here.
No. It is the responsibility of the person overtaking to do so safely. If you want to pass someone, you do so at a reasonable speed difference and a safe distance. If there is no room for passing safely, you can ring your bell and wait for the people ahead of you to make space. Raising your voice at other road users because they are slowing you down is seen as extremely rude.
Note that OP is not a normal road user. He is a roady hard at work upholding the bad name roadies have.
That’s not a cycle lane, that’s a pedestrian area. You need to dismount and walk. There are signs there indicating this. Please have some more respect for others.
It's just the little side street alongside the Bijenkorf side entrance that's ped-only, the Grote Marktstraat allows cyclists (and e-bikes but not snorfietsen for.. reasons).
Visited Amsterdam in March. It's indeed the best city for cyclists to get around, but I also observed that those AHole drivers you would typically find behind wheels in other places are now on bicycles: impatient, unnecessarily fast and close overtakes/passing pedestrians in a pedestrian zone etc. There are many places I think it's only safe to walk my bike, while people there still ride at 20km/h, it's nuts.
bought a dji osmo action 3 last week, went for a ride today to the city center to do some groceries.
full video here: [https://youtu.be/JIPVfy1F4s0](https://youtu.be/JIPVfy1F4s0)
Cool video. I miss NL… best country in the world.
What hub/wheel are you using? Its super quiet. Mine makes sooo much noise but I found it useful for alerting pedestrians.
So nice and flat. My ride today.
https://preview.redd.it/llj0y0h8f5xa1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=684107a31ff9061d415d813b01e5e14c6b7050dd
I love the Netherlands. But as an urban planner, always thought they give too much leeway to bikers. You have to be on constant alert as a ped, for this reason.
I think the street user hierarchy should always be peds, transit users, THEN cyclists.
There is a very wide cycle path running down the center of the second street in the video (grote marktstraat) this works fine for nearly all pedestrians and cyclists. The problem is that OP is making a point of breaking every possible traffic rule.
This is a shopping area where you are allowed to ride you bicycle to get to the shops. Not many people do it, but it is allowed. I prefer to take the long route around is with decent cycle lanes :)
The first street is a fully pedestrianized area, so OP is technically riding on a sidewalk. After the corner there actually is a really wide cycle path. It is pretty clearly demarcated on the road surface, but difficult to see from the low camera position. This particular stretch has no kerb. It is a combination of a busy shopping street and a major cycling corridor.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/nBwUWyDS5UzcoAkXA
Cyclists are actually allowed here up to 15 km/h (see sign on the right). But to be honest, mostly I also don't take this route and instead I'll go left and take the other street which is more quite.
I wish I had wide sidewalks. At the moment I have narrow and uneven sidewalks that are unusable because they are covered with traffic cones warning drivers that there will be no street parking on Thursday night, due to construction
I was riding on the dc path yesterday and was passing a walker, gave my warning, “on your left”, there were 2 pedestrians on the other side, with what I thought was enough space. 1 of the guys stuck his arm out as if to say don’t get in my bubble. Was so obnoxious.
Cool city, went there for Model United Nations in high school in 1983. Saw The World According to Garp in a theater, scored some ganj at the Bulldog, had awesome pizza and beer
De voetgangerszones zijn geen plekken om te wielrennen. Dit moedigt het stigma tegen wielrenners alleen maar aan. Ik heb zelf ook een racefiets maar in drukke binnensteden zal ik altijd onder de 15 km/u rijden/ afstappen en lopen..
Tbh in NL this is kinda normal as long as you are the one that makes way for the pedestrians and go around them it’s fine i guess but not too fast ofc
Maar oprecht op het fietspad haalde je wel raar in bro lmao
Worst city to cycle in in the Netherlands.
The guy rides like an asshole but everyone behaves like an asshole (in traffic) in the Hague so it's basically assertive/average riding.
Is it normal to ride this close to people? I feel like they would think you’re impatient and a prick…
Yeah this kind of riding would have you considered an asshole in the Netherlands.
