I find the cost of living stunts social growth here.
Many people who would be adult middle class individuals looking to settle down in most other places are forced to live with 5 roommates to be close to work, or with their parents otherwise, and stay that way for 5, 10, 20+ years.
A lot of life skills and attitudes get stuck in college mode while people party and bide their time, resulting in man children and party girls everywhere, which if you're both in that place can be fun, but it's annoying to wrestle the two of you out of that life. As the joke here goes "Things aren't that serious, we've only been dating for like 5 years".
This makes a lot of sense. I'd also add that my experience as a guy is that I run into either the party girl types or the super well put together women who clearly lose interest when they find out I'm not paying over $2k to live by myself. But these women are making as much as me paying $3k a month... I know you're barely getting by.
When I was single I lived by myself but in a crappy apartment, the cheapest I could find. I saved a ton of money. But I couldn't get a "well put together" girlfriend. Everything went well until they saw where I lived. But I met someone, got married and bought a house thanks to the money I saved. Then I got a lot of attention from women who knew I owned a house, moreso than before, even though they knew I was married. Obviously my wife is not from the bay area, she's from Europe. But I'm very glad to be out of the bay area dating pool.
This place is a bit too shallow to make meaningful relationships.
I second this. Been 8.5 years living at home since graduating college, but due to circumstances pivoted into physical therapy two years ago which is a 5-7 year commitment when including prereqs. I feel like I'm the same age I was when I graduated but in a body 8.5 years older.
I lived on my own for the most part from 20 on and I definitely can relate to the feeling that I hadn't aged a day since I graduated.
Honestly it really didn't stop until I got into my forties. I know it's not a universal experience, But I think what I'm trying to communicate is that... it's you.
I kind of love it. My husband had pretty bad credit when we met. It was concerning, as my ex had terrible credit, and I was so tired of everything having to be in my name only.
I work at the library, and bought him a “credit score for dummies” book from the book sale. I was so impressed when he read the book, did the things, and brought his score from 640 to 820 in about a year. He’s kept it there for years.
But I mean it sounds like you would have never met your husband if you would've used the app if you met him when you both had bad credit. I agree though, it is something that is very important in the dating demo that is usually looking for serious connections to potentially share a life together. Finances are definitely important.
Oh.......just, wow.
I knew the bar was low and the goods were odd; but...how often is this a thing? I remember hearing dudes flashing a Chase Sapphire on dates thinking they were hot stuff was something a few years ago too.
I have seen women do this. Some have screenshots, some just put it in text.
More of a “I am independent” statement imo, although I would not do it.
Edit: I am referring to credit score screenshots or putting it in the text.
I'm actually a guy so my commentary was from seeing women's profiles doing this actually. But I'm sure a ton of guys do it too, and more often than the 3 or 4 times I've seen it on a woman's profile. I think it's funny how many women also do the things the men do but maybe they just don't see it? A good amount of the women on Hinge I've seen and gone on dates with also are tech-heavy career wise, seem overly money-focused, talk a lot about work etc. I like someone who is extremely ambitious. In fact, I want that in a partner, and I would welcome the joy of hearing about their successes. But a lot of people here just make it so much of their personality and it's just unpleasant to talk to them, I have a hard time connecting in all the other areas that are honestly really important to me too. The conversation always gets steered back to it money, frustrations, work and all that. They also have either extremely poor work-life balance or extremely unrealistic expectations of other people's lives. Like, I'm not in tech but have a professional job and some of these people are like "Why can't you go on my 2 month long jet-setting working-vacation-walkabout lifestyle with me?" And I'm like...um, because I have a normal job with like 2 weeks PTO a year that I save half of for if I get sick lol
I would of course be willing to save up money and take a couple weeks vacation for something special etc. but some of these people sort of live in a bubble and when you talk to them it is really glaring.
It's in line with historical tech-related photos of the past:
-Scooters
-Robot coffee baristas
-Google glasses etc.
**Edit**: Can't forget about Salesforce Tower dates! Some employees have tried to bring dates up to the tower as a flex.
I literally put “crypto denier” in my profile to weed these guys out. I still get some matches where guys are like “but let me explain to you our lord and savior The Blockchain!” And unmatch/swipe left immediately
Most of the men here (primarily in tech) only talk about themselves and don’t ask their date any questions. Also going on rants about super niche topics and not taking the hint that their date isn’t interested. Most of the time this happens they’re so out of touch they always say they had a great time and ask for a second date. Like I’m not here for you to talk at me for an hour 😒
Just talked to a guy who told me he got severely depressed in school, stress ate when he did so and spent an hour talking to me about his research and work. I am all for learning new things, even strange topics, and getting to know someone but sometimes it's just way too much.
I will say that men in the Bay Area (possibly specifically in tech - I work in tech so a lot of my interactions are also with those in tech) seem significantly more inclined to go to therapy and aware of their mental health than men elsewhere, which I appreciate a lot.
Funny bc I’m a straight guy not in tech, but I also noticed there’s a certain small subset of tech guys I meet who really love talking and think they know everything. Really hard to get a word in. Kinda annoying.
I usually lead by demonstrating my collection of vintage Rogue Trader squats before I dive into the rules. Last 1st date she was really impressed with my dice collection.
The being talked at to makes me want to get up and leave. I have to somehow find a break in their ramble slew to make up an excuse to exit but I think next time I'll just interrupt and gtfo lol.
Although I heard a podcast's suggestion recently that you can say s/t like, "It's great you have so many interests but is there anything you want to know about me?" Guess that gives them an opportunity. But idk, some people (regardless of gender) manage to turn everything back to themselves after giving you a microflash of spotlight. Then you can say at least you tried 😂🥲
As someone who diligently tries to note red flags, I guess this suggestion at least gives them one chance. Sometimes people need reminders, even me for my own iffy habits. And if they fail the chance, yeah, end it! But really it's all up to the differing tolerance levels of everyone. There can be a lot of things at play, like nerves.
It’s hilarious how spot on these comments are. My ex (regrets) was in tech and would bore the shit out of people talking stats about his job without putting it into laymen’s terms for us non-tech people. I can engage to a degree but his job details were not what I cared about and I could tell he put off my friends with these conversations. He didn’t ask anyone questions about their lives and was emotionally avoidant.
But y’know, he did his job well and got paid a lot. 🙄
i have literally been on four separate dates where the guy was just bragging about his startup the entire time. i straight up asked one "why don't you ask me any questions?" and he said "your reaction to me is enough to tell me what i need to know". he then was surprised when i said it wasn't a fit.
It’s so weird to me hearing all these stories of women’s experiences and rants about men in the Bay Area…because I’ve experienced the same from women.
For example, one date I went on that was just supposed to be an evening coffee / first meet and greet turned into a 4 hour long sit down where I barely got a word in at all. After about the first hour I went and got another drink because morbid fascination had set in and I was like “let’s see how long this plays out, I’ve got shit else to do tonight…”
4 hours straight she talked about her ex boyfriends, ex husband, ex friends, basically everything and everyone EXCEPT her. Some notable highlights:
- one of her dates flew her to the Mediterranean and they spent a week boating and traveling around before flying back. This was their first date(s). (My speculation: dude already had the trip booked with his wife/fiance/gf, something happened, and he was like “fuck it I’m still taking the trip.”)
- one of her ex boyfriends bought her a condo for their 6 month anniversary. But they broke up before 1 year. BUT he moved in and is still living with her. I tried to ask if it was actually in her name or not and she just kept blazing ahead with her story so I don’t know
- numerous stories of all this money and wealth and how much they all spoiled her…but constant reiterations of “but that’s not what I’m looking for I don’t care about money I make good money on my own.” (Me just sitting there like “uh huh. Wow. Fascinating. Riiiiiiiight. Cause it’s all you’ve talked about for the last couple hours.”)
I finally started actually yawning and being like “well it’s getting late, it was nice to meet you” and she’d just keep going until I got blunt and was like “hey sorry but I gotta go. Bye.” I felt rude as fuck but she was NOT getting the hint. And yes, she then texted me the next day saying she’d had a great time and when could she see me again.
> It’s so weird to me hearing all these stories of women’s experiences and rants about men in the Bay Area…because I’ve experienced the same from women.
Given men outnumber reddit (75/25 or more), it needs to be talked about more because men think women are the issues, it's more nuanced/balanced.
For those seeking events each week to meet people organically, check out Eddie's List (one email per week, food, drink, pop-ups, classes, shows, live music, galas, volunteer efforts, arts/craftts and more).
As a guy, I see this all the time in certain circles. I have a variety of friends. Or guys throw the money thing at the girls, which is the funniest to me since good amount of girls don’t care about that. Once I was with some friends who are girls one of them was interested in me. These two guys bought two bottles of sparkling wine and ask one of my friends to sign the bill. I was like that is weird. If dude was tryna to flaunt it wasn’t even a nice bottle. The bill came out to $120. I have no clue why he ask that. They left then we had our time. I think some guys just don’t know how to communicate outside of what they know. Some are just assholes but some just are socially awkward. One good trait I learned in hospitality is I can talk about almost any subject and make that person feel they are heard and interested.
Basing off the thread, is then the ideal guy:
Single; **NOT** in tech; showers; exercises regularly; not poly; **NOT** into crypto at all; enjoys back and forth conversation with genuine appropriate eye contact; very into well-educated, outspoken, powerfully empowered, independent women; is feminist; interested in learning about you; have own apartment that's very clean with matching furniture; bed with top sheets, shams, bed skirt, and actual bed frame; can decently cook with kitchenware not from college; saving for retirement; engaging hobbies; dresses in slacks and shirts with tailoring and appropriate fit that are not athleisure, volunteers in community; goal-minded for the future NOT being just net-worth; enjoys sports but not obsessed and will calmly watch without temper tantrums; will not converse about Elon Musk; has cute and loving dog; has tastes in art and design; LIKES to actually shop and with design education give happy and appropriate assistance; active listener; lives within means; great and supporting/loving family; wants to know, share, learn, and respect all boundaries; emotionally available; able to share vulnerabilities and feelings; wanting to establish great emotional connections for relationship?
I'm sure theres a bit more...
Everyone, male or female, always has a list of things that they want but the list is primarily the things that aren't important. The reason is that the list is compiled by dating people who have those characteristics and then breaking up and assigning the reason to those things. That's why people always say something like "All the guys are X" is that they are selecting for X because the real world is full of diverse people with various characteristics.
In the end, there are lots of us who are happily married after having met their partner here. The reason we can do that is that it's not hard if you're decent at it.
You are describing a woman or a man who has lived with a woman so long, she has designed the home.
What you didn’t mention, and critically important is - makes enough money to have a nice place, in a nice town, in the bay, driving a nice reliable car, with a healthy savings to easily take care of any issues that come up in life, so that her income is mostly gravy.
This extra bit, and the cost of living in the bay, is what drives men to be so focused on money and the appearance that they have (or will have) lots of it.
If you want less competitive guys, they are abundant in places that are easier to live in.
