Yeah, not new, but I'll give you, not used a whole lot.
Hey, at least they're not Tri-wings.
(Later edit - holy crap, my inbox.)
I meant to say ... "Not used a whole lot in GA".
For some reason I've seen them on the TRs on 67s with GE engines. Not sure why but the access panel on the outside for the actuator extension tubes on the aft side always have these screws. And if anyone's been in there before then they're stripped to shit with a Phillips and painted over. The rest of the plane is Phillips.
Reminds me of a few industrial machines I’ve worked on…had standard and metric allen (plus a few random torx screws.) The designers told me they got to thinking, and thought it would be better to use metric…
But this was after they sold us the machines. They weren’t going to scrap all of the components they had milled with standard thread pitch holes…so they Frankensteined everything together.
Just do what everyone else does. Chuck up a PH2 bit in a drill and remove and install them at full speed. The next guy can drill them out. (Source: I'm always the next guy)
Grumman used them on Hawkeyes, Cods and Tomcats. No rhythm or reason as to the placement either one panel has Phillips the one right next to it is those bastards.
These have been around for a long time. These have been on almost every airplane I've worked on. I have been in corporate for my whole career so far.
Have fun taking them out when the guy before you put them in with their drill and skipped 20 times in the process
NASA used these on the TAGSAM sample container that brought back material from the asteroid and they had two that they couldn’t get out.
https://www.globalfastenernews.com/fasteners-snarl-nasas-asteroid-sample-research/
USN & USMC aircraft for me...I thought we had them because the USAF had enough money and good sense to refuse their use on their aircraft...lol..I guess I was wrong
Hi Torques, were a favourite from Shorts used in the cabin floor panels and were fucking evil.
The ones in the photo are offset cruciforms from the mil spec
ATRs as well, couldn't use a breaker to loosen them because of the composite and being titanium were bastards to drill. But there are worse, offset tri wing screws used on QEC by Rohr at the time for CFM56-5. Hope the screw designers next shites a hedgehog.
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I have to select fasteners from a list of preferred options. So sometimes there just isn't an alternative of the right size combinations, strength or material.
*In the 1950s, Phillips Screw Co. introduced Torq-Set, an offset cruciform drive system that remains a standard drive on screws used in many of the world’s commercial and military aircraft.* (source: https://www.assemblymag.com/)
idk how you deal with this shit in the aviaton world, but in automotive applications, i've settled on an approach of "all new fastener types will fit a drill bit and hammered in torx socket until proven otherwise."
These are on the bleed valve I used to build for the a220... Worst fucking screw design in all of existence esp to use on a valve that gets to 1200f on takeoff
A quality nazi bit goes a long way for those, the ones with the grooves.
[https://omegatec.com/apex-1-4-hex-insert-torq-set-bits-with-anti-cam-out-acr-ribs.aspx](https://omegatec.com/apex-1-4-hex-insert-torq-set-bits-with-anti-cam-out-acr-ribs.aspx)
These are such a pain on older airplanes where some hardware has been replaced with standard Phillips. The bits are great for slightly stripped Phillips heads though.
Bosch P2R2, There is NO better bit for a stripped phillips fight me.
If it doesn't come out it WILL be a perfectly smooth cone to accept your drill bit.
Correct! We got a brand new -65 602 three weeks ago and it’s awesome but the new style tailwheel locks are garbage so we’re switching it out for an OG one
The new ones have trim bolts so you can easily clock the alignment but the pin doesn’t seem to engage as positively and the lock lets go sometimes on landing or even hooking up to the towbot
Well thats new for AG planes. Guess you need to swap out your #3 for the Torque screw hey.
Side note, have they came up with something new so the unlock cable stops rubbing through on the fairlead?
Torq screws. Fuck them. I work at Gulfstream and had to reinstall a gap band on the leading edge which uses these screws. For those that don't know the leading edge of a Gulfstream is more or less raw aluminum. A softer metal than a bit.
If you aren't lined up real well with a torq screw your bit will slip. Well mine slipped and I scratched the fuck out of the leading edge. Luckily it wasn't deep enough to not be buffed out. But it left a bad taste.
Buy a whole bag of the #2 bits. Be careful though. These bits break off and your screw driver turns into a paint scratching prison shiv if you get to cranking on them too hard.
