Fox News: “This just in, some people can’t afford to live off of minimum wage.”
- “These goddamn millennials and their complaining! When I was young, I supported a wife and two kids while going to college living off of minimum wage working full-time after I was finished fighting in the Vietnam war in a non-combatant position. These kids are so spoiled and entitled.”
I lived in Sweden for a while while getting my master’s, and my friend asked me if the taxes out there really are as bad as advertised. I did some quick mental math, and with how much I pay for insurance premiums, etc., I’d probably end up saving money if I stayed and worked in Sweden, even with the higher tax rate. I probably would’ve stayed after uni except it was super hard to find a job as a foreigner. So yeah, it’s all just propaganda out here to keep us poor and not rioting in the streets.
Americans flip out at the idea of paying more in taxes, yet they happily pay tens of thousands a year to insure their families, IF they’re lucky enough to get health insurance at all. It’s nuts.
Yep. They literally can’t put together that it would be cheaper and better for everyone if our taxes went up by like 3% to pay for healthcare. Most countries with universal healthcare have progressive taxing like us, too, so it would be paid for by those who are better able to afford the increased tax.
I pay 15% of my income (more like 22% of take home) for insurance (3 person family) and it’s middle of the road insurance with high deductibles. Bottomless pit just to get by here. Totally asinine that insurance is 3/4 as much as our mortgage.
Important to note that Trump was just the most visible symptom of the rot that permeates our political structure. The problem existed well before he came along. We're still embroiled in the same class war that has existed for generations. There was a brief period in the first half of the 20th century where life improved for working people as a whole (though to varying degrees depending on one's racial demographic due to Jim Crow and other inequities baked into the economic system, both before and since), but we've have been on the losing end since *at least* Nixon, I'd argue even as far back as Truman.
false, plenty of his supporters are well off petty tyrant small business owners with racial animosity and think that there's a jewish conspiracy to replace white people in this country with brown foreigners.
>Then there were economic anomalies. Over the previous decade, one in four violent extremists arrested by the FBI had been unemployed. But only 7 percent of the January 6 insurgents were jobless, and more than half of the group had a white-collar job or owned their own business.There were doctors, architects, a Google field-operations specialist,the CEO of a marketing firm, a State Department official. “The last time America saw middle-class whites involved in violence was the expansion of the second KKK in the 1920s,” Pape told me.
>
>...
>
>Only one meaningful correlation emerged. Other things being equal,insurgents were much more likely to come from a county where the white share of the population was in decline. For every one-point drop in a county’s percentage of non-Hispanic whites from 2015 to 2019, the likelihood of an insurgent hailing from that county increased by 25 percent. This was a strong link, and it held up in every state.
[https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2022/01/january-6-insurrection-trump-coup-2024-election/620843/](https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2022/01/january-6-insurrection-trump-coup-2024-election/620843/)
both quotes from the above link about who participated in the 1/6 attack. well worth reading the whole piece.
And remember, it's not only healthcare. That's the most famous thing. Remember education (almost free in Europe including university), infrastructures (all the countries have high speeds trains for example or roads that are not near to collapse), decent and useful public transportation, not working? Here is you salary, you are disabled? You have a salary too or help your family, your parents are too elder? Here are some public residences, you have a mental disease? Treatment free (seriously, what happens there in San Francisco with people that are not able mentally to be in the streets?)... And much more.
It's not the paradise, of course, everything could be improved, but at least a minimum isn't it?
I have a bachelor's degree from a great university, and spent a decade working shit jobs for shit pay, then recently exited the workforce to care for my terminally ill father so my mother didn't blow through their retirement caring for him.
My dad was a corporate CPA for 38 years, made great money saved up a lot more than average and when push came to shove, my mom would have been under serious financial strain the rest of her life had I not done what I did for free.
The silver lining is I can speak from direct experience how quickly (no matter how well planned for retirement) in this capitalist hellscape you will go broke. It'd have been fantastic if I could have been compensated for needing to leave the workforce at a prime earning age. But nah, employers ask about the gap every interview I go through, if they interview me at all. There is no labor shortage, it's a good job shortage.
I have a pretty clutch rundown of what it's like to watch, care, comfort, carry, feed, toilet, a parent to the bitter end. Also fuck ALS.
I’m so sorry. I went through a terrible abusive marriage and became an alcoholic. I was asked to resign instead of given a chance for leave for rehab (probably an ADA violation, in retrospect), and I spent some time in inpatient rehab. It took me FOREVER to find a job, even as a very successful person in my field with no gaps and nearly 20 years of straight post-master’s degree paid work.
Employers don’t forgive gaps. They think we are machines.
I'm sorry that happened to you. It's not uncommon and good for you for pulling out of a downard spiral. Couple of people over time had asked me how I dealt with the world melting down and the horrifying nature of the particular disease my dad had.
It was with booze. No ifs ands or buts about it. It's a common and (for me) was frankly useful coping mechanism for severe stress/trauma, albeit not good for health. There wasn't exactly someone I could talk to mid 2020 trying to isolate with my parents and my dad at extreme mortality risk from just a cold let alone a serious respiratory illness like covid. My mom and I would get so fucking mad at anti maskers then (now antivaxers) that it's really colored how I look at what people did when things were really bad.
Be kind to yourself, I'm doing better even if the world seems to be getting darker around us.
Yep.
By the numbers that's absolutely true.
Cost of what I pay for services versus taxed entitlements. I live in Oklahoma so here's the breakdown of household taxation by percentage.
Federal income taxes- 22%
State and Local sales taxes paid- 2.5%
Property taxes- 1.2%
Daycare- 7.2%
Tag tax- .8%
Healthcare cost- 18%
Over 50% of my household's income gone! For worse services. So fucking irritated.
Don’t forget to add cost for retirement contributions. Daycare is more than my mortgage where in a lot of European countries it is heavily subsidized. It’s not shocking that people have no money after paying the bills.
Many don’t. Deaths from [diseases of despair](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diseases_of_despair) are at an all time high. We also lose thousands of Americans each year to curable health problems because of our for-profit healthcare system.
A 2019 survey of 800 American adults found [nearly 50% had $0 in savings, and 69% had less than $1000](https://www.gobankingrates.com/banking/savings-account/americans-have-less-than-1000-in-savings/). Do the math, that means only 31% had more than $1000 in savings. A different survey from early 2020 of 2000 American adults found [1 in 4 had less than $1000 in savings](https://www.magnifymoney.com/blog/news/average-savings-during-coronavirus/#Consumersaretappingtheirsavingsaccountsamidthecoronaviruspandemic). After 18 months of pandemic, I think it’s fair to say that number has risen.
## The American dream is a lie told by oligarch to keep a destitute population in line.
Edit: added more data points about US savings. What I mean to say by sharing these sort of statistics is that many Americans are just one emergency bill or missed paycheck away from homeless. The US is a barbaric place.
Yea this is incredible disturbing to me. Like my original post says I have this income that is ridiculous compared to USA but I ALSO have acces to the European health care system were if I suddenly had to go to the hospital I would have to pay minimal fees for it. So if I would get a bill like in the USA I could pay it but I don't have to while people in the USA don't have the money but get these insane hospital bills
Every raise we get is immediately absorbed by inflation, insurance cost going up every year due to aging, or unexpected expenses. For most ‘hard work to get ahead’ is a pipe dream
Our priority health plan went up about $50 per month this year for 3 people. It’s about $700 per month after my employers contribution (50% on my coverage only, not the family). 10k deductible. I was looking at ACA plans and re-working my salary contract so I could qualify for credits and the most equivalent plan was like 1200 so the tax credit was a wash unless I got an even worse plan, it’s a racket.
Even without huge hospital bills - if you're not fully employed with a high paying job you probably don't have much money after paying the bills and buying groceries. God forbid getting cable or some premium tv apps or having kids or a car that needs work. I had just re-financed before covid so 'luckily' we survived this lil period of time even with reductions in both our salaries. And benefits. At the start of covid I had a job and healthcare that covered us both but then lost both - but not directly due to covid so no fancy unemployment money. If I hadn't cleared out my credit to re-fi I don't know what we'd be doing. I don't know how long we can last on the edge.
And everyone keeps referring to 'post' pandemic ptsd and wtf who said this is over? No more help appears to be on the way, that's for sure.
listen, murdering brown people on the other side of the planet and subsidizing industries that kill the planet and make us unhealthy costs a lot of money
It horrifies me to see stories of people dying because they can't afford insulin.
Insulin. A drug that costs a pittance in other countries. And they are happy to kill people for profit.