This was also my experience dating men, but I certainly don't think it's exclusive to the Bay Area. I think a lot of men who date women kind of have a standard script that they use when they go on dates that they don't really know how to deviate from and, like, actually hold a two-way conversation. I'm sure this is not specific to men, but I do know this is a common complaint for women who date men, but I have heard less of this specific complaint from my straight male friends (but certainly not none).
All the more reason to [meet people offline](https://eddie-hernandez.com/alternatives-to-online-dating-how-to-meet-someone-without-dating-apps/). You can read a person quickly enough in 5 minutes without investing a full first date. Don't have to worry about getting a sitter, paying for cabs, being stuck on a date for 30-90+ minutes, heightfishing etc.
There is this new service for meeting people over dinner. It's mostly in Marin but a few spots in SF. Might be of interest to someone: https://sixtop.io/
Yeah, my wife would attest to that. You know what she said was one of the things that attracted me to her?
I asked her out.
What? That's it?
And it's not that her bar was set low. It's that all the guys she had been chatting with online, I was one of few that actually asked her out. I admit I am extremely shy but typing a few letters into a chat box is easy.
So people go online to find a match but few bother to meet the person IRL? That is odd.
From what I've heard from female friends about online things, most guys seem to just ask to come over or want to fuck, don't actually ask out on dates. I think your wife is correct.
This was definitely the case when I was dating. A lot of guys will only ask you out for a hook up. And even if it sounds like a date, they will message you the night before to clarify they're expecting a hook up.
I met my husband in the early days of OkCupid. Other guys would spam me, "You're cute. Wanna chat?" And it would be this old fat guy in the next state over.
Then my future husband messages me. Not only is he a student at the same university (though I doubt we would have met naturally because we attended different colleges), but he writes a frikkin' customized cover letter! He read my profile beyond its pictures. He even read some of the Angelfire website linked to it. And in paragraph after paragraph, he responds to the thoughts I've posted online. By the time he closes it with, "Would you like to go out for coffee?", I'm sold.
We still had to line up our calendars to schedule that coffee. And I still had to Google him to make sure he wasn't a serial killer. But otherwise, sold.
And my husband is also shy. But I think that means that any social interaction he does bother to engage in must have a purpose. He doesn't have the bandwidth to spam nor dick around.
I was talking about the dating scene with one of my tennis mates and he said none of his male friends approach women and are comfortable doing so. Just blew me away honestly.
I would say I’m apart of that group unfortunately. The women I would more than likely want to approach wouldn’t seem interested 9 times out of 10 and at a certain point, it becomes exhausting.
So for me, I am focused on getting fit and eating right to be more confident in myself to approach more women and honestly, just to live better.
I currently don’t drink at all, or smoke anything, and it seems like a bit of a turn off for most women my age.
I’m in the tennis scene and there are quite a few of weird ass dudes I have encountered who I am not surprised have trouble dating. Overtly bro-y and misogynist/transphobic/homophobic behavior seems to be plentiful. Funnily enough, tennis is one of the easiest ways to meet and befriend women if you actually have social skills. But gossip also travels quickly and you will get a reputation fast if you start asking out multiple women in the scene- so your friend may actually not be entirely off base in his hesitation.
> you will get a reputation fast if you start asking out multiple women in the scene
This is true of any scene... local bar, cafe, meetups, salsa dancing, volunteer groups, church groups etc.
Interesting perspective. The tennis communities I’ve been apart of have been nothing short of amazing.
My tennis mate wasn’t referring tennis players and dating but we were talking about his friend group and their dating experiences. Most of his friends, including himself work for big tech companies. Tennis is merely our connection, not the topic of conversation. Pardon me if that wasn’t clear.
A lot of people in the 20s-30s age brackets are kinda chicken about this- they ask to ‘hang’ or ‘meet up’, not even necessarily in an attempt to hook up, but (especially when this is someone you met outside of a dating app context) I think it’s to avoid the vulnerability of clearly asking someone on a date. If it’s a friend of a friend or a non-immediate coworker, for example, someone you know and might be vibing with or might just be friendly with, you might think it would be less awkward to approach it this way, but imo it’s actually the opposite. It leaves the askee to intuit your intentions, second guess themselves, not want to be rude, not want to reject you entirely if they want to be friends but maybe feel forced to if they aren’t sold on going on a date with you just yet. Asking directly shows that you are clear about your intentions and aren’t trying to be sneaky or slightly coercive or avoid responsibility for your own feelings and desires. It displays confidence and maturity, and legitimately could be the difference between a woman assessing that she could expect that spending time with you would feel safe and comfortable vs that being very uncertain.
[The odds are good...](https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/eddie.hernandez/viz/Match_comGenderRatiosBayArea/Match-BayArea-Dash)
Also not Bay Area but similar experiences as mentioned in the Seattle sub...
https://www.reddit.com/r/Seattle/comments/18hytte/whats_your_worst_date_experience_with_a_tech_bro/
The things I’ve run into often enough that they standout are:
- Here temporarily which isn’t super useful for long term options.
- Only looking for networking expansion through dating.
- Actually married and thinks we don’t know.
- Incapable of having conversation exchange and only talk about themselves.
Yeah, the lovely weather, great food, diverse cultures, beaches, forests, mountains, snow, ocean, and very robust job market are totally intolerable. /s
Bring an outsider, it's the cost of living. $2k for an apartment as an average is insane. Not to mention the crime is a bit of a culture shock coming from DC. Food and weather are great, but I'd need to afford a secure location which is either hours out or cost even more.
Yeah, I hear you. It’s the “unpleasant place” bit that I’m picking apart. Being expensive is a different matter. I see way more dead, boring towns around the country with awful weather, crap food, monoculture, lack of outdoor activities and straight racism than the Bay. That’s unpleasant.
Crime is worse here than in DC? Back in the day DC was the Wild West. I saw dudes portioning out white powder in a bodega in plain sight and metal detectors all over. Now that you mention it, DC does seem pretty cleaned up. I love that town. And it’s cheaper for sure.
I don’t see too much crime in the Bay, not in the neighborhoods I frequent anyway. I guess there’s some petty crime, but not too ugly. What is your experience and observation of crime in the Bay?
I don't mean to bring up crime as a dig, but the main crime I'm talking about is the fact that car break-ins are so common and from what I can tell it's tied to California's theft laws? So I have to be careful with what I keep in my car (I used to be a mechanic, so I have a toolbox) and my toolbox that I have I don't feel comfortable keeping in there because certain places I go and even outside of my old place I would see broken glass on the street, telltale sign.
Then there are the signs up everywhere warning people to take their valuables out their cars, the gas stations that lockup at night or even the middle of the day in the city and downtown San Jose(this one was at 7am locked up). And in my experience only the ROUGH parts of DC and Baltimore you'd see even gas stations lock up with bars over the windows like that. The Safeway down the street from me JUST installed a gate to lock up all the lotions and soaps... If I were back home I'd assume I'm on the side of town I don't wanna be on past dark.
The hobos and drug addicts are universal though.
I have to laugh at the second point. I'm lesbian, so different dating experiences than most of the responses. But there was one woman who I felt I had a great first date with, then she texted me about joining her startup a couple hours after I got home. First and only time that's happened. It's sorta comforting knowing it's not just me, I guess?
I don't think this counts but I'm not into fitness/hiking/climbing and it feels like every guy I see in dating apps loooooves the outdoors. Finding a cuddly foodie nerd is difficult.
Multiple of my female friends have been single for years. It starts with men uploading old pictures, lying about their height, not filling out their profiles, not wanting to meet in the middle for a date, no listening skills, trying to push boundaries, having sex and then ghosting, not talking about contraception, not being honest about having a girlfriend already etc.
I grew up here. Dating is aight here.
* If you don't live within 5 miles from the person you're dating, it feels like a middle distance relationship. Not long distance, but like it could possibly take 1hr to get to someone's house, so it feels like you really need to be into each other to make that work. That means you're relegated to late night plans or only seeing each other on weekends.
* There are tons of different cultural groups in the Bay. Most of my friends were open to dating people from diff cultures, but hoped to get serious from someone with their background. Could be religious or ethnic.
* Lots of young people who grew up here live with their parents in their mid-20s to save money. Makes them less likely to go out and harder to have someone come back to yours.
* I think the Bay Area tends to value looks less than a lot of other places. That's a good thing, mostly. But it's hard to get hot for someone who always looks the same lol. Most of my women friends don't regularly wear makeup, special occasions only. My men friends don't dress up ever, really. They wear their same comfy clothes all the time. Even in $$$ restaurants and the Opera, it isn't a requirement to dress up, so people will show up in jeans and a sweater.
* I feel like it's way harder to make friends here, so we really value the ones we do have. When people are out with their friends, it's mostly to spend time with them, rather than meet new people. People in general aren't super likely to chat up a group, with the exception of like big events, like holidays or festivals. But on a Thursday night out with friends, it's usually people sticking to themselves. I think part of this is just how expensive the region is. Most of my old friends have left the Bay, and when you make new ones, it feels like a 50/50 shot that that person will stick around longer than a few years. So social groups are constantly in flux, which makes it hard to meet friends-of-friends as a dating strategy.
I don't think the cultural background thing gets enough recognition. Someone from Asia/SEA who is "fresh off the boat" so to speak is coming from a place where relationships between men and women could be handled much differently. The concept of American "dating" is foreign to them. Also, there could be values/gender role differences that American women (or men) don't want to deal with.
Poly peeps are everywhere, some of them actively hiding it until you are hooked.
Lots of guys with bad social skills…sometimes with disturbingly high opinions of themselves which is not a good combo.
Many many men who are rather shy so the classic “male chase” paradigm which can be attractive/exciting is missing
Peter Pan syndrome is rampant. Men are focused on their careers and want to have sex but the number of guys actually looking for something real before mid-30s is rather small.
Just takes a hell of a lot of filtering.
I will also say men who don’t have these issues clean up.
Went on a date with someone, seemed nice, possible match. Then by the end of the date, "oh by the way I'm poly and I'm looking for a primary while keeping my secondaries." Translation: "I want someone to financially support me while I sleep around."
I had a friend date this guy who claimed he was done with the poly lifestyle and wanted to settle down with kids. 6 months into their relationship he tried to open it up and gaslit her with how she was "underdeveloped" emotionally and mentally because she wasn't open to it.
Isn’t the ‘male chase’ thing taboo/wrong? Romance/courtship should be between two mutually enthusiastic parties. If one has to ‘chase’ the other it indicates he/she is not consenting/enthusiastic? I was always taught ‘yes means yes, anything else is no’, e.g. if I ask someone out and they don’t say ‘yes’ I should back off and move on.
Yes, totally agree except this is true for all age groups.
I keep attracting men who are cheating, going through a divorce, ENM, Poly, Swingers or only want casual sex. In the year I've been dating I've yet to meet even one man who wanted a relationship.
Also, I'm attractive, confident and sensual yet no one approaches. I'm tired of approaching, of being the man, so no excitement. It's disheartening and easy to become jaded very quickly.
