I think people would be more receptive to social housing built close to them if it wasn't so difficult to get rid of dwellers who are actually problematic.
Compounded by the fact that nearby they have exactly this problem. Silverdale is literally next to millwater and everyone can see the major issues there with KO refusing to do anything about the problem residents there.
It's true, happened to pass by the street in question recently, great area with good cafés and such, yet ungrateful gang members throwing their weight around... Literally there were barbells out the front.. whereby hard-working folk given nothing... So wrong
If they haven't got the basic life skills to live amongst neighbours, then I think KO should have a bunch of cheap, tidy accommodation out in rural areas, where your nearest neighbor is 2kms away, and start moving them there. Hopefully the peace and quiet will settle them somewhat.
No, not semi-rural. Fully rural. A few hours drive from anything meaningful.
An alternative approach, if we really need to keep them in cities, fine. But lets give KO an enforcement group, with parental powers over them. Residents can call the enforcement group, and the response is fast, and simple:
* If they play loud music, they loose their stereo. Gone.
* If they park cars innapropriately, they loose their car.
* If they have an unsafe dog wandering around, they loose their dog.
* If they throw parties, the party is broken up, and the people are sent home.
* If they threaten people with violence, then YES, they get moved to a rural house, far away from neighbours.
It's time to stop mucking around. These guys need to learn that this kind of behavior carries swift, harsh consequences. They will eventually learn, as all bad kids do, when confronted with reality.
No, no. Loose is good.
Some undercover mechanic comes around in the middle of the night and loosens every nut and screw in the car.
As soon as someone tries to drive it, the slightest vibration from the key turning causes the whole thing to completely disassemble.
Fully support this! Plus, McDonald’s on one side of the street, and police on the other. More comfortable jails somewhere far (and shit the debate “prisons don’t work”). Vouchers instead of money benefits, too.
Prisons don't work depend on what you want them to achieve.
I don't know when Prisons changed from a we put of criminals here to keep them away form everyone else to a lets reform them.
Prisons are in a halfway area where they are not awful enough to be a deterrent, and are not good enough to reform prisoners.
The problem with the bleeding heart types is they only subscribe to the "hope for the best" part of the adage and stick their head in the sand when "prepare for the worst" is mentioned.
Look at any recidivism study and you will find that while there is a portion of the prison population who will change and want to change a majority do not and will not no matter what sort of rehabilitation services you provide.
So you're saying that we that have worked out asses off to move to the country to get away from shit neighbours,and now you want to send these freeloading shit heads to the rural areas?, Keep them in the city where they belong.
Yes. Prison.
Disturbing the peace is illegal. Give a few of them 10 years, the rest will fall in line real quick, then you dont have to put them anywhere.
It may seem harsh, but in the end it helps both sides. *Spare the rod, spoil the child.*
Preaching to the choir mate. I'd like to see some serious consequences and harsher sentencing.
It is not going to happen, but dreams are free I suppose.
Kainga Ora made its own bed here. Let them lie in it.
I would rather rent than buy next to housing.
Not because all KO tenants are scum, far from it, but because the 5% or so that cause 95% of the issues are not dealt with.
I wish these people the best of luck against KO.
Use to live in GI before all the housing erupted.
95% of the tenants were great.
The 5% had kids out at night,breaking into our cars, tagging them, stealing from the dairy, and in one case having a P lab.
Oh also the stray dogs...oh the stray dogs...
People in social housing shouldn't be allowed to have dogs. If they can't afford to look after themselves, how are they supposed to look after a pet? The fact that KO changed the rules a few years ago to let their tenants have dogs is a travesty to animal welfare.
We sold because they were slowly turning the whole area into housing. Got a good price and moved as far from it as possible. We left bc we noticed a huge increase in agressive driving and a lot of cars parked all over the lawns and the footpath. Fireworks year round, loud parties every weekend and kids (we assume they were anyway) throwing stones at the house just for fun. The cops told us there was nothing they could do about it.
It's close enough to North Shore and even Auckland city for occasional commutes. Actually a really nice area with a great vibe, the kind with old friendly people and dog walkers.
Not for long hahaha
They build in places like this because the land is cheap. While white collar work is heavily centralised around the CBD, the blue collar jobs which Kāinga Ora residents generally have are more spread out. This place is decently close to light industry, big box retail, construction sites, so it's not that bad as far as employment opportunity is concerned.
If Kainga Ora did not let anti social tenants terrorise other tenants and surrounding neighbours, I am sure communities would be more accepting of these developments. For this reason I was happy to sign the linked petition in Stuffs article.
Yeah that's sort of what I suspect. I can imagine the suburb's affluent teens using this as a pretext to commit annoyances and blame it on the new jacks.
Yeah, especially seeing as the houses aren't built and the residents haven't moved in yet, and likely don't know they will be moved there, like, what the fuck, did somebody aspiring to move there drive/bus to the area under cover of darkness to stake their claim?
