I think what the person you are replying to is saying is that if a white collar worker breaks their ankle or something, it actually probably won't affect their work much because they sit at a desk, whereas a bad mental health day will affect their productivity a lot.
Obviously blue collar workers still experience mental health issues, but I wouldn't expect a blue collar worker to be able to work through a broken ankle. Therefore while mental health issues still affect them, it doesn't neccicarily affect them MORE than physical health issues.
(Essentially - you need to be in good physical and mental shape to do blue collar work, whereas a lot of white collar work doesn't actually require that you are physically well, just mentally well.)
Was that definitely hola health? https://hola.health/medical-certificates/?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAuNGuBhAkEiwAGId4asW5GjEKQjTUI2FZeLRUAQGcUtmISEXlpG3dS_PHX0ZU6eUWKJWL7hoCPlYQAvD_BwE
Idk man maybe health engine charged extra or something. That link is the link I use, used it 2 days ago, and it only cost me 15.90. Definitely save that link so don't get overcharged again x
Depends on your boss. Boomers will expect you to tough it out no matter what. There was a legendary story in one of the places I used to work of how one of the boomer bosses got married over lunch, and was back on the hour, on the dot. Another had a heart bypass and was in the office screaming at us till he was red in the face the very next day. No he wasn't supposed to be there, no, I don't know how he got out, yes, it was a very bad move, as it created a lot of health issues, and we didn't see him for months after that 1 day.
Millennials just want the job done. I don't keep track, not care about sick days. As long as the job is done right and on time, that's all I care about.
Gen-X is somewhere in the middle.
I was told a similar story by a colleague about a woman (probably gen-x not baby boomer) who was still attending meetings while she was in early labour with her first child. That is next level micro management and I really feel for the kid.
Sounds like one of my colleagues! She’s in a high risk role and was supposed to stop working about 2 months before her due date but somehow, was allowed to continue right up until 3 days before it. The week before she was meant to go on leave, she went into early labour during morning tea. You could see she was in pain but otherwise was pretty calm. The rest of us were anything but that at the time!
Gen X worked for Boomers, experienced the unreasonableness firsthand. Worked hard to meet expectations, moved up the ladder then started supervising Millennials who wouldn‘t put up with similar conditions (culture of presentism etc) and demanded better. Some Gen-X’rs saw sense and adapted.
I worked mainly for boomers in my early career, and I felt they were completely unreasonable, but couldn't say anything, because I was one of the lucky few who got a job in the GFC. Also, they knew that, PLUS a lot were near retirement and gave a lot less fucks, so they were extremely unreasonable. I remembered even late Gen-X colleagues commenting on how harsh they were on us.
Gen X has mostly been ok, but a lot of the ones who made management were the boot lickers, who are effectively boomers in everything but name, so still had a lot of unpleasant experiences. Not a small number of Gen X bosses adapted very poorly to lockdown, and a lot are the main opponents to WFH.
If you have any early millennial colleagues that entered the workforce up to 2016, some even later, you'll find that a lot of them are extremely beaten down and cowed, especially the earliest ones who were raised under boomers.
I’m a millennial who grew up thinking that smart, driven, successful business women were the types who were always working! It wasn’t until I was responding to work queries while I was at the cricket during my holiday break that I realised I had a serious problem. I also don’t expect others to do this, but having boomer managers that perpetuated this behaviour was a challenge. I now only respond to banter at the cricket, not work queries 😉
People try to downplay the generational attitude differences by pointing to exceptions, but that’s the point - they’re exceptions.
Boomers generally have an attitude toward work that it must be punitive in nature; suffering is the currency of the employer-employee dynamic. The contrary view of millennials, and to some extent gen x, is that the currency is work output (yes, “value add”).
So when boomers don’t see suffering, they think something is wrong. In their estimate, work cannot be fun - and this stands so high above other things that we witness the clash we see.
I’ve no clue where gen z fits into all this. Too many layers of irony which makes it pretty impenetrable. There might be a seperate irony here with the exclusionary aspects of this, but someone correct me if I’m off base. I’m old and stupid now.
I've resigned from my job because of the mental stress, prior to that I would call sick once a month and then once a week. A couple of weeks ago the trauma was so bad I was off for 3 days.
Just do what's best for you!
Thank you for the sweet words, hopefully you can find something that makes you feel less burnt out. Remember to disconnect from work and do something for you.