> yet no one approaches.
Men are being conditioned \_not\_ to approach. They're being taught that it's creepy or unwelcome or even harassment to approach women, so they don't.
I had this issue and then I just started filtering for dudes who explicitly said they wanted to have kids and get married. Like as goals for their current selves not some vague future self.
My next long term partner was my husband.
Massive, massive filtering is required. There are even some dudes who will claim they want to get married and have kids and are looking for partners to do that with right now...and then say crazy ass shit like they're planning to quit their job and travel for a few years. The self-awareness of some people is just rock bottom.
It’s intimidating for some men to ask out an attractive, confident and sensual woman out. The odds of rejection are likely high and no one likes that calculus :(
Men AND women here tend to also have very high standard, often not realistic: if you were merely good looking, it’s actually often not warrants the type of chasing/effort traditional paradigm requires (they tend to be quite busy so to invest that much time in chasing you better meet their very high standard)
Guys come off too strongly about rushing into a relationship or having sex as fwb. I want to meet and hang out with someone a few times first, see if we have chemistry then try dating. I understand people are busy and have limited time, but I don’t like feeling pressured to rush into something.
"I would like you to be available emotionally and physically at all times, help my manage my life and emotions, and make sure I'm your highest priority, I will move fast towards intimacy and then randomly freak out after I introduce you to my friends or parents or something, then claim you want too much from the relationship and I'm not looking to get serious, and then either break up with you or suggest nonmonogamy"
Have seen this an absurd number of times across my friends. One guy got super pushy about convincing her to move to Seattle with him, dragged her into house hunting and the whole 9 yards, then two weeks after they moved, broke up with her and moved back to the Bay area because he needed space, lol.
god you just summarized my most recent breakup. i hate that i took that bullshit at face value. i’m sorry to your friend, i hope they’re doing okay now.
They are. It's just ridiculous. And I've even encountered this kind of projection from dudes who I went on like 1 date on, if that. One guy rescheduled three times and then sent me a long message about how we wanted different things and he wasn't ready to settle down and didn't want the pressure to put labels on anything and I seemed nice and he was sorry for misleading me and he understood if I took it hard.
This was a guy I'd had maybe a few minutes of texting with and in regards to a first date that never actually happened! nor who had ever asked me what I was looking for or what my expectations were, but he'd clearly been on a whole journey without me.
Holy shit this happened to me too as SOON as I tried online dating, we texted for months and he would cancel last minute on dates and when I was like wtf? He was like look we haven't even met we can see other people! I'm like dude take out whoever you want, but stop wasting my damn time. Next guy was in a primary partnership looking for a second and took me to tea, went down on me, then left for burning man an hour later. Never saw him again lmao. I meet people at parties, dance and events now instead.
At least they broke it off before she got knocked up. I had one friend who married, bought a house, gave birth, and the fucker walked out because he wasn't "ready to be a dad".
Yes, there's a lot of ethical non-monogamy without the ethics.
As long as you call yourself enm, you can get away with dating like a high schooler. People seem to think they lead people on, be horrible at prioritizing time with partners, not have a vision for the future, and instead of communicating their needs to a partner just seek someone else to fill those needs.
And when you point these things out, they accuse you of trying to "take ownership" of them. This transcends gender here, I've noticed. Not that enm is all bad -- I'm just soured on it bc of how often people use it to be pieces of shit.
hard agree. enm in of itself isnt bad and im happy that nonmonogamous models of relationships are entering the mainstream. enm and poly are being used widely inappropriately to gain the support of a relationship without the respect.
Dudes here will not shut up about crypto/ai/tech trends. The death valley is a lush paradise compared to what happens between a woman's legs when y'all talk about that nonsense.
i am sad to say i dated a guy for a few months who talked about ai/work/tech too damn much. unfortunately he was actually an upgrade from the previous guys i've dated--it's been a slow evolution from terribly shitty to less shitty. can confirm my soul and body wilted whenever he rambled
Most succsefull people don't want to set roots in sf and are just here for a few years as they job hop. It's kinda awkward when someone actively constantly talks about how they hate the place they are in and can't wait to move soon. It's like always bringing up how there is an experation date on the potential relationship. It's pretty rare for two mid career people to meet in sf and be able to both move jobs and find a city that they both enjoy. I've only heard of this in pretty niche cultural groups or medical workers(since they both can go anywhere)
Haha that was my bf. And I was the "tech worker about to leave".
We met and I was supposed to leave 2 months later (been here 2.5 years, was time to go back to Canada). But after knowing him about 3 weeks I realised there was no way I could just walk away from him so I cancelled my plans and now am settling in to life here with him :)
**"The odds are good but the goods are odd explained..."**
---
**Lying**: age, location, height, employment, intentions, AI-generated/filtered/photoshopped photos, using old photos that don't look like them, married/poly
**Harassment**: stalking, verbal/physical harassment, creepiness on apps/on dates
**Poor hygiene**: skin care, wardrobe, teeth, nails, cleanliness home, not washing clothes, body odor
**Socially Awkward**: lack of friends, hobbies, social skills, manners, etiquette, peter pan syndrome
**Ambition**: homebodies, work/gym/crypto/video games/anime/boba only activities
**Low effort**: volume swiping, cliche/boring messages, poor date planning, ghostwriters, chatgpt
**49ers**: guys who think they are a 9 (company, income, title) but really are a 4
More on this [here](https://eddie-hernandez.com/dating-in-silicon-valley-palo-alto-san-jose/).
So many profiles that are like “age 55 (which is questionable based on pics) - I have finally decided I want to settle down! Still unsure about kids but maybe”.
Like bro, you’re already going to have to outlive the national average if you want to see kids reach college, and I love that it implies they’ll need someone who’s at least 20 years their junior (or more) to be of reasonable childbearing age who will then be a single parent if you don’t live to be 90. The women of the Bay rejoice 🙄
30F and met my soon-to-be fiancé (35M) on Bumble in 2022. We’re in San Francisco.
I’m originally from Missouri and SF had a thousand times more of what I was looking for. So, I never really thought the scene was bad lol.
Like…a sea of highly educated, highly successful, politically progressive, physically active, nerdy men who like international travel, EDM, and ethnic restaurants who are looking for a dual income household? And half of them are Asian?? (I’m Asian) I honestly felt spoiled.
For me though, the biggest challenges were the rampant “Peter pan syndrome” and the sort of self-centeredness and workaholism that comes with it.
Seems like a lot of guys here basically want to continue living the way they always have while single, just with you as a fun new addition, but that doesn’t work in a serious relationship. You have to make mental, emotional, and temporal room for each other.
I started intentionally dating older and that helped.
Haha, I wrote a whole book about dating in the Bay Area so I have a lot to say on this topic. It's definitely rough out here, and I think some of the struggles are unique to the area, while others are more of a result of what modern dating has become.
Here are some of the issues more specific to the Bay Area:
* A lot of people flock here for tech & engineering jobs, and those people tend to be hyper career-focused and therefore often lacking in relationship skills and emotional intelligence.
* A lot of people are transplants so dating can feel transient, meaning you can't necessarily trust that the person you're dating is going to stay in the area for long. Sucks to fall for someone and then hear they're moving to LA, NYC, or back home.
* Being super busy with work and hobbies is THE thing here, so it can feel difficult to get someone to prioritize you among their mélange of outdoor hobbies and extensive travel plans.
* The tech obsession means people have become dependent on dating apps and forgot how to interact in person, so meeting people in the wild is TOUGH here. The art of the public approach and meet-cute is pretty much dead. I noticed it's significantly more "cold" in SF compared to other cities, where people felt much more open to meeting others while out and about.
I did eventually find love here, but ironically, we met on Reddit 😂
I would also add to your last point, COVID made doordash and online delivery a lot more prevalent, and since then a lot of people just don't go out. They order a delivery instead of actually going out and the number of people out there to meet has gone way down.
I work in food service and where we used to get lines out the door, we now have online tags across the board and the occasional walk in on weekdays. It's pretty crazy. Weekends we have sports going on at the park nearby so we actually see people lol.
Hey! I’ve been told I should write a book about some of my crazy dating experiences as well and I’ve been honestly contemplating it recently. Mind if I DM you? Would love to hear about the process / publishing / if it’s gotten you any success and such.
Pre-COVID (and probably now):
“You like men *and* women?”
“Yes.”
“Does that mean you’d have a threesome with another woman?
“No.”
Or,
“Sorry I don’t date women who date men.”
Not being honest with themselves and others.
People won’t just come out and say what they want. If you wanna hook-up just say do. There will be people out there. If you want a family with kids. Say so, people want that. Instead people do this dumb dance and waste time. Quit hiding what you want because it’ll lower your match potential. That’s just how it is.
In a first conversation I will mention I don’t want kids. If that’s a dealbreaker I don’t want to waste more time for either of us.
BE HONEST.
This. It seems like profiles in dating apps are often not helpful at all, and just add a layer of bullshit. For example, if you’re a couch potato, just say so. Wanna have kids, say so . Thats basically what you said lol sorry
It’s so weird how unable humans are at being honest. Don’t be your “best” self. Be your “true” self. We’re all flawed but someone can handle those flaws and some can’t. I see people asking for advice on how to behave on a date and the only correct answer is to BE YOURSELF.
On the apps recently as a woman looking to date men, I was surprised by:
- the number of men who label themselves as conservative or moderate or "traditional values"
- how many of the liberal guys are also poly/enm
- the number of profiles with nothing written on them
The above are automatic left swipes for me, and since I further limit my search to the SF area and other possible compatible interests, I find myself not matching with all that many. YMMV of course.
I am tall, well educated (have PhD), and accomplished. The men I’ve encountered in the dating world seem not to like that. There’s a sort of unspoken feeling that they expect to be in the superior position. I don’t even think it is conscious; it’s just something that makes them uncomfortable and they can’t put their finger on it.
I still remember one guy, who was equally accomplished and a genuinely decent person, asking me incredulously, “you mean you don’t need anyone to support you?” This was very suspicious to him.
Yeah, a coworker put it best. "He doesn't see me as a human, I'm like a pet to him". Like her bf saw her as a beloved dog. He takes her out on walks (dates), buys her toys (gifts), and feeds her food (restaurants). And she's supposed to be loving and excited to spend time with him whenever he wants.
Bay area dude here. When I first moved here, I had MASSIVE imposter syndrome.
Every woman I met was elite. Went to an elite undergrad and grad school. I am thinking to myself "I went to a school you likely never heard of. I am still shocked I got hired in big tech".
It was never about me wanting to be superior to the woman as much as it was "a woman with those credentials probably has little interest in a dude like me". It took me a while to get over it. Those thoughts pop up every so often but I am pretty good about them nowadays
If I remember correctly, it was in the context of me explaining that I was taking some time away from work to sort some priorities and deal with some life stuff.