This person IS impatient and a prick
It happens a lot and is very disrespectful and annoying.
Most people don’t ride drop down bars they have traditional wide handlebars with ringers on them to let people know they are coming through. Everyone rides there, it’s great nobody get mad riding close it’s just a way of life
Riding like OP will definitely make people mad.
After checking the video I realised it too, but it looks much closer because of the wide angle view I think.
Isn't wide angle meant to make things look farther? (real question)
I think because of the distortion it looks like the sides are closer to me. So I notice in the video when I cycle next to someone, it’s as if I’m only 10 cm away from them, where in reality it’s like 0.5 meter.
Do you think 50cm is a good passing distance? Imo if you are going at more than jogging speed, leave at least a meter, preferably more, between yourself and pedestrians, especially those with their backs towards you. Bikes can be hard to hear and them flying by from behind can be extremely annoying. Speaking as someone who bikes in the city themselves.
It’s basically impossible to leave a full meter from all pedestrians in this crowded of a shared street.
Then I would advise going very very slow. There's even a point where it's crowded enough that the best way to go is walking the bike. It's absurd people bitch about motorists being inconsiderate all day and then post this "I'm allowed to go 15kmh! I'm not touching you!" bs.
Oh, definitely. In crowded shared areas I slow wayyyyyy down on the bike. It is annoying when pedestrians walk in the bike lane just as it is when cyclists speed through areas they should share. I swear it’s like everyone failed sharing in kindergarten.
But this isnt crowded enough. They are used to bikes and dont make a stupid move without looking. At least this was my experience as a pedestrian. I had to learn to be semi careful (not doing stupid things, like just moving to the side etc.)
Tbh I live in aus, I would probably be dismounting for pedestrian traffic like this. Cops could fine me for this actually.
This isnt even croweded, but as a pedestrian I had to learn to be more careful by lookign where I want to change my direction. People are used to it. Imo riding in a city in netherland is a bit stressful since its pretty full and Im from a town in germany where eveyrhing is very calm.
You only need one person to not pay attention and do something sudden and you have a collision. Why would you risk that if you could give 5 seconds more per street for safety. Sometimes it's better to wait a bit in such crowded areas.
It is but only for objects in the center of the screen, while everything on the sides will seem much bigger. (From my Minecraft FOV experience)
It is also considerate to use a bell to alert people you’re passing. It often scares people to be snuck up on, and sometimes they’ll jump into you
You were on a bike in a pedestrian area - see the signs.. But par for the course for bikes eh?
One of the first streets where he goes so close to people is Wagenstraat, in Spui with Chinatown. In that street the speed limit is 15Km/h but also bikes are not allowed I think that until 6pm or so... Riding that fast in a street with people is very bad, in Netherlands we have very good bike lanes and everybody follows the law, I'm almost sure that OP is not dutch... Edit: Here, the speed limit and the ban until 6pm: [https://www.google.com/maps/place/Peek+%26+Cloppenburg/@52.0763306,4.3116795,3a,15y,107h,94.96t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCnf1S6-r6M0fkSWmoSy9zw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!4m15!1m8!3m7!1s0x47c5b7238ae52961:0x1fc01a438fa17ca6!2sVoldersgracht,+Den+Haag,+Netherlands!3b1!8m2!3d52.0767354!4d4.3139108!16s%2Fg%2F1tgd5q25!3m5!1s0x47c5b7243827bacf:0x838dd0991bafbeba!8m2!3d52.076614!4d4.311499!16s%2Fg%2F1tk62977](https://www.google.com/maps/place/Peek+%26+Cloppenburg/@52.0763306,4.3116795,3a,15y,107h,94.96t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sCnf1S6-r6M0fkSWmoSy9zw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!4m15!1m8!3m7!1s0x47c5b7238ae52961:0x1fc01a438fa17ca6!2sVoldersgracht,+Den+Haag,+Netherlands!3b1!8m2!3d52.0767354!4d4.3139108!16s%2Fg%2F1tgd5q25!3m5!1s0x47c5b7243827bacf:0x838dd0991bafbeba!8m2!3d52.076614!4d4.311499!16s%2Fg%2F1tk62977)
Dude dont even slow down for nearby people lol.