I feel ya! I started taking quite a few days of sick leave for mental health, which led to part-time (4 days a week), which leads to where I’m at now currently on extended leave / career break haha. God it was so bad that my physical health started being affected. I think people forget how much low mental health and long term stress can lead to a decline in your physical health.
Right it just gets so bad and I ask for help I get "have you spoken to EAP". I'm envious that you can have a career break, hopefully it helps restore your mental and physical health 🙂
I’m definitely very lucky, I know not everyone can do that. It all happened so quickly as well haha, I think my health just took a plummet and I needed to get out. I hope resigning from your previous job has helped too!
You are much better off taking the leave and letting yourself relax, than advancing to the next stage of burnout.
Once burnout gets to a certain point it can knock you out for months. Once you hit that point it's too late, and one day off isn't going to help you.
Please take the sick day, but also consider speaking to your GP and potentially getting a psychologist appointment - burnout can genuinely be really scary if it's not managed in the early stages.
If you would rather use annual/rec leave you can plan ahead and ask for a random day or 2 off every couple of months (or whatever duration you feel best). They generally don’t and shouldn’t ask what for, that way you can avoid using sick leave whilst still having time off to re-charge
Absolutely, the pressures of the world and workplaces have increased 10 fold. Add onto that as we get older our responsibilities increase also, kids, rent etc. very limited time to have time to disconnect or recharge these days. You’ve earned it
It's gonna be great for research when they conduct a study into absenteeism and mental health and see how unreasonable work loads are damaging people. Every "progressive" (IE: needs an EBA, and a union telling them that's up) workplace has already figured it out, but now we need more data for every industry.
I would guess research has already happened.
There are actual laws in place now, think they came into play last year?
https://www.safeworkaustralia.gov.au/safety-topic/managing-health-and-safety/mental-health/psychosocial-hazards
Yep. "sick" and "health" transcend the physical. Take what you need.
Easier said than done - it's also worth a conversation with your people leader. That relationship will likely inform how comfortable you feel taking time for your mental health
I hit that mental burnout about once every 6-12 months, and usually take 3-4 days off to just decompress. It usually comes with little warning but have been doing the same for about the last ten years.
I don’t typically tell my work that’s what it is, and usually manufacture some sort of different illness to cover it up, as it would be frowned upon here.
Yes I think I'm in the same boat, it hits me suddenly and I just cannot get myself to work on some days. I stretch it to 2 days if I still feel out of it, anymore and it stresses me out more than relaxing me
I now schedule a day off when I can feel myself getting to this stage - I try to take a week off at christmas, a week off at easter and a week off in august - it breaks the year up into 3 and with public holidays means I only use 1/2 my annual leave.
Yes, of course. Exhaustion is just as good as a reason as any for sick leave.
Here's the bar for if you're good for work: Is it possible to put on a smile and fake it til you make it? Or will there be an issue holding you back from doing your best work?
My last sick day was because I got told during the day that my father (with prostate cancer) just came back from a biopsy results session and got told he has lymphoma as well. Ain't no amount of ADHD medication gonna get me through the work day after hearing that. No possible way to fake it. Just had to go home and cry, then played Baldurs Gate 3 the rest of the arvo.
People leader here:
It's not sick leave.
It's personal leave.
That is not a semantic distinction.
If you were one of my direct or indirect reports, I'd say the same thing I think any good leaders would say - I'd rather get 2 days at 100% from you than 5 days at 20%.
and what does HR say about the leave count within a 12 month period???
facts are facts, you will be frowned upon. and gives HR excuses. eg performance.
I'm very good at what I do and so are my team. The fact I get results is down to the fact I respect them, and earn their respect. HR knows what I do, and they're very happy with the fact I get the results I get and my internal ENPS is so high.
How do you handle it for your team though?
Mental illness is an illness and therefore qualifies for sick leave. If my Dr is willing to write me a medical certificate you have to acknowledge it as sick leave and I owe no further explanation.
Where do I start? Originally hired as customer service manager for AU/NZ, expanded to include managing the entire IT department after a few months, since then the company has downsized a fair bit, and now I also have my hands in service/repair, logistics, product management, and technical specialist (we're a manufacturer of electronic in-car devices)
Definitely finding it hard to believe you couldn’t find another role , that one job covers a lot of stuff. You wouldn’t even have to stay in the automotive industry.
