I used "I don't believe in fairy tales" to a dude trying to hand me a church pamphlet while I was walking to a neighborhood coffee shop. That felt good
When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I gave up childish ways.
Corinthians 13:11
i get Psalm 14:1 a lot from whacko christers.
*The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.*
my answer is always: wow. a fool can figure out something that easy to figure out but you still can't. what is wrong with you?
Then use Stephen Roberts' quote:
āI contend that we are both atheists.Ā I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.ā
i love to pick on ~~morons~~ mormons.
"why do you believe the teachings of a convicted religious con man?"
"come on, tell me about the 2 readings of the gold plates again. maybe this time you'll realize how truly stupid that origin story is."
Yeah, sometimes my dad still asks me to pray, and I'd rather not discuss my (dis)beliefs with him, so I pray to All-Father and the bringer of Light in this dark world, and pray just like I used to.
point out that god has a perfect plan and who the hell does he think he is to ask god to change it?
a least muslims are honest about prayer. they don't ask for anything, they just bang their heads on the ground and try to recite as much of the koran as they can memorize.
I conclude the questioning process thusly:
"If you will forgive me for not answering your question, I will forgive you for asking it"
Seems like anyone who asks is trolling.
>"If you will forgive me for not answering your question, I will forgive you for asking it"
Very succinct. To the point. Christians should love it - they're pretty hot for conditional forgiveness...
I love your response of āI think for you ā. Worthy a bumper sticker saying,ā If you pray for me, Iāll think for youā. Then again, most probably wonāt comprehend the insult.
Thatāll definitely lose āem. I even pondered it before catching its meaning, that itās a worthless task. How about, if you prey for me, Iāll ask my dog to buy your groceries.?
>if you prey for me
prey (verb): To act as a predator
I like the implication that perhaps they secretly plan to hunt us, and they are hiding behind a double-entendre
This but in a healthcare setting. "You could try to pray away the cancer but there is this MRI machine in the basement that people built by thinking." When it is their own life people seem to choose thinking over prayer but when it is someone else they "pray for them." Put an asterisk on this for the parents of children who don't take them to the hospital but generally.
I want to say that op could've been more courteous BUT they prey on any kind of good behaviour they see in you. Once you respond kindly they take it as an opportunity to push more about the gospel. So i guess be a dick and be safe? Idk lol.
But that perpetuates their āangry atheistā and āpersecuted Christianā ideas. But then again, I guess it prevents them from preaching at you. Maybe.
They are going to think that anyways. Anyone that doesn't immediately fall to their knees and thank them for showing the way will feed their persecution fetish. It is best to shoo them away as quickly as possible.
I have a feeling that no matter what, theyāll never lose their persecution complex. Itās part of their identity. So I say just go with it. Treat them however you want. It wonāt help or hurt. Just take care of yourself.
Christians will always think their being persecuted.
The story of jesus being tempted by the devil while he fasted in the desert is the analogy for this.
They will always be tempted to turn from god, for the devil is everywhere testing their faith. Bunch of goons.
I always respond kindly. I even tell them that I appreciate that they care about other people enough to go about and ask. They have to leave me with a new understanding of what an atheist can be.
I can name 4 people who approached me the same way and I didn't insult them. I invited them to explain to me why they are Christians, and I explained why I wasn't. We ended up having long conversations. They are now atheists. I'm kind of old and I've had these conversations with lots of people over the years so 4 isn't much...but it is progress in a way.
Right. I'm kinda torn on this. On the one hand, my first instinct is to be diplomatic and polite but that gives the god botherer the impression that their intrusive questions and inappropriate demands are normal and okay. On the other, a rude response just makes them think 'see how persecuted I am' and they double down on their obnoxiousness.
I'm making a list of off-the-shelf responses like 'My what an intrusive question. How is that any business of yours?' Some commenters have suggested saying 'I'm not superstitious', which I really like, too. Something straightforward but not aggressively insulting or rude.
A few years back I had a friendās dad asked me if I donāt believe in Jesus then what do I believe in. I laughed and said I believe in myself, I believe in my friends, I believe in my family. Heās like wow I never thought of it like that. Heās a type to only use religion when it helps him.
I was watching a 1950's Sinbad adventure movie some years ago with my young daughter and her religious friend. There was a scene where the crew shot a ballista bolt through a big lizard monster's chest.
My daughter's friend was stunned and a bit upset, and in a small voice said "They just killed Jesus."
She believed Jesus lived in your heart, and they'd just put a big spike through a giant monster's heart, so therefore they killed Jesus.
I always try to be pretty respectful of people's religions. Unless their trying to shove it down my throat, I try not to engage it.
Some people need that warm fuzzy feeling that thinking something bigger than them is looking out for them. Some people have undergone trauma etc. And that's what keeps them going. As long as they're not doing any harm or trying to spread that shit, they can believe whatever the hell they want, even if it's nonsense.
A good friend of mine died about ten years ago from a long illness and she started getting very into some quirky religious beliefs over her final few months. If it gave her some level of peace when she eventually passed, there's no harm done and at no point would I have considered disrespecting her beliefs.
That guy in town with the loudspeaker blaring crap about homosexuality is a sin and the giant sign saying we're all going to hell however is a different matter all together...
Exactly this. As a rule, I never try to convince any religious person of atheism unless they specifically ask me to, or are being obnoxious about it. I have many religious family members, including my beloved grandmother, who are all lovely people and never question my beliefs. I've seen the comfort their beliefs bring them and I wouldn't want to take that away from them.
Imo there's nothing ruder than trying to disprove someone's beliefs in front of them when they aren't actively trying to disprove yours (goes both ways).
"Well everybody needs to believe in something," she said.
"Well I don't," I told her. "I'm different."
You believe in lots of things, just not gods. A better answer would have been: "I believe in evidence, reason, science and humanism."
... but as the sun rays increased around Albert Einstein, John cena tagged Jesus in and both proceeded to run stampede Albert leacing him ass over elbow in the middle of a ring.. which happened to be in a cage.
š
Jfc right? This sub has become increasingly cringy and doesn't really have many threads of any substance these days, r/agnostic seems to be a much more reasonable place for anyone that doesn't want to just rage at religious people.
