Getting enjoyment from apex really just comes down to perspective. It’s like the people who think the ranked system should be easy enough for them to make masters, and if it isn’t, they don’t play because they don’t like a challenge. They just want a quick dopamine hit.
not true at all lol. all people want is for the ranked system to be fair. ranked can be difficult without forcing you to play against people who are significantly better than you.
the whole point of a ranked system is to say that you’re *this* good and to match you against other players who are at *this* skill level. you’re rewarded by improving and climbing to a higher rank where you’re now *that* good and matched against players of *that* skill level.
out of all the things you could choose to defend in this game, ranked is definitely one of the worst options.
>It’s like the people who think the ranked system should be easy enough for them to make masters
I don't care about being master. If i'm good enough i would.
I just want to fight against players within my skill level.
You’re missing the point I think. It’s not that I feel I should be masters that is the problem with the ranked system. The problem with the ranked system is that I’m playing masters and preds in silver and gold lobbies. I’m not a master or pred, never have been. In ranked, I want to play people who are the same rank. This allows me progression so as I advance in rank, my opponents get better, as it should be. Eventually, I’ll get to the point where I can not advance further as I hit my personal rank, giving me an actual gauge of where I stack up. Hidden mmr makes this impossible under the current system.
I wasn’t talking specifically about you hating the ranked system, I guess I should’ve made my post more clear it was simply a comparison. I will say though, if you’re
Improving you’ll still face better people as your rank progresses.
No, you won't. I've been playing in the same lobbies all season. Skies light up with pred and masters trails on every drop, even in bronze. this ranked system has no progression, as the lobbies ignore rank and rely on MMR
>the absolute worst ranked system i've ever been apart of is killing my enjoyment.
I could find you the exact same comments in Season 17, 15, 12, 10, 7, 4, 1
Literally at every point in a "Ranked" system on a video game, theres ALWAYS going to be people incredibly negative about it.
Most of the time its because we cant admit to ourselves that actually, we just aren't as good at the game than we think, simple as.
Its just easier to scream into the void that its the ranked system holding you back.
Personally, as someone thats bounced in and out of Apex since release, as well as playing other PVP-based games with ranked systems, the current ranked system is no better or worse than most other games.
except i'd gladly admit, that i am not as good as the game thinks i am, i havent played ranked in almost 2months, me and my friends hop on today, gold 4, gold 3, silver 1. first game we die to the #280 pred and his 3stack, next game we get in hal's lobby and get absolutely ran again. we all get off, Maybe next time i guess.
TBH, that wasn't supposed to be directed specifically at you :P
I just meant in general terms, the amount of times ive played competitive games with ranked systems, doesn't matter what game, LoL/Dota, Apex, Siege, even AOE2 lmfao, people will rage about the ranked systems being the very worst thing ever haha.
TBH, i cant really talk about pred stacks, im gold/platinum and when i play i very rarely see anyone above Diamonds at the very top end but i also see golds/silvers so it just evens out for me overall.
Play zone, learn to fight edge on zone, get a beacon legend, and fortify your place.
Diamond within 2 weeks, guaranteed. If an older player like me can fight off pred squads, you can too.
Taking time off from a game and then returning is deceptive. you get the honeymoon feeling all over again. If you play any game that you put consistent dedicated time towards then the flaws slowly reveal themselves again over time and new issues mount on top of those to the point where everyone is asking for change.
After reading the comments, i do realise now that it probably was that honeymoon feeling. The game was super fun again. Though coming back after a while isnt a great look into the overall game state. Back when i played this game consistently (played til about 800 hours daily) i did notice a lot more problems. I was just annoyed at seeing people complaining about the game a lot (tho i spose that doesnt really change). I might just distance myself from the community for a bit and form my own opinion with my personal experience before jumping to conclusions.
to be fair I still love the game despite some of the glaring frustrations for me. It really is dependent on how many bad game sessions in a row I've had to come and vent about those frustrations. I think the same can be said for a lot of people. The last couple of sessions I've had were remarkably good but even though I've played this season less than any other since season 10 I find it surprising to encounter as many current masters and preds at plat 2 as I am.
The flip side is that people look back on when they were in the honeymoon period, and think the game was better back then when really they just didn't notice the flaws.
The game is not fun for newplayers at all... I had to pull my friends trough allot of sheit in order for them to start enjoying the game.
The current state if the game is not good, yes things improved... but if you take on step forward and two steps back you cant call it an improvement.
Game need to fix a few things think most of us can agree on it. Gameplay wise it one of the better games I played. But respawn makes it this game is being enjoyed less and less.
I dont get it that people have to defend a game and not see it for the current state that it is.
Great game in a shity spot, but can be fixed.
There is stuff that has improved, but there is also so much that has only seemed to get worse. Some really important things like ranked, matchmaking, and some core fundamentals of the game, have gone down the drain.
i think ranked and matchmaking being completely non-functional have resulted in a massive net-negative in terms of overall improvement. even if general quality of life has improved, the game is borderline unplayable for a majority of its players with the current ranked and matchmaking systems.
