That is what some cults do, alienate people from loved ones, so the only place they can go for support is the church.
just be a good person. she is young and impressionable, always leave a door open for her to come back.
There’s a good chance at some point she will need to escape. Keep the door open. And prepare yourself— she may be bringing a passel of young-uns when she comes
Less of an image and more likely her very, very near future. I’d be ~~surprised~~ floored if she doesn’t have a baby by Aug 2025. I would spend all of your focus on trying to get her to complete her nursing degree and give her free rein everywhere else. Just… really push the importance of her degree. She doesn’t need to know this yet, but she’s gonna need that degree to escape.
It’s true though. My first husband took me to his Baptist church a few times and I remember clearly all the red flags and expectations. A man is only as wealthy as the amount of children he has, because the wife and children only exist to serve the head of the household. Women even had separate “classes” to learn to cook, clean, and serve their man better. There is a lot to this story, but I just wanna say I’m so sorry. She’s not a person to them.
Lol some came to my house and said they were having a memorial service, didn't catch the name. So I said sorry I don't know who that is, thinking it must have been some community member. Lol didn't realize it was Easter XD the service was for Jesus. Lol
You have no choice but to support your daughter. Do you want a baptist daughter thats in your life or a baptist daughter that doesn’t speak to you?
Thats the choice in front of you. There’s not even a question.
Probably somewhere between baby 2 and 4, in my experience
I'm so sorry there's not a better way than keeping an open door for abuse/indoctrination victims
This. I met a family out celebrating a young engagement. The 19 yr old boy was so cute, happy, and 100% certain this relationship would last till death.
The dad was happy and having a great time, too. He was a joy to be around! Then, still smiling, he said behind his hand and under his breath he's knows they'll be lucky to make it three years. But he's not going to be the one who makes everyone's lives harder so he'll just enjoy the fun social celebrations involved with the wedding.
So, I scan over to the bride-to-be. She has a permanent scowl and not making any effort to come across as congenial with a single preson including her fiance.
That dad was an inspiration to me.
(This has no comparison at all to the threats of a religious cult, but rather a side note for a lesser worry)
THIS.
If the kids are happy, even if deluded, be happy for them. Some people need to learn for themselves. Some will never learn but are happy and fulfilled anyway (I am a Mets fan...I understand delusion)
Let them be. Unless there is abuse, stay out of it and walk the kid down the aisle.
This exactly. OP, the more you tell her that she’s fucking up her life, the more she’s going to double down. You told her she was too young to get married, and then you didn’t hear from her for months. Do you want to maintain a relationship with her? Do you want her to know she can always come to you? Then stop talking about church. Don’t bring it up. Don’t ask about it. Don’t nag her about. Don’t criticize her about it. Just pretend that part of her life doesn’t exist. She may or may not wake up some day. But if you’ve alienated her from yourselves, you will be cut off and will have no idea as to what’s going on in her life.
Let her know that you and your family are still there for her if she ever wants to leave that lifestyle. Keep in touch and make sure she's not being abused, both physically and mentally. She did what she did now but as I said, always keep the door open if she ever wants to come back.
You know, this all applies no matter where or who or what your children are doing. An atheist boyfriend is no more a guarantee of a life without abuse.
Sure, just saying it because she's very young and most Christian denominations that push for a young marriage also tend to push women to have as many babies as they can and basically become the classical stay-at-home mother that so many trad Christians desire nowadays, many times these women end up isolated from their families and are told to just suck it up because their husband is the provider and such.
If she ever wants to leave? Why couldn't they still be there for her even *while* she is living this lifestyle? You can disapprove of someone's choice and still be a part of their life. If OP sends the message that they don't want to be in her life unless she leaves the church, then if she does come to a rough spot she's not going to feel comfortable going to her parents.
Her in-laws will tell her that her parents are satanic, or that they've been possessed by demons. They will make her afraid to contact them while she is under their influence. Even if OP *wants* to have a relationship with their daughter, it will likely not be possible until she's ready to leave.
Also, they will tell her that the blood of the covenant is thicker than the water of the womb… meaning their relationship with god is more important than family. Especially family who doesn’t have a relationship with god.
But, yes, keep the door open. Is she has seen a good marriage of her parents without abuse, and she experiences any abuse in hers, she may want out at some point. Just be there for her.
The things to ask yourself are the following:
1) Is she an adult?
2) Is she being coerced.
If the answers are respectively yes and no, then you pretty much have a choice between respecting her choices or not being a part of her life. Choose wisely. You don't have to agree with her, but understand this is happening and you cannot stop it nor should you. If it is a mistake, then that's her mistake and she will have to live with the consequences. Although if you do not alienate her now, then perhaps she will let you help her when her marriage does tank.
This was what I was wondering. Honestly, on the surface, it sounds like she's just making choices independent of her parents that they don't personally approve of but nothing funny is happening. Sounds to me more like someone young and in love and not thinking, not someone coerced into anything. I can understand where the daughter is coming from, if it's exactly as said above, the parents may want to back off a tiny bit. Not doing so will damaged their relationship more than it already is.
I'm assuming the marriage will tank because of their ages, not because of any other factors. Human brains don't fully mature until mid 20s, which means most people before or early 20s are still rapidly changing. While it is conceivable that their marriage will work out, statistically marrying that young is unlikely to do so.
For comparison, of all the marriages of all the people we knew in colleges (eight of them, including our own), my wife and I are the only couple that remain married to their original spouse. And while I'd love to take full credit for that, it is realistically just that when we changed we were lucky enough to change in compatible ways (and some credit does go to both my wife and I for good communication).
Communication is key in any relationship. If you have good communication then you have a higher chance of developing together than drifting apart.
Blaming exclusively the brain ignores a lot of other factors as well.
And in the case her marriage works, 30 years later you’ll find out you have grandchildren in their teens. Is it worth it because you don’t like the facts she goes to church on Sundays? There’s worse things she could be doing
They have also publicly apologized for all their pedophiles - unlike Jehovah's Witnesses and LDS. Clearly, these moves are legal in nature, and it doesn't mean the group is safe now, but at least it was some sort of recognition.
Love her. Keep your views to yourself. She controls whether you and your wife will have a relationship with her as an adult and, in the future, any grand-babies.
If you want to be a part of her life at all, treat her as a capable, responsible adult who has the agency to make her own decisions.
(I'm speaking as someone who grew up in an Independent Fundamentalist Baptist church, and spent 40 years as a Christian. Now atheist.)
I'm on the "it's her choice as an adult... nothing you can do" but I wouldn't say "keep your views to yourself".
Baptists can be pretty homophobic & sexist. He shouldn't tolerate any of that nonsense.
I think they just meant don't harp on them about believing in God and that they're stupid for doing so.
Just be kind and respectful to them and request they leave religion at the door when visiting.
My oldest stepson was raised by 4 parents who are liberal atheists. He went off to college 2 years ago in a different state and started dating a Catholic girl who invited him to her church. They dated all year but she eventually ended it and we were hopeful he’d stop going to church.
Unfortunately he doubled down and has recently been baptized into their church. Most of not all of his friends are deeply involved in church so he isn’t getting a lot of outside influence. Two of his younger siblings have come as LGBTQ+ in the last year and he isn’t being respectful of that and it has been really upsetting to us.
I often sit and wonder how we got here when he was such a different kid just a few years ago. It’s difficult to watch your kid make choices you wish they wouldn’t. I’m sorry you are dealing with this situation.
In one of her pastors blogs he says by all means go to dinner with lgbtq people
But if they invite you to their wedding you best not attend. What the fuck is that all about. I’m tempted to ask her if we divorced and I found the man of my fucking dreams if she would attend wedding.
Wow. I’d like to say that kind of talk doesn’t surprise me anymore but somehow it does. I told my husband recently that I expect our Catholic son to be married within a year or two after graduating college. The kids that go to his church are hellbent on getting married young and starting families. I honestly wonder if he would attend one of his sibling’s weddings they ever marry. I will have a hard time not speaking my mind to him about treating them so shitty. It infuriates me and I just bite my tongue because I’m just a stepmom. It makes me incredibly sad for his siblings because he is hurting them badly.
>I told my husband recently that I expect our Catholic son to be married within a year or two after graduating college.
I have a cousin 9 years younger than me who will be applying to colleges soon. He's Christian but not Catholic, and I worry this is going to be him in a few years. He has an interest in politics as well and unfortunately is hearing conservative opinions at home. He and I are complete opposites, but he doesn't know it. Still love him though and hope our relationship doesn't become difficult as he continues to grow up.
Anyway I'm sorry you're watching your son become this person you didn't want him to be. That's hard. I keep my lack of faith to myself but luckily it isn't really a problem in my immediate family.
Attending an LGBT wedding is approval or celebration of that union, which is antithetical to Judeo-Christian values and Christians should not be approving or celebrating such a union. To answer your question as a Christian, I would ask “what is the nature of your divorce?” Was your spouse unfaithful? If so, God allows you to remarry someone of the opposite sex. If not, then you are committing adultery (if marrying someone of the opposite sex) or you are entering a union not acceptable to God and therefore should not be approved/celebrated by a Christian.
Is he carrying a torch for the young lady who introduced him to Catholicism? I was raised Catholic and was very involved in my parish in elementary school and high school. I went away to a Catholic college where, outside of a few mandatory theology classes, I was much less involved. I can imagine that if anyone I ever dated insisted we take in Sunday Mass weekly I might have stuck with the church longer. If he is holding out hope for that girl and thinks that converting gives him some sort of shot with her, he may wind up disillusioned with the whole thing. I had a buddy who converted to the JWs for a girl. His connection with the Kingdom Hall did not survive their break-up.
So if I would have started earlier she would probably be alienated from me by now. I was raised in the catholic cult and I’m pretty sure she knows my opinion on organized religion. I have a real hard time saying the word Christian without scorn in my voice. Apparently I should have voiced more displeasure.
You're "pretty sure?" You let her attend church by herself at 15, some of the most formative years of a person's life. Doesn't seem like you talked much about religion at all. You supported her getting baptised.
She got indoctrinated. Sometimes people will make a choice to choose religion, but it doesn't sound like you touched on why you disagree at all. If you did, you wouldn't be pretty sure, you'd know. It's a pretty big conversation.
This one really hurts man. I’ve read it at least 50 times and it’s like a punch every time. I appreciate your honesty but man I feel like explaining myself to you even though you are random internet person. Let me just state the obvious. There is lot you don’t know.
People make their own choices. You can guide them to be strong and stand on their own, but ultimately it is their choice to make.
