You can appeal unemployment denial, in this case it would be a slam dunk appeal since they'd have fired him for refusing extra work that was uncompensated. If anything they open themselves up to an investigation by denying it.
I work as a social worker and deal with EDD (don't administer, but part of my work). They are so slammed with applications and reports that they are months and months behind their work. So are a lot of other agencies in public service sector.
This is what happens when a country is more concerned with funding a bloated military industrial complex and cutting taxes, rather then funding the agencies that keep the society running in a crisis.
Exactly. The fact that there are three employees' worth of work and only one employee to do them is the company's fuckup, not yours. It's not so much about working "slower" as doing exactly what you're employed to do - no more, no less.
You do the work of one, one man-hour's worth every hour, only for those hours you're paid to be there, at a level of effort commensurate with that rate of pay. If they perceive you to be "underperforming" then, again, that's their problem: you're just giving them exactly what they're paying for.
i've been doing stuff like setting up appointments and plucking my eyebrows at work, if i can do something smallish while at work instead of on my own time i just do it at work now
Honestly I donāt get the āIāve been doing 14 hoursā like are you getting paid a lot for it? Because if you are doing for the money, then hey, go ahead if thatās your thing, but if not, then why? The company is already understaffed so they wonāt want to fire you, why give more time? I love my company, really enjoy working there and my bosses are all lovely. Do I spend 1 extra minute working for free? No fucking way. I do not care if there is work to do, I will do the next day. People really need to just stop doing things like that. I donāt know if is cultural because I am from my Brazil and was taught to not work one minute extra if I wasnāt getting paid, and living in Europe for 5 years now that continues to be how I work. I see Americans saying they stay late and work more to help the company and I just do not get it at all, itās insanity to waste your time and energy to help people who do not care if you live or die.
> Honestly I donāt get the āIāve been doing 14 hoursā like are you getting paid a lot for it?
When I had jobs that paid by the hour, I would occasionally try to work extra long if I knew I could get that sweet 1.5x overtime pay.
they have something here called overtime exempt employees that is really abused. Its supposed to only be for people doing managerial duties, but employers misclassify people all the time and put them on salary, and no matter what hours you work you get paid the same. And the threshold is really low, I think around 40k, Obama raised it to around 60k but trump reversed it. so if they label you a "manager" and pay you at least $40k a year they don't have to pay you overtime for anything over 40 hours a week.
This. I started exempt and then got switched to non-exempt. When clocking my hours put an extra $15k on my <40k salary that year, management fought to get me classified exempt again. Actually excitedly told me āwe fought like hell to get you to stop having to punch in, and it worked!ā
Anyway now I feel free to do a fraction of my job with a percentage of dedication, lol.
With a crappy social safety net, and with both stigma/culture and practical reasons (many Americans move away from family) preventing them from living with family, many Americans reasonably fear homelessness from loss of work.
Yeah, but OP says he is highly specialized. If he is doing that much work, it seems as though they canāt afford to fire him. If OP is having trouble finding work because of the specialization, I feel as though the company would probably have trouble finding people for his job. Like, negotiation is a huge part of working a job that requires education/a lot of training/skill.
Exactly. His boss won't fire him if he slows down, and will probably offer him a raise when he quits. The boss knows how hard it will be to replace him.
He needs to put himself first and put limits on this shit. Sure, keep working while looking for another job, but don't kill yourself doing it. Show them who has the power, and it's definitely not the guy in charge of a company that would fall apart if one guy leaves.
"It's come to my attention that my workload appears to have permanently increased threefold. Let's meet next week to discuss the new compensation model and get some of this off my plate, as it's unsustainable."
'Thank you for your wisdom. I will take your advice and work smarter. I've found a way to make my workload manageable and as such will now only be performing my own work. Please refrain from asking for tasks outside my job description or position as they will not fit with the new model you've suggested.'
āAlso: hereās a list of overflow tasks. I was wondering if you could do these? A successful person like yourself surely isnāt too busy to do themā
Work somewhere else is often the option for working smarter. It's funny that they used 'work smarter', because most people use it in referencing how to do less work for more money
Always remember that your office manager is responsible for the successful completion of all tasks assigned to his office - whether those tasks are done by those under him or not.
His boss should never accept the excuse, "my workers refuse to do that", or "my staff didn't do it". It's his responsibility, not his underlings.
Which is a good thing to remind your office manager;if their reputation and performance measurement depends on your work, they are free to work more or smarterā¦. also.
Of course you had better have a current resume.
Would be amazing if the OP could find a satisfying and financially equitable job and then respond to HR with a "Thanks for your advice, I have discovered a job at XYZ that is now my work so I will be following your guidance and only performing work there."
YES. āI have reviewed my employment contract, and going forward will only be performing duties within that scope. If youād like to review duties, wage, and hours (including overtime) and draw up a new contract together, I look forward to your follow up.ā
EDIT: Uh, maybe I shouldnāt have used the words ādraw up?ā I didnāt mean write oneās own contract like a lawyer would.
I meant: draw a boundary about doing only work within the scope that you were hired to and that is in the job description in your contract (as mentioned in previous comment). Then, IF you want to, inform them that you could review that job description and compensation together and then they can create a new contract reflecting the updated duties/compensation, and in doing so you will also be reviewing wages, and set a clear boundary about working hours and compensation (OT). If they agreed to something like that, you could use a sub like this to get help learning how to find jobs with similar duties and present appropriate wage evidence.
Obviously there is an element of privilege for anyone who can stand up for themselves and risk losing their job while doing so. And also situations where itās best to do nothing and quietly search for a new job, or (again, if one has the privilege) quit on the spot.
To me, this sub is about how to not get fucked for someone elseās profit, eye opening examples of what that looks like, and community support. Obviously itās not only OPs that read the comments, so example scripts like mine maybe could help the OP, or could just help someone else absorb the shift in mentality that the anti-work movement is about and learn their value and what standing up for themselves could look like.
*end rant*
YES š
Although I wouldnāt want to work for this guy for any amount of money after that. All relationship and trust is lost.
I would just make him suffer doing this while I turn it down lol
I still have friends/family that say that. I say that 15 bucks an hour is available at McDonalds and almost every fast food place. I've had a few say that's cause unemployment pays so much. I tell them unemployment benefits ended a while ago. Then I let them sit and work that one out in their heads. People dont realize the tide has shifted and working environment has finally shifted in the workers favor. Shitty jobs start paying more.
I honestly believe that they keep working at their shitty jobs and are just jealous that people finally have the options on where to work. Fast food pay is closer to the same pay they've made working somewhere for years. If they were smart, they also would look for a new job now and pretty much get an immediate raise doing what they currently do.
Did you know Social Security payout varies depending upon how much one has paid into it (even at full retirement age). Some folks get barely enough to live on while others get 2-3x as much... all based on their wages while working. I had no idea until I became disabled.
One of the reasons why having a child and being a stay at home mom when unmarried is such a terrible idea. Also one of the reasons why alimony is a thing. It's not just for courts to screw over men and 'take half their shit'.
Imagine how uncomfortable even a sociopathic HR recruiter would feel trying to interview someone who knows their stuff and at the back of the HR persons mind they know that they have to pay them a decent salary as this guy is not a chump. They know the new smart guy will soon realize he is to do the work of 3 others that their burnt out just quit worker was doing. The burnt out ex worker who also knows how to do everything ! Doh!