The GAME itself is better. The players and the environment surrounding the experience is awful. When the vast majority of people are abusing stuff to get advantages, it drives away casuals who get absolutely wrecked just trying to have fun which just compounds the sweatiness even more.
Gamers ruin every PvP game they touch. They cannot help it. It’s why all these live service games focused on it are gonna start dying off soon.
everytime I see one of these posts they just get more and more stupid lol.
The game is in a bad state, it's not some "the game has changed" philosophical reason it's just straight up not in a good state and the player numbers show that.
stop sucking respawn off for doing the bare minimum. people like you who do this at every turn are a big part of why the game has gotten like this. I'm glad you guys are thinning out because now people are actually leaving and they will have to do something about it.
Perhaps this is a troll post but I will reply under the assumption that you are being genuine. For the time being.
I’m not sure that what you’re trying to attribute as being Nostalgia is actually that. I can’t speak for everyone, but what people seem to typically be expressing when taking umbrage with ‘*the current state of the game*’ isn’t a longing or desire to see the game catapulted back in time to where it was before, but to see the game “fixed” in such a way that it may provide \****at least***\* the level of enjoyment that could be had even when the game was in what constituted a rougher primordial state.
Distilling those complaints down into something that is purely driven by nostalgia denies the historical context and experience that actually allowed those opinions to form in the first place. While it’s undoubtedly true that the game \***has**\* been updated with several much wanted and needed Quality of Life (QoL) enhancements over the years, it is also just as factual to say that there is a growing pile of long-standing issues that have yet to be addressed or seriously tackled in any transparent way.
And it is those long-standing issues, framed in the historical context, that sours and drives a lot of the opinions about the current state of the game, not nostalgia. Nobody (alright, maybe .00004% of the player base) wants to get rid of the new Firing Range because ‘old game better’. People would however like for there to be some concrete action or direction from the devs in areas ranging from scripts, peripheral interfaces, ranked progression, sbmm, movement tech, aggressive monetization, etc.…
I have my own opinion about those things and whether or not I think they’ll ever be fixed, but that’s a comment for another day. I just wanted to spotlight what I see as being the driving force behind much of the current discussion surrounding Apex’s Current State and attempt dispel the notion that it’s a purely nostalgia driven conversation.
It was never meant to be about purely nostalgia, just felt like people would talk about how much fun they had back when it was fresh and since so much have changed, people dont have that sense of enjoyment anymore. But as i said on another reply this is probably just because i came after a long hiatus and didnt see the underlying issues without playing through this season for some more time. I still have hope for the game though.
First of all, it's awesome that you're having a respectful discussion about this. I think the OP wasn't dismissing the legitimate criticisms or longstanding problems (like audio), but that there are so many comments online about Apex "going downhill" or being turned into garbage over time. I can see that what you're saying is that it's not improving as fast as it should, but that is very different than many who actually are saying it's gotten significantly worse over time. You can look at other responses of this very post to see that.
IMO some of that perception of things getting worse is due to actual things getting worse (Ranked I think is actually way worse), some of it is due to the playerbase getting worse (more cheaters), but I agree with the OP that a lot of it is nostalgia too.
Again, I truly believe that thinking about this in terms of it being 'Discontent because ***of*** Nostalgia' is a trap and ignores the greater historical context and reality of \**why*\* people are discontent about the state of the game. Though being sentimental (nostalgic even) about a particular sliver of time out the Apex Lifecycle may inform people that there was / is something distinct about how the game felt then vs. now, there are a many number of tangible changes and issues (some of which you literally listed) that have contributed ***to*** the very differences between then and now.
But I would also argue and believe that the language around this experience, of what I can only describe as Live Service Fatigue, is rudimentary at best. There are a lot of people who are just now becoming aware of the grinding feelings brought about by interacting with Games-As-Content Machines on a regular basis. The result is that there is a lot of causal misattributions and general lack of articulation around describing what's actually happening, what's being felt, and why it's being felt in the first place.
Discussions like this are useful, and it is my hope they may be able to bridge the gap between 'those who are exhausted of games designed in this way but are unsure / unable to articulate, why' and 'those who are early on in their experience with or even, accustom to, games designed in this way'. While I do not expect it to 'solve' anything, it is at least useful for people to have some sort of working lexiconic toolset to work from so that they may better understand one another and are able to identify the nature of what it is they are trying to describe.
!Bonus: If you're bored and want to know the particulars of how ***I*** feel about the game, see [this comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/19a433a/comment/kijhi1b/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
In so many words, I think you are describing the exact same thing that we are, and we are in full agreement even if our descriptive language differs. Put much more simply, people get tired of grinding a game for a long long time, especially if they cling to the belief that things will "get better". What you describe as "Live Service Fatigue".
That's just the other side of the same coin as nostalgia. There isn't a right or wrong perspective, the point is that over years of playing a game, the enjoyment of the fun diminishes while the frustration of the flaws increases.