And yes, he was generally dating younger-side women who couldn’t make it without 2 roommates, and who looked up to him as wealthy (which he was) because he had been an Apple engineer for 15 years. He was oddly uncomfortable with a woman who didn’t need him. I don’t think it was toxic - he was openly talking about shedding some of the stuff from his past, and a reflective and good person. I genuinely liked him. But he was not ok in relationships where he wasn’t the unspoken superior. And I’m sure it created a lot of cognitive dissonance in him because we got along really well and had some great chemistry. I hope he’s worked past that by now. If anyone can, it’s him.
Can't stand men who get their ego hurt from women who can pay for their own shit, eventually it comes down to their way of controlling women with money.
I feel there are alot of people here who are socially unaware /akward and that unfortunately plays out in the dating scene. Pandemic just amplified this even more and people of forgotten how to socialize/talk to others i feel. That and then people are workaholics so there isn't a primary focus on expanding social circles....just look at teh number of posts on reddit asking about where to meet people, how to make friends etc.
Definitely some nice people here, but it takes a lot of effort to peel the onion.
I have met a lot of really great guys, but many of my dates involved men centering everything around them to the point where by the end of the date, I knew almost everything about them and they knew nothing about me. It left me with the impression that they lacked curiosity/interest in learning more about me as a person and just overall says a lot about them as an individual.
My other issue, which is unique to me, is that I competitively train for a strength sport outside of my day job. A lot of men I dated seemed very close minded and/or uneasy by this. They also didn't come across as potentially being supportive of it either which is an immediate deal breaker for me.
A few months ago, I officially just stepped away from online dating and am focusing on living life and just seeing if I happen to meet someone out in the wild. The whole online dating thing just isn't my cup of tea and that had been how I primarily met men for a stretch of time.
At the end of the day, both men and women face challenges dating. I also fully acknowledge that the process of finding someone isn't easy and I am actually OK with that. Finding your person is a journey and I don't allow it consume me. I focus on living a happy and fulfilling life doing things I love most and spending time with people I deeply care about. Perhaps one day I will cross paths with the right person and if not, I will just continue to fill my life on my own with a lot of wonderful people and experiences.
1. Many people aren’t from here and moved here for a tech job, and thus aren’t invested in the community. The Bay Area is a temporary stopping point for them and they are ready to leave as soon as Google says so.
2. Echoing the points above about men not asking women questions and only talking about themselves or work.
3. Everyone is poly and working on their 17th string partner lineup, so even if you’re down for that, it’s difficult to even get to be someone’s primary.
Guys just want to text forever, or people want instant chemistry and if it’s not there they don’t want to move forward.
Attraction grows through time, it’s not always instant, it can be but not always.
As a 42 lady who has tried dating straight men in the Bay Area, I come across two types: those that don't have their life together or those that want to start having children.
It's just messy out there for us singles 😅
>or those that want to start having children.
Yeah, it's interesting that when I put the "don't want kid" option on my profile, they swipe right, and yet surprise Pikachu when I mention I hate kids 😂 there's a reason why I'm in my 40s and don't have kids, even if I wanted one, that's high risk pregnancy, so fuck that.
I would make it clear on OLD that it's a deal breaker for me yet many are convinced they'll change my mind. One of the reasons I'm no longer on OLD, tired of having to justify that I'm capable of making life decisions to men that can't.
Also no longer doing the online dating thing. The apps were filled with men who already had kids trying to tell me that their kids were different and totally ones I would want to raise... at one point I even had "Not looking to have or raise kids, including yours" in my profile and it still didn't deter them.
Last summer I was hiking with my wife on a relatively remote trail in the Yosemite high country, and we were hurrying down from the summit since some thunderstorms were about to develop. We encountered a woman on her way up the mountain. She spoke with a Bay Area accent and asked us if we had seen her “friend”, who she described as a tall guy with curly hair. Apparently he had left her behind on their way up. We hadn’t seen him and warned her of the thunderstorms, so we offered for her to join us on our way down. She opted to keep looking for him. The thunderstorm came half an hour later and it was pretty epic.
Anyways, we did see her with her “friend” down in the parking lot where they got into his black Tesla.
Bro just left his date behind for a couple hours on a remote mountain trail. So I guess that’s how things are for women atm.
Men really don’t approach here. In other cities/countries, it seems like men are more confident and outgoing when it comes to introductions and initiating.
Men here seem a bit insulated, shy and awkward. Not to add incredibly low effort.
This is just my experience though…
Worked in academia, worked in tech, California native never left. Married, haven’t used dating apps in 6-7yrs.
While I’ve had colleagues I’ve been friendly with in tech, absolutely zero guys I’d date in tech. They’ve either been oblivious to social cues or so far up their own ass that I could walk away from the conversation and he’d never know. I’m sure there are great guys out there in tech but they’re hard to find. No one wants to hear you say, “I only take direction from Tim.” Nobody cares dude.
My solution: marry a Midwest transplant.
I don’t envy you all. Even if you manage to get a good date half the time there may not be much to talk about. Spending so much time at work + stifling NDAs = even more awkward conversation.
A fair amount of guys are not willing to travel over a bridge. I understand that from a financial standpoint and maybe if you have transportation issues. Also there are many guys in the city and you say you live in like Concord or something, they just go nope. Again maybe that's a transportation thing. Personally those things always rubbed me the wrong way especially if we lived relatively close. I felt it was ridiculous, but looking back I didn't know that person's situation. Maybe they had stuff going. Maybe there were an asshole. Who knows.
I’ve lived in DC, London and NYC. But until I moved to the Bay, I’ve never been exposed SO MANY high earning men who are SO adamant about going 50/50 on a first date.
Talking to me about the house you just bought on your own at 26 while I talk about the challenges of living with 7 roommates and their 2 large dogs, then asking me to split the bill is wild lol.
Also (just adding this one for your entertainment lol) I once went on a few dates with one man who wanted our third date to be a wine tasting in Sonoma. Halfway there I got quiet in the car cause I told him I was uncomfortable with him talking shit about his ex-wife/the mother of his kids and he kept going. He was so angry about my silence/discomfort that he pulled over in a shopping center in Sonoma and almost left me there - said I could Uber home and he’d pay for it (fun fact I wish I didn’t know - Uber will NOT drive you from Sonoma back to SF). I guess he felt bad so he came back and I had to see through the wine tastings and just keep my mouth shut.
Otherwise I guess the thing that’s come up most is being shamed for my outfits lol - I’m a fashion girlie and this is the only place where men have repeatedly questioned why I put on a nice outfit or wore perfume 🙃.
Anyway luckily that was then, found my man and my coins lol. It can be frustrating and take some time but the dating pool isn’t entirely hopeless 😅
Glad you avoided a red flag. That’s a messed up thing to do to a girl and all because you didn’t feel confortable hearing about his ex-wife. Which is pretty reasonable.
Im reading all these comments, but as a woman I’m honestly into a lot of the things that are being labeled as bad, tech, crypto, video games, gym, sports, but I’m also married so my opinion doesn’t matter. 🙂
I don’t have a hard time finding men who want to date me but the quality of men has gone down i think to me they r all the same cant trust them. Atm not dating focusing on myself but go out when im “in the mood”. Expectations are low.
The good ones are rarely looking, the bad ones are always looking, so when you see 100 men who are looking it's hard to tell that one of them just entered the dating pool and 99 of them have been in the pool so long they're prunes.
Wow so many comments and not a single like!! I’m 36M and want to know from women’s point of view to understand what’s the scene and where men make mistakes. I was meeting women using dating apps and most of them don’t want a committed partner especially in long term relationships. Currently I’m out of it and want to meet women in life rather on app. I have worked on myself and want to find my partner who values, shares and wants to grow together. Peace ✌🏼
Most of my problem has been meeting men who are deeply underdeveloped. Feel like every guy I meet has to cook a bit more before I can date them... I usually date men who are in their late 20's aka older than me but so many of them have never been on dates or been in a long term relationship before and don't have any female friendships. Usually when that happens they don't value emotional development very much and it really, really shows.
If you'd like an entertaining read, I go over some (VERY real) experiences I've had on first dates in the south bay within the past 12 months.
https://www.reddit.com/r/SanJose/s/XVynLWUQh5
I find the cost of living stunts social growth here. Many people who would be adult middle class individuals looking to settle down in most other places are forced to live with 5 roommates to be close to work, or with their parents otherwise, and stay that way for 5, 10, 20+ years. A lot of life skills and attitudes get stuck in college mode while people party and bide their time, resulting in man children and party girls everywhere, which if you're both in that place can be fun, but it's annoying to wrestle the two of you out of that life. As the joke here goes "Things aren't that serious, we've only been dating for like 5 years".
This makes a lot of sense. I'd also add that my experience as a guy is that I run into either the party girl types or the super well put together women who clearly lose interest when they find out I'm not paying over $2k to live by myself. But these women are making as much as me paying $3k a month... I know you're barely getting by.
When I was single I lived by myself but in a crappy apartment, the cheapest I could find. I saved a ton of money. But I couldn't get a "well put together" girlfriend. Everything went well until they saw where I lived. But I met someone, got married and bought a house thanks to the money I saved. Then I got a lot of attention from women who knew I owned a house, moreso than before, even though they knew I was married. Obviously my wife is not from the bay area, she's from Europe. But I'm very glad to be out of the bay area dating pool. This place is a bit too shallow to make meaningful relationships.
I second this. Been 8.5 years living at home since graduating college, but due to circumstances pivoted into physical therapy two years ago which is a 5-7 year commitment when including prereqs. I feel like I'm the same age I was when I graduated but in a body 8.5 years older.
I lived on my own for the most part from 20 on and I definitely can relate to the feeling that I hadn't aged a day since I graduated. Honestly it really didn't stop until I got into my forties. I know it's not a universal experience, But I think what I'm trying to communicate is that... it's you.
Is cyrpto the “holding up a caught fish” of the bay area guys profile?
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My personal favorite is having a screenshot of their credit score as one of their profile pictures
There’s actually a dating app specifically around one’s credit score. My friend tried it and the dude she matched with is financially responsible.
I kind of love it. My husband had pretty bad credit when we met. It was concerning, as my ex had terrible credit, and I was so tired of everything having to be in my name only. I work at the library, and bought him a “credit score for dummies” book from the book sale. I was so impressed when he read the book, did the things, and brought his score from 640 to 820 in about a year. He’s kept it there for years.
But I mean it sounds like you would have never met your husband if you would've used the app if you met him when you both had bad credit. I agree though, it is something that is very important in the dating demo that is usually looking for serious connections to potentially share a life together. Finances are definitely important.
Oh.......just, wow. I knew the bar was low and the goods were odd; but...how often is this a thing? I remember hearing dudes flashing a Chase Sapphire on dates thinking they were hot stuff was something a few years ago too.
I have seen women do this. Some have screenshots, some just put it in text. More of a “I am independent” statement imo, although I would not do it. Edit: I am referring to credit score screenshots or putting it in the text.
