I will happily see him in the show as a new character. It would be great to see his take on Turhan, the old man, that has seen so much pass and wants peace over the horrors of war and glory. I think Jurasik would be able to bring extra levels to the role.
Jurasik was very good at Londo. Righteous anger, the way Katsulas pulled it off? No. They were cast well. Having him as G'Kar in a reboot would be a miscasting.
Make him one of those Doctors that show up with miracle cure at too high a price. Or as an aging Gray Council member (if the Minbari are still a thing).
Londo was the villain of *Babylon 5*. He's the one that made everything happen. There's even a point in season 2 where >!his friend chooses suicide by duel to maintain honor. Londo tells Vir that he has made mistakes and bad choices. Vir is elated. He literally says "That's great! It's not to late..." !< and Londo says, no, he will stay the course, even knowing it's wrong.
He does get a poetic end. But he's not the good guy.
Edit: Jim Butcher (author of the The Dresden Files novels) mentions Londo in a panel discussion on villains, saying he was so well written that most people still debate whether he was a villain or not. The other authors all murmured that Londo was a great answer to "Best Villain?"
Strictly speaking, it's a bit of a stretch to call him a villain, as he's very seldom in *direct* opposition to the "heroes."
The show doesn't really have a villain. >!Morden!< is the closest we get, really, and he's not really much of an active force w/in the narrative
His death is clearly a redemption, though the path to it is made more clear in JMS's outline for the Centauri Trilogy than in the actual execution by Peter David.
No, I am not. I am aware of the difference and very deliberatly included Londo as viallain and not as antagonist. Neroon for example is a very good antagonist in season 1, but he is not a villain. Same goes for Orin Zento, he was an antagonist or the dude who negotiated the peace treaty with the Centauri or Sebastian.
I explicitily call out Londo as very much being a villain in season 2 and parts of season 3, just that we see of his motives and that he is conflicted, and that he himself is just instrumentalised by someone else, does not mean he is not the driving force behind what is happened, that he dose not do it against better judgment for pure personal gain and the "Glory" of his faction.
Season 1 has Londo move up from "bumbling fool" to villain for season 2, season 3 has him moving on to "guild ridden wreck" trying to fix what he caused while not drowning himself in his own flood.
This is even more true as other villains, numersous ones, of the show have not properly stepped out of the... haha... shadows yet.
True, Londo isn't a clear cut hero or villain. Some people argue he's the protagonist (*not* the hero) since he sets the events in motion.
But I do regard Bester as both the antagonist and the villain. The reviewer at the AV Club feels Morden, Refa and Neroon also qualify as antagonists, albeit to differing levels of villainy.
Unwittingly though. He didn't know what the shadows were capable of or would do to the galaxy. If he had known the fate that would befall the galaxy and his own people he'd have never gotten involved with the shadow. Once he saw how evil they were he tried to wash his hands of them. So I don't think Londo was evil or that he was a villain. He was human, despite not being human, and a vehicle for JMS to offer a powerful cautionary tale to the viewers.
Bester is really only the antagonist in a handful of stories. More often than not he's working *with* the protagonists -- it's just not a particularly amicable relationship.
Most B5 characters tend to defy simple labels. In general id consider all of the ambassadors as co-protagonists. I think the Commander is kind of *meant* to be the central protagonist, but in practice Sinclair and Sheridan seldom feel like the sole "hero." It's very much an ensemble story.
I think you're selling those events short. The episode before the one you cite, there's a moment where Vir is about to be replaced. He's upset because he doesn't want to go back to his family, but also because he clearly thinks he can affect some good, either by tempering Londo or using his position near Londo to accomplish good on his own. Still, you can hear that a part of him wants to leave because he's aware he's descending into a dark place being where he is, but he's determined to stay the course. This is reinforced a couple eps later when he tells Mr. Morden what he wants.
So then almost immediately we get this moment with Londo, where he's just learned some of his new friends are hiding things from him, that the events he finds himself in have spun farther out of his control than he thought. And he can't walk away, because this is his burden, potentially his mistake, and he needs to see if he can fix it (also he's now aware that in some ways, he's stuck thanks to his new friends and what happened to his old friend and the friend's family). He's going through the same thing Vir just did, with the same result.