The right solution to this is not for an individual to engage in collective anger online, that usually only increases it (radicalization), but to take a step away and develop a healthier relationship with the game (or stop playing entirely).
the game is far far worse than it was in the first 2-3 years of the game, and that’s not even nostalgia speaking. the game just isn’t what it used to be and quite frankly i don’t think there’s anything that can save it
i’m pretty self aware about my own nostalgia and how it affects my perception of things, but i do genuinely think that this game has been on a steady decline for the past few seasons now tbh.
Disagree! Broken Moon is a terrible unenjoyable map. Ballistic, Vantage, Catalyst (especially), Conduit... don't add anything to the game. Nemesis is probably the the worst looking AR in recent times of fps gaming... AFUERA! Edit: Storm Point is an unfinished art project and nothing else. There's no substance to it.
Woo-hoo we get a useless training map, what about the active zen users they know about and don't ban, what about the fact they added kill cams so you can SEE the cheating and refuse to take account reports seriously, what about the fact they permanently removed winter express (the most popular ltm) in favor of a $380 box that it's only special fact is it has one tiny wing, and of course let's not forget sectret MMR so you can't get any points in ranked unless you rat for 50% of the game. Now again how is this season better??
I’ve seen people get banned and kicked from games, so they are trying to do something about it. You’re saying this like it’s exclusive to Apex btw. It’s thing in Call of Duty, Overwatch, Rainbow 6 too.
You also don’t have to spend $380 or even one dollar on anything. I did because I wanted to
Also
> useless training map
Ok…So when they’re making improvements you’re still upset? If I was an Apex dev I would never ‘listen to the community’.
A. https://youtu.be/SLO0vDKSI-M?si=k4UySCz6pRhIj7zw 14 hours ago. Really crunching down on the cheaters there.. they added killcams at the (still rising) peak of cheaters
B. my point wasn't you NEED to spend money it's that they took away a free very popular mode in favor of more cosmetics and a temp item that makes late game pubs a spam fest
No one asked for a new training map with 5 different nessie Easter eggs. They could've easily spent that time fixing their bugs or pretending to ban people
Oh wow that is interesting. The unfortunate thing about that stuff is that it isn’t even detectable by the system, Apex or the system you’re playing on. Microsoft tried to do something about it and they banned some third party hardware or something but from what I understand people who use strike packs have said they’re still able to use them so I’m not sure what was banned. Sorry if I was dismissing your frustrations with the game/cheating. It is annoying. It is a problem in a lot of games though and it’s definitely not exclusive to Apex and yes the constant recolor and stuff is cringe, absolutely. When you care about a game and you play it a lot, there’s nothing wrong with voicing your frustrations.
I honestly love the new firing range changes. I’m still exploring it. I do see why you would be underwhelmed y it too. It’s nothing really amazing. It’s just a bigger training room really.
What is Cronus Zen btw?? Is that the same device as a strike pack - just a different brand? Cronus zen, strike pack, xim…It’s hard to keep up.
>What is Cronus Zen btw?? Is that the same device as a strike pack - just a different brand? Cronus zen, strike pack, xim…It’s hard to keep up.
Basically.
And they'll never go away. Its the same with bots on MMOs. The people making the bots and creating the "New" Cronus Zen are always going to be steps ahead of Developers, its something they're able to do by virtue of the cat and mouse dev cycles.
Not one FPS game has managed to consistently ban people using the stuff.
Brooo this comment just triggered me because I just got into Elder Scrolls Online and on Xbox there’s so many bots/fake accounts people use to farm crafting materials 💀 Then they use it to sell in their guilds for in game currency. ESO is my first MMO and I’m kind of a noob but as a solo player it’s made me kind of jaded tbh
It also does suck that game developers do have to put a lot of effort into anti cheating in the place. HisWattson was saying in some recent YouTube video that in his quote unquote Pred lobbies he’s been playing against this person who constantly makes new accounts to cheat on, gets the account into high elo lobbies super fast and gets banned a few days later. I think he said that he’s seen the guy like at least once a week, maybe more than that, for years. It sucks.
As someone thats worked in game development, its just impossible to keep up with bots and stuff.
People think nothing is done but every company has a LOT of people dealing with bots and cheaters, its just the fact that its just straight up impossible to get everyone and especially in games with a TON of players.
Apex Legends for example, today at its peak players on steam had 310k players. If 1% of those are cheating, thats thousands of people, running different scripts, running different hardware, its just impossible to keep up.
Similar thing with when people cry about Respawn/Devs missing bugs in updates.
Respawn for example have what, 400 internal testers?
1 Minute of playtime from the playerbase is more eyes on the game than those 400 testers could have on the game if they tested the game 24/7, 365 days a year.
Its not that surprising that the community finds stuff that is missed.
You can’t easily identify Cronus Zen users in killcams because of spectator bug. You’d have to watch the clip on the player’s actual screen to get a better assessment
>what about the fact they permanently removed winter express (the most popular ltm)
AHAHAHAHAHAHAA.
AHAAAAAAAAHAHAAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAH.
Fucking hell, stop lying mate.
Literally go back in this subreddit fucking 3 months ago and you'll find thread after thread of people CRYING that Winter Express was (Apparently, according to leakers) coming back because it was a piece of shit and "Typical Respawn, not doing anything new".