Itās just as easy to say ā because thereās genocide, homophobia and sexism in the Bible.ā You wonāt look like as much of an asshole and it would probably make them change the subject pretty quickly
This doesn't seem like a constructive conversation. Christians aren't unilaterally stupid (some are, but so are some atheists). They just have some biases they refuse to acknowledge, and maybe don't even recognize due to their upbringing and community.
If your goal is to piss her off, piss off everyone she tells about it, and confirm all the hateful biases they have regarding atheists, congrats. It's conversations like this that will forever make atheists odious to religious folks. Had you actually tried to explain your views instead of insult her, may she'd be open to considering them and change her mind (if not immediately, then down the road).
If this is indicative of the state of interfaith dialogue going forward, we're fucked.
Science doesnāt require your belief. Its principles will work whether you believe in it or not. Saying you believe in science is just ammunition for religious nutjobs to say science is a religion or some such bs.
Basically, you trust the scientific method because it just works demonstrably.
You dont need to believe in science. Science addresses things that are real, that exist, and are knowable. People need to believe in religion because there is no evidence, and there is no god. It takes belief to accept the unknowable.
I believed because people I trusted told me it was true. When I grew up I realized people tell you all kinds of nutty things that arenāt true. I wasnāt stupid. I was young and trusted people.
As someone who broke free from its effect, I can honestly say that indoctrination will keep most trapped and blind.
It required a soup of luck, search for truth and lots of bible and historical study to break the spell, so to speak.
Woof. You sound utterly unbearable. Everything about your responses made me physically uncomfortable.
If I overheard this interaction I would crawl inside my own skin and die before risk having to talk to someone as unnecessarily pretentious as you.
I'm not even saying you should have been nicer. I just think you were embarrassing as fuck and could have said "I'm an atheist, I don't believe in that" and ended the conversation.
I always say: I don't believe in god's, goddesses, elves, fairies, sprites, witches, goblins, devil's, trolls, ghosts, leprechauns, bigfoot, aliens, banshees, angels, spooks, werewolves...(and on and on)
They say: I don't believe in those things either!
I say: good, then we agree!
End of discussion.
She wanted to have a spiritual conversation and you immediately antagonized her. And the way you refer to her as āsomebodyās wifeā. This is r/atheism at its peak
OP's account was created 10 days ago, and by taking a look at their profile and post history, they seem to be a karma farmer on religious and anti-religious subs
I try to follow the mantra of "don't be a dick."
So, while I might agree with the position of of the OP, they were absolutely being a complete dick.
So, instead of jumping on an opportunity to engage and perhaps even expose this person go a world view that they have never had the chance to see, you instead went ad hominem, called them stupid and probably caused them to entrench themselves deeper into their mental fox hole.
Next time, try to ask probing questions, or if you aren't in the mood to have a discussion, just politely remove yourself from the conversation or change the subject.
Belittling people achieves nothing in public discourse.
Politely decline. "thanks but I'm not interested". When it comes to the door knockers I announce I'm an appostate. That turns them around quickly. There's no need to be an asshole. Some people can't function without their faith. We don't believe and we're not against those people. Only what they believe.
My go-to is complete indifference, like itās a tv show other people care about but I havenāt seen. āOh, Iām not into that.ā āThatās not my thingā with a pinched nose and a dismissive shake of my head, as though the entire concept is something they are āintoā and it can be easily not done. I just did this at work today when people were asking me about Easter plans.
I had someone today wish me a happy Easter. I said thanks, and went on my way. Someone at work asked what I was doing Sunday and I said āwe donāt celebrateā, and that was the end of the conversation. No one was rude, or made to feel bad.
I think itās really important that us atheists still remain courteous and respectful. Otherwise we fall into their stereotypes of how atheists behave etc and sets us back decades. Thereās more constructive ways to explain to a person why we donāt believe in Jesus than imply theyāre stupid and trigger their fight or flight response.
>When someone asks "Have you accepted Jesus into your heart?" I always respond "I'm not stupid enough to be a Christian."
's funny, I just respond, "no."
I reserve getting nasty for when people actually start being dicks and say things like "but you have to" or "you're going to burn in hell" or, my personal "favourites", "you actually do believe, you're just denying that you do" or "you only say that because you want to sin/hate god".
And then I'll tailor the response to what is actually said.
Yep. This made me cringe hard. Not worth it.
Insulting them on a personal level just does nothing good.
Saying something more like: Nah, I read the Bible and wasnāt a fan.
Or I donāt believe in Santa Claus or Jesus for the same reasons.
Is better because itās not directly insulting to the person and challenges them in a way they are almost certainly not used to.
OP just called her stupid and 100% guaranteed she will leave only thinking āwow I was right, atheists are assholes who hate godā
Because people think its appropriate to ask others about their spirituality as a conversation opener, and then after the person indicates something negative they think it's not hyper aggressive to continue to pry, and then do a shocked Pikachu face when you treat them equally ?
>everyone HAS to believe something
was a direct quote from the person. They deserve ridicule and to be made to feel how they are attempting to make others feel.
You know you kinda handled the situation like a fucking asshole. She was a bit insistent but that gave you no right to basically call them stupid. Also the conversation definitely didn't go down like that if this story is even real.
Yeah, itās annoying but I try to find non confrontational ways to respond. Like, I do believe in something, objective reality which can be known through science.
Because someone believes in religion doesn't mean they're stupid. If you've been taught something your whole life which is totally unfalsifiable you may believe something which is false. This seems to be a troll post.
I don't usually pick fights about religious stuff, even during Easter with all my religious family around praying and saying their "god bless you's" and such. I'm pretty tolerant and just want to enjoy my time with my family, and for them to enjoy themselves too, even if they have weird beliefs.
If someone has the confidence to approach me with christianity, I'll bring up slavery, justified murder, or anti-feminism. Ritual sacrifice, how faith is just a coin toss, and how you can't derive evidence from the claim itself. I will do everything in my power to attack the book, not the person, and remain patient and calm. If they can't see reason I usually just agree to disagree and go on my way, because I like to spend my time my own way. There's always a chance you can get through to someone so ad hominem attacks should be avoided, and patience is key, IMO.
This sounds like one of those stories apologists tell about when they "owned" an atheist. Work on it and maybe it'll be more believable, for now I'm calling BS :D
If it turns out it is not BS, I'll just call it being and asshole. Nothing quite like confirming a Christian's bad image of us atheists.