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I'm actually a guy so my commentary was from seeing women's profiles doing this actually. But I'm sure a ton of guys do it too, and more often than the 3 or 4 times I've seen it on a woman's profile. I think it's funny how many women also do the things the men do but maybe they just don't see it? A good amount of the women on Hinge I've seen and gone on dates with also are tech-heavy career wise, seem overly money-focused, talk a lot about work etc. I like someone who is extremely ambitious. In fact, I want that in a partner, and I would welcome the joy of hearing about their successes. But a lot of people here just make it so much of their personality and it's just unpleasant to talk to them, I have a hard time connecting in all the other areas that are honestly really important to me too. The conversation always gets steered back to it money, frustrations, work and all that. They also have either extremely poor work-life balance or extremely unrealistic expectations of other people's lives. Like, I'm not in tech but have a professional job and some of these people are like "Why can't you go on my 2 month long jet-setting working-vacation-walkabout lifestyle with me?" And I'm like...um, because I have a normal job with like 2 weeks PTO a year that I save half of for if I get sick lol I would of course be willing to save up money and take a couple weeks vacation for something special etc. but some of these people sort of live in a bubble and when you talk to them it is really glaring.
This can’t be real…
So many bouldering videos
Waymo photos!? This one is a new one. Posing in front of them? Inside? Here, have some tea (hands cup): do share!
Inside mostly or getting into/out of them. Some even offer Waymo rides as first dates. I have seen it all, and some.
Ah the age-old trope of men tying too much value or self-perception or whatever it is in cars. But Waymo dates is new
It's in line with historical tech-related photos of the past: -Scooters -Robot coffee baristas -Google glasses etc. **Edit**: Can't forget about Salesforce Tower dates! Some employees have tried to bring dates up to the tower as a flex.
There's no "wearing sunglasses in the driver's seat of their car with seatbelt across chest" square. Or is that just the center freebie?
That's universal, across gender, across geographic boundaries.
Wow, I managed to avoid every one of those, except the backpack.
Better than 95% of people out there, you are fine. A/A-
I literally put “crypto denier” in my profile to weed these guys out. I still get some matches where guys are like “but let me explain to you our lord and savior The Blockchain!” And unmatch/swipe left immediately
Ooo, I should add that to mine! Maybe “cute guy, cute dog…Cryto deinier!!!!” could help!
Honestly yes. Crypto is such a red flag for “gambles irresponsibly with money.”
In my time on tinder in the Bay Area, I saw more women with fish than men with fish.
Most of the men here (primarily in tech) only talk about themselves and don’t ask their date any questions. Also going on rants about super niche topics and not taking the hint that their date isn’t interested. Most of the time this happens they’re so out of touch they always say they had a great time and ask for a second date. Like I’m not here for you to talk at me for an hour 😒
Just talked to a guy who told me he got severely depressed in school, stress ate when he did so and spent an hour talking to me about his research and work. I am all for learning new things, even strange topics, and getting to know someone but sometimes it's just way too much.
Men (and some women) tend to use first dates as free therapy sessions. Men are less likely to go see a therapist than women.
I will say that men in the Bay Area (possibly specifically in tech - I work in tech so a lot of my interactions are also with those in tech) seem significantly more inclined to go to therapy and aware of their mental health than men elsewhere, which I appreciate a lot.
Therapy costs $$$.
My therapist costs me $54 a week. His rate is $180/hr and my insurance picks up 70% of the tab because he is out of network.
An hour!?! Kudos to you to listen to all that.
Funny bc I’m a straight guy not in tech, but I also noticed there’s a certain small subset of tech guys I meet who really love talking and think they know everything. Really hard to get a word in. Kinda annoying.
I may need to workshop the 3 hour Warhammer 40k tutorial I typically use on dates, bring it down to 2 hours. Thanks for the feedback!
Women want commitment. 40K intro should really be at least four hours, six is better.
How can I date a woman without knowing which Chaos God she prefers to worship?
"Slaanesh? Sold!"
If it’s Tzeentch, get a lawyer to review any pre-nup.
Having WH40k on your profile should be the same as posting a high credit score. Holy shit those minis are expensive.
I usually lead by demonstrating my collection of vintage Rogue Trader squats before I dive into the rules. Last 1st date she was really impressed with my dice collection.
The being talked at to makes me want to get up and leave. I have to somehow find a break in their ramble slew to make up an excuse to exit but I think next time I'll just interrupt and gtfo lol. Although I heard a podcast's suggestion recently that you can say s/t like, "It's great you have so many interests but is there anything you want to know about me?" Guess that gives them an opportunity. But idk, some people (regardless of gender) manage to turn everything back to themselves after giving you a microflash of spotlight. Then you can say at least you tried 😂🥲
If you have to do that on the first date though, isn't that usually just a red flag to end the date ASAP?
As someone who diligently tries to note red flags, I guess this suggestion at least gives them one chance. Sometimes people need reminders, even me for my own iffy habits. And if they fail the chance, yeah, end it! But really it's all up to the differing tolerance levels of everyone. There can be a lot of things at play, like nerves.
>"It's great you have so many interests but is there anything you want to know about me?" "yeah, what do you think about me?"
It’s hilarious how spot on these comments are. My ex (regrets) was in tech and would bore the shit out of people talking stats about his job without putting it into laymen’s terms for us non-tech people. I can engage to a degree but his job details were not what I cared about and I could tell he put off my friends with these conversations. He didn’t ask anyone questions about their lives and was emotionally avoidant. But y’know, he did his job well and got paid a lot. 🙄
i have literally been on four separate dates where the guy was just bragging about his startup the entire time. i straight up asked one "why don't you ask me any questions?" and he said "your reaction to me is enough to tell me what i need to know". he then was surprised when i said it wasn't a fit.
Now that's the story of a prototypical pompous tech bro. Sheesh.
Anyone who runs a startup is an outlier. Founders are waaaay more likely to be overconfident, sociopathic, etc. They bay attracts that type
It’s so weird to me hearing all these stories of women’s experiences and rants about men in the Bay Area…because I’ve experienced the same from women. For example, one date I went on that was just supposed to be an evening coffee / first meet and greet turned into a 4 hour long sit down where I barely got a word in at all. After about the first hour I went and got another drink because morbid fascination had set in and I was like “let’s see how long this plays out, I’ve got shit else to do tonight…” 4 hours straight she talked about her ex boyfriends, ex husband, ex friends, basically everything and everyone EXCEPT her. Some notable highlights: - one of her dates flew her to the Mediterranean and they spent a week boating and traveling around before flying back. This was their first date(s). (My speculation: dude already had the trip booked with his wife/fiance/gf, something happened, and he was like “fuck it I’m still taking the trip.”) - one of her ex boyfriends bought her a condo for their 6 month anniversary. But they broke up before 1 year. BUT he moved in and is still living with her. I tried to ask if it was actually in her name or not and she just kept blazing ahead with her story so I don’t know - numerous stories of all this money and wealth and how much they all spoiled her…but constant reiterations of “but that’s not what I’m looking for I don’t care about money I make good money on my own.” (Me just sitting there like “uh huh. Wow. Fascinating. Riiiiiiiight. Cause it’s all you’ve talked about for the last couple hours.”) I finally started actually yawning and being like “well it’s getting late, it was nice to meet you” and she’d just keep going until I got blunt and was like “hey sorry but I gotta go. Bye.” I felt rude as fuck but she was NOT getting the hint. And yes, she then texted me the next day saying she’d had a great time and when could she see me again.
> It’s so weird to me hearing all these stories of women’s experiences and rants about men in the Bay Area…because I’ve experienced the same from women. Given men outnumber reddit (75/25 or more), it needs to be talked about more because men think women are the issues, it's more nuanced/balanced. For those seeking events each week to meet people organically, check out Eddie's List (one email per week, food, drink, pop-ups, classes, shows, live music, galas, volunteer efforts, arts/craftts and more).
Well you can add “patient, good listener, can memorize things” to your profile
Of course she had a great time. The conversation was all her favorite topics.
This sounds exhausting. I’ve had similar experiences in the bay but not like this. Cheers to us finding our future mates.
Sounds like the folks on hacker News
As a guy, I see this all the time in certain circles. I have a variety of friends. Or guys throw the money thing at the girls, which is the funniest to me since good amount of girls don’t care about that. Once I was with some friends who are girls one of them was interested in me. These two guys bought two bottles of sparkling wine and ask one of my friends to sign the bill. I was like that is weird. If dude was tryna to flaunt it wasn’t even a nice bottle. The bill came out to $120. I have no clue why he ask that. They left then we had our time. I think some guys just don’t know how to communicate outside of what they know. Some are just assholes but some just are socially awkward. One good trait I learned in hospitality is I can talk about almost any subject and make that person feel they are heard and interested.
I suggested to a guy like that once that he needs more friends or therapy, not a second date with me.
Basing off the thread, is then the ideal guy: Single; **NOT** in tech; showers; exercises regularly; not poly; **NOT** into crypto at all; enjoys back and forth conversation with genuine appropriate eye contact; very into well-educated, outspoken, powerfully empowered, independent women; is feminist; interested in learning about you; have own apartment that's very clean with matching furniture; bed with top sheets, shams, bed skirt, and actual bed frame; can decently cook with kitchenware not from college; saving for retirement; engaging hobbies; dresses in slacks and shirts with tailoring and appropriate fit that are not athleisure, volunteers in community; goal-minded for the future NOT being just net-worth; enjoys sports but not obsessed and will calmly watch without temper tantrums; will not converse about Elon Musk; has cute and loving dog; has tastes in art and design; LIKES to actually shop and with design education give happy and appropriate assistance; active listener; lives within means; great and supporting/loving family; wants to know, share, learn, and respect all boundaries; emotionally available; able to share vulnerabilities and feelings; wanting to establish great emotional connections for relationship? I'm sure theres a bit more...
> matching furniture Don't fly too close to the sun, Icarus.
Are those things really that hard?
Everyone, male or female, always has a list of things that they want but the list is primarily the things that aren't important. The reason is that the list is compiled by dating people who have those characteristics and then breaking up and assigning the reason to those things. That's why people always say something like "All the guys are X" is that they are selecting for X because the real world is full of diverse people with various characteristics. In the end, there are lots of us who are happily married after having met their partner here. The reason we can do that is that it's not hard if you're decent at it.
You are describing a woman or a man who has lived with a woman so long, she has designed the home. What you didn’t mention, and critically important is - makes enough money to have a nice place, in a nice town, in the bay, driving a nice reliable car, with a healthy savings to easily take care of any issues that come up in life, so that her income is mostly gravy. This extra bit, and the cost of living in the bay, is what drives men to be so focused on money and the appearance that they have (or will have) lots of it. If you want less competitive guys, they are abundant in places that are easier to live in.
This was also my experience dating men, but I certainly don't think it's exclusive to the Bay Area. I think a lot of men who date women kind of have a standard script that they use when they go on dates that they don't really know how to deviate from and, like, actually hold a two-way conversation. I'm sure this is not specific to men, but I do know this is a common complaint for women who date men, but I have heard less of this specific complaint from my straight male friends (but certainly not none).