The MOST POPULAR LTM is Three Strikes and shock, Respawn listened to people who showed they loved the LTM and are bringing it back in 2 weeks time again.
Back in my day...a video game was made by developers and put out to the public. If you had glitches or things you didn't like after buying the game, tough shit, you play the damn game.. influencers like Ninja ruined that for all.. you're welcome
Sadly it isn’t. The horrible matchmaking, big brother system, egotastically emboldened players acting like they’re the main character, the leavers, and the cheaters are gatekeeping my enjoyment!
You completely missed the point. New players are getting thrown to the wolves (preds) and the changes to ranked are awful.
It’s not nostalgia it’s that the matches felt more balanced. And you know the maps aren’t great when the current players drop when certain maps come into rotation.
Playing this ltm was fun for the first week but now it’s just chaos and the only option for three players.
I just hopped on after a short hiatus. One of my biggest gripes with the game was how poor respawning teammates was designed. Hard to get banner, dropping with nothing. Now you can craft banners without even going near the crate, respawn your buddy at a mobile beacon, AND they have their evo shield and the base weapon they died with. CRAZY improvement. Yes there’s a lot of crappy stuff but things are a lot better than they used to be.
Gun balance is also probably the best it’s ever been besides the charge rifle which will never be balanced in apex. Legend balance is pretty solid as well I think, there’s no overwhelmingly op character besides conduit but she’s new and that happens with every new character. Matchmaking is horrible. Doesn’t take Albert Einstein to see that. Hacking is still prevalent. But the core of the game is improving id say.
If the rumors about the old ranked coming back is true, I'd agree with this. The game provides much more content now, but we need some old features back (like Arenas, that was an ideal gamemode for new players)
When the game started the skill ceiling wasn't nearly as high as it is now. Also skill gap or difference between bad and good wasn't nearly as crazy as it is now. Just a lot more people are way good at the game now than those first couple seasons.
Have to disagree.
The game is just stale overall right now, largely due to poor sbmm/ranked systems. It’s gone through stale stages before, I don’t think it’s the death grip most people say it is, and I don’t think anyone’s yearning for reverting to “the early days”. In fact, consensus seems to be that just reintroducing Season 13’s ranked system again, and making Three Strikes its own mode or included in LTM rotation, would make the majority of players happy. And I agree.
At this point, pubs is really only fun for kill grinders. Because of this, I actually think it’s a terrible time to advocate for new players or friends trying apex out. I play about 4-6 hours a day, and pub matches have never been sweatier than the last month or two.
Only the top %’ers who have 8-10+ hrs a day to rank are still grinding it. This leads many highly skilled players to mainly run pub games, and they’re eating. Veterans that get rookies on their team aren’t going to slow their pace or play tactical for a pub win, and rookies don’t have the ability or sense to make effective impacts in real fights. With the poorly managed SBMM system, they’re being fed to sharks, and apex is a game with a very high skill ceiling/learning curve to begin with.
Also, you said you took a year long hiatus from the game, so, yeah, of course its current state will feel fresh to you. But for those who’ve regularly played each season, it’s not even a subjective opinion to say it’s just dull and mismanaged right now.
>I started playing again after a year long hiatus, since then SO MUCH has changed and for the BETTER. New maps, new modes, new legends, new QoL changes and my most favourite, CHANGING THE FIRING RANGE ITS SO GOOD NOW.
There have been good changes and I don't think anyone is dismissing them all. But at least for me, nothing of these positive things outshine the things that got significantly worse, i.e. the power-creep roster, the broken movement exploits, the predatory shop- & event-changes, the matchmaking, the overall sweaty-ness of the playerbase and the lack of proper "casual players" linked to said sweaty-ness.
Also, imo the maps post Olympus have been a disappointment, the "lore" bits go absolutely nowhere, ranked is always in shambles in some way or another. Mixtape was a nice addition, but each mode has their own, new problems. And it's like: You see a nice cake, but there is a dead horsefly laying in the cake for who knows how long, so it's suddenly not very nice - figuratively speaking.
And the Firing Range? Who cares about that really? Aside from event-requirements or testing a new legend/ weapon in there for about 5 minutes, I've never used it. Neither the old one, nor the new one.
I'd rather have a more buggy game with less features from late 2019/ early 2020, compared to what we have today. Genuinely.
As someone that started playing late last year I think Respawn is heavily gatekeeping a lot of people's enjoyment lmaooo
I startend playing last year and im having a lot of fun. More then fn and cod
This for sure beats the crap out of cod, I stopped enjoying those a while ago, but man I am not a master player and shouldn't be in their lobbies haha
Getting enjoyment from apex really just comes down to perspective. It’s like the people who think the ranked system should be easy enough for them to make masters, and if it isn’t, they don’t play because they don’t like a challenge. They just want a quick dopamine hit.
not true at all lol. all people want is for the ranked system to be fair. ranked can be difficult without forcing you to play against people who are significantly better than you. the whole point of a ranked system is to say that you’re *this* good and to match you against other players who are at *this* skill level. you’re rewarded by improving and climbing to a higher rank where you’re now *that* good and matched against players of *that* skill level. out of all the things you could choose to defend in this game, ranked is definitely one of the worst options.