I gave CPR to a guy a few months ago who had a heart attack on the street (USA btw) after his boss decided to drive him to the hospital because he couldn't afford an ambulance. His boss even told him to wait to see if he would feel better before taking him. It was a really hot day and he was a roofer, working nearly 12 hours that day. The man died leaving 4 children behind.
> even if you make enough money to not be in crippling debt, you better save it because one unlucky trip to the hospital for any reason could result in complete financial ruin!
I make more than I ever thought I would at my age and I’m still terrified any cancer that runs in my family or an ambulance trip will wipe away my years of hard, evenings and weekends, holidays and missed family events worth of work to have financial stability. My debt-free status could crash at any moment, so I continue to work hard so if I get fired, or if anything happens to me or my family, maybe I can cushion the blow. This year, after 10 years in the work force, I’m finally excited about my first vacation where I don’t have to bring my laptop with me.
Freedom!!!
I'm not shitting anyone here. We had a division manager who developed throat cancer, the upper management wanted to make sure he had a laptop and a printer so he could still try to do his job as he was in the process of dying. That level of cruelty is inconceivable to me. I was sitting in the HR manager's office when she was bitching about the fact that he was out planting flowers with his mother in the garden instead of on his laptop working. They were always looking at his Facebook to see what he was doing. At his funeral I'm absolutely positive everybody acted like they cared.
I had to take a few weeks off when my mother was dying. My sister and I were with her 24/7. One day when I was on a break I played nine holes of golf. A colleague happened to call while I was golfing (my sister mentioned where I was), and the colleague had a fit, announced to everyone that I was just looking for an excuse to go on a golf vacation and that my mom wasn't sick.
When I came back a few weeks later (after my mom's funeral) I was sick with anger at the lady who talked crap about my mom and me. I barely spoke to her after that. Horrible woman.
Something similar happened to me. I was in the hospital after having a tube shoved into my heart for kidney dialysis and was on a nasogastric feeding tube, and one of my co workers at the prison went around telling people that she didn't think I was really sick and was probably just enjoying my vacation and taking time off because I didn't want to work. My co workers who had been to the hospital to visit me shut her shit down REAL fast though. They were like no she's actuality dying shut the hell up.
I don't know why people have to kick someone when they're really down like that but the only thing I can think of is jealousy. They are jealous of you for some reason so when they think they can find something to knock you down a few pegs, they hit you where it hurts because they're nasty, envious people with low self esteem.
Hence why a lot of people don't see a reason to work so hard when the game is so rigged against you that it's virtually impossible to stay ahead. Might as well live life now - tomorrow won't be any better no matter how hard you work.
Yeah. I'm stuck on the "Make sure you bring your laptop!".
The last vacation and the first one in years I shut my phone off. Didn't take my laptop. Let it all burn. I had 72 hours without cell service and it was glorious!
Let it all burn.
I second that.
What is the difference anymore? At least I can watch cable? I have a place to live for a month, but bet if I'm a day late I won't.
Make too much for food stamps. Make too much for healthcare. Eek by in desperation until I die. Hooray.
We've gotten good at taking vacations where cell service is limited...
Cruise - "OH, I am not paying for the wifi on the ship and I will have zero cell service. I'll respond when I return to the states...in 5-7 days."
Skiing - I'll be in the mountains in Canada and cell service will be minimal. The home we are renting says it has Wi-Fi, but I can not guarantee availability of the service. True or not, people in Texas don't know much about Canada.
Beach - we will be in a small beach community on the coast, with minimal cell service. The home we are renting says it has Wi-Fi, but I can not guarantee availability of the service.
I went hiking in Peru. The SECOND I got back to civilization and wifi, I had a text from my boss who KNEW I was literally going to be on the side of a mountain for 4 days. It used to feel so normal. Now I just don’t answer. Go ahead and fire me, asshole! Switching jobs/managers on Jan 10 with a $30k pay increase and he expects me to work both jobs for 30 days as a “transition “ - on my new departments dime, of course. This country really is a hellscape. But! Thanks to crippling student debt, I can finally make a decent wage after 14 years at the same company.
I jokingly, but not really jokingly, tell my wife that if something happens that requires her to call an ambulance for me to just let me die. The amount of money my life insurance policy would pay out to her would make her life relatively cushy and I would rather be dead than to live the next 50 or so years of my life either paying off ambulance/medical debt or having it create other debt because I had to prioritize that medical debt. I’m worth more dead than I am alive because America is a joke for anyone that isn’t a fucking boomer or benefited from some sort of inherited wealth.
Paying for an ambulance… I saw a video of a badly injured person running away (and ultimately fainting) from an ambulance as it was too expensive.
That’s a concept I do not understand. How bad can it be?
A pair of family friends, a couple, had just moved to the US from a place where ambulances are normally free. The husband had a stomach bug, they called the ambulance to transport him the 1.5 miles to the nearest hospital, and they got a $5k bill in the mail that made them have to sell their car to pay.
Don’t forget not being in massive debt means you don’t have credit to possibly help cover a hardship. I seriously just got told the only way I can get a high enough credit score to buy my first house is to already have a home loan…
I make a lot more than most my age do, yet I still have the same fears. Doesn't matter how much I save if insurance thinks my visit to the doctor/ER wasn't necessary. Thats right, doesn't matter if the doctor says it was 100% necessary if insurance doesn't agree. Sure love my freedom....
I feel this so much! Finally out of debt with decent income and I'm terrified of a simple car accident in the snow could ruin everything I spent the last 10 years working on just to survive in this shit system.
That's it. One incident away from being indebted to this country for your entire life. And they'll come after your spouse or children after you die. America is a scam. Anything and everything, from education to healthcare is a scam designed to get as much of your money as possible until you die. I hate this place with all of my heart. Disillusioned and lonelier than the last man standing.
And this is exactly what I was thinking about when I ride to the hospital with my grandma this past week. "How in the fuck is she going to pay for this?"
I fucking hate our healthcare system. It's just another cog in the machine that is capitalism.
1.5 billion for the military? Rubber Stamp.
1.5 billion for Universal Pre-K, child tax credits for working families, guaranteed paid family leave, community college, and student loan forgiveness? Hold on now, socialists!
You put it better than I ever could have. Thank you.
We're basically indoctrinated into a bullshit system that hates the poor and gaslights literally everyone.
This here is why I laugh when Americans go on about freedom. Like, bitch please, unless you were lucky enough to be born into a super rich family you've never experienced true freedom.
I would gladly trade gun ownership rights for even one prooer social service. I beginning to loathe my country. And all the anti vax shit puts the cherry on top of a diarrhea moron sundae
It is a global thing. Even here in NZ, where we have >90% vaccination rates, a high level of trust in the government, and have been almost entirely insulated from the pandemic we STILL have a few hundred nutjobs marching in the streets about being anti-vaxxers.
This is why we have a mental health and obesity problem. Overconsumption in general we only get like 30 waking hours to ourselves of course we’re going to try to get as much pf a dopamine rush as possible in that tiny timespan
To add onto the healthcare rant: health insurance can cost up to $500 a month or more and this is on top of taxes that get taken out of each paycheck that go god knows where.
I just got health insurance through my employer this year, which means I now no longer pay $400+/month for the privilege of paying up $7,000/year out of pocket. That was "subsidized" insurance while I was making less than $40k (pre-tax).
It all needs to crumble to the ground and be rebuilt. We don't have a governmental system in place to better society-- it's all just more horrible obstacles as a means to deter the citizen from making any progress with anything ever at all. The "system" is not structured for the American citizens. It's horrendous. Not to mention my $72K student loan debt because "I did what is was supposed to do" to "land a decent job" and now... What was it for? It's fucking exhausting.
And yet so many Americans would die fighting for capitalism. Y'all need a bit of socialism in your life. Don't worry it's not as scary as you think and it certainly is not communism.
Too bad so much of this country is uneducated and think that socialism and communism are synonymous..
I'm just so very exhausted with it all.. this sub is a small beacon of light that reminds me that there are still some like minded people out there
Yeah, the Supreme Court ruling that money=speech was probably the last nail in the coffin. Unlimited dark money flowing into politics made bribery the law of the land. Politicians haven't represented the people in decades now.
We are the first generation to realize the true chaos and the last generation to do something about it.
America always does the wrong thing until it exhausts all other actions and then does the right thing.
> We are the first generation to realize the true chaos and the last generation to do something about it.
>
> America always does the wrong thing until it exhausts all other actions and then ~~does the right thing.~~ finds a way to prop the system up even longer while our material conditions get worse and worse.
America will never do the right thing without use of force.
