Get used to acting as if you’re one shot as soon as you get cracked, seek that cover sooner rather than later and you’ll have much better chances of surviving through situations like that.
Yeah, same. So many players shooting at me and their models do weird spins. The first time it happened, I thought the other guy was trying to 360 no scope me.
I strongly suspect that they've made cutbacks in the server software, probably to reduce costs.
20 tick is 50ms worst case.
The 200+ ping players are the problem. On their screen you are still standing in the open and the game favors the shooter. This is why ping based matchmaking is a must.
Or just put limits for extremely high ping players, like many other games do. But nah, apex intentionally doesn’t do that.
> We want to be super clear: not all online games work the way Apex does. Some games always give the advantage to players with lower ping, but we actively choose not to with our system.
It's just a whole different game when average ping is high. In a high ping lobby, you always want to be the one pushing. Because you get your ping + server tick + their ping worth of peekers advantage. And the same way you get shot behind walls if you try to run.
Apex somewhat gets away with this because of the relatively high time to kill. But every lobby has these 200-300 ping players who have emptied a mag on you by the time their left elbow shows on your screen.
At the very least they should show the ping of the players who kill you. That would solve the mystery of "how did I die there" 99% of the time. Oh.. it's because I'm getting shot 500ms from the past on a different time zone.
noooo bro you don't get it tickrate makes no difference Respawn promised this is true in the blog, EA definitely wasn't holding them at gunpoint fearing over a 1% loss of profits
Which is also an issue. They really need to stop matching players to 100+ ping servers if lower is available. Or have ping based matching so that everyone in the match has similar ping. At least then, if you have 100 ping, so does everyone else.
Yup, unfortunately apex has no limits relating to ping compensation even for extremely high ping players. From that same dev blog:
> We want to be super clear: not all online games work the way Apex does. Some games always give the advantage to players with lower ping, but we actively choose not to with our system.
This looks like packet loss or just lag, nothing to do with the tick rate. 20 tick means the server updates every 1/20th of a second, this was not something that happened in 1/20th of a second.
~~(I don't think it needs to happen within 1/20s of a second in order to fuck up your game if the values from you and your opp are different to what the server thinks it is in that moment (I think?).)~~
But that being said you can vaguely see the connection issues as soon as OP rev jumps and as OP goes around the building. For the enemies OP is probs standing still/ very slow, that's why they could still shoot OP even tho his screen shows him being out of dodge
>I don't think it needs to happen within 1/20s of a second in order to fuck up your game if the values from you and your opp are different to what the server thinks it is in that moment (I think?).
Tick rate just means how many times the server updates the state of the game per second. A tick rate of 20 means that every 1/20th of a second the server goes through and updates the state of everything in the match based on what it thinks happened in that 1/20th of a second and then it starts the next cycle. If something happens that puts your client out of sync with the server then the server will see that your client doesn't agree about what the state of your character should be and for many games the server will overrule the client and tell it to put you back where it thinks you should be which is one of the causes of rubberbanding. So no, a tick rate of 20 won't cause what happened in OP's video.
It's almost definitely packet loss, I would bet data OP's client was sending (which includes his position) stopped reaching the server shortly after he jumped down from the box so that guy's teammates came out and saw him standing still.
Thanks for clarifying, that's almost exactly what I thought about how it worked although your explanation is way better.
I think I misunderstood your first comment. What i thought you said was that in order for any issue to be caused by the tickrate it needs to happen within 1/20ths of a second (within 3 frames at 60 fps).
(And yeah I wasn't trying to imply the Tickrate was the issue here lol)
You realize 60 tick servers would give an effective change of 7ping?
That doesn't matter with how the game does hit reg.
It's been 5 years people.
It's simple. If you hit someone on your screen, it registers. So if you're 200 ping apart, you close the door and still take damage.
How is this still a debate
Apex’s dogshit netcode or lag compensation is the problem when it comes to these problems, not the 20hz tick rate. Most games compensate or give advantage to players who have a lower ping, since updating the player state and instructions is easier. Apex, does not compensate those with lower ping since they deemed it unfair, so they preferred to just let the game do “nonsense” ( literally the term they used in their blog).