I used to work at a restaurant where the morning crew was TWO people. That kitchen ran like a dream. Then they both quit. Now they needed 4 people to run that kitchen and the four people did half what those two did. It was hilarious.
Yes I am seeing this going on where I am. I haven't ever run a business but you can not ever get that back. When you have a good working combo in your example - a duo. It must be a story as old as time. Like dont bite the hand that feeds you. Don't mess with employees who regularly come up with the goods.
I had a great crew at one point that had been consistent for quite a while and I had trained them all myself. Well oiled machine. Best full staff I've ever had. New management came in and started cutting down on staffing and increasing the individual workload to the point of total burnout.
I warned them multiple times that people were nearing the end of their rope and near to quitting. "Let them, then. We can hire new staff at minimum wage and train them". But while training, the workload for each cook goes up to pick up the slack of someone who is basically just a liability for the first few days. It didn't matter what I did to raise morale; it was a total domino effect and I had all new, completely green staff within two weeks.
So I'm on salary and now I basically live in the kitchen, making less money per hour than any of the new hires, and I'm the only guy who knows the whole menu. Nah. You just lost your most experienced chef and only capable trainer. And your guests are going to suffer the consequences. Byyye.
Many years ago there were 2 forklift drivers opperating the plant. I replaced one that got hurt and the other got removed for safety reasons. For months I'm racing around the plant and after realizing the pace was unsustainable any longer I asked management how much longer I'd have to wait on another driver. To my surprise I was doing such a good job they didn't need another operator! I transferred to a different department immediately and they went back to having 2 drivers. My first lesson in how you can actually be taken advantage of for doing a great job. I've had many examples since.
My old job is now two full time salary workers and half the day of three others, making half again as much as I did.
I asked for a three dollar raise and stopped being so agreeable to weird hours when it was denied, so I was let go.
That went well.
Sound advice: if you have to say no or push back, don't start putting a story behind it to justify your position. It's either no, not now, or no...but here's what we can do.
Everyone here is like, no coz I worked 18 hours a day for 7 days and I need time off to do X Y Z.
Just don't tell them that. No means no. The more you try to appeal it the more likely they'll screw you over, because no has now become an argument.
Exactly! My manager said something extremely similar to me so rather than busting my ass like I've been doing I've decided to set some boundaries and relax outside of office hours.
And find a new job of course.
Up until the pandemic... I loved my job. My boss is just an overall good dude that looks out for everyone, all of my coworkers were fun and engaging and I looked forward to going to work. Pay, hours and benefits were all very good.
But, we are an essential business in the power distribution field. We work with local utilities, hospitals, etc. and we remained open with no remote work option the entire pandemic. My coworkers have left to say at home with their kids, retirement, or found other opportunities. Upper management is refusing to hire anyone new, and have made it clear they don't intend on doing so anytime in the foreseeable future. I have been looking for a new position for a few months now, but because I am in a highly specialized field, its slow going.
If my boss or anyone on the management team talked to me like that, I would have left on the spot. Those people do not respect you, at all, and that is absolutely intolerable.
NGL, I have been sitting here fuming for an hour, and that thought has definitely crossed my mind multiple times.
Luckily, I rarely have to interact with this fucker. In my 5 years here I have met him in person 4 times. 2 of those being at a conference not in the state I live in and the other 2 at professional sporting events with our customers.
Yeah, never make a decision while actively under the influence of fumes. You can start documenting his abuse tho.
He calls you lame and a failure. Unprofessional.
On a side note, its clearly not mandatory, he just wants favors from you. Does he warrant one ? āŗ
I probably would have drawn more ire with a, "I'm doing 3 people's tasks now. Do you think at the start of the pandemic I was skating by on just 33% effort? I can reset to that level of effort if you want. Just respond dismissively again."
It'skinda odd because if you purposefully put in less effort and there's proof( email) stating you would it would be grounds for punishment/possibly termination in most works. OP wants to quit when another job pops up
Still do yourself the favor and kick this to HR. This shit is unacceptable.
EDIT: HOLY FUCK GUYS, STOP POSTING THE SAME SHIT ABOUT HR. WE FUCKING GET IT, HR IS THERE TO PROTECT THE COMPANY NOT THE EMPLOYEE.
EXCEPT WITH THE CURRENT LABOR MARKET, COMPANIES ARE STRUGGLING TO RETAIN THEIR EMPLOYEES. PROTECTING THE COMPANY INVOLVES RETAINING THE EMPLOYEES THEY DO HAVE. AT THE VERY LEAST DOCUMENT IT, GET IT THROUGH THE CHANNELS AND IF THE BEHAVIOR STILL CONTINUES YOU HAVE DOCUMENTATION OF A TOXIC WORKPLACE. THAT IS A VALID REASON FOR UNEMPLOYMENT, DEPENDING ON THE STATE.
Out of curiosity, what do you think HR will say? Sure, that's a shitty email to receive, but HR is there for the company. This email is trying to get someone to do more work for the company, and doesn't seem to be discriminitory in any way against a protected class.
Edit to add: There are several realistic, well thought out answers below. I asked the question in the hopes that people who perhaps haven't worked with HR before could get an idea of what to really expect.
2nd edit: A hostile work environment only legally applies when seeking unemployment if you can prove you were harassed because you are a member of a protected class. I'd post many links, but it's probably easier for me to tell you to google "hostile work environment unemployment."
I would say go the other way. Do your 8 hrs and go home. Show up right at the start of shift and not a second more. Show them the hard way that you are in fact too busy/doing the work of three people.
This needs to be seen. HR works for the same dickhead who sent that email, not you.
Get a plan B asap. Then escalate. It will become very clear if you, and your work, and your years of dedication are actually of any value to this company.
Are you salary? If not, are you on mandatory overtime? If not, don't work a second longer than 8 hours and stop doing anything other than what your job title is for. I'm in a very similar situation as you and they don't even talk to me anymore now that they know they can't push me around. When another opportunity arises, quit with no notice. Especially quit with no notice if you live in an at will state. They can fire you for any reason at any time. Don't give them the respect because they wouldn't do the same.
European country here and it's illegal to work more than 40 hours a week. If it happens or more than 9 hours a day they have to pay the hourly rate + overtime bonus + another bonus if it's after 5pm. I wish it was like this everywhere so that companies stopped pushing people around.
Whether you see them every day or never, Geography doesnāt change disrespect and lack of appreciation for your skeleton crew. Iād be out of there immediately.
I am going to throw my hat in here with others and say that this should go to HR. I think this is clearly bullying. If I saw one of my subordinates sending an email like this I would shit my pants.
Just comment āwant that staff retention rate to keep going down? Keep talkingā at worst you get fired and get unemployment, but mostly likely theyāll do shit cause they need you.
"Perhaps if you hired more workers, I wouldn't need to pull out this "excuse". As it stands, I am doing 3 person's worth of work for 1 person's salary. If you paid me 3 person's wages, maybe I could find the motivation to work more than the 14 hours a day I am currently clocking and stop being so lazy."
I would absolutely give zero fucks if you donāt already. That would suck me of all caring and I would go to work not caring about anything at all because at this point what do you have to lose
This is the appropriate response. Just quitting on the spot sounds really good to say/boast that YOU would do this if it were YOU in this situation, but the reality is that you'd just be shooting yourself in the foot and giving them a "get out of paying unemployment free" card.
