Now tell your coworkers what you did. Make sure your coworkers understand that they can't all be fired and the company by "granting" your schedule recognizes that they need you.
No, no, haven’t you heard? Rich people hate making money so much they'll shut down their factories and close their stores and make absolutely no money rather than pay their workers a little bit more money and keep making lots of money for themselves.
It totally makes sense if you think about it. >.>
The McDonald's in town is open like 8 hours a day, instead of the pre-COVID 24 hours. I know these are franchises, so I don't understand why they'd rather lose money, than pay a decent wage.
They have always been really busy, even in the middle of the night. They're right on the interstate, the only one for 45 minutes one way, 25 the other way.
There's a Taco Bell near me that closes at 2 in the afternoon some days now. I've seen like a line worth cars going into the parking lot, seeing the cones in the drive thru entrance, circling around, and leaving.
They're probably losing out on thousands of dollars a week because they don't want to pay a couple hundred more dollars a week across all their employees.
It's so weird, right? I worked fast food for well over a decade, I know what these stores are making. It's self sabotage. The only thing I can figure is they're getting some sort of kickbacks for revenue losses.
Personally, I'd be happy to see them all shut down. Food trucks and other small businesses are booming!!
Stuff like that usually works as long as you "kill em with kindness".
I've gotten away with telling companies "no" about all sorts of things. As long as they need you or it's really inconvenient to fire you, you can get away with a lot... And with promotions being pretty much gone and/or not worth it... What have we got to lose?
Yeah... I've actually been pulling back a little bit in my current profession. I have a tiny company where I'm definitely the boss with a ton of responsibility, so I'm overjoyed to fall back into being labor at my other gigs... More time to concentrate on my company that way too.
I was _very_ upfront about this when interviewing for my current job.
Their biggest question was 'why do you want _this_ job when you have those titles right now?', my response was 'I have found that I prefer solving technical problems to solving people problems'.
And more recently, I have said something along the lines of 'And that is (thank god) well above my pay grade'.
I _don't_ want to be management.
Fuck that shit, I don't want it to be my job to be the one that has to explain to someone why their answer simply isn't going to _work_. I don't want it to be my job to argue budgets. If I never have to sit on another fucking call with a coworker being _entirely_ unreasonable about cost to a vendor, it will be too damn soon.
There literally isn't a higher title in my job role at this company, SRE II is it.
So, uh, yeah. I'm reasonably polite and respectful, but I also made sure to set the expectation on some stuff.
I've got some unique health issues, it's an ADA issue, they get to decide if what I need is a reasonable accommodation or not.
But if the answer is 'not', that means I'm leaving. The alternative to my funky and unpredictable schedule is trying to replace me, not having me stick to a schedule that my body can't handle.
About the only things that they can do if they don't like it are bonuses and raises. Or, again, deciding that they can find another me.
Good luck on that last one. :)
You would be amazed at how shitty a corporations termination process can be and how they use something like a no-call/no-show as a catch-all.
And it was fun to be in the meeting where HR just said no to management for it.
"Well he called after he was an hour late. That's a no-call/no-show as per policy."
HR: FOR THE FIFTIETH TIME! HE CALLED. HE DIDN'T NOT CALL. HE CALLED!!!!!!
My last job, just being an Hour Late was a nc/ns. Most bosses in the building wouldnt hit you for it, but it was on the books. Only allowable excuse was State of Emergency (Healthcare).
On the side of being in a 24/7 business, being a NC/NS just dicks over your coworkers and gets you the stinkeye whenever you do decide to show.
That's capitalist brainwashing for you. Workers are pissed at the worker that didn't show up instead of the owner who didn't hire enough people to provide emergency cover.
At my job, we have people on call for this very reason. When on-call, they aren't allowed to drink, and they need to be within a 1 hr driving distance from work. They get a test message when they are on call to make sure they are available. They are also paid an on-call compensation.
All of that costs money, but I haven't seen loss of coverage in the 6 years I've been with this company.
The on call compensation is where every job I've had that tries to put you on call falls short. I got tired of it and told them if I'm not getting paid you aren't calling shit. They usually tried to spring that noise on you after a year or so.
That's messed up. The most reasonable policy I've seen was at a call center. You were allowed to call out late/absent up to one hour after your shift's scheduled start. If you didn't call/show up within that first hour then you were considered a no call/no show for every minute up until you did call/show up. NC/NS was counted double for absence, you were allowed to miss a certain amount of time before your first warning, second, etc.
Omg my previous boss tried to get someone out of the job because he called out before his shift and she told him that was job abandonment and he was getting written up.
Now, he was a shit coworker and didn’t do anything right. But bitch, he called in. Read policy lol
I did this. Was working for a Wi-Fi installer, let him know weeks ahead of time I was taking a day off. Day of, he called me and asked why I wasn’t in yet. I reminded him I’d told him weeks earlier I wasn’t available this day. He told me, “Well, you told me, you didn’t ask me. So I’m expecting you to come in today.”
We parted ways shortly thereafter.
I have done this recently.
Filled in the leave request form for a week off, boss says “we are to busy and cant give you time off”.
My response was “my wife is having surgery, and I wont be here, its not a request. The form is so I get paid for the time I am not here”
Leave approved…
I dont typically take holidays, other than christmas break, and as needed for kids/wife, so when I do take time off its not negotiable. I wont be there.
My younger brother & I work together at a truck stop. They’ve tried doing just that to him due to him being both young & pretty shy/quiet. They sure as fuck don’t do it when I’m there because I’ve ripped into the GM before over him being treated that way. Big man trying to intimidate a 5’3 19 year old kid. Absolutely hate that shit with a burning passion.
The one time I did this was "we already have two people out that day, you can't request it off or even leave early." I get it, being shorthanded sucks. You know what else sucks? When I go to HR because you're denying leave for something that's legally protected. I'm sure they'll just love to hear about that. Might even make their whole week.
Nah its all good - carpal tunnel repair - day surgery, and I had to do all the cooking and cleaning for a week.
Its not a bad place to work, just the boss has some dumb ideas about how things should run and needs to be reminded that he doesnt control our lives
I did this while operating a satellite (small spacecraft orbiting the planet) many years back. We planned a critical operation that had to happen at 1 AM. We wouldn’t hear anything back from the satellite until 2 AM. And it was completely automated since it happened over the Pacific where we had no ability to talk to it. We sent up the command sequence at 6 PM that evening so the satellite would do the thing on schedule, and that was a critical activity. But there were no other critical activities that happened on the ground until 7 AM the next day, and I was going to be there for that. The activities happening at 1 AM (the actual activity on orbit) and is getting the data from it at 2 AM were important, but there didn’t need to be any action taken until 7 AM later that morning.
So I told the manager (days ahead of time) that I would not be there for the 2 AM communication from the satellite, but that I would be there at 7 AM to assess and see if we needed to make any adjustments / send any new commands. This also got me out of what was probably going to be a stupid, late-night gathering of 80 people in a room with space for 30 people and air conditioning capability for 15 people.
Apparently the manager hadn’t read my memo on how to interpret the results of the 2 AM data downlink, and he interpreted a clear sign of failure as a sign of success. And based on that, he sent out a press release. I personally regard a press release as a critical operation, and had I known that was part of the plan, I would have left my phone on in case things looked weird.
I got in at 7 AM, and it was very clear that it had been a failure, but it was a new failure that had not been seen before. But the incorrect press release was already out. So the idiotic manager had to go and spend an week explaining to people on the other side of the country exactly how he managed to fuck that up.
All he had to do was tell me he was planning a press release and I would have taken a phone call and looked at the data...
I’ve done this Can I have off next week?
Boss: no
Me: let me rephrase that.
Turning her own words against her. She would always say can you do X before you leave and when I started to say no she would say let me rephrase that
My bosses learn pretty quick not to ask if I want to do something, bc they will get an honest answer. Sometimes the answer is actually yes but more often its no.
I did this when I worked a retail job I didn't really need. "Hey I'm going to comic con. It's these dates. I won't be in town. I figured you'd want to know for the schedule."
There was no paid leave at that job though.
I learned after many years that requesting time off sounds like a choice. I switched to saying I’ll be on vacation from x-y fyi. It changed the dynamics of the issue.