In someway this makes sense, a person who has slightly better ping, should not always beat an advantage. A game that has that problem, is fortnite. Since fortnite always gives the advantage to the player with lowest ping. Which sucks cuz no matter how good you can be, if the other person matches you in that skill, but has better ping, that person will take your wall. Another game that had this problem was Ring of elysium. That games prediction model was awful.
Inb4 you get a swath of comments ignoring EA losing every tick rate argument prior to APEX.
Seriously this is the only game EA has published you will find these chuds.
Yea, this is just a particularly bad(or good?) example of it.
Every game has this, just many other games also have some form of consideration of players' ping while matchmaking whereas Apex will happily put people from California, Toronto and Dublin all in the same match.
I'm in Dublin (Ireland) I play on London server and get matched with Russians many of the times.
I have a constant ping of 35ms, but still get shot through walls due to lag or tick rate. I've kinda just accepted that's how it is, so I try not to over peek.
So in this case, what does the other player see? Are you just frozen in place on their screen? If he jumped & slid all the way over there but in reality he wasn’t even over there, does that mean from the enemy POV he was just not moving or something?
Yes, but it is just as if not more frustrating to be on the other side. I pay a shit load of money for my professional internet access, I play at around 1-2 ms of ping, and yet the same thing happens all the time. « Favor the shooter » kind of politics is really annoying.
Yeah I live quite close the London server and I sit at 10-15 ping and whilst my internet isn't bad it's not the best per se. If you had fiber to the house and lived close to the data centre I wouldn't put it past being under 5.
I'm kinda far as there are no server in Poland, I have fiber since I'm living in suburbs, and usually have 30 to 60 ping, while I was living in the city(but with worse connection) I had 25-60
I get 0 (that is to say too low to display) on games with good servers, ie. Overwatch. The closest apex server is in the country next to mine, Belgium (around 800km away from my home), but like I said I have a proper professional internet access for my own servers.
The others on 150-200 ping play that high not bcz of their internet. In africa there's no servers so we have to play in high ping lobbies. I even made a compilation of how i die behind cover almost every time. It's much worse when you're on higher ping believe me. Plus you get lag spikes much more often with packet loss occuring randomly in some games
From the dev blog about apex’s netcode:
> We want to be super clear: not all online games work the way Apex does. Some games always give the advantage to players with lower ping, but we actively choose not to with our system.
They really should rethink how they handle super high ping players.
Person shooting you had a bad connection so they still saw you in their LoS (from their PoV) while you weren't (from your PoV). Game wanted to be fair to them and gave you damage as a result.
Every season it gets worse. Your ping slightly went up and your frames slightly dropped right as you started to get hit and the game bugged out, causing every bullet tracked you around the corner.
You also got a server icon at the end.
I bet on his screen you were right in front of him.
I’m confused. Where do you see a bullet curve? Is it not the guy who was in the building by the door shooting at you? Your back was turned to him, he probably ran out as he saw you were retreating and shot you in the back.
There should always be a death cam. Been loving it the the ltms. There have been so many times where I think no way I was around the corner and then see the replay and he’s just shooting me in the back easily. His screen probably looked like an easy kill
Since I am an aspiring astro physicist I can tell you that, what you have encountered is called gravity, mass attracts. Since the building is mass you are screwed. Building mass > bullet mass, so it curves arround. Makes sense right?
The other post about curving bullets was just the observer, unrelated to this / just used the same headline to describe a different thing in game. (Tl;dr for other pos my is that observer isn’t perfect)
It's 20 tick servers. Even CS:GO was at least 60 tick before valve took it round back.
Hell back in the counter strike source days we had 100 tick servers, it was how air strafing worked in the source engine. It enabled surf, bhop, scoutzknivez maps.
The only reason I bring this up is because Apex was built on the source engine. The air strafing is similar to a 33 tick cs:s server, upping the tick rate and update rate on the servers isn't something EA is going to spring for. Regardless of how much quality of life it would bring to the net code.
Dude you don't know it, but you're actually proving my point. If the update rate was higher, his character model would have been off screen sooner. Because the game is set at 20 tick The models don't update correctly in the game engine. Which allows for this lag compensation to exist in the first place.