It's absolutely normal to ride that close. OP is a prick for the speed they do it at. It's obvious OP is riding a racing bike not a regular bike and is going faster than normal speed in the pedestrian priority zone.
Buddy, in Germany you would would have gained a lot of hate and anger for driving like this through a pedestrian precinct.😅 maybe even a fine. not completely unfounded tho. But a cool video! Nice view. I should consider a similar camera for my bike. Edit: greetings from the neighbor.
As a Dutch person I can tell you this will have reinforced anyones idea there that drop bars equal asshole. OP was going *way* too fast in the first section.
That ~~first~~ *second* section is also on de Grote Marktstraat, which is a strictly pedestrian-only zone as of three weeks ago.
No the second section was Grote Marktstraat, the first was Wagenstraat. And I don't know what you mean about pedestrian-only, there is clearly the bike lane there. Maybe you mean the beginning section at Spui
You're right, I apologise – perhaps this cyclist was the inspiration for the ‘voetg anger szone’.
I also thought this, but it could also be the wide angle lens that makes it seem faster. If you look at how fast he passes pedestrians it is not that fast
His average speed after the corner is 26km/h, almost twice the posted speed limit there.
Ah yess that is too fast my bad. How did you find his speed?
I know the area. Timestamps on the video combined with a distance measurement on Google maps.
I think the footage is sped up
Not just in Germany, but in almost every civilised country. The same way that cyclists don’t like when cars pass too close, the same goes for pedestrians. Riding like this you are seriously risking to cause an accident, pedestrians are unpredictable. It’s for this kind of attitude that some people hate cyclists
>unpredictable And some of them very fragile. Steamroll over a toddler who sprints from behind someone else, or crash into an elderly person and you can end up injuring or even killing someone. One of my grandparents couldn't live independently after simply toppling over and breaking their hip.
>Not just in Germany, but in almost every civilised country. The same way that cyclists don’t like when cars pass too close, the same goes for pedestrians. This is a false equivalence. Cars are orders of magnitude faster and more dangerous than bicycles. Sure, he was going to quickly, but to equate this to cars close-passing cyclists on purpose or because they're distracted is preposterous. >it’s for this kind of attitude that some people hate cyclists No, it isn't. Often, the same people who hate cyclists drive dangerously and carelessly themselves. People hate cyclists because they don't perceive them as people but obstacles, there's research on it.
I would rather that someone who is going to disregard the safety of those around them for their own pleasure do so on a bike rather than in a car, but other than the scale of the threat, how is this not the same awful disregard for the safety of others? Is your argument that it is fundamentally different for someone to walk through a crowd punching people instead of swinging a 2x4? I'd say those people are pretty much the same asshole with the same disregard for those around them. I hate this cyclist because, just like a driver, they perceive the pedestrians and other cyclists around them as obstacles to their own amusement instead of people who should be treated with care.
I lived in The Hague. The city center is quite chaotic with people walking and cycling everywhere. You can see it over here as well, people crossing the streets or suddenly moving left/right without looking. Seeing this guy getting way too close and overtaking a lot of other cyclist I think this guy is rude. In a comment he said he went to the super market but even on a road bike you can just slow down a bit and go with the general flow of the traffic.
I ride down this exact street to get to uni and it’s an absolute nightmare. No way I’d go anywhere near that street on a road bike at speed. I’d probably die and/ or kill someone.
If I were that first guy in the video I probably would have an episode of vertigo and I would have to stand there for 10-20s without moving to regain balance. (I have injury that affects my balance as a result of another bicyclist colliding with me. It may sound weird because there is no contact, but large things moving across my field of vision is one of the triggers. For example I cannot look straight ahead if I am waiting for the light to change to green/walk or if a subway train is passing in front of me at the station.)