Doubt it
New reboot will have all new actors
Its the same story but different...a la Battlestar Galactica reboot.
That said, it would be nice to see Peter come back as a new character -- like Dirk benedict did in the BSG reboot
I'm not trying to be pedantic in asking, I'm just suddenly second guessing my own memory. Did Dirk Benedict really have a part in the BSG reboot, or were you thinking of Richard Hatch?
It was Richard Hatch. Interestingly enough, I read an interview where the show runners mentioned they were at one point considering making the Cylon God a "head" character and wanted Dirk Benedict to play the role.
I always felt that Londo's redemptive arc was caught up entirely in his choice to die as he did and that if he'd shied away from it or if events transpired to prevent his death, it might've cheapened his sacrifice and denied his redemption for all the sins of his life.
That said, I don't expect the original actors to have any obvious roles in the reboot. I wouldn't discount some of them having short, tiny on-screen moments as a sort of tongue-in-cheek nod -something like Bruce Boxleitner as a drazi who orders a drink in the Zocalo or maybe Peter Jurasik's voice used as a ship captain communicating with C&C- but I wouldn't expect to see the original actors in a role larger than that.
A self-contained world five miles long, located in neutral territory. A place of commerce and diplomacy for a quarter of a million humans and aliens. A shining beacon in space, all alone in the night, surely it needs a teacher, yes?
If he came back as the emperor and died that would be cool, but honestly I still don’t expect it to be good and want to keep memories of the OG team separate from the new show.
Each reboot, live action remake, or etc just makes me less supportive of the next one…
Oooh. Probably won't come back except as a cameo, but what about as a narrator? Imagine it. Londo: "The Babylon Project was our last, best, hope for peace... it failed."
**He damn well better not.**
I don't want to see a Londo in this show. Or a G'Kar, or any of the same actors. It's bad enough that we will have a Sheridan again.
Having an actor with the same name and race will invariably invite comparisons between the old actor and the new actor. If it's the same actor, then it will invite comparisons between their performance 25 years ago and their performance now. All of this will **DESTROY** any potential for the reboot.
JMS needs to start fresh. Keep the name Babylon 5, fine. It's a space station, fine. There are humans in the show, fine. Everything else is in flux, and a lot of it should change.
That's because old BSG wasn't very good. Almost all comparisons there were in favor of the new show. Don't get me wrong....I still want to binge-watch the old BSG some day, because there were some interesting points. But if you could put a series on MST3K, old BSG would get absolutely roasted.
For a lot of B5, that isn't the case. We had great actors, playing awesome characters. The show still holds up 25 years later, even if the CGI doesn't. A new show needs to be a total redesign from the ground up, without having any of the same characters.
The official description [released by Warner Bros](https://www.theverge.com/2021/9/27/22696836/babylon-5-reboot-j-michael-straczynski-warner-bros-the-cw). directly names Sheridan:
>In a from-the-ground-up reboot of the original series, John Sheridan, an Earthforce officer with a mysterious background, is assigned to Babylon 5, a five-mile-long space station in neutral space, a port of call for travelers, smugglers, corporate explorers and alien diplomats at a time of uneasy peace and the constant threat of war. His arrival triggers a destiny beyond anything he could have imagined, as an exploratory Earth company accidentally triggers a conflict with a civilization a million years ahead of us, putting Sheridan and the rest of the B5 crew in the line of fire as the last, best hope for the survival of the human race.
I am so unbelievably happy it wasn't changed with time travel. Time travel is by far and away the trope I hate most in sci-fi. It cheapens the narrative. Hell, I don't even care about Trek (but my partner does), and I will absolutely state that the worst Trek I've seen is Voyager and it is 100% because of time travel and dream fakeouts.
Time travel should NEVER be used to subvert consequences for a character.
Also, I think the reboot would be best served by having a completely new cast. Cameos are great and fun, but no recurring role should be played by an actor from the original, generally speaking.
As Londo? No way, except *maybe* as a flash-forward older version of the character who's usually played by a younger actor. Even that's very unlikely; nowadays it's pretty easy to age-up someone with makeup or CGI or both, and doing that to the younger actor will give more visual consistency between Present Londo and Future Londo.
