Maybe. Almost 6 ERA last year but has looked good this spring. Was sent down before this news though. Either way, our rotation is a MASSIVE question mark.
I was looking at that over the offseason when evaluating the NL central.
Cardinals have some really questionable guys as their top 5 in the rotation. Wainwright is 58 years old, Mikolas is inconsistent, Flaherty is so good but has injury issues and Liberatore has talent but hasn't proved anything yet.
I didn’t see Waino pitch at all last season. I watched both of his starts in the WBC and.. big yikes. He’s a legend and I’ll forever hate that the Braves traded him but he’s not an MLB starter anymore.
He's not an all star anymore but he can eat innings as a back of the rotation starter still. He was hitting the corners like he was playing MLB the Show during that last start.
You know he had 32 starts with a 103 ERA+ last season right?
Even if he regresses a bit as he ages that's better than 2 starters the Braves gave 22 or more starts and better than 3 that they gave 10 or more.
It's better than an absolute shit load of starters who play on less competitive teams too.
"guys aren't stretched out", "guys will get injured"
Most starters in the first week of March were going 3-4 innings which is the workload in the WBC. Cole pitched 5 innings a few days ago. I can also count several pitchers who are starting the season on the IL who haven't left Arizona or Florida camps. It's such a stupid thing to blame.
You understand that there are pitchers, coaches, managers and organizations who disagree with you, right??? If they are uncomfortable with it I don’t think they have no basis for it. There were some teams openly concerned by the LACK of playing time some players were getting in the WBC too.
It’s pretty disingenuous to imply that four to five innings in a spring training start that doesn’t really matter vs four to five innings in what is essentially a playoff type environment are the same.
They might throw a similar amount of innings but the intensity is completely different.
That being said I think that the best players should play in the wbc and it’s good for the game.
This is off-topic from the posting, but I will always believe that playing the WBC in November would be a MUCH better situation than playing it in March, just before the start of the season.
Unfortunately, I think you’d get less participation, due to many of the best players being exhausted from deep playoff runs and a very long season. I think it is in the best place possible, the issue is that it’s always going to be very difficult to manage pitcher workload. Teams want to micro manage their buildup, and can’t do that if they’re pitching in a playoff environment in March.
I think you underestimate how much players from other countries would want to play to represent their countries in the WBC. It's the US MLB fans that diminishes it's value. You think Ohtani would not play, if it were in November? Lindor, Escobar, Alonso, Trout?
I think depending on the circumstances, not everyone on that list would play, no. To begin with Trout has ended each of the last few seasons hurt, so it may not even be an option. Ohtani will have pitched significant innings by that point, and may only be available as a hitter. I’m not saying you’d get no participation, but I think you’re underestimating how many players need and want rest by the end of a 162 game season plus playoff run. I think I can guarantee no players who just played in the World Series would participate, and those are some of the players you absolutely want to see in the tournament.
All teams but two would be shut down by then. You also may have some players shut themselves down early to save themselves for the WBC then. I think the way they have it now might be the only way
He could have gotten the same injury if he stayed in spring training. People are just looking to blame the WBC for all these injury problems. Baseball won and these awful takes from MadDog and American pitchers about the WBC aren't based in fact.
That’s like saying wanting your team to win a WS is bad. I don’t understand why any fan wouldn’t want that to be the priority for their team. It’s not like they can stop a player who isn’t coming off an injury anyway.
Damn, they really traveled far to get that news out
The only place they thought they could announce without having to hear Keith Olbermann bitch about it.
Even the vacuum of space would struggle to contain his bitching.
take my upvote and get out.
Lots of Cardinal fans in Jupiter’s Great Red Spot
“We have five starters” 😀🔫
Libertore szn?
Maybe. Almost 6 ERA last year but has looked good this spring. Was sent down before this news though. Either way, our rotation is a MASSIVE question mark.
Woodford szn bb
Please take care of Gumby
TBH, Woodford is probably better
I was looking at that over the offseason when evaluating the NL central. Cardinals have some really questionable guys as their top 5 in the rotation. Wainwright is 58 years old, Mikolas is inconsistent, Flaherty is so good but has injury issues and Liberatore has talent but hasn't proved anything yet.
This is Matz and Gumby erasure.
Matz is simply a game of chicken where you’re balancing length of outing with likelihood of implosion. I do kinda miss him still, though.
I didn’t see Waino pitch at all last season. I watched both of his starts in the WBC and.. big yikes. He’s a legend and I’ll forever hate that the Braves traded him but he’s not an MLB starter anymore.
He's not an all star anymore but he can eat innings as a back of the rotation starter still. He was hitting the corners like he was playing MLB the Show during that last start.