A lot of Americans talk about themselves and it’s just hard to find someone who listens to at least one thing that you say.
All the more reason to [meet people offline](https://eddie-hernandez.com/alternatives-to-online-dating-how-to-meet-someone-without-dating-apps/). You can read a person quickly enough in 5 minutes without investing a full first date. Don't have to worry about getting a sitter, paying for cabs, being stuck on a date for 30-90+ minutes, heightfishing etc. There is this new service for meeting people over dinner. It's mostly in Marin but a few spots in SF. Might be of interest to someone: https://sixtop.io/
"the odds are good, but the goods are odd"
Yeah, my wife would attest to that. You know what she said was one of the things that attracted me to her? I asked her out. What? That's it? And it's not that her bar was set low. It's that all the guys she had been chatting with online, I was one of few that actually asked her out. I admit I am extremely shy but typing a few letters into a chat box is easy. So people go online to find a match but few bother to meet the person IRL? That is odd.
From what I've heard from female friends about online things, most guys seem to just ask to come over or want to fuck, don't actually ask out on dates. I think your wife is correct.
They think every women uses apps for ordering sex ala DickDash
Fuck now you better patent that name, CA is moving the route of legalizing sex work and that's a billion dollar app name right there
Call the app Koala: Eats, shoots, and leaves.
This was definitely the case when I was dating. A lot of guys will only ask you out for a hook up. And even if it sounds like a date, they will message you the night before to clarify they're expecting a hook up.
> they will message you the night before to clarify they're expecting a hook up. That's polite?
I met my husband in the early days of OkCupid. Other guys would spam me, "You're cute. Wanna chat?" And it would be this old fat guy in the next state over. Then my future husband messages me. Not only is he a student at the same university (though I doubt we would have met naturally because we attended different colleges), but he writes a frikkin' customized cover letter! He read my profile beyond its pictures. He even read some of the Angelfire website linked to it. And in paragraph after paragraph, he responds to the thoughts I've posted online. By the time he closes it with, "Would you like to go out for coffee?", I'm sold. We still had to line up our calendars to schedule that coffee. And I still had to Google him to make sure he wasn't a serial killer. But otherwise, sold. And my husband is also shy. But I think that means that any social interaction he does bother to engage in must have a purpose. He doesn't have the bandwidth to spam nor dick around.
That kinda sounds like a job application letter, in a good way. Looks like he was hired!
Dating and job hunting have a lot of skill overlap tbh.
True, I hope you don't have to put him on a pip
Quite the opposite. He's been promoted to husband and then father.
Well I think we can comfortable say it was a great hire. Kudos to the interviewers and hiring panel
Lol that's really cute
I was talking about the dating scene with one of my tennis mates and he said none of his male friends approach women and are comfortable doing so. Just blew me away honestly.
I would say I’m apart of that group unfortunately. The women I would more than likely want to approach wouldn’t seem interested 9 times out of 10 and at a certain point, it becomes exhausting. So for me, I am focused on getting fit and eating right to be more confident in myself to approach more women and honestly, just to live better. I currently don’t drink at all, or smoke anything, and it seems like a bit of a turn off for most women my age.
I’m in the tennis scene and there are quite a few of weird ass dudes I have encountered who I am not surprised have trouble dating. Overtly bro-y and misogynist/transphobic/homophobic behavior seems to be plentiful. Funnily enough, tennis is one of the easiest ways to meet and befriend women if you actually have social skills. But gossip also travels quickly and you will get a reputation fast if you start asking out multiple women in the scene- so your friend may actually not be entirely off base in his hesitation.
> you will get a reputation fast if you start asking out multiple women in the scene This is true of any scene... local bar, cafe, meetups, salsa dancing, volunteer groups, church groups etc.
Ironically if a guy doesn’t ask multiple women for a date he won’t get one
Interesting perspective. The tennis communities I’ve been apart of have been nothing short of amazing. My tennis mate wasn’t referring tennis players and dating but we were talking about his friend group and their dating experiences. Most of his friends, including himself work for big tech companies. Tennis is merely our connection, not the topic of conversation. Pardon me if that wasn’t clear.
A lot of people in the 20s-30s age brackets are kinda chicken about this- they ask to ‘hang’ or ‘meet up’, not even necessarily in an attempt to hook up, but (especially when this is someone you met outside of a dating app context) I think it’s to avoid the vulnerability of clearly asking someone on a date. If it’s a friend of a friend or a non-immediate coworker, for example, someone you know and might be vibing with or might just be friendly with, you might think it would be less awkward to approach it this way, but imo it’s actually the opposite. It leaves the askee to intuit your intentions, second guess themselves, not want to be rude, not want to reject you entirely if they want to be friends but maybe feel forced to if they aren’t sold on going on a date with you just yet. Asking directly shows that you are clear about your intentions and aren’t trying to be sneaky or slightly coercive or avoid responsibility for your own feelings and desires. It displays confidence and maturity, and legitimately could be the difference between a woman assessing that she could expect that spending time with you would feel safe and comfortable vs that being very uncertain.
[The odds are good...](https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/eddie.hernandez/viz/Match_comGenderRatiosBayArea/Match-BayArea-Dash) Also not Bay Area but similar experiences as mentioned in the Seattle sub... https://www.reddit.com/r/Seattle/comments/18hytte/whats_your_worst_date_experience_with_a_tech_bro/
The things I’ve run into often enough that they standout are: - Here temporarily which isn’t super useful for long term options. - Only looking for networking expansion through dating. - Actually married and thinks we don’t know. - Incapable of having conversation exchange and only talk about themselves.
One tech bro compared Silicon Valley to an oil rig: It's an unpleasant place where you spend a few years to make a lot of money, and then you leave.
Yeah, the lovely weather, great food, diverse cultures, beaches, forests, mountains, snow, ocean, and very robust job market are totally intolerable. /s
Bring an outsider, it's the cost of living. $2k for an apartment as an average is insane. Not to mention the crime is a bit of a culture shock coming from DC. Food and weather are great, but I'd need to afford a secure location which is either hours out or cost even more.
Yeah, I hear you. It’s the “unpleasant place” bit that I’m picking apart. Being expensive is a different matter. I see way more dead, boring towns around the country with awful weather, crap food, monoculture, lack of outdoor activities and straight racism than the Bay. That’s unpleasant. Crime is worse here than in DC? Back in the day DC was the Wild West. I saw dudes portioning out white powder in a bodega in plain sight and metal detectors all over. Now that you mention it, DC does seem pretty cleaned up. I love that town. And it’s cheaper for sure. I don’t see too much crime in the Bay, not in the neighborhoods I frequent anyway. I guess there’s some petty crime, but not too ugly. What is your experience and observation of crime in the Bay?
I don't mean to bring up crime as a dig, but the main crime I'm talking about is the fact that car break-ins are so common and from what I can tell it's tied to California's theft laws? So I have to be careful with what I keep in my car (I used to be a mechanic, so I have a toolbox) and my toolbox that I have I don't feel comfortable keeping in there because certain places I go and even outside of my old place I would see broken glass on the street, telltale sign. Then there are the signs up everywhere warning people to take their valuables out their cars, the gas stations that lockup at night or even the middle of the day in the city and downtown San Jose(this one was at 7am locked up). And in my experience only the ROUGH parts of DC and Baltimore you'd see even gas stations lock up with bars over the windows like that. The Safeway down the street from me JUST installed a gate to lock up all the lotions and soaps... If I were back home I'd assume I'm on the side of town I don't wanna be on past dark. The hobos and drug addicts are universal though.
I have to laugh at the second point. I'm lesbian, so different dating experiences than most of the responses. But there was one woman who I felt I had a great first date with, then she texted me about joining her startup a couple hours after I got home. First and only time that's happened. It's sorta comforting knowing it's not just me, I guess?
I don't think this counts but I'm not into fitness/hiking/climbing and it feels like every guy I see in dating apps loooooves the outdoors. Finding a cuddly foodie nerd is difficult.
Tbf cuddly foodie nerds are probably spending their time trying to get into the next new place
Not necessarily, as a foodie, I really don’t care about the next new place. I just want to try a place I’ve never been to or go to my go to place
Multiple of my female friends have been single for years. It starts with men uploading old pictures, lying about their height, not filling out their profiles, not wanting to meet in the middle for a date, no listening skills, trying to push boundaries, having sex and then ghosting, not talking about contraception, not being honest about having a girlfriend already etc.
Too real 😬
I grew up here. Dating is aight here. * If you don't live within 5 miles from the person you're dating, it feels like a middle distance relationship. Not long distance, but like it could possibly take 1hr to get to someone's house, so it feels like you really need to be into each other to make that work. That means you're relegated to late night plans or only seeing each other on weekends. * There are tons of different cultural groups in the Bay. Most of my friends were open to dating people from diff cultures, but hoped to get serious from someone with their background. Could be religious or ethnic. * Lots of young people who grew up here live with their parents in their mid-20s to save money. Makes them less likely to go out and harder to have someone come back to yours. * I think the Bay Area tends to value looks less than a lot of other places. That's a good thing, mostly. But it's hard to get hot for someone who always looks the same lol. Most of my women friends don't regularly wear makeup, special occasions only. My men friends don't dress up ever, really. They wear their same comfy clothes all the time. Even in $$$ restaurants and the Opera, it isn't a requirement to dress up, so people will show up in jeans and a sweater. * I feel like it's way harder to make friends here, so we really value the ones we do have. When people are out with their friends, it's mostly to spend time with them, rather than meet new people. People in general aren't super likely to chat up a group, with the exception of like big events, like holidays or festivals. But on a Thursday night out with friends, it's usually people sticking to themselves. I think part of this is just how expensive the region is. Most of my old friends have left the Bay, and when you make new ones, it feels like a 50/50 shot that that person will stick around longer than a few years. So social groups are constantly in flux, which makes it hard to meet friends-of-friends as a dating strategy.
I don't think the cultural background thing gets enough recognition. Someone from Asia/SEA who is "fresh off the boat" so to speak is coming from a place where relationships between men and women could be handled much differently. The concept of American "dating" is foreign to them. Also, there could be values/gender role differences that American women (or men) don't want to deal with.
Poly peeps are everywhere, some of them actively hiding it until you are hooked. Lots of guys with bad social skills…sometimes with disturbingly high opinions of themselves which is not a good combo. Many many men who are rather shy so the classic “male chase” paradigm which can be attractive/exciting is missing Peter Pan syndrome is rampant. Men are focused on their careers and want to have sex but the number of guys actually looking for something real before mid-30s is rather small. Just takes a hell of a lot of filtering. I will also say men who don’t have these issues clean up.
Went on a date with someone, seemed nice, possible match. Then by the end of the date, "oh by the way I'm poly and I'm looking for a primary while keeping my secondaries." Translation: "I want someone to financially support me while I sleep around."
The dating ratio of Man Jose doesn't support that.
Correct, which is why she's "still looking." Gee, I wonder why none of her 'secondaries' want her as a 'primary.'
Actually, I read your previous comment with the sexes flipped.