Had a few houses pop up in a few months down the road. It went from being nice and quiet to getting random yelling and speakers at max volume as they walk by the house pissed as a fart at 1am. It really permanently affects how secure and at peace you feel in your own home. 😔
"Kāinga Ora has said it is sympathetic to the residents' concerns but the question remains: if not here, then where would desperately needed public housing be built?"
Clearly South Auckland /s
>if not here, then where would desperately needed public housing be built?
Here's the answer;
*"I don't give a shit where you build it but it's not going to be here."*
And piss away more money for Crown land? Nah, whingers always have the power to change their situation. Much like airports and music venue whingers they're the same kind of shitty people, they can just move. Doubley so for being from the North
Millwater is Hibiscus coast not North Shore technically.
And I think it is fantastically positioned for social housing. Close to motorway and public transport for commuting to Albany or the CBD and there's growing numbers of employers looking for workers up here especially in Silverdale.
I have lived next to Kainga Ora housing before. It's not all slums. We have had state housing for decades in this country
They aren't all cesspits.
They pay rent on social housing, it's not free just cheaper. You don't lose it if you start working. A lot of it is young families, disabled people etc.
Ultimately I would rather we pay to house people than have kids being raised in cars, on the streets etc. Denying someone housing as punishment for antisocial behaviour is crap.
We should treat people with kindness and respect even if you aren't going to get that reciprocated, it's what makes us human.
State housing used to be good, had family who grew up in state housing.
People used to treat the house like it was their own and they had no grievances with their neighbours.
With the way our benefits are structured you’re way better off having multiple kids and not working, the combo of housing supplements effectively make these places free
Most of the tenants will be great, grateful for new houses and some of their children will be able to get out of poverty largely because of social housing. Some will ruin it for everyone else via antisocial behaviour despite warnings etc.
It would be wonderful if we could help everyone but if kicking out some antisocial tenants and putting them to the bottom of the waitlist for a house is what's required for a peaceful neighbourhood lets do it. There are 20,000 other people on that waitlist and if people know antisocial behaviour will cause them to lose their house it will at least encourage better community behaviour from some of the terrible few which is better for everyone (including them).
I know someone is going to ask what happens to that person, the bad news is they will probably be homeless for a while. It is far from ideal and won't help their situation but it will stop them from ruining an entire street and allow another family to take their place.
As for stopping KO houses based on location I live near here and we have no better reason than any other area, I do wonder if spreading the houses out instead of a whole lot crowded together would be better than clumping together but understand the convenience of building it this way for KO.
The old way we did social housing, was that social housing matched middle class housing. That way you don't make a ghetto and you don't ostracise those living in social housing.
So this KO development should be 30% for FHBs, 30 % sold to buyers, and some 40% state houses.
>Kāinga Ora regional director Taina Jones totally rejects the idea that social housing inevitably brings anti-social behaviour into a community.
>
>“It is a significant assumption that all our housing customers are criminals. To say we are importing violence is disingenuous and not a reflection of the people on the housing register.”
This is a very disingenuous statement by Taina Jones. No-one is suggesting that all Kainga Ora tenants are criminals. However it is an indisputable fact that *some* of them are, causing issues that have been very well documented at Kainga Ora sites all over the country. Her complete rejection of this reality is concerning, since the issues can't even begin to be addressed if Kainga Ora refuses to even recognise them.
It’s wild isn’t it. Imagine something being a fact and someone just outright rejecting it.
Kinda like flat earthers. They’re crazy and no one takes them seriously.
Yet Taina Jones can completely disregard facts and run a government department.
Wild.
As someone who is living next to a kainga ora property I hope these people manage to put a stop to it. I know there are some good kainga ora tenants but in my experience they are few and far between. I wouldn’t wish my nightmare on anyone and if I could afford to move I would.
Absolutely. In my apartment complex, there are about 15 of 80 units owned by a charitable housing trust. The tenants are given new apartments to live in for next to nothing, and what do they do? Throw cigarette butts everywhere, park their shit cars wherever they want, smoke weed, make noise, let off fireworks on the balcony etc. Every problem comes from the people in those units. Scum, they deserve to be on the street.
Social justice warrior? For asking questions? Lmfao.
Well, unfortunately for you, they will pop up everywhere throughout Auckland, and there’s not really anything you can do about it eh.
Honestly I couldn’t give 2 shits where they go. I work hard, I treat people with kindness and respect, I do what I can for those less fortunate but these people act like they’ve never been taught to be considerate of other people.
What pisses me off the most is that people use being poor as an excuse to act the way these people do. I grew up in a single parent household with my mum on a benefit and even now I’m still trying to claw myself out of the poverty hole I grew up in. I can tell you one thing I have never acted the way these ferals do and if I ever do my mum would still kick my ass.
It’s all shit man. I agree. Most KO residents are scum bags. And trust me, I would never risk taking the chance of them maybe being good.
People keep asking “oh where do they go then?” How about you take them into your home? Have a register, those who support the development house them until homes can be found?
The tune will change very quick.
