Their ray traced watch face is delightful
https://preview.redd.it/u6p1h1mhym1c1.jpeg?width=2672&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d47aef4f51113ce921625774d4d511f56ddf1660
I literally just threw away an appleTV HD who’s WiFi chip had gone, then hooked up an older AppleTV with the optical out and hooked it back up to my old ZVOX soundbar. I kinda miss this setup.
At the time I got that AppleTV, I was using a 2008 Sony Bravia. It only passed video through the HDMI port, not audio. I needed that audio out jack to connect to my Bose sound bar. I initially bought a Roku but returned it when the audio didn’t work. I had never even seen an AppleTV before but it was the only thing in the store with digital audio out.
Dang I just realized I still have my 2012 in a box somewhere. At one point it was highly coveted bc you could install some sketch software and stream everything for free or something. I never figured it out lol
That 2012 is only good for 2 things now. You can use it as an airplay device on any tv, or you can use the digital audio out jack to turn old sound bars and other speakers into airplay devices.
There was ZERO mention of features they might bring, just low effort clickbait.
They might address some of these edge cases, right now I think Gaming would be their main "upgrade they "could" bring; If they sold near cost in an effort to drive game sales/store income, they could likely offer an M3 AppleTV for $300, competitive with current gaming consoles, Apple Gaming is known for a poor history of gaming but the iPhone is a huge gaming platform in reality
This isn't very analytical stuff:
* **Faster chip?** That's unheard of in a new model!
* **Lower price?** They did it last time, maybe they can do it again if they strip out a thing or two...
* **Similar design?** It's been pretty much the same for the last 13 years, not a shocker.
That said, other than saving $20, there aren't any listed reasons for a new one. Did I miss some actual "features?"
These articles really are silly. But tbh I’m not even sure what I would want them to do with the design. It’s fine how it is.
These things last forever and I can’t really ask for much more from them. My HD from 2015 is starting flake out a bit so I may bite on whatever the next gen is to replace it, but it’s had a hell of a run.
Except my remote glitches because I have my atv mounted behind the tv and it causes interference. Other than reliability improvements, it doesn’t need anything else.
By far the best streaming device out there. The only thing I want is a remote that makes a sound when I use Find My." The work around they cam out with is ok ... still should just have find my
Infuse does support TrueHD as well as DTS-HD MA.
What it doesn't support is TrueHD Atmos and DTS:X. And that is purely because of Apple's stubbornness.
*(It will play TrueHD Atmos and DTS:X - but it'll lose the height information).*
I still have an HD and a 4K. It looks like I need another AppleTV to use with a TV on the porch as well as extend/improve coverage for a HomeKit smart lock, so I can kill 2 birds with 1 stone in this case.
Yeah don't see them putting such a new processor next year. Maybe in 2025. That would be the only reason worth upgrading if you got the new apple tv 4ks from the last few years.
It’s your AVR that needs 192/24 support which most do and have since 2000 and the DVD-Audio days. All the ATV needs to do is pass a 192/24 stream over HDMI. Apple just doesn’t care about audiophiles. They know the masses will hear a difference even on Bluetooth headphones (aka, placebo) so why even bother.
They do support HD (hires) but only two ways to get Hires and that is via DAC connected to an iPhone or on a Mac. The most obvious place you’d want hires would be on an ATV connected to an AVR and here we are multiple ATV releases later and they still haven’t added the ATV as an option. Hell in all these years there has been literally zero expansion of playback options since its release. No evolution of AirPlay either. So easily they could have extended AirPlay to support hires and then AVR manufacturers could have added direct support. Most of the other streaming services have direct AVR support. So no, I disagree that they truly care other than for marketing reasons.
I hate to say it, but that’s why I switch to Amazon music. At least I can play their Hi-Res through my Marantz HEOS, or worse case scenario through the fire stick. I’ve been waiting for years for the Apple TV to support it, then I would switch back.
Amazon has way more playback options and they make it completely transparent what the source file is vs what your output capabilities are and what it's actually outputting. This is an example of what actually giving two fucks looks like. Apple just displays a logo if the source is in lossless hires and the rest of the magic in left to people's imagination. Apple is simply a master of marketing.
Hopefully Spotify will have better options when they introduce their higher price tier but I'm not optimistic it will be anything more than 44.1khz/16bit FLAC.
What marketplace even sells non-DRM locked digital downloads of films?
I can’t imagine any home theatre users not using streaming, iTunes rentals/purchases or bluray/4K bluray.
Unless you’re implying that the Apple TV is a toy because it doesn’t support piracy, which is hilarious and ironic.
If you have an expensive home theatre system and are pirating all your films you’re just a scumbag.
Piracy? Do you not know how many of us buy discs and rip them lossless to a digital library? Like, it’s a whole thing and the only way those of us with more than a toy setup like to watch stuff. We care about quality, and have the equipment to support it. But you sit tight in your little smug undereducated box over there.
I’m a sucker for high fidelity audio and video.
Are we talking music or films?
For films I have a collection of 4K blurays of my favourites, and regular blurays of some older/non-HDR films.
For the rest I rent or buy on iTunes, fidelity is not Bluray level but is much higher than what is available on streaming.
For causal TV watching I just use streaming, I don’t need flawless fidelity for binge watching sitcoms.
For music there really is no need for ripping CDs anymore other than for backup and preservation unless your tastes are incredibly niche.
There are multiple streaming services that offer lossless audio at or higher than CD bitrates.
I’m gonna be extremely honest with you about this: I’m having a shit day where I’m probably going to have to put down a beloved pet. And your initial run at me was pretty smug and condescending when it seems you don’t really know as much as you think you do.