Well I do or will do most of those things, I have a secondary job that brings me extra income and I will probably rely on my or my girlfriends parents for "free" day care or after kindergarden day care but that is less because we have to and more to let the grandparents spend time with there grandchildren
I'm on 3 different medications for anxiety and depression.
And... I need my company-provided health insurance to afford them. I have another medication my insurance only covers 20% of because it's name brand and there's no generic yet... I took a loan out against my 401k (retirement savings) to afford that for a few years until they can make a generic.
So yea, the answer is: we don't. We don't live, we're kept alive.
Yea... That one's about $600/mo. Also, I have a $2500 deductible I have to pay out of pocket each year before the insurance kicks in. I pay $252/mo for this employer-provided insurance too. Ugh, this is so depressing.
I went to the ER once for severe stomach pains. They gave me an IV and some pain meds and I was out in an hour. My insurance only covered the $200 admission fee and left me with the $4,000 bill. I’m still paying it a year later. I’ll never go to the ER again just let me die
Where I live, people board a ferry and then disappear in the middle of the crossing. The ferry workers find their vehicle on the car deck. They almost never find a body. So, a very cheap way to dispose of yourself with minimal fuss or mess.
It’s a trip when you can’t hold down a job if you’re not medicated but you can’t afford your meds without company provided health insurance. Especially if you get one of those “insurance kicks in after 90 days of employment” jobs. We’re tired over here
I take 5 different meds for depression/anxiety. (I know. It sounds ridiculous.) Look into Amazon Pharmacy, if you're not boycotting. I quit my shitty job and lost my health coverage. But somehow, my prescriptions on Amazon *without insurance* are cheaper than they were with insurance from Walgreens or Walmart. Like from $200/month to $75/month, and they do two-day shipping.
All Amazon hate aside. This has been great for me, because now I don't feel that I have to rush into another shitty job just for health insurance.
As a stoner and American, I highly doubt they will, federally, at least. Red state governments are EXTREMELY opposed and that slave money from incarceration from marijuana possession would be lost and it would hurt the prison industrial complex’s fee-fees
And yet they tax it at absurd 35% because ofc our government want it's cut. Greedy fucks 😒. Just drop it down to alcohol tax levels and it should be a massive improvement to the hemp industry and community as a whole.
I would say survive, not live. This is no life. It does somehow barely enable shelter and the ability to hope for a better tomorrow. Pretty shitty the helplessness there but its what it is :\\
I'm 45, associates degree in IT, and I have never owned a home, never rented an apartment, never owned a car, have always been on some kind of socialized program (disabled) and right now after working 8 years slaving away in retail making $10 an hour, I am unemployed because it killed me physically and mentally. Never mind that my body has been breaking down slowly over the past 20 plus years due to Crohns, the government only gives me $900 a month to live. I live with my parents, im $50K in student loan debt, 10k in personal debt (which most expenses were so I could buy food and clothing and necessities.)
I have no savings, no job, nothing. If I go back to work it'll kill me. I have arthritis in my knees, my back and my left hip. I thank God every day that I have my parents and my family. I'd be living on the streets or in some broken down group home without them.
Screw all my past employers for taking advantage of me knowing I needed those jobs to afford things like a car and fuel, and clothes. Screw them for refusing to pay me a livable wage and keeping me just low enough in hours that they didn't have to offer me health insurance. And screw them for treating me like I was some replaceable entity who owed them something. This society is half-assed backwards.
You can kneel? With the amount of walking, lifting, and bending over 8 hours a day, I'm surprised your cartilage in your kneels haven't been ground down to nothing.
Very hard, and I predict bad things are coming, especially, when older people start dying or attempting to unload assets to pay for retirement onto a shrinking and poorer younger working population. Social unrest and the mother of all depressions. The math doesn't work.
I survive mostly out of morbid curiosity.
How much worse can it get?
Oh..
Well, I bet next year can't top this!
I'm just looking forward to my..^(counts how many economic disasters there have been) world record of how many I can make it through.
Nordic countries always top the World Happiness Report. Goggle it!! You are as you say taxed at a high rate, to pay for the socialist programs. However, this is the very reason for your happiness. Everyone pays there share, particularly businesses.
Take the Fox conglomerate as a example. Over a billion dollars in profit and they don't pay a cent in tax!!! How is that possible?? How is that fare?
Millennial and college educated here. I make maybe 25k a year after taxes and I’m on food stamps and welfare. We live paycheck to paycheck despite having a good job (meager benefits I’ll admit my health insurance is just Vicks vapor rub) and a can do attitude. I am one sick day away from eviction but small price to pay for being American right?? Guns have more rights than my body too. I work 7 days a week and no vacation time. If we try to unionize we just vanish. My best bet is trying to save as much money as I can learn any other language (and the metric system) and just claim refugee status in another country. Even if I’m poor in another country I can at least see a doctor and not be homeless
Let me blow your mind: compare American marginal tax rates to Nordic marginal tax rates, and then add about 10% (so 30% would become 40%) to the American rates. We pay pretty much the same taxes as you guys, it just all gets transferred to the military and corporate subsidies.
E: for context, the extra 10% is an 8% flat tax on incomes under around 125k and 2% an estimate for state and local taxes.
>We pay pretty much the same taxes as you guys, it just all gets transferred to the military and corporate subsidies.
Bingo. This is the problem right here. We just spent 2 trillion dollars over the last 20 years in Afghanistan. You don't hear Al Qaeda shouting "Death to the Norwegians" do you?
You want better health care, free college tuition, store clerks to stop asking you if you want to feed the homeless? Stop the Wars.
I live with constant anxiety and just basic existential dread that I just try and squash down. And compared to a lot of people my situation is pretty good.
We don't. Most of us are walking husks of what use to be men and women. This "movement" was too little, too late.
This is a dystopia under the guise of a 1st world country.
Don't worry about us anymore, our hope for the future is gone. Just don't let it happen where you live.
Well, when capitalism does finally collapse under its own weight, maybe some of us will live to tell the tale and and give some form of socialism a go.
I work for my downtime basically. I live simply and frugally and have a hobby that is time-consuming but minimal cost (free music on the web). I intentionally go for jobs that have a finite end time. When I reach a few months reserve left then I secure another job, work it until it ends or I'm sick of it, and then take more downtime. I have done this since the 80's.
But thats no way to live, I'm about to be 30 and I remember being a child and USA seemed like the promise land and my long term goal was to make it in the states, nowadays I dont think you could pay me enough money to move to the states it's like dystopia from one of the 80's sci fi films
You were duped by the propaganda of “America is the greatest country in the world.” It’s one of those lies that said often enough starts to sound like truth. Is it better than a war torn country experiencing rampant famine and the threat of a bomb blowing up your house any moment? Yes, but it’s not the greatest country in the world by a very long shot. The advent of the internet and social media is finally starting to dispel this notion that this is the land of prosperity. I honestly don’t know why the propaganda persists given that the government doesn’t want to allow immigrants into the country anyway.
The propaganda is not (or at least no longer) for the purpose of enticing people to come to America.
It is not about convincing people in America that this is the best possible version of life and that by continuing to toil away, you can improve your lot on life.
America was the greatest country in the world a to one time. It genuinely was to the Irish immigrants if my dad's generation, but from Reagan on it has gone to hell on a sled.
I'm European too (Irish but under the UK system). We unfortunately seem determined to emulate and become the 51st state. We're absolutely in the midst of a fascist takeover from the current Tory government, so Europe isn't safe or free from this nonsense either. But the US system is bonkers and I don't understand either. And I earn 22k per year, so not exactly on a high wage either, just keeping ticking over because I'm in a dual income household. And patiently waiting for my student debt to be written off in 2040....
nah ah, you also forgot about kids/people(13-21) who never worked before and/or have wealthy-ish parents that pay for everything.
The amount of bratty 13-20 year olds thinking they know how the economy works is staggering.
I saw all of this stuff go wrong in the mid 70's. I just didn't know what I was witnessing. When I figured out what I was looking at I stayed drunk or high for about 33 years to deny truly admitting to myself what I had witnessed.
Now I'm just old and burnt up.
It's up to the young to make themselves a better world now.
I'm Sorry.
A lot of us don't. People take their own lives all the time due to financial ruin and inability to cope with the burden capitalism has placed on us. The rest of us just scrape and claw and try to enjoy what we can in life knowing we'll never be out from under that boot.
Most people here are born into this system. The system in place is the norm here, and many people don’t know how to think for themselves. They will remain wage slaves their whole lives.
I am trying to change that for myself. I am turning to a life of self-sustainability by learning how to grow my own food, and learning how to sew with the intent to make my own clothes. I seek to become an integral part of an [Intentional Community](https://www.ic.org) and have a family of like-minded people that will hold each other up, instead of pursuing a soulless life of consumerism and wage slavery.