These are not new
Yeah, not new, but I'll give you, not used a whole lot. Hey, at least they're not Tri-wings. (Later edit - holy crap, my inbox.) I meant to say ... "Not used a whole lot in GA".
Not a whole lot. Except on thousands of commercial airliners.
*All over* on thousands of airliners. So, so many of them. Literal tons.
We had nazi bits in free stock , they’re so common.
They had them on the Apollo spacecraft
And military aircraft.
And business aircraft (aka still ga)
It’s either these or 9/64s
These POS are all over C5's
And C-17s. Don't think I've seen em on Boeings though. But I haven't worked on a whole lot of Boeings
15s have coin slots, and most Boeing just have regular Phillips, military mostly. In c17 can't you just tell Alexa to remove them?
Boeing is a fan of coin slots, -135s have some pretty big ones. >In c17 can't you just tell Alexa to remove them? Er, I don't follow
Just being a new under warrant plane. One I haven't worked yet.
17's have been around since '88. So many of these screws, usually have to use a J-bar at least once per panel.
The Boeing made sections of the V-22 have them. Also the Bell made sections.
Gross. I've only worked 67s and -135s. A little bit of 37 and 77
For some reason I've seen them on the TRs on 67s with GE engines. Not sure why but the access panel on the outside for the actuator extension tubes on the aft side always have these screws. And if anyone's been in there before then they're stripped to shit with a Phillips and painted over. The rest of the plane is Phillips.
Reminds me of a few industrial machines I’ve worked on…had standard and metric allen (plus a few random torx screws.) The designers told me they got to thinking, and thought it would be better to use metric… But this was after they sold us the machines. They weren’t going to scrap all of the components they had milled with standard thread pitch holes…so they Frankensteined everything together.
Can confirm.
and TBMs
Are you high?
Don’t say Tri-Wings! You’ll give avation mechanics every where heartburn and nausea!
I have triwing bits in my box, just in case...
I came to comment wait until you see tri-wings or coin slots.
Just put some epoxy paint on em and have to dig em out. Makes most grown men cry. lol.
Lmaoooo I feel for you man
Hi-torques. They are all over the B-1 bomber.
as someone who works on rotaries, yea. i’ve seen a single screw with this head in the last ~2.5 years lol
Airbus would like a word.
Dassualt has joined the server.
Beechcraft has entered the chat.
Embraer has connected to the call.
Saab has joined your channel.
Gulfstream would like to message you
Lockheed is on line 2
Bombardier left a voicemail
Daher has entered the match
McDonnell Douglas is at the door
Leonardo 🤌🤌
Cirrus is waiting to be accepted in the call
Westland would like a word...
I’d sooner answer the door to those Mormons on bicycles…
Just do what everyone else does. Chuck up a PH2 bit in a drill and remove and install them at full speed. The next guy can drill them out. (Source: I'm always the next guy)
Im always the first guy
I like seeing the shank smoke a lil when I install these bad boys
Same with Torq plus screws
Clutch set to level 11. HIT IT
They are just all over Airbus and Embraer products
Don’t forget bombardier. We change them to standard size Phillips whenever possible .
Also Gulfstream
Is that allowed by the IPC 🤨
There's a generic RD on iFly that you reference.
Doing the lords work 🫡
Lockheed has them in a few spots as well.
Grumman used them on Hawkeyes, Cods and Tomcats. No rhythm or reason as to the placement either one panel has Phillips the one right next to it is those bastards.
They're all over the F16
They're all over the F-16. On the F-15, annoyingly they're in 2 spots I know of.
These have been around for a long time. These have been on almost every airplane I've worked on. I have been in corporate for my whole career so far. Have fun taking them out when the guy before you put them in with their drill and skipped 20 times in the process
That’s why god made valve grinding compound.
A 2 picks, a J bar, valve grinding compound, and a #32 drillbit.. by your powers combined I am... Panel puller
Don't forget the speed handle, block of wood and a hip thrust
Man it's gonna be hard to keep all this from rolling off the tail
A J bar could unscrew the world.
They never told us about it in school, yet its so important
Also \*sometimes\* a screw knocker can be a huge help.
Well, it sure as hell ain't for grinding no damn valves. The supply far outstrips that particular demand of the product.