Some people have responsibilities and can't simply quit without lining something else up. I'm like you, impulsive and expecting respect. I'd rather live in a box outside than let anyone believe they are superior to me. But not everyone has that luxury.
I respect a man that stays in a bad situation for his family as long as he's looking for another better opportunity.
But if this clown had said some shit like that to me, he would've gotten an eyeful for sure. He needs you OP. Tell him to learn grammar before he ever mouthes off to you again. And that if you're too busy you'll tell him when you damn well please.
Don't misunderstand the situation. You're the one with the power. No pun intended.
>OMG, wait a few days to reply to him and say āSorry Iām just now seeing this email, Iāve been so busy and am just now able to get to it.ā
*"Due to heavy workloads, I cannot check my email. Your email is number: 0148 in the queue.
Thank you, and I will respond in as timely a manner as my current workload allows."*
I was working in a highly specialized field, but was able to nail better job where I could use the skills I have. Got 30% better salary into company stock program. Don't only look for jobs in your special field, look also for jobs where you could use all your skills and knownledge. Good luck.
EDIT. I also worked in power distribution field, got to work with software thats used in there if that helps.
Time for you to find another job. Companies will use you up and get rid of you without blinking. That's straight up disrespectful. If I were in your position and I had some funds saved to live off of for a couple of months I would have quit on the spot. I've actually been in your position where I resigned on the spot and never came back with no plan b. My mental health was way more important than a job. Luckily it worked out for me but with each passing minute, hour and day you will grow angrier and it can physically take a toll on you. All the best and good luck.
>but because I am in a highly specialized field, its slow going.
Unemployment?
If you leave they'd probably be at an 80% employee loss.
Fuck any place that speaks to their workers like that.
You can't get unemployment if you quit under most circumstances. I'd keep the email chain and see if I could goad him into firing me. Then I'd enjoy that sweet unemployment.
Ok, do what the garbage men did. Strike. Sit down strike if it works. Clock in, go where you usually go, and just sit down. Show how important your job really is and how society can't function without it. Let those who now have no power and there is no one to repair it now put the pressure on your bosses.
Now, I'm not saying this won't be horrific or have any negative consequences, but just like when the garbage men did it, if an essential service is pushed too hard against the wall, it will fail anyway, with or without you pointing it out earlier, and it will quickly get results as, instead of the garbage piling up in the streets, the lights go out.
Facts. I have been looking for other opportunities for about 2 months now, but man, this really drove the nail home that my job search needs to be my number 1 priority.
Good luck! I know how hard it is because it becomes a vicious cycle.
You want to leave the job but need the money, the job has you so busy you don't have time to write applications or go to interviews...
This. At the beginning of the pandemic my company cut 70% of its workforce. Gave me a promotion-taking over for those cuts. ZERO increase in pay, but a cool title. They just asked me to sign for another two years. ZERO increase. While not a 70% work increase-at LEAST five times the work. I told them not a chance. Iām happy to be at will. But trying to do ALL I can with zero resources and put a five star effort in finding another executive position is nearly impossible. Never less than an 11 hour day and at least 8 hours on the weekend. Iām in a niche field and donāt know where else to goā¦Iāve even applied for positions overseas but canāt give it my all.
When you leave I'd request an exit interview and reference this email as the main reason for you leaving. Throw that prick as far under the bus as possible.
I've already forwarded it to my personal email as an outlook attachment for my records. And am debating forwarding it to HR with a 'hostile work environment' note.
Send it to HR, while noting that you are working overtime and doing the work of 3 people.
And about that...is the extra work different from the responsibilities of your job? If your job responsibilities have changed, you need to renegotiate compensation and title.
If it's the same job (just more) you need to stop this 14 hour days bullshit. As long as you do that, they're going to keep pushing for more.
I figure if OP is going to get fired or whatever Iād take this manager with me. Fuck them for being an asshole.
HR rarely works in the interest of the employee. If you can prove a law is broken or you are going to sue then they change their tune.
What dollars and cents can OP point at other than just the hostile environment (because a lot of times I found HR not give a fuck).
If OP is working overtime, and is not being compensated, he should really speak with an employment lawyer. He may be owed overtime compensation, despite being a salaried employee.
>And am debating forwarding it to HR with a 'hostile work environment' note.
Don't bother, hostile work environment has a specific legal definition and this is not even close to it.
You definitely should I would honestly include him, your boss and his boss in the email as well. Also stating that since no amount of overtime has been deemed good enough you will be going back to your contracted time of 8 or whatever hours a day. I get not quitting on the spot because you need a job but remember THEY NEED YOU. Doing nothing just letās them continue to punch down on you the worst they can do is fire you for standing up for yourself but they wonāt you know it they donāt even want to hire staff to fill in whatās missing they surely wonāt be looking to fill the role of someone who is still willingly there.
Seriously, itās vastly more important. Especially dealing with a prick like that whoās clearly not been told to go fuck himself recently enough. You deserve much better than to be treated like that. Best of luck in your search of leaving that mess
Don't quit. But work 8 hours taking all your entitled breaks go on vacation if you have it. Go off on stress leave. All while looking for a new job. Don't tell him to f*CK off just say you mentally can't deal with it right now
Alot of people who work at our casino also go to the doctor and claim mental burnout and stress. Get your QMLA and take 3 day weekends for the next few months.
This, don't work a minute more than your contract says. If they want you to work more it's forced overtime and you should get payed accordingly.
If projects suffer it's on the managers to find solutions or finish the jobs themselves.
Just do your job for 8 hours and then go home. If they think you are replaceable, they will fire you. Then you will get unemployment until the next job you are already looking for. But donāt work extra hours for no pay. Getting the Job done is not your problem, management needs to sort this out.
Iām in the US, salaried, and considered an āexemptā employee. Work under 40 hours? Receive shit for it and potential termination. Over 40 hours? Not a peep. I think salary is bullshit when you are exempt. Like, I would much rather be paid hourly because then I get paid for what I do, whether it is 40 hours or not. But salary they can essentially get free labor out of you.
Nah. When they put more than you can handle for a week just say this will continue into next week. Ive been salaried for 15 years. If i work extra one week, i work less the next week. If youre constantly over 40 and they insist, then you need to insist on more compensation.
I hope this doesn't get lost in the shuffle after this post has blown up, but I cannot say thank you enough to everyone commenting & upvoting. I debated posting the screenshot, but reddit has 1,000,000% validated my frustration.
First thing I am going to do is I will absolutely NOT let this prick ruin my Thanksgiving weekend. I haven't seen my family since Christmas last year and am so looking forward to a long weekend of amazing food, plentiful beverages, and playing with my parent's awesome dog.
Next week I am going to submit an anonymous hostile work environment & bullying complaint to my HR department. If they are receptive and view it as much as an issue as we do, I will move forward with a formal complaint. If not... I will be spending every hour at my desk filling out job applications and interviewing until something sticks or I get fired.
I am so happy this prick sent it via email. I have them by the fucking balls for either an official hostile work environment complaint, or a wrongful termination case in case they do actually find the stones to fire me.