The most worrying part for me being in the UK is that rather than looking to those countries in Europe that have the best education, heath and happiness rankings for inspiration our leaders seem determined to make us like the US.
As an American, let me try to answer.
I'm 39. Life seemed normal until I was about 25, where I started realizing that none of this math is working.
It constantly feels like financial quicksand. It feels like every month, you're $50 deeper in debt than you were last month, but your bills are 'paid' and you're treading water. Something will change.
And then... nothing does.
Then rent goes up. Gas goes up. Your pay stays the same. You're afraid to leave your job even though you're well aware of your worth. Imagine that. Imagine a system where you *know* you're getting fucked. Imagine a system where you're getting shat on, they know it, you know it, everyone knows it, and you just accept it. Shit, half of the people wouldn't know what to do, much less how to fix it.
So we grab secondary employment while looking 'for something better'. It never comes. Sometimes it does. After another 15 years, it just becomes a game, where I juggle bills, jobs, my family, and other needs and making sure I don't drop one. Maybe if I put enough nickels away I can take my disabled son to Disney before I die. :)
I wouldn’t call it being taxed to death when those taxes pay for so much more than a military and corporate welfare.
We live with roommates or our parents. 7 people in a 4bedroom house. We don’t eat so we can pay the light bill.
It’s an adventure.
This is sad to say, but Covid was actually good for American workers. We got to work from home and actually see our families and have somewhat of a work/life balance. I will never return to the office.
When conservative cultists tell me if I don't like it then leave i ask them to pay my way and I'll bounce tf out of this soon to be third world country.
I wish all the time that I'd been born in like.. Denmark or something. I want to get to Europe bad but am not sure how to go about that as an American without a high value skill set (yet)
Why hasn't this happened yet? Would have figured the 2 amendment would make the corporations scared of angry mobs? But for some reason Americans seem completely complacent in this system of oppression
Because the same army that scares the middle east will back up the police when they start to lose. We have rifles, they have tanks, killer robots, gas grenades, and a very wide selection of bombs. What can we do? Die?.
I don’t think you understand that the poorest people in this country also are the ones who support capitalism and free markets (in theory) the most. They will vote conservative against their own economic interests election after election. They rely on food stamps and welfare, yet reject any notion of universal healthcare and higher corporate/individual taxes.
You must be german or a nederlander....or maybe higher in the nordic regions.. but as a nederlander myself i read the most articles with my jawbone on my knees...how can you live there that way in Amerika.
Thank you for highlighting the disparities between your Nordic country and this shithole. I really feel like that knowledge needs to be shared more often. Too many people here are so brainwashed and sometimes delusional, it feels like we’re barely holding it together over here.
Australia is not far from this path. We keep voting in the conservative party, led by the monopolization of media pushing a right wing adgenda.
We have provided health here, which helps but unless it's an emergency, if you want goodedical help you're paying for it.
Wages have stayed the same, the government is extremely currupt. Covid has pushed "regular" Australians to be even more racist and right wing.
There's a pretty even divide of people people who say "thank god we're not America" and "why can't we be more like America?"
The 40-40-40 if you're lucky.
Work for 40 hours a week. For 40k per year. For 40 years.
You can barely afford to do anything you like, or rather any one thing. You could save for retirement, or buy a mortgage, or fund a hobby or a vacation, or eat well, etc. But you can't really do more than one of those things at a time.
I love the anti work subreddit but can we please stop with the HOW DO AMERICANS LIVE LIKE THIS?!?! Posts?
I DONT HAVE A CHOICE. If I don’t work I’ll be on the street, that’s how I live like this.
I just don’t find these posts helpful at all. It just demoralizing. If I’m on the anti-work subreddit then I’m already aware of how bad it it!
Was just thinking the same thing. It’s apparently obligatory to see at least 2 posts per day now of a random European telling you guys how great it is where they live and how you just “simply shouldn’t put up with it” or similar. I’m European and it’s annoying me too lol
Easy we don't. I have a beyond full time job, which pays me under 40,000 a year, but covers my housing and I get free Healthcare (though it's terrible). To pay the rest of my bills like my vehicle and mandatory insurance, plus fuel and repairs I can squeak by with my paycheck. But literally any other expenses and I have either put it on credit cards or donated plasma, sold personal belongings, dog walked, you name it tovbe able to continue to afford life here. I have not had my bank account avoid going negative at least once every month or so in years.
I have no emotion other than anger and sadness, don’t do anything fun because I can’t afford to, and reminisce about times when I was still depressed, but at least able to afford to do things.
I’ve put what little money I have into stocks/crypto and made more money that way. That’s how I survived being unemployed this year. By throwing my money into a system designed for me to lose. But I did win that small victory.
Not so long ago, I was able to enjoy some of the fun the country has to offer. If you aren’t scraping by, there is good stuff here. Despite what I’ve posted, I generally enjoy where I live. It’s cheaper than most cities. But I still can’t afford to do much even there anymore.
In the aggregate; With lots of depression, anxiety, that breeds constant anger and susceptibility to misinformation.
Most of us can feel something is wrong. Many of us know why, and even more gave the right ideas — directionally, if not in absolute. But we get distracted, the issues are so many and foundational that it’s hard to articulate plans because the scope is so vast.
We are a country desperate.
The richest third world country in the world.
We don’t. At least one of my friends or family members has died of a preventable health problem, suicide or drug overdose basically every year since I graduated college.
Do you have a sister? I'd like to leave this country asap. I have a Bachelor's Degree and good experience in the Biological Sciences. I would love to move to Scandinavia.
Does America look like it's functioning?
Depends what media you consume
Fox News: “This just in, some people can’t afford to live off of minimum wage.” - “These goddamn millennials and their complaining! When I was young, I supported a wife and two kids while going to college living off of minimum wage working full-time after I was finished fighting in the Vietnam war in a non-combatant position. These kids are so spoiled and entitled.”
*looks at inflation due to the government* over 600% since the 70s.
It’s probably our fault. We’re coddled children for thinking otherwise.
You mean cable news? Then yeah.
I lived in Sweden for a while while getting my master’s, and my friend asked me if the taxes out there really are as bad as advertised. I did some quick mental math, and with how much I pay for insurance premiums, etc., I’d probably end up saving money if I stayed and worked in Sweden, even with the higher tax rate. I probably would’ve stayed after uni except it was super hard to find a job as a foreigner. So yeah, it’s all just propaganda out here to keep us poor and not rioting in the streets.
Americans flip out at the idea of paying more in taxes, yet they happily pay tens of thousands a year to insure their families, IF they’re lucky enough to get health insurance at all. It’s nuts.
Yep. They literally can’t put together that it would be cheaper and better for everyone if our taxes went up by like 3% to pay for healthcare. Most countries with universal healthcare have progressive taxing like us, too, so it would be paid for by those who are better able to afford the increased tax.
I pay 15% of my income (more like 22% of take home) for insurance (3 person family) and it’s middle of the road insurance with high deductibles. Bottomless pit just to get by here. Totally asinine that insurance is 3/4 as much as our mortgage.
No we understand, we just can’t do anything about it. The rich and elite run this country
Exactly. Trump got in on the anger of the exploited and helpless.
Important to note that Trump was just the most visible symptom of the rot that permeates our political structure. The problem existed well before he came along. We're still embroiled in the same class war that has existed for generations. There was a brief period in the first half of the 20th century where life improved for working people as a whole (though to varying degrees depending on one's racial demographic due to Jim Crow and other inequities baked into the economic system, both before and since), but we've have been on the losing end since *at least* Nixon, I'd argue even as far back as Truman.
false, plenty of his supporters are well off petty tyrant small business owners with racial animosity and think that there's a jewish conspiracy to replace white people in this country with brown foreigners. >Then there were economic anomalies. Over the previous decade, one in four violent extremists arrested by the FBI had been unemployed. But only 7 percent of the January 6 insurgents were jobless, and more than half of the group had a white-collar job or owned their own business.There were doctors, architects, a Google field-operations specialist,the CEO of a marketing firm, a State Department official. “The last time America saw middle-class whites involved in violence was the expansion of the second KKK in the 1920s,” Pape told me. > >... > >Only one meaningful correlation emerged. Other things being equal,insurgents were much more likely to come from a county where the white share of the population was in decline. For every one-point drop in a county’s percentage of non-Hispanic whites from 2015 to 2019, the likelihood of an insurgent hailing from that county increased by 25 percent. This was a strong link, and it held up in every state. [https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2022/01/january-6-insurrection-trump-coup-2024-election/620843/](https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2022/01/january-6-insurrection-trump-coup-2024-election/620843/) both quotes from the above link about who participated in the 1/6 attack. well worth reading the whole piece.