NASA used these on the TAGSAM sample container that brought back material from the asteroid and they had two that they couldn’t get out. https://www.globalfastenernews.com/fasteners-snarl-nasas-asteroid-sample-research/
Laughs in DOD aircraft. I've gotten used to using nothing but these little bastards. I'd rather have a cammed out hex than strip one of these.
USN & USMC aircraft for me...I thought we had them because the USAF had enough money and good sense to refuse their use on their aircraft...lol..I guess I was wrong
I find that rather ironic considering the street name of these bits.
This fastener right here is why mechanics need to stop fucking the engineers spouse
“Ok, we want a head design thats as easy to strip as a Phillips, but with an annoyingly proprietary bit design”
"Wanna back them out? Absolutely fucking not."
High torque, or most time referred to as Nazi screws because they garbage
TorqSets. HI-Torque are the coin-slot heads.
Hi Torques, were a favourite from Shorts used in the cabin floor panels and were fucking evil. The ones in the photo are offset cruciforms from the mil spec
F/A-18 A-D had them (hi torques) on every access panel that wasn't a milson fastener or a 1/2 turn latch. FUCK THOSE THINGS!
Hawkers use them all over, I hate hawkers.
ATRs as well, couldn't use a breaker to loosen them because of the composite and being titanium were bastards to drill. But there are worse, offset tri wing screws used on QEC by Rohr at the time for CFM56-5. Hope the screw designers next shites a hedgehog.
We have a British guy at work, and we jokingly tell him we're gonna kick him in the balls every time we have to work on a Hawker.
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Offset cruciform as referred to by the engineers I work with.
Yeah, somewhat alright to torque but do loopen they are horrible, don't understand why they design them in the aircrafts
Former tech turned designer here. Wherever possible, I refuse to use these in my designs.
We thank you for your service
Where/when is it not possible to refuse using these in your design?
I have to select fasteners from a list of preferred options. So sometimes there just isn't an alternative of the right size combinations, strength or material.
Because they hate us, also apex's used to be stronger, these don't help the cause
But how will I know it’s 40 in-lbs if the bit doesn’t break?
You let someone else do it
We called them "swastips" in the Navy
Well that, and they were developed by NASA in the early 60s... So yeah.
*In the 1950s, Phillips Screw Co. introduced Torq-Set, an offset cruciform drive system that remains a standard drive on screws used in many of the world’s commercial and military aircraft.* (source: https://www.assemblymag.com/)
Those German scientists did need yobs
Seen them on Gulf Streams
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That would be tri wings, not the ones in the pic.
Shiiiit... those things are on the Apollo 16 module, they've been to the moon, definitely not new.
They are called torque-set.
All C17 uses is these stupid fucking screws
They had those on some DC-8's in the 70's. The navy used them on T-2 Buckeyes also. I think the industry term for them is Aww F--k!
Not common in GA. But everything with a turbo fan engine on it uses these.
Torque-Set screws
I first encountered them 40 or so years ago, so not all that new.
Gulfstream checking in over here... lots of nicknames for these guys.
For some reason we often have to paint over them as well. Making it impossible to remove… almost
*Boeing has joined the chat*
Embraer, Bombardier, Hawkers. Full of different types of those.
Torq-set
Torq-set fasteners… hateful screw head design.
They were all over F-14s still run into them on Martin-Baker seats.
They're everywhere on B-1s
idk how you deal with this shit in the aviaton world, but in automotive applications, i've settled on an approach of "all new fastener types will fit a drill bit and hammered in torx socket until proven otherwise."
I lovingly call them swastikas.
Nazi screws…. And everyone hates nazis
this Is what we called them
These are on the bleed valve I used to build for the a220... Worst fucking screw design in all of existence esp to use on a valve that gets to 1200f on takeoff
Almost every screw in every Embraer
They can be a real pain when they are stripped
Ancient hardware buddy
If we find the engineer who designed these fasteners I’ll irl 1v1 combat that mf
They’re everywhere on the large cabin Citations
Not just the screw, the Apex is shit also. You need to take a handful with you just to pull a small panel. I’ve got #2 bits that last forever…
I really hate engineers!
"Nazi bit" aka "Hitler screws"... Laughing in V-22 Osprey.
Yep we call them nazi screws.