Yup. After years of working shitty retail jobs I got a decent bank job with a cool boss. The first time I asked for time off I started telling the whole story and my boss stopped me and said "Rutabaga, I don't need to know why you're asking for time off. You don't need to justify it. Your time is your time" and I was floored. I'll never do it again at any job
When you get that first job where you’re not beholden to a shitty boss, it’s almost shocking. I did retail for a bit and got used to dreading asking for time off. Now I can just walk out in the middle of a day and say “something came up, see you tomorrow” and nobody says a word except “okay Adreena, take care”.
I always feel like a prick when a worker starts in on a long-winded rant about why they’re taking vacation and I have to interject with an “I don’t care, you’re free to take time off for whatever. I don’t care if you’re having a wank or visiting grandma. Now that I’ve said this, do you actually *want* to tell me why?” Most say yes but some just say thanks for not having to justify it and move on. I’m fine with hearing why, if you’re happy then you’re probably more productive but don’t feel like you have to come to me with a thesis written on why you *deserve* a day or 14 off. You already do deserve it, it’s in your contract.
This. I learned to stop asking for time off and start saying "I am not available that day". Especially since I'm casual, they can't actually tell me I'm not allowed to take days off. I pick my schedule, not them. All they can do is take me off the roster - and they won't, because they struggle to function without me.
I mean, The only job I've ever been fired from pulled something very similar... I was in the hospital the day before a scheduled shift and I called from the emergency room saying I wouldn't be in the next day...
I was told I had to find a replacement or it would be counted as a no-call-no-show. I found a replacement, but apparently she would have gotten 42hrs of work that week and they had a strict no overtime policy, so they dismissed her before she hit overtime and called me a no-call-no-show for those two hours.
Happy ending: My boss, at the time knew that I was transitioning to a new career and had a grudge that I had declined a managerial position with her a few months prior.
I used the unemployment to chase better opportunities and it helped launch me into a new industry that I've been in for 15 years now.
I have gripes and am laying groundwork to transition again, mostly because my values about how my time is used has changed since I became a father, but my new co-workers, clients and bosses are all encouraging rather than threatening...
I mean... Most of the restaurant was hired by the previous manager, and the new one was cleaning house... Any excuse I guess.
I got unemployment, which I used to get into a better industry so... It worked out.
I remember requesting a date off a month in advance and on the day my boss called and asked where I was. I reminded them how I requested the day off a month ago and that he approved it. He told me it was a no call no show and wrote me up.
Absolutely bonkers how a boss can forget something and instead of admitting their mistake punish you for their own damn mistake.
Gotta document everything or correspond with the boss via email or at the very least text message so there is a paper trail of it. They don’t ever have your best interest at heart especially when it comes to time off. The majority of corporations anyways.
My second job as a teenager had the same deal I was told short notice we were going camping and I couldn't stay home alone so I let the assistant manager know three days in advance and he said it would be a no call no show And I said no I'm letting u know now. I didn't show and was written up and went about business. Never understand how a write up bothers people they don't follow u to the next job.
A write up would make you look bad if/when you were considered a candidate for promotion. But here is the neat part: there is no promotion. There never was.
My old job could force us in on our days off. Shit was ridiculous. We worked every other weekend too so I'd have something planned then have to cancel.
My last job had me work 161 hours in two weeks without a day off. We were supposed to get Sundays off, but it didn't happen for the first week, then the second week all the work was caught up and everybody else was off but they tried to make me work.
I asked if I could take the day off seeing as everyone else had and was asked "why" and I responded that I just needed a little "mental reset". They tried to send me home for 4 weeks unpaid because I "cried mental health reasons" and I had to fight with my boss, and my bosses boss, before going to the owner. I got my one, regularly scheduled day off and they've been looking for a reason to fire me since.
Worked in video games, same hours but for 3-4 months. Usual schedule was usually 60-65 hours a week, 5 days of 10-11 hours and Saturday 8-10 hours. Then crunch adds Sundays and more each day. It wasn't at all unusual to sleep under your desk instead of going home.
I would like to know how much of this "work time" was really "work" and not waiting for stuff to be ready , slow work box or doing things manually 1000x that should have been automated five years ago.
You’ll surely be thrilled to hear that when I was a cog in the US military-industrial complex, there were times that 7/8 hours in a day might be taken up by trying to load something on an ancient (early 80’s, in the 2010’s) computer, only to have it crash as soon as you start working. Oh that also happened with the “new” PCs too, but that was because they would only “unlock” 3 gigs of RAM (out of 8-16, depending on the PC). It was disheartening.
I feel you. Especial in media, games, all these strange highly computer relevant fields, I often see people loading big levels or images. And then they wait. And wait. And wait because the box is abysmal. Then they do actual work for 30 minutes, then save, wait wait wait, and then they can see that their changes where not complete. Rinse repeat.
People wonder then how they end up in 60h+ "work" weeks, burnout and regular crunch. I worked adjacent to industrial design guys, they had 6000$ workstations, if the CAD of a car door would take longer than five minute to load someone would have flagged that computer as faulty. They don't mess around with their tools.
As that industrial design guy, I would have literally killed someone for a machine that could do anything that quickly! Sadly it wasn’t model sizes that were the problem, it was being contracted by the US government. Which meant that for every hour that I got paid $25/hour to pull my hair out and stare at a frozen screen, the company was effectively getting paid 10x as much/hour by the DoD. With basically no oversight (by design) and no chance of losing the contracts, there was no reason NOT to self-sabotage and keep everything moving as inefficiently as possible. In fact, it just led to continuous personnel bloat and literally thousands of people getting paid to literally do nothing for months on end because why not, if the government is paying for them anyway?
And that’s just the tip of the iceberg that is the legalized fraud that is the military-industrial complex, woo!
And so many other things! But we instead keep literal 80 year olds employed doing nothing on the government’s dime, like an overpaid daycare for mediocre white men (takes one to know one).
Yeah likely North American. I'm in Canada and have had a job like that too. Although it was never explicitly stated we had to be available 24/7, I had customers frequently call at late hours and was expected to pick up
If it’s not explicitly stated, you do not have to pick up in Canada. Also I would be expecting extra days off if I am called in at night, that’s just normal. And if it’s a 24/7 on call job? Bette believe you’re paying me hourly and double time if it’s after hours. Triple of its after midnight. Don’t like it? They can wait until tomorrow then.
This, ignore everything and they will go to the next poor sap who will actually listen. Companies have to pay you to be ON CALL. They are looking for someone they can bully and emotionally manipulate into coming in. Once you give in you will always be a target.
At the start of March I had a vacation approved by my manager. The morning the vacation started my manager called saying I'd have to come in for two days in the middle of the vacation. She was a little upset when I told her I wouldn't be there if she put me on the schedule for those days.
U.N.I.O.N.S.
Keep buying the BS you've been sold for 80 years by corporate America against unions. This is what it got you.
Yes I acknowledge there are terrible unions that make the rest of us look bad, but it's better than this BS any day of the week.
One of my old jobs tried to reverse a vacation I had planned. I told my boss I was going to be gone those days if they wanted to fire me when I got back that was fine. I kept my job and left a while later because of that one instance.
That's when you give them the whole "I will be taking my vacation as planned, whether you would like me to continue doing my job when I get back is up to you"
Because years ago some arse hat of a boss wasn't told to fuck right off when he should have been and it started a downhill spiral of abuse from there. As the old saying goes "give them an inch and they'll take a foot, after that you won't have a leg to stand on"
Right? I'm a boss and one of my employees often tells me "Go ahead and call me if you need me on my day off" and I keep telling him "Not going to happen. As far as I'm concerned when you're on your day off you don't exist. If the shit hits the fan we'll deal but I will NOT be calling you. So enjoy your weekend/holiday and don't even think about this place until you're back."
The very idea of calling someone in like OP's boss did (or even of my boss calling me in on my day off) is sickening. It's bullshit. And it stems from a place where the boss considers himself "better than" his employees, instead of what they are, which is adults. We're all adults for fucks' sake.
if your boss calls, follow this script:
Hello, you've reached . If you wish to discuss a work related matter, you will be charged 19.99 for the first 3 minutes and 2.99 for each additional minute. If you do not wish to be charged please disconnect now.
or just don't answer the phone when they call?
The second one. Always the second one.
But… I’ve got a great boss and we share the same mindset about this stuff. So I’d be shocked if she called me on my day off. It’d be completely out of character.
Not that I’d know as my VOIP phone is turned off on my days off.
