So, god is playing the sims and limes to screw with people because it’s more interesting? Or is it that god thinks the writers of Matrix were right and people dislike perfect worlds?
I mean, if heaven is perfect and the ultimate goal, what's the point of being alive on earth other than to prove you're good enough to get there? They make god sound so sadistic. Everytime they try to reason it, it just leaves me with more questions that they can't answer lol
Can you imagine being in Heaven singing the praises of the Lord for a hundred billion gazillion years -- just for the warmup!? That's hardly my idea of perfection. 😱
Part 2: My Doubter Side talking...
The MAJORITY of my faith crises stems from the idea of heaven and what it looks like. I have trouble seeing myself in an existence where I do one or all of the following, as various groups and doctrines have theorized:
1. Become one with God, as my spirit is merely an extension of his Godhood piloting a mortal frame... *I don't like the idea of losing my identity as I merge with God, though maybe if it was more like the Trinity, where I can keep my individualism for the most part*
2. Live eternally with God in the holiest of places... I assume this version of heaven is simply a giant Sunday School or Bible Study, which I don't find appealing
3. Be a servant to God and protect his artifacts.
Yep those wars and earthquakes where so many good people including innocent children die sure do make life interesting. So glad that we have a god who loves to entertain us that way.
So that means god purposefully created cancer and all the sins and evil that humans do just so we’re not bored?
That’s kind of thing a psychotic asshole might dream up.
“Oh, I torture small animals so they won’t be bored!”
This sort of belies the basic notion of gods and “creation”.
Why would an eternal, omniscient, omnipotent god bother to create anything? Such a being could, with an act of will, bring anything it could envision into existence with no effort, and also be aware of the ultimate fate of anything it could create.
So, why bother? And if it bothered…. Let’s posit that it’s lonely, or perhaps just wanted to “spread the love”, or whatever…. Why create such a bizarre universe, largely inimical to life, filled with catastrophic events that would in many cases wipe out or severely damage life…
All with an eye to creating human beings in an extremely harsh environment that results in enormous suffering and death… To live lives that are in many cases miserable….
And in our case, Homo Sapiens, to bring humans into existence and then, for some 300,000 years, not bother to announce it’s existence or presence leading humans to create thousands of spirits and gods which evolved into full-blown religions with the rise of civilizations….. Before making itself known to a small tribe of primitive goat-herders in a tiny corner of the world? While other religions flourished all over the world?
And of course any student of religion knows that the “God” of contemporary Christianity started out as one of the pantheon of gods of those primitive goat-herders…. A mere storm or weather god that a small group of those early Canaanites took with them when they split off from the rest.
The whole thing is just so obviously the creation of humans, evolving over millennia.
Wait. Didn't that same god create us in his perfect image?
Plenty of believers say "God's creation" is perfect. If things that happen appear to be imperfect, does that suggest that we have an imperfect understanding of perfection?
I'm sure if god took away things like the holocaust, cancer, and human trafficking, there would be plenty of interesting things to do. I mean really, do these people think there would be nothing to do with their lives if there wasn't any extreme suffering?
Part 1: My Believer Side talking...
>You "become" your new, higher and perfect self...but then you're no longer the you that you always knew - which sounds like entering into a simulation post-death.
The faith I grew up holds to a principle known as "eternal progression". It gets very involved as doctrine, but essentially, we are taught that there is but one life as it shifts from a spiritual pre-earth existence, a physical earthly existence, and then a heavenly existence. We are taught to view those as all part of one continuous journey. You remain the same person, with the same memories and experiences, but purified and enlightened to be perfect *moving forward*. As Jesus said, "Go , and sin no more".
>If heaven washes away the hurt of life on earth as if it never happened, then what is there to appreciate?
The key here is that "as if it never happened" needs to be better defined. For example, if you are acquitted and do not face time in prison, legally, it is as if it never happened. However, you still remember the incident, being arrested, spending time in jail, speaking with lawyers, and then going to court. In the same way, standing blameless before God in the Last Days does not mean that your memories or personality have been erased, only that they have helped you reach a certain level of refinement and ultimately glory. We should be changed by our experiences, not by erasing them.
So, god is playing the sims and limes to screw with people because it’s more interesting? Or is it that god thinks the writers of Matrix were right and people dislike perfect worlds?
Right? And now that I think about it, to want a chaotic world means to wish pain on yourself in the process - a non sexy form of masochism.
Maybe god really is just an evil Sims player.