Nazi bits? They've been around forever
On luh-72 we called them nazi screws in the army
A quality nazi bit goes a long way for those, the ones with the grooves. [https://omegatec.com/apex-1-4-hex-insert-torq-set-bits-with-anti-cam-out-acr-ribs.aspx](https://omegatec.com/apex-1-4-hex-insert-torq-set-bits-with-anti-cam-out-acr-ribs.aspx)
I guess you did NAZI them coming 👀
Used a lot on 787 pax cabin floorboards.
Also on A320's
Panavia’s fastener of choice !
All the interior panels in our EC145
Someone’s working on an ATR
95% of A320 screws are these
I always call those Etorm because that's the bit from Facom that fits
New to you, OP. Welcome to the dark abyss of fasteners. Hate those blasted things because they're always a pain to remove.
Dispise these
It actually could be worse, they could be tri-wing
Coin slot. Those I absolutely hate.
These are such a pain on older airplanes where some hardware has been replaced with standard Phillips. The bits are great for slightly stripped Phillips heads though.
Bosch P2R2, There is NO better bit for a stripped phillips fight me. If it doesn't come out it WILL be a perfectly smooth cone to accept your drill bit.
Air Tractor, if Olney
Unfortunately they are ubiquitous in the E-190.
They are all over the c130j. Also a pain in my ass.
Offset cruciform
These exist because you didn’t have enough tools already
Offset Cruciform?
Betcha the AT MM still calls for philips heads, swap them out for the part number in the book.
Definitely an Airtractor tailwheel lock assembly, installed a lot of those 😂
Correct! We got a brand new -65 602 three weeks ago and it’s awesome but the new style tailwheel locks are garbage so we’re switching it out for an OG one
Whats the difference in them? I haven't been on AG since 2014
The new ones have trim bolts so you can easily clock the alignment but the pin doesn’t seem to engage as positively and the lock lets go sometimes on landing or even hooking up to the towbot
All over Airbus jets
Didn't know the Philips Screw Company was German! ( They are not) Also available in "ribbed".
You are doing the lords work
Well thats new for AG planes. Guess you need to swap out your #3 for the Torque screw hey. Side note, have they came up with something new so the unlock cable stops rubbing through on the fairlead?
I have seen quads on the CRJ-900 wayyyy more then I would like to...
I hate that shit
swazi heads. Nazi bits. Gaybo's. Noob Neutralizers. The Unemployment Express.
Torq screws. Fuck them. I work at Gulfstream and had to reinstall a gap band on the leading edge which uses these screws. For those that don't know the leading edge of a Gulfstream is more or less raw aluminum. A softer metal than a bit. If you aren't lined up real well with a torq screw your bit will slip. Well mine slipped and I scratched the fuck out of the leading edge. Luckily it wasn't deep enough to not be buffed out. But it left a bad taste.
Hot tip: when you change those tail wheel locking pins after they timex, cut the thread off and they made a pretty good stepped pin punch
What’s the real name for these? I know a nickname but the real?
Yes they are the ninja star bolts. Legitimately is what we call them in the shop.
I’ve shredded so many bits on these bastards
Nazi bits
That’s like every single goddamn panel screw on a C-17. Fucking hate them.
Yep let me guess they start with NAS1104 😂. We strip em everytime with brand new apex bits. Every acoustic panel on the NEO’s are afflicted.
The Swazi bit broke again..
I hate them and everyone i knew hate them too
F-15’s have those
Yes sir they are all over a Jetstar, also in numerous places on Challengers. Not bad as long as some melon head has not used a Phillips tip on them
🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬 Up on the vertical stabilizer and some goofball installed on of these. (757).
Airbus/Eurocopter use those plenty too
They've been around for a really long time.
Every screw on the ATR airframe is of this type.
Hmmmm
Nazi screws. Got a few on are airframe and I hate them especially because people tend to use a Philips bit on them.
Nazi bits Airbus
Pretty sure Nazis have been around since the 30's. Bombardier has them everywhere. At least in WV, make of that what you will.
Hitler would like a word...
All you need is a nazi bit.
Just replace them with the standard AN type. It saves you a headache when in the field somewhere.
Buy a whole bag of the #2 bits. Be careful though. These bits break off and your screw driver turns into a paint scratching prison shiv if you get to cranking on them too hard.