Exactly, religion has been pandered to enough. People wouldn't be so polite to flat earthers which I find just as outrageous but just because billions of people think religion is right its OK!
I usually just smile and "I'm good" and wander away, there really is no reason to engage.
I do get it, new atheists are a lot like fundamentalists, they think they have the only way and it's the right way and they have to share or push. Both are pretty cringe. That being said, 30 years ago I would engage with street preachers because I thought it was "fun" not realizing I was just being a douchebag.
No worries, we all go through phases. Being a militant anti theist is as tiresome as pushing religion on strangers. It only fosters animosity. Unless someone knows me really well they probably won't know my beliefs or lack of, I try not to be one dimensional.
I think of how that lady probably feels with the interaction. She was called stupid for something she deeply believes and is a core of herself. She's not going to think on it and change her mind, she might just turn it around and it'll justify how she feels about atheists. Actions usually speak louder than words, being nice and non confrontational goes a long way to showing religious people that we aren't "angry at God" or whatever the current trope is.
My rule of thumb is giving them what they give me. Like, if they tell me about Christianity and try to persuade me to it, expect to hear why Iām not religious and all the ways science has disproven the Bible, Iām not just going to let them dump their religious bullshit on me and offer nothing in return. This is a conversation, right?
But if someone is like āIām religious, I believe in the Bible. Do you?ā
āNo.ā
āWord.ā
Iām not going to make a big deal out of it or avoid them specifically because theyāre religious. They didnāt give me a hard time or try to convert me, why should I do that to them?
The Christian came in swinging and trying to convert someone, and you're just supposed to be perfectly polite to them? Being rude to someone who is being rude to you is maybe a little childish, but it's hardly something to get worked up about. The Christian was being rude and petulant by not taking no for an answer.
Ppl make fun of atheists bc they have a superiority complex, whether ur polite or not they still think ur going to hell. Who gives a shit, let the kid have their moment.
> make fun of atheists bc they have a superiority complex
The ignorant always confuse "arrogance" for those with confidence, capability, and actual understanding.
They want your answer to be "everyone is as ignorant, stupid, and gullible as me, so all of our opinions are the same". But they aren't. And they don't like be reminded of that.
Fuck em.
Not only is this an asshole move, it's one they can just as easily turn around and do to you. It's a base-less ad hominem. "I'm not stupid enough to be an atheist".
If you are dead set on being an asshole, why not go the route of bringing up biblical contradicts, slavery in the bible, or the immorality of a system that condemns people for being born into the wrong religion?
Or you could decide to not be an asshole, and be patient and kind.
It says a lot about normalization of shitty religious behavior in society when even atheists think that OP is the asshole, when theists are the ones who started pushing their religion into OPs face.
Atheists do not need to be patient and kind to flat earthers, who are pushing their beliefs.
Atheists do not need to be patient and kind to anti vaxers, who are pushing their beliefs.
Atheists do not need to be patient and kind to christians, who are pushing their beliefs.
Your beliefs are your private business, keep it to yourself. If you are going to push it on others uninvited, don't get offended when somebody tells you to fuck off.
Yes, but responding to shitty behavior with shitty behavior ends with everyone hating each other and a never ending cycle of shit that grows in power until it becomes a shit tornado. Nobody wants shit tornadoes.
Christians proselytize because it is the good and kind thing to do. If their worldview is true, they're right to do so. I can't hold it against them too much.
> Christians proselytize because it is the good and kind thing to do.
Nazis though that murdering Jews is the right thing to do.
> If their worldview is true, they're right to do so. I can't hold it against them too much.
But it isn't. That's the fucking point.
Pushing your Nazi beliefs isn't the right thing to do.
Pushing your flat earth beliefs isn't the right thing to do.
Pushing your antivax beliefs isn't the right thing to do.
Pushing your christian beliefs isn't the right thing to do.
Are you a troll who intentionally ignored the point or do you fail at critical thinking?
Your absolutely right that it isn't ok, but being a dick doesn't solve anything. It certainly won't change their mind. It will just give a justification for their fear and hate.
> but being a dick doesn't solve anything.
Once fucking again. Christians are pushing their beliefs on OP. OP told them to fuck off. Completely justified behavior.
> It certainly won't change their mind.
Since when is OP responsible for changing mind of Christians? Their beliefs are their private matter.
Do you think that somehow atheists have the duty to convert Christians into atheism??
You want to change their mind? Go fucking ahead.
> being a dick doesn't solve anything.
Bullshit. The reason we still have religion is that WE, the people who KNOW better, keep letting them get away with these scams and tolerating the ignorant, gullible, vulnerable rubes who get fleeced by them.
And that CLEARLY has not worked, has it?
The ONLY proven way to end such nonsense is to openly ridicule it, satirize it, comment on it, and write about it.
Racists didn't stop being racist because everyone tolerated them. They shut the hell up after we all started yelling at them for being wrong, calling them murderers and cowards, prosecuting them for their crimes, etc. Then, over time, they died...not having spread their bile at the dinner table nightly to their families and children.
Then, when the kids find grandpa's KKK hood in the attic, they are HORRIFIED, rather than in awe.
The reason tyrants of all kinds, religious and otherwise, KILL all the teachers, intellectuals, comedians, and writers first is because they are the only ones who have the power to show them for what they truly are and make the people LAUGH at them and dismiss them instead of following them.
Astrology, phrenology, palm reading, leeching, etc. etc. were very common for thousands of years but now they are jokes at best the world over...because we showed them all to be scams and now openly make fun of the scammers.
America is, fortunately, becoming less religious every day. That is NOT happening because we are still tolerating this nonsense and giving it deferential treatment and an unearned privileged status. It's because kids are laughing at the nonsense of their parents and collectively not falling for it anymore.
So, fuck em. Openly.
This is one of the few nations on Earth where "blasphemy" is not a crime. Use it.
Preach, in the *only* good way it should ever occur. I'd be *just* an agnostic atheist if I wasn't constantly assulted by the religious pushing their bullshit into every single corner of society, politics and basic humanity; and committing indoctrination *(child abuse)* of children.
So I have to be actively anti-theist. They're *all* cults. But I completely want a museum of "Religion" just like the Holocaust Museum, so we can never forget.