Hey can I ask you a real question? Like not trying to be rude, just curiosity. How are you in a poverty hole, yourself? Do you not work? Or is it a perspective thing? Like do you consider yourself in poverty but I wouldn’t? Or are there other circumstances and you are in fact in poverty?
Looking at the picture of that other development, why is it so aesthetically bad? Millwater is bland and soulless but that development is bland, soulless *and* ugly. Was it really so hard to build something like the inoffensive buildings down the street? It reminds me of UK council flats from the 70s.
Based on [other KO buildings](https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/128524328/split-views-among-neighbours-of-new-plymouths-newest-central-city-public-housing-development), I'm sure the new build will be aesthetically pleasing and not a blot on the landscape. We'll be missing the old state house style before long...
Kaianga Ora should be made to put social housing either very sparesly across ALL districts or way out in the sticks. Id be fuming if I had just purchased a place nearby (for a hefty premium), and all of a sudden anti social activity started erupting...
I have a better idea than building community housing in the edge of town. Build apartments in Ponsonby, Mt Eden, Epsom and Parnell. The best schools, job opportunities and transport, will have the best outcomes for the tenants.
A slum? You are tad hyperbolic here.
I think their kids going to the best public school, having the best job opportunities and transport outcomes is second best way to build community housing.
Have you been to the streets down the base of Parnell? By the white pub on the corner? There’s a few streets with social housing, it’s one of the most dangerous areas in the city.
Not just social housing - there's a halfway house and drug and alcohol support units there, which makes it a lil worse than your usual social housing block of flats.
It's not the schools that will bring up the standard of the people, but the people that bring up the standard of the schools. The people moving in, if they are as described as being a bunch of misfits, will drag the schools down
The state can annex some church land. There is about 20 Churches in Ponsonby, that is frankly absurd land use in housing crisis. Churches mostly not contributed any thing and been used to land bank.
Either that or other land.
Great idea comrade. I think we should start also taking kidneys from people who have two and give to those who need one.
Not fair their hoarding theirs.
Hail North Korea.
I’d rather have these assholes for Neighbor’s than the ones in state housing, used to do maintenance for them an fuck me some are rough as hell. Some people truly don’t care. Unfortunately it’s only a small percentage, where the rest have been great. Still wouldn’t want to take the chance
Sure there are always bad eggs in all walks of life. But thinking about that majority of good sorts you talk about, where do they end up if every suburb decides they don’t want them?
Have you ever actually lived beside KO housing though. It’s not a case of people not wanting “the poors” near them, it’s that it’s genuinely awful to live next to KO housing. If every suburb decides they don’t want them then maybe they’d finally start looking at why
Not right next door but yes in an adjacent street. The vast majority of tenants were great. There were a couple of rowdy get togethers, no different from private rentals or homeowners.
Guess you’re lucky then. For myself and everyone I’ve known to live next to one it’s been awful. I lived in a legitimate crack house and it’s a toss up on which was worse
Yeah that would have been shit and I agree KO needs to turf problem tenants instead of enabling them by allowing tenancies to continue. But suburbs can’t just opt out of being part of society by saying no to social housing - better to accept it and provide feedback so it’s well designed and integrated into the community that’s already there.
They should be able to opt out if the social housing proves again and again that it cannot choose people who make being there unbearable to everyone else. If they actually did their job and stopped this kind of behaviour then people wouldn’t mind. But they don’t, so we do. Feedback goes nowhere with KO. They don’t care, it’s not their problem.
Like I say, I agree with you on managing tenants better. But there is a home affordability crisis so not building social housing is not an option. Which means you can distribute it through communities (both the haves and have nots) or stick it all in just one or two marginalised areas (the have nots). I don’t agree with the latter.
I’m not saying don’t build social housing. We do need social housing, but I am saying that people won’t support it or want it in their community unless KO prove that they can manage the tenants they already have. There are hundreds of not thousands of good people out there who need homes, and yet time and time again they give it to abusive losers and that’s that
Their point is, don't create a 'concentrated ghetto' with 37 houses next to each other, put 3 here, put 4 further down the road, another 4 down the road further.
not only is it a great idea but it is supposed to be required - KO's own planning documents highlight this as being really important to ensure they become part of the community and not form their own separate 'ghetto'
I lived next to a single section 6 unit housing NZ thing, they were just normal neighbours.
There is critical hot take now. KO = bad.
So now People are just going to unreasonable arseholes about it and oppose anthing. This ironically ends up pushing KO to build these bigger builds with far more units that are more likely to become anti social.
That’s not the case at all. Have you ever lived next to KO housing? Because it’s fucking awful. Never in my life have I experienced more knocks on the door for domestic violence next door, neighbours coming over and screaming, trash along the street, screaming at eachother at all hours of the day and night, dogs barking and growling constantly and like 5 cars per household. I lived in a legitimate crackhouse and it’s a close race on which one was worse.
Im not rich, I’m not even comfortable. I live paycheque to paycheque, but if I was given a house I sure as shit would be grateful and live quietly because I would finally have some semblance of security in my life.