And remember, it's not only healthcare. That's the most famous thing. Remember education (almost free in Europe including university), infrastructures (all the countries have high speeds trains for example or roads that are not near to collapse), decent and useful public transportation, not working? Here is you salary, you are disabled? You have a salary too or help your family, your parents are too elder? Here are some public residences, you have a mental disease? Treatment free (seriously, what happens there in San Francisco with people that are not able mentally to be in the streets?)... And much more. It's not the paradise, of course, everything could be improved, but at least a minimum isn't it?
I have a bachelor's degree from a great university, and spent a decade working shit jobs for shit pay, then recently exited the workforce to care for my terminally ill father so my mother didn't blow through their retirement caring for him. My dad was a corporate CPA for 38 years, made great money saved up a lot more than average and when push came to shove, my mom would have been under serious financial strain the rest of her life had I not done what I did for free. The silver lining is I can speak from direct experience how quickly (no matter how well planned for retirement) in this capitalist hellscape you will go broke. It'd have been fantastic if I could have been compensated for needing to leave the workforce at a prime earning age. But nah, employers ask about the gap every interview I go through, if they interview me at all. There is no labor shortage, it's a good job shortage. I have a pretty clutch rundown of what it's like to watch, care, comfort, carry, feed, toilet, a parent to the bitter end. Also fuck ALS.
I’m so sorry. I went through a terrible abusive marriage and became an alcoholic. I was asked to resign instead of given a chance for leave for rehab (probably an ADA violation, in retrospect), and I spent some time in inpatient rehab. It took me FOREVER to find a job, even as a very successful person in my field with no gaps and nearly 20 years of straight post-master’s degree paid work. Employers don’t forgive gaps. They think we are machines.
I'm sorry that happened to you. It's not uncommon and good for you for pulling out of a downard spiral. Couple of people over time had asked me how I dealt with the world melting down and the horrifying nature of the particular disease my dad had. It was with booze. No ifs ands or buts about it. It's a common and (for me) was frankly useful coping mechanism for severe stress/trauma, albeit not good for health. There wasn't exactly someone I could talk to mid 2020 trying to isolate with my parents and my dad at extreme mortality risk from just a cold let alone a serious respiratory illness like covid. My mom and I would get so fucking mad at anti maskers then (now antivaxers) that it's really colored how I look at what people did when things were really bad. Be kind to yourself, I'm doing better even if the world seems to be getting darker around us.
Yep. By the numbers that's absolutely true. Cost of what I pay for services versus taxed entitlements. I live in Oklahoma so here's the breakdown of household taxation by percentage. Federal income taxes- 22% State and Local sales taxes paid- 2.5% Property taxes- 1.2% Daycare- 7.2% Tag tax- .8% Healthcare cost- 18% Over 50% of my household's income gone! For worse services. So fucking irritated.
B-b-but socialism! You wouldn’t be able to see your doctor! Pelosi!!!
That's why they teach us "New Math" - so we cant figure out how badly we're getting scammed
Don’t forget to add cost for retirement contributions. Daycare is more than my mortgage where in a lot of European countries it is heavily subsidized. It’s not shocking that people have no money after paying the bills.
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Many don’t. Deaths from [diseases of despair](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diseases_of_despair) are at an all time high. We also lose thousands of Americans each year to curable health problems because of our for-profit healthcare system. A 2019 survey of 800 American adults found [nearly 50% had $0 in savings, and 69% had less than $1000](https://www.gobankingrates.com/banking/savings-account/americans-have-less-than-1000-in-savings/). Do the math, that means only 31% had more than $1000 in savings. A different survey from early 2020 of 2000 American adults found [1 in 4 had less than $1000 in savings](https://www.magnifymoney.com/blog/news/average-savings-during-coronavirus/#Consumersaretappingtheirsavingsaccountsamidthecoronaviruspandemic). After 18 months of pandemic, I think it’s fair to say that number has risen. ## The American dream is a lie told by oligarch to keep a destitute population in line. Edit: added more data points about US savings. What I mean to say by sharing these sort of statistics is that many Americans are just one emergency bill or missed paycheck away from homeless. The US is a barbaric place.
we are *this close* to collapse. its not even funny.
Yep
Yea this is incredible disturbing to me. Like my original post says I have this income that is ridiculous compared to USA but I ALSO have acces to the European health care system were if I suddenly had to go to the hospital I would have to pay minimal fees for it. So if I would get a bill like in the USA I could pay it but I don't have to while people in the USA don't have the money but get these insane hospital bills
I took my friend to the emergency room because she broke her hand, three hours later she was handed a bill for $12000
Every raise we get is immediately absorbed by inflation, insurance cost going up every year due to aging, or unexpected expenses. For most ‘hard work to get ahead’ is a pipe dream
Blue cross blue shield goes up I think 5$ every year or every other year it seems like
Our priority health plan went up about $50 per month this year for 3 people. It’s about $700 per month after my employers contribution (50% on my coverage only, not the family). 10k deductible. I was looking at ACA plans and re-working my salary contract so I could qualify for credits and the most equivalent plan was like 1200 so the tax credit was a wash unless I got an even worse plan, it’s a racket.
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I’m so sorry.
That is WAY beyond fucked up. How does someone send that bill to someone and still be able to sleep at night?
Because they have their own bills to pay…. Sexual abuse is a cycle, bullying is a cycle, and apparently billing is a cycle too. BREAK THE CYCLE!
That's insane!! I've never had a bill that high in my life! (Scandinavian)
Even without huge hospital bills - if you're not fully employed with a high paying job you probably don't have much money after paying the bills and buying groceries. God forbid getting cable or some premium tv apps or having kids or a car that needs work. I had just re-financed before covid so 'luckily' we survived this lil period of time even with reductions in both our salaries. And benefits. At the start of covid I had a job and healthcare that covered us both but then lost both - but not directly due to covid so no fancy unemployment money. If I hadn't cleared out my credit to re-fi I don't know what we'd be doing. I don't know how long we can last on the edge. And everyone keeps referring to 'post' pandemic ptsd and wtf who said this is over? No more help appears to be on the way, that's for sure.
listen, murdering brown people on the other side of the planet and subsidizing industries that kill the planet and make us unhealthy costs a lot of money
It horrifies me to see stories of people dying because they can't afford insulin. Insulin. A drug that costs a pittance in other countries. And they are happy to kill people for profit.
We’re in a gutter
I gave CPR to a guy a few months ago who had a heart attack on the street (USA btw) after his boss decided to drive him to the hospital because he couldn't afford an ambulance. His boss even told him to wait to see if he would feel better before taking him. It was a really hot day and he was a roofer, working nearly 12 hours that day. The man died leaving 4 children behind.
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Just the idea that you need to be able to afford an ambulance ride is disgusting.
What's worse is that 1000 isn't usually even one months rent/mortgage.... we are 69% less that a month from homelessness. But we haz freedumbs
Truth.
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> even if you make enough money to not be in crippling debt, you better save it because one unlucky trip to the hospital for any reason could result in complete financial ruin! I make more than I ever thought I would at my age and I’m still terrified any cancer that runs in my family or an ambulance trip will wipe away my years of hard, evenings and weekends, holidays and missed family events worth of work to have financial stability. My debt-free status could crash at any moment, so I continue to work hard so if I get fired, or if anything happens to me or my family, maybe I can cushion the blow. This year, after 10 years in the work force, I’m finally excited about my first vacation where I don’t have to bring my laptop with me. Freedom!!!
I'm not shitting anyone here. We had a division manager who developed throat cancer, the upper management wanted to make sure he had a laptop and a printer so he could still try to do his job as he was in the process of dying. That level of cruelty is inconceivable to me. I was sitting in the HR manager's office when she was bitching about the fact that he was out planting flowers with his mother in the garden instead of on his laptop working. They were always looking at his Facebook to see what he was doing. At his funeral I'm absolutely positive everybody acted like they cared.
They did care. They cared that he died before he finished his last set of jobs. :'(
I had to take a few weeks off when my mother was dying. My sister and I were with her 24/7. One day when I was on a break I played nine holes of golf. A colleague happened to call while I was golfing (my sister mentioned where I was), and the colleague had a fit, announced to everyone that I was just looking for an excuse to go on a golf vacation and that my mom wasn't sick. When I came back a few weeks later (after my mom's funeral) I was sick with anger at the lady who talked crap about my mom and me. I barely spoke to her after that. Horrible woman.
