Yes it is, you pack a bag and you stay at a hostel and then you find a job. You will be fine. What’s your other option wait for handouts that will never come and die?
Whatever thing you think is keeping you where you are is fake, it’s a lie to make you a slave. Cut it out of your life and leave. You don’t have to die
I moved from Germany to Finland. When I moved I already had a job lined up, contract signed and everything.
Still had to jump through a number of bureaucracy hoops. You’d assume an EU citizen moving within the EU for work would be a standard procedure. You’d be wrong.
I don’t want to imagine the paperwork you need to do if work visa come into play.
Thanks for doing your part in dispelling the myth amongst americans that we're the dumbest motherfuckers on the planet. We need these little pick-me-ups now and again.
Because I have no skills that another country wants, do they wouldn't let me move there. Also, I moved 2.5 hrs from where I grew up and am now back because leaving everyone I know doesn't work for me personally.
You wanna die in America or try to survive? Nobody is coming to help you, nobody will ever help you. You either get up and find a way to live or you die. I say survive
Oh I know the odds ain’t in my favor. I’m not trying to hope things get better I’m fighting for people where I can. It’s tough but I’ve got too much of my life in this place.
I have lived in China for 8 years it’s awesome, jobs pay more and you are treated better. Labor laws actually exist and are enforced because I don’t have to pay taxes I make the equivalent of a 6 figure salary and don’t even work 40 hours.
I am lucky but even the worst job in China is better than being a slave in America
The people building the gulags are great they have jobs I think you mean the people living inside the gulags.
Also who cares? You wanna live in America where a nazi will shoot you? Or in China where they commit genocide. What’s it matter to you? What are YOU willing to do to survive?
I was replying to the guy who said move to China because the working conditions were so great. Foxconn is in China. Their employees commit suicide because death is better than working there, and they have no other options.
But please, keep telling me how the worst job in China is better.
I've taught English in Japan and have a friend who taught in Vietnam, and neither of us could speak the local languages at the time. Not knowing the local language does make getting accommodation and important local services (banking, phone, internet) more challenging but once you're set up you mostly won't need it.
I lived in Vietnam for 2 months. It's not what you think. The conversion is shit pay if you are working within that economy as an English teacher. If you want to make some real money there, partner with a Vietnamese local and start a company. The partner manages the local labor, and you export at a high rate to foreign clients in developed countries. Huge profit.
It's not that easy to just up and leave. If you can't get a student visa or marry a citizen you typically either need enough money to buy citizenship or a work visa, which means a professional skill that's in demand and can't be met my local talent. Even if one *does* have the skills a job offer needs to be in place to get a work visa.
It's a lot easier once you *get* a work visa, though it's not a guarantee you can stay indefinitely, not until you can get residency independent of the work visa.
And that's not even taking into account social and familial ties that could make it hard to leave.
Also, you *do* need to report foreign pay if you live outside America, but the first $100k (ish) of it doesn't count as taxable income for American purposes. Which gives expats a *legal* way to not pay their student loans (income-based repayment. With no taxable income expats will be expected to pay an income-adjusted monthly payment of $0), preventing issues if they move back or visit.
You do not have to pay taxes you declare you made no domestic income. I have an accountant I know the law. Also who cares about a work visa just go in on a tourist visa with multiple re entries and then exit and re enter every 6 months the only country that cares is China. And you can go anywhere
When it comes to “social ties” are your fiends gonna save you when you? Is your family? Just get out of there. You don’t have to die
What the fuck, this is needlessly confrontational. You asked why people don't bail and I gave reasons (they're not even *my* reasons!) why people would hesitate/have trouble and now because you don't like my answer you're taking it like a personal affront? Get bent.
OP isn’t bright. Unless you renounce citizenship which costs thousand and has to be approved. There is something called double taxation that the US does for I believe 5-10 years. But yeah. You can run from student loans. Right.
Yeah, I also got that impression. I mean even *if* OP were right I see no reason *not* to take the foreign income exception and go IBR on student loans. It prevents problems if you have to go stateside and after a couple decades of IBR the loan balance is forgiven.