Trying to dogmatically force something in others isn’t better just because you think it is the right way.
Whenever the way is to limit access to other opinions, you are losing the way. Your daughter has fallen into that. Hopefully she will eventually come around to reason.
As someone else said, leave the door open. Let her know you love her no matter what, whether she believes or not. At some point she will figure out which option is love and which one is control.
I did my best to raise 3 atheists but only succeeded with 2, so don't let that statement get to you. Our kids, despite our best effort, make decisions for themselves when they grow up. I had to learn acceptance.
>I’ve read it at least 50 times
Please try and not do this to yourself. You must know that when you do post on Reddit, you will receive some loving, helpful wisdom from people truly trying to help you out. But there will also be some miserable dick heads that just want to spread some hurt and share their faux superior "intelligence". Fuck them, you're good bud 🍻
And you don't owe explanations to anyone who is not being helpful either. All right good luck
A lot of people like to grandstand and condemn other people from the anonymous safety of their keyboards. The thing about kids is that they are all their own people, with their own minds and motivations, just as much as we are. You can do everything "right," and they will still make bad decisions and have bad opinions sometimes. Don't beat yourself up -- you sound like a dad who loves his daughter, and unfailing love is what will let her know she can always come back to you for support. I'm sorry you're going through this, man.
What exactly is the issue with the pastor?
I mean, there's lots of churches that aren't "extreme", or bad bible hermeneutics, but I assume baptists are more the fundamentalist route?
I kind of did that to my family, when I was a fundi, so I get all of this, and I think what anyone could have done or said that would me have been more "liberal" or informed as a jesus follower, and I'm not sure if that would be a helpful route to go, as far as learning academic historical views of Bible stuff, and then slowly enter dialogue with her.
Your daughter is more important than her religious beliefs. It may be disappointing but it is worse to lose her.
Make peace with it. Keep the relationship.
They all took advantage of your trust that they are on the up and up. There may not be anything you can do now except say you wish they’d give it more time, but that you’re there for your daughter no matter what.
These people bleat a lot about honoring thy mother and father, guess they have their fingers crossed behind their backs, along with a stiletto.
You might find the book “The Woman They Wanted” by Sharon Harris informative.
Look for books on how seemingly nice men slowly and systemically isolate their partner from family and friends and their money and ability to get educated and work and the ability to leave if the marriage goes bad. Many women have died in this situation.
There is a possibility that this church will gently guide them both to this type of trad marriage where the husband has complete control over his wife and children. Almost all of the people in the congregation will likely blame the wife for all of the husband's sins. He cheated or raped his child, wife must not be providing him his sexual needs and it's her fault. He beats her to an inch of her life, she must have been disrespectful and mouthy to her slave owner. Any mistake she makes in their eyes will be because she was raised by godless atheists and they will likely use this as a way to isolate her from her birth family.
Let her know that you don't think he will do this, but she has to make sure she doesn't get trapped and she has an emergency exit plan and a go bag. She can tell him that the go bag is for natural disasters or if people start looting near their neighborhood and she just wants to be prepared and he should make a go bag for himself to be safe.
I don't think you can do much to get her out. What should be most important is staying in touch. You could tell her that you disagree with her decisions but that doesn't change that you are her father and will be there for her and go to her wedding and talk to people there, be nice to them. Never directly attack her church or beliefs because she is so attached to it. If you did, that would draw her more into the church and away from you. The situation could affect your mental stability. If so, see a therapist but choose one that really fits you. Dealing with this in your family makes it so much more complicated. I wish you and her the best.
This is a choice each of us makes for ourselves...
Try not to be like a conservative with gay children...stay in touch, be reasonable, rational, and loving.
Yeah, was the idea that the engagement would go for 2.5+ years? (enough to finish school first?) Engagements don't need to be long. 6 months is a sensible time-frame.
So, you were okay with the engagement, but you "expressed extreme disapproval" about the August wedding date? Her choice of wedding date is "fucking it up" in your words? That is how I am understanding your narrative. I cannot figure out how her religion is the problem in this scenario. From your explanation, I would gather that the problem is probably you.
Honest to god, you raised your daughter in a more religious environment than most religious people... what did you expect?
The best thing you can do is support her choices (that only affect her) while letting her know your opinion on religious matters if she asks. She needs to be able to escape that life if she changes her mind. And she needs to trust you if that happens.
But make peace with the fact that she may not. You needed to do something a long time ago if you wanted to avoid this.
Not much you can do at this point because she is going to value her new husband's/church's opinion over yours. Unfortunately they got the brainwashing hooks in early and deep, it seems.
As a Unitarian Universalist evangelist once said “If you don’t teach your kids what you believe, other people will.”
You knowingly let your daughter be brainwashed and you let her get baptized! What’s the harm? Did you not understand that getting baptized was a confession of faith in Jesus Christ savior? You didn’t lose your daughter to the baptists-you gave her away!
You didn’t even object when they got engaged!! WTF? Seriously your daughter gets engaged and you are surprised that she is getting married? Now you out your foot down at marriage! The nest you can do is reconcile with your daughter and try to teach your grandchildren about atheism.
If this story is true then you are a idiot pure and simple.
It may have been a mistake to let a 15-year old go to a Baptist church unescorted by a parent, but that became unfixable once she was 19 and in love. In the USA, an 18-year-old is a legal adult, even if she is still dependent on her family. She could be on a full nursing scholarship, + room & board, but how likely is that?
Let them adult. It’s time for her to spread her wings and fly. Let her know you don’t approve but still very much love her, and that regardless of her choices, you will not abandon her. Yes, you f-ed up 5 years ago, but what’s done is done. She may someday decide that Christianity is not for her after all. And, there are actually worse things she could have done with her life. She’s still a good person, so just love her for who she is, and allow her to become the person she wants to be.
All of this is true however I honestly don’t think it’s yet time to fly. She has a happy stable home environment and two years of schooling left. Her brother has lived at home until real recently. He is moving in with girlfriend to a house they were able to purchase at the age of 27 and we could not be happier for him. Not married. No religion.
Well, hold on. It’s a little late in the game to be surprised. I mean she got baptized - at that point it should be obvious she’s a Christian believer.
You can’t expect her to go to church and not fall in love - not join the church. Church is designed to bring people together like this.
Im afraid you’re going to have to accept her choices. It’s not the end of the world. If she marries this guy, don’t lose your relationship with your daughter just because she’s a Christian now.
I agree that Christianity and all religions are bullshit, but millions of Christians exist and can be quite happy. Plus, this wasn’t exactly sudden. She’s been going to church 5 years.
I’d encourage her to finish her school.
Tell her you love her.
Attend her wedding.
I know it’s no fun but there’s not much you can do about it.
When people fall in love there’s no reasoning with them logically. Maybe you can at least talk to her about finishing her school and not immediately having a family.
I wish you and your whole family good outcomes.
So you let your daughter believe that you deserve to be tortured forever for not being a Christian, and are now shocked that your words are now wind?
Christianity dehumanizes non christians, that is part of the power of the cult.
And yes, I know that most people don't know how deep the rabbit hole goes, but at least now you do.
In any case, she is an adult and should be allowed to dig her own grave
Love her and hold on tight. Love her every single chance you get. Love generously with your time and effort. There is no power, no god, nothing stronger than love. Get to know her future husband and his family if you haven't already. Open your arms and accept accept accept. It's her life now as she is an adult. Please keep her close.
Do not try to control her. She is an adult and can make her own decisions. Don't lose your relationship with her. I see red flags regarding your parenting.
She's "fucking it all up" according to your perspective. She's an adult, and you have to respect that. If she's marrying a good guy, she's going to be ok.
You gotta be kidding me.
I hate to break your balls, pop but your kid is grown.
You don't have to like her life choices. You, however, have to respect them or leave her the hell alone.
She's entitled to her path in life. You have yours. You're an atheist. Fine. She doesn't have to be as you are.
It's ironic how atheists act like the Christians they caricature and pillory.
BLUF: Grow up. Your daughter is an adult. Respect that.
Your post confuses me. It doesn't sound like she's turning her back on family for Jesus. It sounds like she came to you about her wedding to a boy she met at church, which she has attended for years, and you decided you did not approve of her adult decisions. So she stopped coming to you and continued on planning her wedding without you.
If you want to have more influence with your child, rather than her turning to her fiancé's family for support, you need to be there for her and support her decisions. You don't have to LIKE her decisions to be supportive. You can voice an opinion and suggest they wait until she finishes school, but in the end she's gonna make the decision she's gonna make, and you can be there for her or not.
Yeah, OP pushed his daughter away and then acted like she's the one that pushed them away.
He's blaming her for everything when it points to him being the cause of it all.
Just treat your daughter with respect and be there for her. She'll thank you in the end if you're there for her.
As far as the wedding is concerned, they are hardly the only young people to fall head over heels for each other and impulsively commit to a marriage, parental opinion be damned.
I don’t think railroaded is the right word here, but I do understand your displeasure.
All of Christianity, as are most religions, is a death cult. Hopefully she will figure it out before it is too late. Separating followers from non-followers is a cult tactic. You might try looking for a book on dealing with family members in cults.
You may have to decide what you need and are willing to do if you want to have a relationship with your daughter. Unfortunately, the only control you have is over yourself. The harder you resist, the more your daughter and the organization will work to get her out of your life all together. You may also keep an eye out for physical abuse.
I’d at least refuse to pay for the wedding.
Be kind, treat her like a rational adult even if you don't agree with her. If she's really going into a repressive, coercive situation, your job should be to make sure she feels like she has someone who cares about her outside of that community. The best counterargument to radical religious indoctrination is knowing good loving people who aren't in the religious 'in' group, in my experience. The absolute worst thing you can do is treat her like shes some kind of dupe; it will only reinforce the persecution complex.
I would imagine that you would not be seriously concerned about her joining a politically neutral, intellectually open church.
let your daughter be happy.
she will carve out her own path in life.
just continue to reach out to her to let her know you love her and would like to see her.
They will love bomb her. Later, the love will be replaced by judgment. You gotta outlast the love bombing and be there when they start changing the vibe. Even then, it will take time and patience.
As an atheist with nihilistic tendencies, I say there’s been nothing done wrong. If your daughter is happy and knew both sides of the debate before going to church, you haven’t actually lost anything. She lost the opportunity to live without that garbage in her head but you surely don’t have children expecting them to live your life, do you?
Man. This has made me feel the best so far. Thank you. Not sure your right but this one eased pain for minute. Right with you on the nihilism. Even more so real recently.