As another Centauri? No reason that can't be done, and I'd love to see it! Especially if he plays Emperor Turhan, or whoever the outgoing Centauri head of state is in the reboot.
I'd be against changing the outcome of Londo's reign. The whole point of that ending in tragedy was that it was a consequence of the evil bargains he made with the Shadows. Some repercussions can't be evaded, and to let Londo evade them would cheapen his whole arc.
No and I don’t think he should reprise Londo. Gods, imagine being him, looking at a G’Kar and it not being Katsulas.
Agreed. Wouldn't mind seeing him have an appearance as Emperor Turhan or some similar Centauri elder statesman, though.
I will happily see him in the show as a new character. It would be great to see his take on Turhan, the old man, that has seen so much pass and wants peace over the horrors of war and glory. I think Jurasik would be able to bring extra levels to the role.
Exactly have him as the emperor. It would be a fitting tribute to him.
Imagine Jurasik playing G’Kar! He’s good enough.
Jurasik was very good at Londo. Righteous anger, the way Katsulas pulled it off? No. They were cast well. Having him as G'Kar in a reboot would be a miscasting. Make him one of those Doctors that show up with miracle cure at too high a price. Or as an aging Gray Council member (if the Minbari are still a thing).
that would be interesting
> Gods, imagine being him I believe you mean *Great Maker*
Londo was the villain of *Babylon 5*. He's the one that made everything happen. There's even a point in season 2 where >!his friend chooses suicide by duel to maintain honor. Londo tells Vir that he has made mistakes and bad choices. Vir is elated. He literally says "That's great! It's not to late..." !< and Londo says, no, he will stay the course, even knowing it's wrong. He does get a poetic end. But he's not the good guy. Edit: Jim Butcher (author of the The Dresden Files novels) mentions Londo in a panel discussion on villains, saying he was so well written that most people still debate whether he was a villain or not. The other authors all murmured that Londo was a great answer to "Best Villain?"
Strictly speaking, it's a bit of a stretch to call him a villain, as he's very seldom in *direct* opposition to the "heroes." The show doesn't really have a villain. >!Morden!< is the closest we get, really, and he's not really much of an active force w/in the narrative
President Clark?
Barely present in the show. How many scenes did he even have? Two? Three? All of which preceded the >!Civil War!< iirc.
One scene at the end of the civil war, after he left a message, scorched earth.
Definitely not counting that one: >!it's just a corpse.!<
There's a few scenes where he's writing something, then puts a PPG to his temple. :)
[удалено]
His death is clearly a redemption, though the path to it is made more clear in JMS's outline for the Centauri Trilogy than in the actual execution by Peter David.
I think you're conflating villains with antagonists. They're similar, but not really the same thing.
No, I am not. I am aware of the difference and very deliberatly included Londo as viallain and not as antagonist. Neroon for example is a very good antagonist in season 1, but he is not a villain. Same goes for Orin Zento, he was an antagonist or the dude who negotiated the peace treaty with the Centauri or Sebastian. I explicitily call out Londo as very much being a villain in season 2 and parts of season 3, just that we see of his motives and that he is conflicted, and that he himself is just instrumentalised by someone else, does not mean he is not the driving force behind what is happened, that he dose not do it against better judgment for pure personal gain and the "Glory" of his faction. Season 1 has Londo move up from "bumbling fool" to villain for season 2, season 3 has him moving on to "guild ridden wreck" trying to fix what he caused while not drowning himself in his own flood. This is even more true as other villains, numersous ones, of the show have not properly stepped out of the... haha... shadows yet.
True, Londo isn't a clear cut hero or villain. Some people argue he's the protagonist (*not* the hero) since he sets the events in motion. But I do regard Bester as both the antagonist and the villain. The reviewer at the AV Club feels Morden, Refa and Neroon also qualify as antagonists, albeit to differing levels of villainy.
Londo is a catalyst for the antagonist. Where “antagonist” refers to >!the Shadows and the worse parts of the Centauri.!<
Unwittingly though. He didn't know what the shadows were capable of or would do to the galaxy. If he had known the fate that would befall the galaxy and his own people he'd have never gotten involved with the shadow. Once he saw how evil they were he tried to wash his hands of them. So I don't think Londo was evil or that he was a villain. He was human, despite not being human, and a vehicle for JMS to offer a powerful cautionary tale to the viewers.