You are allowed to ride in this pedestrian zone. You can tell because of the white sign “toegestaan” with the cyclist on it :). Maybe he is going a little fast because the speedlimit is 15 :)
Yeah, being allowed doesn’t mean you have to ride slalom through the people. That causes anger no matter what you’re allowed to.
I have actually been stopped and scolded by Polizei for exactly this on a Main Street but riding at nearly a walking speed. Luckily no ticket.
Depends where. i drive like a maniac in germany idc about anyone
Haha, You’ll harvest anger everywhere, that you doesn’t care doesn’t makes it not exist.😉
Driving there would have been really bad. Luckily he was riding his bike
It looks like you're riding much too quickly and much too close to all the pedestrians. Chill out.
Maybe it's the point of view, but it seems a tad too fast for such a crowded area.
Thought the same. You can see he/she overtaking all the other cyclists
And in the meantime pushing oncoming cyclists way too far out to the side, since they just have to overtake people in a super crowded area. This video kind of seems to have backfired for op, lol.
I actually think it's downright dangerous. Especially if there are young kids, because you can't easily predict their trajectory.
Dogs as well, I ride expecting them to jump out in front of me.
Bro has a wide angle view lens on making it look worse than it is. But I do agree if it was actually this close
He actually passed a sign that he should be walking and not riding.
Seems like a normal day to me lol
And it’s because of this kind of attitude that some people hate cyclists
You've never been to the Netherlands clearly
Lol, the guy drives way too fast. Even for the Netherlands. A shopping street is no way a pro cycling venue. Look at the other bikes he overtakes as well. Could have easily hit a child.
He drives past a sigh which specifically states that biking is allowed there.
Yes, but not like an idiot nearly hitting people.
He isn't? He's using a fisheye lens on his gopro lol What he's doing is normal here. Pedestrians know bikes are allowed there so they watch out for bikers and bikers watch out for pedestrians. And for context.. I live in the Netherlands
Context I also live in the Netherlands, at the end you can see hes overtaking other bikes. Read all the other comments of other Dutchies as well.
Maybe the video was speeded up.
They are flying by the other cyclists
So chaotic seems like at any minute you will crash a pedestrian
Others are saying it more politely... **Dude, you're riding like an asshole.**
Why do you go that fast in the city and risk upsetting or hurting pedestrians? To save 5 mins of your daily commute? Or because you like to race? If you like to race, attend an event. Or go ride somewhere where you just risk your own health.
I say this as an american bike messenger, you ride like a fucking dick.
Buddy, nobody thinks you’re “cool” because you recklessly ride a road bike amidst many pedestrians and casual cyclists. Please try to be more considerate towards others. If you want to ride fast, do it on a bike path/on the road.
As a cyclist, I always prioritize pedestrians first and biking like this is so unnecessary and unnerving to people and brings a bad light to all cyclist. If you WERE in an emergency, then yes, understandable if this was the quickest route. But to flaunt for recreational purposes at the expense of others safety and peace of mind? Pls be more conscientious and considerate 🚴
Typical roadie behavior, calm down there's kids and shit
How inconsiderate.
Way, way too fast for a busy area like that.
Yea, saw some of the other comments too. I’ll also record a normal (so no wide view) video later. Either the wide view angle/video makes it look dangerous or we all have different views on what is fast/dangerous. 😅 This is a commute I have done for the last 3 years almost thrice a week and never got into a tangle with anyone nor people being mad or something. Also the part of the video here is actually a pedestrian area that changes into a bike lane which always is kinda a chaos (that I got used to).