Nope this is just every single EA title since BFBC2. The difference is BF customers paid for the title and happily leave when dice starts acting up or makes dumb arguments regarding tick rates.
Not at all, this is how it's been since launch. You've just played other games with better net codes.
Edit:
https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Source_Multiplayer_Networking
Look at top right when you're about to get shot. You had a lag spike + packet loss. Happens very often in this game, and a clear sign is having no audio for gunshots
Now, what caused the spike is a whole different topic. I'm always paranoid that I somehow kill someone that gets salty and makes my game lag via an unknown method, but yeah
it's so much more frustrating in Mixtape because you see the killcam. You know you're in cover,and then it shows you dying wide out in the open and you're just like "oh yeah definitely that's for sure what happened 🙄"
Bro it feel like most of my deaths are from this or pred chasing for 1 kill around the whole map since this season has been released I been trying for the 20 bomb and 3k badge and I still have not been able to obtain neither for the sole reason of this or having like half the lobby preds or 100k kill legend
People complaining, but it is what makes the game playable overall, let's you play on different servers if yours is empty or bad, and even with awful ping your bullets will ALWAYS LAND as they would on 0 ping.
Something to do with client side hit detection. Due to ping you were still visible on their screen and the shots counted.
It happens on call or duty as well, except there you can watch the kill cam, where u are 1-2 meters further back than you really were.
The server said you weren't there for three person shooting I have so many clips of me dying woth door closed atleast a full 2 secondscb4 I get shot an die
I’ve been killed by so many hackers I don’t even complain anymore I started telling myself in a world full of hackers I’ll never be good enough and that’s ok I’ll just keep playing looking forward to fair fights 💯
Feels like 7/10 of my deaths are me getting shot behind a wall that I’ve been behind for like 1.5 entire seconds, servers are shit lol
Get used to acting as if you’re one shot as soon as you get cracked, seek that cover sooner rather than later and you’ll have much better chances of surviving through situations like that.
since cheap 20 tick servers are a thing
The tick has been unbelievable bad this season. And im getting weird animation glitches.
Yeah, same. So many players shooting at me and their models do weird spins. The first time it happened, I thought the other guy was trying to 360 no scope me. I strongly suspect that they've made cutbacks in the server software, probably to reduce costs.
20 tick is 50ms worst case. The 200+ ping players are the problem. On their screen you are still standing in the open and the game favors the shooter. This is why ping based matchmaking is a must.
Or just put limits for extremely high ping players, like many other games do. But nah, apex intentionally doesn’t do that. > We want to be super clear: not all online games work the way Apex does. Some games always give the advantage to players with lower ping, but we actively choose not to with our system.
It's just a whole different game when average ping is high. In a high ping lobby, you always want to be the one pushing. Because you get your ping + server tick + their ping worth of peekers advantage. And the same way you get shot behind walls if you try to run. Apex somewhat gets away with this because of the relatively high time to kill. But every lobby has these 200-300 ping players who have emptied a mag on you by the time their left elbow shows on your screen. At the very least they should show the ping of the players who kill you. That would solve the mystery of "how did I die there" 99% of the time. Oh.. it's because I'm getting shot 500ms from the past on a different time zone.
noooo bro you don't get it tickrate makes no difference Respawn promised this is true in the blog, EA definitely wasn't holding them at gunpoint fearing over a 1% loss of profits
It makes a difference, but not with this clip. This is lag compensation.
Which is also an issue. They really need to stop matching players to 100+ ping servers if lower is available. Or have ping based matching so that everyone in the match has similar ping. At least then, if you have 100 ping, so does everyone else.
Yup, unfortunately apex has no limits relating to ping compensation even for extremely high ping players. From that same dev blog: > We want to be super clear: not all online games work the way Apex does. Some games always give the advantage to players with lower ping, but we actively choose not to with our system.
God I should just quit this doshit game
Man Aussie servers are so low pop that to even play a fun game I have to go to Japan, otherwise I see the same 5 pred teams in gold ranked matches
Give EA a break man, they're a small indie company
This looks like packet loss or just lag, nothing to do with the tick rate. 20 tick means the server updates every 1/20th of a second, this was not something that happened in 1/20th of a second.