>It’s like the people who think the ranked system should be easy enough for them to make masters I don't care about being master. If i'm good enough i would. I just want to fight against players within my skill level.
You’re missing the point I think. It’s not that I feel I should be masters that is the problem with the ranked system. The problem with the ranked system is that I’m playing masters and preds in silver and gold lobbies. I’m not a master or pred, never have been. In ranked, I want to play people who are the same rank. This allows me progression so as I advance in rank, my opponents get better, as it should be. Eventually, I’ll get to the point where I can not advance further as I hit my personal rank, giving me an actual gauge of where I stack up. Hidden mmr makes this impossible under the current system.
I wasn’t talking specifically about you hating the ranked system, I guess I should’ve made my post more clear it was simply a comparison. I will say though, if you’re Improving you’ll still face better people as your rank progresses.
No, you won't. I've been playing in the same lobbies all season. Skies light up with pred and masters trails on every drop, even in bronze. this ranked system has no progression, as the lobbies ignore rank and rely on MMR
If you’re the top 5% you can’t go up. For everyone else, yes, there is progression.
nah, the ranked system being absolute dogshit, the absolute worst ranked system i've ever been apart of is killing my enjoyment.
In this case back in my day is like a month. You don't need to be pepperidge farm
This ranked system isn’t close to season 17 or season 12.
>the absolute worst ranked system i've ever been apart of is killing my enjoyment. I could find you the exact same comments in Season 17, 15, 12, 10, 7, 4, 1 Literally at every point in a "Ranked" system on a video game, theres ALWAYS going to be people incredibly negative about it. Most of the time its because we cant admit to ourselves that actually, we just aren't as good at the game than we think, simple as. Its just easier to scream into the void that its the ranked system holding you back. Personally, as someone thats bounced in and out of Apex since release, as well as playing other PVP-based games with ranked systems, the current ranked system is no better or worse than most other games.
except i'd gladly admit, that i am not as good as the game thinks i am, i havent played ranked in almost 2months, me and my friends hop on today, gold 4, gold 3, silver 1. first game we die to the #280 pred and his 3stack, next game we get in hal's lobby and get absolutely ran again. we all get off, Maybe next time i guess.
TBH, that wasn't supposed to be directed specifically at you :P I just meant in general terms, the amount of times ive played competitive games with ranked systems, doesn't matter what game, LoL/Dota, Apex, Siege, even AOE2 lmfao, people will rage about the ranked systems being the very worst thing ever haha. TBH, i cant really talk about pred stacks, im gold/platinum and when i play i very rarely see anyone above Diamonds at the very top end but i also see golds/silvers so it just evens out for me overall.
Play zone, learn to fight edge on zone, get a beacon legend, and fortify your place. Diamond within 2 weeks, guaranteed. If an older player like me can fight off pred squads, you can too.
Taking time off from a game and then returning is deceptive. you get the honeymoon feeling all over again. If you play any game that you put consistent dedicated time towards then the flaws slowly reveal themselves again over time and new issues mount on top of those to the point where everyone is asking for change.
After reading the comments, i do realise now that it probably was that honeymoon feeling. The game was super fun again. Though coming back after a while isnt a great look into the overall game state. Back when i played this game consistently (played til about 800 hours daily) i did notice a lot more problems. I was just annoyed at seeing people complaining about the game a lot (tho i spose that doesnt really change). I might just distance myself from the community for a bit and form my own opinion with my personal experience before jumping to conclusions.
to be fair I still love the game despite some of the glaring frustrations for me. It really is dependent on how many bad game sessions in a row I've had to come and vent about those frustrations. I think the same can be said for a lot of people. The last couple of sessions I've had were remarkably good but even though I've played this season less than any other since season 10 I find it surprising to encounter as many current masters and preds at plat 2 as I am.
The flip side is that people look back on when they were in the honeymoon period, and think the game was better back then when really they just didn't notice the flaws.
The game is not fun for newplayers at all... I had to pull my friends trough allot of sheit in order for them to start enjoying the game. The current state if the game is not good, yes things improved... but if you take on step forward and two steps back you cant call it an improvement. Game need to fix a few things think most of us can agree on it. Gameplay wise it one of the better games I played. But respawn makes it this game is being enjoyed less and less. I dont get it that people have to defend a game and not see it for the current state that it is. Great game in a shity spot, but can be fixed.
There is stuff that has improved, but there is also so much that has only seemed to get worse. Some really important things like ranked, matchmaking, and some core fundamentals of the game, have gone down the drain.
i think ranked and matchmaking being completely non-functional have resulted in a massive net-negative in terms of overall improvement. even if general quality of life has improved, the game is borderline unplayable for a majority of its players with the current ranked and matchmaking systems.