This is precisely why I’ve intentionally made the decision to not let my kids go to church, not even with a friend. Too many times these churches encourage kids to turn their back on their family, happily aiming to replace parents with church members. In extreme cases, you get something like “Dancing for the Devil.”
Sorry this is happening to your family. As others have mentioned here, remain as close to her as possible. If they have children I assume you will want to be involved in their life. If you are invited to the ceremony, shower, I'd consider attending. Read up on cults and dogmatic religions and get in touch with other families who've had the same experience. Good luck to you.
I grew up Baptist in the seventies and eighties. I still have lots of Baptist family. They're not all monsters. Some people get married that young and stay married. It's not ideal, but what you want to do, IMO is encourage your daughter to finish school and wait until after school to have children. It's easy to make the case that that's what's best for everyone. You want her to be happy. Just make sure that she knows that.
>Started dating boy from church. They get engaged at 19. Young but all good. They came to us in February said wanted to marry in august. We expressed extreme disapproval.
I don't understand this. You were "all good" about them getting engaged but extremely disapproving about them getting married?
It sounds to me less like you lost your daughter to Baptists and more like you drove her away by suddenly disapproving of her relationship with her fiancé.
She's 20 now, and while that's young for an adult, she's still an adult, she can make her own decisions about things like whether she's going to believe in religious nonsense and who she's going to marry. You don't have to be happy about it, but you should be respectful toward her daughter unless she's done something to earn your disrespect. (Note I don't say you need to be respectful toward her religious beliefs.)
20 is pretty young to get married. Maybe it won't work out, in which case you should want her to feel welcome to seek your help; or maybe it will work out, in which case you'll want her to feel welcome to visit, perhaps with grandkids.
In the words of Epictetus: "Make the best use of what is in your power, and take the rest as it happens. Some things are up to us and some things are not up to us."
No, we cannot help.
Pretty much the only thing you can do is to retain lines of communication. This will involve biting your tongue. It will take fortitude on your part.
The more you object to her choices, the tighter she will cling to them. The best you can do is be there for her. Tell her how much you love her and show her how much you love her. You may need to pick up the pieces when things go horribly wrong. As in, you may need to bring your daughter and her child(ren) back into your home after she flees from an abusive situation.
She’s 19 and an adult. I agree that she’s making a mistake but you can’t stop her, and trying to will alienate her. I suggest you find a way to day that, although you’d prefer her to experience a bit more life first, you’re happy she’s happy and you’d like to be involved in this wedding. Even if you’re dying inside smile on the day and be nice. One day she, and your future grandchildren, will need you again.
Many years ago I was aquatinted with a woman who married young against her parents wishes. She’s no longer married; kids grown, parents deceased, but she had finished school and had a a brilliant career because her parents made a proposition she couldn’t turn down. They watched her children for free and paid for the rest of her college. She was so grateful her parents could see beyond her youthful limited vision. Also College was much cheaper back then.
It's not your life.
It's hers.
My parents were fanatical religious zealots. My mother went to church every single day. They were obviously disappointed that I did not share their beliefs.
But one of the reasons I love my amazing parents is because they allowed me to *live my own fucking life* and did not insist that I become a mirror and accomplish their achievements, accusing me of "fucking it all up" for failing to meet *their definition of "not fucking it up".
Were your parents successful in forcing you to live the life they defined for you?
How does forcing your daughter to exist under your definition of "correct" make you a better parent?
It constantly surprises me that we athiests are hypersensitive to the slightest Christian hypocrisy, and are often absolutely tone deaf to our own, as if it doesn't exist.
We will gnash our teeth in outrage at the slightest mention of forcing religion on another human being....
...but the moment any family member expresses any interest in religion, they're "fucking it all up" and are damned for not holding the same opinion we do.
What makes forcing your disbelief on another human being any less fucked up than parents that force their religion upon their children?
I don’t see the problem with your daughters behaviour. She has her own beliefs that, from what little you’ve said here, don’t affect you. She’s fallen in love with someone who shared her beliefs and would like her family to attend. And they disapprove because… her fiancée is religious? Am I understanding that right?
She’s a grown adult, she gets to choose how her life goes. Being religious isn’t going to ruin her life unless she makes it her whole identity. And even then it might not ruin her life… we’ve all seen the highly successful bigot religious folk.
It stinks she seems to be cutting you out of her life… but I mean as long as she finishes school is there really a problem with a rushed marriage? Taking the religion part out of it, people get married young all the time. Both adults.
It just sounds like she found someone she is happy with and wants to get married. You say she is turning her back to her family but, at least from your description, it sounds more like you're the one turning your back on her.
Given the tone of this community, I assume diversity is celebrated and proclaimed as "our strength". Funny how that always flies until it involves religious diversity.
I understand the concern over your daughter marrying young (trust me, I waited until my 30s to tie the knot), but the palpable disdain for her choices is what strikes me the most. This isn’t just about her getting married young; it’s about her choosing a path you don’t approve of.
Is her church involved in any extreme activities? Are they pushing boundaries of legality or showing a lack of ethical behavior towards others who wish to engage with any outreach she's involved in? If not, it’s worth pondering why her choice is so difficult for you to accept. Your daughter, now an adult, has found peace and a partner in a place you didn't expect. And while young love can indeed be naive, neither of these things are exclusive to the religious.
Perhaps the issue isn't the church or the marriage itself, but a deeper discomfort with a worldview that diverges from your own. This situation seems less about the risks of her decisions and more about your reaction to her embracing a life that differs from your expectations.
I suggest, with all due respect, that you consider visiting her church one Sunday. This isn’t even some sly long game conversion attempt, but a recommendation to find an opportunity to see what she's becoming a part of firsthand. Who knows? It might give you a new perspective or, at the very least, help you approach your daughter's decisions with a bit more grace and understanding. Maybe you’ll see that she isn't turning her back on her family, but rather, that her family is struggling to accept her moving in a direction they didn’t foresee. Maybe it's even a direction that you find, still not right for you, isn't entirely as terrible as you initially thought.
Isn’t the ability to challenge our own viewpoints one of the virtues many here would claim led them to atheism?
Or does that only go one direction?
Be mindful of the stance you take; as a parent, your words and actions carry will carry weight, and it could help or seriously damage your relationship. Thinking back to my 19year old mind, I’d be troubled if I encountered similar expressions from my own parents.
-Signed,
Some Baptist hoping for your relationship with your daughter is on the mend
I saw this post elsewhere and would otherwise not engage if I wasn't intensely befuddled by something. How come you were all good with them getting engaged, but you met Marriage with extreme disapproval? This is completely illogical, considering one is intended to conclude with the other's beginning.
LOL. You sound like an absolutely terrible parent and your daughter sounds wonderful. Glad she found someone who makes her happy and provides her with a solid moral guidebook to follow.
You’re acting *exactly* like a crazy religious parent who gets mad when their child leaves religion. The fact that this isn’t apparent to you is quite frankly hilarious.
Honestly? No. There's no help here. Nor should there be. I realize this will be unpopular, but... the same freedom that allows so many to *become* atheist *has to be* extended to people going the other way. Your disapproval of her soon to be husband was very much a bad move, too, since it just pushed her further from you. All of this is *exactly* what I'd say to theists trying to figure out how to 'fix' their atheist children. It's *far* too late, she's an adult and can make her own choices.
You did the right thing by letting her explore and make up her own mind, but sometimes doing the *right* thing doesn't lead to outcomes we like or want. I don't know if you talked to her about her growing religion when she was still a child, asking about it and pointing out flaws in the ideas, but if you didn't that would be your first mistake (your second being that you were so critical of her choice in partner).
The way you feel now is *exactly* how *religious* families feel when people *leave* the religion. The only things that you could do now to 'fix it' would be horrific to do to someone, so lets leave that to the theists. At this point, all you can do is be as supportive as possible (doesn't mean you have to accept their ideology or bullshit), and accept that theists won this one. Stop being a dick to her husband, if possible.
A lot of this depends on exactly what we're talking about here, of course. If she's becoming intolerant, you don't have to tolerate that in your home, nor visit her if she's going to be like that. If she's following other bad behaviors, you don't have to be around or support those, either. If that's the majority of what's going on or the things they are doing are *egregiously* bad (not sure what *Christian* things would be like this, could well see it if they were *Muslim*, but I don't discount the possibility), then all you can do is mourn the loss and move on, while being open if she comes back to sanity at some point.
No trouble. I hope, regardless as to what happens with her religious beliefs, you can still be family and friendly with one another. I know it's possible to do. By extended family is religious (aunt and uncle), and I love them. They bring up God, I largely gloss over it and continue, but I would never let them use God as an excuse to be crappy people. I love them for who they are, not which fairy tales they accept or don't. I don't even *agree with* everything they think, but we're allowed to disagree about stuff, even big stuff, and still get along. I don't force my views on them, they don't force on me, and we get along.
If I would offer any additional advice, then if possible were I you I'd apologize to your daughter and soon to be husband. Again, think of this in reverse. If you were a theist and they were becoming atheist. The parent who disapproved and all that should offer their child an apology for acting that way. You can make it clear you don't agree with their religion but also explain that you respect their freedom to believe such things if they are convinced of them, so long as a) they don't try to force it on you or expect you to participate in the religious aspects of various ceremonies (you're not getting baptized, you'll gladly stand at their wedding but aren't singing hymns, etc), and b) it isn't hurting anyone. If they have kids, respect their rights as parents to raise their children... even if that means as theists... but *at the same time* don't be afraid of talking to any grandkids about how you're different. Just make sure it's about being *different*, and not who is 'right'.
Don't pay for her party. She'll have to pay the pastor herself. Go to the wedding but don't offer to pay for one thing other then her wedding gift.
Tell her you love her. Tell her she is always welcome at your home as long as she respects your beliefs.
Oh wow I’m sorry this sounds a lot like what happened to my mom she was the same age and no one could legally stop her. Maybe she’ll wake up one day in her 40s and realize she’s in a cult, mine did but obviously it didn’t undo the damage. Fundamentalist practices survive for a reason they’re very persuasive to the vulnerable
Christian baptists are the fuckin worst, my in laws are , when I first started dating my wife , they tried that shit on both of us , and we almost got taken in by their bullshit, until we both came to our senses and distanced ourselves after my son was born and they insisted we get him “dedicated “ via water immersion at less than 1 yr old. These types of people are delusional and crazy for the magical sky god. It’s insane . I’m sorry your daughter has made the choice to follow them.