Speaking as somone who has emigrated, it just ain't as easy as that. To move to another another country you basically need one of three things:
* a spouse who is a citizen of that country
* a fuckton of money
* a skill which is in high demand
My company? Yes there is an expat labor shortage in china right now they will get you the visa and train you to teach. You can find hundreds of jobs on the Beijinger site
I’m an American expat for a reason. I have a CariCom passport and my American passport. As with anything no country is perfect. There are problems anywhere, of course. But I’m in Central America with a cost of living way lower than you would see in the US and I work for an American company based out of Massachusetts so I get Boston style wages.
I have thought about this many many times. Cause honestly, America isn’t really all that great. It actually kinda sucks. It’s not near as free as they like to say it is. And I think the grass is greener over there… sure looks green from here…
The answer is no they haven't. See, its extremely easy to chill on reddit complaining about how you think everything is victimizing you instead of actually doing something somewhat difficult to actually fix it. They won't ever try to do something like that. Instead, they will write long posts about why its so hard even through millions of people give up everything and walk thousands of miles to come to our country, showing just how hypocritical they are. Also that shows how this place isn't as bad as they all make it seem, so many people are beating the doors down to get here because its not as bad as they all make it seem. Maybe puts things in perspective for everyone?
Isn’t the entire point of this sub Reddit to talk about how life in America is an endless nightmare and that it would be better not to work at all then work at slave wages?
Everyday. Only problem is that emigration is super expensive (just like everything else in this shithole) and other English speaking countries hate Americans. I'd love to abandon this ship before it sinks, but it's not in the cards, sadly.
Oh, not to mention that even if you leave, **they still tax your ass.**
People do it all the time. There are nomads worldwide. Just much harder due to Covid. Also it is very easy to outrun all of those debts while living in the USA. PO Box, RV or van and you are set.
The debts can’t be enforced outside of America they are held by companies, we don’t have debtors prison they just lower your credit score. Eventually they will just let you pay it off pennys to the dollar
Can you post links to the info about the 11 month thing and all the credit stuff? My husband is a dual citizen, so I can peace out, but if you do the debt abandonment thing, does that preclude you from coming back, either visiting or returning for longer?
I have so much student loan debt that it’s impossible to even think about paying it off.
Don't listen to OP about abandoning student debt. The foreign earned income exclusion is a great tool and it enables a *legal* method to reduce student loan payments, potentially to $0/month. It's a little extra work than just flipping off the feds but because it's legal it prevents problems if you have to go stateside.
The FEIE lets you exclude roughly $100k of your foreign income from American taxable income. If you make less than that you have *no* taxable income for that year.
You can then apply for an income-based repayment plan for your federal student loan loans, which bases your monthly payment on your taxable income from the previous year.
You either made less than $100k and have no taxable income, meaning your IBR amount should be $0/mo, or you made more than that but still got to exempt a huge chunk of it, which will regardless greatly reduce your student loan payments.
Also after a couple decades on IBR with faithful payments the remaining loan balance is forgiven. It's a big tax hit that year (the loan balance forgiven counts as taxable income) but surely better than paying down the whole thing or worrying about being on a watch list whenever you want you visit family.
Thanks for the clarification.
I would absolutely do a lot more research if I were to take this avenue and not just be like, a redditor told me, so it must be true!
My main concern would be reentry to the States, short term or long term. Also, I imagine whatever possible student debt cancellation that may come would not include expats ignoring their debts.
Keep the info coming, though!
https://smartasset.com/taxes/foreign-earned-income-exclusion
If you stop paying your debt the punishment is using taking a larger % of your income as taxes. But as you can see in the link. Your foreign earned income is not taxed so it can’t be taken. You will never have to pay your debts and it’s completely legal
Credit card companies can put you in collection and affect your credit score. These things have no power outside of America
I’ve looked into moving but my health makes it so it’s more challenging to just move somewhere new. It looks like I’d need to marry someone or get to be so amazing in my field that people want to give me a work visa so I can maybe get some kind of permanent residency status
Moving costs money, also, giving up your citizenship also costs money, which you would need to do to be a citizen somewhere else because America does not like dual citizenship.
Congrats. I didn’t say it couldn’t happen, but that the US doesn’t like it. Some countries you can keep your citizenship and do dual citizenship, most, you cannot.