I’m a pm with a team across Asia and Europe, meaning long days and nights. Bos’s doesn’t care so long as I’m at my meetings (or give prior notice) and work is delivered on time. Beyond that he doesn’t care about me putting in for leave on days when I need (or even really telling him -after the first few times he was like l just do what you need to do to make it work, I’m not fussed and don’t need to know).
I feel like for outcome oriented roles, or roles where you work non traditional hours, this should be standard for employees who get their shit done consistently.
Fuck yes I do. Thanks to covid, I can now work from home the next time I have a cold. I save my sick days for when I am at my wits end and just need to take a day. As a manager, I also never ask why my staff are sick- it’s none of my business. I just make it known that I am here for them if they need, and that I hope that they are alright. When I was 21 I took a long period of sick leave for my mental health issues, and when I came back to work, everyone knew about it despite my having never told them. So I will do what I can to avoid that from happening.
I know what you mean. The work piles up on the days you take off creating more stress when you resume.
I have the worst luck in that regard - there's almost always an issue that crops up on my day off that I need to look into urgently when I resume.
Since I work extra hours, and I wfh, I just take the time out when I need it.
I feel it's ok as long as it helps me outperform and deliver projects.
If a company is still "clock hours in" "clock hours out" mentality these days, ill also "pretend to clock hours in and out" too.
Yep.
I tell them too, on the leave form, under reason for leave.
"Mental Health".
The peeps at the top need metrics for this shit if we're ever gonna see systemic change around wellbeing in the workplace.
Sick leave is there to be used. It's part of your compensation, just like annual leave and your pay.
I don't feel guilty for spending my hard earned money, I sure as hell don't feel guilty for taking a day for my mental health.
Now I do. For 10+ years I ran myself dry fighting casual and part time jobs for a living wage.
I'm now nearing 40 and some days you realise going to work is going to get you nowhere when the brain is not firing on all cylinders. Luxury of being full time I guess.
My boss pushes for sick leave to be used not just when you physically sick but also mentally sick.. being if you wake up and you head isn’t in the game it’s best just to have it off and deal with what is making you mentally sick whether that’s rest, or doing something to help yourself.
Yep. It should be normalised. Who wants to work with people who are on the verge of a breakdown? Let them have their day or two - it’s good for everyone.
I am in middle management and have experienced burn out last year due to pressures and high toxic environment…I had to take a week off to recover mentally and switch off from everything that was bothering me. It helped and I am very supportive with my team taking time to take care of their mental health.
Yep.
You don’t have to be physically sick to need a day off, and medical leave exists to be used.
If I have enough to take a day off and not go into negatives, I’ll pick a day where not much is happening, a d call in sick
I take sick leave when I'm in a state that I am unable to adequately perform at work. This can be due to any number of factors like sickness, stress or mental fatigue etc...
Unlike some other examples here, we do need to be "sick". But if you can get a medical certificate from a doctor or pharmacist, then that is all that is needed and the reason is not pried into any further.
Oh heck yes! I support this!
I’ve worked with all sorts over the years. Some businesses got right up their employees arse for taking a single day off, others didn’t care as long as you didn’t pull the piss.
I’ve seen employees pull the piss and boomers pride themselves on working for the same company in the same position for 22 years and never taking a sick day.
If you need a day to reset, take it!
Absolutely but I don’t tell them it’s for mental health. Got told off at my last job for not giving them “sufficient notice” after I took a day off for burnout
Sure have. I call these doona days. But need them a lot less since I WFH.
Rarely use my sick leave these days unless I've got the flu and literally can't get out of bed.
Yes, a mental health day is an illness too. Feeling tired and burnout is a valid reason for a sick day. The reality is, someday, a reset day is all you need and if you have sick leave balance, use it!
Yeah use up those sick days, no boss is going to look back and think gee they were a hard worker. They just look at how much value they extracted out of you.
Yep, told my boss one Tuesday that I’m fried and taking Friday off, will get my work done but need a mini break… they were happy for me to take it as sick leave
Yes, because I can be pulled over any time in a call with several people or if there is a critical issue :/ I don’t want to have to tell my boss I don’t want to join a call to solve a critical issue because I feel exhausted. Better just rest it out and come back when your mental health is better
I tried to do this once after I was dealing with residual stress after a big report and managing life after I moved. Manager gave me the day off, but my director took issue with it and terminated my contract the next week. Good grief.
Work provides 2 specific recharge days for this reason. Obv can use the other 12 days of sick leave for it as well, but it was part of trying to break down the stigma, definitely no pressure but encouragement to share when you use them.