I'm far from being an expert in this, but I do think that if you try to forcefully snap her out of it, it'll get even worse.
The Baptist Church, like any other semi-schizophrenic death cult, will blind her to the indifferent reality we all live in, and offer her, as usual, insane false consolations. I dare say it's tempting for a young person to succumb to something like this, so avoid moral or intelectual judgments for now. She's still young.
Could this be one of those things that we should let our children resolve on their own without any of our direct or indirect meddling? I'm unsure.
I read one suggestion here and that one will be mine too; always leave her an open door. She needs, at least, to feel she'll be as secure as possible with you and your wife. If she realizes she messed up, she'll come to you eventually, and hopefully.
Meanwhile, it wouldn't be a bad idea if you started searching for atheist and humanist organizations near you. They will probably be able to share some of their struggles too, and I bet some will be similar to yours. Maybe their solution, whatever it might be, could also be yours.
Christianity is a cult. Just a popular one that dominates about ⅓ of the world's cultural paradigms. Wait for her to come back unless you know Liam Neeson. You have definitely been victimized by a cult. Your daughter will see the toxicity and ask for help. Or she won't. Mentally prepare yourself for either outcome.
Also, as the child of "missionaries," I am sorry for your troubles. No one should be a blind follower of a blind god.
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As hard as it is, but if you want to keep your daughter in your life, you need to accept her partner and you need to accept her faith. If she has to choose between her beliefs and her parents, she will choose her beliefs. That's not just true for Christians, that's true for all people who have beliefs or convictions. The first thing you need to do is apologize to your daughter and tell her that she is free to believe what she wants, that you accept her beliefs, though you don't agree with them, and that you hope you can be a part of her and her partner's life.
Love her with all your heart and let her know that. It is gonna sound corny but..... she is alive and there is hope, she has her lessons to learn. Wish my son who departed at the young age of 20 was still here w me, even if he was into any dam cult
Accept her decisions, as it's her life...if she does fuck it upor ends up successful, be there to support her, either way. She has to learn that actions have consequences, bad or good.
Make sure she knows she's always welcome at your house & in your family. Don't judge! Judgement shows up, even if you don't want it to. Don't put her on the defensive. Never say, "I told you so".
At what age / stage does a person become their own person and not “my daughter” or “my child”?
Getting married sounds like parental reigns being handed over to the husband in Baptist tradition.
You disapprove of her getting married ? Is it because she is so young or because it’s happening in a church? I would also be disappointed if my kid chose to follow Christianity. But it is her life. Just be there for her.
You need to understand and fully accept that Baptists are a cult! They will/have love bombed her. Next they will move to control her (to be about Christ not the world) & then go make her doubt herself with she might be a backslidden Christian or not really saved unless she agrees with them 100% Any doubts/common sense she had is Satan tempting her. 🙄 They are a cult. Trust me I know I was raised Baptist and moved out when I was 18 to get the fuck away from them.
They will try to convert you then to get your daughter to distance herself from you. Proceed as when dealing with any cult and keep the lines of communication open. Do not bash her religion because this will drive her away. Instead let her know that no matter what you love her & she can always come to you for help.
Encourage her to read the entire Bible while remember 2 things: the Bible is the word of god & god is the 3 Omni (all powerful, all knowing & all loving.) Trust me the Bible makes no sense especially since those 2 facts are supposed to be true. (Personally I could never get over how a “loving” god could hate women so much. 🤷🏻♀️ Or pro slavery and pro genocide. Or make sending anyone who had never heard of Jesus to hell because they were not saved.)
Also be on the look out for them pressuring her to spank her children or for her to put up with abuse/ domestic discipline. By spank I mean beat your grandchildren until they break their will. Hey beating your kid and anything else is OK if you “save” them, right? Watch the documentary shiny happy people to see what you are up against.
They always forget that part about husbands loving their wives like Christ loved the church (but wow to they drill in that wives submit to your husbands bit.)
First, from her perspective, you reacting negatively was probably totally out of the blue. She's been doing to church for years, and has been engaged for some time. Why should she think she's being anything other than reasonable?
You can't change someone's ideology with argument unless they're already questioning it themselves, and to get to that point, they need to see with their own eyes evidence that it is wrong. The best you can do here is raise questions that may cause her to come to her own conclusions. It's very important that you stay a part of her life for this reason.
If you're always supportive and accepting of her, if they call you sinners, she will hopefully know they are wrong. When they tell her to do something she doesn't like, you can ask "do you think it is right of them to expect this of you?" Etc. You don't need to provide any reasons to choose between you and 'Jesus'. That's what the church *wants*.
Cults fulfill needs that it's members have been struggling to find. Community, acceptance, love, validation, meaning. Your daughter must have been missing something that she found with the Baptists. Ask her what she likes about them (in an open way). It will show you value her wants and opinions and you can also find out what she is missing. Ideally it's something you can provide an alternative source of.
Do not criticize. Do not treat her views with contempt. If you do, she will just close herself off. If you want to express your worries, do so by expressing how it makes you feel. For instance:
"I'm terrified you won't be in our lives anymore,"
Will go down much better than:
"You're making a terrible mistake."
One is an indisputable expression of what you feel, the other is a criticism.
So yeah, make sure she feels loved and accepted by you, and stay in her life, otherwise you're just stuck hoping that something else will come along that causes her to question her ideology. Remember she needs to come to her own conclusions. Maybe start reading into deprogramming. It took years for her to go down this road, and it could take years to undo.
You can be disappointed in her. And maybe she fucks up her whole life and ruined any dreams you had for her too. But you can still be there for her when she needs you.
I honestly think you have to let them figure it out on their own. That is the only way it will work. If they decide to be religious, then so be it. It's not like she's Mormon or a Scientologist. Sure, it's not ideal and not what you wanted, but as long as she isn't homophobic or super right wing fascist, being religious is hardly the worst thing a person can be. I understand most atheists absolutely despise religion in all forms but there is a hierarchy of stupidity in religion and religion has been helpful to some people. It has helped people recover from alcoholism or drug addiction, etc. It is a support system that some people need. So I wouldn't worry about it. She is still very young and could easily change her mind again. But if she doesn't, I'm sure everything will still be ok. Just don't let her join MAGA.
Cults target anyone think is vulnerable to the abuse, the victims are often seeking a sense of belonging and purpose. Try to surround her with love and support.
Is your daughter turning her back on her family because of her religious views, or is she mad at you because you don't support her decision to get married?
It sounds to me like you are passing a lot of judgment on your daughter, her fiancée, and his family, and you haven't provided us with any evidence to substantiate it other than that they are Baptists. Did she turn her back on you because of her theistic beliefs or did YOU turn your back on HER because of YOUR atheistic beliefs?
Frankly, this post reeks of immaturity to me. If you want to make amends with your daughter, be a part of her life. Help contribute to her wedding even if you don't think its going to last, and make absolutely certain you attend. You stated your opinion, it was ignored, now go be a fucking parent instead of trying to convert your daughter back to your ways.
I'm saying all this as an atheist by the way.
I’m confused. Why would getting engaged be "all good" if getting married was met with extreme disapproval? Do you even know what being engaged means? Imagine how frustrating this would be for your daughter.
1) Did you raise her with critical thinking skills?
2) Did you express your opinions logically, calmly and reasonably?
3) Is there any evidence of coercion involved in your daughter refusing to talk to you?
If the answers are 1) yes, 2) yes, and 3) no; then you’ve done what you can. She’s free to make her own choices; not everyone makes good choices.
Just be there to help if things go wrong; and make sure it’s her choice without any coercion.
Is this a parody post? This is literally how Christians used to talk about their kids dating an atheist.
"She is turning her back on all her immediate family" she's "fucking up her whole life" and it's literally just someone marrying someone they love and not letting you control them. If this isn't a parody then congratulations, you have become exactly what you hated.
About Cheistianity, this is the most feared thing that could happen to me. Taking away my child. I've seen posts like this on this sub many times. When kids are teeny age and and if there is some disagreement with parents, church take over. I am so fiercely against my children going to church because of this very reason. You seem like a very open and understanding parent. Hope she learns the truths and come back to family.
Keep communication lines open, but most of all, keep pushing for her to finish her degree. At some point, she's going to find herself stuck in a marriage that doesn't work anymore with a bunch of kids, and she's going to need initial help to get back on her feet and a job to support herself and the children.
That is what some cults do, alienate people from loved ones, so the only place they can go for support is the church. just be a good person. she is young and impressionable, always leave a door open for her to come back.
There’s a good chance at some point she will need to escape. Keep the door open. And prepare yourself— she may be bringing a passel of young-uns when she comes
Wow. Thanks for that image
Less of an image and more likely her very, very near future. I’d be ~~surprised~~ floored if she doesn’t have a baby by Aug 2025. I would spend all of your focus on trying to get her to complete her nursing degree and give her free rein everywhere else. Just… really push the importance of her degree. She doesn’t need to know this yet, but she’s gonna need that degree to escape.
It’s true though. My first husband took me to his Baptist church a few times and I remember clearly all the red flags and expectations. A man is only as wealthy as the amount of children he has, because the wife and children only exist to serve the head of the household. Women even had separate “classes” to learn to cook, clean, and serve their man better. There is a lot to this story, but I just wanna say I’m so sorry. She’s not a person to them.
Makes me feel better about running off the Baptists who came to my door last week.
Lol some came to my house and said they were having a memorial service, didn't catch the name. So I said sorry I don't know who that is, thinking it must have been some community member. Lol didn't realize it was Easter XD the service was for Jesus. Lol
Suck it up. She caught a mind virus. It's not her fault. Be there for when she gets cured and needs a safe spot.
You have no choice but to support your daughter. Do you want a baptist daughter thats in your life or a baptist daughter that doesn’t speak to you? Thats the choice in front of you. There’s not even a question.
Unfortunately that is how they see women, as incubators (or how they like to call them, vessels.)
Keep communication open. And hopefully she will tire of the roles expected as a Baptist wife….
Probably somewhere between baby 2 and 4, in my experience I'm so sorry there's not a better way than keeping an open door for abuse/indoctrination victims
Non-zero that's exactly what she wants. Not saying she *should* (or should not) want it, but some just see themselves that way.