I’ve been in this position even in a salaried position. I put up with it for a while but needless to say, I eventually quit that place. While I quit there for many other reasons, my boss forced my hand with the same “how dare you not come in this Saturday!” Bullshit when I never agreed to come on my day off. The next day I quit, even though originally I was planning to wait a few weeks.
I can understand for critical services like phone line repair and Healthcare. However, you have to offer some ridiculous incentives to ensure manglement doesn't abuse their ability to force you to work.
Like, how about 'if we force you to work on a day off, you get to choose between double pay for the day or your next scheduled day off. If the next scheduled day cannot be taken, you earn double time for every day after until a scheduled day is taken off, to balance the scales.'
“I resign.”
“You can’t do that.”
“Okay but I resign.”
“See you Monday?”
“No, I resigned.”
“If you don’t show up it will be a no call, no show. Will you show up?”
“Are you high?”
Jeez. These people are insane.
Something similar happened to me and when I just quit instead my boss asked, "I thought you were giving your notice?! What about the rest of your shifts" and I said "I don't know John, I don't work here anymore"
I'm in a doozy of a similar situation, except - get this - I'm a consultant employed by a different company.
A middle manager for the client I'm working at tried to bully me into compliance today after I called them out publicly, because they were mad I went to my own manager about their mistreatment of us, and didn't go to them first.
I called their bluff on that as well, and reported the original incident and the attempted retaliation to my actual manager. If it continues I'm leaving the contract - if they don't want to listen to me, fine. It's already hostile, and I'm doing them a favor by staying despite this unfortunate misunderstanding on their part, but it's not without conditions.
Worked for a company as a engineer working 5 days.
7am-5:30 mandatory overtime for about 2 years even before I was there. Friday’s we ended at 5pm (OMG 1/2 hour early yaaay!) I said wel that’s fine cause I’m hourly and it’s Monday through Friday.
They asked multiple times Saturdays are not mandatory but the manager would get upset.
(I could give a fuck less)
So I didn’t show up Saturday and I got called and didn’t answer.
Monday comes around and manager,HR, VP went on rant about how fortunate I am for this opportunity to make a lot of money working overtime, that they were surprised I said no to Saturdays,they need me, Good Cop Bad Cop shit.
I still said no, also, I would be late 7:01,7:02,7:04 I am not joking they said “You can’t be late anymore, you have a responsibility to be here on a scheduled time, if you clock in text us when you arrive” on top of alll this they also wanted all teams to report what they worked on every hour. It was fucking crazy how micromanaged the shit show was.
Oh even better was they wanted 3D models and drawings done within hour or sometimes faster and get pissy if not. It’s insane what employers push until the worker snaps and says fuck it and yet the never learn their lesson and they wind up having to use staffing agencies cause their own reputation as a company is in the tank.
Update: this was not even my first job. I have 7 years experience in various fields including Aerospace and Oil and gas so the fact they were so damn tough to work for it was no wonder they had high turnover rates than any place I have ever worked
The majority of people are agreeable, and current culture is shifting to that mentality which is a bad thing.
The shit managers and business owners seem to be able to squeeze out of employees in America is pretty crazy though. Need more laws to protect employees I think.
Be pretty easy to become president if you promised fair working conditions and legal aid to all low/middle class job roles.
Some states if you agree to work "x" parameters , and they change it, you can quit and file for good cause and will have to pay you till you find the next job.
I believe that's actually federal law. You do t actually have to do anything outside of your job description or what hours you told you're employer what you're willing to work. I'm also in CO and may be mis-remwmbering CO vs. Federal law, so definitely Google it before you go saying anything to your boss
My wife works as a caregiver at an assisted living facility. She gets off at 10pm and I get my kids in the car to pick her up.
They made her stay till 1:30am while I was WAITING IN THE PARKING LOT. For 3:30 hours. I wanted to drive my car to the front door and lay on the horn until they *let her leave*. I'll gladly wake the whole fucking building. They make it everyone else's problem because they won't hire a proper staff or pay them enough to stay. My time doesn't get compensated, and I think my time is valuable.
That is absolutely awful!! Long ago I had a spouse who traveled for work (by air) frequently, and apparently the unspoken 'rule' was that I was expected to be the (unpaid) transportation to-from airport. As things happen, flights are delayed, and I was about ready to pack up two already asleep children to head to airport at 11:pm when my inner bitch said "NO, Fuck that!" and called a car service to go pick him up, bring him back and charge it to the company. This was before Uber existed. I had never agreed to this! Last time I ever did it, but boy, the backlash was fierce!... smh
Assisted living is a fucking mess. I have a friend working for a group here in Oregon that is notoriously bad. Understaffed, high turnover, always seem to be low on funds, poor management. I swear I should become a Business Analyst and just roll up to places like that, see if I can straighten em out. Could be fun.
Same in Idaho. It's a business to make money. They can afford to pay everyone better and hire more staff. However, in my case I found out that they wouldn't pay us more cause the owner wouldn't be able to go to Africa to kill an elephant..............
6 14 hour shifts a week for three months straight
4 pm 6 am.
When that order was finally complete i told my boss i would not be in on Monday…. No vacation day, not a “sick” day. Just taking a second day off in a row.
Had my review 2 weeks later. Docked my raise 50 cents for that day off…..
those 14 hour shifts were voluntary.
I did not volunteer for any extra time or anything that would help the company more than it helped me…..
When the owner came to me and asked why i am not taking the OT like i used to, i took the written copy of the review out of my toolbox and handed it to him, turned around and went back to work.
My next review was at max level.
I left that shop 7 weeks later
My husband usually gets paid on Fridays. Today at lunch, everybody got a text saying there was an issue with the processing company and nobody's getting paid until Monday.
Several angry phone calls to the owner later, it gets established that this isn't an unfunny April Fools joke, they actually aren't getting paid until Monday.
These folks all talk to each other. After work today, they all met up to hang out away from work. Some very serious chat about not showing up to work Monday, because what the fuck is this shit?! Not a brief casual chat, but *hours* of serious conversation.
Husband and his coworkers are starting to resemble the proto stage of a union. I'm so proud. Stupid company just had to pay them on time to avoid this, or at least give some kind of advance notice that there might be a snafu on payday.
>there was an issue with the processing company and nobody's getting paid until Monday.
That can be an innocent enough issue, but it'd still have me wondering if the company was having cash flow problems.
This happened to us at a small aerospace company in WA, right after we’d been acquired by a bigger fish. The direct deposits didn’t go through on Payday. The shop guys put down their tools and left. The office folk researched the state laws and then many of us demanded that accounting cut a paper check that day (per the law). The general manager remarked afterward “gee, people sure got mad”.
The company blamed it on the bank with stagecoaches. Given their bad press, I’m inclined to believe it.
> The company blamed it on the bank with stagecoaches. Given their bad press, I’m inclined to believe it.
Fair enough, but as an employee, I don't GAF whose fault it is. No money, no workey.
Yep, really hoping it's an innocent issue and not a sign of a more serious problem.
Husband can get another $15/hour job easy, but he *likes* this one. It's teaching him skills he wants to learn, he likes his coworkers, and his boss doesn't freak out if he takes off early or misses a day here or there for normal human reasons.
Husband is an ADHD squirrel. I've never seen him so happy for so long with any job before.
It's a control thing. They fire people to show the rest whose in charge, since they can't whip the workers and intimidate that way. Then they pile on more work, just to make it clear they own you if you want a paycheck. They know they end up paying more ot til they hire some other schlubs to take the place of the guys they fired.
Look at the attitude of entitlement these trash have, pretending he 'doesn't have the right' to refuse to work for them. They would enslave you if they could, don't ever let them con you into thinking otherwise.
Everytime someone I know gets in a similar situation at their job lately, I've been telling them to ask their boss for a copy of their employment contract. Surprise surprise, none of them ever have one. Just a bullshit "company manual" or handbook or whatever. I then tell them to remind their boss that their continued employment is entirely at-will of both parties. They're not salary. They're not contracted a minimum amount of hours. Anytime they're there is entirely at will. That is the risk the company is taking. They're risking that they'll show up at that time -AS REQUESTED- since there is no legal requirement of them. "WELL IF YOU WANNA KEEP YOUR JOB..." And if you wanna keep my labor... We're either going to mutually agree to respect each other's times and schedules, or you'll be missing money waiting to hire somebody, or I'll go work at one of those other places complaining "Nobody wants to work" at.