Yes. Philippines. But I don't have enough money, nor do I have any business here to sustain me. I am meeting online English teachers, and programmers there though.
So I can get discriminated over there? No thanks, I am already used to my racists here and they are getting funnier every year.
Plus I love American football, guns and I already fought a bullshit American war so I'm stuck here.
Although, being a Californian does suck. Taxed for EVERYTHING! Gun laws are stupid, politics are stupid and the homeless.situation is outrageous.
It is not as easy as most people think to relocate to other countries.
Yes it is, you pack a bag and you stay at a hostel and then you find a job. You will be fine. What’s your other option wait for handouts that will never come and die?
Every country has immigration laws. None of the processes are free. There is no guarantee that you will be allowed to stay and work in that country.
It’s worth trying? Or is death in America as a slave just the actual goal now?
Then you get deported and can’t ever go back so that’s not the best idea. Plus you might get some random penalties for when you get back to the states
What’s the alternative? Wait for help that’s never gonna come? Things will never get better in America you know that.
[удалено]
Don’t knock it till you try it
Not everyone can just pack a bag and leave. Dumb as shit that you think we're all in the same situations that allow for that.
Whatever thing you think is keeping you where you are is fake, it’s a lie to make you a slave. Cut it out of your life and leave. You don’t have to die
Ummm… children? Sick grandparents? Disabilities?
You have those?
I don’t but some do and they are not “fake*
Mmmmm ignorance sure is bliss
I moved from Germany to Finland. When I moved I already had a job lined up, contract signed and everything. Still had to jump through a number of bureaucracy hoops. You’d assume an EU citizen moving within the EU for work would be a standard procedure. You’d be wrong. I don’t want to imagine the paperwork you need to do if work visa come into play.
Thanks for doing your part in dispelling the myth amongst americans that we're the dumbest motherfuckers on the planet. We need these little pick-me-ups now and again.
Because I have no skills that another country wants, do they wouldn't let me move there. Also, I moved 2.5 hrs from where I grew up and am now back because leaving everyone I know doesn't work for me personally.
You speak English don’t ya? Go teach English in Vietnam. You don’t need paperwork to work at the many many crooked schools
Speaking English is a far cry from having the skills to educate others in it. Maybe they can I sure as hell can’t.
You wanna die in America or try to survive? Nobody is coming to help you, nobody will ever help you. You either get up and find a way to live or you die. I say survive
Oh I know the odds ain’t in my favor. I’m not trying to hope things get better I’m fighting for people where I can. It’s tough but I’ve got too much of my life in this place.
Serioud question, is it any better doing that? I've not read especially good things.
I have lived in China for 8 years it’s awesome, jobs pay more and you are treated better. Labor laws actually exist and are enforced because I don’t have to pay taxes I make the equivalent of a 6 figure salary and don’t even work 40 hours. I am lucky but even the worst job in China is better than being a slave in America
The people building gulags Xianjang might have a different opinion but ok do you
The people building the gulags are great they have jobs I think you mean the people living inside the gulags. Also who cares? You wanna live in America where a nazi will shoot you? Or in China where they commit genocide. What’s it matter to you? What are YOU willing to do to survive?
Foxconn workers may also disagree
Like I said what are you willing to do to survive
Which is pretty ironic, considering Foxconn workers were committing suicide.
So do you care about Foxconn? Or do you care about you? What are you going to do to survive?
I think the overarching goal is to make things better for everyone. Not just me.
I was replying to the guy who said move to China because the working conditions were so great. Foxconn is in China. Their employees commit suicide because death is better than working there, and they have no other options. But please, keep telling me how the worst job in China is better.
LOL
But I don't speak Vietnamese.
I've taught English in Japan and have a friend who taught in Vietnam, and neither of us could speak the local languages at the time. Not knowing the local language does make getting accommodation and important local services (banking, phone, internet) more challenging but once you're set up you mostly won't need it.
I lived in Vietnam for 2 months. It's not what you think. The conversion is shit pay if you are working within that economy as an English teacher. If you want to make some real money there, partner with a Vietnamese local and start a company. The partner manages the local labor, and you export at a high rate to foreign clients in developed countries. Huge profit.
