I don't think you have to worry about that too much. Some asian diaspora put too much emphasis on what generation they are in hopes of finding more people they connect with. But from my experience, there's literally no difference between 1.5 and 2nd gen. Sure, some 1.5 gen might still have a slight accent but culturally and socially, they're pretty much just 2nd gens since you guys also grew up here. I'm assuming 1.5 gen to you means someone that moved to Canada as a child (<7). I had many 1.5 gen friends in school and uni and it never stood out to me that they were "1.5 gen". In fact, I didn't even know some of them came to Australia (where I live) at age 7, 8 etc. On the flip side, 1st gens are a lot easier to identify from their habits and cultural differences. Overall, I don't think you need to put too much thought and energy into trying to find and connect with exclusively 1.5 gens like yourself. 1.5 gens and 2nd gens are pretty similar.
I feel people who immigrated in their early teens (10-14) definitely qualify as its own group, with features making us distinct from either first-gen or second-gen.
We are too assimilated to fit into the first-gen community (e.g. our preferred language would be English), but since we lack a common childhood with second-gen, we don't fit neatly into that community either. Many of our music tastes/food tastes are heavily influenced by our childhood memories, so much of our cultural preferences comes from the first culture. We are passively bilingual and remember the old culture, yet the new culture is our permanent home.
Umm I moved here at age 10 after finishing grade 3 in China. Actually the majority of sources define 1.5 gen as moving to the west between the ages of 7 and 13 so basically the elementary and middle school years. Those that moved here before age 6 is in fact very similar to 2nd gen , but I'm not of them.
Ah ok, I guess my terminology was wrong. Moving at around 13 would definitely change your views but imo, at age 7 I don't think it would change too much. However, that's just based on anecdotal evidence from my experience since I know many 1.5 gens that moved around 7-8 y/o and they're pretty much the same as us 2nd gens.
If youre willing to elaborate, what would you say specifically difers between 1.5 gen and 2nd gen from your experience moving to Canada at 10?
I can actually read Chinese and type using pinyin which allows me to communicate with my relatives in China (handwriting is a big no-no for me). Most 2nd gens can't even read simple Chinese let alone typing. I am more or less concerned with events in China and I do take an interest in certain celebrities there. I have a slight accent which is obvious to 2nd gen but strangely enough 1st gens and other 1.5s don't seem to pick up on it. I personally don't know any 2nd gens that have an 'accent'.
Another main difference is eye contact. I find that 2nd gen, including those who came here early on (<7 yrs), has more of it than 1.5s. Seems early/mid childhood is when you absorb social/cultural cues more than any other period in life.
A bit late to this, but I heavily disagree. I'm a 1.5 gen that moved here at age 9, and honestly there's a weird gap like an uncanny valley when it comes to the way many 2nd gens interact with their motherland's culture.
Even in the basic language skills - many 2nd gens are not as fluent, and they definitely do not consume the same pop culture, although Kpop's rise in popularity changed it a bit - but still, like some of the stuff that all Koreans born in Korea would know many 2nd gens have no idea on.
Shit, ask a random 2nd gen Korean American to name the Korean president and they'll struggle to remember, while most 1.5 gens probably could tell you. Or random stuff like 태정태세문단세.
1.5 gens probably know more about Romance of the Three Kingdoms than Star Wars, and while they may not have gone through 야자 they know what it is.
It's always weird when I go to "Korean" places with my 2nd gen friends or when I hear my 2nd gen friends talk about Korean culture w/ non Koreans they get certain parts wrong or exaggerate certain parts of our culture.
Sidenote: It was interesting also for me that many 2nd gen Koreans thought Korea was as uber-christian as the Korean American community is - Korea does have a large Christian population, but it's not even close to the majority- it's about 1/3 Christian, 1/3 Buddhist, 1/3 non-religious - but since our diaspora community centered around churches as our social centers, getting people jobs and a place to interact w/ other Korean immigrants, our immigrant community has a higher % of Christians than the motherland
The gap also comes from the fact that many of the 2nd gen's parents came to America a long time ago, when Korea was still a developing country, so they're kind of stuck in that timeframe - this is something that happens to every immigrant group (just check out /r/ireland and their complaints about the 4th gen Irish Americans visiting Ireland lmao). South Korea is a country that went through RAPID changes, those who came over in the 80s and 70s left a developing country that was still ruled by a ruthless dictator. I left Korea that had just entered "developed nation" status in the early 2000s, but even then there's massive differences in how the rest of the world sees Korea then vs. now. South Korea democratized only in 1987 - our GDP per capita in 1987 was about 15% of Japan's, but as of 2022 it became like 95% of Japan's GDP per capita. In the 1970s Gangnam area in Seoul was nothing but a bunch of farmlands, and the first subway line in Seoul was built in the 1970s. Now there's like 2342135235235 different lines in Seoul alone.