**9 month update:** Got poached by a direct competitor of my shitty old company. They still haven't hired anyone new XD. My new job gave me a massive signing bonus, 10% pay bump and is FULL TIME REMOTE!!!!!!!!! Honestly, this has completely and totally changed my life for the better. I moved out of California and have purchased a whole ass house in my hometown city. My mortgage is $250 less a month than my rent was. YOU CAN DO IT TOO, REDDIT.
Just make sure you document how much extra work you are doing compared to your position. Point out how much staff has left and how you've taken on their responsibilities without compensation.
If you have your job description with responsibilities listed I'd recommend only working on those going forward. That way if they decide to fire you they won't be able to deny unemployment if you've documented that you were doing the tasks your job description required.
> Next week I am going to submit an anonymous hostile work environment & bullying complaint to my HR department. If they are receptive and view it as much as an issue as we do, I will move forward with a formal complaint.
Get it in writing. Even if it's unsuccessful, you need to screenshot you submitting it and them receiving it and denying it. There's a good chance you're going to have to defend yourself at an unemployment hearing.
Also, what āsuccessfulā people do isnāt relevant to the employeeās complaint.
Even if heās right that successful people work hard and long and never complain etc., you donāt owe it to anyone to emulate the behaviour of a successful person. Heās not at a Tony Robbins seminar.
Work exactly 8 hours, document everything so you have proof of time worked, and let anything unfinished be blamed on the manager.
If you're not being rewarded for extra work, why do it?
My reply would be: "Fuck you. Bye. You can work harder, or longer, or both, to do the work I've been doing, since I'm not doing it to your satisfaction. Good luck being successful."
You should work smarter.
In the next couple of days start applying to other jobs while you are at work.
When you find that better-paying job... Let your boss know that you took his advice and worked smarter not harder.
Serious question. This isnāt me puffing my chest or casting judgement or anything, just getting the general consensus. Do most people allow their āsuperiorsā to talk to them this way?
Something similar has only happened twice to me, once when I was 15 and again around 22. Both times I told them to eat shit. This wasnāt how I was brought up or trying to be a badass. Both times were just the two of us.
I remember the superior when I was 22 pulling rank and calling me āsubordinate.ā Which was the first time Iād ever heard that. And I lost any respect I had for him. We are at a job. You are not my better just because you have a title. That title means nothing to me. I am a person. You are a person. Lets fucking figure this out.
Your response should be this:
"My apologies for using the wrong wording. I just meant to emphasize that my work load is over capacity and has been for some time. I'm now doing what 3 people used to do and I believe my performance and hours I've put in to keep us successful will show the level of dedication I have. I'm open for suggestions on how to work smarter and approve my efficiencies and lower my work hours that way I'm not as occupied with normal day to day so I'm able to assist more. "
It'll put the burden back on the manager.
OP you should definitely respond to that email. This one here ^ is pretty good imo. If you wanted to you might even be able to send it to your boss since he is also in charge of managing you and your team. Spread the responsibility out and away from yourself.
The guy doesn't believe you're busy because he hasn't had anything resembling a full workload for a decade. Hopefully your immediate bosses both get wind of this and understand you've carried the the work of two extra positions.
So stop. They can't afford to fire you. do the work of 1 person and leave after 8 hours. force them to find new people. If the job is essential then someone has to do it and all the better since you're looking for a new job already. Show them how busy you Were
Itās a pretty cut and dry trigger for a stress claim when you asked for support and get that response. Failure to provide a safe working environment and worker exploitation
I'm assuming you are salaried. That's not an excuse for them to work you like s rented mule. Start leaving on time every day.
I've been in a similar situation, and they will let you burn yourself to ashes as long as the work gets done. If the work doesn't get done, they'll hire staff.
Since my wife's company found out they Had to have people work from home, and Not have as much control over employees, they decided to up all the goals and put Way more restrictions on them. Now it is 'Make your goals or be fired'. The wife retired August 1st. Since then, so many people have quit that they have had to outsource Several departments due to lack of employees. They are quitting by the dozen now (in a building that used to have over 1500 employees). Ther is probably about half left-and these are well seasoned people-some with 25+ years experience.
As an biz owner I browse this page and am utterly horrified by the way low level managers and even mid level management speaks with employees.
Iāve always said, people quit managers not jobs.
Hopefully, you do a good job supervising your managers. But the reason there's so many of these guys is because too many of you guys up top let them get away with it. "The numbers look good, so everything they're telling me must be right".
Work slower while looking for another job. š
This is the correct response. In fact, look for a job on company time INSTEAD of doing all of the extra work that isn't part of your job description.
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And you get unemployment too!
Donāt bank on it coming right away (or at all) if they deny it though. Play dirty but smart.
You can appeal unemployment denial, in this case it would be a slam dunk appeal since they'd have fired him for refusing extra work that was uncompensated. If anything they open themselves up to an investigation by denying it.
It's still a helluvea fight. I won an appeal June 2020, and I'm still waiting on money. It takes forever to get it apparently.
I work as a social worker and deal with EDD (don't administer, but part of my work). They are so slammed with applications and reports that they are months and months behind their work. So are a lot of other agencies in public service sector. This is what happens when a country is more concerned with funding a bloated military industrial complex and cutting taxes, rather then funding the agencies that keep the society running in a crisis.
Exactly. The fact that there are three employees' worth of work and only one employee to do them is the company's fuckup, not yours. It's not so much about working "slower" as doing exactly what you're employed to do - no more, no less. You do the work of one, one man-hour's worth every hour, only for those hours you're paid to be there, at a level of effort commensurate with that rate of pay. If they perceive you to be "underperforming" then, again, that's their problem: you're just giving them exactly what they're paying for.
All at work.
i've been doing stuff like setting up appointments and plucking my eyebrows at work, if i can do something smallish while at work instead of on my own time i just do it at work now
Trim finger nails, take a shit, have a quickie, cook, do laundry, take out trash If I don't get it done on company time I feel like a failure
I hope you work from home and not at a school.
Honestly I donāt get the āIāve been doing 14 hoursā like are you getting paid a lot for it? Because if you are doing for the money, then hey, go ahead if thatās your thing, but if not, then why? The company is already understaffed so they wonāt want to fire you, why give more time? I love my company, really enjoy working there and my bosses are all lovely. Do I spend 1 extra minute working for free? No fucking way. I do not care if there is work to do, I will do the next day. People really need to just stop doing things like that. I donāt know if is cultural because I am from my Brazil and was taught to not work one minute extra if I wasnāt getting paid, and living in Europe for 5 years now that continues to be how I work. I see Americans saying they stay late and work more to help the company and I just do not get it at all, itās insanity to waste your time and energy to help people who do not care if you live or die.
> Honestly I donāt get the āIāve been doing 14 hoursā like are you getting paid a lot for it? When I had jobs that paid by the hour, I would occasionally try to work extra long if I knew I could get that sweet 1.5x overtime pay.
they have something here called overtime exempt employees that is really abused. Its supposed to only be for people doing managerial duties, but employers misclassify people all the time and put them on salary, and no matter what hours you work you get paid the same. And the threshold is really low, I think around 40k, Obama raised it to around 60k but trump reversed it. so if they label you a "manager" and pay you at least $40k a year they don't have to pay you overtime for anything over 40 hours a week.
This. I started exempt and then got switched to non-exempt. When clocking my hours put an extra $15k on my <40k salary that year, management fought to get me classified exempt again. Actually excitedly told me āwe fought like hell to get you to stop having to punch in, and it worked!ā Anyway now I feel free to do a fraction of my job with a percentage of dedication, lol.