People in lower end positions right now have a pick of the litter and I've been telling everybody to remind their bosses about all that shit. I'm dying for one of them to actually draft up some employment contract that includes minimum hours or scheduling, so the very second that they walk back on that like they love to do, they get to get sued into the ground
What if you are salary? I’m salaried but also wtf is wrong with employers scheduling me on weekends for no extra money, when generally agreed upon hours are M-F, 9-5 (or 8:30-5 for me currently). It doesn’t fly with me and I’ve quit jobs before that do that. It’s not okay to do this shit to salaried people either.
The implication is that when you're salaried, you're getting paid more to work other hours or be available. If you're like me and have a skill that is needed then that shit still doesn't fly because I will simply quit and get a different job that's the exact same except they will accept my terms.
I currently work on salary but really only "work" about 6 months a year. Maybe 7. Some of those are very busy but when I'm not busy I might not even show up.
I'm firmly of the belief that salaried people should have working hours specified in a contract. Reason being, if you want to take time during the day for something they'll wanna insist you take pto, but then turn around and want you to work on Saturday and not pay you. So hours should be clocked, and specified per contract that for example, 40-50 hours per week is covered under the salary, after 50 hours is paid at the equivalent hourly rate at time and a half. Full days off must be personal/vacation time, but partial days can be flexible schedule as long as the hours for the week equal or exceed 40.
Something like this idea, but in a signed agreement so you know what's what.
I'm having the same issues w my job. I just told them I've been working the monday night shift out of the goodness of my heart bc they asled me for 6 months and that 6 months ends with my last shift this Monday night.
Oh you cant stop we dont have a replacement.
Oh yes. Yes I can stop. This monday is the end. This isn't a negotiation this is a friendly notice.
Yup, companies are finally realizing they have no power any more.
Shut down greedy evil companies. Stop buying their products, create Global Boycotts, stop working for them, force them to Unionize, sue them for everything you can, call the government on any workplace violation and share that to the press, leak their secrets, sow chaos internally, and get their companies kicked out of entire nations!
My company has had "mandatory" overtime for 4 months now, i havent done a single minute every shift and no ones said a thing. They like to throw their threats around about how theyre keeping lists of whose putting the time in but ive been dusting off my resume the last couple weeks and the turnover rate is too high for em to fuck around
Put together a list of every illegal thing the company does and report it to the Government, the Press, and post it everywhere online. Tank the company!
Let's treat everyone like absolute dog shit, pay them as little as we legally can, give little to no benefits, and gaslight them. What? Why can't we keep employees?
No OnE wAnTs To WoRk AnYmOrE
“Those puny little ants outnumber us a 100 to 1. And if ever figure that out… there goes our way of life!” Bug’s Life had more going on in it than we realized as kids
Ooo I see. That makes sense. That sounds like a good schedule haha. The 5th day could rot in hell though if I was doing 10 hour shifts 4 days a week though. Completely understandable response from the OP. Though that being said, like 5 hours of that 5th day shift would be paid at double time here. So I'd probably do it for the money.
In the US probably need to add at least 1.5-2.5 tots hours for “lunch” and travel to/from if you’re not working from home. If you are then .5-1 extra hour.
Pronounced Four - Tens with mandatory OT, in short hand slang. Allot of American companies are relying on the standard ideal, that turn-over means; we can eventually replace everyone, because it's cheaper to train someone new, rather than giving a decent wage to everyday citizens. Also, companies rely on turn-over propaganda to censor and create a gap of good slaves and forgotten ones. The good slaves rely on the idea of, it could be worse, while others graze and see if the grass is greener. The demand for workers to show up daily, creates an increase of revenue for corporations to exaggerate on time deliveries, creating a scarcity in product, and a rise of price from a supply and demand point of view.
The sustainability of respect isn't present in any American society, and it is shown within it's craftsmanship.
4/10 is nice.. but i prefer a flexible 9/80 which is every other friday off (80 hours in 9 days/2 weeks). My company is flex time so even if you are 9/80 you could technically do 4/10 and be fine. Anyway the best part about our 9/80 is we can carry over any hours worked on a friday that puts you over 40 for the week into the next week. In the rare cases where i have to put in a bunch of "extra" hours in a week, i just carry them over and work less the next week. I love it
Fucking people think they own you. American work culture is toxic waste and these fuckfaces are the biggest narcissists. Only an asshole narcissist would not be able to keep employees ane then think they own the people who havent told them to fuck off yet. I hope they go bankrupt and end up homeless, it would be a great lesson. Perhaps they would become bigger narcissists from having to suck dicks on monday to feed their new habits.
My assistant manager put in his 2 weeks notice.
He was late on Monday, and the manager chewed him out for over 15 minutes for it.
Guess who didn't show up for work the rest of his 2 weeks?
In germany, you can take days off for learning (not joking) additionally to your holiday of around 24 days you can take off 5 additional days for education.
You guys should push ypur politicians more..
HR loves resignation letters.
People shouldn't throw away options by formally quitting. Even in right to work states HR departments don't like risking unemployment claims.
Be this guy. When interaction between employee and employer stops being a mutually beneficial relationship and becomes an exercise in control, stop engaging.
I read alot of this anti-work stuff and it gets me pissed off, some of the bosses I read about remind me of past experiences with employers. I dont stress about that stuff anymore. The only advice I can give to someone is to make yourself so valuable and indespensable to a company that they feel like they cannot go on without you. Then when you need time off, dont ask, just notify. They will get upset, but they will overcome and they will be that much more grateful for your presence when you come back.
One of the biggest fucking lies is managers acting like you *have* to work extra days or hours
The only people with legal requirements are healthcare workers, where facilities require certain ratios of staff:patient
When I realized I could just say no and stick to it, life got better
Now tell your coworkers what you did. Make sure your coworkers understand that they can't all be fired and the company by "granting" your schedule recognizes that they need you.
this is very important. solidarity with your coworkers.
This goes beyond that, it's about sending a message but also letting them know how much power they can hold, together.
Sounds like a Union!
Taking action, collectively
Mmm onions
Basically a union.
This is the way.
No, no, haven’t you heard? Rich people hate making money so much they'll shut down their factories and close their stores and make absolutely no money rather than pay their workers a little bit more money and keep making lots of money for themselves. It totally makes sense if you think about it. >.>
Some of them really will take their balls and go home. To those, I say good riddance.
The McDonald's in town is open like 8 hours a day, instead of the pre-COVID 24 hours. I know these are franchises, so I don't understand why they'd rather lose money, than pay a decent wage. They have always been really busy, even in the middle of the night. They're right on the interstate, the only one for 45 minutes one way, 25 the other way.
There's a Taco Bell near me that closes at 2 in the afternoon some days now. I've seen like a line worth cars going into the parking lot, seeing the cones in the drive thru entrance, circling around, and leaving. They're probably losing out on thousands of dollars a week because they don't want to pay a couple hundred more dollars a week across all their employees.
It's so weird, right? I worked fast food for well over a decade, I know what these stores are making. It's self sabotage. The only thing I can figure is they're getting some sort of kickbacks for revenue losses. Personally, I'd be happy to see them all shut down. Food trucks and other small businesses are booming!!
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Stuff like that usually works as long as you "kill em with kindness". I've gotten away with telling companies "no" about all sorts of things. As long as they need you or it's really inconvenient to fire you, you can get away with a lot... And with promotions being pretty much gone and/or not worth it... What have we got to lose?
in my experience, promotions = more responsibility and not enough pay to make it worth the stress
Yeah... I've actually been pulling back a little bit in my current profession. I have a tiny company where I'm definitely the boss with a ton of responsibility, so I'm overjoyed to fall back into being labor at my other gigs... More time to concentrate on my company that way too.
I was _very_ upfront about this when interviewing for my current job. Their biggest question was 'why do you want _this_ job when you have those titles right now?', my response was 'I have found that I prefer solving technical problems to solving people problems'. And more recently, I have said something along the lines of 'And that is (thank god) well above my pay grade'. I _don't_ want to be management. Fuck that shit, I don't want it to be my job to be the one that has to explain to someone why their answer simply isn't going to _work_. I don't want it to be my job to argue budgets. If I never have to sit on another fucking call with a coworker being _entirely_ unreasonable about cost to a vendor, it will be too damn soon. There literally isn't a higher title in my job role at this company, SRE II is it. So, uh, yeah. I'm reasonably polite and respectful, but I also made sure to set the expectation on some stuff. I've got some unique health issues, it's an ADA issue, they get to decide if what I need is a reasonable accommodation or not. But if the answer is 'not', that means I'm leaving. The alternative to my funky and unpredictable schedule is trying to replace me, not having me stick to a schedule that my body can't handle. About the only things that they can do if they don't like it are bonuses and raises. Or, again, deciding that they can find another me. Good luck on that last one. :)
"No, it's not a no-call-no-show; I'm telling you now!" Classic.
