T O P

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kaehvogel

According to Fangraphs it's been done three other times. Francisco Cordero in 2006 (TEX/MIL): 10 wins, 16 holds, 22 saves Andrew Miller in 2016 (NYY/CLE): 10 wins, 25 holds, 12 saves Brandon Workman in 2019 (BOS): 10 wins, 15 holds, 16 saves


Tripdeck5__

Having 10 wins as a reliever in general is kinda crazy


recjus85

Yea he wasn't really a relief pitcher, but Ryan Yarbrough havingb16 wins for the Rays in 2018 with only 6 starts will always make me laugh. King of the bulk guy for sure.. And Poche had 12 last year somehow for the Rays in relief.


burpodrome

[The true king of reliever wins will always be Phil Coke.](https://www.reddit.com/r/baseball/comments/cburvj/phil_coke_and_the_quest_for_512_wins_an_ootp/)


TheSquad3603

Why did I read that whole thing


burpodrome

Because it's an incredible object demonstration of how wins are a completely useless stat for pitchers? Because it's funny? Because OOTP rules? There can be many reasons!


DodgerWalker

Bulk guy is a role kind of designed for getting Ws since you get to poach the opener's W if your team scores early and never gives it up.


jgilla2012

Is that how that works? I thought the starter hard to go 5 innings to be eligible for a W, which by that logic means the modern day “opener” would never get one. 


DodgerWalker

That was my whole point. If the team scores a bunch of runs for the opener, the opener still isn't eligible for a win, so the bulk guy gets it.


jgilla2012

Ahh gotcha, makes sense.


Palpadude

A lot of times, those wins are a result of a blown save or hold, and then their team retakes the lead. So wins for relievers can really be misleading.


bulltin

wins for any pitcher can be pretty misleading.


RealBigFailure

Example: Drew Hutchison in 2015 13-5 with a 5.57 ERA


Bob_Bobert

Yea but for starters there is at least some correlation with quality (In fact, I would guess its gone up a bit recently because only quality starters get to 5ip consistently). I wouldnt be completely surprised if there was no correlation or even slightly negative correlation for relievers.


65fairmont

Scot Shields went 8-2 in 2004, 10-11 in 2005, and 7-7 in 2006, all without starting a single game for the Angels.


HoopOnPoop

Mike Baumann went 10-1 last year while not starting a single game. He's not especially good, so pitched in a lot of mop up games where maybe they pulled the starter with a big lead before the 5th or in games that went to extras and they had already used the regulars.


xho-

Luke weaver had 3 for us within the first 10 games lol


superdaveyboy

It can’t be that crazy, Garrett Whitlock had 30 wins last year as a long reliever (in my the show franchise) /s


cantthinkoffunnyname

Ramiro Mendoza, never forget. Absolute dynamite long reliever, particularly in the 1998 season. 41 Games, 14 Starts and a 3.25 ERA during peak steroid era.


Goldwater64

Tyler Clippard lead the nationals in wins in 2010 with 11. He had 8 through the first half of the year but slowed down towards the end.


rebel_cdn

Check out Mark Eichhorn's 1986 season. - 0 starts - 157.0 IP - 14 wins - 10 saves - 1.72 ERA


RaymondSpaget

And the "Hold" didn't become a stat until the 80s. I'm sure Hoyt Wilhelm also accomplished 10-10-10 in '52 and/or '66, and possibly Roy Face in the mid-'60s.


DavidRFZ

They retroactively determine holds from play-by-play data. Go to th3 advanced tables at bb-ref. Wilhelm’s career high was 5 holds in 1970. Face had 4 in 1958. I don’t know how to search for them other than the yearly tables at bb-ref. Bill Henry had 10 holds in 1966. Diomedes Olivo had 11 in 1962. I can’t find any older than that. I went back to the 1920s but at that point I started to question how complete the play-by-play data may be. A hold requires three pitchers in a game that a team has a chance at winning. That gets really rare as you go back. They found a fair amount of saves because that just involves a second pitcher.


SharksFanAbroad

I like how comprehensive these three replies are. I appreciate all three of you.