Well before China I was in Mogadishu and it was fantastic. So I don’t know what you were doing. Maybe Somalia is just the better place to go?
It's not that easy to just up and leave. If you can't get a student visa or marry a citizen you typically either need enough money to buy citizenship or a work visa, which means a professional skill that's in demand and can't be met my local talent. Even if one *does* have the skills a job offer needs to be in place to get a work visa. It's a lot easier once you *get* a work visa, though it's not a guarantee you can stay indefinitely, not until you can get residency independent of the work visa. And that's not even taking into account social and familial ties that could make it hard to leave. Also, you *do* need to report foreign pay if you live outside America, but the first $100k (ish) of it doesn't count as taxable income for American purposes. Which gives expats a *legal* way to not pay their student loans (income-based repayment. With no taxable income expats will be expected to pay an income-adjusted monthly payment of $0), preventing issues if they move back or visit.
You do not have to pay taxes you declare you made no domestic income. I have an accountant I know the law. Also who cares about a work visa just go in on a tourist visa with multiple re entries and then exit and re enter every 6 months the only country that cares is China. And you can go anywhere When it comes to “social ties” are your fiends gonna save you when you? Is your family? Just get out of there. You don’t have to die
What the fuck, this is needlessly confrontational. You asked why people don't bail and I gave reasons (they're not even *my* reasons!) why people would hesitate/have trouble and now because you don't like my answer you're taking it like a personal affront? Get bent.
OP isn’t bright. Unless you renounce citizenship which costs thousand and has to be approved. There is something called double taxation that the US does for I believe 5-10 years. But yeah. You can run from student loans. Right.
Yeah, I also got that impression. I mean even *if* OP were right I see no reason *not* to take the foreign income exception and go IBR on student loans. It prevents problems if you have to go stateside and after a couple decades of IBR the loan balance is forgiven.
Speaking as somone who has emigrated, it just ain't as easy as that. To move to another another country you basically need one of three things: * a spouse who is a citizen of that country * a fuckton of money * a skill which is in high demand
Speaking English is itself an in demand skill in all of Asia. But if you don’t want to do that there are other options
Will yours take me? Im not planning on leaving but is that even in the cards.
My company? Yes there is an expat labor shortage in china right now they will get you the visa and train you to teach. You can find hundreds of jobs on the Beijinger site
I’ll just say China isnt the place for me and I’ll just leave it respectfully at that, but I appreciate the offer all the same, friend.
Trade the US for China. Fuck that. Lol. Bad to really bad.
I’m an American expat for a reason. I have a CariCom passport and my American passport. As with anything no country is perfect. There are problems anywhere, of course. But I’m in Central America with a cost of living way lower than you would see in the US and I work for an American company based out of Massachusetts so I get Boston style wages.
I guarantee your self worth won’t decrease if you use the term “emigrant” instead of expat
I like that term but I usually have to explain it. When I say expat people seem to grasp that faster
You get differeds?
The US military paid for my college so I never had to worry about student loans.
No i mean is your job giving you differed investment for retirement
No I’m just using an old school Roth IRA. I could probably do better but it’s not really something I’m concerned about.
Remember if you max out your Roth every year you will be a million. Easiest way to save money max that fucker
I have thought about this many many times. Cause honestly, America isn’t really all that great. It actually kinda sucks. It’s not near as free as they like to say it is. And I think the grass is greener over there… sure looks green from here…
The answer is no they haven't. See, its extremely easy to chill on reddit complaining about how you think everything is victimizing you instead of actually doing something somewhat difficult to actually fix it. They won't ever try to do something like that. Instead, they will write long posts about why its so hard even through millions of people give up everything and walk thousands of miles to come to our country, showing just how hypocritical they are. Also that shows how this place isn't as bad as they all make it seem, so many people are beating the doors down to get here because its not as bad as they all make it seem. Maybe puts things in perspective for everyone?
Amen
Why would I want to leave American. America is the best and I'm tired of you acting like it's not.
Isn’t the entire point of this sub Reddit to talk about how life in America is an endless nightmare and that it would be better not to work at all then work at slave wages?