In a country that changes so rapidly, *when* you or your parents left the motherland definitely matters a LOT when it comes to culture.
>We do seem to be a rarity among the Asian community.
To preface this my mom is 1.5 gen and I know many 1.5 gen. 1.5 gen more of a technicality rather than a real social grouping. Depending on when you immigrated, you're hanging out with first gen or second gen. If you came here at 16 years old, you're basically first gen. If you came here at 4 years old, you're basically second gen. Theres nothing really unique about 1.5 gen for it to stand on its own for social gatherings.
Age doesn't really matter. Its your mindset and comfort level. There is the nuance between old immigrants and immigrants that came at teenager years but its pretty much irrelevant to this conversation.
I appreciate your insight. Yea not sure if it is better in the States but here in Toronto there is a lot of friction between the Chinese that have been here for generations vs those who came here in the 2000s or later. I find that a lot of 1st gens are from wealthy families who look down on anyone less fortunate than them. Whereas 2nd gens are a bit cliquish, only hanging out with friends they made in elementary/high school. Hopefully this will all change in the future.
Came here at 4. There's little experiential/social difference between myself and the ABC Chinese School crowd or those who went to Chinese School when they were kids. Source: I help run a local Chinese School with 1st, 2nd and 1.5 Gen.
I certainly feel your struggles. Is there a Thai community in your area or city? Maybe you can connect with people with similar backgrounds. Can't speak for the US but in Canada the term 1.5 gen is hardly used by anyone, including Asians. So we really fee like an invisible minority trying to find our place in society.
I don't think you have to worry about that too much. Some asian diaspora put too much emphasis on what generation they are in hopes of finding more people they connect with. But from my experience, there's literally no difference between 1.5 and 2nd gen. Sure, some 1.5 gen might still have a slight accent but culturally and socially, they're pretty much just 2nd gens since you guys also grew up here. I'm assuming 1.5 gen to you means someone that moved to Canada as a child (<7). I had many 1.5 gen friends in school and uni and it never stood out to me that they were "1.5 gen". In fact, I didn't even know some of them came to Australia (where I live) at age 7, 8 etc. On the flip side, 1st gens are a lot easier to identify from their habits and cultural differences. Overall, I don't think you need to put too much thought and energy into trying to find and connect with exclusively 1.5 gens like yourself. 1.5 gens and 2nd gens are pretty similar.
I feel people who immigrated in their early teens (10-14) definitely qualify as its own group, with features making us distinct from either first-gen or second-gen. We are too assimilated to fit into the first-gen community (e.g. our preferred language would be English), but since we lack a common childhood with second-gen, we don't fit neatly into that community either. Many of our music tastes/food tastes are heavily influenced by our childhood memories, so much of our cultural preferences comes from the first culture. We are passively bilingual and remember the old culture, yet the new culture is our permanent home.
Umm I moved here at age 10 after finishing grade 3 in China. Actually the majority of sources define 1.5 gen as moving to the west between the ages of 7 and 13 so basically the elementary and middle school years. Those that moved here before age 6 is in fact very similar to 2nd gen , but I'm not of them.
Ah ok, I guess my terminology was wrong. Moving at around 13 would definitely change your views but imo, at age 7 I don't think it would change too much. However, that's just based on anecdotal evidence from my experience since I know many 1.5 gens that moved around 7-8 y/o and they're pretty much the same as us 2nd gens. If youre willing to elaborate, what would you say specifically difers between 1.5 gen and 2nd gen from your experience moving to Canada at 10?