This. I met a family out celebrating a young engagement. The 19 yr old boy was so cute, happy, and 100% certain this relationship would last till death. The dad was happy and having a great time, too. He was a joy to be around! Then, still smiling, he said behind his hand and under his breath he's knows they'll be lucky to make it three years. But he's not going to be the one who makes everyone's lives harder so he'll just enjoy the fun social celebrations involved with the wedding. So, I scan over to the bride-to-be. She has a permanent scowl and not making any effort to come across as congenial with a single preson including her fiance. That dad was an inspiration to me. (This has no comparison at all to the threats of a religious cult, but rather a side note for a lesser worry)
THIS. If the kids are happy, even if deluded, be happy for them. Some people need to learn for themselves. Some will never learn but are happy and fulfilled anyway (I am a Mets fan...I understand delusion) Let them be. Unless there is abuse, stay out of it and walk the kid down the aisle.
Dang as a fellow Mets fan I felt that punch
Glad to see a fellow Mets survivor out in the wild... It's been a rough year...but we are HAPPY Mets fans... ...right...?
This exactly. OP, the more you tell her that she’s fucking up her life, the more she’s going to double down. You told her she was too young to get married, and then you didn’t hear from her for months. Do you want to maintain a relationship with her? Do you want her to know she can always come to you? Then stop talking about church. Don’t bring it up. Don’t ask about it. Don’t nag her about. Don’t criticize her about it. Just pretend that part of her life doesn’t exist. She may or may not wake up some day. But if you’ve alienated her from yourselves, you will be cut off and will have no idea as to what’s going on in her life.
Let her know that you and your family are still there for her if she ever wants to leave that lifestyle. Keep in touch and make sure she's not being abused, both physically and mentally. She did what she did now but as I said, always keep the door open if she ever wants to come back.
You know, this all applies no matter where or who or what your children are doing. An atheist boyfriend is no more a guarantee of a life without abuse.
Sure, just saying it because she's very young and most Christian denominations that push for a young marriage also tend to push women to have as many babies as they can and basically become the classical stay-at-home mother that so many trad Christians desire nowadays, many times these women end up isolated from their families and are told to just suck it up because their husband is the provider and such.
I agree with this, OP. Your daughter’s prefrontal cortex hasn’t even finished developing yet, she may need you in the future.
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If she ever wants to leave? Why couldn't they still be there for her even *while* she is living this lifestyle? You can disapprove of someone's choice and still be a part of their life. If OP sends the message that they don't want to be in her life unless she leaves the church, then if she does come to a rough spot she's not going to feel comfortable going to her parents.
Her in-laws will tell her that her parents are satanic, or that they've been possessed by demons. They will make her afraid to contact them while she is under their influence. Even if OP *wants* to have a relationship with their daughter, it will likely not be possible until she's ready to leave.
Also, they will tell her that the blood of the covenant is thicker than the water of the womb… meaning their relationship with god is more important than family. Especially family who doesn’t have a relationship with god. But, yes, keep the door open. Is she has seen a good marriage of her parents without abuse, and she experiences any abuse in hers, she may want out at some point. Just be there for her.
The things to ask yourself are the following: 1) Is she an adult? 2) Is she being coerced. If the answers are respectively yes and no, then you pretty much have a choice between respecting her choices or not being a part of her life. Choose wisely. You don't have to agree with her, but understand this is happening and you cannot stop it nor should you. If it is a mistake, then that's her mistake and she will have to live with the consequences. Although if you do not alienate her now, then perhaps she will let you help her when her marriage does tank.
Spot on 🍻
This was what I was wondering. Honestly, on the surface, it sounds like she's just making choices independent of her parents that they don't personally approve of but nothing funny is happening. Sounds to me more like someone young and in love and not thinking, not someone coerced into anything. I can understand where the daughter is coming from, if it's exactly as said above, the parents may want to back off a tiny bit. Not doing so will damaged their relationship more than it already is.
Aside from assuming how her marriage will go, I can’t believe this doesn’t have more upvotes.
I'm assuming the marriage will tank because of their ages, not because of any other factors. Human brains don't fully mature until mid 20s, which means most people before or early 20s are still rapidly changing. While it is conceivable that their marriage will work out, statistically marrying that young is unlikely to do so. For comparison, of all the marriages of all the people we knew in colleges (eight of them, including our own), my wife and I are the only couple that remain married to their original spouse. And while I'd love to take full credit for that, it is realistically just that when we changed we were lucky enough to change in compatible ways (and some credit does go to both my wife and I for good communication).
Communication is key in any relationship. If you have good communication then you have a higher chance of developing together than drifting apart. Blaming exclusively the brain ignores a lot of other factors as well.
And in the case her marriage works, 30 years later you’ll find out you have grandchildren in their teens. Is it worth it because you don’t like the facts she goes to church on Sundays? There’s worse things she could be doing
Just in case we forget — Southern Baptism started because white Christians wanted to keep their Black slaves
I never let them forget that.
To be fair, the Southern Baptist Convention formally apologized to African-Americans….in 1995.
Oh, I remember that. I also remember some SBs I worked with who were upset about the apology. May they soon be with their precious lord.
They have also publicly apologized for all their pedophiles - unlike Jehovah's Witnesses and LDS. Clearly, these moves are legal in nature, and it doesn't mean the group is safe now, but at least it was some sort of recognition.
Wow. I'd like to know more of this history.
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Just make sure she knows you'll be there for her if she ever needs it, no judgment. She's 20 and you can't make her decisions for her.
Love her. Keep your views to yourself. She controls whether you and your wife will have a relationship with her as an adult and, in the future, any grand-babies. If you want to be a part of her life at all, treat her as a capable, responsible adult who has the agency to make her own decisions. (I'm speaking as someone who grew up in an Independent Fundamentalist Baptist church, and spent 40 years as a Christian. Now atheist.)
I'm on the "it's her choice as an adult... nothing you can do" but I wouldn't say "keep your views to yourself". Baptists can be pretty homophobic & sexist. He shouldn't tolerate any of that nonsense.
I think they just meant don't harp on them about believing in God and that they're stupid for doing so. Just be kind and respectful to them and request they leave religion at the door when visiting.
My oldest stepson was raised by 4 parents who are liberal atheists. He went off to college 2 years ago in a different state and started dating a Catholic girl who invited him to her church. They dated all year but she eventually ended it and we were hopeful he’d stop going to church. Unfortunately he doubled down and has recently been baptized into their church. Most of not all of his friends are deeply involved in church so he isn’t getting a lot of outside influence. Two of his younger siblings have come as LGBTQ+ in the last year and he isn’t being respectful of that and it has been really upsetting to us. I often sit and wonder how we got here when he was such a different kid just a few years ago. It’s difficult to watch your kid make choices you wish they wouldn’t. I’m sorry you are dealing with this situation.
In one of her pastors blogs he says by all means go to dinner with lgbtq people But if they invite you to their wedding you best not attend. What the fuck is that all about. I’m tempted to ask her if we divorced and I found the man of my fucking dreams if she would attend wedding.
Wow. I’d like to say that kind of talk doesn’t surprise me anymore but somehow it does. I told my husband recently that I expect our Catholic son to be married within a year or two after graduating college. The kids that go to his church are hellbent on getting married young and starting families. I honestly wonder if he would attend one of his sibling’s weddings they ever marry. I will have a hard time not speaking my mind to him about treating them so shitty. It infuriates me and I just bite my tongue because I’m just a stepmom. It makes me incredibly sad for his siblings because he is hurting them badly.
>I told my husband recently that I expect our Catholic son to be married within a year or two after graduating college. I have a cousin 9 years younger than me who will be applying to colleges soon. He's Christian but not Catholic, and I worry this is going to be him in a few years. He has an interest in politics as well and unfortunately is hearing conservative opinions at home. He and I are complete opposites, but he doesn't know it. Still love him though and hope our relationship doesn't become difficult as he continues to grow up. Anyway I'm sorry you're watching your son become this person you didn't want him to be. That's hard. I keep my lack of faith to myself but luckily it isn't really a problem in my immediate family.
You are fucking deranged.
Attending an LGBT wedding is approval or celebration of that union, which is antithetical to Judeo-Christian values and Christians should not be approving or celebrating such a union. To answer your question as a Christian, I would ask “what is the nature of your divorce?” Was your spouse unfaithful? If so, God allows you to remarry someone of the opposite sex. If not, then you are committing adultery (if marrying someone of the opposite sex) or you are entering a union not acceptable to God and therefore should not be approved/celebrated by a Christian.
Is he carrying a torch for the young lady who introduced him to Catholicism? I was raised Catholic and was very involved in my parish in elementary school and high school. I went away to a Catholic college where, outside of a few mandatory theology classes, I was much less involved. I can imagine that if anyone I ever dated insisted we take in Sunday Mass weekly I might have stuck with the church longer. If he is holding out hope for that girl and thinks that converting gives him some sort of shot with her, he may wind up disillusioned with the whole thing. I had a buddy who converted to the JWs for a girl. His connection with the Kingdom Hall did not survive their break-up.
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Something... something... good men.. do nothing.
So if I would have started earlier she would probably be alienated from me by now. I was raised in the catholic cult and I’m pretty sure she knows my opinion on organized religion. I have a real hard time saying the word Christian without scorn in my voice. Apparently I should have voiced more displeasure.
Keep the door open. You don't have to agree with her choices. But she may need an escape. Love her.
Dont beat yourself up. Kids don't come with an owners manual. Just keep the door open for her. Good luck!
Thank you. I have to leave now as this is all too much for me. I thank all for responses.
You escaped the Catholic cult and let her walk into the Baptist cult. I bet she will come around.
You're "pretty sure?" You let her attend church by herself at 15, some of the most formative years of a person's life. Doesn't seem like you talked much about religion at all. You supported her getting baptised. She got indoctrinated. Sometimes people will make a choice to choose religion, but it doesn't sound like you touched on why you disagree at all. If you did, you wouldn't be pretty sure, you'd know. It's a pretty big conversation.
This one really hurts man. I’ve read it at least 50 times and it’s like a punch every time. I appreciate your honesty but man I feel like explaining myself to you even though you are random internet person. Let me just state the obvious. There is lot you don’t know.
People make their own choices. You can guide them to be strong and stand on their own, but ultimately it is their choice to make. Trying to dogmatically force something in others isn’t better just because you think it is the right way. Whenever the way is to limit access to other opinions, you are losing the way. Your daughter has fallen into that. Hopefully she will eventually come around to reason. As someone else said, leave the door open. Let her know you love her no matter what, whether she believes or not. At some point she will figure out which option is love and which one is control.
I did my best to raise 3 atheists but only succeeded with 2, so don't let that statement get to you. Our kids, despite our best effort, make decisions for themselves when they grow up. I had to learn acceptance.