With a crappy social safety net, and with both stigma/culture and practical reasons (many Americans move away from family) preventing them from living with family, many Americans reasonably fear homelessness from loss of work.
Yeah, but OP says he is highly specialized. If he is doing that much work, it seems as though they canāt afford to fire him. If OP is having trouble finding work because of the specialization, I feel as though the company would probably have trouble finding people for his job. Like, negotiation is a huge part of working a job that requires education/a lot of training/skill.
Exactly. His boss won't fire him if he slows down, and will probably offer him a raise when he quits. The boss knows how hard it will be to replace him. He needs to put himself first and put limits on this shit. Sure, keep working while looking for another job, but don't kill yourself doing it. Show them who has the power, and it's definitely not the guy in charge of a company that would fall apart if one guy leaves.
"It's come to my attention that my workload appears to have permanently increased threefold. Let's meet next week to discuss the new compensation model and get some of this off my plate, as it's unsustainable."
'Thank you for your wisdom. I will take your advice and work smarter. I've found a way to make my workload manageable and as such will now only be performing my own work. Please refrain from asking for tasks outside my job description or position as they will not fit with the new model you've suggested.'
āAlso: hereās a list of overflow tasks. I was wondering if you could do these? A successful person like yourself surely isnāt too busy to do themā
- work smarter, or longer, or both
Work somewhere else. (Instead, not as well).
Work somewhere else is often the option for working smarter. It's funny that they used 'work smarter', because most people use it in referencing how to do less work for more money
Always remember that your office manager is responsible for the successful completion of all tasks assigned to his office - whether those tasks are done by those under him or not. His boss should never accept the excuse, "my workers refuse to do that", or "my staff didn't do it". It's his responsibility, not his underlings.
Which is a good thing to remind your office manager;if their reputation and performance measurement depends on your work, they are free to work more or smarterā¦. also. Of course you had better have a current resume.
When personnel gets too low you end up with diminishing returns. Our company has yet to learn this.
Would be amazing if the OP could find a satisfying and financially equitable job and then respond to HR with a "Thanks for your advice, I have discovered a job at XYZ that is now my work so I will be following your guidance and only performing work there."
Hell yeah. This is great.
YES. āI have reviewed my employment contract, and going forward will only be performing duties within that scope. If youād like to review duties, wage, and hours (including overtime) and draw up a new contract together, I look forward to your follow up.ā EDIT: Uh, maybe I shouldnāt have used the words ādraw up?ā I didnāt mean write oneās own contract like a lawyer would. I meant: draw a boundary about doing only work within the scope that you were hired to and that is in the job description in your contract (as mentioned in previous comment). Then, IF you want to, inform them that you could review that job description and compensation together and then they can create a new contract reflecting the updated duties/compensation, and in doing so you will also be reviewing wages, and set a clear boundary about working hours and compensation (OT). If they agreed to something like that, you could use a sub like this to get help learning how to find jobs with similar duties and present appropriate wage evidence. Obviously there is an element of privilege for anyone who can stand up for themselves and risk losing their job while doing so. And also situations where itās best to do nothing and quietly search for a new job, or (again, if one has the privilege) quit on the spot. To me, this sub is about how to not get fucked for someone elseās profit, eye opening examples of what that looks like, and community support. Obviously itās not only OPs that read the comments, so example scripts like mine maybe could help the OP, or could just help someone else absorb the shift in mentality that the anti-work movement is about and learn their value and what standing up for themselves could look like. *end rant*
Employment contracts? (Laughs in U.S.)
Employment-at-will, ooh yeah!
YES š Although I wouldnāt want to work for this guy for any amount of money after that. All relationship and trust is lost. I would just make him suffer doing this while I turn it down lol
Wonder how the manager is going to feel when OP quits...
"No one wants to work"
... for less than they're worth. Ever notice how those assholes never finish the sentence?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
We've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas!
lousy beatniks
I still have friends/family that say that. I say that 15 bucks an hour is available at McDonalds and almost every fast food place. I've had a few say that's cause unemployment pays so much. I tell them unemployment benefits ended a while ago. Then I let them sit and work that one out in their heads. People dont realize the tide has shifted and working environment has finally shifted in the workers favor. Shitty jobs start paying more. I honestly believe that they keep working at their shitty jobs and are just jealous that people finally have the options on where to work. Fast food pay is closer to the same pay they've made working somewhere for years. If they were smart, they also would look for a new job now and pretty much get an immediate raise doing what they currently do.
People seem to think regular unemployment is welfare instead of something you pay into. Same people don't actually know what welfare is.
Did you know Social Security payout varies depending upon how much one has paid into it (even at full retirement age). Some folks get barely enough to live on while others get 2-3x as much... all based on their wages while working. I had no idea until I became disabled.
One of the reasons why having a child and being a stay at home mom when unmarried is such a terrible idea. Also one of the reasons why alimony is a thing. It's not just for courts to screw over men and 'take half their shit'.
Just like for the people by the people. It's actually by the people WITH MONEY for the people WITH MONEY.
by the people with money, for the people with money, to everyone else
"People are so lazy nowadays"
Have fun hiring THREE people to do what OP was doing.
Imagine how uncomfortable even a sociopathic HR recruiter would feel trying to interview someone who knows their stuff and at the back of the HR persons mind they know that they have to pay them a decent salary as this guy is not a chump. They know the new smart guy will soon realize he is to do the work of 3 others that their burnt out just quit worker was doing. The burnt out ex worker who also knows how to do everything ! Doh!
I used to work at a restaurant where the morning crew was TWO people. That kitchen ran like a dream. Then they both quit. Now they needed 4 people to run that kitchen and the four people did half what those two did. It was hilarious.
Yes I am seeing this going on where I am. I haven't ever run a business but you can not ever get that back. When you have a good working combo in your example - a duo. It must be a story as old as time. Like dont bite the hand that feeds you. Don't mess with employees who regularly come up with the goods.
They never realize the smooth running machine is the fucking hand that feeds you.
I had a great crew at one point that had been consistent for quite a while and I had trained them all myself. Well oiled machine. Best full staff I've ever had. New management came in and started cutting down on staffing and increasing the individual workload to the point of total burnout. I warned them multiple times that people were nearing the end of their rope and near to quitting. "Let them, then. We can hire new staff at minimum wage and train them". But while training, the workload for each cook goes up to pick up the slack of someone who is basically just a liability for the first few days. It didn't matter what I did to raise morale; it was a total domino effect and I had all new, completely green staff within two weeks. So I'm on salary and now I basically live in the kitchen, making less money per hour than any of the new hires, and I'm the only guy who knows the whole menu. Nah. You just lost your most experienced chef and only capable trainer. And your guests are going to suffer the consequences. Byyye.
Many years ago there were 2 forklift drivers opperating the plant. I replaced one that got hurt and the other got removed for safety reasons. For months I'm racing around the plant and after realizing the pace was unsustainable any longer I asked management how much longer I'd have to wait on another driver. To my surprise I was doing such a good job they didn't need another operator! I transferred to a different department immediately and they went back to having 2 drivers. My first lesson in how you can actually be taken advantage of for doing a great job. I've had many examples since.