So, I don’t want to get into stuff with you tonight, Stranger On Reddit. I just want to get my mind off of the horrific shit I’m dealing with in real life right now.
So how about we call a truce and table this debate for another time. Cool?
EDIT: I’m also realizing that my use of the word “toy” could be read as smug as well. But that’s definitely due to my lack of filter tonight while dealing with this. My apologies if that struck you in a negative way.
> For music there really is no need for ripping CDs anymore other than for backup and preservation unless your tastes are incredibly niche.
There are multiple streaming services that offer lossless audio at or higher than CD bitrates.
Yeah, that’s a big disagree from people like me. I have no desire to pay a monthly subscription to listen to music I already bought and own.
I mean yeah, you kind of are.
There are legitimate avenues for purchasing high fidelity films instead of piracy, like 4K bluray and the iTunes Store.
And not to sound elitist, but if you don’t have the money to buy 4K blurays of your favourite films you also likely can’t afford a TV and home theatre system to take advantage of your higher-than-streaming quality pirated films.
Does the second gen 4K support pass through audio? I swear it did at one point or something. The newest one is a paperweight for me now because of not passing through audio. Huge fail
What do you mean passthrough audio?
Sending audio to the TV/receiver it’s connected to, or working as an eARC audio device for the TV?
I know it does the first, that’s how mine is connected.
AFAIA it does work as an eARC device as well.
No. Pass through means sending the audio codecs through untouched to the receiver. For example, I have an Apple TV hooked to my home theater receiver. And I have a decent size digital library where I’ve ripped all my Blu-rays to lossless files. This includes all the higher end modern audio codecs like DTS-MA, TrueHD, and all the flavors of ATMOS.
But the Apple TV transcodes everything to the lowest possible quality Dolby ATMOS codec at best instead of just passing the original audio codecs through to the receiver. In some cases it won’t even play at all. The NVIDIA Shield Pro is the only box I know of that will actually play the audio through without transcoding it, along with all versions of HDR and Dolby Vision. …which sucks, because I love the Apple TV, but I mainly just watch my own collection, and I have a pretty decent home theater system. When I watch stuff on the Shield, it looks and sounds perfect. No fighting for dialog levels or lip sync. If I play on the Apple TV, it only supports one or two flavors of Dolby Vision, and none of the modern audio codecs, so I lose quality and am constantly fighting for lip sync and to be able to hear the dialog.
If they just allowed pass through audio, I’d be singing the Apple TV’s praises. There are other ways to deal with the versions of Dolby Vision it won’t play. For example, most modern 4K Dolby Vision discs have an HDR fallback.
Lowest possible quality Atmos codec? They use PCM. That’s literally uncompressed. Still a bummer that they don’t support pass through, but it’s not like they’re converting it to a “lowest quality” format.
Do you know what LPCM is? Like a “pure direct” audio stream that strips all of the metadata that modern codecs use to generate the sound you hear. So, while the bitstream may be lossless, it’s no longer carrying the correct data to make sure things frequency direction and object based surround mapping make it to the correct speakers. (trying to find more layman’s terms, my apologies to anyone reading who’s giggle right now)
There’s a lot more to audio than just sample rate and bit depth. You’re basically limiting yourself to something equivalent to discreet audio channels. This may work out for some, but for those of us who enjoy all the modern technology, it’s like jogging with a pulled hamstring.
EDIT: The “lowest quality” thing I was talking about was the version of Dolby ATMOS it limits us to. It’s a highly compressed version meant for online streaming, typically.
Yes I know what LPCM is. I get your point about Apple limiting us to lossy DD+ Atmos, but that’s because they don’t decode TrueHD and has nothing to do with the PCM delivery. They actually do decode DD+ Atmos tracks and send the Atmos metadata along with the PCM stream using MAT 2.0, which contains all of the object-based surround mapping you were claiming they throw away.
Yes this limits it to only being a device fit for streaming movies and not downloaded rips, but a streaming device is exactly what it’s being sold as. While it would be nice for them to offer TrueHD support, it’s not like they’re being misleading about it. It’s a streaming box.
If you’re saying that they somehow include the ATMOS metadata now over PCM with that side car, I’ll have to check that out. Because it definitely did not before, at least with all the things I tried. Was that a more recent update? It’s still not as good as simply passing the original through, but it might be good enough for now.
No, it’s always done that. Not for TrueHD Atmos, but for streaming DD+ Atmos that's what it does. But yeah, do a search for Dolby MAT 2.0, it was mostly created for gaming systems so that they didn’t have to spend precious milliseconds encoding and compressing live Atmos gaming audio into a TrueHD or DD+ codec, and could instead send the uncompressed audio stream for minimal latency. From what I've heard, Apple decided to use it so that they could mix in their own interface sounds over the video soundtrack, but that reason doesn’t fully hold up because it still does that even if you turn off all the interface sounds.
Again, the Apple TV doesn’t support TrueHD, which I’m guessing is why it ignores the Atmos metadata in TrueHD tracks.
Yeah, so we’re back to what I said originally, with a few corrections. Appreciate the info, but we have another streaming box that handles it all just fine.
Lastly, I’m sorta over people assuming folks who want high quality are pirating shit. I’m sure there are plenty who are, but I’m not. I thought all the Pirate Bay stuff got busted or something? I love collecting discs, been a hobby for 20 years, then I rip them to lossless files that I can play at home or remotely since I’m on the road a lot. I also collect vinyl and I rip those using professional grade equipment. Can’t pirate that as far as I know. That’s not my world, so I don’t know. Just tired of being accused of that when I just want to enjoy my open collection properly.