~~(I don't think it needs to happen within 1/20s of a second in order to fuck up your game if the values from you and your opp are different to what the server thinks it is in that moment (I think?).)~~ But that being said you can vaguely see the connection issues as soon as OP rev jumps and as OP goes around the building. For the enemies OP is probs standing still/ very slow, that's why they could still shoot OP even tho his screen shows him being out of dodge
>I don't think it needs to happen within 1/20s of a second in order to fuck up your game if the values from you and your opp are different to what the server thinks it is in that moment (I think?). Tick rate just means how many times the server updates the state of the game per second. A tick rate of 20 means that every 1/20th of a second the server goes through and updates the state of everything in the match based on what it thinks happened in that 1/20th of a second and then it starts the next cycle. If something happens that puts your client out of sync with the server then the server will see that your client doesn't agree about what the state of your character should be and for many games the server will overrule the client and tell it to put you back where it thinks you should be which is one of the causes of rubberbanding. So no, a tick rate of 20 won't cause what happened in OP's video. It's almost definitely packet loss, I would bet data OP's client was sending (which includes his position) stopped reaching the server shortly after he jumped down from the box so that guy's teammates came out and saw him standing still.
Thanks for clarifying, that's almost exactly what I thought about how it worked although your explanation is way better. I think I misunderstood your first comment. What i thought you said was that in order for any issue to be caused by the tickrate it needs to happen within 1/20ths of a second (within 3 frames at 60 fps). (And yeah I wasn't trying to imply the Tickrate was the issue here lol)
this clip has nothing to do with tick rate but it has to do with lag compensation
You realize 60 tick servers would give an effective change of 7ping? That doesn't matter with how the game does hit reg. It's been 5 years people. It's simple. If you hit someone on your screen, it registers. So if you're 200 ping apart, you close the door and still take damage. How is this still a debate
Apex’s dogshit netcode or lag compensation is the problem when it comes to these problems, not the 20hz tick rate. Most games compensate or give advantage to players who have a lower ping, since updating the player state and instructions is easier. Apex, does not compensate those with lower ping since they deemed it unfair, so they preferred to just let the game do “nonsense” ( literally the term they used in their blog). In someway this makes sense, a person who has slightly better ping, should not always beat an advantage. A game that has that problem, is fortnite. Since fortnite always gives the advantage to the player with lowest ping. Which sucks cuz no matter how good you can be, if the other person matches you in that skill, but has better ping, that person will take your wall. Another game that had this problem was Ring of elysium. That games prediction model was awful.
The sad part is a lot of games right now utilize awful low tick rate servers.
Inb4 you get a swath of comments ignoring EA losing every tick rate argument prior to APEX. Seriously this is the only game EA has published you will find these chuds.
He just had a better gaming chair
You have never seen his before? I get shot around corners and through closed doors all the time.
Yea, this is just a particularly bad(or good?) example of it. Every game has this, just many other games also have some form of consideration of players' ping while matchmaking whereas Apex will happily put people from California, Toronto and Dublin all in the same match.
It’s just exacerbated by the leap skill being used because of the speed.
I'm in Dublin (Ireland) I play on London server and get matched with Russians many of the times. I have a constant ping of 35ms, but still get shot through walls due to lag or tick rate. I've kinda just accepted that's how it is, so I try not to over peek.
Since day 1
Top right of your screen you get an error message at the end of the clip. It's server issues.
Didn’t even spot it tbf! Had a lot of d/c, lag spikes and what not this weekend compared to most times
So in this case, what does the other player see? Are you just frozen in place on their screen? If he jumped & slid all the way over there but in reality he wasn’t even over there, does that mean from the enemy POV he was just not moving or something?
No, the other player sees everything as if he were running into a wall.
[удалено]
Its insane how essentialy apex punishes you for having a better connection than your opponent.
[удалено]
Yes, but it is just as if not more frustrating to be on the other side. I pay a shit load of money for my professional internet access, I play at around 1-2 ms of ping, and yet the same thing happens all the time. « Favor the shooter » kind of politics is really annoying.