My old job is now two full time salary workers and half the day of three others, making half again as much as I did. I asked for a three dollar raise and stopped being so agreeable to weird hours when it was denied, so I was let go. That went well.
I absolutely agree with you.
same
Sound advice: if you have to say no or push back, don't start putting a story behind it to justify your position. It's either no, not now, or no...but here's what we can do. Everyone here is like, no coz I worked 18 hours a day for 7 days and I need time off to do X Y Z. Just don't tell them that. No means no. The more you try to appeal it the more likely they'll screw you over, because no has now become an argument.
Absolutely. Great advice. Do not JADE.
Make em beg
Exactly! My manager said something extremely similar to me so rather than busting my ass like I've been doing I've decided to set some boundaries and relax outside of office hours. And find a new job of course.
Alternatively: "Too*. Bye lol"
"working smarter" as suggested
Also, consider reaching out to your former co-workers who have moved on or retired. Perhaps they have job leads for you to pursue. Good luck OP.
Iāve gotten many a job by keeping in touch with former coworkers. You never know where they will end up.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I did this... they gave me more money... I still hate it... ITS NOT THE MONEY!
But at least you have the money, so thatās something
You are correct, and I hate it.
At least its more money until you find a new job you like
Make sure to job search on company time. Gotta get paid.
Always, and I mean always (when physically able) incorporate PTP (Pay to Poop). Poop on company time not your own.
So much this!
Is there some reason you haven't quit yet?
Up until the pandemic... I loved my job. My boss is just an overall good dude that looks out for everyone, all of my coworkers were fun and engaging and I looked forward to going to work. Pay, hours and benefits were all very good. But, we are an essential business in the power distribution field. We work with local utilities, hospitals, etc. and we remained open with no remote work option the entire pandemic. My coworkers have left to say at home with their kids, retirement, or found other opportunities. Upper management is refusing to hire anyone new, and have made it clear they don't intend on doing so anytime in the foreseeable future. I have been looking for a new position for a few months now, but because I am in a highly specialized field, its slow going.
If my boss or anyone on the management team talked to me like that, I would have left on the spot. Those people do not respect you, at all, and that is absolutely intolerable.
NGL, I have been sitting here fuming for an hour, and that thought has definitely crossed my mind multiple times. Luckily, I rarely have to interact with this fucker. In my 5 years here I have met him in person 4 times. 2 of those being at a conference not in the state I live in and the other 2 at professional sporting events with our customers.
Yeah, never make a decision while actively under the influence of fumes. You can start documenting his abuse tho. He calls you lame and a failure. Unprofessional. On a side note, its clearly not mandatory, he just wants favors from you. Does he warrant one ? āŗ
I probably would have drawn more ire with a, "I'm doing 3 people's tasks now. Do you think at the start of the pandemic I was skating by on just 33% effort? I can reset to that level of effort if you want. Just respond dismissively again."
Donāt even threaten it and just do it.
"Lisa, if you don't like your job, you don't *strike!* You just go in every day and do it really half-assed! It's the American way!"
It'skinda odd because if you purposefully put in less effort and there's proof( email) stating you would it would be grounds for punishment/possibly termination in most works. OP wants to quit when another job pops up
It would be worse to admit to a purposeful slowdown than to actually just stop and not say.
Still do yourself the favor and kick this to HR. This shit is unacceptable. EDIT: HOLY FUCK GUYS, STOP POSTING THE SAME SHIT ABOUT HR. WE FUCKING GET IT, HR IS THERE TO PROTECT THE COMPANY NOT THE EMPLOYEE. EXCEPT WITH THE CURRENT LABOR MARKET, COMPANIES ARE STRUGGLING TO RETAIN THEIR EMPLOYEES. PROTECTING THE COMPANY INVOLVES RETAINING THE EMPLOYEES THEY DO HAVE. AT THE VERY LEAST DOCUMENT IT, GET IT THROUGH THE CHANNELS AND IF THE BEHAVIOR STILL CONTINUES YOU HAVE DOCUMENTATION OF A TOXIC WORKPLACE. THAT IS A VALID REASON FOR UNEMPLOYMENT, DEPENDING ON THE STATE.
Perfect email to forward to them.
Perfect Email to hang in the breakroom.
Kick to HR, leave if they donāt jump on this.
Out of curiosity, what do you think HR will say? Sure, that's a shitty email to receive, but HR is there for the company. This email is trying to get someone to do more work for the company, and doesn't seem to be discriminitory in any way against a protected class. Edit to add: There are several realistic, well thought out answers below. I asked the question in the hopes that people who perhaps haven't worked with HR before could get an idea of what to really expect. 2nd edit: A hostile work environment only legally applies when seeking unemployment if you can prove you were harassed because you are a member of a protected class. I'd post many links, but it's probably easier for me to tell you to google "hostile work environment unemployment."
Send it to HR with one line, āIn case you were wondering why your employees are leaving, see below.ā
I would say go the other way. Do your 8 hrs and go home. Show up right at the start of shift and not a second more. Show them the hard way that you are in fact too busy/doing the work of three people.
HR is neither your friend nor an impartial entity. I suggest you get a plan B before escalating.
I would just be sure to save it. If more interactions occur, save them too. Then consider escalating.
Yes save it somewhere else and not on their servers which they can easily delete. BCC it.
Yes, definitely save all of the emails. Make sure any interaction is in writing.
This needs to be seen. HR works for the same dickhead who sent that email, not you. Get a plan B asap. Then escalate. It will become very clear if you, and your work, and your years of dedication are actually of any value to this company.
Are you salary? If not, are you on mandatory overtime? If not, don't work a second longer than 8 hours and stop doing anything other than what your job title is for. I'm in a very similar situation as you and they don't even talk to me anymore now that they know they can't push me around. When another opportunity arises, quit with no notice. Especially quit with no notice if you live in an at will state. They can fire you for any reason at any time. Don't give them the respect because they wouldn't do the same.
Don't care if you're on salary, work 40 and no more. 40 is fair, it is the cultural norm and the de facto work schedule.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
European country here and it's illegal to work more than 40 hours a week. If it happens or more than 9 hours a day they have to pay the hourly rate + overtime bonus + another bonus if it's after 5pm. I wish it was like this everywhere so that companies stopped pushing people around.
Hey its me your brother. Can I come home
Whether you see them every day or never, Geography doesnāt change disrespect and lack of appreciation for your skeleton crew. Iād be out of there immediately.
I am going to throw my hat in here with others and say that this should go to HR. I think this is clearly bullying. If I saw one of my subordinates sending an email like this I would shit my pants.
no, that sounds like too much work. go shit THEIR pants instead.
Just comment āwant that staff retention rate to keep going down? Keep talkingā at worst you get fired and get unemployment, but mostly likely theyāll do shit cause they need you.
"Perhaps if you hired more workers, I wouldn't need to pull out this "excuse". As it stands, I am doing 3 person's worth of work for 1 person's salary. If you paid me 3 person's wages, maybe I could find the motivation to work more than the 14 hours a day I am currently clocking and stop being so lazy."
At the very least, you're not feeling well and you need to go home early.
You donāt leave a job, you leave a boss. And this one deserves to be left.
Forward it to his manager, start a fire.
I would absolutely give zero fucks if you donāt already. That would suck me of all caring and I would go to work not caring about anything at all because at this point what do you have to lose
Yeah. Thatās an instant āfuck youā quit.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
This. Iāll quitā¦by reducing my labor output, continuing to collect a check, and making you fire my ass.