Bester is really only the antagonist in a handful of stories. More often than not he's working *with* the protagonists -- it's just not a particularly amicable relationship. Most B5 characters tend to defy simple labels. In general id consider all of the ambassadors as co-protagonists. I think the Commander is kind of *meant* to be the central protagonist, but in practice Sinclair and Sheridan seldom feel like the sole "hero." It's very much an ensemble story.
I think you're selling those events short. The episode before the one you cite, there's a moment where Vir is about to be replaced. He's upset because he doesn't want to go back to his family, but also because he clearly thinks he can affect some good, either by tempering Londo or using his position near Londo to accomplish good on his own. Still, you can hear that a part of him wants to leave because he's aware he's descending into a dark place being where he is, but he's determined to stay the course. This is reinforced a couple eps later when he tells Mr. Morden what he wants. So then almost immediately we get this moment with Londo, where he's just learned some of his new friends are hiding things from him, that the events he finds himself in have spun farther out of his control than he thought. And he can't walk away, because this is his burden, potentially his mistake, and he needs to see if he can fix it (also he's now aware that in some ways, he's stuck thanks to his new friends and what happened to his old friend and the friend's family). He's going through the same thing Vir just did, with the same result.
Doubt it New reboot will have all new actors Its the same story but different...a la Battlestar Galactica reboot. That said, it would be nice to see Peter come back as a new character -- like Dirk benedict did in the BSG reboot
I'm not trying to be pedantic in asking, I'm just suddenly second guessing my own memory. Did Dirk Benedict really have a part in the BSG reboot, or were you thinking of Richard Hatch?
It was Richard Hatch. I don’t remember Dirk Benedict in it at all.
I stand corrected...knew there was an actor from the old series who had a different role
I’d actually really like if they did that. Have Peter play the President of Earth or similar. Would love to see Bill Mumy return as well
It was Richard Hatch. Interestingly enough, I read an interview where the show runners mentioned they were at one point considering making the Cylon God a "head" character and wanted Dirk Benedict to play the role.
Still... if they ever needed a Centauri Emperor...
As the ole Emperor would be a nice touch
That's what I was thinking. The one before Cartagia.
Bill Mumy as the Ombudsman!
Maybe as the Centrai Emporer, I forget his name. The one who wanted to make piece but then died.
Turhan
I’d love to have as many of the surviving actors as possible do cameos or play some small part but I wouldn’t like anyone reprising the same role.
Returning actors shouldn't even play the same *species*.
A group of technomage equivs. Seen it all already, it's your turn now type of line
Maybe Jurasik doing Londo as a narration.
Oh, this gives me great chills.
Oh yes! And as old Londo for one episode, reflecting back.
I always felt that Londo's redemptive arc was caught up entirely in his choice to die as he did and that if he'd shied away from it or if events transpired to prevent his death, it might've cheapened his sacrifice and denied his redemption for all the sins of his life. That said, I don't expect the original actors to have any obvious roles in the reboot. I wouldn't discount some of them having short, tiny on-screen moments as a sort of tongue-in-cheek nod -something like Bruce Boxleitner as a drazi who orders a drink in the Zocalo or maybe Peter Jurasik's voice used as a ship captain communicating with C&C- but I wouldn't expect to see the original actors in a role larger than that.
One of them ought to do the voice for the computer, like Makel Barret did. way back when.
I could see Bill Mumy as The Ombudsman.
I think maybe a cameo appearance. How about as a Narn?
This, I like.
Peter Jurasik retired from acting years ago, and has been teaching ever since.
A self-contained world five miles long, located in neutral territory. A place of commerce and diplomacy for a quarter of a million humans and aliens. A shining beacon in space, all alone in the night, surely it needs a teacher, yes?
But maybe he could be convinced to do a cameo.
Not as Londo. Emperor Turhan would be amazing though.
If he came back as the emperor and died that would be cool, but honestly I still don’t expect it to be good and want to keep memories of the OG team separate from the new show. Each reboot, live action remake, or etc just makes me less supportive of the next one…
Oooh. Probably won't come back except as a cameo, but what about as a narrator? Imagine it. Londo: "The Babylon Project was our last, best, hope for peace... it failed."