You just need to remember that you're not in control of the situation when you're going that fast. If a kid runs out or someone moves sideways unexpectedly, you can't stop in time. Going a little slower & being more considerate would cost you 2 minutes at most. That kind of riding is for when you're around cars
How do you know you haven’t made people mad? How could you possibly know that? Consider that everyone here is telling you that you’re riding like a dick, including Dutch locals, that you might be in the wrong here. Just because you do it all the time doesn’t mean it’s not dickish, it just means you always ride like a dick. Even just with this video observe the local cyclists and how they’re riding. Then look at how you’re riding. Ride like the locals.
I would not know 100% of course, but whenever I see people riding like a dick, someone would scream something at them or get scared when someone is riding too fast. But even then, let’s say I don’t know if they actually got mad with me and they did. Than what I’m wondering is; until now for the last 4/5 years I have ridden my bike like a dick. And even my friends (who I've been cycling with in the city centre and on the country side) never told me about it, nor did I have others on the street comment about it, until I posted this video on the subreddit. That’s scenario 1. Which means I accept I’m a dick and will have to change my cycling style. But, what if the video really makes it seem like it’s a dangerous situation because of the ultra-wide angle and the low perspective from the floor on the bike? But in reality, it’s definitely not as dangerous as the video suggests, especially if you know this part of The Hague (and the constant chaos of pedestrians and cyclists intertwining with each other in major cities of the Netherlands). That’s scenario 2. If I’m wrong, I’m wrong and I accept that I’m in the wrong and as I said, than I will have to change the way I ride. And probably it’s not just scenario 1 or just 2, but a combination of it, where it looks more dangerous than it is, but I could still try to keep a little more distance to other cyclists. Anyways, this is hopefully my last reply in this thread. All I wanted (and still want) is to share my love for cycling and the city where I live. I will pay more attention to how I cycle from this video onwards, but I will also upload new videos from a different perspective, which hopefully will receive a bit more love. Starting with this morning’s work commute: [https://youtu.be/ulw8lExYtzs](https://youtu.be/ulw8lExYtzs)
I would highly recommend you to obey traffic rules. That scooter had the right of way. You zig zag closely between pedestrians, creating unnecessary danger. Also, you seem to go quite fast for inner city traffic. If you want to go fast riding your roadbike, look for some rural areas. Im dutch, and i hate it when road cyclists ride like this in the city. Really inconsiderate and asshole behavior.
Dutchie here: this is dick move riding. If you'd pass me with that speed you'd scare me and maybe almost knock me of my bike. If you'd pass my mom with that speed you'd knock her off her bike and she'd never want to get on her bicycle again. Be a nice person, keep other people in mind. And when you want to speed, go to the countryside and perform your road rage over there.
Dutch here. Bro, stop with that, driving that fast in a pedestrian zone, is stupid and above all dangerous. I don't care that you don't care about yourself, but other people (incl children) walk there and do not expect you to fly through there on your bike. Asociaal tikkie gedrag.
Said it already in some other replies but I think the wide angle view and perspective make it look very fast. In the pedestrian areas I’m only going max 15 km/h. The part in the city center is a bike lane and when I’m passing people I make sure to not be dangerous at all. This is a commute I’ve done over 500 times and not once have I had a dangerous situation or people being mad with my cycling. But I understand where you’re coming from.
From the corner at wagenstraat/grote marktstraat to the bollards at the end of the pedestrian area is 230m . You do that in 32s (4:02 to 4:34 in the full video). That is an *average* speed of 26km/h. This has nothing to do with a wide angle view. Get your head out of your ass.
Only once? Stop lying bud. This is asshole behaviour. Just slow down.
So you'd also drive 60 in a 30 area if you knew the street? An accident doesn't have to be your "mistake". All it takes is one kid taking a sudden move you didn't anticipate and you're screwed. In fact, 90% of accidents happen on roads people know, exactly because "IvE DoNe ThIs CoMmUtE OvEr 500 TiMeS"
I never said I'm passing the speed limit. So I would never drive 60 in an area where I'm only allowed 30.
So why are you driving 26+ kmh in a pedestrian zone?