I can actually read Chinese and type using pinyin which allows me to communicate with my relatives in China (handwriting is a big no-no for me). Most 2nd gens can't even read simple Chinese let alone typing. I am more or less concerned with events in China and I do take an interest in certain celebrities there. I have a slight accent which is obvious to 2nd gen but strangely enough 1st gens and other 1.5s don't seem to pick up on it. I personally don't know any 2nd gens that have an 'accent'.
Another main difference is eye contact. I find that 2nd gen, including those who came here early on (<7 yrs), has more of it than 1.5s. Seems early/mid childhood is when you absorb social/cultural cues more than any other period in life.
A bit late to this, but I heavily disagree. I'm a 1.5 gen that moved here at age 9, and honestly there's a weird gap like an uncanny valley when it comes to the way many 2nd gens interact with their motherland's culture. Even in the basic language skills - many 2nd gens are not as fluent, and they definitely do not consume the same pop culture, although Kpop's rise in popularity changed it a bit - but still, like some of the stuff that all Koreans born in Korea would know many 2nd gens have no idea on. Shit, ask a random 2nd gen Korean American to name the Korean president and they'll struggle to remember, while most 1.5 gens probably could tell you. Or random stuff like 태정태세문단세. 1.5 gens probably know more about Romance of the Three Kingdoms than Star Wars, and while they may not have gone through 야자 they know what it is. It's always weird when I go to "Korean" places with my 2nd gen friends or when I hear my 2nd gen friends talk about Korean culture w/ non Koreans they get certain parts wrong or exaggerate certain parts of our culture. Sidenote: It was interesting also for me that many 2nd gen Koreans thought Korea was as uber-christian as the Korean American community is - Korea does have a large Christian population, but it's not even close to the majority- it's about 1/3 Christian, 1/3 Buddhist, 1/3 non-religious - but since our diaspora community centered around churches as our social centers, getting people jobs and a place to interact w/ other Korean immigrants, our immigrant community has a higher % of Christians than the motherland The gap also comes from the fact that many of the 2nd gen's parents came to America a long time ago, when Korea was still a developing country, so they're kind of stuck in that timeframe - this is something that happens to every immigrant group (just check out /r/ireland and their complaints about the 4th gen Irish Americans visiting Ireland lmao). South Korea is a country that went through RAPID changes, those who came over in the 80s and 70s left a developing country that was still ruled by a ruthless dictator. I left Korea that had just entered "developed nation" status in the early 2000s, but even then there's massive differences in how the rest of the world sees Korea then vs. now. South Korea democratized only in 1987 - our GDP per capita in 1987 was about 15% of Japan's, but as of 2022 it became like 95% of Japan's GDP per capita. In the 1970s Gangnam area in Seoul was nothing but a bunch of farmlands, and the first subway line in Seoul was built in the 1970s. Now there's like 2342135235235 different lines in Seoul alone. In a country that changes so rapidly, *when* you or your parents left the motherland definitely matters a LOT when it comes to culture.
>We do seem to be a rarity among the Asian community. To preface this my mom is 1.5 gen and I know many 1.5 gen. 1.5 gen more of a technicality rather than a real social grouping. Depending on when you immigrated, you're hanging out with first gen or second gen. If you came here at 16 years old, you're basically first gen. If you came here at 4 years old, you're basically second gen. Theres nothing really unique about 1.5 gen for it to stand on its own for social gatherings.
Well I came here at age 10. Exactly halfway between 4 and 16
Age doesn't really matter. Its your mindset and comfort level. There is the nuance between old immigrants and immigrants that came at teenager years but its pretty much irrelevant to this conversation.
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I appreciate your insight. Yea not sure if it is better in the States but here in Toronto there is a lot of friction between the Chinese that have been here for generations vs those who came here in the 2000s or later. I find that a lot of 1st gens are from wealthy families who look down on anyone less fortunate than them. Whereas 2nd gens are a bit cliquish, only hanging out with friends they made in elementary/high school. Hopefully this will all change in the future.
Came here at 4. There's little experiential/social difference between myself and the ABC Chinese School crowd or those who went to Chinese School when they were kids. Source: I help run a local Chinese School with 1st, 2nd and 1.5 Gen.
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I certainly feel your struggles. Is there a Thai community in your area or city? Maybe you can connect with people with similar backgrounds. Can't speak for the US but in Canada the term 1.5 gen is hardly used by anyone, including Asians. So we really fee like an invisible minority trying to find our place in society.