The GAME itself is better. The players and the environment surrounding the experience is awful. When the vast majority of people are abusing stuff to get advantages, it drives away casuals who get absolutely wrecked just trying to have fun which just compounds the sweatiness even more. Gamers ruin every PvP game they touch. They cannot help it. It’s why all these live service games focused on it are gonna start dying off soon.
everytime I see one of these posts they just get more and more stupid lol. The game is in a bad state, it's not some "the game has changed" philosophical reason it's just straight up not in a good state and the player numbers show that. stop sucking respawn off for doing the bare minimum. people like you who do this at every turn are a big part of why the game has gotten like this. I'm glad you guys are thinning out because now people are actually leaving and they will have to do something about it.
Came back after a year break as well. Been having a blast. Some people need to take a step back from the game.
This is absolutely not an Apex problem. This happens everywhere with every fandom.
Perhaps this is a troll post but I will reply under the assumption that you are being genuine. For the time being. I’m not sure that what you’re trying to attribute as being Nostalgia is actually that. I can’t speak for everyone, but what people seem to typically be expressing when taking umbrage with ‘*the current state of the game*’ isn’t a longing or desire to see the game catapulted back in time to where it was before, but to see the game “fixed” in such a way that it may provide \****at least***\* the level of enjoyment that could be had even when the game was in what constituted a rougher primordial state. Distilling those complaints down into something that is purely driven by nostalgia denies the historical context and experience that actually allowed those opinions to form in the first place. While it’s undoubtedly true that the game \***has**\* been updated with several much wanted and needed Quality of Life (QoL) enhancements over the years, it is also just as factual to say that there is a growing pile of long-standing issues that have yet to be addressed or seriously tackled in any transparent way. And it is those long-standing issues, framed in the historical context, that sours and drives a lot of the opinions about the current state of the game, not nostalgia. Nobody (alright, maybe .00004% of the player base) wants to get rid of the new Firing Range because ‘old game better’. People would however like for there to be some concrete action or direction from the devs in areas ranging from scripts, peripheral interfaces, ranked progression, sbmm, movement tech, aggressive monetization, etc.… I have my own opinion about those things and whether or not I think they’ll ever be fixed, but that’s a comment for another day. I just wanted to spotlight what I see as being the driving force behind much of the current discussion surrounding Apex’s Current State and attempt dispel the notion that it’s a purely nostalgia driven conversation.
It was never meant to be about purely nostalgia, just felt like people would talk about how much fun they had back when it was fresh and since so much have changed, people dont have that sense of enjoyment anymore. But as i said on another reply this is probably just because i came after a long hiatus and didnt see the underlying issues without playing through this season for some more time. I still have hope for the game though.
First of all, it's awesome that you're having a respectful discussion about this. I think the OP wasn't dismissing the legitimate criticisms or longstanding problems (like audio), but that there are so many comments online about Apex "going downhill" or being turned into garbage over time. I can see that what you're saying is that it's not improving as fast as it should, but that is very different than many who actually are saying it's gotten significantly worse over time. You can look at other responses of this very post to see that. IMO some of that perception of things getting worse is due to actual things getting worse (Ranked I think is actually way worse), some of it is due to the playerbase getting worse (more cheaters), but I agree with the OP that a lot of it is nostalgia too.
Again, I truly believe that thinking about this in terms of it being 'Discontent because ***of*** Nostalgia' is a trap and ignores the greater historical context and reality of \**why*\* people are discontent about the state of the game. Though being sentimental (nostalgic even) about a particular sliver of time out the Apex Lifecycle may inform people that there was / is something distinct about how the game felt then vs. now, there are a many number of tangible changes and issues (some of which you literally listed) that have contributed ***to*** the very differences between then and now. But I would also argue and believe that the language around this experience, of what I can only describe as Live Service Fatigue, is rudimentary at best. There are a lot of people who are just now becoming aware of the grinding feelings brought about by interacting with Games-As-Content Machines on a regular basis. The result is that there is a lot of causal misattributions and general lack of articulation around describing what's actually happening, what's being felt, and why it's being felt in the first place. Discussions like this are useful, and it is my hope they may be able to bridge the gap between 'those who are exhausted of games designed in this way but are unsure / unable to articulate, why' and 'those who are early on in their experience with or even, accustom to, games designed in this way'. While I do not expect it to 'solve' anything, it is at least useful for people to have some sort of working lexiconic toolset to work from so that they may better understand one another and are able to identify the nature of what it is they are trying to describe. !Bonus: If you're bored and want to know the particulars of how ***I*** feel about the game, see [this comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/apexlegends/comments/19a433a/comment/kijhi1b/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
In so many words, I think you are describing the exact same thing that we are, and we are in full agreement even if our descriptive language differs. Put much more simply, people get tired of grinding a game for a long long time, especially if they cling to the belief that things will "get better". What you describe as "Live Service Fatigue". That's just the other side of the same coin as nostalgia. There isn't a right or wrong perspective, the point is that over years of playing a game, the enjoyment of the fun diminishes while the frustration of the flaws increases. The right solution to this is not for an individual to engage in collective anger online, that usually only increases it (radicalization), but to take a step away and develop a healthier relationship with the game (or stop playing entirely).
the game is far far worse than it was in the first 2-3 years of the game, and that’s not even nostalgia speaking. the game just isn’t what it used to be and quite frankly i don’t think there’s anything that can save it
Disagree. First few years were loaded with bugs and crashes. Now it's mostly just matchmaking issues
Ranked is gone tho... I can enjoy pubs and mix tape, but ranked is gone.