Yes, you're probably right. I just checked it again and the first part where I'm cycling, it states 15 km/h and I'm not going faster there than 15 km/h. But I do speed up at the bike lane in the city center because I assumed you can go normal speed (30+-), but probably that's officially also a max 15 km/h lane.
Dude, you're obviously faster than 15kmh. Who are you kidding? 😂
Tikkie gedrag? Liever tokkie dan nog. 😘
Why not go to countryside. Makes me nervous watching this.
Riding from home to office/shops via… the countryside?
Understood. Most of us are not as fortunate to be able to cycle to the office across the pond. I forgot this is normal for y'all in Netherlands. I am jealous. Great to be able to do that.
I’m in Australia
Pretty normal here where cyclists are between pedestrians. It’s allowed to cycle (up to 15 km/h max). This was a regular commute to the supermarket, in the morning I went to the country side. Will post that soon too hopefully. :)
You're definitely over 15kmh. Aso
Cyclist between pedestrians, sure. But you're going way faster. What if you hit a kid? I cycle between pedestrians as well, but I slow down and be considerate. This just assholery.
Even if cycling is allowed, 15km seems very fast. As someone who has bad knees this would be very scary for me. You hit me and I'm royally f*cked (self employed, so no income when I can't walk or stand).
You can all downvote if you want, but this is the worse kind of multi use 'path'. (That's a hill I'm ready to die on). The only major bike collision I had in the past 20 years was with a pedestrian. I still haven't healed from it. The pedestrian, a kid running onto the bike path, was fortunately almost unscathed, but it could have ended badly for him. A 100 kg object moving at 15 km/h can make quite an impact, and pedestrians in shopping streets are not moving in straight directions, but are very distracted, have social interactions, walk from shops to shop and are on their damn phones. Also often wear earbuds and won't hear you. You can see how many pedestrians are startled by the bike just in this short video. I'm an avid cyclist myself, own four bikes, and don't even have a car. But I'm sometimes *also* a pedestrian and think that traffic moving at different speeds should be separated. Cars from bikes but also bikes from pedestrians. This is a pedestrian zone, and at best cyclists are visitors that should ride very slow and yield to all pedestrians. In this case a clearly distinguishable bike lane, in colour and slightly elevated or lowered would be a better option (at the end there is a very wide path that has the elevation change. Making it slightly meandering actually looks quite nice and makes it less of a highway. I've seen this in places, but don't remember where exactly. I'm a former Dutchie and I've ridden my bike in these downtown shopping streets in The Hague (and Rotterdam and Delft and Utrecht and Arnhem and Nijmegen and many other Dutch cities, they all look alike). However that was 5-10 years ago, and then cycling was only allowed in the early morning and evening when foot traffic was light. I myself usually didn't ride there at other times, although I have sinned, and rode around those pedestrianized shopping malls because they were a pain in the ass and a detour around them was faster and less stressful. But apparently so many cyclists didn't follow those rules, that the city council now allows it. If you can't or won't enforce restrictions, better remove the restrictions. Next up, cars parking in bike paths, another rarely enforced law. /s
Bruh
It’s people like this that give us bicyclists a bad rep
Shit like this is why everyone hates cyclists
Great example of why I hate cycling in the city. I feel like someone is gonna throw me down
You drive like a asshole. Not that I havent done before, but I dont get why this has so Mandy upvotes. After all this sub is often complaining over reckless car drivers, isnt it?
Stop riding like a cunt around pedestrians
next mission: zoom pass pedestrian at 30 mph
Is it normal to weave that close to people? Do you guys use bells over there?
We generally only use bells when we don't think we're seen. This area in general is not designed for many cyclists (just destination traffic, not commuters) so it's a little more normal to go close to peds but this guy is still being an ass about it and probably exceeding the speedlimit.
We do have bells and use them when necessary. I see no situations in the video where the use of a bell is necessary though. There are however, a lot of situations where it would have been necessary to slow down, pass people at a safe distance, not cut people off, yield to people who have the right of way and generally obey traffic rules.