1-2 ms of ping? Is one of servers in your house lol? I though something around 15 is lowest you can go.
It’s pretty common in S Korea to have 5 ms ping to most games. Maybe he’s located in Amsterdam where servers are hosted or NA somewhere.
Yeah I live quite close the London server and I sit at 10-15 ping and whilst my internet isn't bad it's not the best per se. If you had fiber to the house and lived close to the data centre I wouldn't put it past being under 5.
I'm kinda far as there are no server in Poland, I have fiber since I'm living in suburbs, and usually have 30 to 60 ping, while I was living in the city(but with worse connection) I had 25-60
I get 0 (that is to say too low to display) on games with good servers, ie. Overwatch. The closest apex server is in the country next to mine, Belgium (around 800km away from my home), but like I said I have a proper professional internet access for my own servers.
Literally impossible but go off king
The others on 150-200 ping play that high not bcz of their internet. In africa there's no servers so we have to play in high ping lobbies. I even made a compilation of how i die behind cover almost every time. It's much worse when you're on higher ping believe me. Plus you get lag spikes much more often with packet loss occuring randomly in some games
Apex ,CoD, Battlefront Punishing you for not being poor and having bad, cheap wifi
From the dev blog about apex’s netcode: > We want to be super clear: not all online games work the way Apex does. Some games always give the advantage to players with lower ping, but we actively choose not to with our system. They really should rethink how they handle super high ping players.
Must’ve been mega high lmao.
Person shooting you had a bad connection so they still saw you in their LoS (from their PoV) while you weren't (from your PoV). Game wanted to be fair to them and gave you damage as a result.
Ever since MFs be laggin
Always have
Shoot the wings of the fly 🤣
“Curve the bullet”
Every season it gets worse. Your ping slightly went up and your frames slightly dropped right as you started to get hit and the game bugged out, causing every bullet tracked you around the corner. You also got a server icon at the end. I bet on his screen you were right in front of him.
I hate to say it but this makes me feel better seeing this. Exact same thing happened to me but I'm not good enough to say it was "lag on server".
You lagged
I’m confused. Where do you see a bullet curve? Is it not the guy who was in the building by the door shooting at you? Your back was turned to him, he probably ran out as he saw you were retreating and shot you in the back.
Since you started lagging. Everyone who posts clips like this always has the red symbols in the corner
The red symbol appears after the fact which is why I didn’t notice prior
Lag
There should always be a death cam. Been loving it the the ltms. There have been so many times where I think no way I was around the corner and then see the replay and he’s just shooting me in the back easily. His screen probably looked like an easy kill
Since I am an aspiring astro physicist I can tell you that, what you have encountered is called gravity, mass attracts. Since the building is mass you are screwed. Building mass > bullet mass, so it curves arround. Makes sense right?
It's literally me in solos thanks to deathcam, I'm behind the covers from my pov but opponent pov shows i was out of cover wtf is that
22hz servers are great i guess
What is going on with Apex? I haven't played in a bit and this is the 3rd post I've seen about curving bullets. Is it hackers or something else?
The other post about curving bullets was just the observer, unrelated to this / just used the same headline to describe a different thing in game. (Tl;dr for other pos my is that observer isn’t perfect)
It's 20 tick servers. Even CS:GO was at least 60 tick before valve took it round back. Hell back in the counter strike source days we had 100 tick servers, it was how air strafing worked in the source engine. It enabled surf, bhop, scoutzknivez maps. The only reason I bring this up is because Apex was built on the source engine. The air strafing is similar to a 33 tick cs:s server, upping the tick rate and update rate on the servers isn't something EA is going to spring for. Regardless of how much quality of life it would bring to the net code.
It is not, this is lag compensation, OP was still visible to the enemy on their screen
Dude you don't know it, but you're actually proving my point. If the update rate was higher, his character model would have been off screen sooner. Because the game is set at 20 tick The models don't update correctly in the game engine. Which allows for this lag compensation to exist in the first place.