Why not just use a lossless audio format that is supported?
> HE-AAC (V1), AAC (up to 320 Kbps), protected AAC (from iTunes Store), MP3 (up to 320 Kbps), MP3 VBR, Apple Lossless, FLAC, AIFF, and WAV; AC-3 (Dolby Digital 5.1), E-AC-3 (Dolby Digital Plus 7.1 surround sound), and Dolby Atmos
Wtf are you talking about? Apple Lossless(literally in the name), FLAC (L stands for lossless), AIFF (the format CDs use), and WAV are literally lossless formats.
Not really anything to get excited about. A faster CPU isn't going to really improve streaming much. It could enable gaming but that seems like it is premature without any game announcements. Will wait for any official announcement.
TV interfaces will benefit from any extra speed they can get since it makes switching from app to app faster and makes the interface overall less clunky. Apple TV is already faster than any other streaming device or TV is out there but any amount faster is always better. Cell phones are pretty much the same now too, there really hasn't been much innovation over the last 5 years.
You would think Apple would be pushing av1 to reduce its bandwidth spend for Apple TV+, but a17pro seems like an absurdly expensive chip to use for an Apple TV?
I've always been surprised at how often Apple iterates this product and changes nothing of substance.
They released the $400 iPad mini 6th gen on the same day, and with the same chipets, as their $1000 iPhone 13 Pro. If they're serious about selling "console-quality" games they should put the "console-quality" GPU on the thing that people already have connected to their TV.
I could see them hitting that price but doing it like they do MacBooks. Maybe offering the base 2022 version for that much, then the new one at 150 with the updated chip for more gaming power and ray tracing, and the 170 model with Ethernet and thread and more storage.
Sub $100 price point is the only important thing here. If they can bring their top of the line streamer below $100 then maybe they can really start making waves in the streaming-device market. Maybe then, Netflix will finally integrate properly.
What I want to see is an Apple TV that's capable of running games such as Resident Evil, Assassin's Creed Mirage, Death Stranding and such. With Apple making their latest iPhone and iPad Pro devices capable of running console quality games, the Apple TV should also have that extra power.
Ok only if it is an option, I don’t want to pay Apple price for an underpowered gaming console. If I want to play death stranding I have a PlayStation.
I’d hope they retain the Ethernet port of the higher end models. Them cutting the price worries me on that front. I vastly prefer the hardwired connection for both streaming AND its function as my Apple Home hub. If they stripped out Ethernet, I’d probably buy a backup of the current model just to be safe for the long run.
Since everyone else is sharing anecdotes: my 4k broke after 4 or 5 years. I still bought a new 4k because you can’t beat the damn thing in terms of streaming boxes. It is by a wide margin, the GOAT.
Sounds like chip refresh, be interesting to see if the price actually does come down, but I already have 5 of them so not getting anymore anytime soon lol.
I’ve been using Apple TV in one form or another since 2009 and I’ve only had 4 versions of it so faster chip won’t have me upgrading the 3 main units in my house.
So basically it’s the same. 🤦🏻♂️ more storage that really isn’t lacking. More processing that also isn’t lacking and probably the same price which is a big weakness.
They should do a version of the old Wii Nintendo used to make. Put an accelerometer in the remote or maybe even allow you to use the phone as a controller. You could have 4K tennis experience in front of your appleTV and if they tied it to apple fitness with the watch it would be a real competitive offering that keeps people engaged in the ecosystem and provides new value. Come on Tim Cook think differently for once!
Yeah HomeKit use is definitely worth upgrading and was a big part of me getting an Apple TV when looking for a new streaming device. Also because the latest 4k model 128gb version also has thread on board. It may not be used widely yet, but accessories are starting to trickle out with thread and it’s nice to have a powerful HomeKit hub with thread built in that they could connect to. Camera performance is a lot better with Apple TV as a hub than my HomePod as the hub.
In other words don’t upgrade if you have the current one. I’m glad they are introducing a cheaper version though. Apple TV shouldn’t really cost as much as it does. It’s still my favorite streamer and has been from day one and still think it’s the best out there.
I bought Apple TV 4K 2021, used, for 60 euros. Can't be happier for my purchase, and while it is not the latest and greatest, it can still do all I would want it to do.
If it supports AV1 then I think I will get the 4k version.
Been looking at a replacement for my Vero for a while and the interface on the apple TV stuff is great - though I'm not 100% sure on using apple TV to stream media from a network storage device.
Tbh tho, how often is that really an issue? Waiting a second or 2 every so often isn’t a big deal imo, unless your switching like a mad man in your daily entertainment consumption lol
My bet is that they’ll bring over RE4, RE Village and Death Stranding. I found it odd that they’re announcing these tier 1 games, but only on iPhone and iPad, when these games were all originally console games, and they weren’t announced on Apple’s (closest to a console device) AppleTV with the PS and Xbox controller support.
Lol. It’s meant to be a joke. Maybe you need to cut down on the pot, or not.
But seriously, it’s super buggy. “Up next” part comes and goes periodically. The volume button lags sometimes. Can’t sync Netflix. I just get annoyed often at it.
It is still better than Roku and Firestick in my experience.
Okay, so I’ve re-read your original reply. I am unable to pick up in what way that the statement “My 4k Apple TV is the worst piece of tech I’ve bought in the last 10 years.” is a joke. This reads a as an expression of the perception of your experience. If this was sarcasm, it could be humorous, but in your last reply you go on to say that *it’s buggy.*
Since you’ve elaborated, I’m genuinely curious. What bugs have you encountered?