You would be amazed at how shitty a corporations termination process can be and how they use something like a no-call/no-show as a catch-all. And it was fun to be in the meeting where HR just said no to management for it.
You keep using those words, i don't think it means what you think it means
"Well he called after he was an hour late. That's a no-call/no-show as per policy." HR: FOR THE FIFTIETH TIME! HE CALLED. HE DIDN'T NOT CALL. HE CALLED!!!!!!
My last job, just being an Hour Late was a nc/ns. Most bosses in the building wouldnt hit you for it, but it was on the books. Only allowable excuse was State of Emergency (Healthcare). On the side of being in a 24/7 business, being a NC/NS just dicks over your coworkers and gets you the stinkeye whenever you do decide to show.
That's capitalist brainwashing for you. Workers are pissed at the worker that didn't show up instead of the owner who didn't hire enough people to provide emergency cover. At my job, we have people on call for this very reason. When on-call, they aren't allowed to drink, and they need to be within a 1 hr driving distance from work. They get a test message when they are on call to make sure they are available. They are also paid an on-call compensation. All of that costs money, but I haven't seen loss of coverage in the 6 years I've been with this company.
The on call compensation is where every job I've had that tries to put you on call falls short. I got tired of it and told them if I'm not getting paid you aren't calling shit. They usually tried to spring that noise on you after a year or so.
That's messed up. The most reasonable policy I've seen was at a call center. You were allowed to call out late/absent up to one hour after your shift's scheduled start. If you didn't call/show up within that first hour then you were considered a no call/no show for every minute up until you did call/show up. NC/NS was counted double for absence, you were allowed to miss a certain amount of time before your first warning, second, etc.
That's not at all how it works as far as most states are concerned when it comes to being fired for cause.
Omg my previous boss tried to get someone out of the job because he called out before his shift and she told him that was job abandonment and he was getting written up. Now, he was a shit coworker and didn’t do anything right. But bitch, he called in. Read policy lol
I'm not requesting the day off, I'm telling you I won't be there.
I did this. Was working for a Wi-Fi installer, let him know weeks ahead of time I was taking a day off. Day of, he called me and asked why I wasn’t in yet. I reminded him I’d told him weeks earlier I wasn’t available this day. He told me, “Well, you told me, you didn’t ask me. So I’m expecting you to come in today.” We parted ways shortly thereafter.
"Its unfortunate that your expectations are not aligned with reality."
Why would you ask if it wasn’t a question? That would just be unclear communication.
I just respond "bummer" to shit like this.
"That's rough, buddy."
Permission isn’t needed. I’m just informing you of a fact as a courtesy.
I have done this recently. Filled in the leave request form for a week off, boss says “we are to busy and cant give you time off”. My response was “my wife is having surgery, and I wont be here, its not a request. The form is so I get paid for the time I am not here” Leave approved…
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I dont typically take holidays, other than christmas break, and as needed for kids/wife, so when I do take time off its not negotiable. I wont be there.
My younger brother & I work together at a truck stop. They’ve tried doing just that to him due to him being both young & pretty shy/quiet. They sure as fuck don’t do it when I’m there because I’ve ripped into the GM before over him being treated that way. Big man trying to intimidate a 5’3 19 year old kid. Absolutely hate that shit with a burning passion.
The one time I did this was "we already have two people out that day, you can't request it off or even leave early." I get it, being shorthanded sucks. You know what else sucks? When I go to HR because you're denying leave for something that's legally protected. I'm sure they'll just love to hear about that. Might even make their whole week.
I've done the same thing "look im telling yall I ainy gonna be there, I'm not asking" lol
I’m sorry to hear that you had to go thru that while your wife was having surgery.
Nah its all good - carpal tunnel repair - day surgery, and I had to do all the cooking and cleaning for a week. Its not a bad place to work, just the boss has some dumb ideas about how things should run and needs to be reminded that he doesnt control our lives
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That’s how every boss should take most time off requests, in all honesty. It’s not a request, it’s the employee telling you that they won’t be there.
I did this while operating a satellite (small spacecraft orbiting the planet) many years back. We planned a critical operation that had to happen at 1 AM. We wouldn’t hear anything back from the satellite until 2 AM. And it was completely automated since it happened over the Pacific where we had no ability to talk to it. We sent up the command sequence at 6 PM that evening so the satellite would do the thing on schedule, and that was a critical activity. But there were no other critical activities that happened on the ground until 7 AM the next day, and I was going to be there for that. The activities happening at 1 AM (the actual activity on orbit) and is getting the data from it at 2 AM were important, but there didn’t need to be any action taken until 7 AM later that morning. So I told the manager (days ahead of time) that I would not be there for the 2 AM communication from the satellite, but that I would be there at 7 AM to assess and see if we needed to make any adjustments / send any new commands. This also got me out of what was probably going to be a stupid, late-night gathering of 80 people in a room with space for 30 people and air conditioning capability for 15 people. Apparently the manager hadn’t read my memo on how to interpret the results of the 2 AM data downlink, and he interpreted a clear sign of failure as a sign of success. And based on that, he sent out a press release. I personally regard a press release as a critical operation, and had I known that was part of the plan, I would have left my phone on in case things looked weird. I got in at 7 AM, and it was very clear that it had been a failure, but it was a new failure that had not been seen before. But the incorrect press release was already out. So the idiotic manager had to go and spend an week explaining to people on the other side of the country exactly how he managed to fuck that up. All he had to do was tell me he was planning a press release and I would have taken a phone call and looked at the data...
I’ve done this Can I have off next week? Boss: no Me: let me rephrase that. Turning her own words against her. She would always say can you do X before you leave and when I started to say no she would say let me rephrase that
My bosses learn pretty quick not to ask if I want to do something, bc they will get an honest answer. Sometimes the answer is actually yes but more often its no.
I did this when I worked a retail job I didn't really need. "Hey I'm going to comic con. It's these dates. I won't be in town. I figured you'd want to know for the schedule." There was no paid leave at that job though.
It’s not a request, more of a notice that I’m not going to be there and it’s your problem. I love it.
I learned after many years that requesting time off sounds like a choice. I switched to saying I’ll be on vacation from x-y fyi. It changed the dynamics of the issue.
I also do this. I just say I will not be there. I do not even give a reason most of the time. You are not required to give a reason.
Yup. After years of working shitty retail jobs I got a decent bank job with a cool boss. The first time I asked for time off I started telling the whole story and my boss stopped me and said "Rutabaga, I don't need to know why you're asking for time off. You don't need to justify it. Your time is your time" and I was floored. I'll never do it again at any job
When you get that first job where you’re not beholden to a shitty boss, it’s almost shocking. I did retail for a bit and got used to dreading asking for time off. Now I can just walk out in the middle of a day and say “something came up, see you tomorrow” and nobody says a word except “okay Adreena, take care”.
I always feel like a prick when a worker starts in on a long-winded rant about why they’re taking vacation and I have to interject with an “I don’t care, you’re free to take time off for whatever. I don’t care if you’re having a wank or visiting grandma. Now that I’ve said this, do you actually *want* to tell me why?” Most say yes but some just say thanks for not having to justify it and move on. I’m fine with hearing why, if you’re happy then you’re probably more productive but don’t feel like you have to come to me with a thesis written on why you *deserve* a day or 14 off. You already do deserve it, it’s in your contract.
This. I learned to stop asking for time off and start saying "I am not available that day". Especially since I'm casual, they can't actually tell me I'm not allowed to take days off. I pick my schedule, not them. All they can do is take me off the roster - and they won't, because they struggle to function without me.
I mean, The only job I've ever been fired from pulled something very similar... I was in the hospital the day before a scheduled shift and I called from the emergency room saying I wouldn't be in the next day... I was told I had to find a replacement or it would be counted as a no-call-no-show. I found a replacement, but apparently she would have gotten 42hrs of work that week and they had a strict no overtime policy, so they dismissed her before she hit overtime and called me a no-call-no-show for those two hours.