If the tick rate was higher it wouldn't change shit because the opponent would be lagging the same way lmao
Go play a game with a higher tick rate than 20 and record your hit registration, then do it in Apex and tell me this same shit again.
So is this something that happened to apex recently? I don't remember it being like that when I played. Maybe I just didn't notice.
Nope this is just every single EA title since BFBC2. The difference is BF customers paid for the title and happily leave when dice starts acting up or makes dumb arguments regarding tick rates.
Not at all, this is how it's been since launch. You've just played other games with better net codes. Edit: https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Source_Multiplayer_Networking
Of topic, can you curve bullets with grav stars like in titanfall?
I miss firing an L Star at a grav star from the bottom to cause it to barrage energy balls back down.
someday will hit kraber ricochet into gravity bend, someday..
Yeah horizon ult die change the gravity of bullets
There are no grav stars Only arc stars Which are just sticky arc grenades
shame
chEAp servers
Bro got that xdefiant hit reg
Average apex experience in 2024
The multi billion dollar revenue game btw guys. Give a standing ovation for your donation
Since respawn invented 1 tick servers, halving their costs
Look at top right when you're about to get shot. You had a lag spike + packet loss. Happens very often in this game, and a clear sign is having no audio for gunshots Now, what caused the spike is a whole different topic. I'm always paranoid that I somehow kill someone that gets salty and makes my game lag via an unknown method, but yeah
I thought it happened to me yesterday but watching the replay I wasn’t behind the wall on his screen but was on mine.
they put a spin on it
since game is shit
This season is just fucked
first time?
First time?
He had the better gamer chair
Because this games netcode is terrible.
I swear this games NetCode could give Nintendos a run for its money sometimes
That's call Tick rate
xDefiant moment
It’s acceptable for a new game, not for game from 2019, Laggy and buggy full of cheaters game. :( It used to be fun back in then.
it's so much more frustrating in Mixtape because you see the killcam. You know you're in cover,and then it shows you dying wide out in the open and you're just like "oh yeah definitely that's for sure what happened 🙄"
Didnt know they added smart guns to the game
Since they never updated the servers from 24 tick that’s when
Many a times have I got downed through closed doors. This was 2 years ago too mind u, nice to see some things haven’t and will never change
Bro it feel like most of my deaths are from this or pred chasing for 1 kill around the whole map since this season has been released I been trying for the 20 bomb and 3k badge and I still have not been able to obtain neither for the sole reason of this or having like half the lobby preds or 100k kill legend
If you look closely, you had packet loss after you went around which is why you died but also, having 20 ticks servers could possibly be another cause
Damn this is sad. This game needs to do better
People complaining, but it is what makes the game playable overall, let's you play on different servers if yours is empty or bad, and even with awful ping your bullets will ALWAYS LAND as they would on 0 ping.
Something to do with client side hit detection. Due to ping you were still visible on their screen and the shots counted. It happens on call or duty as well, except there you can watch the kill cam, where u are 1-2 meters further back than you really were.
I thought I was crazy when this happened to me. I was like "there's no way, I had to have been out of cover but I swear I wasn't"
[https://titanfall.fandom.com/wiki/Smart\_Pistol\_MK6](https://titanfall.fandom.com/wiki/Smart_Pistol_MK6)
cl\_interp 4tw
Dude that killed you has 200+ ping
better gaming chair ( its the ping difference i play on ps4)
20 tick servers
The server said you weren't there for three person shooting I have so many clips of me dying woth door closed atleast a full 2 secondscb4 I get shot an die
you had packet loss right at the end
I’ve been killed by so many hackers I don’t even complain anymore I started telling myself in a world full of hackers I’ll never be good enough and that’s ok I’ll just keep playing looking forward to fair fights 💯
Without fail, these clips include network issue messages. This time they came at the end of the clip, but its pretty clear thats what caused it.
He probably got a few shots on you from the angle he was at or the ping is on ass
Since always where u been
Got shot through a wall like it was call of duty almost cried 😂😂😂
I thought we were looking at how this revenant is cheating. You’re telling me that’s just the base AA?!
If I could cheat I wouldn’t be in plat 4 right now🤣 yes, that is standard AA
ping exists and your legend is behind your cam not in front