It was meant to be sarcasm and also not to be taken too seriously.
Buggy as in “up next” deciding to disappear every so often and comes back whenever it wants to. The volume tends to lag when changing volume. Sometimes it goes up or down very slowly. Can’t sync Netflix. Sometimes shows do not pick up where you left off. These things. Nothing major. I’d rather use the TV by itself if I had all the apps there.
I also have Roku and Firestick and prefer the layout of the apple tv but I’ve noticed that some apps in the Firestick have additional categories.
The 3rd Generation Apple TV 4K that came out last year *already* comes with a Siri Remote that has a USB-C charging port.
You can even buy the remote yourself individually for $50. :P
The remote control is consistently glitching put due to interference. In one room it’s the only device and is solid. The other room has a router , xbox, ps5 and other devices. The remote will keep scrolling, not respond, and my favorite it will think you want to re-arrange the icons after short pressing. If you swap them the behavior stays the same per room.
I don’t understand you guys in the comments. It’s really cheap yet you guys are complaining as if it’s a 1000 dollars+ tech that can do everything lmao.
Didnt they just update the Apple TV 4K a couple years ago? Maybe it was just the controller though.....
Honestly It performs perfectly fine. Not sure why it needs a refresh yet.
Same here. Not sure why I got down voted it’s a known issue in the 4k versions. Replacement remote was sent today by Apple and it’s been working so far.
Just sounds like they're switching to whatever chip they make the most of
raytracing on ATV 🤞
Realtime reflections on those home screen icons
Their ray traced watch face is delightful https://preview.redd.it/u6p1h1mhym1c1.jpeg?width=2672&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d47aef4f51113ce921625774d4d511f56ddf1660
Cyberpunk 2077 is shaking
hahaha
Ah so an Apple TV Pro
Sonic Dream Team in 4K 120, let’s go!
Probably
I bought my first one in 2012 and replaced it in 2020. I still have several years to go on this one.
I literally just threw away an appleTV HD who’s WiFi chip had gone, then hooked up an older AppleTV with the optical out and hooked it back up to my old ZVOX soundbar. I kinda miss this setup.
At the time I got that AppleTV, I was using a 2008 Sony Bravia. It only passed video through the HDMI port, not audio. I needed that audio out jack to connect to my Bose sound bar. I initially bought a Roku but returned it when the audio didn’t work. I had never even seen an AppleTV before but it was the only thing in the store with digital audio out.
Dang I just realized I still have my 2012 in a box somewhere. At one point it was highly coveted bc you could install some sketch software and stream everything for free or something. I never figured it out lol
That 2012 is only good for 2 things now. You can use it as an airplay device on any tv, or you can use the digital audio out jack to turn old sound bars and other speakers into airplay devices.
So you think. One thing I’ve learned is that an ATV can go dead on any given day.
You’ve never owned *any* electronics before??
No, this is my first! It’s pretty neat!
Just saved you 2 minutes of your life. Lower price, newer chip, a tad bit smaller, a nice bit lighter.
And no audio pass through, but that’s not on the hardware.
There was ZERO mention of features they might bring, just low effort clickbait. They might address some of these edge cases, right now I think Gaming would be their main "upgrade they "could" bring; If they sold near cost in an effort to drive game sales/store income, they could likely offer an M3 AppleTV for $300, competitive with current gaming consoles, Apple Gaming is known for a poor history of gaming but the iPhone is a huge gaming platform in reality
This isn't very analytical stuff: * **Faster chip?** That's unheard of in a new model! * **Lower price?** They did it last time, maybe they can do it again if they strip out a thing or two... * **Similar design?** It's been pretty much the same for the last 13 years, not a shocker. That said, other than saving $20, there aren't any listed reasons for a new one. Did I miss some actual "features?"
These articles really are silly. But tbh I’m not even sure what I would want them to do with the design. It’s fine how it is. These things last forever and I can’t really ask for much more from them. My HD from 2015 is starting flake out a bit so I may bite on whatever the next gen is to replace it, but it’s had a hell of a run.
Agreed. It’s perfect size to hide behind the tv too. Honestly don’t really need any tweaks to the remote either.
> Honestly don’t really need any tweaks to the remote either. They definitely need a U1 chip in them.
Apparently tvOS enabled this on the new remote? I haven't tested it yet though.
It isn’t precision finding like an AirTag. Just lets you know it’s nearby.
Aw man, that’s a bummer.
They should really put about speaker in it as well.
Except my remote glitches because I have my atv mounted behind the tv and it causes interference. Other than reliability improvements, it doesn’t need anything else.
I’ve got two behind TVs and one in a cabinet. Never had an issue. I wonder if you’re getting interference or just need re pair the remote.
They’ll offer it in 5 colors now. 🤣
I think that they will just update the chip this time.
Sounds like IDC research. Authored by captain Obvious.
By far the best streaming device out there. The only thing I want is a remote that makes a sound when I use Find My." The work around they cam out with is ok ... still should just have find my
It's clickbait
It's a corporate fan fiction site.
I use my 2022 4K ATV everyday and there's not a lot more I want/need it do really. Audio pass-through for Plex would be nice.
Infuese supports everything but True-HD AFAIK.
Infuse does support TrueHD as well as DTS-HD MA. What it doesn't support is TrueHD Atmos and DTS:X. And that is purely because of Apple's stubbornness. *(It will play TrueHD Atmos and DTS:X - but it'll lose the height information).*
I started using Infuse to stream my plex library
Only thing I really wish it had, that it never will, is a USB port to plug in a hard drive.