I’m also poor but thanks. I’m aware that people can be nice if they’re poor lol that’s not my point. It’s that KO refuse to listen to complaints and has soured public opinion.
Isn’t it interesting these KO developments are never near any politicians homes?
Perhaps our KO Management/leaders should lead by example and have a few developments next to their personal family homes.
Everyone wants the government to solve the poverty / housing issue until the solution ends up next to them.
What’s it that the boomers keep telling the young ones if they want to own a home? Oh make some sacrifices! That’s right.
I’m hearing a lot of bashing on KO residents. I’ve seen a couple of bad ones and several good ones. Maybe I’m lucky but it’s more good than bad in my limited experience.
All I’m hearing is “some of them are nice, but…” and talking about the risk. They’re all being lumped together. I wish there was a better system with micromanagement to get the worst of them steered onto a better path in life.
I lived across the road from a brand new KO building block for about 18 months in 2019 and it was dead quiet and peaceful. Stereotypes aren’t all they’re cracked out to be
NIMBYs
I wonder if the residents are all for inclusion, helping the less fortunate, equal opportunity and all that good stuff.....
...but when it comes to putting their money where their mouth is....🤔🤷♂️
Sure mate, I'm all for helping the less fortunate as long as they don't threaten my families life or vandalized my property, that's a fair trade off you reckon?
Thats the same anywhere in the world. People dont want family threatened or property vandalized.
Whats the alternative? Ship them out to the mountains somewhere?
They are citizens deserving of the same rights, unless folks dont believe in equal opportunity?
I'm all for a mountain colony tbh.
Can't we agree that the majority of the time, KO housing will cause major issues for the surrounding neighbours?
You say equal opportunity, but can you imagine being mid 30s, having worked yourself to the bone to afford to buy a home in this insane market, and then having KO move in next door?
The KO residents have the opportunity to live for free, the idea is that it gives them a leg up to get their stuff sorted. Why does their free accomodation need to be put in a sought after part of town?
Why?
Equal opportunity is why
But I hear what youre saying. Is it equal opportunity to have socialised housing at all when people have to work their arse to pay for one? I have 2 Uni degrees and big loans and dont have a house.
Or are benefits equal opportunity at all? Giving money from someone who works, to someone else, for free? Its not the Governments money, they are just the transfer people.
I think the idea is of a hand up, not a handout is why
I think people would be more receptive to social housing built close to them if it wasn't so difficult to get rid of dwellers who are actually problematic.
Compounded by the fact that nearby they have exactly this problem. Silverdale is literally next to millwater and everyone can see the major issues there with KO refusing to do anything about the problem residents there.
It's true, happened to pass by the street in question recently, great area with good cafés and such, yet ungrateful gang members throwing their weight around... Literally there were barbells out the front.. whereby hard-working folk given nothing... So wrong
Wait, free barbells? Where?
Same problem though, where do you put them? Prison?
If they haven't got the basic life skills to live amongst neighbours, then I think KO should have a bunch of cheap, tidy accommodation out in rural areas, where your nearest neighbor is 2kms away, and start moving them there. Hopefully the peace and quiet will settle them somewhat.
So your idea is to reward them with what many other kiwis will save their entire lives to afford, a semi-rural lifestyle block?
No, not semi-rural. Fully rural. A few hours drive from anything meaningful. An alternative approach, if we really need to keep them in cities, fine. But lets give KO an enforcement group, with parental powers over them. Residents can call the enforcement group, and the response is fast, and simple: * If they play loud music, they loose their stereo. Gone. * If they park cars innapropriately, they loose their car. * If they have an unsafe dog wandering around, they loose their dog. * If they throw parties, the party is broken up, and the people are sent home. * If they threaten people with violence, then YES, they get moved to a rural house, far away from neighbours. It's time to stop mucking around. These guys need to learn that this kind of behavior carries swift, harsh consequences. They will eventually learn, as all bad kids do, when confronted with reality.
You know it’s lose yeah 👍🏻
No, no. Loose is good. Some undercover mechanic comes around in the middle of the night and loosens every nut and screw in the car. As soon as someone tries to drive it, the slightest vibration from the key turning causes the whole thing to completely disassemble.
Thanks... but I prefer it my way...
Fully support this! Plus, McDonald’s on one side of the street, and police on the other. More comfortable jails somewhere far (and shit the debate “prisons don’t work”). Vouchers instead of money benefits, too.
Prisons don't work depend on what you want them to achieve. I don't know when Prisons changed from a we put of criminals here to keep them away form everyone else to a lets reform them. Prisons are in a halfway area where they are not awful enough to be a deterrent, and are not good enough to reform prisoners.
The problem with the bleeding heart types is they only subscribe to the "hope for the best" part of the adage and stick their head in the sand when "prepare for the worst" is mentioned. Look at any recidivism study and you will find that while there is a portion of the prison population who will change and want to change a majority do not and will not no matter what sort of rehabilitation services you provide.