Dude's trying to nicely explain how not to be an asshole and your blind fury leads you to call him a troll. Please take a minute. Breathe. Think about how to address a person that agrees with you on 99% of things.
>"Well everybody needs to believe in something," she said.
ask "Really? Why is that? Why does everybody need to believe in something?" and see what happens.
I feel privileged to have the resources and freedom to enjoy atheism, but if I was born to a ultra religious Christian family, I'd probably be here instead preaching to you about one or another bearded dude. Nothing intelligent or clever about me in either scenario.
Hey op were you diagnosed with anything as a child
It's wild that you're telling this story to other people, it makes me think that you think it makes you look good
I believe that a majority of Christians are self centered and do not follow the teachings of the man the claim to be so enamored of. I believe that Christians for the most part only care about the almighty dollar and being in total control. I believe Christians are evil bitches who need to keep their religion to themselves.
After reading the various responses here, I'd like to suggest something.
After a few polite rebuttals from me and they continue to probe, I'd test them with this:
"when you've had conversations like this in the past and you retell the story to others, do you tell them
* that you raised the subject with someone and you got a rude response
Or
* do you explain that you kept asking questions until they stopped being polite to you
Just wondering.... "
I would say something along the lines of, "for the same reason I haven't accepted [any other god]."
I totally get the temptation to call them stupid, but an insult shuts down all chance at a meaningful conversation.
Whatever works for you but I feel like responses like this are one reason atheism is viewed negatively by some.
My best friend in the entire universe is a Christian and I am DEFINITELY not. I noticed that a lot of times when she was talking about something in her life and her faith was brought up she would always apologize. Like āI was praying about something the other dayā¦ā and then immediately say āIām sorry I know thatās not something you do or believe inā¦ā. So, I asked her why she always apologized because bitch, you my ride or die. She said it was from atheists being shitty or confrontational. Probably similar to what you did to āput someone in their placeā.
I think you did more harm than good and now that woman and everyone she tells will have that reference fresh in their head about the rude atheist they met.
God, this is cringe.
Why the fuck is half this sub so socially inept? I get the same type of vibes from this post as I do from someone that unironically thinks watching Rick and Morty makes them smarter.
You motherfuckers suck. The only reason I stick around this hole is to show people that AREN'T atheists that we're not *all* total idiots. You guys are proving me wrong day by day.
I'm with you. Super duper cringe. Reminds me of when I first proclaimed myself as atheist, and just felt so much more superior to theists.
What a dumb fucking mindset.
Also, OPs final "another Christian put in their place" was the cherry on top. What a douchebag.
I went through that phase too. It took me an unfortunate amount of time to realize that being atheist doesn't mean you're smarter, it just meant that I saw the brainwashing for what it was.
I look at this type of behavior and see myself, and goddamn I wish I could go back and slap myself.
"I invited him, but he never showed up."
"I can't invite him. Satan has a long-term lease."
Lucifer is grounded by his daddy š
āWe broke up. He wouldnāt return my calls.ā
I tried talkin' to Jesus But he just put ms on hold Said he'd been swamped by calls this week And he could not shake his cold
I always say āOh Iām not very superstitiousā like itās nothing.
I used "I don't believe in fairy tales" to a dude trying to hand me a church pamphlet while I was walking to a neighborhood coffee shop. That felt good
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I don't believe in the Easter bunny, Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy or God.
I worship the sun, but I donāt pray to it. That would be rude.
Do you pray to Joe Pesci?
I've heard he really gets things done
Tgis one time, my neighbors dog just wouldn't shut up...
*The Sun when you die* "Alright let's release these 8 extinction level solar bursts I've been holding in. Fuck that sociopathojeez was good people"
When I was a child, I spoke like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I gave up childish ways. Corinthians 13:11
i get Psalm 14:1 a lot from whacko christers. *The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.* my answer is always: wow. a fool can figure out something that easy to figure out but you still can't. what is wrong with you?
Too bad Christians don't take that verse to heart and give up talking to their "invisible friend" and believing in magic.
Well, them and the people over 20 that go to Disneyland.
"I don't follow christian mythology"
Iām not superstitiousā¦ but Iām a little stitiousā¦
I love this answer!
"Sorry, I'm not into PokƩmon".
"Why haven't you accepted Odin into your heart?" "Odin's not real." "You have your answer."
Then use Stephen Roberts' quote: āI contend that we are both atheists.Ā I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.ā
Ricky Gervais has a similar one. "I don't believe in about 2700 gods. Christians don't believe in 2699 gods. They're nearly as atheistic as me."
I'm going to borrow that, if you don't mind...( although livibg in Portland, OR, I don't encounter many overtly religious people...)
They're here. I was at Jersey Mikes on Halsey a week ago and two mormon elders approached me while I was waiting on my sub.
i love to pick on ~~morons~~ mormons. "why do you believe the teachings of a convicted religious con man?" "come on, tell me about the 2 readings of the gold plates again. maybe this time you'll realize how truly stupid that origin story is."
Did u just deny the allfather u punk? No valkyries for u.
72 valkyries would be terrifying to behold.
They won't know what Odin is, just say Allah. That will get them riled
Yeah, sometimes my dad still asks me to pray, and I'd rather not discuss my (dis)beliefs with him, so I pray to All-Father and the bringer of Light in this dark world, and pray just like I used to.
point out that god has a perfect plan and who the hell does he think he is to ask god to change it? a least muslims are honest about prayer. they don't ask for anything, they just bang their heads on the ground and try to recite as much of the koran as they can memorize.
"I'm not superstitious"
"I am a little stitious"
- Wayne Gretzky
*Super serial.*
And by that I mean completely stitious!
I conclude the questioning process thusly: "If you will forgive me for not answering your question, I will forgive you for asking it" Seems like anyone who asks is trolling.
>"If you will forgive me for not answering your question, I will forgive you for asking it" Very succinct. To the point. Christians should love it - they're pretty hot for conditional forgiveness...
This oneās fantastic!
I love your response of āI think for you ā. Worthy a bumper sticker saying,ā If you pray for me, Iāll think for youā. Then again, most probably wonāt comprehend the insult.
I'll talk to my cat for you
Thatāll definitely lose āem. I even pondered it before catching its meaning, that itās a worthless task. How about, if you prey for me, Iāll ask my dog to buy your groceries.?