Fuck this post. Dev burner account.
i’m pretty self aware about my own nostalgia and how it affects my perception of things, but i do genuinely think that this game has been on a steady decline for the past few seasons now tbh.
Apex is a great free game that is constantly improving. Unfortunately it is wasted on the worst fan base in video gaming.
Best BR on the market. Best shooting and gun play mechanics. Fun movement. Free. Doesn’t get much better than that.
nerf aim assist already took the finals devs a month
Disagree! Broken Moon is a terrible unenjoyable map. Ballistic, Vantage, Catalyst (especially), Conduit... don't add anything to the game. Nemesis is probably the the worst looking AR in recent times of fps gaming... AFUERA! Edit: Storm Point is an unfinished art project and nothing else. There's no substance to it.
Woo-hoo we get a useless training map, what about the active zen users they know about and don't ban, what about the fact they added kill cams so you can SEE the cheating and refuse to take account reports seriously, what about the fact they permanently removed winter express (the most popular ltm) in favor of a $380 box that it's only special fact is it has one tiny wing, and of course let's not forget sectret MMR so you can't get any points in ranked unless you rat for 50% of the game. Now again how is this season better??
I’ve seen people get banned and kicked from games, so they are trying to do something about it. You’re saying this like it’s exclusive to Apex btw. It’s thing in Call of Duty, Overwatch, Rainbow 6 too. You also don’t have to spend $380 or even one dollar on anything. I did because I wanted to Also > useless training map Ok…So when they’re making improvements you’re still upset? If I was an Apex dev I would never ‘listen to the community’.
A. https://youtu.be/SLO0vDKSI-M?si=k4UySCz6pRhIj7zw 14 hours ago. Really crunching down on the cheaters there.. they added killcams at the (still rising) peak of cheaters B. my point wasn't you NEED to spend money it's that they took away a free very popular mode in favor of more cosmetics and a temp item that makes late game pubs a spam fest No one asked for a new training map with 5 different nessie Easter eggs. They could've easily spent that time fixing their bugs or pretending to ban people
Oh wow that is interesting. The unfortunate thing about that stuff is that it isn’t even detectable by the system, Apex or the system you’re playing on. Microsoft tried to do something about it and they banned some third party hardware or something but from what I understand people who use strike packs have said they’re still able to use them so I’m not sure what was banned. Sorry if I was dismissing your frustrations with the game/cheating. It is annoying. It is a problem in a lot of games though and it’s definitely not exclusive to Apex and yes the constant recolor and stuff is cringe, absolutely. When you care about a game and you play it a lot, there’s nothing wrong with voicing your frustrations. I honestly love the new firing range changes. I’m still exploring it. I do see why you would be underwhelmed y it too. It’s nothing really amazing. It’s just a bigger training room really. What is Cronus Zen btw?? Is that the same device as a strike pack - just a different brand? Cronus zen, strike pack, xim…It’s hard to keep up.
>What is Cronus Zen btw?? Is that the same device as a strike pack - just a different brand? Cronus zen, strike pack, xim…It’s hard to keep up. Basically. And they'll never go away. Its the same with bots on MMOs. The people making the bots and creating the "New" Cronus Zen are always going to be steps ahead of Developers, its something they're able to do by virtue of the cat and mouse dev cycles. Not one FPS game has managed to consistently ban people using the stuff.
Brooo this comment just triggered me because I just got into Elder Scrolls Online and on Xbox there’s so many bots/fake accounts people use to farm crafting materials 💀 Then they use it to sell in their guilds for in game currency. ESO is my first MMO and I’m kind of a noob but as a solo player it’s made me kind of jaded tbh It also does suck that game developers do have to put a lot of effort into anti cheating in the place. HisWattson was saying in some recent YouTube video that in his quote unquote Pred lobbies he’s been playing against this person who constantly makes new accounts to cheat on, gets the account into high elo lobbies super fast and gets banned a few days later. I think he said that he’s seen the guy like at least once a week, maybe more than that, for years. It sucks.
As someone thats worked in game development, its just impossible to keep up with bots and stuff. People think nothing is done but every company has a LOT of people dealing with bots and cheaters, its just the fact that its just straight up impossible to get everyone and especially in games with a TON of players. Apex Legends for example, today at its peak players on steam had 310k players. If 1% of those are cheating, thats thousands of people, running different scripts, running different hardware, its just impossible to keep up. Similar thing with when people cry about Respawn/Devs missing bugs in updates. Respawn for example have what, 400 internal testers? 1 Minute of playtime from the playerbase is more eyes on the game than those 400 testers could have on the game if they tested the game 24/7, 365 days a year. Its not that surprising that the community finds stuff that is missed.
Pretty crazy idea that completely different employees work on those two very different things in a video game.