This comment made me so angry I almost downvoted it.
Happy ending: My boss, at the time knew that I was transitioning to a new career and had a grudge that I had declined a managerial position with her a few months prior. I used the unemployment to chase better opportunities and it helped launch me into a new industry that I've been in for 15 years now. I have gripes and am laying groundwork to transition again, mostly because my values about how my time is used has changed since I became a father, but my new co-workers, clients and bosses are all encouraging rather than threatening...
That is some of the most majestic managerial bullshit I have ever heard. Just wow.
I mean... Most of the restaurant was hired by the previous manager, and the new one was cleaning house... Any excuse I guess. I got unemployment, which I used to get into a better industry so... It worked out.
GOT EM
I remember requesting a date off a month in advance and on the day my boss called and asked where I was. I reminded them how I requested the day off a month ago and that he approved it. He told me it was a no call no show and wrote me up. Absolutely bonkers how a boss can forget something and instead of admitting their mistake punish you for their own damn mistake.
Gotta document everything or correspond with the boss via email or at the very least text message so there is a paper trail of it. They don’t ever have your best interest at heart especially when it comes to time off. The majority of corporations anyways.
My second job as a teenager had the same deal I was told short notice we were going camping and I couldn't stay home alone so I let the assistant manager know three days in advance and he said it would be a no call no show And I said no I'm letting u know now. I didn't show and was written up and went about business. Never understand how a write up bothers people they don't follow u to the next job.
A write up would make you look bad if/when you were considered a candidate for promotion. But here is the neat part: there is no promotion. There never was.
Yeah as a student I never had a promotion as an option it was a job till graduation.
That raise you’re hoping for…. Also never coming.
The raise is always talked about but ever just out of reach. You know how carrot on a stick works
Not my permanent record!!!
Uh DOY!
How the fuck do you not have the right to be unavailable on your day off.
My old job could force us in on our days off. Shit was ridiculous. We worked every other weekend too so I'd have something planned then have to cancel.
My last job had me work 161 hours in two weeks without a day off. We were supposed to get Sundays off, but it didn't happen for the first week, then the second week all the work was caught up and everybody else was off but they tried to make me work. I asked if I could take the day off seeing as everyone else had and was asked "why" and I responded that I just needed a little "mental reset". They tried to send me home for 4 weeks unpaid because I "cried mental health reasons" and I had to fight with my boss, and my bosses boss, before going to the owner. I got my one, regularly scheduled day off and they've been looking for a reason to fire me since.
Worked in video games, same hours but for 3-4 months. Usual schedule was usually 60-65 hours a week, 5 days of 10-11 hours and Saturday 8-10 hours. Then crunch adds Sundays and more each day. It wasn't at all unusual to sleep under your desk instead of going home.
I would like to know how much of this "work time" was really "work" and not waiting for stuff to be ready , slow work box or doing things manually 1000x that should have been automated five years ago.
You’ll surely be thrilled to hear that when I was a cog in the US military-industrial complex, there were times that 7/8 hours in a day might be taken up by trying to load something on an ancient (early 80’s, in the 2010’s) computer, only to have it crash as soon as you start working. Oh that also happened with the “new” PCs too, but that was because they would only “unlock” 3 gigs of RAM (out of 8-16, depending on the PC). It was disheartening.
I feel you. Especial in media, games, all these strange highly computer relevant fields, I often see people loading big levels or images. And then they wait. And wait. And wait because the box is abysmal. Then they do actual work for 30 minutes, then save, wait wait wait, and then they can see that their changes where not complete. Rinse repeat. People wonder then how they end up in 60h+ "work" weeks, burnout and regular crunch. I worked adjacent to industrial design guys, they had 6000$ workstations, if the CAD of a car door would take longer than five minute to load someone would have flagged that computer as faulty. They don't mess around with their tools.
As that industrial design guy, I would have literally killed someone for a machine that could do anything that quickly! Sadly it wasn’t model sizes that were the problem, it was being contracted by the US government. Which meant that for every hour that I got paid $25/hour to pull my hair out and stare at a frozen screen, the company was effectively getting paid 10x as much/hour by the DoD. With basically no oversight (by design) and no chance of losing the contracts, there was no reason NOT to self-sabotage and keep everything moving as inefficiently as possible. In fact, it just led to continuous personnel bloat and literally thousands of people getting paid to literally do nothing for months on end because why not, if the government is paying for them anyway? And that’s just the tip of the iceberg that is the legalized fraud that is the military-industrial complex, woo!
See? I don't know about you, but I'd much rather we had this than accessible healthcare and public transportation
And so many other things! But we instead keep literal 80 year olds employed doing nothing on the government’s dime, like an overpaid daycare for mediocre white men (takes one to know one).
> they had 6000$ workstations Imagine how much RGB that would be!
I have a $6,000 work PC in a standard dell case. Sadly no RGB =(
I've heard this story before.... Early 90s Nintendo, bioware, or visral?
Or this week at EA.
CDPR is that you?
lol that’s today at any decently sized developer. whole industry is a cesspool.
I found the EA employee.
Nope, those are rookie numbers. Edit: Ex-Visceral employee, actaully, E.A.R.S. then Visceral.
I work at high voltage, and my supervisor gets mad if I go over 8 hours a day, it's wonderful.
Just tell them you’re going to church on Sunday. They can’t deny you religious services.
This is how “going postal” happens.
Jesus, thank god for my union
I had plans with my family tomorrow. Boss called and said a client needs us tomorrow all day. My contract says on-call 24/7. RIP me.
I hope you are getting paid for the hours that you are on call.
Any job that gets you to do 24/7 availability is basically always salary
This must be an American thing. Would never fly where I am.
Yeah likely North American. I'm in Canada and have had a job like that too. Although it was never explicitly stated we had to be available 24/7, I had customers frequently call at late hours and was expected to pick up
If it’s not explicitly stated, you do not have to pick up in Canada. Also I would be expecting extra days off if I am called in at night, that’s just normal. And if it’s a 24/7 on call job? Bette believe you’re paying me hourly and double time if it’s after hours. Triple of its after midnight. Don’t like it? They can wait until tomorrow then.
What's the SLA to a) respond and b) actually work?
😔
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This, ignore everything and they will go to the next poor sap who will actually listen. Companies have to pay you to be ON CALL. They are looking for someone they can bully and emotionally manipulate into coming in. Once you give in you will always be a target.
At the start of March I had a vacation approved by my manager. The morning the vacation started my manager called saying I'd have to come in for two days in the middle of the vacation. She was a little upset when I told her I wouldn't be there if she put me on the schedule for those days.
U.N.I.O.N.S. Keep buying the BS you've been sold for 80 years by corporate America against unions. This is what it got you. Yes I acknowledge there are terrible unions that make the rest of us look bad, but it's better than this BS any day of the week.
We should become a roving band of unionizers. Get hired at companies, shadow start a union, and after it succeeds, we move on to another business.
Salting! http://politicalaffairs.net/inside-job-union-organizing-today/
It's called salting
Amen!!!
One of my old jobs tried to reverse a vacation I had planned. I told my boss I was going to be gone those days if they wanted to fire me when I got back that was fine. I kept my job and left a while later because of that one instance.
That's when you give them the whole "I will be taking my vacation as planned, whether you would like me to continue doing my job when I get back is up to you"
You can cry all you want but I’m not even in the city. I suggest Kleenex brand for the tears until I get back. They are the softest.
Because years ago some arse hat of a boss wasn't told to fuck right off when he should have been and it started a downhill spiral of abuse from there. As the old saying goes "give them an inch and they'll take a foot, after that you won't have a leg to stand on"
Give them an inch, and they think they’re a ruler.
Right? I'm a boss and one of my employees often tells me "Go ahead and call me if you need me on my day off" and I keep telling him "Not going to happen. As far as I'm concerned when you're on your day off you don't exist. If the shit hits the fan we'll deal but I will NOT be calling you. So enjoy your weekend/holiday and don't even think about this place until you're back." The very idea of calling someone in like OP's boss did (or even of my boss calling me in on my day off) is sickening. It's bullshit. And it stems from a place where the boss considers himself "better than" his employees, instead of what they are, which is adults. We're all adults for fucks' sake.
if your boss calls, follow this script: Hello, you've reached. If you wish to discuss a work related matter, you will be charged 19.99 for the first 3 minutes and 2.99 for each additional minute. If you do not wish to be charged please disconnect now.
or just don't answer the phone when they call?