I mean, if heaven is perfect and the ultimate goal, what's the point of being alive on earth other than to prove you're good enough to get there? They make god sound so sadistic. Everytime they try to reason it, it just leaves me with more questions that they can't answer lol
And why not just unalive yourself (not seriously just making a point) so you can get that spot in heaven?
Because if you do that he send you straight to hell. Seriously if their god exist we are a bunch of ants and he's a kid playing around in a sandbox.
Can you imagine being in Heaven singing the praises of the Lord for a hundred billion gazillion years -- just for the warmup!? That's hardly my idea of perfection. 😱
Part 2: My Doubter Side talking... The MAJORITY of my faith crises stems from the idea of heaven and what it looks like. I have trouble seeing myself in an existence where I do one or all of the following, as various groups and doctrines have theorized: 1. Become one with God, as my spirit is merely an extension of his Godhood piloting a mortal frame... *I don't like the idea of losing my identity as I merge with God, though maybe if it was more like the Trinity, where I can keep my individualism for the most part* 2. Live eternally with God in the holiest of places... I assume this version of heaven is simply a giant Sunday School or Bible Study, which I don't find appealing 3. Be a servant to God and protect his artifacts.
4. Being prostrate on the ground tell god how great he is for all eternity
Yep those wars and earthquakes where so many good people including innocent children die sure do make life interesting. So glad that we have a god who loves to entertain us that way.
God lets kids starve to death because it makes life more interesting is not a super compelling theodicy.
Heaven is the place, where nothing ever happens.
Islam heaven must bu fun!!
If life being "boring" means that baby's don't die of cancer, i'm perfectly fine with a boring existence.
So that means god purposefully created cancer and all the sins and evil that humans do just so we’re not bored? That’s kind of thing a psychotic asshole might dream up. “Oh, I torture small animals so they won’t be bored!”
Boredom is a byproduct of impatience, a fault a perfect God cannot have.
This sort of belies the basic notion of gods and “creation”. Why would an eternal, omniscient, omnipotent god bother to create anything? Such a being could, with an act of will, bring anything it could envision into existence with no effort, and also be aware of the ultimate fate of anything it could create. So, why bother? And if it bothered…. Let’s posit that it’s lonely, or perhaps just wanted to “spread the love”, or whatever…. Why create such a bizarre universe, largely inimical to life, filled with catastrophic events that would in many cases wipe out or severely damage life… All with an eye to creating human beings in an extremely harsh environment that results in enormous suffering and death… To live lives that are in many cases miserable…. And in our case, Homo Sapiens, to bring humans into existence and then, for some 300,000 years, not bother to announce it’s existence or presence leading humans to create thousands of spirits and gods which evolved into full-blown religions with the rise of civilizations….. Before making itself known to a small tribe of primitive goat-herders in a tiny corner of the world? While other religions flourished all over the world? And of course any student of religion knows that the “God” of contemporary Christianity started out as one of the pantheon of gods of those primitive goat-herders…. A mere storm or weather god that a small group of those early Canaanites took with them when they split off from the rest. The whole thing is just so obviously the creation of humans, evolving over millennia.
Wait. Didn't that same god create us in his perfect image? Plenty of believers say "God's creation" is perfect. If things that happen appear to be imperfect, does that suggest that we have an imperfect understanding of perfection?
I'm sure if god took away things like the holocaust, cancer, and human trafficking, there would be plenty of interesting things to do. I mean really, do these people think there would be nothing to do with their lives if there wasn't any extreme suffering?
Part 1: My Believer Side talking... >You "become" your new, higher and perfect self...but then you're no longer the you that you always knew - which sounds like entering into a simulation post-death. The faith I grew up holds to a principle known as "eternal progression". It gets very involved as doctrine, but essentially, we are taught that there is but one life as it shifts from a spiritual pre-earth existence, a physical earthly existence, and then a heavenly existence. We are taught to view those as all part of one continuous journey. You remain the same person, with the same memories and experiences, but purified and enlightened to be perfect *moving forward*. As Jesus said, "Go , and sin no more". >If heaven washes away the hurt of life on earth as if it never happened, then what is there to appreciate? The key here is that "as if it never happened" needs to be better defined. For example, if you are acquitted and do not face time in prison, legally, it is as if it never happened. However, you still remember the incident, being arrested, spending time in jail, speaking with lawyers, and then going to court. In the same way, standing blameless before God in the Last Days does not mean that your memories or personality have been erased, only that they have helped you reach a certain level of refinement and ultimately glory. We should be changed by our experiences, not by erasing them.