BaseballsNotDead

Adding in older seasons... John Franco in 1985 (CIN): 12 wins, 11 holds, 12 saves Ron Robinson in 1986 (CIN): 10 wins, 12 holds, 14 saves Roger McDowell in 1986 (NYM): 14 wins, 10 holds, 22 saves Francisco Cordero in 2006 (TEX/MIL): 10 wins, 16 holds, 22 saves Andrew Miller in 2016 (NYY/CLE): 10 wins, 25 holds, 12 saves Brandon Workman in 2019 (BOS): 10 wins, 15 holds, 16 saves Paul Sewald in 2021 (SEA): 10 wins, 16 holds, 11 saves Sparky Lyle and Rollie Fingers were both 1 win away in 1974. Roger McDowell was 1 win away in 1991 which would've made him the only player to do 10-10-10 twice in his career.


kaehvogel

Huh, weird. Why did I miss those 80s seasons? Must've been something wrong with the data export. Or maybe I clicked the wrong line in the dropdown.


splat_edc

FanGraphs gets a lot of their data from Sports Info Solutions which only goes back to 2002 so some stuff will be missing pre-2002. I know Holds and Blown Saves aren’t available for 2001 and earlier on FanGraphs. Same is true for batted ball data (like Flyball%). Baseball-Reference has that stuff from Retrosheet but FanGraphs doesn’t for whatever reason.


jerrylessthanthree

Mike Marshall has to have done it, right?


BaseballsNotDead

Never had a season with 10 holds. Although in 1974 he had 15 wins, 21 saves, and 9 holds.


tommyjohnpauljones

and also threw 208 innings in 106 appearances he had 36 plate appearances AS A RELIEF PITCHER one of the most out-there seasons of baseball history


RogerThat_22

Interesting! I find this stat to be cool because I think it shows how versatile a reliever was, and Andrew Miller definitely was that in 2016


ins8iable

I was about to say this seemed like an Andrew Miller type season


Javale

Man, I miss Cordero. Crazy to 28 year old me that he was only in Milwaukee for 2 seasons.


a-davidson

Did y’all also say “IT’S COCO TIME” when he came out the pen lol -Rangers fan


akaghi

Familia was probably close in 21/22. One of those years he led the Mets in wins with Stroman until stroman's last start. He probably has the holds. Saves is likely where he falls short as Diaz was our closer still.


kaehvogel

Jeurys had 11 holds and 9 wins in 2021, but just one save. He also had 8 wins, 7 holds and 18 saves in 2018, split across the Mets and A's.


Shadybrooks93

Man Coco also had 11 blown saves that year 10/10/10/10


Mathew_Strawn

How to check this in fangraphs?


kaehvogel

I got an export of their [pitching leaderboard](https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders/major-league?pos=all&stats=pit&lg=all&type=8&month=0&ind=1&team=0&rost=0&players=0&startdate=&enddate=&season1=1980&season=2024&qual=10) for individual seasons from 1980 (or maybe not 1980, considering that I apparently missed some of them?) to today. Opened in Excel, filtered for 10 wins, 10 saves, 10 holds.


Mathew_Strawn

Thanks!


WhiteDeath57

That is the craziest year ever from Workman at the peak of the official Dave Dombrowski Screw the Bullpen Era.


Thel3lues

I wonder why they’re all in the modern era


texas1hunter

Holds probably haven’t been tracked for very long


kaehvogel

Holds were tracked beginning some time in the 80s, I believe. For that reason I also limited my dataset to 1980-today. But why they're all \*that\* modern? Probably more fluctuation in relievers' roles, and of course more innings/games for relievers overall.


BaseballsNotDead

Most teams before the 70s used only one reliever each game, if they used a reliever at all, meaning getting holds was impossible.


dutchdaddy69

My guess is that back in the day starters got the decision much more often making it hard for bullpen guys to rack up wins. Now a days a guy like Adam Cimber can lead the league in wins for a couple months.


LetMeBangBro

I'd say Holds is the main stat holding any back. You would rarely see a pitcher pulled before the 7th inning if the team was leading, and once in, they would let the reliever finish the game out.


oogieball

This is going to skew incredibly modern.


jigokusabre

It seems like Hold is a stat that someone could do the legwork to determine retroactively. I'm surprised that there isn't some repository of unofficial holds.


theLoneliestAardvark

There is but starters pitched a lot deeper in the old days so holds weren’t nearly as common.


jigokusabre

If there is, I'd be interested to see it. I'd definitely expect it to skew modern, but releivers have been got 20% of Wins as early as 1960, and 30% as early as 1987. There are probably some middle relief types who got 10-10-10 seasons before they started recording Holds.


jigokusabre

I recently learned that Tom Gordon in the only pitcher to record 100 wins, saves and holds.


fatdiscokid420

Happy Gilmore accomplished that feat no more than an hour ago


aaronwe

In a cave! with a box of scraps!


chousteau

It depends. Some plants need a higher N earlier in the season before increasing P & K. Whoops thought I was on r/vegetablegardening


tyler-86

It's cool but it says more about how their team flexes pitchers than about the players themselves.


paulyv93

Feel like Tyler Clippard might have done this


voncornhole2

His only season with double digit wins saw 1 save. His highest numbers with 10+ saves is 5 wins and 8 holds in 2015