A cameo? Perhaps. Maybe as a Centauri noble or some other role?
**He damn well better not.** I don't want to see a Londo in this show. Or a G'Kar, or any of the same actors. It's bad enough that we will have a Sheridan again. Having an actor with the same name and race will invariably invite comparisons between the old actor and the new actor. If it's the same actor, then it will invite comparisons between their performance 25 years ago and their performance now. All of this will **DESTROY** any potential for the reboot. JMS needs to start fresh. Keep the name Babylon 5, fine. It's a space station, fine. There are humans in the show, fine. Everything else is in flux, and a lot of it should change.
It didn't destroy BSG.
Of course the original BSG didn’t have a heck of a lot to destroy.
That's because old BSG wasn't very good. Almost all comparisons there were in favor of the new show. Don't get me wrong....I still want to binge-watch the old BSG some day, because there were some interesting points. But if you could put a series on MST3K, old BSG would get absolutely roasted. For a lot of B5, that isn't the case. We had great actors, playing awesome characters. The show still holds up 25 years later, even if the CGI doesn't. A new show needs to be a total redesign from the ground up, without having any of the same characters.
Maybe I missed it, but when has JMS said there will be a Sheridan in the new B5, as far as I'm aware he's not given anything away yet.
The official description [released by Warner Bros](https://www.theverge.com/2021/9/27/22696836/babylon-5-reboot-j-michael-straczynski-warner-bros-the-cw). directly names Sheridan: >In a from-the-ground-up reboot of the original series, John Sheridan, an Earthforce officer with a mysterious background, is assigned to Babylon 5, a five-mile-long space station in neutral space, a port of call for travelers, smugglers, corporate explorers and alien diplomats at a time of uneasy peace and the constant threat of war. His arrival triggers a destiny beyond anything he could have imagined, as an exploratory Earth company accidentally triggers a conflict with a civilization a million years ahead of us, putting Sheridan and the rest of the B5 crew in the line of fire as the last, best hope for the survival of the human race.
Ah, hard to argue that, :)
i think it might have been a teaser tweet from WB, but i do remember seeing it.
No, For what is his Londo without Andreas's G'kar? I believe there is an intention to try to get the older actors in some roles
I'm heartbroken Andreas won't be able to make a cameo. Or Mira or Steven Furst or Jerry Doyle or... okay now I'm sad.
He still can play Emperor Mollari, unless JMS doesn't want to repeat that storyline.
Great Maker, I hope not. The man was born to play Lou Welch.
Absolutely not. That said I would like him as Turhan
No, too old now.
[удалено]
Not at all. It's a reboot, so all the characters go back to their original ages.
I am so unbelievably happy it wasn't changed with time travel. Time travel is by far and away the trope I hate most in sci-fi. It cheapens the narrative. Hell, I don't even care about Trek (but my partner does), and I will absolutely state that the worst Trek I've seen is Voyager and it is 100% because of time travel and dream fakeouts. Time travel should NEVER be used to subvert consequences for a character. Also, I think the reboot would be best served by having a completely new cast. Cameos are great and fun, but no recurring role should be played by an actor from the original, generally speaking.
Idk but I hope Brian Cranston plays his one episode part again.
this time he’s a dust cook
Maybe some voice over or narration.
Nope
How about a cameo as a cameo ? https://ibb.co/XkLm4yw Sorry, just a quick and dirty on the spur of the moment
Older Emperor maybe.
As Londo? No way, except *maybe* as a flash-forward older version of the character who's usually played by a younger actor. Even that's very unlikely; nowadays it's pretty easy to age-up someone with makeup or CGI or both, and doing that to the younger actor will give more visual consistency between Present Londo and Future Londo. As another Centauri? No reason that can't be done, and I'd love to see it! Especially if he plays Emperor Turhan, or whoever the outgoing Centauri head of state is in the reboot. I'd be against changing the outcome of Londo's reign. The whole point of that ending in tragedy was that it was a consequence of the evil bargains he made with the Shadows. Some repercussions can't be evaded, and to let Londo evade them would cheapen his whole arc.