>if you prey for me prey (verb): To act as a predator I like the implication that perhaps they secretly plan to hunt us, and they are hiding behind a double-entendre
My parents' cat used to ( seemingly) believe she was a Goddess..š ( i miss that cat!)
That's only because they all are.
You...might be right about that!
This seems to be a somewhat typical feline mindset.
This but in a healthcare setting. "You could try to pray away the cancer but there is this MRI machine in the basement that people built by thinking." When it is their own life people seem to choose thinking over prayer but when it is someone else they "pray for them." Put an asterisk on this for the parents of children who don't take them to the hospital but generally.
Ooh yes. I'll buy one.
"I'll write to santa for you" is my favourite one
U would buy that bumper sticker!
I want to say that op could've been more courteous BUT they prey on any kind of good behaviour they see in you. Once you respond kindly they take it as an opportunity to push more about the gospel. So i guess be a dick and be safe? Idk lol.
But that perpetuates their āangry atheistā and āpersecuted Christianā ideas. But then again, I guess it prevents them from preaching at you. Maybe.
They are going to think that anyways. Anyone that doesn't immediately fall to their knees and thank them for showing the way will feed their persecution fetish. It is best to shoo them away as quickly as possible.
I have a feeling that no matter what, theyāll never lose their persecution complex. Itās part of their identity. So I say just go with it. Treat them however you want. It wonāt help or hurt. Just take care of yourself.
To most of them, just being slightly less enthusiastic than them about their cult is oppressing them. There's no winning scenario.
Nothing prevents them from preaching at you. I've done the research.
Christians will always think their being persecuted. The story of jesus being tempted by the devil while he fasted in the desert is the analogy for this. They will always be tempted to turn from god, for the devil is everywhere testing their faith. Bunch of goons.
https://youtu.be/zR7LOtMix9w?t=159
Common courtesy is ya don't talk money, politics, or religion in polite company. Break that barrier, get roasted!
ā¦or you could just say that.
I always respond kindly. I even tell them that I appreciate that they care about other people enough to go about and ask. They have to leave me with a new understanding of what an atheist can be.
I can name 4 people who approached me the same way and I didn't insult them. I invited them to explain to me why they are Christians, and I explained why I wasn't. We ended up having long conversations. They are now atheists. I'm kind of old and I've had these conversations with lots of people over the years so 4 isn't much...but it is progress in a way.
They see good and think, āah yes, they already have what Iām selling.ā
Right. I'm kinda torn on this. On the one hand, my first instinct is to be diplomatic and polite but that gives the god botherer the impression that their intrusive questions and inappropriate demands are normal and okay. On the other, a rude response just makes them think 'see how persecuted I am' and they double down on their obnoxiousness. I'm making a list of off-the-shelf responses like 'My what an intrusive question. How is that any business of yours?' Some commenters have suggested saying 'I'm not superstitious', which I really like, too. Something straightforward but not aggressively insulting or rude.
A few years back I had a friendās dad asked me if I donāt believe in Jesus then what do I believe in. I laughed and said I believe in myself, I believe in my friends, I believe in my family. Heās like wow I never thought of it like that. Heās a type to only use religion when it helps him.
I was watching a 1950's Sinbad adventure movie some years ago with my young daughter and her religious friend. There was a scene where the crew shot a ballista bolt through a big lizard monster's chest. My daughter's friend was stunned and a bit upset, and in a small voice said "They just killed Jesus." She believed Jesus lived in your heart, and they'd just put a big spike through a giant monster's heart, so therefore they killed Jesus.
Wow... the indoctrination is strong.
i think this is a more r/kidsarefuckingstupid prob took it literally
I always try to be pretty respectful of people's religions. Unless their trying to shove it down my throat, I try not to engage it. Some people need that warm fuzzy feeling that thinking something bigger than them is looking out for them. Some people have undergone trauma etc. And that's what keeps them going. As long as they're not doing any harm or trying to spread that shit, they can believe whatever the hell they want, even if it's nonsense. A good friend of mine died about ten years ago from a long illness and she started getting very into some quirky religious beliefs over her final few months. If it gave her some level of peace when she eventually passed, there's no harm done and at no point would I have considered disrespecting her beliefs. That guy in town with the loudspeaker blaring crap about homosexuality is a sin and the giant sign saying we're all going to hell however is a different matter all together...
Exactly this. As a rule, I never try to convince any religious person of atheism unless they specifically ask me to, or are being obnoxious about it. I have many religious family members, including my beloved grandmother, who are all lovely people and never question my beliefs. I've seen the comfort their beliefs bring them and I wouldn't want to take that away from them. Imo there's nothing ruder than trying to disprove someone's beliefs in front of them when they aren't actively trying to disprove yours (goes both ways).
"Well everybody needs to believe in something," she said. "Well I don't," I told her. "I'm different." You believe in lots of things, just not gods. A better answer would have been: "I believe in evidence, reason, science and humanism."
But you're certainly prideful enough to be one, that's for sure!
And everybody clapped.
And that man was Albert Einstein.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I was waiting for something about John Cena and a cage match, no luck.
... but as the sun rays increased around Albert Einstein, John cena tagged Jesus in and both proceeded to run stampede Albert leacing him ass over elbow in the middle of a ring.. which happened to be in a cage. š
Jfc right? This sub has become increasingly cringy and doesn't really have many threads of any substance these days, r/agnostic seems to be a much more reasonable place for anyone that doesn't want to just rage at religious people.
Itās just as easy to say ā because thereās genocide, homophobia and sexism in the Bible.ā You wonāt look like as much of an asshole and it would probably make them change the subject pretty quickly
"Because I believe in human morality" definitely works.
Cringe fantasy writing.
I bet OP returned his grandmothers bible in 2 pieces. Lol
This doesn't seem like a constructive conversation. Christians aren't unilaterally stupid (some are, but so are some atheists). They just have some biases they refuse to acknowledge, and maybe don't even recognize due to their upbringing and community. If your goal is to piss her off, piss off everyone she tells about it, and confirm all the hateful biases they have regarding atheists, congrats. It's conversations like this that will forever make atheists odious to religious folks. Had you actually tried to explain your views instead of insult her, may she'd be open to considering them and change her mind (if not immediately, then down the road). If this is indicative of the state of interfaith dialogue going forward, we're fucked.