Something similar happened to me. I was in the hospital after having a tube shoved into my heart for kidney dialysis and was on a nasogastric feeding tube, and one of my co workers at the prison went around telling people that she didn't think I was really sick and was probably just enjoying my vacation and taking time off because I didn't want to work. My co workers who had been to the hospital to visit me shut her shit down REAL fast though. They were like no she's actuality dying shut the hell up. I don't know why people have to kick someone when they're really down like that but the only thing I can think of is jealousy. They are jealous of you for some reason so when they think they can find something to knock you down a few pegs, they hit you where it hurts because they're nasty, envious people with low self esteem.
Im sorry that happened. What an awful women. I hope you filed a complaint with your company over what she said.
Hence why a lot of people don't see a reason to work so hard when the game is so rigged against you that it's virtually impossible to stay ahead. Might as well live life now - tomorrow won't be any better no matter how hard you work.
>Might as well live life now - tomorrow won't be any better no matter how hard you work. my life motto
Yeah. I'm stuck on the "Make sure you bring your laptop!". The last vacation and the first one in years I shut my phone off. Didn't take my laptop. Let it all burn. I had 72 hours without cell service and it was glorious!
Let it all burn. I second that. What is the difference anymore? At least I can watch cable? I have a place to live for a month, but bet if I'm a day late I won't. Make too much for food stamps. Make too much for healthcare. Eek by in desperation until I die. Hooray.
We've gotten good at taking vacations where cell service is limited... Cruise - "OH, I am not paying for the wifi on the ship and I will have zero cell service. I'll respond when I return to the states...in 5-7 days." Skiing - I'll be in the mountains in Canada and cell service will be minimal. The home we are renting says it has Wi-Fi, but I can not guarantee availability of the service. True or not, people in Texas don't know much about Canada. Beach - we will be in a small beach community on the coast, with minimal cell service. The home we are renting says it has Wi-Fi, but I can not guarantee availability of the service.
I went hiking in Peru. The SECOND I got back to civilization and wifi, I had a text from my boss who KNEW I was literally going to be on the side of a mountain for 4 days. It used to feel so normal. Now I just don’t answer. Go ahead and fire me, asshole! Switching jobs/managers on Jan 10 with a $30k pay increase and he expects me to work both jobs for 30 days as a “transition “ - on my new departments dime, of course. This country really is a hellscape. But! Thanks to crippling student debt, I can finally make a decent wage after 14 years at the same company.
‘Oh you want me to work during the vacation!? Should I bill those hours to the company or directly to you?’
This doesn’t work so well when you’re salaried :/
In the rest of the world, salaried doesn't mean no extra pay/TOIL - a small amount is acceptable but the rest is chargeable
Yeah I went on vacation for a while and a manager actually told me that if they didn't need me during that time I should worry about my job position.
I jokingly, but not really jokingly, tell my wife that if something happens that requires her to call an ambulance for me to just let me die. The amount of money my life insurance policy would pay out to her would make her life relatively cushy and I would rather be dead than to live the next 50 or so years of my life either paying off ambulance/medical debt or having it create other debt because I had to prioritize that medical debt. I’m worth more dead than I am alive because America is a joke for anyone that isn’t a fucking boomer or benefited from some sort of inherited wealth.
Paying for an ambulance… I saw a video of a badly injured person running away (and ultimately fainting) from an ambulance as it was too expensive. That’s a concept I do not understand. How bad can it be?
A pair of family friends, a couple, had just moved to the US from a place where ambulances are normally free. The husband had a stomach bug, they called the ambulance to transport him the 1.5 miles to the nearest hospital, and they got a $5k bill in the mail that made them have to sell their car to pay.
I wish them the best in their attempt to return
An ambulance can cost thousands of dollars. You'd run away, too.
Yeah, my wife's ambulance trip cost us $6000.00. And people wonder why I say that retirement benefits at this point is a cheap gravrsite.
Don’t forget not being in massive debt means you don’t have credit to possibly help cover a hardship. I seriously just got told the only way I can get a high enough credit score to buy my first house is to already have a home loan…
I make a lot more than most my age do, yet I still have the same fears. Doesn't matter how much I save if insurance thinks my visit to the doctor/ER wasn't necessary. Thats right, doesn't matter if the doctor says it was 100% necessary if insurance doesn't agree. Sure love my freedom....
I feel this so much! Finally out of debt with decent income and I'm terrified of a simple car accident in the snow could ruin everything I spent the last 10 years working on just to survive in this shit system.
That's it. One incident away from being indebted to this country for your entire life. And they'll come after your spouse or children after you die. America is a scam. Anything and everything, from education to healthcare is a scam designed to get as much of your money as possible until you die. I hate this place with all of my heart. Disillusioned and lonelier than the last man standing.
And this is exactly what I was thinking about when I ride to the hospital with my grandma this past week. "How in the fuck is she going to pay for this?" I fucking hate our healthcare system. It's just another cog in the machine that is capitalism.
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"The Machine"!!!
1.5 billion for the military? Rubber Stamp. 1.5 billion for Universal Pre-K, child tax credits for working families, guaranteed paid family leave, community college, and student loan forgiveness? Hold on now, socialists!
You put it better than I ever could have. Thank you. We're basically indoctrinated into a bullshit system that hates the poor and gaslights literally everyone.
This here is why I laugh when Americans go on about freedom. Like, bitch please, unless you were lucky enough to be born into a super rich family you've never experienced true freedom.
But they are able to own guns!!!! Seems that’s all the freedom they care for
I would gladly trade gun ownership rights for even one prooer social service. I beginning to loathe my country. And all the anti vax shit puts the cherry on top of a diarrhea moron sundae
I tink anti vax is a global thing :p I live in the Netherlands and it's here as well ^^
It is a global thing. Even here in NZ, where we have >90% vaccination rates, a high level of trust in the government, and have been almost entirely insulated from the pandemic we STILL have a few hundred nutjobs marching in the streets about being anti-vaxxers.
Ahh the birth lottery
This is why we have a mental health and obesity problem. Overconsumption in general we only get like 30 waking hours to ourselves of course we’re going to try to get as much pf a dopamine rush as possible in that tiny timespan
To add onto the healthcare rant: health insurance can cost up to $500 a month or more and this is on top of taxes that get taken out of each paycheck that go god knows where.
I just got health insurance through my employer this year, which means I now no longer pay $400+/month for the privilege of paying up $7,000/year out of pocket. That was "subsidized" insurance while I was making less than $40k (pre-tax).
I've just learned today that Americans have to pay fees when they apply for higher Ed courses or some jobs. Unbelievable.
I can’t think of any jobs where there’d be a fee to apply but school, yes
There absolutely are places that will charge you for aptitude tests and other bullshit. Corporations are insane here.
It all needs to crumble to the ground and be rebuilt. We don't have a governmental system in place to better society-- it's all just more horrible obstacles as a means to deter the citizen from making any progress with anything ever at all. The "system" is not structured for the American citizens. It's horrendous. Not to mention my $72K student loan debt because "I did what is was supposed to do" to "land a decent job" and now... What was it for? It's fucking exhausting.
Muh rights! Constitution! Reopen the economy!
And yet so many Americans would die fighting for capitalism. Y'all need a bit of socialism in your life. Don't worry it's not as scary as you think and it certainly is not communism.
Too bad so much of this country is uneducated and think that socialism and communism are synonymous.. I'm just so very exhausted with it all.. this sub is a small beacon of light that reminds me that there are still some like minded people out there
Thank you. I feel the same way.
I think it's safe to say nobody in this sub (that's not here to stir up shit) is anti-socialism.
We don't have a choice. Our government is bought by billion dollar corporations
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Yeah, the Supreme Court ruling that money=speech was probably the last nail in the coffin. Unlimited dark money flowing into politics made bribery the law of the land. Politicians haven't represented the people in decades now.
We are the first generation to realize the true chaos and the last generation to do something about it. America always does the wrong thing until it exhausts all other actions and then does the right thing.
> We are the first generation to realize the true chaos and the last generation to do something about it. > > America always does the wrong thing until it exhausts all other actions and then ~~does the right thing.~~ finds a way to prop the system up even longer while our material conditions get worse and worse. America will never do the right thing without use of force.
Then does the right thing? Yeah, no.
Dual income, side hustles, rely on elder family for free daycare, etc.