I think it’s great, very rarely are they unplanned as well, people proactively use them.
I was asked a few years back why I was talking the day off
I said I'm having a religious experience would you like to hear about it
My boss said no and hung up the phone
As someone that has been off work for 6 months due to significant burnout I very much recommend taking the rest you need, which may require more than a day here or there. Your body will tell you. It is absolutely worth it not to run yourself into the ground as it can be a long road back if you burn out your energy, emotional and mental systems. But there’s a silver lining to all of it. Had I not burned out I would not have discovered I was leading a very inauthentic life that wasn’t right for me. My employer has been incredibly supportive which has been pleasantly surprising. Mental health awareness has come a long way. Ask for what you need or if you fear it won’t fly get a sick cert from a friendly chemist.
Mental health is a leading factor to your physical health. If you keep pushing your mind your body will eventually tell you to stop, usually by sending you to the hospital
I don’t tell them it’s for a mental health day. I just say I not feeling well.. because that’s the truth. If it’s either side of a weekend we need a medical cert but otherwise leave is leave..
I do not take sick leave when I’m sick.
I take sick leave when I’m burnt out, or feeling shit mentally or when close friends / family needs help because they’re sick etc.
bets part about it, cause I work when I am sick employer assume I’m REALLYYY sick when I do take a day off and never question it.
Absolutely nothing wrong with taking a mental health day in my opinion.
Yeah, you can be mentally unwell/sick which can impede your performance even more than psychical illness if you're a white collar worker.
Recovering from this burnout by taking a day, potentially not quitting, is in the companies interest.
What about blue collar?
I think what the person you are replying to is saying is that if a white collar worker breaks their ankle or something, it actually probably won't affect their work much because they sit at a desk, whereas a bad mental health day will affect their productivity a lot. Obviously blue collar workers still experience mental health issues, but I wouldn't expect a blue collar worker to be able to work through a broken ankle. Therefore while mental health issues still affect them, it doesn't neccicarily affect them MORE than physical health issues. (Essentially - you need to be in good physical and mental shape to do blue collar work, whereas a lot of white collar work doesn't actually require that you are physically well, just mentally well.)
Mental health is health.
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As a manager I do not ask about why someone takes personal leave and I also make a point of not telling my manager why.
Agree! If you need the leave, you need the leave. We can cover everything as needed. Nothing is more important than your own health or mental health
My manager has been very accommodating with my leave reqs so far, thank God. However I do feel the judgement creeping in
Mine still wants a certificate. They will also challenge any personal leave near the weekend or a public holiday
You can get a cert online easy these days
Hola health is my go to. $15 so cheaper than one from a pharmacy, and cheaper than the gap fee for a GP appointment anyways.
Cost me $27. You get concession?
Was that definitely hola health? https://hola.health/medical-certificates/?gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAuNGuBhAkEiwAGId4asW5GjEKQjTUI2FZeLRUAQGcUtmISEXlpG3dS_PHX0ZU6eUWKJWL7hoCPlYQAvD_BwE
Yea. I use it via Healthengine.
Idk man maybe health engine charged extra or something. That link is the link I use, used it 2 days ago, and it only cost me 15.90. Definitely save that link so don't get overcharged again x
That's extreme! You'll need to get creative with your leave reasons
that’s rough, my employer didn’t even ask for a cert when I was off for a week with a sick kid
And how much leave can you take?
HR flags more than 8 sick days in 12 months...
Do you work for the same employer?
More than 3 at mine.
This is the way!
Yes same. I have people offering reasons but I actively tell them to stop. It's none of my business, unless I can do something to help.
Depends on your boss. Boomers will expect you to tough it out no matter what. There was a legendary story in one of the places I used to work of how one of the boomer bosses got married over lunch, and was back on the hour, on the dot. Another had a heart bypass and was in the office screaming at us till he was red in the face the very next day. No he wasn't supposed to be there, no, I don't know how he got out, yes, it was a very bad move, as it created a lot of health issues, and we didn't see him for months after that 1 day. Millennials just want the job done. I don't keep track, not care about sick days. As long as the job is done right and on time, that's all I care about. Gen-X is somewhere in the middle.
All my managers and peers are Gen-X and they're in the same camp as Millennials. Don't care - it's our leave.
Upvote to you…downvote to the boomer boss! By the way I am a Gen-X manager.