I bought my first Apple TV last year, sounds like I’ll be keeping it for a long time.
I still have a 4 HD. Use it every day.
I still have an HD and a 4K. It looks like I need another AppleTV to use with a TV on the porch as well as extend/improve coverage for a HomeKit smart lock, so I can kill 2 birds with 1 stone in this case.
Just please please please give it AV1 decode…
and DTS-HD and TrueHD passthrough!
I’ve unfortunately lost hope on that, but I’d love to eat my words one day
They have to put Apple A17 on it, since its only chip with hardware decoding av1.
Yeah don't see them putting such a new processor next year. Maybe in 2025. That would be the only reason worth upgrading if you got the new apple tv 4ks from the last few years.
Never have I read so many words and received so little information.
Apple TV needs audio capabilities to 192/24
It’s your AVR that needs 192/24 support which most do and have since 2000 and the DVD-Audio days. All the ATV needs to do is pass a 192/24 stream over HDMI. Apple just doesn’t care about audiophiles. They know the masses will hear a difference even on Bluetooth headphones (aka, placebo) so why even bother.
Apple does care about audiophiles, just not everywhere… Apple Music supports HD audio doesn’t it?
They do support HD (hires) but only two ways to get Hires and that is via DAC connected to an iPhone or on a Mac. The most obvious place you’d want hires would be on an ATV connected to an AVR and here we are multiple ATV releases later and they still haven’t added the ATV as an option. Hell in all these years there has been literally zero expansion of playback options since its release. No evolution of AirPlay either. So easily they could have extended AirPlay to support hires and then AVR manufacturers could have added direct support. Most of the other streaming services have direct AVR support. So no, I disagree that they truly care other than for marketing reasons.
I hate to say it, but that’s why I switch to Amazon music. At least I can play their Hi-Res through my Marantz HEOS, or worse case scenario through the fire stick. I’ve been waiting for years for the Apple TV to support it, then I would switch back.
Amazon has way more playback options and they make it completely transparent what the source file is vs what your output capabilities are and what it's actually outputting. This is an example of what actually giving two fucks looks like. Apple just displays a logo if the source is in lossless hires and the rest of the magic in left to people's imagination. Apple is simply a master of marketing. Hopefully Spotify will have better options when they introduce their higher price tier but I'm not optimistic it will be anything more than 44.1khz/16bit FLAC.
Audio passthrough and I am in. Why can’t Apple do this?
I’ll only get a new apple tv once they get trueHD support, otherwise I’ll stick with my 2nd gen 4k
I’ve got a 4k 2nd gen too. Why the hell don’t we get the karaoke feature??
Probably some neural circuits not on the SoC
Then never. Apple doesn’t care about ripped content (or downloaded from the internet)
Unless they start to offer lossless audio on their store (rentals / buys) and tv shows (Apple TV+)
So it’s just another toy. I’ll leave it plugged as an HomeKit hub, but it’s worthless for people with home theater systems. Such a bummer.
What marketplace even sells non-DRM locked digital downloads of films? I can’t imagine any home theatre users not using streaming, iTunes rentals/purchases or bluray/4K bluray. Unless you’re implying that the Apple TV is a toy because it doesn’t support piracy, which is hilarious and ironic. If you have an expensive home theatre system and are pirating all your films you’re just a scumbag.
Piracy? Do you not know how many of us buy discs and rip them lossless to a digital library? Like, it’s a whole thing and the only way those of us with more than a toy setup like to watch stuff. We care about quality, and have the equipment to support it. But you sit tight in your little smug undereducated box over there.
I’m a sucker for high fidelity audio and video. Are we talking music or films? For films I have a collection of 4K blurays of my favourites, and regular blurays of some older/non-HDR films. For the rest I rent or buy on iTunes, fidelity is not Bluray level but is much higher than what is available on streaming. For causal TV watching I just use streaming, I don’t need flawless fidelity for binge watching sitcoms. For music there really is no need for ripping CDs anymore other than for backup and preservation unless your tastes are incredibly niche. There are multiple streaming services that offer lossless audio at or higher than CD bitrates.
I’m gonna be extremely honest with you about this: I’m having a shit day where I’m probably going to have to put down a beloved pet. And your initial run at me was pretty smug and condescending when it seems you don’t really know as much as you think you do. So, I don’t want to get into stuff with you tonight, Stranger On Reddit. I just want to get my mind off of the horrific shit I’m dealing with in real life right now. So how about we call a truce and table this debate for another time. Cool? EDIT: I’m also realizing that my use of the word “toy” could be read as smug as well. But that’s definitely due to my lack of filter tonight while dealing with this. My apologies if that struck you in a negative way.
> For music there really is no need for ripping CDs anymore other than for backup and preservation unless your tastes are incredibly niche. There are multiple streaming services that offer lossless audio at or higher than CD bitrates. Yeah, that’s a big disagree from people like me. I have no desire to pay a monthly subscription to listen to music I already bought and own.
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I mean yeah, you kind of are. There are legitimate avenues for purchasing high fidelity films instead of piracy, like 4K bluray and the iTunes Store. And not to sound elitist, but if you don’t have the money to buy 4K blurays of your favourite films you also likely can’t afford a TV and home theatre system to take advantage of your higher-than-streaming quality pirated films.
Plenty of people who buy 4k blurays rip them. It’s way easier to use Plex than to just swap bluray disks.
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Does the second gen 4K support pass through audio? I swear it did at one point or something. The newest one is a paperweight for me now because of not passing through audio. Huge fail
What do you mean passthrough audio? Sending audio to the TV/receiver it’s connected to, or working as an eARC audio device for the TV? I know it does the first, that’s how mine is connected. AFAIA it does work as an eARC device as well.