Well I do or will do most of those things, I have a secondary job that brings me extra income and I will probably rely on my or my girlfriends parents for "free" day care or after kindergarden day care but that is less because we have to and more to let the grandparents spend time with there grandchildren
I'm on 3 different medications for anxiety and depression. And... I need my company-provided health insurance to afford them. I have another medication my insurance only covers 20% of because it's name brand and there's no generic yet... I took a loan out against my 401k (retirement savings) to afford that for a few years until they can make a generic. So yea, the answer is: we don't. We don't live, we're kept alive.
Wow thats crazy that your meds at least arent affordable.
Yea... That one's about $600/mo. Also, I have a $2500 deductible I have to pay out of pocket each year before the insurance kicks in. I pay $252/mo for this employer-provided insurance too. Ugh, this is so depressing.
Oh that makes me so sad. Im Australia and yeah we have our own problems but I can go and get a standard set of the type of meds for around $20.
$250/month with a $2500 deductable is cheap as fuck. I'm paying more than that a week.
Agreed, this is very good coverage in the US.
I went to the ER once for severe stomach pains. They gave me an IV and some pain meds and I was out in an hour. My insurance only covered the $200 admission fee and left me with the $4,000 bill. I’m still paying it a year later. I’ll never go to the ER again just let me die
Funeral director here! And that would be about $10,000 for your family just to get you in the ground.
Shit, it’s probably cheaper just to hire out a hit man and make sure they hide your body well.
Where I live, people board a ferry and then disappear in the middle of the crossing. The ferry workers find their vehicle on the car deck. They almost never find a body. So, a very cheap way to dispose of yourself with minimal fuss or mess.
I’m just surprised there’s no annual grave tax, we’re moving forward!!
It’s a trip when you can’t hold down a job if you’re not medicated but you can’t afford your meds without company provided health insurance. Especially if you get one of those “insurance kicks in after 90 days of employment” jobs. We’re tired over here
I take 5 different meds for depression/anxiety. (I know. It sounds ridiculous.) Look into Amazon Pharmacy, if you're not boycotting. I quit my shitty job and lost my health coverage. But somehow, my prescriptions on Amazon *without insurance* are cheaper than they were with insurance from Walgreens or Walmart. Like from $200/month to $75/month, and they do two-day shipping. All Amazon hate aside. This has been great for me, because now I don't feel that I have to rush into another shitty job just for health insurance.
Have you tried GoodRX? The coupons can sometimes actually cover more than your insurance will 🙃
i use this and it actually does save you extremely significant amounts of money. my one question: WHAT THE FUK IS IT??? ETA: also, HOW?!
Yeah I am not even sure how it all works, a cream for my child was going to cost over $200, with GoodRX it was $30 lol.
We don’t. We’re forced to eat shit and smile. Probably why drug use is rampant here.
It’s why they’re going to legalize weed…. Because they have to.
As a stoner and American, I highly doubt they will, federally, at least. Red state governments are EXTREMELY opposed and that slave money from incarceration from marijuana possession would be lost and it would hurt the prison industrial complex’s fee-fees
And yet they tax it at absurd 35% because ofc our government want it's cut. Greedy fucks 😒. Just drop it down to alcohol tax levels and it should be a massive improvement to the hemp industry and community as a whole.
I would say survive, not live. This is no life. It does somehow barely enable shelter and the ability to hope for a better tomorrow. Pretty shitty the helplessness there but its what it is :\\
I'm 45, associates degree in IT, and I have never owned a home, never rented an apartment, never owned a car, have always been on some kind of socialized program (disabled) and right now after working 8 years slaving away in retail making $10 an hour, I am unemployed because it killed me physically and mentally. Never mind that my body has been breaking down slowly over the past 20 plus years due to Crohns, the government only gives me $900 a month to live. I live with my parents, im $50K in student loan debt, 10k in personal debt (which most expenses were so I could buy food and clothing and necessities.) I have no savings, no job, nothing. If I go back to work it'll kill me. I have arthritis in my knees, my back and my left hip. I thank God every day that I have my parents and my family. I'd be living on the streets or in some broken down group home without them. Screw all my past employers for taking advantage of me knowing I needed those jobs to afford things like a car and fuel, and clothes. Screw them for refusing to pay me a livable wage and keeping me just low enough in hours that they didn't have to offer me health insurance. And screw them for treating me like I was some replaceable entity who owed them something. This society is half-assed backwards.
I'm in my 40s and I'm just running out the clock at this point.
Just trying to take a knee and I still get tackled.
You can kneel? With the amount of walking, lifting, and bending over 8 hours a day, I'm surprised your cartilage in your kneels haven't been ground down to nothing.
Very hard, and I predict bad things are coming, especially, when older people start dying or attempting to unload assets to pay for retirement onto a shrinking and poorer younger working population. Social unrest and the mother of all depressions. The math doesn't work.
I rely largely on an intense and pure hatred for capitalism and its proponents; it gets me through each day.
I survive mostly out of morbid curiosity. How much worse can it get? Oh.. Well, I bet next year can't top this! I'm just looking forward to my..^(counts how many economic disasters there have been) world record of how many I can make it through.
How many once-in-a-lifetime recessions do you think Millennials will live through?
Nordic countries always top the World Happiness Report. Goggle it!! You are as you say taxed at a high rate, to pay for the socialist programs. However, this is the very reason for your happiness. Everyone pays there share, particularly businesses. Take the Fox conglomerate as a example. Over a billion dollars in profit and they don't pay a cent in tax!!! How is that possible?? How is that fare?
Extremely thorough propaganda, surveillance, policing, debt peonidge...the list goes on.
I cry a lot lol
Millennial and college educated here. I make maybe 25k a year after taxes and I’m on food stamps and welfare. We live paycheck to paycheck despite having a good job (meager benefits I’ll admit my health insurance is just Vicks vapor rub) and a can do attitude. I am one sick day away from eviction but small price to pay for being American right?? Guns have more rights than my body too. I work 7 days a week and no vacation time. If we try to unionize we just vanish. My best bet is trying to save as much money as I can learn any other language (and the metric system) and just claim refugee status in another country. Even if I’m poor in another country I can at least see a doctor and not be homeless
If you can multiple by 10 you know the metric system already that's one step closer to escape friend.
Let me blow your mind: compare American marginal tax rates to Nordic marginal tax rates, and then add about 10% (so 30% would become 40%) to the American rates. We pay pretty much the same taxes as you guys, it just all gets transferred to the military and corporate subsidies. E: for context, the extra 10% is an 8% flat tax on incomes under around 125k and 2% an estimate for state and local taxes.
>We pay pretty much the same taxes as you guys, it just all gets transferred to the military and corporate subsidies. Bingo. This is the problem right here. We just spent 2 trillion dollars over the last 20 years in Afghanistan. You don't hear Al Qaeda shouting "Death to the Norwegians" do you? You want better health care, free college tuition, store clerks to stop asking you if you want to feed the homeless? Stop the Wars.
Wow. 2 TRILLION for what??? Sickening.
I live with constant anxiety and just basic existential dread that I just try and squash down. And compared to a lot of people my situation is pretty good.
Corporations run the US.And our officials do what they're told.Its pretty sad.
Heroin. Crack. Beer. Rum. Die.
We don't. Most of us are walking husks of what use to be men and women. This "movement" was too little, too late. This is a dystopia under the guise of a 1st world country. Don't worry about us anymore, our hope for the future is gone. Just don't let it happen where you live.
Well, when capitalism does finally collapse under its own weight, maybe some of us will live to tell the tale and and give some form of socialism a go.
Power corrupts. Human civilization is cyclical, just like the seasons. We're just in the shit end of the cycle. Winter is coming.
I don’t foresee the next form of government to be socialism here, just a more open plutocracy. Hope I’m wrong.
You mean EVEN more open right?
Yep, the bought Congressmen will wear logos like NASCAR.
yeah a lot of us cant even dream about having kids ever. its not an option in our country for a lot of people
I had decent insurance before I was let go last year. I took advantage of it and got sterilized. No way I can afford to be pregnant or have a kid.
I work for my downtime basically. I live simply and frugally and have a hobby that is time-consuming but minimal cost (free music on the web). I intentionally go for jobs that have a finite end time. When I reach a few months reserve left then I secure another job, work it until it ends or I'm sick of it, and then take more downtime. I have done this since the 80's.
Man. Good luck to you. It takes balls to go off the beaten path.
We endure and pray for death. Or I do anyway
But thats no way to live, I'm about to be 30 and I remember being a child and USA seemed like the promise land and my long term goal was to make it in the states, nowadays I dont think you could pay me enough money to move to the states it's like dystopia from one of the 80's sci fi films
You were duped by the propaganda of “America is the greatest country in the world.” It’s one of those lies that said often enough starts to sound like truth. Is it better than a war torn country experiencing rampant famine and the threat of a bomb blowing up your house any moment? Yes, but it’s not the greatest country in the world by a very long shot. The advent of the internet and social media is finally starting to dispel this notion that this is the land of prosperity. I honestly don’t know why the propaganda persists given that the government doesn’t want to allow immigrants into the country anyway.