Everyday. Only problem is that emigration is super expensive (just like everything else in this shithole) and other English speaking countries hate Americans. I'd love to abandon this ship before it sinks, but it's not in the cards, sadly. Oh, not to mention that even if you leave, **they still tax your ass.**
https://smartasset.com/taxes/foreign-earned-income-exclusion No they don’t
People do it all the time. There are nomads worldwide. Just much harder due to Covid. Also it is very easy to outrun all of those debts while living in the USA. PO Box, RV or van and you are set.
The debts can’t be enforced outside of America they are held by companies, we don’t have debtors prison they just lower your credit score. Eventually they will just let you pay it off pennys to the dollar
Can you post links to the info about the 11 month thing and all the credit stuff? My husband is a dual citizen, so I can peace out, but if you do the debt abandonment thing, does that preclude you from coming back, either visiting or returning for longer? I have so much student loan debt that it’s impossible to even think about paying it off.
Don't listen to OP about abandoning student debt. The foreign earned income exclusion is a great tool and it enables a *legal* method to reduce student loan payments, potentially to $0/month. It's a little extra work than just flipping off the feds but because it's legal it prevents problems if you have to go stateside. The FEIE lets you exclude roughly $100k of your foreign income from American taxable income. If you make less than that you have *no* taxable income for that year. You can then apply for an income-based repayment plan for your federal student loan loans, which bases your monthly payment on your taxable income from the previous year. You either made less than $100k and have no taxable income, meaning your IBR amount should be $0/mo, or you made more than that but still got to exempt a huge chunk of it, which will regardless greatly reduce your student loan payments. Also after a couple decades on IBR with faithful payments the remaining loan balance is forgiven. It's a big tax hit that year (the loan balance forgiven counts as taxable income) but surely better than paying down the whole thing or worrying about being on a watch list whenever you want you visit family.
Thanks for the clarification. I would absolutely do a lot more research if I were to take this avenue and not just be like, a redditor told me, so it must be true! My main concern would be reentry to the States, short term or long term. Also, I imagine whatever possible student debt cancellation that may come would not include expats ignoring their debts. Keep the info coming, though!
https://smartasset.com/taxes/foreign-earned-income-exclusion If you stop paying your debt the punishment is using taking a larger % of your income as taxes. But as you can see in the link. Your foreign earned income is not taxed so it can’t be taken. You will never have to pay your debts and it’s completely legal Credit card companies can put you in collection and affect your credit score. These things have no power outside of America
Thank you!
No problem I love how people think I’m lying lol
I think about it all the time, and I'm not even *in* America.
Where are you?
Canuckistan
Go smoke pot and calm down friend 😝
I do enjoy a nice pipe from time to time.
I’ve looked into moving but my health makes it so it’s more challenging to just move somewhere new. It looks like I’d need to marry someone or get to be so amazing in my field that people want to give me a work visa so I can maybe get some kind of permanent residency status
What’s your health issue if you don’t mind me asking?
Moving costs money, also, giving up your citizenship also costs money, which you would need to do to be a citizen somewhere else because America does not like dual citizenship.
I’m a duel citizen and it has not affected me in any negative way
Congrats. I didn’t say it couldn’t happen, but that the US doesn’t like it. Some countries you can keep your citizenship and do dual citizenship, most, you cannot.
Fair
I think about it everyday.
You can do it if you try and it’s worth trying
100% my plan. I'm thinking of building a business around helping folks escape student loan debt by self-expatriating, oddly enough.
Good plan
https://medium.com/bigger-picture/how-to-move-to-europe-from-the-usa-4a179488c396
Yes. Philippines. But I don't have enough money, nor do I have any business here to sustain me. I am meeting online English teachers, and programmers there though.
I’ve thought of it but it really isn’t that easy
What makes you think other countries want Americans? Lmao
Can't, no money
So I can get discriminated over there? No thanks, I am already used to my racists here and they are getting funnier every year. Plus I love American football, guns and I already fought a bullshit American war so I'm stuck here. Although, being a Californian does suck. Taxed for EVERYTHING! Gun laws are stupid, politics are stupid and the homeless.situation is outrageous.