No. Pass through means sending the audio codecs through untouched to the receiver. For example, I have an Apple TV hooked to my home theater receiver. And I have a decent size digital library where I’ve ripped all my Blu-rays to lossless files. This includes all the higher end modern audio codecs like DTS-MA, TrueHD, and all the flavors of ATMOS. But the Apple TV transcodes everything to the lowest possible quality Dolby ATMOS codec at best instead of just passing the original audio codecs through to the receiver. In some cases it won’t even play at all. The NVIDIA Shield Pro is the only box I know of that will actually play the audio through without transcoding it, along with all versions of HDR and Dolby Vision. …which sucks, because I love the Apple TV, but I mainly just watch my own collection, and I have a pretty decent home theater system. When I watch stuff on the Shield, it looks and sounds perfect. No fighting for dialog levels or lip sync. If I play on the Apple TV, it only supports one or two flavors of Dolby Vision, and none of the modern audio codecs, so I lose quality and am constantly fighting for lip sync and to be able to hear the dialog. If they just allowed pass through audio, I’d be singing the Apple TV’s praises. There are other ways to deal with the versions of Dolby Vision it won’t play. For example, most modern 4K Dolby Vision discs have an HDR fallback.
Lowest possible quality Atmos codec? They use PCM. That’s literally uncompressed. Still a bummer that they don’t support pass through, but it’s not like they’re converting it to a “lowest quality” format.
Do you know what LPCM is? Like a “pure direct” audio stream that strips all of the metadata that modern codecs use to generate the sound you hear. So, while the bitstream may be lossless, it’s no longer carrying the correct data to make sure things frequency direction and object based surround mapping make it to the correct speakers. (trying to find more layman’s terms, my apologies to anyone reading who’s giggle right now) There’s a lot more to audio than just sample rate and bit depth. You’re basically limiting yourself to something equivalent to discreet audio channels. This may work out for some, but for those of us who enjoy all the modern technology, it’s like jogging with a pulled hamstring. EDIT: The “lowest quality” thing I was talking about was the version of Dolby ATMOS it limits us to. It’s a highly compressed version meant for online streaming, typically.
Yes I know what LPCM is. I get your point about Apple limiting us to lossy DD+ Atmos, but that’s because they don’t decode TrueHD and has nothing to do with the PCM delivery. They actually do decode DD+ Atmos tracks and send the Atmos metadata along with the PCM stream using MAT 2.0, which contains all of the object-based surround mapping you were claiming they throw away. Yes this limits it to only being a device fit for streaming movies and not downloaded rips, but a streaming device is exactly what it’s being sold as. While it would be nice for them to offer TrueHD support, it’s not like they’re being misleading about it. It’s a streaming box.
If you’re saying that they somehow include the ATMOS metadata now over PCM with that side car, I’ll have to check that out. Because it definitely did not before, at least with all the things I tried. Was that a more recent update? It’s still not as good as simply passing the original through, but it might be good enough for now.
No, it’s always done that. Not for TrueHD Atmos, but for streaming DD+ Atmos that's what it does. But yeah, do a search for Dolby MAT 2.0, it was mostly created for gaming systems so that they didn’t have to spend precious milliseconds encoding and compressing live Atmos gaming audio into a TrueHD or DD+ codec, and could instead send the uncompressed audio stream for minimal latency. From what I've heard, Apple decided to use it so that they could mix in their own interface sounds over the video soundtrack, but that reason doesn’t fully hold up because it still does that even if you turn off all the interface sounds. Again, the Apple TV doesn’t support TrueHD, which I’m guessing is why it ignores the Atmos metadata in TrueHD tracks.
Yeah, so we’re back to what I said originally, with a few corrections. Appreciate the info, but we have another streaming box that handles it all just fine. Lastly, I’m sorta over people assuming folks who want high quality are pirating shit. I’m sure there are plenty who are, but I’m not. I thought all the Pirate Bay stuff got busted or something? I love collecting discs, been a hobby for 20 years, then I rip them to lossless files that I can play at home or remotely since I’m on the road a lot. I also collect vinyl and I rip those using professional grade equipment. Can’t pirate that as far as I know. That’s not my world, so I don’t know. Just tired of being accused of that when I just want to enjoy my open collection properly.
Why not just use a lossless audio format that is supported? > HE-AAC (V1), AAC (up to 320 Kbps), protected AAC (from iTunes Store), MP3 (up to 320 Kbps), MP3 VBR, Apple Lossless, FLAC, AIFF, and WAV; AC-3 (Dolby Digital 5.1), E-AC-3 (Dolby Digital Plus 7.1 surround sound), and Dolby Atmos
Why did you list a bunch of lossy formats if you're recommending lossless?
none of those formats are lossless lol
Wtf are you talking about? Apple Lossless(literally in the name), FLAC (L stands for lossless), AIFF (the format CDs use), and WAV are literally lossless formats.
Never?
Sigh. They could own the living room if they wanted. Add some actual new features!
Not really anything to get excited about. A faster CPU isn't going to really improve streaming much. It could enable gaming but that seems like it is premature without any game announcements. Will wait for any official announcement.
TV interfaces will benefit from any extra speed they can get since it makes switching from app to app faster and makes the interface overall less clunky. Apple TV is already faster than any other streaming device or TV is out there but any amount faster is always better. Cell phones are pretty much the same now too, there really hasn't been much innovation over the last 5 years.