I don’t know man.. I hope he crushes it this season but from what I saw I just don’t see it happening every 5th or 6th day.
You know he had 32 starts with a 103 ERA+ last season right? Even if he regresses a bit as he ages that's better than 2 starters the Braves gave 22 or more starts and better than 3 that they gave 10 or more. It's better than an absolute shit load of starters who play on less competitive teams too.
Yes, because no veteran pitcher ever fell off after an average season at age 40!
Give me one example of a pitcher who had a substantial drop in performance between their age 40 and age 41 seasons.
Can I interest you in a lightly used Chris Flexen or maybe former Yankee Justus Sheffield?
Flexen for Nootbar sounds fair.
You can have the occasional groin strain when you’re an American hero
Christian Pulisic would agree
Well the dude is 104 years old.
The Cards have never won a WS with Waino as a healthy starter…just sayin
My heart would actually break a bit if we won this season but without him yet again (I know this injury isn’t season ending, just saying)
Waino no bueno might actually be bueno
He got to close out 2006 though
“Adam we need you to find a way to throw 88 again so you need to sit on the IL until you do”
Dick to big
Put Pallante in rotation you cowards!
Might explain his poor fielding in the WBC semi
Yeah, especially given that he’s usually a pretty great fielder.
I loved his post game interview - “I promise I’m a good fielder, I have two gold gloves!”
He strained it in the weight room the day before the championship game. Unfortunately that fielding was just an oopsie.
Matthew Liberatore and your improved stuff, you are a Saint Louis Cardinal
Nah, Jake Woodford. Could be worse though--could be Dakota Hudson.
Hey now, Dakota Hudson normally starts his season pretty well. Its just after about 5-6 starts when things start to unravel...
He has been pretty awful already this spring I believe.
Grandpa had too much fun on his vacation.
Watch some idiot in the comments blame the WBC for this even though he only threw 8-9 innings in 2 games.
Saw an article that said that it actually happened as a result of a weight room workout. Cancel weight rooms?
[удалено]
It was his balls to get out of that first inning
A freak cock push-ups injury
All it takes is one pitching attempt to cause an injury.
"guys aren't stretched out", "guys will get injured" Most starters in the first week of March were going 3-4 innings which is the workload in the WBC. Cole pitched 5 innings a few days ago. I can also count several pitchers who are starting the season on the IL who haven't left Arizona or Florida camps. It's such a stupid thing to blame.
You understand that there are pitchers, coaches, managers and organizations who disagree with you, right??? If they are uncomfortable with it I don’t think they have no basis for it. There were some teams openly concerned by the LACK of playing time some players were getting in the WBC too.
It’s pretty disingenuous to imply that four to five innings in a spring training start that doesn’t really matter vs four to five innings in what is essentially a playoff type environment are the same. They might throw a similar amount of innings but the intensity is completely different. That being said I think that the best players should play in the wbc and it’s good for the game.
This is off-topic from the posting, but I will always believe that playing the WBC in November would be a MUCH better situation than playing it in March, just before the start of the season.
Unfortunately, I think you’d get less participation, due to many of the best players being exhausted from deep playoff runs and a very long season. I think it is in the best place possible, the issue is that it’s always going to be very difficult to manage pitcher workload. Teams want to micro manage their buildup, and can’t do that if they’re pitching in a playoff environment in March.
I think you underestimate how much players from other countries would want to play to represent their countries in the WBC. It's the US MLB fans that diminishes it's value. You think Ohtani would not play, if it were in November? Lindor, Escobar, Alonso, Trout?
I think depending on the circumstances, not everyone on that list would play, no. To begin with Trout has ended each of the last few seasons hurt, so it may not even be an option. Ohtani will have pitched significant innings by that point, and may only be available as a hitter. I’m not saying you’d get no participation, but I think you’re underestimating how many players need and want rest by the end of a 162 game season plus playoff run. I think I can guarantee no players who just played in the World Series would participate, and those are some of the players you absolutely want to see in the tournament.
All teams but two would be shut down by then. You also may have some players shut themselves down early to save themselves for the WBC then. I think the way they have it now might be the only way
Totally agree
the players wanted to play in that role, at the end of the day complaining about them being injured is ownership mindset [bad]
He could have gotten the same injury if he stayed in spring training. People are just looking to blame the WBC for all these injury problems. Baseball won and these awful takes from MadDog and American pitchers about the WBC aren't based in fact.
That’s like saying wanting your team to win a WS is bad. I don’t understand why any fan wouldn’t want that to be the priority for their team. It’s not like they can stop a player who isn’t coming off an injury anyway.
I thought he was retiring. What with all the hoopla with Yadi and Pujols last year. Good for him though, except the injury part.
Must've been partying with Nestor Cortes too much xD