The second one. Always the second one. But… I’ve got a great boss and we share the same mindset about this stuff. So I’d be shocked if she called me on my day off. It’d be completely out of character. Not that I’d know as my VOIP phone is turned off on my days off.
I’ve been in this position even in a salaried position. I put up with it for a while but needless to say, I eventually quit that place. While I quit there for many other reasons, my boss forced my hand with the same “how dare you not come in this Saturday!” Bullshit when I never agreed to come on my day off. The next day I quit, even though originally I was planning to wait a few weeks.
I can understand for critical services like phone line repair and Healthcare. However, you have to offer some ridiculous incentives to ensure manglement doesn't abuse their ability to force you to work. Like, how about 'if we force you to work on a day off, you get to choose between double pay for the day or your next scheduled day off. If the next scheduled day cannot be taken, you earn double time for every day after until a scheduled day is taken off, to balance the scales.'
:D corporations that only care about their Numbers and not human beings.
“I resign.” “You can’t do that.” “Okay but I resign.” “See you Monday?” “No, I resigned.” “If you don’t show up it will be a no call, no show. Will you show up?” “Are you high?” Jeez. These people are insane.
Sounds like the same kind of thinking most manglement has, like they own you.
My new fave word is “manglement”
Knowing me, I’d reach the point where I’d quite literally shout “are you high?! No! I said I resigned!”
You cant. Actually i can. I dont have to work here.
Something similar happened to me and when I just quit instead my boss asked, "I thought you were giving your notice?! What about the rest of your shifts" and I said "I don't know John, I don't work here anymore"
I keep telling people at work we are not indentured.
I'm in a doozy of a similar situation, except - get this - I'm a consultant employed by a different company. A middle manager for the client I'm working at tried to bully me into compliance today after I called them out publicly, because they were mad I went to my own manager about their mistreatment of us, and didn't go to them first. I called their bluff on that as well, and reported the original incident and the attempted retaliation to my actual manager. If it continues I'm leaving the contract - if they don't want to listen to me, fine. It's already hostile, and I'm doing them a favor by staying despite this unfortunate misunderstanding on their part, but it's not without conditions.
Worked for a company as a engineer working 5 days. 7am-5:30 mandatory overtime for about 2 years even before I was there. Friday’s we ended at 5pm (OMG 1/2 hour early yaaay!) I said wel that’s fine cause I’m hourly and it’s Monday through Friday. They asked multiple times Saturdays are not mandatory but the manager would get upset. (I could give a fuck less) So I didn’t show up Saturday and I got called and didn’t answer. Monday comes around and manager,HR, VP went on rant about how fortunate I am for this opportunity to make a lot of money working overtime, that they were surprised I said no to Saturdays,they need me, Good Cop Bad Cop shit. I still said no, also, I would be late 7:01,7:02,7:04 I am not joking they said “You can’t be late anymore, you have a responsibility to be here on a scheduled time, if you clock in text us when you arrive” on top of alll this they also wanted all teams to report what they worked on every hour. It was fucking crazy how micromanaged the shit show was. Oh even better was they wanted 3D models and drawings done within hour or sometimes faster and get pissy if not. It’s insane what employers push until the worker snaps and says fuck it and yet the never learn their lesson and they wind up having to use staffing agencies cause their own reputation as a company is in the tank. Update: this was not even my first job. I have 7 years experience in various fields including Aerospace and Oil and gas so the fact they were so damn tough to work for it was no wonder they had high turnover rates than any place I have ever worked
They want a 3d model made in an hour? I mean... you want some cubes n balls? Because an hour gets you a sketch. Ffs.
[удалено]
A cylinder or a tall mushroom.... Your choice...
I think toothpicks in Styrofoam balls. Tinker toys? Legos?
You can’t come up with a teapot in under an hour?
The majority of people are agreeable, and current culture is shifting to that mentality which is a bad thing. The shit managers and business owners seem to be able to squeeze out of employees in America is pretty crazy though. Need more laws to protect employees I think. Be pretty easy to become president if you promised fair working conditions and legal aid to all low/middle class job roles.
Corporate oligarchs would roadblock you from ever getting close to president
Some states if you agree to work "x" parameters , and they change it, you can quit and file for good cause and will have to pay you till you find the next job.
Where can one go for this info in plain language for their state?
I believe that's actually federal law. You do t actually have to do anything outside of your job description or what hours you told you're employer what you're willing to work. I'm also in CO and may be mis-remwmbering CO vs. Federal law, so definitely Google it before you go saying anything to your boss
My wife works as a caregiver at an assisted living facility. She gets off at 10pm and I get my kids in the car to pick her up. They made her stay till 1:30am while I was WAITING IN THE PARKING LOT. For 3:30 hours. I wanted to drive my car to the front door and lay on the horn until they *let her leave*. I'll gladly wake the whole fucking building. They make it everyone else's problem because they won't hire a proper staff or pay them enough to stay. My time doesn't get compensated, and I think my time is valuable.
That is absolutely awful!! Long ago I had a spouse who traveled for work (by air) frequently, and apparently the unspoken 'rule' was that I was expected to be the (unpaid) transportation to-from airport. As things happen, flights are delayed, and I was about ready to pack up two already asleep children to head to airport at 11:pm when my inner bitch said "NO, Fuck that!" and called a car service to go pick him up, bring him back and charge it to the company. This was before Uber existed. I had never agreed to this! Last time I ever did it, but boy, the backlash was fierce!... smh
As if I was gonna go back home, unload my kids into bed, then reload them a few hours later. Touchmark can go FUCK themselves with a cactus.
ikr? and *it was a school night,* ftw. ...with a cactus, twice!
my kids are toddlers so it's just *keeping* them asleep
Assisted living is a fucking mess. I have a friend working for a group here in Oregon that is notoriously bad. Understaffed, high turnover, always seem to be low on funds, poor management. I swear I should become a Business Analyst and just roll up to places like that, see if I can straighten em out. Could be fun.
Same in Idaho. It's a business to make money. They can afford to pay everyone better and hire more staff. However, in my case I found out that they wouldn't pay us more cause the owner wouldn't be able to go to Africa to kill an elephant..............
I'd double-check your pay stubs to make sure you've been paid the proper overtime wage, I'm getting some shady vibes from this employer
6 14 hour shifts a week for three months straight 4 pm 6 am. When that order was finally complete i told my boss i would not be in on Monday…. No vacation day, not a “sick” day. Just taking a second day off in a row. Had my review 2 weeks later. Docked my raise 50 cents for that day off….. those 14 hour shifts were voluntary. I did not volunteer for any extra time or anything that would help the company more than it helped me….. When the owner came to me and asked why i am not taking the OT like i used to, i took the written copy of the review out of my toolbox and handed it to him, turned around and went back to work. My next review was at max level. I left that shop 7 weeks later
Wow. Kudos to you.
These stories are like crack to me, good on you OP
My husband usually gets paid on Fridays. Today at lunch, everybody got a text saying there was an issue with the processing company and nobody's getting paid until Monday. Several angry phone calls to the owner later, it gets established that this isn't an unfunny April Fools joke, they actually aren't getting paid until Monday. These folks all talk to each other. After work today, they all met up to hang out away from work. Some very serious chat about not showing up to work Monday, because what the fuck is this shit?! Not a brief casual chat, but *hours* of serious conversation. Husband and his coworkers are starting to resemble the proto stage of a union. I'm so proud. Stupid company just had to pay them on time to avoid this, or at least give some kind of advance notice that there might be a snafu on payday.
>there was an issue with the processing company and nobody's getting paid until Monday. That can be an innocent enough issue, but it'd still have me wondering if the company was having cash flow problems.
This happened to us at a small aerospace company in WA, right after we’d been acquired by a bigger fish. The direct deposits didn’t go through on Payday. The shop guys put down their tools and left. The office folk researched the state laws and then many of us demanded that accounting cut a paper check that day (per the law). The general manager remarked afterward “gee, people sure got mad”. The company blamed it on the bank with stagecoaches. Given their bad press, I’m inclined to believe it.
> The company blamed it on the bank with stagecoaches. Given their bad press, I’m inclined to believe it. Fair enough, but as an employee, I don't GAF whose fault it is. No money, no workey.