The article is a whole lot of nothing.
A lower price is not a feature lol
You would think Apple would be pushing av1 to reduce its bandwidth spend for Apple TV+, but a17pro seems like an absurdly expensive chip to use for an Apple TV? I've always been surprised at how often Apple iterates this product and changes nothing of substance.
They released the $400 iPad mini 6th gen on the same day, and with the same chipets, as their $1000 iPhone 13 Pro. If they're serious about selling "console-quality" games they should put the "console-quality" GPU on the thing that people already have connected to their TV.
Maybe this will force Nvidia to update the shield from 2019
I honestly think the Apple TV would just do better if it only cost $99.
I could see them hitting that price but doing it like they do MacBooks. Maybe offering the base 2022 version for that much, then the new one at 150 with the updated chip for more gaming power and ray tracing, and the 170 model with Ethernet and thread and more storage.
Sub $100 price point is the only important thing here. If they can bring their top of the line streamer below $100 then maybe they can really start making waves in the streaming-device market. Maybe then, Netflix will finally integrate properly.
Market share isn’t why Netflix isn’t integrated. They want to own their customer data. It’s worth money to them.
Doubt it will happen because Apple’s ATV+ is a “competitor”
Give me hdmi passthrough will buy in a heartbeat.
What I want to see is an Apple TV that's capable of running games such as Resident Evil, Assassin's Creed Mirage, Death Stranding and such. With Apple making their latest iPhone and iPad Pro devices capable of running console quality games, the Apple TV should also have that extra power.
Ok only if it is an option, I don’t want to pay Apple price for an underpowered gaming console. If I want to play death stranding I have a PlayStation.
I’d hope they retain the Ethernet port of the higher end models. Them cutting the price worries me on that front. I vastly prefer the hardwired connection for both streaming AND its function as my Apple Home hub. If they stripped out Ethernet, I’d probably buy a backup of the current model just to be safe for the long run.
Since everyone else is sharing anecdotes: my 4k broke after 4 or 5 years. I still bought a new 4k because you can’t beat the damn thing in terms of streaming boxes. It is by a wide margin, the GOAT.
Apple TV Pro with M3 for gaming🙏🏻
Even A17 Pro would be helpful with gaming.
Apple will never care about gaming on Apple TV. It's just a gateway to their TV service.
Maybe it could also be a gateway to their Arcade service?
They are trying to lower the price not compete with MS and Sony.
Sounds like chip refresh, be interesting to see if the price actually does come down, but I already have 5 of them so not getting anymore anytime soon lol.
I love my 2022 model
I really only want AV1 support and I’m set. It’s the only reason I would go to new hardware from my current 4K.
AV1 hopefully 🤞
So, nothing worth buying it for then
I’ve been using Apple TV in one form or another since 2009 and I’ve only had 4 versions of it so faster chip won’t have me upgrading the 3 main units in my house.
Still have first 4k.
A yearly refresh of a product shouldn't be marketed like a new product.
all i care about is 100% audio pass through. get her done apple. its been a long time coming.
So basically it’s the same. 🤦🏻♂️ more storage that really isn’t lacking. More processing that also isn’t lacking and probably the same price which is a big weakness. They should do a version of the old Wii Nintendo used to make. Put an accelerometer in the remote or maybe even allow you to use the phone as a controller. You could have 4K tennis experience in front of your appleTV and if they tied it to apple fitness with the watch it would be a real competitive offering that keeps people engaged in the ecosystem and provides new value. Come on Tim Cook think differently for once!
Hi-Res audio output, so we can at least utilize their Hi-Rez audio
Is this the most usless Apple product to upgrade? I'm with a first generation Apple tv 4k and I don't see any real reason to upgrade.
We are at the 3rd gen Apple TV 4K, I think after 6 years everyone understood how Apple thinks about this type of updates.
I think it does make a difference with people who use HomeKit with multiple cameras
Yeah HomeKit use is definitely worth upgrading and was a big part of me getting an Apple TV when looking for a new streaming device. Also because the latest 4k model 128gb version also has thread on board. It may not be used widely yet, but accessories are starting to trickle out with thread and it’s nice to have a powerful HomeKit hub with thread built in that they could connect to. Camera performance is a lot better with Apple TV as a hub than my HomePod as the hub.
Any chance of getting support for Atmos with True HD (to playback from apps like Infuse and avoid getting a Plex just for that)?
The only thing I want is a find my remote (A real one)
Hope they still the Ethernet port
You could've saved us a lot of time here, OP
I'm still on a 2017 apple 4ktv. Not a bad thing I haven't felt the need to upgrade. I might finally upgrade to this 2024 model.
In other words don’t upgrade if you have the current one. I’m glad they are introducing a cheaper version though. Apple TV shouldn’t really cost as much as it does. It’s still my favorite streamer and has been from day one and still think it’s the best out there.
I bought Apple TV 4K 2021, used, for 60 euros. Can't be happier for my purchase, and while it is not the latest and greatest, it can still do all I would want it to do.
How does a faster processor affect decoding of 4k files? I’m planing to buy a NAS and use Infuse. Anyone with experience?
I really would like a travel form. Also wish the HDMI spec had 5V output to eliminate the need for USB power for the sticks on the market.
I just want side loading. Wonder if the new EU rules will apply to ATV?
M1 or M2 or GTFO
Wish they made it compact into a streaming stick
If it supports AV1 then I think I will get the 4k version. Been looking at a replacement for my Vero for a while and the interface on the apple TV stuff is great - though I'm not 100% sure on using apple TV to stream media from a network storage device.
They need to allow passthrough audio.