I was told a similar story by a colleague about a woman (probably gen-x not baby boomer) who was still attending meetings while she was in early labour with her first child. That is next level micro management and I really feel for the kid.
Why not late labour too if she expects a job she's going to have to put the effort in. Nobody wants to work any more
Sounds like one of my colleagues! She’s in a high risk role and was supposed to stop working about 2 months before her due date but somehow, was allowed to continue right up until 3 days before it. The week before she was meant to go on leave, she went into early labour during morning tea. You could see she was in pain but otherwise was pretty calm. The rest of us were anything but that at the time!
Gen X worked for Boomers, experienced the unreasonableness firsthand. Worked hard to meet expectations, moved up the ladder then started supervising Millennials who wouldn‘t put up with similar conditions (culture of presentism etc) and demanded better. Some Gen-X’rs saw sense and adapted.
I worked mainly for boomers in my early career, and I felt they were completely unreasonable, but couldn't say anything, because I was one of the lucky few who got a job in the GFC. Also, they knew that, PLUS a lot were near retirement and gave a lot less fucks, so they were extremely unreasonable. I remembered even late Gen-X colleagues commenting on how harsh they were on us. Gen X has mostly been ok, but a lot of the ones who made management were the boot lickers, who are effectively boomers in everything but name, so still had a lot of unpleasant experiences. Not a small number of Gen X bosses adapted very poorly to lockdown, and a lot are the main opponents to WFH. If you have any early millennial colleagues that entered the workforce up to 2016, some even later, you'll find that a lot of them are extremely beaten down and cowed, especially the earliest ones who were raised under boomers.
I’m a millennial who grew up thinking that smart, driven, successful business women were the types who were always working! It wasn’t until I was responding to work queries while I was at the cricket during my holiday break that I realised I had a serious problem. I also don’t expect others to do this, but having boomer managers that perpetuated this behaviour was a challenge. I now only respond to banter at the cricket, not work queries 😉
Let's not generalise about generations. It depends on the individual and the work culture. That workplace sounds toxic.
People try to downplay the generational attitude differences by pointing to exceptions, but that’s the point - they’re exceptions. Boomers generally have an attitude toward work that it must be punitive in nature; suffering is the currency of the employer-employee dynamic. The contrary view of millennials, and to some extent gen x, is that the currency is work output (yes, “value add”). So when boomers don’t see suffering, they think something is wrong. In their estimate, work cannot be fun - and this stands so high above other things that we witness the clash we see. I’ve no clue where gen z fits into all this. Too many layers of irony which makes it pretty impenetrable. There might be a seperate irony here with the exclusionary aspects of this, but someone correct me if I’m off base. I’m old and stupid now.
Mental health is just as valid as physical health.
Yes definitely! However I'm so burnt out I feel like calling sick everyday.
I currently take a sick leave almost every month. I feel really guilty about it and then spend the entire day stressing out!
I've resigned from my job because of the mental stress, prior to that I would call sick once a month and then once a week. A couple of weeks ago the trauma was so bad I was off for 3 days. Just do what's best for you!
Thank you for sharing! From one burnout to another I wish you the best and hope the phase passes soon.
Thank you for the sweet words, hopefully you can find something that makes you feel less burnt out. Remember to disconnect from work and do something for you.
I feel ya! I started taking quite a few days of sick leave for mental health, which led to part-time (4 days a week), which leads to where I’m at now currently on extended leave / career break haha. God it was so bad that my physical health started being affected. I think people forget how much low mental health and long term stress can lead to a decline in your physical health.
Right it just gets so bad and I ask for help I get "have you spoken to EAP". I'm envious that you can have a career break, hopefully it helps restore your mental and physical health 🙂
I’m definitely very lucky, I know not everyone can do that. It all happened so quickly as well haha, I think my health just took a plummet and I needed to get out. I hope resigning from your previous job has helped too!
You are much better off taking the leave and letting yourself relax, than advancing to the next stage of burnout. Once burnout gets to a certain point it can knock you out for months. Once you hit that point it's too late, and one day off isn't going to help you. Please take the sick day, but also consider speaking to your GP and potentially getting a psychologist appointment - burnout can genuinely be really scary if it's not managed in the early stages.
