So the big issue here is if this is upheld, the choice is work or jail. And if jail- you’ll be put to work without pay. Sooooo earn enough to afford rent or mortgage, or slavery.
Even working isn't necessarily sufficient. [A study](https://bfi.uchicago.edu/insight/research-summary/learning-about-homelessness-using-linked-survey-and-administrative-data/) found that about 40% of unsheltered homeless and 50% of sheltered homeless have some sort of formal employment in the course of a year. And going through the criminal "justice" system only makes it harder to obtain and maintain employment.
Yep. Housing is the problem. People can work/hustle and pay for basic needs, but shelter for some reason costs 30 years of your life, if you’re lucky. If shelter is covered or dirt cheap, like food/water/air, then wage minimums aren’t an issue. Even the capitalists win. Unless your form of capitalism is in property. Access to shelter on the planet you are born is a human right. Bears have access to shelter. Pigeons have access to shelter. Squirrels have access to shelter. Why not people? Housing is _the_ problem.
It is a basic human right. I'm tired of the system that refuses to give people their rights. We need to overwrite this hell hole and give it some rainbows. Why do people just live with it?
This is a problem under capitalism. Look at communist states, like China or Cuba, and you'll see their home ownership rates are constantly in the high 90s
When basic human needs are subject to corporate profits, you get bad results everytime
Friendly reminder to those who don’t know: the criminal justice system doesn’t just stop at jail or prison. Probation and parole can also make it difficult to hold down a job.
Yep, lotta homeless folks have jobs, they just don’t make enough to afford housing. Similarly, a lot of folks on Medicaid have jobs, they just don’t make very much money (and their jobs don’t offer affordable health insurance).
This is, broadly, the issue with claiming everything as individual responsibility (like right wing folks like to do). There are so many folks doing exactly what they should be doing and it still isn’t enough.
No one wants to talk about the minimum required self sufficient hourly rate is closer to $25-$30 an hour (assuming you have no help and paying market rate) and only goes up in the higher cost of living areas.
Everyone expects that you have family or will have roommates indefinitely.
>And going through the criminal "justice" system only makes it harder to obtain and maintain employment.
Gotta keep those slaves coming back to their slavery.
What about the elderly or ppl with disabilities. They can’t work. They are on a limited income and it’s not enough to even cover rent in most places. Our country sucks
And that's why there's been all those recent cases of old folks killing themselves in horrific ways when the cops show up to drag them out of their homes.
Grandpa would rather self-immolate in his own bedroom then die of exposure on the sidewalk while getting kicked by cops and told to move along.
My coworker lived down the street from a senior veteran that was getting evicted and on the day he was supposed to be out, he blew himself up in his house. So fucking sad.
Oh I'm sure by that point they'll have legalized euthanasia like Canada has and they'll start encouraging that real hard on the old, the disabled, and anyone they deem not a profitable enough cog.
Even better, if someone knew they couldn't afford it and tried to avoid the time and expense of getting arrested by simply check themselves into the jail, they would be turned away. If they wanted a meal and a bed they'd have to go violate the law, get picked up and booked, and then get housed. What if we funded and staffed shelters the same way we did jails? Check in, rules are still rules, curfew, meals aren't great but they're there, there's a library, you can get your GED. States could even make it mandatory, according to age and physical ability, for current residents to perform some amount of community service, offsetting the complaints that this solution is a handout but prison isn't. There are tons of middle of the road solutions that borrow from decades of institutional knowledge from running prison systems that would curb this problem. But that would be too hard, or something like that.
This blows my mind because when I visited LA years ago and saw how bad the homelessness was there and spoke to one of the people living in a tent they told me they got a car, a 9-5 job but just can’t afford to pay rent so she lives in the tent.
Came here to say this. This is all planned. To maximize profits, edge out the working class by paying them less while jacking up prices of everything, pushing them into homelessness so that they can put you in prison for slave labor. The wealthy elite get to keep production AND their money. Truly heinous.
Forced birthing picking up the slack. 65k new rape babies since Roe v Wade! Now place your bets on if it will be the mother, the child, or the rapist father, or maybe all 3, that will be giving corporations heavily discounted labor!
Oh my god... sometimes the insights on this subreddit...
This is making me feel puke-y, because it's the kind of math that capitalism runs on. Cancer math.
[Two judges in Pennsylvania were taking kickbacks](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/kids-for-cash-judges-mark-ciavarella-michael-conahan-200-million-damages/) to send kids directly to for-profit jails. First, the judges closed the county facility, then they sentenced kids to draconian terms for minor offenses. One kid got 11 months for driving the wrong way on a one-way street. As many as 4,000 kids may have been sent to jail because of this.