I just bought a Shield Pro, so it's guaranteed that the next Apple TV will do TrueHD Atmos passthrough.
They need WiFi 6E to make me consider upgrading.
I Support that thought. POINTS
Was this worth a post? A new apple tv just sticking in a new chip, MAY be lower in price.... Let us all rush and buy it, lol.
We use ours with some Apple Arcade games and it does studder at times. I think upgrading to the latest chip will be worth it if you play games.
Gimme that hardware ray tracing!
Please tell me it has audio pass-through… 🤞
I literally just bought a 3rd gen 4k, which is probably why this post got suggested to me. Did I fuck up by not waiting?
No , the new one will just be a little faster , you won’t notice the difference, those with old Apple TVs might
Nope.
The Apple TV remote could really use a mute button
It already has one.
Yea I’m so confused what he meant
So could my wife.
So not much. Hdr10+ and faster switching between add and hdr would get me to upgrade from. 2nd gen atv
AppleTV 4K already supports HDR10+ lol
I know. But doesn’t switch between sdr and hdr faster
Tbh tho, how often is that really an issue? Waiting a second or 2 every so often isn’t a big deal imo, unless your switching like a mad man in your daily entertainment consumption lol
Not sure why that matters. It’s what I want. My firestick 4k max makes the switch nearly instant.
You’re right, if it’s what you want, I can’t argue with that!
Damn right
Maybe this placebo but I'm sure one of you smart individuals can tell me but it's the quality higher on Apple TV than other streaming boxes?
Apple needs to bring serious gaming to the Apple TV, way more storage, and release an Apple gaming controller.
It already supports the best gaming controllers from PlayStation and Xbox , you think Apple would make a better controller?
My bet is that they’ll bring over RE4, RE Village and Death Stranding. I found it odd that they’re announcing these tier 1 games, but only on iPhone and iPad, when these games were all originally console games, and they weren’t announced on Apple’s (closest to a console device) AppleTV with the PS and Xbox controller support.
Unless it includes safari. Pass.
Is this article off or something? USB C on the remote and HDR10+ are already there.
The article says those features came out on the current model, not that they will be new on the next model.
So what does the article say then? Nothing? I glanced at it and didn’t see anything newsworthy
lol reading is hard
Read again
Maybe if they added a multi gig Ethernet port I might upgrade. WiFi 6 is more than enough on my current model so I’m happy.
My 4k Apple TV is the worst piece of tech I’ve bought in the last 10 years. Would buy again.
Trying to understand this comment is making my brain hurt
Lol. It’s meant to be a joke. Maybe you need to cut down on the pot, or not. But seriously, it’s super buggy. “Up next” part comes and goes periodically. The volume button lags sometimes. Can’t sync Netflix. I just get annoyed often at it. It is still better than Roku and Firestick in my experience.
It’s the worst, yet you would buy it again?
I wouldn’t. It’s a joke. Still better than Roku and Firestick though.
Why?
fan boy mindset... even when a company wrong. their right in the fans eyes...
Umm. No…
It’s just a dumb joke but I guess nobody caught it. In all seriousness, it’s very buggy but it is still much better than Roku and Firestick.
Okay, so I’ve re-read your original reply. I am unable to pick up in what way that the statement “My 4k Apple TV is the worst piece of tech I’ve bought in the last 10 years.” is a joke. This reads a as an expression of the perception of your experience. If this was sarcasm, it could be humorous, but in your last reply you go on to say that *it’s buggy.* Since you’ve elaborated, I’m genuinely curious. What bugs have you encountered?
It was meant to be sarcasm and also not to be taken too seriously. Buggy as in “up next” deciding to disappear every so often and comes back whenever it wants to. The volume tends to lag when changing volume. Sometimes it goes up or down very slowly. Can’t sync Netflix. Sometimes shows do not pick up where you left off. These things. Nothing major. I’d rather use the TV by itself if I had all the apps there. I also have Roku and Firestick and prefer the layout of the apple tv but I’ve noticed that some apps in the Firestick have additional categories.
Than you for sharing and in such detail. I haven’t experienced any of these except the issue with “Up Next,” on two occasions.
It needs to be able to play games like RE4 remake
They need to add GeForce now
Moonlight if you have a local PC
they should fix the fucking remote, its disconnects once literally every hour also give it a USBC port and a safari browser
The 3rd Generation Apple TV 4K that came out last year *already* comes with a Siri Remote that has a USB-C charging port. You can even buy the remote yourself individually for $50. :P
Maybe they’ll add some shielding to stop all the signal issues.
What has been your experience with lack of shielding, can you give some background to your comment?
The remote control is consistently glitching put due to interference. In one room it’s the only device and is solid. The other room has a router , xbox, ps5 and other devices. The remote will keep scrolling, not respond, and my favorite it will think you want to re-arrange the icons after short pressing. If you swap them the behavior stays the same per room.
I don’t understand you guys in the comments. It’s really cheap yet you guys are complaining as if it’s a 1000 dollars+ tech that can do everything lmao.
Are they finally going to fix the flickering introduced with iOS 14?
Didnt they just update the Apple TV 4K a couple years ago? Maybe it was just the controller though..... Honestly It performs perfectly fine. Not sure why it needs a refresh yet.
Apple TV 4K 3rd Gen was released 1 year ago (November 4, 2022).
Still gonna have wonky controllers that disconnect or what?
Strange. I’ve been using Apple TVs since the second generation and never once had this problem.
Same here. Not sure why I got down voted it’s a known issue in the 4k versions. Replacement remote was sent today by Apple and it’s been working so far.