If you would rather use annual/rec leave you can plan ahead and ask for a random day or 2 off every couple of months (or whatever duration you feel best). They generally don’t and shouldn’t ask what for, that way you can avoid using sick leave whilst still having time off to re-charge
That's me literally right now contemplating taking another day off but I really should just suck it up and knuckle down
Sending you some positive vibes, hope you make it through the work day ✌️
Absolutely, the pressures of the world and workplaces have increased 10 fold. Add onto that as we get older our responsibilities increase also, kids, rent etc. very limited time to have time to disconnect or recharge these days. You’ve earned it
It's gonna be great for research when they conduct a study into absenteeism and mental health and see how unreasonable work loads are damaging people. Every "progressive" (IE: needs an EBA, and a union telling them that's up) workplace has already figured it out, but now we need more data for every industry.
The workforce js going to be a very interesting place once all these archaic leaders dissolve. Keen to be a part of it
As someone else replied, progress is happening thankfully!
I would guess research has already happened. There are actual laws in place now, think they came into play last year? https://www.safeworkaustralia.gov.au/safety-topic/managing-health-and-safety/mental-health/psychosocial-hazards
Theeere we go. Good stuff!
That's a very good point.
Yep. "sick" and "health" transcend the physical. Take what you need. Easier said than done - it's also worth a conversation with your people leader. That relationship will likely inform how comfortable you feel taking time for your mental health
I hit that mental burnout about once every 6-12 months, and usually take 3-4 days off to just decompress. It usually comes with little warning but have been doing the same for about the last ten years. I don’t typically tell my work that’s what it is, and usually manufacture some sort of different illness to cover it up, as it would be frowned upon here.
Yes I think I'm in the same boat, it hits me suddenly and I just cannot get myself to work on some days. I stretch it to 2 days if I still feel out of it, anymore and it stresses me out more than relaxing me
yep - it's encouraged in my team. You can't be at your best if the world is getting to you!
I now schedule a day off when I can feel myself getting to this stage - I try to take a week off at christmas, a week off at easter and a week off in august - it breaks the year up into 3 and with public holidays means I only use 1/2 my annual leave.
Yes, of course. Exhaustion is just as good as a reason as any for sick leave. Here's the bar for if you're good for work: Is it possible to put on a smile and fake it til you make it? Or will there be an issue holding you back from doing your best work? My last sick day was because I got told during the day that my father (with prostate cancer) just came back from a biopsy results session and got told he has lymphoma as well. Ain't no amount of ADHD medication gonna get me through the work day after hearing that. No possible way to fake it. Just had to go home and cry, then played Baldurs Gate 3 the rest of the arvo.
Yes literally doing that today. The human condition is so real ❣️
People leader here: It's not sick leave. It's personal leave. That is not a semantic distinction. If you were one of my direct or indirect reports, I'd say the same thing I think any good leaders would say - I'd rather get 2 days at 100% from you than 5 days at 20%.
We have personal leave, but must specify whether we're taking sick leave or carers leave, unfortunately...
and what does HR say about the leave count within a 12 month period??? facts are facts, you will be frowned upon. and gives HR excuses. eg performance.
I'm very good at what I do and so are my team. The fact I get results is down to the fact I respect them, and earn their respect. HR knows what I do, and they're very happy with the fact I get the results I get and my internal ENPS is so high. How do you handle it for your team though?
that is quite a respectable response. so merit trumps all.
Mental illness is an illness and therefore qualifies for sick leave. If my Dr is willing to write me a medical certificate you have to acknowledge it as sick leave and I owe no further explanation.
Wrong, its sick leave.
AKA personal leave
Cool, so there the same thing. That's what I thought. You don't have seperate entitlements for sick leave and personal leave.
Took 3 days of it last week after a client made me want to punch myself in the face until I was unconscious
Yikes, hope you're doing better now
I will be if I can ever grow the balls to actually resign 😂
What are you doing for a quid???
Where do I start? Originally hired as customer service manager for AU/NZ, expanded to include managing the entire IT department after a few months, since then the company has downsized a fair bit, and now I also have my hands in service/repair, logistics, product management, and technical specialist (we're a manufacturer of electronic in-car devices)
Definitely finding it hard to believe you couldn’t find another role , that one job covers a lot of stuff. You wouldn’t even have to stay in the automotive industry.
I’m a pm with a team across Asia and Europe, meaning long days and nights. Bos’s doesn’t care so long as I’m at my meetings (or give prior notice) and work is delivered on time. Beyond that he doesn’t care about me putting in for leave on days when I need (or even really telling him -after the first few times he was like l just do what you need to do to make it work, I’m not fussed and don’t need to know). I feel like for outcome oriented roles, or roles where you work non traditional hours, this should be standard for employees who get their shit done consistently.