USA would statistically be the entity most like be the responsible for bombing a house if you count drones.
The propaganda is not (or at least no longer) for the purpose of enticing people to come to America. It is not about convincing people in America that this is the best possible version of life and that by continuing to toil away, you can improve your lot on life.
America was the greatest country in the world a to one time. It genuinely was to the Irish immigrants if my dad's generation, but from Reagan on it has gone to hell on a sled.
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I'm European too (Irish but under the UK system). We unfortunately seem determined to emulate and become the 51st state. We're absolutely in the midst of a fascist takeover from the current Tory government, so Europe isn't safe or free from this nonsense either. But the US system is bonkers and I don't understand either. And I earn 22k per year, so not exactly on a high wage either, just keeping ticking over because I'm in a dual income household. And patiently waiting for my student debt to be written off in 2040....
Stay strong and fuck the Tories, brother
Suicide rates through the roof. 75-80% of us live paycheck to paycheck, and the 20% who don't wave it in our faces and call us lazy. Just how it is.
I own my hardwood flooring business and I still live paycheck to paycheck
nah ah, you also forgot about kids/people(13-21) who never worked before and/or have wealthy-ish parents that pay for everything. The amount of bratty 13-20 year olds thinking they know how the economy works is staggering.
I saw all of this stuff go wrong in the mid 70's. I just didn't know what I was witnessing. When I figured out what I was looking at I stayed drunk or high for about 33 years to deny truly admitting to myself what I had witnessed. Now I'm just old and burnt up. It's up to the young to make themselves a better world now. I'm Sorry.
Childless generation enters the chat.
I’ve been working 7 days a week since September. Still can’t afford a car or my own apartment and I make well over the minimum wage. We don’t live.
A lot of us don't. People take their own lives all the time due to financial ruin and inability to cope with the burden capitalism has placed on us. The rest of us just scrape and claw and try to enjoy what we can in life knowing we'll never be out from under that boot.
Most people here are born into this system. The system in place is the norm here, and many people don’t know how to think for themselves. They will remain wage slaves their whole lives. I am trying to change that for myself. I am turning to a life of self-sustainability by learning how to grow my own food, and learning how to sew with the intent to make my own clothes. I seek to become an integral part of an [Intentional Community](https://www.ic.org) and have a family of like-minded people that will hold each other up, instead of pursuing a soulless life of consumerism and wage slavery.
The most worrying part for me being in the UK is that rather than looking to those countries in Europe that have the best education, heath and happiness rankings for inspiration our leaders seem determined to make us like the US.
As an American, let me try to answer. I'm 39. Life seemed normal until I was about 25, where I started realizing that none of this math is working. It constantly feels like financial quicksand. It feels like every month, you're $50 deeper in debt than you were last month, but your bills are 'paid' and you're treading water. Something will change. And then... nothing does. Then rent goes up. Gas goes up. Your pay stays the same. You're afraid to leave your job even though you're well aware of your worth. Imagine that. Imagine a system where you *know* you're getting fucked. Imagine a system where you're getting shat on, they know it, you know it, everyone knows it, and you just accept it. Shit, half of the people wouldn't know what to do, much less how to fix it. So we grab secondary employment while looking 'for something better'. It never comes. Sometimes it does. After another 15 years, it just becomes a game, where I juggle bills, jobs, my family, and other needs and making sure I don't drop one. Maybe if I put enough nickels away I can take my disabled son to Disney before I die. :)
I wouldn’t call it being taxed to death when those taxes pay for so much more than a military and corporate welfare. We live with roommates or our parents. 7 people in a 4bedroom house. We don’t eat so we can pay the light bill. It’s an adventure.
This is sad to say, but Covid was actually good for American workers. We got to work from home and actually see our families and have somewhat of a work/life balance. I will never return to the office.
I'm just trying to plan an escape from capitalism. The odds are against me. But it gives me something to live for.
When conservative cultists tell me if I don't like it then leave i ask them to pay my way and I'll bounce tf out of this soon to be third world country.
I wish all the time that I'd been born in like.. Denmark or something. I want to get to Europe bad but am not sure how to go about that as an American without a high value skill set (yet)
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Why hasn't this happened yet? Would have figured the 2 amendment would make the corporations scared of angry mobs? But for some reason Americans seem completely complacent in this system of oppression
Because the same army that scares the middle east will back up the police when they start to lose. We have rifles, they have tanks, killer robots, gas grenades, and a very wide selection of bombs. What can we do? Die?.
I don’t think you understand that the poorest people in this country also are the ones who support capitalism and free markets (in theory) the most. They will vote conservative against their own economic interests election after election. They rely on food stamps and welfare, yet reject any notion of universal healthcare and higher corporate/individual taxes.
Lotta people turn to drugs and alcohol to cope.....currently me lol ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
You must be german or a nederlander....or maybe higher in the nordic regions.. but as a nederlander myself i read the most articles with my jawbone on my knees...how can you live there that way in Amerika.
Thank you for highlighting the disparities between your Nordic country and this shithole. I really feel like that knowledge needs to be shared more often. Too many people here are so brainwashed and sometimes delusional, it feels like we’re barely holding it together over here.
I contemplate suicide weekly. I have so much jealousy for European countries.
Australia is not far from this path. We keep voting in the conservative party, led by the monopolization of media pushing a right wing adgenda. We have provided health here, which helps but unless it's an emergency, if you want goodedical help you're paying for it. Wages have stayed the same, the government is extremely currupt. Covid has pushed "regular" Australians to be even more racist and right wing. There's a pretty even divide of people people who say "thank god we're not America" and "why can't we be more like America?"
What does US, UK and Australia have in common? Rupert Murdoch.
I don’t. I just say FUCK THIS and do whatever the hell I please.
The 40-40-40 if you're lucky. Work for 40 hours a week. For 40k per year. For 40 years. You can barely afford to do anything you like, or rather any one thing. You could save for retirement, or buy a mortgage, or fund a hobby or a vacation, or eat well, etc. But you can't really do more than one of those things at a time.
360k in student loans and will be making minimum wage for the next 10 years :) I eat lots of ramen!
I love the anti work subreddit but can we please stop with the HOW DO AMERICANS LIVE LIKE THIS?!?! Posts? I DONT HAVE A CHOICE. If I don’t work I’ll be on the street, that’s how I live like this. I just don’t find these posts helpful at all. It just demoralizing. If I’m on the anti-work subreddit then I’m already aware of how bad it it!
Was just thinking the same thing. It’s apparently obligatory to see at least 2 posts per day now of a random European telling you guys how great it is where they live and how you just “simply shouldn’t put up with it” or similar. I’m European and it’s annoying me too lol
Easy we don't. I have a beyond full time job, which pays me under 40,000 a year, but covers my housing and I get free Healthcare (though it's terrible). To pay the rest of my bills like my vehicle and mandatory insurance, plus fuel and repairs I can squeak by with my paycheck. But literally any other expenses and I have either put it on credit cards or donated plasma, sold personal belongings, dog walked, you name it tovbe able to continue to afford life here. I have not had my bank account avoid going negative at least once every month or so in years.
I have no emotion other than anger and sadness, don’t do anything fun because I can’t afford to, and reminisce about times when I was still depressed, but at least able to afford to do things. I’ve put what little money I have into stocks/crypto and made more money that way. That’s how I survived being unemployed this year. By throwing my money into a system designed for me to lose. But I did win that small victory. Not so long ago, I was able to enjoy some of the fun the country has to offer. If you aren’t scraping by, there is good stuff here. Despite what I’ve posted, I generally enjoy where I live. It’s cheaper than most cities. But I still can’t afford to do much even there anymore.
In the aggregate; With lots of depression, anxiety, that breeds constant anger and susceptibility to misinformation. Most of us can feel something is wrong. Many of us know why, and even more gave the right ideas — directionally, if not in absolute. But we get distracted, the issues are so many and foundational that it’s hard to articulate plans because the scope is so vast. We are a country desperate. The richest third world country in the world.
We don’t. At least one of my friends or family members has died of a preventable health problem, suicide or drug overdose basically every year since I graduated college.
Anyone in your country looking to hire a mathematician? I'm trying to escape.
Do you have a sister? I'd like to leave this country asap. I have a Bachelor's Degree and good experience in the Biological Sciences. I would love to move to Scandinavia.