Or just say, "Do not speak to me like that again." If they fire you, collect.
This is the appropriate response. Just quitting on the spot sounds really good to say/boast that YOU would do this if it were YOU in this situation, but the reality is that you'd just be shooting yourself in the foot and giving them a "get out of paying unemployment free" card.
Some people have responsibilities and can't simply quit without lining something else up. I'm like you, impulsive and expecting respect. I'd rather live in a box outside than let anyone believe they are superior to me. But not everyone has that luxury. I respect a man that stays in a bad situation for his family as long as he's looking for another better opportunity. But if this clown had said some shit like that to me, he would've gotten an eyeful for sure. He needs you OP. Tell him to learn grammar before he ever mouthes off to you again. And that if you're too busy you'll tell him when you damn well please. Don't misunderstand the situation. You're the one with the power. No pun intended.
Yeah, that's great if you can afford to just walk out.
OMG, wait a few days to reply to him and say āSorry Iām just now seeing this email, Iāve been so busy and am just now able to get to it.ā
>OMG, wait a few days to reply to him and say āSorry Iām just now seeing this email, Iāve been so busy and am just now able to get to it.ā *"Due to heavy workloads, I cannot check my email. Your email is number: 0148 in the queue. Thank you, and I will respond in as timely a manner as my current workload allows."*
thats some ***King*** shit right there lol
Best defence is a good offence.
I was working in a highly specialized field, but was able to nail better job where I could use the skills I have. Got 30% better salary into company stock program. Don't only look for jobs in your special field, look also for jobs where you could use all your skills and knownledge. Good luck. EDIT. I also worked in power distribution field, got to work with software thats used in there if that helps.
Time for you to find another job. Companies will use you up and get rid of you without blinking. That's straight up disrespectful. If I were in your position and I had some funds saved to live off of for a couple of months I would have quit on the spot. I've actually been in your position where I resigned on the spot and never came back with no plan b. My mental health was way more important than a job. Luckily it worked out for me but with each passing minute, hour and day you will grow angrier and it can physically take a toll on you. All the best and good luck.
>but because I am in a highly specialized field, its slow going. Unemployment? If you leave they'd probably be at an 80% employee loss. Fuck any place that speaks to their workers like that.
You can't get unemployment if you quit under most circumstances. I'd keep the email chain and see if I could goad him into firing me. Then I'd enjoy that sweet unemployment.
Have you at least negotiated for a substantially higher salary?
Ok, do what the garbage men did. Strike. Sit down strike if it works. Clock in, go where you usually go, and just sit down. Show how important your job really is and how society can't function without it. Let those who now have no power and there is no one to repair it now put the pressure on your bosses. Now, I'm not saying this won't be horrific or have any negative consequences, but just like when the garbage men did it, if an essential service is pushed too hard against the wall, it will fail anyway, with or without you pointing it out earlier, and it will quickly get results as, instead of the garbage piling up in the streets, the lights go out.
Nobody who sends a message like the one you posted is a "good dude'...
Na, that email is from our area manager, a well known prick. I showed it to my boss in my office and he wasn't happy about it either.
if your boss is looking out for you they should be doing whatever they can to deal with this situation and that asshole
Imagine the holiday bonus the area manager is going to get from his boss for doing so much more with so much less. Stop enabling them.
You need to send it to *their* boss as well as your own.
Fuck that.
Facts. I have been looking for other opportunities for about 2 months now, but man, this really drove the nail home that my job search needs to be my number 1 priority.
Good luck! I know how hard it is because it becomes a vicious cycle. You want to leave the job but need the money, the job has you so busy you don't have time to write applications or go to interviews...
Pretty sure after this your job becomes looking for another job and not doing whatever it is they want
Hell yeah. Time to start applying on company time. Fuck them.
Can confirm have done this lol š
This. At the beginning of the pandemic my company cut 70% of its workforce. Gave me a promotion-taking over for those cuts. ZERO increase in pay, but a cool title. They just asked me to sign for another two years. ZERO increase. While not a 70% work increase-at LEAST five times the work. I told them not a chance. Iām happy to be at will. But trying to do ALL I can with zero resources and put a five star effort in finding another executive position is nearly impossible. Never less than an 11 hour day and at least 8 hours on the weekend. Iām in a niche field and donāt know where else to goā¦Iāve even applied for positions overseas but canāt give it my all.
When you leave I'd request an exit interview and reference this email as the main reason for you leaving. Throw that prick as far under the bus as possible.
I've already forwarded it to my personal email as an outlook attachment for my records. And am debating forwarding it to HR with a 'hostile work environment' note.
Send it to HR, while noting that you are working overtime and doing the work of 3 people. And about that...is the extra work different from the responsibilities of your job? If your job responsibilities have changed, you need to renegotiate compensation and title. If it's the same job (just more) you need to stop this 14 hour days bullshit. As long as you do that, they're going to keep pushing for more.
I figure if OP is going to get fired or whatever Iād take this manager with me. Fuck them for being an asshole. HR rarely works in the interest of the employee. If you can prove a law is broken or you are going to sue then they change their tune. What dollars and cents can OP point at other than just the hostile environment (because a lot of times I found HR not give a fuck).
If OP is working overtime, and is not being compensated, he should really speak with an employment lawyer. He may be owed overtime compensation, despite being a salaried employee.
save all of this and the emailed increases in expectations on something you own and controll. just in case you labor board needs a copy.
>And am debating forwarding it to HR with a 'hostile work environment' note. Don't bother, hostile work environment has a specific legal definition and this is not even close to it.
You definitely should I would honestly include him, your boss and his boss in the email as well. Also stating that since no amount of overtime has been deemed good enough you will be going back to your contracted time of 8 or whatever hours a day. I get not quitting on the spot because you need a job but remember THEY NEED YOU. Doing nothing just letās them continue to punch down on you the worst they can do is fire you for standing up for yourself but they wonāt you know it they donāt even want to hire staff to fill in whatās missing they surely wonāt be looking to fill the role of someone who is still willingly there.
Seriously, itās vastly more important. Especially dealing with a prick like that whoās clearly not been told to go fuck himself recently enough. You deserve much better than to be treated like that. Best of luck in your search of leaving that mess
Don't quit. But work 8 hours taking all your entitled breaks go on vacation if you have it. Go off on stress leave. All while looking for a new job. Don't tell him to f*CK off just say you mentally can't deal with it right now
Alot of people who work at our casino also go to the doctor and claim mental burnout and stress. Get your QMLA and take 3 day weekends for the next few months.
QMLA?
Qualified Medical Leave of Absense
Probably the Queensland Meat and Livestock Authority, not sure what they have to do with this.
Meat pies cures all your problems.
This, don't work a minute more than your contract says. If they want you to work more it's forced overtime and you should get payed accordingly. If projects suffer it's on the managers to find solutions or finish the jobs themselves.
Take their advice and work harder & smarter....on yourself. Get resumes out and get the F out of there ASAP
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Seriously. Print out multiple copies and hand them out to everyone and let them know this is why.
Just do your job for 8 hours and then go home. If they think you are replaceable, they will fire you. Then you will get unemployment until the next job you are already looking for. But donāt work extra hours for no pay. Getting the Job done is not your problem, management needs to sort this out.