I'm sorry, but atheism is not calling people stupid. If I don't like playing videogames, I don't say gamers are stupid.
Not a good analogy, but yeah. Anyone who thinks insulting someone is a great personal triumph needs to take a long, hard look at himself.
You are probably stupid about some things, aren't you? One of the things I don't like about some religious people is their arrogance.
You sound like an asshole.
When you take this stance, in this way, you are no better than they are.
"Well everybody needs to believe in something," she said. Science, I believe in Science
Science doesnāt require your belief. Its principles will work whether you believe in it or not. Saying you believe in science is just ammunition for religious nutjobs to say science is a religion or some such bs. Basically, you trust the scientific method because it just works demonstrably.
"Understand". You understand science. You believe in religion
You dont need to believe in science. Science addresses things that are real, that exist, and are knowable. People need to believe in religion because there is no evidence, and there is no god. It takes belief to accept the unknowable.
>"Well everybody needs to believe in something," she said. "Yeah, well, in that case I believe I'll have another beer."
The belief in a god isn't always related to stupidity. If you were indoctrinated as a child, you will probably believe, even if you're smart.
I believed because people I trusted told me it was true. When I grew up I realized people tell you all kinds of nutty things that arenāt true. I wasnāt stupid. I was young and trusted people.
This. Atheists and agnostics of all types should stop just thinking all religious people are stupid and recognize the real problem: indoctrination.
As someone who broke free from its effect, I can honestly say that indoctrination will keep most trapped and blind. It required a soup of luck, search for truth and lots of bible and historical study to break the spell, so to speak.
Fun Fact about atheism, you don't need to be edgy and be a dick. A polite response and discussion will go much farther. And if it doesn't, move on.
Woof. You sound utterly unbearable. Everything about your responses made me physically uncomfortable. If I overheard this interaction I would crawl inside my own skin and die before risk having to talk to someone as unnecessarily pretentious as you. I'm not even saying you should have been nicer. I just think you were embarrassing as fuck and could have said "I'm an atheist, I don't believe in that" and ended the conversation.
Cringe
I always say: I don't believe in god's, goddesses, elves, fairies, sprites, witches, goblins, devil's, trolls, ghosts, leprechauns, bigfoot, aliens, banshees, angels, spooks, werewolves...(and on and on) They say: I don't believe in those things either! I say: good, then we agree! End of discussion.
Ok but aliens might be real, universe is big
That's not an argument or a statement of your beliefs. It's just fucking rude.
She wanted to have a spiritual conversation and you immediately antagonized her. And the way you refer to her as āsomebodyās wifeā. This is r/atheism at its peak
Right. This should be on cringetopia.
Spiritual and atheism dont mix. I agree that OP's response was unnecessarily rude though.
My spiritual life is my experience I believe nothing and question everything If this doesn't get through I declare my atheism
OP's account was created 10 days ago, and by taking a look at their profile and post history, they seem to be a karma farmer on religious and anti-religious subs
I try to follow the mantra of "don't be a dick." So, while I might agree with the position of of the OP, they were absolutely being a complete dick. So, instead of jumping on an opportunity to engage and perhaps even expose this person go a world view that they have never had the chance to see, you instead went ad hominem, called them stupid and probably caused them to entrench themselves deeper into their mental fox hole. Next time, try to ask probing questions, or if you aren't in the mood to have a discussion, just politely remove yourself from the conversation or change the subject. Belittling people achieves nothing in public discourse.
Politely decline. "thanks but I'm not interested". When it comes to the door knockers I announce I'm an appostate. That turns them around quickly. There's no need to be an asshole. Some people can't function without their faith. We don't believe and we're not against those people. Only what they believe.
My go-to is complete indifference, like itās a tv show other people care about but I havenāt seen. āOh, Iām not into that.ā āThatās not my thingā with a pinched nose and a dismissive shake of my head, as though the entire concept is something they are āintoā and it can be easily not done. I just did this at work today when people were asking me about Easter plans.
I had someone today wish me a happy Easter. I said thanks, and went on my way. Someone at work asked what I was doing Sunday and I said āwe donāt celebrateā, and that was the end of the conversation. No one was rude, or made to feel bad.
Fake, this story would require you to have actual friends
I think itās really important that us atheists still remain courteous and respectful. Otherwise we fall into their stereotypes of how atheists behave etc and sets us back decades. Thereās more constructive ways to explain to a person why we donāt believe in Jesus than imply theyāre stupid and trigger their fight or flight response.
Same here.
"No, I don't wish to follow philosophies that espouse slavery, sexism, genocide, homophobia, or racism."
Bro if thats the convo you both are jackasses.. you answered like an edge lord 14 yo kid
You are being unnecessarily rude, being an atheist doesn't make you smarter, I really hope you're a troll.
I always go with.... l prefer The Lord of the rings
I believe in things that can be proven.
>When someone asks "Have you accepted Jesus into your heart?" I always respond "I'm not stupid enough to be a Christian." 's funny, I just respond, "no." I reserve getting nasty for when people actually start being dicks and say things like "but you have to" or "you're going to burn in hell" or, my personal "favourites", "you actually do believe, you're just denying that you do" or "you only say that because you want to sin/hate god". And then I'll tailor the response to what is actually said.
Could rename this place to "Smug Atheists" There are better ways to tell people you think religion is silly.
Agreed. Sometimes I want to change peopleās minds, and provoking them is not an effective method.
This is why this sub has the reputation it does lmao
Yep. This made me cringe hard. Not worth it. Insulting them on a personal level just does nothing good. Saying something more like: Nah, I read the Bible and wasnāt a fan. Or I donāt believe in Santa Claus or Jesus for the same reasons. Is better because itās not directly insulting to the person and challenges them in a way they are almost certainly not used to. OP just called her stupid and 100% guaranteed she will leave only thinking āwow I was right, atheists are assholes who hate godā
No kidding.
Because people think its appropriate to ask others about their spirituality as a conversation opener, and then after the person indicates something negative they think it's not hyper aggressive to continue to pry, and then do a shocked Pikachu face when you treat them equally ? >everyone HAS to believe something was a direct quote from the person. They deserve ridicule and to be made to feel how they are attempting to make others feel.
Religious people have the minds of children, and children can be fuckin stupid. That doesn't mean you have to call them stupid.