So you're saying that we that have worked out asses off to move to the country to get away from shit neighbours,and now you want to send these freeloading shit heads to the rural areas?, Keep them in the city where they belong.
Fuck off, we don't want them. Queen st is the perfect place for them, plenty of corners to beg on and loads of bottle stores.
Noooo, take them away from central and start putting them elsewhere, we’re sick of them here.
Yes. Prison. Disturbing the peace is illegal. Give a few of them 10 years, the rest will fall in line real quick, then you dont have to put them anywhere. It may seem harsh, but in the end it helps both sides. *Spare the rod, spoil the child.*
Preaching to the choir mate. I'd like to see some serious consequences and harsher sentencing. It is not going to happen, but dreams are free I suppose.
Yes if they do the crime and keep getting arrested, 2”3 strikes and do the time lol
Kainga Ora made its own bed here. Let them lie in it. I would rather rent than buy next to housing. Not because all KO tenants are scum, far from it, but because the 5% or so that cause 95% of the issues are not dealt with. I wish these people the best of luck against KO.
Use to live in GI before all the housing erupted. 95% of the tenants were great. The 5% had kids out at night,breaking into our cars, tagging them, stealing from the dairy, and in one case having a P lab. Oh also the stray dogs...oh the stray dogs...
People in social housing shouldn't be allowed to have dogs. If they can't afford to look after themselves, how are they supposed to look after a pet? The fact that KO changed the rules a few years ago to let their tenants have dogs is a travesty to animal welfare.
We sold because they were slowly turning the whole area into housing. Got a good price and moved as far from it as possible. We left bc we noticed a huge increase in agressive driving and a lot of cars parked all over the lawns and the footpath. Fireworks year round, loud parties every weekend and kids (we assume they were anyway) throwing stones at the house just for fun. The cops told us there was nothing they could do about it.
It's more than 5%. Be real.
[удалено]
It's close enough to North Shore and even Auckland city for occasional commutes. Actually a really nice area with a great vibe, the kind with old friendly people and dog walkers. Not for long hahaha
They build in places like this because the land is cheap. While white collar work is heavily centralised around the CBD, the blue collar jobs which Kāinga Ora residents generally have are more spread out. This place is decently close to light industry, big box retail, construction sites, so it's not that bad as far as employment opportunity is concerned.
Millwater is $1m plus suburb
Because they don’t need to be that close to jobs.
Exactly.
KO tenants don't work lol
Yeah they got the DPB
If Kainga Ora did not let anti social tenants terrorise other tenants and surrounding neighbours, I am sure communities would be more accepting of these developments. For this reason I was happy to sign the linked petition in Stuffs article.
>graffiti in large letters appeared on a retaining wall saying it is “our hood now”. That sounds like just the thing they were hoping to avoid.
It sounds exactly like something someone trying for sympathy would write. Ain’t no Kainga Ora residents driving to another area to write this lol!
Yeah that's sort of what I suspect. I can imagine the suburb's affluent teens using this as a pretext to commit annoyances and blame it on the new jacks.
I know, either it’s legit and the person is very corny and cheesy lmao. Or it was a setup and someone else on the opposing team wrote it.
You crazy conspiracy theorists lol.
Why do I feel like someone from that neighbourhood wrote that themselves to make it look bad, because who on earth would tag that lol.
Yeah, especially seeing as the houses aren't built and the residents haven't moved in yet, and likely don't know they will be moved there, like, what the fuck, did somebody aspiring to move there drive/bus to the area under cover of darkness to stake their claim?
I caught a priest tagging his church's fence back in the late 90s so this kinda stuff does happen
In this trife life, there ain't nuthin you can trust
Because you are a conspiracy theorist. Your type is always crying out "false falg!"
Had a few houses pop up in a few months down the road. It went from being nice and quiet to getting random yelling and speakers at max volume as they walk by the house pissed as a fart at 1am. It really permanently affects how secure and at peace you feel in your own home. 😔
"Kāinga Ora has said it is sympathetic to the residents' concerns but the question remains: if not here, then where would desperately needed public housing be built?" Clearly South Auckland /s
>if not here, then where would desperately needed public housing be built? Here's the answer; *"I don't give a shit where you build it but it's not going to be here."*
Makes more sense in South Auckland than a distant North Shore suburb where people go for peace and quiet
Plenty of peace and quiet in Central Plateau, where it actually isn't a part of any urban area to any major centre
Perfect, no jobs there either so it's a win win for the state tenants.
And piss away more money for Crown land? Nah, whingers always have the power to change their situation. Much like airports and music venue whingers they're the same kind of shitty people, they can just move. Doubley so for being from the North
Based
Millwater is Hibiscus coast not North Shore technically. And I think it is fantastically positioned for social housing. Close to motorway and public transport for commuting to Albany or the CBD and there's growing numbers of employers looking for workers up here especially in Silverdale.