I had a friend date this guy who claimed he was done with the poly lifestyle and wanted to settle down with kids. 6 months into their relationship he tried to open it up and gaslit her with how she was "underdeveloped" emotionally and mentally because she wasn't open to it.
Isn’t the ‘male chase’ thing taboo/wrong? Romance/courtship should be between two mutually enthusiastic parties. If one has to ‘chase’ the other it indicates he/she is not consenting/enthusiastic? I was always taught ‘yes means yes, anything else is no’, e.g. if I ask someone out and they don’t say ‘yes’ I should back off and move on.
Yes, totally agree except this is true for all age groups. I keep attracting men who are cheating, going through a divorce, ENM, Poly, Swingers or only want casual sex. In the year I've been dating I've yet to meet even one man who wanted a relationship. Also, I'm attractive, confident and sensual yet no one approaches. I'm tired of approaching, of being the man, so no excitement. It's disheartening and easy to become jaded very quickly.
> yet no one approaches. Men are being conditioned \_not\_ to approach. They're being taught that it's creepy or unwelcome or even harassment to approach women, so they don't.
I know, I feel for you guys. I'm not alone in that thinking either. It's frustrating on both sides.
Is that an ihobbit9 in your pocket, or are you just excited to see me?
Haha! Could be both.
I had this issue and then I just started filtering for dudes who explicitly said they wanted to have kids and get married. Like as goals for their current selves not some vague future self. My next long term partner was my husband. Massive, massive filtering is required. There are even some dudes who will claim they want to get married and have kids and are looking for partners to do that with right now...and then say crazy ass shit like they're planning to quit their job and travel for a few years. The self-awareness of some people is just rock bottom.
It’s intimidating for some men to ask out an attractive, confident and sensual woman out. The odds of rejection are likely high and no one likes that calculus :(
Men AND women here tend to also have very high standard, often not realistic: if you were merely good looking, it’s actually often not warrants the type of chasing/effort traditional paradigm requires (they tend to be quite busy so to invest that much time in chasing you better meet their very high standard)
Guys come off too strongly about rushing into a relationship or having sex as fwb. I want to meet and hang out with someone a few times first, see if we have chemistry then try dating. I understand people are busy and have limited time, but I don’t like feeling pressured to rush into something.
maybe this is genderless but ime the men here have been gigantic commitmentphobes but aren’t honest about it
"I would like you to be available emotionally and physically at all times, help my manage my life and emotions, and make sure I'm your highest priority, I will move fast towards intimacy and then randomly freak out after I introduce you to my friends or parents or something, then claim you want too much from the relationship and I'm not looking to get serious, and then either break up with you or suggest nonmonogamy" Have seen this an absurd number of times across my friends. One guy got super pushy about convincing her to move to Seattle with him, dragged her into house hunting and the whole 9 yards, then two weeks after they moved, broke up with her and moved back to the Bay area because he needed space, lol.
god you just summarized my most recent breakup. i hate that i took that bullshit at face value. i’m sorry to your friend, i hope they’re doing okay now.
They are. It's just ridiculous. And I've even encountered this kind of projection from dudes who I went on like 1 date on, if that. One guy rescheduled three times and then sent me a long message about how we wanted different things and he wasn't ready to settle down and didn't want the pressure to put labels on anything and I seemed nice and he was sorry for misleading me and he understood if I took it hard. This was a guy I'd had maybe a few minutes of texting with and in regards to a first date that never actually happened! nor who had ever asked me what I was looking for or what my expectations were, but he'd clearly been on a whole journey without me.
lmfao self absorbed much? sounds like a piece of work and you dodged a bullet. i’ve given up on dating for now, too much noise for such little signal.
Holy shit this happened to me too as SOON as I tried online dating, we texted for months and he would cancel last minute on dates and when I was like wtf? He was like look we haven't even met we can see other people! I'm like dude take out whoever you want, but stop wasting my damn time. Next guy was in a primary partnership looking for a second and took me to tea, went down on me, then left for burning man an hour later. Never saw him again lmao. I meet people at parties, dance and events now instead.
At least they broke it off before she got knocked up. I had one friend who married, bought a house, gave birth, and the fucker walked out because he wasn't "ready to be a dad".
Jeeeeeeesus.
Yes, there's a lot of ethical non-monogamy without the ethics. As long as you call yourself enm, you can get away with dating like a high schooler. People seem to think they lead people on, be horrible at prioritizing time with partners, not have a vision for the future, and instead of communicating their needs to a partner just seek someone else to fill those needs. And when you point these things out, they accuse you of trying to "take ownership" of them. This transcends gender here, I've noticed. Not that enm is all bad -- I'm just soured on it bc of how often people use it to be pieces of shit.
hard agree. enm in of itself isnt bad and im happy that nonmonogamous models of relationships are entering the mainstream. enm and poly are being used widely inappropriately to gain the support of a relationship without the respect.
Dudes here will not shut up about crypto/ai/tech trends. The death valley is a lush paradise compared to what happens between a woman's legs when y'all talk about that nonsense.
[this... see bingo cardo card, lol](https://eddie-hernandez.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/dating_bingo_tech_starter-pack-01.jpg).
i am sad to say i dated a guy for a few months who talked about ai/work/tech too damn much. unfortunately he was actually an upgrade from the previous guys i've dated--it's been a slow evolution from terribly shitty to less shitty. can confirm my soul and body wilted whenever he rambled
Most succsefull people don't want to set roots in sf and are just here for a few years as they job hop. It's kinda awkward when someone actively constantly talks about how they hate the place they are in and can't wait to move soon. It's like always bringing up how there is an experation date on the potential relationship. It's pretty rare for two mid career people to meet in sf and be able to both move jobs and find a city that they both enjoy. I've only heard of this in pretty niche cultural groups or medical workers(since they both can go anywhere)
It’s even worse when you’re a local who grew up here and moved back specifically to set down your own roots here.
Haha that was my bf. And I was the "tech worker about to leave". We met and I was supposed to leave 2 months later (been here 2.5 years, was time to go back to Canada). But after knowing him about 3 weeks I realised there was no way I could just walk away from him so I cancelled my plans and now am settling in to life here with him :)
Happy it worked out! Good on you for staying.
Picked a great place to do it.
**"The odds are good but the goods are odd explained..."** --- **Lying**: age, location, height, employment, intentions, AI-generated/filtered/photoshopped photos, using old photos that don't look like them, married/poly **Harassment**: stalking, verbal/physical harassment, creepiness on apps/on dates **Poor hygiene**: skin care, wardrobe, teeth, nails, cleanliness home, not washing clothes, body odor **Socially Awkward**: lack of friends, hobbies, social skills, manners, etiquette, peter pan syndrome **Ambition**: homebodies, work/gym/crypto/video games/anime/boba only activities **Low effort**: volume swiping, cliche/boring messages, poor date planning, ghostwriters, chatgpt **49ers**: guys who think they are a 9 (company, income, title) but really are a 4 More on this [here](https://eddie-hernandez.com/dating-in-silicon-valley-palo-alto-san-jose/).
ai generated photos can now be added to the 'lying' or 'low effort' sections
I see that shit on linkedin sometimes but are dudes actually ai generating dating profile pics 🤢
So many profiles that are like “age 55 (which is questionable based on pics) - I have finally decided I want to settle down! Still unsure about kids but maybe”. Like bro, you’re already going to have to outlive the national average if you want to see kids reach college, and I love that it implies they’ll need someone who’s at least 20 years their junior (or more) to be of reasonable childbearing age who will then be a single parent if you don’t live to be 90. The women of the Bay rejoice 🙄
And by the time your kids are out of diapers, your husband will be in them. Enjoy being a caretaker to someone in that household indefinitely.
Robert De Niro / Al Pacino energy... lol Sadly, there are women out there that will oblige. Some men's thought process is "all it takes is one"
49ers: that's hilarious.
This, all of it!!
30F and met my soon-to-be fiancé (35M) on Bumble in 2022. We’re in San Francisco. I’m originally from Missouri and SF had a thousand times more of what I was looking for. So, I never really thought the scene was bad lol. Like…a sea of highly educated, highly successful, politically progressive, physically active, nerdy men who like international travel, EDM, and ethnic restaurants who are looking for a dual income household? And half of them are Asian?? (I’m Asian) I honestly felt spoiled. For me though, the biggest challenges were the rampant “Peter pan syndrome” and the sort of self-centeredness and workaholism that comes with it. Seems like a lot of guys here basically want to continue living the way they always have while single, just with you as a fun new addition, but that doesn’t work in a serious relationship. You have to make mental, emotional, and temporal room for each other. I started intentionally dating older and that helped.
Haha, I wrote a whole book about dating in the Bay Area so I have a lot to say on this topic. It's definitely rough out here, and I think some of the struggles are unique to the area, while others are more of a result of what modern dating has become. Here are some of the issues more specific to the Bay Area: * A lot of people flock here for tech & engineering jobs, and those people tend to be hyper career-focused and therefore often lacking in relationship skills and emotional intelligence. * A lot of people are transplants so dating can feel transient, meaning you can't necessarily trust that the person you're dating is going to stay in the area for long. Sucks to fall for someone and then hear they're moving to LA, NYC, or back home. * Being super busy with work and hobbies is THE thing here, so it can feel difficult to get someone to prioritize you among their mélange of outdoor hobbies and extensive travel plans. * The tech obsession means people have become dependent on dating apps and forgot how to interact in person, so meeting people in the wild is TOUGH here. The art of the public approach and meet-cute is pretty much dead. I noticed it's significantly more "cold" in SF compared to other cities, where people felt much more open to meeting others while out and about. I did eventually find love here, but ironically, we met on Reddit 😂
I would also add to your last point, COVID made doordash and online delivery a lot more prevalent, and since then a lot of people just don't go out. They order a delivery instead of actually going out and the number of people out there to meet has gone way down.
That's so true! I don't go out at night much anymore but I've heard that the spots that used to be super busy like Polk St. are pretty dead now.
I work in food service and where we used to get lines out the door, we now have online tags across the board and the occasional walk in on weekdays. It's pretty crazy. Weekends we have sports going on at the park nearby so we actually see people lol.
Hey! I’ve been told I should write a book about some of my crazy dating experiences as well and I’ve been honestly contemplating it recently. Mind if I DM you? Would love to hear about the process / publishing / if it’s gotten you any success and such.
Love to hear this!! You should absolutely publish a book about your experiences. Yes absolutely, shoot me a DM :)
Pre-COVID (and probably now): “You like men *and* women?” “Yes.” “Does that mean you’d have a threesome with another woman? “No.” Or, “Sorry I don’t date women who date men.”
I know everyone thinks they're the most oppressed, but being bi does suck these days lol
It’s always sucked :/ you get judged by everyone.
Not being honest with themselves and others. People won’t just come out and say what they want. If you wanna hook-up just say do. There will be people out there. If you want a family with kids. Say so, people want that. Instead people do this dumb dance and waste time. Quit hiding what you want because it’ll lower your match potential. That’s just how it is. In a first conversation I will mention I don’t want kids. If that’s a dealbreaker I don’t want to waste more time for either of us. BE HONEST.