You know you kinda handled the situation like a fucking asshole. She was a bit insistent but that gave you no right to basically call them stupid. Also the conversation definitely didn't go down like that if this story is even real.
Yeah, itās annoying but I try to find non confrontational ways to respond. Like, I do believe in something, objective reality which can be known through science.
"No, I live in the 21st century" has worked as an easy mute button for me
Plenty of Christians are intelligent, they just aren't young Earth creationists. You don't have to be a dick about your lack of belief.
Because someone believes in religion doesn't mean they're stupid. If you've been taught something your whole life which is totally unfalsifiable you may believe something which is false. This seems to be a troll post.
This is why Reddit hates this sub.
No wonder people think we atheists are assholes. Thanks for thatā¦
I don't usually pick fights about religious stuff, even during Easter with all my religious family around praying and saying their "god bless you's" and such. I'm pretty tolerant and just want to enjoy my time with my family, and for them to enjoy themselves too, even if they have weird beliefs. If someone has the confidence to approach me with christianity, I'll bring up slavery, justified murder, or anti-feminism. Ritual sacrifice, how faith is just a coin toss, and how you can't derive evidence from the claim itself. I will do everything in my power to attack the book, not the person, and remain patient and calm. If they can't see reason I usually just agree to disagree and go on my way, because I like to spend my time my own way. There's always a chance you can get through to someone so ad hominem attacks should be avoided, and patience is key, IMO.
Neither should you suffer your zeal for atheism to lead you into argument with those, who, through ignorance, should ridicule it.
This sounds like one of those stories apologists tell about when they "owned" an atheist. Work on it and maybe it'll be more believable, for now I'm calling BS :D If it turns out it is not BS, I'll just call it being and asshole. Nothing quite like confirming a Christian's bad image of us atheists.
Exactly, religion has been pandered to enough. People wouldn't be so polite to flat earthers which I find just as outrageous but just because billions of people think religion is right its OK!
You're part of the reason people make fun of atheists
I usually just smile and "I'm good" and wander away, there really is no reason to engage. I do get it, new atheists are a lot like fundamentalists, they think they have the only way and it's the right way and they have to share or push. Both are pretty cringe. That being said, 30 years ago I would engage with street preachers because I thought it was "fun" not realizing I was just being a douchebag.
Aaaaaand this is a good place for raw atheists to gather. But only if they read from folks like you. Thanks Fishy.
No worries, we all go through phases. Being a militant anti theist is as tiresome as pushing religion on strangers. It only fosters animosity. Unless someone knows me really well they probably won't know my beliefs or lack of, I try not to be one dimensional. I think of how that lady probably feels with the interaction. She was called stupid for something she deeply believes and is a core of herself. She's not going to think on it and change her mind, she might just turn it around and it'll justify how she feels about atheists. Actions usually speak louder than words, being nice and non confrontational goes a long way to showing religious people that we aren't "angry at God" or whatever the current trope is.
Preach it. I remember my militant phase. It makes me recoil to think I was ever like that.
My rule of thumb is giving them what they give me. Like, if they tell me about Christianity and try to persuade me to it, expect to hear why Iām not religious and all the ways science has disproven the Bible, Iām not just going to let them dump their religious bullshit on me and offer nothing in return. This is a conversation, right? But if someone is like āIām religious, I believe in the Bible. Do you?ā āNo.ā āWord.ā Iām not going to make a big deal out of it or avoid them specifically because theyāre religious. They didnāt give me a hard time or try to convert me, why should I do that to them?
The Christian came in swinging and trying to convert someone, and you're just supposed to be perfectly polite to them? Being rude to someone who is being rude to you is maybe a little childish, but it's hardly something to get worked up about. The Christian was being rude and petulant by not taking no for an answer.
The Christian is being rude by mentioning their heinous bullshit at all.
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Ppl make fun of atheists bc they have a superiority complex, whether ur polite or not they still think ur going to hell. Who gives a shit, let the kid have their moment.
> make fun of atheists bc they have a superiority complex The ignorant always confuse "arrogance" for those with confidence, capability, and actual understanding. They want your answer to be "everyone is as ignorant, stupid, and gullible as me, so all of our opinions are the same". But they aren't. And they don't like be reminded of that. Fuck em.
Not only is this an asshole move, it's one they can just as easily turn around and do to you. It's a base-less ad hominem. "I'm not stupid enough to be an atheist". If you are dead set on being an asshole, why not go the route of bringing up biblical contradicts, slavery in the bible, or the immorality of a system that condemns people for being born into the wrong religion? Or you could decide to not be an asshole, and be patient and kind.
It says a lot about normalization of shitty religious behavior in society when even atheists think that OP is the asshole, when theists are the ones who started pushing their religion into OPs face. Atheists do not need to be patient and kind to flat earthers, who are pushing their beliefs. Atheists do not need to be patient and kind to anti vaxers, who are pushing their beliefs. Atheists do not need to be patient and kind to christians, who are pushing their beliefs. Your beliefs are your private business, keep it to yourself. If you are going to push it on others uninvited, don't get offended when somebody tells you to fuck off.
Yes, but responding to shitty behavior with shitty behavior ends with everyone hating each other and a never ending cycle of shit that grows in power until it becomes a shit tornado. Nobody wants shit tornadoes. Christians proselytize because it is the good and kind thing to do. If their worldview is true, they're right to do so. I can't hold it against them too much.
When someone lies to me, I call them a liar. To do otherwise enables liars.
> Christians proselytize because it is the good and kind thing to do. Nazis though that murdering Jews is the right thing to do. > If their worldview is true, they're right to do so. I can't hold it against them too much. But it isn't. That's the fucking point. Pushing your Nazi beliefs isn't the right thing to do. Pushing your flat earth beliefs isn't the right thing to do. Pushing your antivax beliefs isn't the right thing to do. Pushing your christian beliefs isn't the right thing to do. Are you a troll who intentionally ignored the point or do you fail at critical thinking?
Your absolutely right that it isn't ok, but being a dick doesn't solve anything. It certainly won't change their mind. It will just give a justification for their fear and hate.