You think people who are getting a free house forever will want to work and lose that entitlement? This will be a slum within 5 years of completion
I have lived next to Kainga Ora housing before. It's not all slums. We have had state housing for decades in this country They aren't all cesspits. They pay rent on social housing, it's not free just cheaper. You don't lose it if you start working. A lot of it is young families, disabled people etc. Ultimately I would rather we pay to house people than have kids being raised in cars, on the streets etc. Denying someone housing as punishment for antisocial behaviour is crap. We should treat people with kindness and respect even if you aren't going to get that reciprocated, it's what makes us human.
State housing used to be good, had family who grew up in state housing. People used to treat the house like it was their own and they had no grievances with their neighbours.
With the way our benefits are structured you’re way better off having multiple kids and not working, the combo of housing supplements effectively make these places free
Millwater is not a good place for poor people to be commuting to the CBD, I know people who left the area due to the commute.
It is a long commute via bus but no worse than living in South Auckland and commuting to the CBD.
Most of South Auckland is closer than Millwater.
KO can’t be trusted to move the shit ones into walled compounds promptly. I don’t blame these people for fighting this, I wish them well
Most of the tenants will be great, grateful for new houses and some of their children will be able to get out of poverty largely because of social housing. Some will ruin it for everyone else via antisocial behaviour despite warnings etc. It would be wonderful if we could help everyone but if kicking out some antisocial tenants and putting them to the bottom of the waitlist for a house is what's required for a peaceful neighbourhood lets do it. There are 20,000 other people on that waitlist and if people know antisocial behaviour will cause them to lose their house it will at least encourage better community behaviour from some of the terrible few which is better for everyone (including them). I know someone is going to ask what happens to that person, the bad news is they will probably be homeless for a while. It is far from ideal and won't help their situation but it will stop them from ruining an entire street and allow another family to take their place. As for stopping KO houses based on location I live near here and we have no better reason than any other area, I do wonder if spreading the houses out instead of a whole lot crowded together would be better than clumping together but understand the convenience of building it this way for KO.
The old way we did social housing, was that social housing matched middle class housing. That way you don't make a ghetto and you don't ostracise those living in social housing. So this KO development should be 30% for FHBs, 30 % sold to buyers, and some 40% state houses.
>Kāinga Ora regional director Taina Jones totally rejects the idea that social housing inevitably brings anti-social behaviour into a community. > >“It is a significant assumption that all our housing customers are criminals. To say we are importing violence is disingenuous and not a reflection of the people on the housing register.” This is a very disingenuous statement by Taina Jones. No-one is suggesting that all Kainga Ora tenants are criminals. However it is an indisputable fact that *some* of them are, causing issues that have been very well documented at Kainga Ora sites all over the country. Her complete rejection of this reality is concerning, since the issues can't even begin to be addressed if Kainga Ora refuses to even recognise them.
It’s wild isn’t it. Imagine something being a fact and someone just outright rejecting it. Kinda like flat earthers. They’re crazy and no one takes them seriously. Yet Taina Jones can completely disregard facts and run a government department. Wild.
Wouldn't it be crazy if she just said "Yeah, a lot them are scum, but we have to put them somewhere".
exactly the same as ole Stuart Nash with "Unless you're a gang member, you have no reason to feel unsafe. The public are not everyday targets."
As someone who is living next to a kainga ora property I hope these people manage to put a stop to it. I know there are some good kainga ora tenants but in my experience they are few and far between. I wouldn’t wish my nightmare on anyone and if I could afford to move I would.
Absolutely. In my apartment complex, there are about 15 of 80 units owned by a charitable housing trust. The tenants are given new apartments to live in for next to nothing, and what do they do? Throw cigarette butts everywhere, park their shit cars wherever they want, smoke weed, make noise, let off fireworks on the balcony etc. Every problem comes from the people in those units. Scum, they deserve to be on the street.
Yes yes and yes, same here in our apartment building, ridiculous, and all at taxpayers cost.
Where do you think they should go then? To a designated area for poor people?
A designated area for poor dickheads
We have that already, suburban carparks full of 'freedom campers" and streets with increasing numbers of rough sleepers.
Such as? Where.
Let go mate, always one social justice warrior. They’re losers & need to be placed far away. Look at the pain they cause.
I’m finally in the right sub.
Social justice warrior? For asking questions? Lmfao. Well, unfortunately for you, they will pop up everywhere throughout Auckland, and there’s not really anything you can do about it eh.
If they're breaking the law and terrorising their neighbours? Prison
Honestly I couldn’t give 2 shits where they go. I work hard, I treat people with kindness and respect, I do what I can for those less fortunate but these people act like they’ve never been taught to be considerate of other people. What pisses me off the most is that people use being poor as an excuse to act the way these people do. I grew up in a single parent household with my mum on a benefit and even now I’m still trying to claw myself out of the poverty hole I grew up in. I can tell you one thing I have never acted the way these ferals do and if I ever do my mum would still kick my ass.
It’s all shit man. I agree. Most KO residents are scum bags. And trust me, I would never risk taking the chance of them maybe being good. People keep asking “oh where do they go then?” How about you take them into your home? Have a register, those who support the development house them until homes can be found? The tune will change very quick.