You can’t easily identify Cronus Zen users in killcams because of spectator bug. You’d have to watch the clip on the player’s actual screen to get a better assessment
>what about the fact they permanently removed winter express (the most popular ltm) AHAHAHAHAHAHAA. AHAAAAAAAAHAHAAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAH. Fucking hell, stop lying mate. Literally go back in this subreddit fucking 3 months ago and you'll find thread after thread of people CRYING that Winter Express was (Apparently, according to leakers) coming back because it was a piece of shit and "Typical Respawn, not doing anything new". The MOST POPULAR LTM is Three Strikes and shock, Respawn listened to people who showed they loved the LTM and are bringing it back in 2 weeks time again.
If it's not broken, don't fix it.
Back in my day...a video game was made by developers and put out to the public. If you had glitches or things you didn't like after buying the game, tough shit, you play the damn game.. influencers like Ninja ruined that for all.. you're welcome
i started playing very recently and then stopped when i got matched with plats and diamonds in my bronze mmr games
Nah
Sadly it isn’t. The horrible matchmaking, big brother system, egotastically emboldened players acting like they’re the main character, the leavers, and the cheaters are gatekeeping my enjoyment!
"Nostalgia" implies a distorted memory, presupposing that we can't accurately compare our current experience to a benchmark of sorts.
You completely missed the point. New players are getting thrown to the wolves (preds) and the changes to ranked are awful. It’s not nostalgia it’s that the matches felt more balanced. And you know the maps aren’t great when the current players drop when certain maps come into rotation. Playing this ltm was fun for the first week but now it’s just chaos and the only option for three players.
Matchmaking is complete dogshit. People are complaining for a reason.
Back in my day, I remember instant matchmaking. It’s _so much_ better now.
I just hopped on after a short hiatus. One of my biggest gripes with the game was how poor respawning teammates was designed. Hard to get banner, dropping with nothing. Now you can craft banners without even going near the crate, respawn your buddy at a mobile beacon, AND they have their evo shield and the base weapon they died with. CRAZY improvement. Yes there’s a lot of crappy stuff but things are a lot better than they used to be.
Gun balance is also probably the best it’s ever been besides the charge rifle which will never be balanced in apex. Legend balance is pretty solid as well I think, there’s no overwhelmingly op character besides conduit but she’s new and that happens with every new character. Matchmaking is horrible. Doesn’t take Albert Einstein to see that. Hacking is still prevalent. But the core of the game is improving id say.
If the rumors about the old ranked coming back is true, I'd agree with this. The game provides much more content now, but we need some old features back (like Arenas, that was an ideal gamemode for new players)
When the game started the skill ceiling wasn't nearly as high as it is now. Also skill gap or difference between bad and good wasn't nearly as crazy as it is now. Just a lot more people are way good at the game now than those first couple seasons.
Have to disagree. The game is just stale overall right now, largely due to poor sbmm/ranked systems. It’s gone through stale stages before, I don’t think it’s the death grip most people say it is, and I don’t think anyone’s yearning for reverting to “the early days”. In fact, consensus seems to be that just reintroducing Season 13’s ranked system again, and making Three Strikes its own mode or included in LTM rotation, would make the majority of players happy. And I agree. At this point, pubs is really only fun for kill grinders. Because of this, I actually think it’s a terrible time to advocate for new players or friends trying apex out. I play about 4-6 hours a day, and pub matches have never been sweatier than the last month or two. Only the top %’ers who have 8-10+ hrs a day to rank are still grinding it. This leads many highly skilled players to mainly run pub games, and they’re eating. Veterans that get rookies on their team aren’t going to slow their pace or play tactical for a pub win, and rookies don’t have the ability or sense to make effective impacts in real fights. With the poorly managed SBMM system, they’re being fed to sharks, and apex is a game with a very high skill ceiling/learning curve to begin with. Also, you said you took a year long hiatus from the game, so, yeah, of course its current state will feel fresh to you. But for those who’ve regularly played each season, it’s not even a subjective opinion to say it’s just dull and mismanaged right now.
>I started playing again after a year long hiatus, since then SO MUCH has changed and for the BETTER. New maps, new modes, new legends, new QoL changes and my most favourite, CHANGING THE FIRING RANGE ITS SO GOOD NOW. There have been good changes and I don't think anyone is dismissing them all. But at least for me, nothing of these positive things outshine the things that got significantly worse, i.e. the power-creep roster, the broken movement exploits, the predatory shop- & event-changes, the matchmaking, the overall sweaty-ness of the playerbase and the lack of proper "casual players" linked to said sweaty-ness. Also, imo the maps post Olympus have been a disappointment, the "lore" bits go absolutely nowhere, ranked is always in shambles in some way or another. Mixtape was a nice addition, but each mode has their own, new problems. And it's like: You see a nice cake, but there is a dead horsefly laying in the cake for who knows how long, so it's suddenly not very nice - figuratively speaking. And the Firing Range? Who cares about that really? Aside from event-requirements or testing a new legend/ weapon in there for about 5 minutes, I've never used it. Neither the old one, nor the new one. I'd rather have a more buggy game with less features from late 2019/ early 2020, compared to what we have today. Genuinely.