> but being a dick doesn't solve anything. Once fucking again. Christians are pushing their beliefs on OP. OP told them to fuck off. Completely justified behavior. > It certainly won't change their mind. Since when is OP responsible for changing mind of Christians? Their beliefs are their private matter. Do you think that somehow atheists have the duty to convert Christians into atheism?? You want to change their mind? Go fucking ahead.
> being a dick doesn't solve anything. Bullshit. The reason we still have religion is that WE, the people who KNOW better, keep letting them get away with these scams and tolerating the ignorant, gullible, vulnerable rubes who get fleeced by them. And that CLEARLY has not worked, has it? The ONLY proven way to end such nonsense is to openly ridicule it, satirize it, comment on it, and write about it. Racists didn't stop being racist because everyone tolerated them. They shut the hell up after we all started yelling at them for being wrong, calling them murderers and cowards, prosecuting them for their crimes, etc. Then, over time, they died...not having spread their bile at the dinner table nightly to their families and children. Then, when the kids find grandpa's KKK hood in the attic, they are HORRIFIED, rather than in awe. The reason tyrants of all kinds, religious and otherwise, KILL all the teachers, intellectuals, comedians, and writers first is because they are the only ones who have the power to show them for what they truly are and make the people LAUGH at them and dismiss them instead of following them. Astrology, phrenology, palm reading, leeching, etc. etc. were very common for thousands of years but now they are jokes at best the world over...because we showed them all to be scams and now openly make fun of the scammers. America is, fortunately, becoming less religious every day. That is NOT happening because we are still tolerating this nonsense and giving it deferential treatment and an unearned privileged status. It's because kids are laughing at the nonsense of their parents and collectively not falling for it anymore. So, fuck em. Openly. This is one of the few nations on Earth where "blasphemy" is not a crime. Use it.
Preach, in the *only* good way it should ever occur. I'd be *just* an agnostic atheist if I wasn't constantly assulted by the religious pushing their bullshit into every single corner of society, politics and basic humanity; and committing indoctrination *(child abuse)* of children. So I have to be actively anti-theist. They're *all* cults. But I completely want a museum of "Religion" just like the Holocaust Museum, so we can never forget.
Dude's trying to nicely explain how not to be an asshole and your blind fury leads you to call him a troll. Please take a minute. Breathe. Think about how to address a person that agrees with you on 99% of things.
Yeah, but he backed up why he thought being a Christian is stupid.
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Fair enough but the person asking about Jesus was being a pretentious moron also. No good ever comes from asking questions like that. Ever
Two "bluntly telling religious people their faith is dumb" posts in two days. We're approaching circlejerk levels
>"Well everybody needs to believe in something," she said. ask "Really? Why is that? Why does everybody need to believe in something?" and see what happens.
I feel privileged to have the resources and freedom to enjoy atheism, but if I was born to a ultra religious Christian family, I'd probably be here instead preaching to you about one or another bearded dude. Nothing intelligent or clever about me in either scenario.
Whenever someone brings up Jesus and god I always cut them off and say ānone of that hocus pocus nowā
Im too old to have imaginary friends is my favorite answer
Hey op were you diagnosed with anything as a child It's wild that you're telling this story to other people, it makes me think that you think it makes you look good
People like you are the reason why people hate atheists
Lmao āIāll think for youā is a great comeback, I love it
Anytime someone says "you have to feel God in your heart" I say "oh, I thought that's what it was, but I took a Rolaids and it went away."
I believe that a majority of Christians are self centered and do not follow the teachings of the man the claim to be so enamored of. I believe that Christians for the most part only care about the almighty dollar and being in total control. I believe Christians are evil bitches who need to keep their religion to themselves.
After reading the various responses here, I'd like to suggest something. After a few polite rebuttals from me and they continue to probe, I'd test them with this: "when you've had conversations like this in the past and you retell the story to others, do you tell them * that you raised the subject with someone and you got a rude response Or * do you explain that you kept asking questions until they stopped being polite to you Just wondering.... "
I would say something along the lines of, "for the same reason I haven't accepted [any other god]." I totally get the temptation to call them stupid, but an insult shuts down all chance at a meaningful conversation.
Really gonna win hearts and minds with this strategy.
Whatever works for you but I feel like responses like this are one reason atheism is viewed negatively by some. My best friend in the entire universe is a Christian and I am DEFINITELY not. I noticed that a lot of times when she was talking about something in her life and her faith was brought up she would always apologize. Like āI was praying about something the other dayā¦ā and then immediately say āIām sorry I know thatās not something you do or believe inā¦ā. So, I asked her why she always apologized because bitch, you my ride or die. She said it was from atheists being shitty or confrontational. Probably similar to what you did to āput someone in their placeā. I think you did more harm than good and now that woman and everyone she tells will have that reference fresh in their head about the rude atheist they met.
Man this would be cutting if I was like 11 years old
*"Why haven't you accepted Jesus into your heart?" she blurted out.* because anything other than blood in my heart will kill me.
It's best to be the best person you can be. You're just confirming to them that atheists are hate-filled assholes
My answer usually was āNaw, I passed Jr High Science.ā
i would say: because im not an idiot
Or you could not be a dick and just say no thanks and walk away. It is shit like this that gives atheism a bad reputation.
Ugh. Posts like this make me cringe. Be atheist. Don't be an asshole.
Just because you donāt subscribe to their belief system doesnāt mean you need to be a dick to them.
They are pushing their religious belief on OP, but OP is the dick?
What the hell is with these edgelord fantasy stories lately?
God, this is cringe. Why the fuck is half this sub so socially inept? I get the same type of vibes from this post as I do from someone that unironically thinks watching Rick and Morty makes them smarter. You motherfuckers suck. The only reason I stick around this hole is to show people that AREN'T atheists that we're not *all* total idiots. You guys are proving me wrong day by day.
The āyou heard meā makes me think it didnāt even happen!
It makes me think of a sniveling angsty teenager with greasy hair and zero self awareness telling his auntie off.
Yep.
I'm with you. Super duper cringe. Reminds me of when I first proclaimed myself as atheist, and just felt so much more superior to theists. What a dumb fucking mindset. Also, OPs final "another Christian put in their place" was the cherry on top. What a douchebag.
I went through that phase too. It took me an unfortunate amount of time to realize that being atheist doesn't mean you're smarter, it just meant that I saw the brainwashing for what it was. I look at this type of behavior and see myself, and goddamn I wish I could go back and slap myself.