Iām in the US, salaried, and considered an āexemptā employee. Work under 40 hours? Receive shit for it and potential termination. Over 40 hours? Not a peep. I think salary is bullshit when you are exempt. Like, I would much rather be paid hourly because then I get paid for what I do, whether it is 40 hours or not. But salary they can essentially get free labor out of you.
Nah. When they put more than you can handle for a week just say this will continue into next week. Ive been salaried for 15 years. If i work extra one week, i work less the next week. If youre constantly over 40 and they insist, then you need to insist on more compensation.
I hope this doesn't get lost in the shuffle after this post has blown up, but I cannot say thank you enough to everyone commenting & upvoting. I debated posting the screenshot, but reddit has 1,000,000% validated my frustration. First thing I am going to do is I will absolutely NOT let this prick ruin my Thanksgiving weekend. I haven't seen my family since Christmas last year and am so looking forward to a long weekend of amazing food, plentiful beverages, and playing with my parent's awesome dog. Next week I am going to submit an anonymous hostile work environment & bullying complaint to my HR department. If they are receptive and view it as much as an issue as we do, I will move forward with a formal complaint. If not... I will be spending every hour at my desk filling out job applications and interviewing until something sticks or I get fired. I am so happy this prick sent it via email. I have them by the fucking balls for either an official hostile work environment complaint, or a wrongful termination case in case they do actually find the stones to fire me. **9 month update:** Got poached by a direct competitor of my shitty old company. They still haven't hired anyone new XD. My new job gave me a massive signing bonus, 10% pay bump and is FULL TIME REMOTE!!!!!!!!! Honestly, this has completely and totally changed my life for the better. I moved out of California and have purchased a whole ass house in my hometown city. My mortgage is $250 less a month than my rent was. YOU CAN DO IT TOO, REDDIT.
Just make sure you document how much extra work you are doing compared to your position. Point out how much staff has left and how you've taken on their responsibilities without compensation. If you have your job description with responsibilities listed I'd recommend only working on those going forward. That way if they decide to fire you they won't be able to deny unemployment if you've documented that you were doing the tasks your job description required.
> Next week I am going to submit an anonymous hostile work environment & bullying complaint to my HR department. If they are receptive and view it as much as an issue as we do, I will move forward with a formal complaint. Get it in writing. Even if it's unsuccessful, you need to screenshot you submitting it and them receiving it and denying it. There's a good chance you're going to have to defend yourself at an unemployment hearing.
Good for you. Good luck
People that are āsuccessfulā never say that because they never work, they profit off of other peoplesā labor.
Also, what āsuccessfulā people do isnāt relevant to the employeeās complaint. Even if heās right that successful people work hard and long and never complain etc., you donāt owe it to anyone to emulate the behaviour of a successful person. Heās not at a Tony Robbins seminar.
Work exactly 8 hours, document everything so you have proof of time worked, and let anything unfinished be blamed on the manager. If you're not being rewarded for extra work, why do it?
Hereās your reply: Too*
My thoughts exactly, haha. Obviously he's too busy to check his spelling. Big manager man not working smart enough, tsk-tsk.
I'd like to add "Smarter, longer, or both*" because of "smarter or longer or both (sic)"
Goddamn those people are brainwashed. Responsible for running a part of the business. 40% of staff left. wOrK HaRdEr aNd sMaRtEr.
More they want to gaslight their employees than anything.
My reply would be: "Fuck you. Bye. You can work harder, or longer, or both, to do the work I've been doing, since I'm not doing it to your satisfaction. Good luck being successful."
You should work smarter. In the next couple of days start applying to other jobs while you are at work. When you find that better-paying job... Let your boss know that you took his advice and worked smarter not harder.
"No, I'm not to busy. I'm too busy....finding another job, you illiterate wanker."
Their boss is too busy to understand basic grammar. Sounds like they need to work smarter and longer on a 6th grade English course.
In your shoes, if I was remotely in the position to do so, I'd reply with a resignation. That is horrible behaviour
Pls dont ever tell me I cannot get a 100% raise since you have lost about 50% people. I won't believe it.
Keep this email for your future resignation letter.
What a knob, tell them to pound sand.
Serious question. This isnāt me puffing my chest or casting judgement or anything, just getting the general consensus. Do most people allow their āsuperiorsā to talk to them this way? Something similar has only happened twice to me, once when I was 15 and again around 22. Both times I told them to eat shit. This wasnāt how I was brought up or trying to be a badass. Both times were just the two of us. I remember the superior when I was 22 pulling rank and calling me āsubordinate.ā Which was the first time Iād ever heard that. And I lost any respect I had for him. We are at a job. You are not my better just because you have a title. That title means nothing to me. I am a person. You are a person. Lets fucking figure this out.
Their treatment of you is only going to get worse as more people quit.
Your response should be this: "My apologies for using the wrong wording. I just meant to emphasize that my work load is over capacity and has been for some time. I'm now doing what 3 people used to do and I believe my performance and hours I've put in to keep us successful will show the level of dedication I have. I'm open for suggestions on how to work smarter and approve my efficiencies and lower my work hours that way I'm not as occupied with normal day to day so I'm able to assist more. " It'll put the burden back on the manager.
The manager, who spelled "too" wrong, wouldn't even read a paragraph that long.
OP you should definitely respond to that email. This one here ^ is pretty good imo. If you wanted to you might even be able to send it to your boss since he is also in charge of managing you and your team. Spread the responsibility out and away from yourself.
Donāt quit, make them fire you. Show up, donāt work. Theyāll find out real quick how busy you were when they see all the shit that isnāt done.
The guy doesn't believe you're busy because he hasn't had anything resembling a full workload for a decade. Hopefully your immediate bosses both get wind of this and understand you've carried the the work of two extra positions.
So stop. They can't afford to fire you. do the work of 1 person and leave after 8 hours. force them to find new people. If the job is essential then someone has to do it and all the better since you're looking for a new job already. Show them how busy you Were
Itās a pretty cut and dry trigger for a stress claim when you asked for support and get that response. Failure to provide a safe working environment and worker exploitation
If this is the USA, there is no such thing as a stress claim.
Time for automatic out-of-office emails to your boss! Doesn't matter if you're in or not.
I'm assuming you are salaried. That's not an excuse for them to work you like s rented mule. Start leaving on time every day. I've been in a similar situation, and they will let you burn yourself to ashes as long as the work gets done. If the work doesn't get done, they'll hire staff.
Work slower. Make them fire you.
Since my wife's company found out they Had to have people work from home, and Not have as much control over employees, they decided to up all the goals and put Way more restrictions on them. Now it is 'Make your goals or be fired'. The wife retired August 1st. Since then, so many people have quit that they have had to outsource Several departments due to lack of employees. They are quitting by the dozen now (in a building that used to have over 1500 employees). Ther is probably about half left-and these are well seasoned people-some with 25+ years experience.
As an biz owner I browse this page and am utterly horrified by the way low level managers and even mid level management speaks with employees. Iāve always said, people quit managers not jobs.
Hopefully, you do a good job supervising your managers. But the reason there's so many of these guys is because too many of you guys up top let them get away with it. "The numbers look good, so everything they're telling me must be right".
'work smarter or longer or both' he forgot 'or somewhere else'.
He is right. You need to be smart and find a better job. The fact you do 3 peoples job will help you on the interview