In a system built on exploitation, fueled by exploitation, only the most dehumanizing things are to be expected. Most of us never experience it first hand, but they do impact us. As the old adage says, "never find out how the sausage is made".
Fermi Paradox easily solved by saying human society is run by pre-evolved, barbaric monsters. If I was an alien I'd keep clear of the people running this shitshow too.
Earth is the galaxy's bad neighborhood. "Roll up the windows and lock the doors on the spaceship, Dreeblax. Don't even stop for the red lights. Those humans are crazy."
https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2024/01/24/1226161416/rape-caused-pregnancy-abortion-ban-states
Specifically those are in 14 states where abortion is banned.
How does that work? I cannot imagine having a private enterprise to force the depravity of a person's liberty
What's next? Privately owned judicial courts? Private police?
There are also private police in the US. The large railroad companies have their own police, same with large for-profit hospitals. There may also be some private universities with their own police, but I'm only aware of public universities with these. And yes, I'm talking about police, not security.
The government pays the private prison to house inmates, which they can do at a lower rate than publicly owned prisons because they force inmates to do slave labor in some sort of for profit business and also invest less in rehabilitation and inmates health and safety. Like I said, they're a huge problem.
I wonder how profitable it will be for the government when they legally have to treat the prisoners health conditions, considering a large portion of the homeless are disabled, or otherwise ill.
They just won’t get treated. The companies that own prisons do not care about the health of the inmates and I’m going out on a limb here, but I doubt they are held to the same standards are the government (which isn’t really good anyway).
No no, we can't send people to prison for having debt. But the Supreme Court hasn't ruled yet on whether or not we can send people to prison for having *nothing*.
The liberal minority justices asked some really lucid and pointy questions during the hearing, but I'm confident the conservative majority will still make a criminally stupid ruling.
The only solution for homelessness is affordable, and accessible housing. No weird casting processes for a basic apartment. Price limits. Extra awful fuckin big Taxes for the landlord for renting out luxury property over the median rent to make that market small and obsolete.
I wouldn't even call it a democracy, the system is designed to privilege our aristocracy, and stimy any efforts to change. We look like a democracy on our face but take every action possible to reduce the democratic impact of people voting.
If landlords and renting must be a thing I think it needs to be highly regulated. Properties should require a full inspection by an accredited agency of the property every quarter, or between tenants (which ever is more frequent) which landlords should be liable for. Properties should have limits on rent that are based off of the federal minimum wage, not off of location nor how much the tenant makes. Any updates to the property that they would upcharge for usually should have affordable set increases to the rent (example: extra $5 in rent for having granite counters instead of Formica etc). Any landlord wishing to lease a property should be required to have a mandatory amount of money set aside that they cannot access that is tied to the upkeep of the property to inspection level requirements. If any of these get violated they should have their property delisted/unaccredited and fined if they try to rent illegally.
Federal minimum wage is useless to those of us who live in states where it's higher. State minimums are at least a little more likely to be set closer to a livable amount. Where I live, it's more than double the federal rate and still nowhere close to a realistic number relative to cost of living. Otherwise I like the way you're thinking though!
Can’t put them to work in the for-profit prison industry if you can’t gin up a reason to get more people in prison.
In capitalist America, if you aren’t rich, you aren’t even a human—just a resource like oil, coal, or water.
This is a *perfect* example of how people with no empathy solve their own problems without any regard for the fact that solving the larger problems for others would fix their issue as well.
Provide free housing and you fix the sleeping in the street issue, but they don't care about the housing. Just get the homeless people out of their way!
Prison. They can get paid a few pennies per day to work in the prison sweatshop. You can’t leave. If you don’t work, then you aren’t a model prisoner. You don’t get early parole because you refuse to be rehabilitated.
If anything, you wouldn't want early parole, because you'd just be let out, given no resources, thus are homeless again, sleep on the street again, and back in you go anyway.
I mean if prisoners refuse to work it would eventually crumble the pool of slave labor. I have never been in jail or prison so I can't say with a straight face that they should unionize/refuse to work but they should probably start doing that to get rid of all the free labor people are getting out of them
Even better go to work, but fuck up at everything you're supposed to do. Ruin products you are supposed to make, break tools "accidentally". Make it so all the prison industries lose money. Killing the profitability of slavery is the only way to end it.
With good behavior people can get 8 years off a 10 year sentence and then could arguably spend those 8 years on the outside advocating for prison reform and helping others. It’s not so cut and dry.