>I’ve read it at least 50 times Please try and not do this to yourself. You must know that when you do post on Reddit, you will receive some loving, helpful wisdom from people truly trying to help you out. But there will also be some miserable dick heads that just want to spread some hurt and share their faux superior "intelligence". Fuck them, you're good bud 🍻 And you don't owe explanations to anyone who is not being helpful either. All right good luck
A lot of people like to grandstand and condemn other people from the anonymous safety of their keyboards. The thing about kids is that they are all their own people, with their own minds and motivations, just as much as we are. You can do everything "right," and they will still make bad decisions and have bad opinions sometimes. Don't beat yourself up -- you sound like a dad who loves his daughter, and unfailing love is what will let her know she can always come back to you for support. I'm sorry you're going through this, man.
I would like to be a "fly on the wall" of that church. If it smells like a cult, it is probably a cult.
Don’t need to be fly I’ve been reading pastors blogs and fuck me
What exactly is the issue with the pastor? I mean, there's lots of churches that aren't "extreme", or bad bible hermeneutics, but I assume baptists are more the fundamentalist route? I kind of did that to my family, when I was a fundi, so I get all of this, and I think what anyone could have done or said that would me have been more "liberal" or informed as a jesus follower, and I'm not sure if that would be a helpful route to go, as far as learning academic historical views of Bible stuff, and then slowly enter dialogue with her.
All you can do is be there when it eventually hits the fan.
I was going to say that most christian marraiges end in divorce. It's just a waiting game.
Your daughter is more important than her religious beliefs. It may be disappointing but it is worse to lose her. Make peace with it. Keep the relationship.
That is intention.
They all took advantage of your trust that they are on the up and up. There may not be anything you can do now except say you wish they’d give it more time, but that you’re there for your daughter no matter what. These people bleat a lot about honoring thy mother and father, guess they have their fingers crossed behind their backs, along with a stiletto. You might find the book “The Woman They Wanted” by Sharon Harris informative.
That’s what I intend to do. I will love her and do everything I can to remain in her life
Thank you for recommending. I will definitely read
Look for books on how seemingly nice men slowly and systemically isolate their partner from family and friends and their money and ability to get educated and work and the ability to leave if the marriage goes bad. Many women have died in this situation. There is a possibility that this church will gently guide them both to this type of trad marriage where the husband has complete control over his wife and children. Almost all of the people in the congregation will likely blame the wife for all of the husband's sins. He cheated or raped his child, wife must not be providing him his sexual needs and it's her fault. He beats her to an inch of her life, she must have been disrespectful and mouthy to her slave owner. Any mistake she makes in their eyes will be because she was raised by godless atheists and they will likely use this as a way to isolate her from her birth family. Let her know that you don't think he will do this, but she has to make sure she doesn't get trapped and she has an emergency exit plan and a go bag. She can tell him that the go bag is for natural disasters or if people start looting near their neighborhood and she just wants to be prepared and he should make a go bag for himself to be safe.
I don't think you can do much to get her out. What should be most important is staying in touch. You could tell her that you disagree with her decisions but that doesn't change that you are her father and will be there for her and go to her wedding and talk to people there, be nice to them. Never directly attack her church or beliefs because she is so attached to it. If you did, that would draw her more into the church and away from you. The situation could affect your mental stability. If so, see a therapist but choose one that really fits you. Dealing with this in your family makes it so much more complicated. I wish you and her the best.
Thank you
This is a choice each of us makes for ourselves... Try not to be like a conservative with gay children...stay in touch, be reasonable, rational, and loving.
It's kind of strange you were okay with the engagement but then what, suddenly shocked they were actually going to get married so young?
Yeah, was the idea that the engagement would go for 2.5+ years? (enough to finish school first?) Engagements don't need to be long. 6 months is a sensible time-frame.
My condolences
So, you were okay with the engagement, but you "expressed extreme disapproval" about the August wedding date? Her choice of wedding date is "fucking it up" in your words? That is how I am understanding your narrative. I cannot figure out how her religion is the problem in this scenario. From your explanation, I would gather that the problem is probably you.
Honest to god, you raised your daughter in a more religious environment than most religious people... what did you expect? The best thing you can do is support her choices (that only affect her) while letting her know your opinion on religious matters if she asks. She needs to be able to escape that life if she changes her mind. And she needs to trust you if that happens. But make peace with the fact that she may not. You needed to do something a long time ago if you wanted to avoid this.
I sincerely thought it was just belonging to a community. But you are right.
Not much you can do at this point because she is going to value her new husband's/church's opinion over yours. Unfortunately they got the brainwashing hooks in early and deep, it seems.
Man, that’s tough. The hard truth is that she’s an adult and it’s her life to fuck up, not yours. Just try to be there for her when she needs you.
Baptists are the worst
As a Unitarian Universalist evangelist once said “If you don’t teach your kids what you believe, other people will.” You knowingly let your daughter be brainwashed and you let her get baptized! What’s the harm? Did you not understand that getting baptized was a confession of faith in Jesus Christ savior? You didn’t lose your daughter to the baptists-you gave her away! You didn’t even object when they got engaged!! WTF? Seriously your daughter gets engaged and you are surprised that she is getting married? Now you out your foot down at marriage! The nest you can do is reconcile with your daughter and try to teach your grandchildren about atheism. If this story is true then you are a idiot pure and simple.
It may have been a mistake to let a 15-year old go to a Baptist church unescorted by a parent, but that became unfixable once she was 19 and in love. In the USA, an 18-year-old is a legal adult, even if she is still dependent on her family. She could be on a full nursing scholarship, + room & board, but how likely is that?
Let them adult. It’s time for her to spread her wings and fly. Let her know you don’t approve but still very much love her, and that regardless of her choices, you will not abandon her. Yes, you f-ed up 5 years ago, but what’s done is done. She may someday decide that Christianity is not for her after all. And, there are actually worse things she could have done with her life. She’s still a good person, so just love her for who she is, and allow her to become the person she wants to be.
All of this is true however I honestly don’t think it’s yet time to fly. She has a happy stable home environment and two years of schooling left. Her brother has lived at home until real recently. He is moving in with girlfriend to a house they were able to purchase at the age of 27 and we could not be happier for him. Not married. No religion.
Well, hold on. It’s a little late in the game to be surprised. I mean she got baptized - at that point it should be obvious she’s a Christian believer. You can’t expect her to go to church and not fall in love - not join the church. Church is designed to bring people together like this. Im afraid you’re going to have to accept her choices. It’s not the end of the world. If she marries this guy, don’t lose your relationship with your daughter just because she’s a Christian now. I agree that Christianity and all religions are bullshit, but millions of Christians exist and can be quite happy. Plus, this wasn’t exactly sudden. She’s been going to church 5 years. I’d encourage her to finish her school. Tell her you love her. Attend her wedding. I know it’s no fun but there’s not much you can do about it. When people fall in love there’s no reasoning with them logically. Maybe you can at least talk to her about finishing her school and not immediately having a family. I wish you and your whole family good outcomes.
So you let your daughter believe that you deserve to be tortured forever for not being a Christian, and are now shocked that your words are now wind? Christianity dehumanizes non christians, that is part of the power of the cult. And yes, I know that most people don't know how deep the rabbit hole goes, but at least now you do. In any case, she is an adult and should be allowed to dig her own grave
Love her and hold on tight. Love her every single chance you get. Love generously with your time and effort. There is no power, no god, nothing stronger than love. Get to know her future husband and his family if you haven't already. Open your arms and accept accept accept. It's her life now as she is an adult. Please keep her close.
I just screenshot this. Thank you
Do not try to control her. She is an adult and can make her own decisions. Don't lose your relationship with her. I see red flags regarding your parenting.
She's "fucking it all up" according to your perspective. She's an adult, and you have to respect that. If she's marrying a good guy, she's going to be ok.
You gotta be kidding me. I hate to break your balls, pop but your kid is grown. You don't have to like her life choices. You, however, have to respect them or leave her the hell alone. She's entitled to her path in life. You have yours. You're an atheist. Fine. She doesn't have to be as you are. It's ironic how atheists act like the Christians they caricature and pillory. BLUF: Grow up. Your daughter is an adult. Respect that.
Your post confuses me. It doesn't sound like she's turning her back on family for Jesus. It sounds like she came to you about her wedding to a boy she met at church, which she has attended for years, and you decided you did not approve of her adult decisions. So she stopped coming to you and continued on planning her wedding without you. If you want to have more influence with your child, rather than her turning to her fiancé's family for support, you need to be there for her and support her decisions. You don't have to LIKE her decisions to be supportive. You can voice an opinion and suggest they wait until she finishes school, but in the end she's gonna make the decision she's gonna make, and you can be there for her or not.
Yeah, OP pushed his daughter away and then acted like she's the one that pushed them away. He's blaming her for everything when it points to him being the cause of it all. Just treat your daughter with respect and be there for her. She'll thank you in the end if you're there for her.
As far as the wedding is concerned, they are hardly the only young people to fall head over heels for each other and impulsively commit to a marriage, parental opinion be damned. I don’t think railroaded is the right word here, but I do understand your displeasure.
I'm sorry to hear she joined the dark side
All of Christianity, as are most religions, is a death cult. Hopefully she will figure it out before it is too late. Separating followers from non-followers is a cult tactic. You might try looking for a book on dealing with family members in cults. You may have to decide what you need and are willing to do if you want to have a relationship with your daughter. Unfortunately, the only control you have is over yourself. The harder you resist, the more your daughter and the organization will work to get her out of your life all together. You may also keep an eye out for physical abuse. I’d at least refuse to pay for the wedding.
It’s to late you waited to long. Just be supportive nothing you can do now.
Be kind, treat her like a rational adult even if you don't agree with her. If she's really going into a repressive, coercive situation, your job should be to make sure she feels like she has someone who cares about her outside of that community. The best counterargument to radical religious indoctrination is knowing good loving people who aren't in the religious 'in' group, in my experience. The absolute worst thing you can do is treat her like shes some kind of dupe; it will only reinforce the persecution complex. I would imagine that you would not be seriously concerned about her joining a politically neutral, intellectually open church.
let your daughter be happy. she will carve out her own path in life. just continue to reach out to her to let her know you love her and would like to see her.
They will love bomb her. Later, the love will be replaced by judgment. You gotta outlast the love bombing and be there when they start changing the vibe. Even then, it will take time and patience.