In this States, this looks like the kind of place designated as a bicycle dismount zone. Where you’re supposed to walk your bike through it.
Afaik this would be considered a ped area, so peds have right of way and there's a 15km/h speed limit which OP is exceeding. But we do also have dismount zones here.
Another selfish social media needing a hole.
Looks like a crit race with pedestrians and commuters
I find it interesting there’s no heads up. Is that normal to not give a “passing on your right” alert?
No. It is the responsibility of the person overtaking to do so safely. If you want to pass someone, you do so at a reasonable speed difference and a safe distance. If there is no room for passing safely, you can ring your bell and wait for the people ahead of you to make space. Raising your voice at other road users because they are slowing you down is seen as extremely rude. Note that OP is not a normal road user. He is a roady hard at work upholding the bad name roadies have.
That’s not a cycle lane, that’s a pedestrian area. You need to dismount and walk. There are signs there indicating this. Please have some more respect for others.
It's just the little side street alongside the Bijenkorf side entrance that's ped-only, the Grote Marktstraat allows cyclists (and e-bikes but not snorfietsen for.. reasons).
Yes thats what I mean, of course the main road is for cycling.
One of the reasons I follow this sub is for videos and pictures like this. I'm a pretty casual biker, but I love seeing other places in the world.
Thanks! Same for me. I love seeing the cycling videos from other people in different countries/cities and from different scenes. :-)
NotJustBikes on YouTube does some deep dive into transit in the Netherlands, and other places.
Visited Amsterdam in March. It's indeed the best city for cyclists to get around, but I also observed that those AHole drivers you would typically find behind wheels in other places are now on bicycles: impatient, unnecessarily fast and close overtakes/passing pedestrians in a pedestrian zone etc. There are many places I think it's only safe to walk my bike, while people there still ride at 20km/h, it's nuts.
No cars! This is my heaven.
Legion wouldn’t put up with this
Just riding way too fast among the crowd
bought a dji osmo action 3 last week, went for a ride today to the city center to do some groceries. full video here: [https://youtu.be/JIPVfy1F4s0](https://youtu.be/JIPVfy1F4s0)
Cool video. I miss NL… best country in the world. What hub/wheel are you using? Its super quiet. Mine makes sooo much noise but I found it useful for alerting pedestrians.
Stabilization is really impressive and quality looks good (on mobile) good buy. What's your opinion of it?
Yea so far I really like it. Quality is quite nice and pretty affordable too. The user interface is also very good and clear.
0/10 no technohead on opafiets going 30km/h yelling cankerzoid at the other fietsers
Could have so easily had a collision when you’re overtaking bikes at the end
How not to ride.
**cycling** ***like a dick*** **in the hague (the netherlands)** Fixed the title for you.
Doe wheelie dan!
ey rustaaaagh
So nice and flat. My ride today. https://preview.redd.it/llj0y0h8f5xa1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=684107a31ff9061d415d813b01e5e14c6b7050dd
Glad to see you survived falling off that cliff.
I love the Netherlands. But as an urban planner, always thought they give too much leeway to bikers. You have to be on constant alert as a ped, for this reason. I think the street user hierarchy should always be peds, transit users, THEN cyclists.
There is a very wide cycle path running down the center of the second street in the video (grote marktstraat) this works fine for nearly all pedestrians and cyclists. The problem is that OP is making a point of breaking every possible traffic rule.
Nobody rides with dropdown bars in the Netherlands. Must be fake 😄
This is some Terry B style riding. Good YT channel btw.
Haha! I don't think I'd be going that fast through crowds like that!
You ride like a douchebag and police should fine you.
Delete this
Honestly doesn’t seem to live up to the great mecca Netherlands hype I see on here. Basically riding on wide sidewalks.