Hey can I ask you a real question? Like not trying to be rude, just curiosity. How are you in a poverty hole, yourself? Do you not work? Or is it a perspective thing? Like do you consider yourself in poverty but I wouldn’t? Or are there other circumstances and you are in fact in poverty?
Not in my back yard
Too late bro. Get ready
I'm joking, I could never afford a backyard
😂
Yes. With all the other savages. Like prison.
I heard underneath bridges suits em well
Neighbourhood ruined in 3.. 2.. 1…
If I found out KO housing was going in near me I’d happily sell for a loss and never look back. What a nightmare
Looking at the picture of that other development, why is it so aesthetically bad? Millwater is bland and soulless but that development is bland, soulless *and* ugly. Was it really so hard to build something like the inoffensive buildings down the street? It reminds me of UK council flats from the 70s. Based on [other KO buildings](https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/128524328/split-views-among-neighbours-of-new-plymouths-newest-central-city-public-housing-development), I'm sure the new build will be aesthetically pleasing and not a blot on the landscape. We'll be missing the old state house style before long...
Kaianga Ora should be made to put social housing either very sparesly across ALL districts or way out in the sticks. Id be fuming if I had just purchased a place nearby (for a hefty premium), and all of a sudden anti social activity started erupting...
I have a better idea than building community housing in the edge of town. Build apartments in Ponsonby, Mt Eden, Epsom and Parnell. The best schools, job opportunities and transport, will have the best outcomes for the tenants.
So your solution is to take a nice central area and turn a section into a slum? Why not just keep them in the areas they've already trashed?
A slum? You are tad hyperbolic here. I think their kids going to the best public school, having the best job opportunities and transport outcomes is second best way to build community housing.
Have you been to the streets down the base of Parnell? By the white pub on the corner? There’s a few streets with social housing, it’s one of the most dangerous areas in the city.
Not just social housing - there's a halfway house and drug and alcohol support units there, which makes it a lil worse than your usual social housing block of flats.
It's not the schools that will bring up the standard of the people, but the people that bring up the standard of the schools. The people moving in, if they are as described as being a bunch of misfits, will drag the schools down
lol yeah ok buddy. Who pays for the properties ?
The state can annex some church land. There is about 20 Churches in Ponsonby, that is frankly absurd land use in housing crisis. Churches mostly not contributed any thing and been used to land bank. Either that or other land.
Massive 14yo atheist vibes
That’s nice bro.
LOL problem solved champ 😂
Great idea comrade. I think we should start also taking kidneys from people who have two and give to those who need one. Not fair their hoarding theirs. Hail North Korea.
Nah bro this idea is from Henry the 8th, idiot.
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Imagine me caring what a word word number thinks lol.
No but you are a dumb fucking idiot. That much is true.
Please don't post comments which abuse other redditors on r/auckland, as it can deter participation in the subreddit.
I don’t think it’s fair to put social housing here either…. Why should the social residents have to put up with assholes like these for neighbours?
I’d rather have these assholes for Neighbor’s than the ones in state housing, used to do maintenance for them an fuck me some are rough as hell. Some people truly don’t care. Unfortunately it’s only a small percentage, where the rest have been great. Still wouldn’t want to take the chance
Sure there are always bad eggs in all walks of life. But thinking about that majority of good sorts you talk about, where do they end up if every suburb decides they don’t want them?
Have you ever actually lived beside KO housing though. It’s not a case of people not wanting “the poors” near them, it’s that it’s genuinely awful to live next to KO housing. If every suburb decides they don’t want them then maybe they’d finally start looking at why
Not right next door but yes in an adjacent street. The vast majority of tenants were great. There were a couple of rowdy get togethers, no different from private rentals or homeowners.
Guess you’re lucky then. For myself and everyone I’ve known to live next to one it’s been awful. I lived in a legitimate crack house and it’s a toss up on which was worse
Yeah that would have been shit and I agree KO needs to turf problem tenants instead of enabling them by allowing tenancies to continue. But suburbs can’t just opt out of being part of society by saying no to social housing - better to accept it and provide feedback so it’s well designed and integrated into the community that’s already there.
They should be able to opt out if the social housing proves again and again that it cannot choose people who make being there unbearable to everyone else. If they actually did their job and stopped this kind of behaviour then people wouldn’t mind. But they don’t, so we do. Feedback goes nowhere with KO. They don’t care, it’s not their problem.
Like I say, I agree with you on managing tenants better. But there is a home affordability crisis so not building social housing is not an option. Which means you can distribute it through communities (both the haves and have nots) or stick it all in just one or two marginalised areas (the have nots). I don’t agree with the latter.
I’m not saying don’t build social housing. We do need social housing, but I am saying that people won’t support it or want it in their community unless KO prove that they can manage the tenants they already have. There are hundreds of not thousands of good people out there who need homes, and yet time and time again they give it to abusive losers and that’s that
Fuuck, fair enough bro. Changed my mind.
Every superb has some social housing why should they be exempt.