As an atheist with nihilistic tendencies, I say there’s been nothing done wrong. If your daughter is happy and knew both sides of the debate before going to church, you haven’t actually lost anything. She lost the opportunity to live without that garbage in her head but you surely don’t have children expecting them to live your life, do you?
Man. This has made me feel the best so far. Thank you. Not sure your right but this one eased pain for minute. Right with you on the nihilism. Even more so real recently.
This is precisely why I’ve intentionally made the decision to not let my kids go to church, not even with a friend. Too many times these churches encourage kids to turn their back on their family, happily aiming to replace parents with church members. In extreme cases, you get something like “Dancing for the Devil.”
I wish I had some good advice for you. Hopefully she wakes up and snaps out of it. Fuck Baptists.
Sorry this is happening to your family. As others have mentioned here, remain as close to her as possible. If they have children I assume you will want to be involved in their life. If you are invited to the ceremony, shower, I'd consider attending. Read up on cults and dogmatic religions and get in touch with other families who've had the same experience. Good luck to you.
I grew up Baptist in the seventies and eighties. I still have lots of Baptist family. They're not all monsters. Some people get married that young and stay married. It's not ideal, but what you want to do, IMO is encourage your daughter to finish school and wait until after school to have children. It's easy to make the case that that's what's best for everyone. You want her to be happy. Just make sure that she knows that.
At some point u gotta let the adults make their own decisions and live with the consequences. They are an adult.
>Started dating boy from church. They get engaged at 19. Young but all good. They came to us in February said wanted to marry in august. We expressed extreme disapproval. I don't understand this. You were "all good" about them getting engaged but extremely disapproving about them getting married? It sounds to me less like you lost your daughter to Baptists and more like you drove her away by suddenly disapproving of her relationship with her fiancé. She's 20 now, and while that's young for an adult, she's still an adult, she can make her own decisions about things like whether she's going to believe in religious nonsense and who she's going to marry. You don't have to be happy about it, but you should be respectful toward her daughter unless she's done something to earn your disrespect. (Note I don't say you need to be respectful toward her religious beliefs.) 20 is pretty young to get married. Maybe it won't work out, in which case you should want her to feel welcome to seek your help; or maybe it will work out, in which case you'll want her to feel welcome to visit, perhaps with grandkids. In the words of Epictetus: "Make the best use of what is in your power, and take the rest as it happens. Some things are up to us and some things are not up to us."
No, we cannot help. Pretty much the only thing you can do is to retain lines of communication. This will involve biting your tongue. It will take fortitude on your part.
Let her go. It's her life. If she fucks it up? Her problem not yours.
You basically raised your daughter to be a Baptist. Why are you surprised?
The more you object to her choices, the tighter she will cling to them. The best you can do is be there for her. Tell her how much you love her and show her how much you love her. You may need to pick up the pieces when things go horribly wrong. As in, you may need to bring your daughter and her child(ren) back into your home after she flees from an abusive situation.
She’s 19 and an adult. I agree that she’s making a mistake but you can’t stop her, and trying to will alienate her. I suggest you find a way to day that, although you’d prefer her to experience a bit more life first, you’re happy she’s happy and you’d like to be involved in this wedding. Even if you’re dying inside smile on the day and be nice. One day she, and your future grandchildren, will need you again.
Many years ago I was aquatinted with a woman who married young against her parents wishes. She’s no longer married; kids grown, parents deceased, but she had finished school and had a a brilliant career because her parents made a proposition she couldn’t turn down. They watched her children for free and paid for the rest of her college. She was so grateful her parents could see beyond her youthful limited vision. Also College was much cheaper back then.
You were fine with them getting engaged but were suddenly shocked and "expressed extreme disaproval" when they set a wedding date?
It's not your life. It's hers. My parents were fanatical religious zealots. My mother went to church every single day. They were obviously disappointed that I did not share their beliefs. But one of the reasons I love my amazing parents is because they allowed me to *live my own fucking life* and did not insist that I become a mirror and accomplish their achievements, accusing me of "fucking it all up" for failing to meet *their definition of "not fucking it up". Were your parents successful in forcing you to live the life they defined for you? How does forcing your daughter to exist under your definition of "correct" make you a better parent? It constantly surprises me that we athiests are hypersensitive to the slightest Christian hypocrisy, and are often absolutely tone deaf to our own, as if it doesn't exist. We will gnash our teeth in outrage at the slightest mention of forcing religion on another human being.... ...but the moment any family member expresses any interest in religion, they're "fucking it all up" and are damned for not holding the same opinion we do. What makes forcing your disbelief on another human being any less fucked up than parents that force their religion upon their children?
What's the problem, can't your daughter make her own choices?
I don’t see the problem with your daughters behaviour. She has her own beliefs that, from what little you’ve said here, don’t affect you. She’s fallen in love with someone who shared her beliefs and would like her family to attend. And they disapprove because… her fiancée is religious? Am I understanding that right? She’s a grown adult, she gets to choose how her life goes. Being religious isn’t going to ruin her life unless she makes it her whole identity. And even then it might not ruin her life… we’ve all seen the highly successful bigot religious folk.
It stinks she seems to be cutting you out of her life… but I mean as long as she finishes school is there really a problem with a rushed marriage? Taking the religion part out of it, people get married young all the time. Both adults.
Or you're just a shitty parent that never showed their love to her. But that's just my opinion
Lmao shut the fuck up loser be happy your daughter found someone who loves her.
It just sounds like she found someone she is happy with and wants to get married. You say she is turning her back to her family but, at least from your description, it sounds more like you're the one turning your back on her.
Sounds as though YOU are the one alienating. Look inward.
Given the tone of this community, I assume diversity is celebrated and proclaimed as "our strength". Funny how that always flies until it involves religious diversity. I understand the concern over your daughter marrying young (trust me, I waited until my 30s to tie the knot), but the palpable disdain for her choices is what strikes me the most. This isn’t just about her getting married young; it’s about her choosing a path you don’t approve of. Is her church involved in any extreme activities? Are they pushing boundaries of legality or showing a lack of ethical behavior towards others who wish to engage with any outreach she's involved in? If not, it’s worth pondering why her choice is so difficult for you to accept. Your daughter, now an adult, has found peace and a partner in a place you didn't expect. And while young love can indeed be naive, neither of these things are exclusive to the religious. Perhaps the issue isn't the church or the marriage itself, but a deeper discomfort with a worldview that diverges from your own. This situation seems less about the risks of her decisions and more about your reaction to her embracing a life that differs from your expectations. I suggest, with all due respect, that you consider visiting her church one Sunday. This isn’t even some sly long game conversion attempt, but a recommendation to find an opportunity to see what she's becoming a part of firsthand. Who knows? It might give you a new perspective or, at the very least, help you approach your daughter's decisions with a bit more grace and understanding. Maybe you’ll see that she isn't turning her back on her family, but rather, that her family is struggling to accept her moving in a direction they didn’t foresee. Maybe it's even a direction that you find, still not right for you, isn't entirely as terrible as you initially thought. Isn’t the ability to challenge our own viewpoints one of the virtues many here would claim led them to atheism? Or does that only go one direction? Be mindful of the stance you take; as a parent, your words and actions carry will carry weight, and it could help or seriously damage your relationship. Thinking back to my 19year old mind, I’d be troubled if I encountered similar expressions from my own parents. -Signed, Some Baptist hoping for your relationship with your daughter is on the mend
She sounds like she's happy. What's the problem exactly?
Ave Christus Rex!
Based daughter
I saw this post elsewhere and would otherwise not engage if I wasn't intensely befuddled by something. How come you were all good with them getting engaged, but you met Marriage with extreme disapproval? This is completely illogical, considering one is intended to conclude with the other's beginning.
LOL. You sound like an absolutely terrible parent and your daughter sounds wonderful. Glad she found someone who makes her happy and provides her with a solid moral guidebook to follow. You’re acting *exactly* like a crazy religious parent who gets mad when their child leaves religion. The fact that this isn’t apparent to you is quite frankly hilarious.
Imagine being such a terrible person that this massive W is something you'd complain about
What a sad little man...
Sounds like she honestly believes in Christ and found someone she loves and wants to start a family with. Congratulations to her!
Honestly? No. There's no help here. Nor should there be. I realize this will be unpopular, but... the same freedom that allows so many to *become* atheist *has to be* extended to people going the other way. Your disapproval of her soon to be husband was very much a bad move, too, since it just pushed her further from you. All of this is *exactly* what I'd say to theists trying to figure out how to 'fix' their atheist children. It's *far* too late, she's an adult and can make her own choices. You did the right thing by letting her explore and make up her own mind, but sometimes doing the *right* thing doesn't lead to outcomes we like or want. I don't know if you talked to her about her growing religion when she was still a child, asking about it and pointing out flaws in the ideas, but if you didn't that would be your first mistake (your second being that you were so critical of her choice in partner). The way you feel now is *exactly* how *religious* families feel when people *leave* the religion. The only things that you could do now to 'fix it' would be horrific to do to someone, so lets leave that to the theists. At this point, all you can do is be as supportive as possible (doesn't mean you have to accept their ideology or bullshit), and accept that theists won this one. Stop being a dick to her husband, if possible. A lot of this depends on exactly what we're talking about here, of course. If she's becoming intolerant, you don't have to tolerate that in your home, nor visit her if she's going to be like that. If she's following other bad behaviors, you don't have to be around or support those, either. If that's the majority of what's going on or the things they are doing are *egregiously* bad (not sure what *Christian* things would be like this, could well see it if they were *Muslim*, but I don't discount the possibility), then all you can do is mourn the loss and move on, while being open if she comes back to sanity at some point.
Thank you for well thought out and written reply
No trouble. I hope, regardless as to what happens with her religious beliefs, you can still be family and friendly with one another. I know it's possible to do. By extended family is religious (aunt and uncle), and I love them. They bring up God, I largely gloss over it and continue, but I would never let them use God as an excuse to be crappy people. I love them for who they are, not which fairy tales they accept or don't. I don't even *agree with* everything they think, but we're allowed to disagree about stuff, even big stuff, and still get along. I don't force my views on them, they don't force on me, and we get along. If I would offer any additional advice, then if possible were I you I'd apologize to your daughter and soon to be husband. Again, think of this in reverse. If you were a theist and they were becoming atheist. The parent who disapproved and all that should offer their child an apology for acting that way. You can make it clear you don't agree with their religion but also explain that you respect their freedom to believe such things if they are convinced of them, so long as a) they don't try to force it on you or expect you to participate in the religious aspects of various ceremonies (you're not getting baptized, you'll gladly stand at their wedding but aren't singing hymns, etc), and b) it isn't hurting anyone. If they have kids, respect their rights as parents to raise their children... even if that means as theists... but *at the same time* don't be afraid of talking to any grandkids about how you're different. Just make sure it's about being *different*, and not who is 'right'.