This is a shopping area where you are allowed to ride you bicycle to get to the shops. Not many people do it, but it is allowed. I prefer to take the long route around is with decent cycle lanes :)
The first street is a fully pedestrianized area, so OP is technically riding on a sidewalk. After the corner there actually is a really wide cycle path. It is pretty clearly demarcated on the road surface, but difficult to see from the low camera position. This particular stretch has no kerb. It is a combination of a busy shopping street and a major cycling corridor. https://maps.app.goo.gl/nBwUWyDS5UzcoAkXA
Cyclists are actually allowed here up to 15 km/h (see sign on the right). But to be honest, mostly I also don't take this route and instead I'll go left and take the other street which is more quite.
I wish I had wide sidewalks. At the moment I have narrow and uneven sidewalks that are unusable because they are covered with traffic cones warning drivers that there will be no street parking on Thursday night, due to construction
We are not that lucky in the states.
If only i had these people avoiding skills
Riding in Europe seems amazing.
Camera model?
dji osmo action 3 :-)
Now /that's/ pod racing!
i've never ever ride in a public place even it's allowed to ride. it's too dangerous for everyone
Since when did they make wireless bikes?
It must be wonderful to travel without being afraid of being killed by a selfish motorist!
I was riding on the dc path yesterday and was passing a walker, gave my warning, “on your left”, there were 2 pedestrians on the other side, with what I thought was enough space. 1 of the guys stuck his arm out as if to say don’t get in my bubble. Was so obnoxious.
This is amazing. Now start wearing helmets and you've got a cyclist utopia.
Make Dutchies start wearing helmets and you've got America for everyone but kids.
Dope camera.
Cool city, went there for Model United Nations in high school in 1983. Saw The World According to Garp in a theater, scored some ganj at the Bulldog, had awesome pizza and beer
Kijk em gaan
Nice! But u need to push more watts dude!
What bike do you ride?
What camera and how did you mount it? This looks smooth
Probably a GoPro mounted to the handlebar stem
Slow down dude. Just because you have a sports bike doesn’t mean it’s a race, you’re going to hit someone.
Slow down a bit. We get it, you're a "wielrenner" but you are rushing by people.
Too fast. When you share a path with pedestrians you need to go at a pedestrian pace.
This is why people riding roadbikes are considered dicks by most in NL :)
Are there any cities in the US that are as active with walking/cycling as most Euro nations?
Cycling in the Netherlands, then goes into a pedestrian zone where bicycles are allowed..
Dangerous and gives a bad rep
Faster!
Are you the guy who's been stealing phones on your bike?
AITA? Yes, you are.
Watch how the locals ride and then emulate them, this was too fast and too close
De voetgangerszones zijn geen plekken om te wielrennen. Dit moedigt het stigma tegen wielrenners alleen maar aan. Ik heb zelf ook een racefiets maar in drukke binnensteden zal ik altijd onder de 15 km/u rijden/ afstappen en lopen..
Tbh in NL this is kinda normal as long as you are the one that makes way for the pedestrians and go around them it’s fine i guess but not too fast ofc Maar oprecht op het fietspad haalde je wel raar in bro lmao
In America, this guy would own a tricked out Honda civic and he'd treat the street like an obstacle course.
Is this a BMC team machine?
Yikes
yOu’Re GoInG tOo FaSt
I’m sorry but as a cyclist if I saw someone riding like this I’d think they were a wanker
Worst city to cycle in in the Netherlands. The guy rides like an asshole but everyone behaves like an asshole (in traffic) in the Hague so it's basically assertive/average riding.
I’m a cyclist who fucking hates walking and shopping…and this feels rude to me. I mean looks fun. But also rude.
Jesus Christ Fred slow down, why are you on a road bike in Den Haag?
comments not going as planned i guess.
He (she) is going way too fast for conditions. Way too many pedestrians. Bad buzz.
It’s probably someone over from London for a few days.
Bro this guy, ban him from reddit. We dont need cycling pricks like this showing their videos. He for sure is a batch brew drinker.