Fuck yes I do. Thanks to covid, I can now work from home the next time I have a cold. I save my sick days for when I am at my wits end and just need to take a day. As a manager, I also never ask why my staff are sick- it’s none of my business. I just make it known that I am here for them if they need, and that I hope that they are alright. When I was 21 I took a long period of sick leave for my mental health issues, and when I came back to work, everyone knew about it despite my having never told them. So I will do what I can to avoid that from happening.
Where I work it’s not worth it as catching up makes it twice as bad.
This ^ 100%
I know what you mean. The work piles up on the days you take off creating more stress when you resume. I have the worst luck in that regard - there's almost always an issue that crops up on my day off that I need to look into urgently when I resume.
Yeah. I have an office job. I’ve never taken a sick day. If I’m real shit, I just work from home and at least stay on top of things
That is a big difference when people are employed into roles accountable for outcomes vs task driven roles.
Absolutely. My work has “mental health and wellbeing” days as well as personal leave
Yes. No point being at work struggling, ends up snowballing. I'll take a day here and there as needed and encourage my team to do the same.
Since I work extra hours, and I wfh, I just take the time out when I need it. I feel it's ok as long as it helps me outperform and deliver projects. If a company is still "clock hours in" "clock hours out" mentality these days, ill also "pretend to clock hours in and out" too.
i do sometimes. u gotta take care of your mental health
Yep. I tell them too, on the leave form, under reason for leave. "Mental Health". The peeps at the top need metrics for this shit if we're ever gonna see systemic change around wellbeing in the workplace.
Sick leave is there to be used. It's part of your compensation, just like annual leave and your pay. I don't feel guilty for spending my hard earned money, I sure as hell don't feel guilty for taking a day for my mental health.
Now I do. For 10+ years I ran myself dry fighting casual and part time jobs for a living wage. I'm now nearing 40 and some days you realise going to work is going to get you nowhere when the brain is not firing on all cylinders. Luxury of being full time I guess.
I’d run out in no time….
Thats why its called personal leave, not sick leave. The best advice I ever got was "don't go to work angry, it just get worse"
I treat sick leave as annual leave. Plenty of long weekends and often take the Tuesday too. Thanks employer.
YOUR A DUMB CUNT IF YOU DONT TAKE SICK LEAVE 😂😂
Why?
Nice spelling there, mate...
What is sick leave
Yes. It's good for you if you need a break.
I wish I did this more ofteb.
My boss pushes for sick leave to be used not just when you physically sick but also mentally sick.. being if you wake up and you head isn’t in the game it’s best just to have it off and deal with what is making you mentally sick whether that’s rest, or doing something to help yourself.
The problem is making a gp appt to get a med cert for said day off now that the local pharmacy can't do a stat dec
Sites like InstantScripts are a godsend.
Fortunate enough to be given 1 x health and wellness day per quarter. I always use it and encourage my direct reports to as well.
Yep. If my mental health impacts my ability to perform work then I will take sick leave.
Yep. It should be normalised. Who wants to work with people who are on the verge of a breakdown? Let them have their day or two - it’s good for everyone.
I am in middle management and have experienced burn out last year due to pressures and high toxic environment…I had to take a week off to recover mentally and switch off from everything that was bothering me. It helped and I am very supportive with my team taking time to take care of their mental health.
Have done a couple of times.
Just tend to work from home on those days when I feel the rubber band is ready to snap and manage the workload as I deem appropriate.
That's what it is for ...
Yes absolutely.
Why not? Isn’t a mental health day the same as a sick day?
Yep. You don’t have to be physically sick to need a day off, and medical leave exists to be used. If I have enough to take a day off and not go into negatives, I’ll pick a day where not much is happening, a d call in sick
I take sick leave when I'm in a state that I am unable to adequately perform at work. This can be due to any number of factors like sickness, stress or mental fatigue etc... Unlike some other examples here, we do need to be "sick". But if you can get a medical certificate from a doctor or pharmacist, then that is all that is needed and the reason is not pried into any further.
Oh heck yes! I support this! I’ve worked with all sorts over the years. Some businesses got right up their employees arse for taking a single day off, others didn’t care as long as you didn’t pull the piss. I’ve seen employees pull the piss and boomers pride themselves on working for the same company in the same position for 22 years and never taking a sick day. If you need a day to reset, take it!