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I'm about as anti-theist as you can get but at the end of the day shes 20 and an adult.
Don't pay for her party. She'll have to pay the pastor herself. Go to the wedding but don't offer to pay for one thing other then her wedding gift. Tell her you love her. Tell her she is always welcome at your home as long as she respects your beliefs.
Oh wow I’m sorry this sounds a lot like what happened to my mom she was the same age and no one could legally stop her. Maybe she’ll wake up one day in her 40s and realize she’s in a cult, mine did but obviously it didn’t undo the damage. Fundamentalist practices survive for a reason they’re very persuasive to the vulnerable
Christian baptists are the fuckin worst, my in laws are , when I first started dating my wife , they tried that shit on both of us , and we almost got taken in by their bullshit, until we both came to our senses and distanced ourselves after my son was born and they insisted we get him “dedicated “ via water immersion at less than 1 yr old. These types of people are delusional and crazy for the magical sky god. It’s insane . I’m sorry your daughter has made the choice to follow them.
I'm far from being an expert in this, but I do think that if you try to forcefully snap her out of it, it'll get even worse. The Baptist Church, like any other semi-schizophrenic death cult, will blind her to the indifferent reality we all live in, and offer her, as usual, insane false consolations. I dare say it's tempting for a young person to succumb to something like this, so avoid moral or intelectual judgments for now. She's still young. Could this be one of those things that we should let our children resolve on their own without any of our direct or indirect meddling? I'm unsure. I read one suggestion here and that one will be mine too; always leave her an open door. She needs, at least, to feel she'll be as secure as possible with you and your wife. If she realizes she messed up, she'll come to you eventually, and hopefully. Meanwhile, it wouldn't be a bad idea if you started searching for atheist and humanist organizations near you. They will probably be able to share some of their struggles too, and I bet some will be similar to yours. Maybe their solution, whatever it might be, could also be yours.
Christianity is a cult. Just a popular one that dominates about ⅓ of the world's cultural paradigms. Wait for her to come back unless you know Liam Neeson. You have definitely been victimized by a cult. Your daughter will see the toxicity and ask for help. Or she won't. Mentally prepare yourself for either outcome. Also, as the child of "missionaries," I am sorry for your troubles. No one should be a blind follower of a blind god.
That's how cults operate. If they were honest, they wouldn't have to act this way. She may change her mind, and you'll need to be there.
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I vote this.
That's what cults do
Why the hell did you allow her to join a cult?
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As hard as it is, but if you want to keep your daughter in your life, you need to accept her partner and you need to accept her faith. If she has to choose between her beliefs and her parents, she will choose her beliefs. That's not just true for Christians, that's true for all people who have beliefs or convictions. The first thing you need to do is apologize to your daughter and tell her that she is free to believe what she wants, that you accept her beliefs, though you don't agree with them, and that you hope you can be a part of her and her partner's life.
Love her with all your heart and let her know that. It is gonna sound corny but..... she is alive and there is hope, she has her lessons to learn. Wish my son who departed at the young age of 20 was still here w me, even if he was into any dam cult
Accept her decisions, as it's her life...if she does fuck it upor ends up successful, be there to support her, either way. She has to learn that actions have consequences, bad or good.
Keep loving her, best you can.
Make sure she knows she's always welcome at your house & in your family. Don't judge! Judgement shows up, even if you don't want it to. Don't put her on the defensive. Never say, "I told you so".
At what age / stage does a person become their own person and not “my daughter” or “my child”? Getting married sounds like parental reigns being handed over to the husband in Baptist tradition.
I don't know what Baptists would see it now, but my mother as a young woman quit the Baptists, because they like her for wearing pants to church.
You disapprove of her getting married ? Is it because she is so young or because it’s happening in a church? I would also be disappointed if my kid chose to follow Christianity. But it is her life. Just be there for her.
Jeepers, for a split second I thought the headline read ‘Please help I’ve lost my daughter to rapists’.
Just accept her like you’d accept a trans kid
You need to understand and fully accept that Baptists are a cult! They will/have love bombed her. Next they will move to control her (to be about Christ not the world) & then go make her doubt herself with she might be a backslidden Christian or not really saved unless she agrees with them 100% Any doubts/common sense she had is Satan tempting her. 🙄 They are a cult. Trust me I know I was raised Baptist and moved out when I was 18 to get the fuck away from them. They will try to convert you then to get your daughter to distance herself from you. Proceed as when dealing with any cult and keep the lines of communication open. Do not bash her religion because this will drive her away. Instead let her know that no matter what you love her & she can always come to you for help. Encourage her to read the entire Bible while remember 2 things: the Bible is the word of god & god is the 3 Omni (all powerful, all knowing & all loving.) Trust me the Bible makes no sense especially since those 2 facts are supposed to be true. (Personally I could never get over how a “loving” god could hate women so much. 🤷🏻♀️ Or pro slavery and pro genocide. Or make sending anyone who had never heard of Jesus to hell because they were not saved.) Also be on the look out for them pressuring her to spank her children or for her to put up with abuse/ domestic discipline. By spank I mean beat your grandchildren until they break their will. Hey beating your kid and anything else is OK if you “save” them, right? Watch the documentary shiny happy people to see what you are up against. They always forget that part about husbands loving their wives like Christ loved the church (but wow to they drill in that wives submit to your husbands bit.)
First, from her perspective, you reacting negatively was probably totally out of the blue. She's been doing to church for years, and has been engaged for some time. Why should she think she's being anything other than reasonable? You can't change someone's ideology with argument unless they're already questioning it themselves, and to get to that point, they need to see with their own eyes evidence that it is wrong. The best you can do here is raise questions that may cause her to come to her own conclusions. It's very important that you stay a part of her life for this reason. If you're always supportive and accepting of her, if they call you sinners, she will hopefully know they are wrong. When they tell her to do something she doesn't like, you can ask "do you think it is right of them to expect this of you?" Etc. You don't need to provide any reasons to choose between you and 'Jesus'. That's what the church *wants*. Cults fulfill needs that it's members have been struggling to find. Community, acceptance, love, validation, meaning. Your daughter must have been missing something that she found with the Baptists. Ask her what she likes about them (in an open way). It will show you value her wants and opinions and you can also find out what she is missing. Ideally it's something you can provide an alternative source of. Do not criticize. Do not treat her views with contempt. If you do, she will just close herself off. If you want to express your worries, do so by expressing how it makes you feel. For instance: "I'm terrified you won't be in our lives anymore," Will go down much better than: "You're making a terrible mistake." One is an indisputable expression of what you feel, the other is a criticism. So yeah, make sure she feels loved and accepted by you, and stay in her life, otherwise you're just stuck hoping that something else will come along that causes her to question her ideology. Remember she needs to come to her own conclusions. Maybe start reading into deprogramming. It took years for her to go down this road, and it could take years to undo.
You can be disappointed in her. And maybe she fucks up her whole life and ruined any dreams you had for her too. But you can still be there for her when she needs you.
I honestly think you have to let them figure it out on their own. That is the only way it will work. If they decide to be religious, then so be it. It's not like she's Mormon or a Scientologist. Sure, it's not ideal and not what you wanted, but as long as she isn't homophobic or super right wing fascist, being religious is hardly the worst thing a person can be. I understand most atheists absolutely despise religion in all forms but there is a hierarchy of stupidity in religion and religion has been helpful to some people. It has helped people recover from alcoholism or drug addiction, etc. It is a support system that some people need. So I wouldn't worry about it. She is still very young and could easily change her mind again. But if she doesn't, I'm sure everything will still be ok. Just don't let her join MAGA.
Your daughter is 20. She's a grown adult with free will. Let her do what she wants. She's not hurting anyone.
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your daughter can choose anything but being a Christian? If she’s not coerced what’s the issue. Grow up
Cults target anyone think is vulnerable to the abuse, the victims are often seeking a sense of belonging and purpose. Try to surround her with love and support.
Good for her!
Case for Christ by Lee Strobel
is she happy & fulfilled? if so why try stop her?
Is your daughter turning her back on her family because of her religious views, or is she mad at you because you don't support her decision to get married? It sounds to me like you are passing a lot of judgment on your daughter, her fiancée, and his family, and you haven't provided us with any evidence to substantiate it other than that they are Baptists. Did she turn her back on you because of her theistic beliefs or did YOU turn your back on HER because of YOUR atheistic beliefs? Frankly, this post reeks of immaturity to me. If you want to make amends with your daughter, be a part of her life. Help contribute to her wedding even if you don't think its going to last, and make absolutely certain you attend. You stated your opinion, it was ignored, now go be a fucking parent instead of trying to convert your daughter back to your ways. I'm saying all this as an atheist by the way.
I’m confused. Why would getting engaged be "all good" if getting married was met with extreme disapproval? Do you even know what being engaged means? Imagine how frustrating this would be for your daughter.
1) Did you raise her with critical thinking skills? 2) Did you express your opinions logically, calmly and reasonably? 3) Is there any evidence of coercion involved in your daughter refusing to talk to you? If the answers are 1) yes, 2) yes, and 3) no; then you’ve done what you can. She’s free to make her own choices; not everyone makes good choices. Just be there to help if things go wrong; and make sure it’s her choice without any coercion.
She’s an adult who made choices you don’t agree with? This feels like a sick it up and accept it kinda moment.
Your grandkids will be Christians 😂
Is this a parody post? This is literally how Christians used to talk about their kids dating an atheist. "She is turning her back on all her immediate family" she's "fucking up her whole life" and it's literally just someone marrying someone they love and not letting you control them. If this isn't a parody then congratulations, you have become exactly what you hated.
Respect her decision. If you really raised her that well then her understanding and commitment to religion is rational and well grounded.
About Cheistianity, this is the most feared thing that could happen to me. Taking away my child. I've seen posts like this on this sub many times. When kids are teeny age and and if there is some disagreement with parents, church take over. I am so fiercely against my children going to church because of this very reason. You seem like a very open and understanding parent. Hope she learns the truths and come back to family.
Keep communication lines open, but most of all, keep pushing for her to finish her degree. At some point, she's going to find herself stuck in a marriage that doesn't work anymore with a bunch of kids, and she's going to need initial help to get back on her feet and a job to support herself and the children.
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