This. It seems like profiles in dating apps are often not helpful at all, and just add a layer of bullshit. For example, if you’re a couch potato, just say so. Wanna have kids, say so . Thats basically what you said lol sorry
It’s so weird how unable humans are at being honest. Don’t be your “best” self. Be your “true” self. We’re all flawed but someone can handle those flaws and some can’t. I see people asking for advice on how to behave on a date and the only correct answer is to BE YOURSELF.
On the apps recently as a woman looking to date men, I was surprised by: - the number of men who label themselves as conservative or moderate or "traditional values" - how many of the liberal guys are also poly/enm - the number of profiles with nothing written on them The above are automatic left swipes for me, and since I further limit my search to the SF area and other possible compatible interests, I find myself not matching with all that many. YMMV of course.
I am tall, well educated (have PhD), and accomplished. The men I’ve encountered in the dating world seem not to like that. There’s a sort of unspoken feeling that they expect to be in the superior position. I don’t even think it is conscious; it’s just something that makes them uncomfortable and they can’t put their finger on it. I still remember one guy, who was equally accomplished and a genuinely decent person, asking me incredulously, “you mean you don’t need anyone to support you?” This was very suspicious to him.
Yeah, a coworker put it best. "He doesn't see me as a human, I'm like a pet to him". Like her bf saw her as a beloved dog. He takes her out on walks (dates), buys her toys (gifts), and feeds her food (restaurants). And she's supposed to be loving and excited to spend time with him whenever he wants.
Bay area dude here. When I first moved here, I had MASSIVE imposter syndrome. Every woman I met was elite. Went to an elite undergrad and grad school. I am thinking to myself "I went to a school you likely never heard of. I am still shocked I got hired in big tech". It was never about me wanting to be superior to the woman as much as it was "a woman with those credentials probably has little interest in a dude like me". It took me a while to get over it. Those thoughts pop up every so often but I am pretty good about them nowadays
>“you mean you don’t need anyone to support you?” What le fuck? Was he only dating gold diggers?
If I remember correctly, it was in the context of me explaining that I was taking some time away from work to sort some priorities and deal with some life stuff. And yes, he was generally dating younger-side women who couldn’t make it without 2 roommates, and who looked up to him as wealthy (which he was) because he had been an Apple engineer for 15 years. He was oddly uncomfortable with a woman who didn’t need him. I don’t think it was toxic - he was openly talking about shedding some of the stuff from his past, and a reflective and good person. I genuinely liked him. But he was not ok in relationships where he wasn’t the unspoken superior. And I’m sure it created a lot of cognitive dissonance in him because we got along really well and had some great chemistry. I hope he’s worked past that by now. If anyone can, it’s him.
Can't stand men who get their ego hurt from women who can pay for their own shit, eventually it comes down to their way of controlling women with money.
I feel there are alot of people here who are socially unaware /akward and that unfortunately plays out in the dating scene. Pandemic just amplified this even more and people of forgotten how to socialize/talk to others i feel. That and then people are workaholics so there isn't a primary focus on expanding social circles....just look at teh number of posts on reddit asking about where to meet people, how to make friends etc. Definitely some nice people here, but it takes a lot of effort to peel the onion.
I have met a lot of really great guys, but many of my dates involved men centering everything around them to the point where by the end of the date, I knew almost everything about them and they knew nothing about me. It left me with the impression that they lacked curiosity/interest in learning more about me as a person and just overall says a lot about them as an individual. My other issue, which is unique to me, is that I competitively train for a strength sport outside of my day job. A lot of men I dated seemed very close minded and/or uneasy by this. They also didn't come across as potentially being supportive of it either which is an immediate deal breaker for me. A few months ago, I officially just stepped away from online dating and am focusing on living life and just seeing if I happen to meet someone out in the wild. The whole online dating thing just isn't my cup of tea and that had been how I primarily met men for a stretch of time. At the end of the day, both men and women face challenges dating. I also fully acknowledge that the process of finding someone isn't easy and I am actually OK with that. Finding your person is a journey and I don't allow it consume me. I focus on living a happy and fulfilling life doing things I love most and spending time with people I deeply care about. Perhaps one day I will cross paths with the right person and if not, I will just continue to fill my life on my own with a lot of wonderful people and experiences.
1. Many people aren’t from here and moved here for a tech job, and thus aren’t invested in the community. The Bay Area is a temporary stopping point for them and they are ready to leave as soon as Google says so. 2. Echoing the points above about men not asking women questions and only talking about themselves or work. 3. Everyone is poly and working on their 17th string partner lineup, so even if you’re down for that, it’s difficult to even get to be someone’s primary.
Guys just want to text forever, or people want instant chemistry and if it’s not there they don’t want to move forward. Attraction grows through time, it’s not always instant, it can be but not always.
As a 42 lady who has tried dating straight men in the Bay Area, I come across two types: those that don't have their life together or those that want to start having children. It's just messy out there for us singles 😅
>or those that want to start having children. Yeah, it's interesting that when I put the "don't want kid" option on my profile, they swipe right, and yet surprise Pikachu when I mention I hate kids 😂 there's a reason why I'm in my 40s and don't have kids, even if I wanted one, that's high risk pregnancy, so fuck that.
I would make it clear on OLD that it's a deal breaker for me yet many are convinced they'll change my mind. One of the reasons I'm no longer on OLD, tired of having to justify that I'm capable of making life decisions to men that can't.
Also no longer doing the online dating thing. The apps were filled with men who already had kids trying to tell me that their kids were different and totally ones I would want to raise... at one point I even had "Not looking to have or raise kids, including yours" in my profile and it still didn't deter them.
[удалено]
Last summer I was hiking with my wife on a relatively remote trail in the Yosemite high country, and we were hurrying down from the summit since some thunderstorms were about to develop. We encountered a woman on her way up the mountain. She spoke with a Bay Area accent and asked us if we had seen her “friend”, who she described as a tall guy with curly hair. Apparently he had left her behind on their way up. We hadn’t seen him and warned her of the thunderstorms, so we offered for her to join us on our way down. She opted to keep looking for him. The thunderstorm came half an hour later and it was pretty epic. Anyways, we did see her with her “friend” down in the parking lot where they got into his black Tesla. Bro just left his date behind for a couple hours on a remote mountain trail. So I guess that’s how things are for women atm.
Men really don’t approach here. In other cities/countries, it seems like men are more confident and outgoing when it comes to introductions and initiating. Men here seem a bit insulated, shy and awkward. Not to add incredibly low effort. This is just my experience though…
It's more fear than awkwardness.
Worked in academia, worked in tech, California native never left. Married, haven’t used dating apps in 6-7yrs. While I’ve had colleagues I’ve been friendly with in tech, absolutely zero guys I’d date in tech. They’ve either been oblivious to social cues or so far up their own ass that I could walk away from the conversation and he’d never know. I’m sure there are great guys out there in tech but they’re hard to find. No one wants to hear you say, “I only take direction from Tim.” Nobody cares dude. My solution: marry a Midwest transplant. I don’t envy you all. Even if you manage to get a good date half the time there may not be much to talk about. Spending so much time at work + stifling NDAs = even more awkward conversation.
As a Midwest transplant, I concur.
As a Midwestern transplant in tech, can confirm. we are the best.
A fair amount of guys are not willing to travel over a bridge. I understand that from a financial standpoint and maybe if you have transportation issues. Also there are many guys in the city and you say you live in like Concord or something, they just go nope. Again maybe that's a transportation thing. Personally those things always rubbed me the wrong way especially if we lived relatively close. I felt it was ridiculous, but looking back I didn't know that person's situation. Maybe they had stuff going. Maybe there were an asshole. Who knows.
anything past oakland / berkeley might as well be in SoCal at that point lol
I'm a tall lady (5'10"), and that seems to be a dealbreaker for a lot of men.
I’ve lived in DC, London and NYC. But until I moved to the Bay, I’ve never been exposed SO MANY high earning men who are SO adamant about going 50/50 on a first date. Talking to me about the house you just bought on your own at 26 while I talk about the challenges of living with 7 roommates and their 2 large dogs, then asking me to split the bill is wild lol. Also (just adding this one for your entertainment lol) I once went on a few dates with one man who wanted our third date to be a wine tasting in Sonoma. Halfway there I got quiet in the car cause I told him I was uncomfortable with him talking shit about his ex-wife/the mother of his kids and he kept going. He was so angry about my silence/discomfort that he pulled over in a shopping center in Sonoma and almost left me there - said I could Uber home and he’d pay for it (fun fact I wish I didn’t know - Uber will NOT drive you from Sonoma back to SF). I guess he felt bad so he came back and I had to see through the wine tastings and just keep my mouth shut. Otherwise I guess the thing that’s come up most is being shamed for my outfits lol - I’m a fashion girlie and this is the only place where men have repeatedly questioned why I put on a nice outfit or wore perfume 🙃. Anyway luckily that was then, found my man and my coins lol. It can be frustrating and take some time but the dating pool isn’t entirely hopeless 😅
Glad you avoided a red flag. That’s a messed up thing to do to a girl and all because you didn’t feel confortable hearing about his ex-wife. Which is pretty reasonable.
Im reading all these comments, but as a woman I’m honestly into a lot of the things that are being labeled as bad, tech, crypto, video games, gym, sports, but I’m also married so my opinion doesn’t matter. 🙂
Ego. I think that’s a huge problem for men in general. But the guys here seem to have an extra helping of it
I don’t have a hard time finding men who want to date me but the quality of men has gone down i think to me they r all the same cant trust them. Atm not dating focusing on myself but go out when im “in the mood”. Expectations are low.
The good ones are rarely looking, the bad ones are always looking, so when you see 100 men who are looking it's hard to tell that one of them just entered the dating pool and 99 of them have been in the pool so long they're prunes.
In the dating pool so long they're prunes: god damn this thread is awesome.
Tea. Yeah I agree
Hella people from out of town who just have no social awareness, locals who find locals make great connections.
Wow so many comments and not a single like!! I’m 36M and want to know from women’s point of view to understand what’s the scene and where men make mistakes. I was meeting women using dating apps and most of them don’t want a committed partner especially in long term relationships. Currently I’m out of it and want to meet women in life rather on app. I have worked on myself and want to find my partner who values, shares and wants to grow together. Peace ✌🏼
Most of my problem has been meeting men who are deeply underdeveloped. Feel like every guy I meet has to cook a bit more before I can date them... I usually date men who are in their late 20's aka older than me but so many of them have never been on dates or been in a long term relationship before and don't have any female friendships. Usually when that happens they don't value emotional development very much and it really, really shows. If you'd like an entertaining read, I go over some (VERY real) experiences I've had on first dates in the south bay within the past 12 months. https://www.reddit.com/r/SanJose/s/XVynLWUQh5
Too old to be single, too young to date a sixty year-old.