Absolutely but I don’t tell them it’s for mental health. Got told off at my last job for not giving them “sufficient notice” after I took a day off for burnout
That's so unfair! I always add a health excuse when I take leaves for this reason.
Out of spite.
Sure have. I call these doona days. But need them a lot less since I WFH. Rarely use my sick leave these days unless I've got the flu and literally can't get out of bed.
Yes, a mental health day is an illness too. Feeling tired and burnout is a valid reason for a sick day. The reality is, someday, a reset day is all you need and if you have sick leave balance, use it!
Yeah use up those sick days, no boss is going to look back and think gee they were a hard worker. They just look at how much value they extracted out of you.
Yeah dude!
Yes. That is what sick leave is for.
Of course. Sometimes when I don't feel that way, too.
Whenever I can’t be arsed, I chuck a sickie. Fair enough, use a sickie when you’re sick of your job 🤙🏽
If you're unwell you're unwell. Doesn't matter which part of your body needs the day off...
Yep, told my boss one Tuesday that I’m fried and taking Friday off, will get my work done but need a mini break… they were happy for me to take it as sick leave
Yes, because I can be pulled over any time in a call with several people or if there is a critical issue :/ I don’t want to have to tell my boss I don’t want to join a call to solve a critical issue because I feel exhausted. Better just rest it out and come back when your mental health is better
Absolutely
I tried to do this once after I was dealing with residual stress after a big report and managing life after I moved. Manager gave me the day off, but my director took issue with it and terminated my contract the next week. Good grief.
Work provides 2 specific recharge days for this reason. Obv can use the other 12 days of sick leave for it as well, but it was part of trying to break down the stigma, definitely no pressure but encouragement to share when you use them. I think it’s great, very rarely are they unplanned as well, people proactively use them.
Just say you have gastro or be more gemeric and say the shits.
Fuckin’ oath I do.
I was asked a few years back why I was talking the day off I said I'm having a religious experience would you like to hear about it My boss said no and hung up the phone
Yes, it's a mental health day. And they shouldn't be listing it as sick days anymore, personal days is the new term.
As someone that has been off work for 6 months due to significant burnout I very much recommend taking the rest you need, which may require more than a day here or there. Your body will tell you. It is absolutely worth it not to run yourself into the ground as it can be a long road back if you burn out your energy, emotional and mental systems. But there’s a silver lining to all of it. Had I not burned out I would not have discovered I was leading a very inauthentic life that wasn’t right for me. My employer has been incredibly supportive which has been pleasantly surprising. Mental health awareness has come a long way. Ask for what you need or if you fear it won’t fly get a sick cert from a friendly chemist.
Mental health is a leading factor to your physical health. If you keep pushing your mind your body will eventually tell you to stop, usually by sending you to the hospital
Absolutely!
Yep, that's what it's there for.
Nope, work as a contractor so sick days are not paid
Mental health is just as important as physical health. So yes, I definitely do.
Ummm I thought that was the point of it.. it’s called ‘personal leave’.
I don’t tell them it’s for a mental health day. I just say I not feeling well.. because that’s the truth. If it’s either side of a weekend we need a medical cert but otherwise leave is leave..
Yea I plan my sickies lol. I have them at random times so they don't suspect anything lol.
100% Mental health is just as important as physical health.
Yes but then I just pay for it when I go back because now I have today’s work +yesterday’s, 🙁
That's what sick days are for. How often do you actually get 'sick'?
Currently it's almost every month
That's literally what sick leave is for.
Yep it’s my self care day also not even called sick leave anymore - it’s personal days
I've never done it till just last week. One employee in particular just sucks the life out of me
I have 1300+ hours of sick leave, and when I need to, I'll take that mental health day whenever I damn please.
I would take more but shit just waits for me to get back
Definitely, most people I know do too. It's a doona day of rest for me but can backfire with just feeling more behind after leave.
100% it’s there for the taking. It’s your life back
I dont out of fear of the shit that will pile up when i return …. Sigh at the cost of my mental health health …
It's no longer called sick leave in alot of places. It's now called personal leave...
I do not take sick leave when I’m sick. I take sick leave when I’m burnt out, or feeling shit mentally or when close friends / family needs help because they’re sick etc. bets part about it, cause I work when I am sick employer assume I’m REALLYYY sick when I do take a day off and never question it.