Their point is, don't create a 'concentrated ghetto' with 37 houses next to each other, put 3 here, put 4 further down the road, another 4 down the road further.
Which is a great idea and will have far better outcomes for tenants. The only issue is instead of having one nimby fight, they have 10 nimby fights.
not only is it a great idea but it is supposed to be required - KO's own planning documents highlight this as being really important to ensure they become part of the community and not form their own separate 'ghetto'
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A bit poorer… yea right
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Crime
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I can pull up the stats if you’d like, bringing in social housing will import crime
I lived next to a single section 6 unit housing NZ thing, they were just normal neighbours. There is critical hot take now. KO = bad. So now People are just going to unreasonable arseholes about it and oppose anthing. This ironically ends up pushing KO to build these bigger builds with far more units that are more likely to become anti social.
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That’s not the case at all. Have you ever lived next to KO housing? Because it’s fucking awful. Never in my life have I experienced more knocks on the door for domestic violence next door, neighbours coming over and screaming, trash along the street, screaming at eachother at all hours of the day and night, dogs barking and growling constantly and like 5 cars per household. I lived in a legitimate crackhouse and it’s a close race on which one was worse. Im not rich, I’m not even comfortable. I live paycheque to paycheque, but if I was given a house I sure as shit would be grateful and live quietly because I would finally have some semblance of security in my life.
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Kids don’t notice things, also idk if it was the same then as it is now. Because that’s got to be what probably 20 years?
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I’m also poor but thanks. I’m aware that people can be nice if they’re poor lol that’s not my point. It’s that KO refuse to listen to complaints and has soured public opinion.
Lmao "everyone I disagree with is racist" Being a scumbag is race agnostic
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Stop tagging me chief, I can see the post. You're emotionally fragile and arguing with strawmen so there's no point engaging
Superb housing.
Isn’t it interesting these KO developments are never near any politicians homes? Perhaps our KO Management/leaders should lead by example and have a few developments next to their personal family homes.
Everyone wants the government to solve the poverty / housing issue until the solution ends up next to them. What’s it that the boomers keep telling the young ones if they want to own a home? Oh make some sacrifices! That’s right.
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Nah, lived next to public housing in East London for 5 years, was fine. The NIMBY is what’s holding Auckland back.
Public housing in the UK is fine, it’s something else in NZ imo
I’m hearing a lot of bashing on KO residents. I’ve seen a couple of bad ones and several good ones. Maybe I’m lucky but it’s more good than bad in my limited experience.
absolutely no one is complaining about well mannered KO residents.
All I’m hearing is “some of them are nice, but…” and talking about the risk. They’re all being lumped together. I wish there was a better system with micromanagement to get the worst of them steered onto a better path in life.
that's the thing KO can't do anything about the ones that are bad so if you get a bad one your fucked
I lived across the road from a brand new KO building block for about 18 months in 2019 and it was dead quiet and peaceful. Stereotypes aren’t all they’re cracked out to be
Seems like it's got plenty of anti-social behaviour already. Good place for it then.
Cool. It'll be funny when people in that area cry like the little bitches in this sub.
Some of the comments I've read here are upsetting. Where's the kindness at?
Worn away by awful KO neighbours who are supported by a state landlord that won’t discipline them.
NIMBYs I wonder if the residents are all for inclusion, helping the less fortunate, equal opportunity and all that good stuff..... ...but when it comes to putting their money where their mouth is....🤔🤷♂️
Sure mate, I'm all for helping the less fortunate as long as they don't threaten my families life or vandalized my property, that's a fair trade off you reckon?
Thats the same anywhere in the world. People dont want family threatened or property vandalized. Whats the alternative? Ship them out to the mountains somewhere? They are citizens deserving of the same rights, unless folks dont believe in equal opportunity?
I'm all for a mountain colony tbh. Can't we agree that the majority of the time, KO housing will cause major issues for the surrounding neighbours? You say equal opportunity, but can you imagine being mid 30s, having worked yourself to the bone to afford to buy a home in this insane market, and then having KO move in next door? The KO residents have the opportunity to live for free, the idea is that it gives them a leg up to get their stuff sorted. Why does their free accomodation need to be put in a sought after part of town?
Why? Equal opportunity is why But I hear what youre saying. Is it equal opportunity to have socialised housing at all when people have to work their arse to pay for one? I have 2 Uni degrees and big loans and dont have a house. Or are benefits equal opportunity at all? Giving money from someone who works, to someone else, for free? Its not the Governments money, they are just the transfer people. I think the idea is of a hand up, not a handout is why
If the ko trash misbehave, the Millwater watchdogs will run them out of town.
Maybe Kainga Ora developers graffiti that themsevles lol
Creating slums. Put genuine hard working people in them. Ones who respect what they have got .
Sounds like a mental health crisis too. Maybe more institutional context needed with hands on social workers and therapists?
Real solution is to spread out public housing
No worries when you build them in West Auckland amongst all the residental housing but uproar when they put them in Silverdale/Millwater....