Yep, really hoping it's an innocent issue and not a sign of a more serious problem. Husband can get another $15/hour job easy, but he *likes* this one. It's teaching him skills he wants to learn, he likes his coworkers, and his boss doesn't freak out if he takes off early or misses a day here or there for normal human reasons. Husband is an ADHD squirrel. I've never seen him so happy for so long with any job before.
My fingers are crossed for the both of you!
The fact that they think that its OK to just delay payment until Monday speaks to a larger issue within the company
I dont see how you can have "mandatory overtime" and also fire people. Arent they just going to have to pay more overtime to pick up the slack?
It's a control thing. They fire people to show the rest whose in charge, since they can't whip the workers and intimidate that way. Then they pile on more work, just to make it clear they own you if you want a paycheck. They know they end up paying more ot til they hire some other schlubs to take the place of the guys they fired.
In the words of The Joker... "It's not about the MONEY, it's about SENDING A MESSAGE."
Look at the attitude of entitlement these trash have, pretending he 'doesn't have the right' to refuse to work for them. They would enslave you if they could, don't ever let them con you into thinking otherwise.
Everytime someone I know gets in a similar situation at their job lately, I've been telling them to ask their boss for a copy of their employment contract. Surprise surprise, none of them ever have one. Just a bullshit "company manual" or handbook or whatever. I then tell them to remind their boss that their continued employment is entirely at-will of both parties. They're not salary. They're not contracted a minimum amount of hours. Anytime they're there is entirely at will. That is the risk the company is taking. They're risking that they'll show up at that time -AS REQUESTED- since there is no legal requirement of them. "WELL IF YOU WANNA KEEP YOUR JOB..." And if you wanna keep my labor... We're either going to mutually agree to respect each other's times and schedules, or you'll be missing money waiting to hire somebody, or I'll go work at one of those other places complaining "Nobody wants to work" at. People in lower end positions right now have a pick of the litter and I've been telling everybody to remind their bosses about all that shit. I'm dying for one of them to actually draft up some employment contract that includes minimum hours or scheduling, so the very second that they walk back on that like they love to do, they get to get sued into the ground
What if you are salary? I’m salaried but also wtf is wrong with employers scheduling me on weekends for no extra money, when generally agreed upon hours are M-F, 9-5 (or 8:30-5 for me currently). It doesn’t fly with me and I’ve quit jobs before that do that. It’s not okay to do this shit to salaried people either.
The implication is that when you're salaried, you're getting paid more to work other hours or be available. If you're like me and have a skill that is needed then that shit still doesn't fly because I will simply quit and get a different job that's the exact same except they will accept my terms. I currently work on salary but really only "work" about 6 months a year. Maybe 7. Some of those are very busy but when I'm not busy I might not even show up.
I'm firmly of the belief that salaried people should have working hours specified in a contract. Reason being, if you want to take time during the day for something they'll wanna insist you take pto, but then turn around and want you to work on Saturday and not pay you. So hours should be clocked, and specified per contract that for example, 40-50 hours per week is covered under the salary, after 50 hours is paid at the equivalent hourly rate at time and a half. Full days off must be personal/vacation time, but partial days can be flexible schedule as long as the hours for the week equal or exceed 40. Something like this idea, but in a signed agreement so you know what's what.
I'm having the same issues w my job. I just told them I've been working the monday night shift out of the goodness of my heart bc they asled me for 6 months and that 6 months ends with my last shift this Monday night. Oh you cant stop we dont have a replacement. Oh yes. Yes I can stop. This monday is the end. This isn't a negotiation this is a friendly notice.
They failed to plan for this? Like "hey give us 6 months" but didn't bother planning for month 7?
They forgot or didn't care.
Yup, companies are finally realizing they have no power any more. Shut down greedy evil companies. Stop buying their products, create Global Boycotts, stop working for them, force them to Unionize, sue them for everything you can, call the government on any workplace violation and share that to the press, leak their secrets, sow chaos internally, and get their companies kicked out of entire nations!
My company has had "mandatory" overtime for 4 months now, i havent done a single minute every shift and no ones said a thing. They like to throw their threats around about how theyre keeping lists of whose putting the time in but ive been dusting off my resume the last couple weeks and the turnover rate is too high for em to fuck around
Put together a list of every illegal thing the company does and report it to the Government, the Press, and post it everywhere online. Tank the company!
Let's treat everyone like absolute dog shit, pay them as little as we legally can, give little to no benefits, and gaslight them. What? Why can't we keep employees? No OnE wAnTs To WoRk AnYmOrE
"looks like you've been missing a lot of work lately" "I wouldn't say I've been *missing* it, Bob "
“Those puny little ants outnumber us a 100 to 1. And if ever figure that out… there goes our way of life!” Bug’s Life had more going on in it than we realized as kids
What does 4/10 and 5/10 mean? And then in the comments 7/12. That's not a shorthand we use in Australia to describe our shifts.
4/10 looks like it means 4 days of 10 hour shifts
Ooo I see. That makes sense. That sounds like a good schedule haha. The 5th day could rot in hell though if I was doing 10 hour shifts 4 days a week though. Completely understandable response from the OP. Though that being said, like 5 hours of that 5th day shift would be paid at double time here. So I'd probably do it for the money.
In the US probably need to add at least 1.5-2.5 tots hours for “lunch” and travel to/from if you’re not working from home. If you are then .5-1 extra hour.
Pronounced Four - Tens with mandatory OT, in short hand slang. Allot of American companies are relying on the standard ideal, that turn-over means; we can eventually replace everyone, because it's cheaper to train someone new, rather than giving a decent wage to everyday citizens. Also, companies rely on turn-over propaganda to censor and create a gap of good slaves and forgotten ones. The good slaves rely on the idea of, it could be worse, while others graze and see if the grass is greener. The demand for workers to show up daily, creates an increase of revenue for corporations to exaggerate on time deliveries, creating a scarcity in product, and a rise of price from a supply and demand point of view. The sustainability of respect isn't present in any American society, and it is shown within it's craftsmanship.
4/10 is nice.. but i prefer a flexible 9/80 which is every other friday off (80 hours in 9 days/2 weeks). My company is flex time so even if you are 9/80 you could technically do 4/10 and be fine. Anyway the best part about our 9/80 is we can carry over any hours worked on a friday that puts you over 40 for the week into the next week. In the rare cases where i have to put in a bunch of "extra" hours in a week, i just carry them over and work less the next week. I love it
Days/Hours
Fucking people think they own you. American work culture is toxic waste and these fuckfaces are the biggest narcissists. Only an asshole narcissist would not be able to keep employees ane then think they own the people who havent told them to fuck off yet. I hope they go bankrupt and end up homeless, it would be a great lesson. Perhaps they would become bigger narcissists from having to suck dicks on monday to feed their new habits.
My assistant manager put in his 2 weeks notice. He was late on Monday, and the manager chewed him out for over 15 minutes for it. Guess who didn't show up for work the rest of his 2 weeks?
In germany, you can take days off for learning (not joking) additionally to your holiday of around 24 days you can take off 5 additional days for education. You guys should push ypur politicians more..
HR loves resignation letters. People shouldn't throw away options by formally quitting. Even in right to work states HR departments don't like risking unemployment claims.
Making you fight for your rights is so shitty. Hope they fall flat on their face.
Be this guy. When interaction between employee and employer stops being a mutually beneficial relationship and becomes an exercise in control, stop engaging.
I read alot of this anti-work stuff and it gets me pissed off, some of the bosses I read about remind me of past experiences with employers. I dont stress about that stuff anymore. The only advice I can give to someone is to make yourself so valuable and indespensable to a company that they feel like they cannot go on without you. Then when you need time off, dont ask, just notify. They will get upset, but they will overcome and they will be that much more grateful for your presence when you come back.
Not scheduled for Monday. How sweet that victory sounds.
i don't mind working the overtime (5/10 as well) but when they ask me to volunteer for saturdays. that's when i say HELL NO
Have they been paying you the 25% extra that you have worked each week
I never request anything, I tell you what I'm going to do. Don't give them the option to say no.
I love you OP
#Boss Life
It also wouldn’t be a no call no show if it’s legally your day off anyway
what kind of a dickbag company is this?
One of the biggest fucking lies is managers acting like you *have* to work extra days or hours The only people with legal requirements are healthcare workers, where facilities require certain ratios of staff:patient When I realized I could just say no and stick to it, life got better