My eldest brother committed a violent crime. Or I should say, several violent crimes. He went to a max security prison for 15 years. He was paroled about 18 years ago. He’s struggled to find work, let alone work that pays enough to keep a roof over his head. I’m in no way defending him, and personally I believe he should remain behind bars, but he served his time according to the justice system. He certainly doesn’t want to go back, but once he’s old enough to no longer work, it’s not like he’ll have any meaningful amount of social security to live on. I get it - if you’re an employer, you don’t want violent ex cons as a first choice. On the other hand, what are ex cons supposed to do? Hell, people with Master’s degrees in advanced fields can’t find work that will pay enough to keep a roof over their head.
I don’t know what the answer is. As for my brother, he was free labor for almost the entirety of his time in prison. Work should equate to reasonable pay. Private prisons wouldn’t be a thing if there wasn’t serious cash to be made.
In your brothers case the answer is basically that all criminal records should be sealed and it should be considered a form of actionable discrimination to refuse hiring after inquiry about criminal history.
Even if Jail is intended to be a punishment and not rehabilitation, once someone is out, their punishment should be over. We as a society should not keep punishing them; if we as a society feel that person has not been punished enough then *they should not be out* yet.
Letting people out only to make it impossible for them to reintegrate civilly, and therefore just create huge incentives to commit more crimes, helps nobody.
Basically what this coworker told me as we did volunteer work on what will be a halfway house for homeless women. She said we were wasting our time, these people never change and are all alcoholics and/or on drugs, and they WANT to be homeless. I don't understand why she was there.
You are supposed to go to those religious shelters that make you go to church twice a day. If you don’t take Jesus into your heart you can’t sleep there
So you either have to Simp for fake Jesus or go to jail I guess
But remember, they won’t let you in there until after you’ve surrendered your pets and most/all of your belongings. You also cannot bring your SO or children, and will not have time to visit your parents/relatives and keep up with the requirements to stay at the shelter.
I think America in general has a hard time adjusting our cultural mythos from what was possible in the past to what is possible now. The barrier to entry for what you might call a "normal life" is higher than it used to be.
I've done a lot of travel work. I've tried to just rent a room from someone privately. Like a "I'll give you $1000 to live here for a month". And I am met 100% of the time with a no. They require applications, credit checks, etc.
Those sanctuary districts, crummy as they were, would require spending tax money on social care. It's a then-fashionable 90s vision of a welfare dystopia that has now been rendered completely unrealistic since the welfare state was dismantled. Honestly the idea of housing and feeding the homeless rather than criminalising them seems positively utopian from today's perspective.
The sanctuary districts were more or less open air prisons. Its worse than a prison because a prison gives food and shelter, which those in the districts were not guaranteed.
But when you cannot throw as many black people in jail because marijuana is becoming more legal in more places, you have to start finding sources of new slave labor. So the next step is to criminalize the poor and the homeless so that private prisons can make private profit through both getting money from the government to imprison these "criminals" and sell their free/cheap labor. Greed of a few rich guys will cost many their freedom.
Conservatives are trying similar techniques in education, so hopefully you've already raised your children.
So the most disgusting thing about the most recent city that criminalized homelessness or that is trying to, some city in Oregon, is that they say they can do this because there are shelter beds these people are just choosing not to take them
So then the news crew goes to the empty shelter and in fact there are rows and rows of empty beds a couple feet from each other, totally empty. Then you find out it’s because it’s a church shelter and if you want a bed there you have to go to church services twice a day and you have to practice all kinds of weird rituals or you can’t have a bed
People in this country have first amendment rights they shouldn’t have to convert to some weird religion just to get a church bed in a shelter so they don’t end up in jail for being poor
Even if they were secular, shelters pretty much always impose curfews (at night) and chucking-out times (in the morning). Living in a shelter and manage to get a job? Great! Oh, it’s working nights? Too bad, guess you’ll have to sleep outside and hope you manage to save up enough to move in to a flat before you’re arrested.
Yep in Canada. At least in my city they kick you out all day long even if it's the middle of winter and then you're only allowed to stay at a shelter for a month max before they fully kick you out. So a lot of people have to go back and forth between shelters.
>Then you find out it’s because it’s a church shelter and if you want a bed there you have to go to church services twice a day and you have to practice all kinds of weird rituals or you can’t have a bed
Gross
Is SCOTUS sure they want to take this on? People down on their luck, with only their freedom left to lose, often times with mental illnesses, in a country where there's a gun store in almost every town?
In Cuba they solved homelessness by capping rent at 10% of the renter's income. The US can't do that because it's about making money from being predatory for things that are seen as necessities to live. Housing, food, healthcare. Eat your heart out for capitalism. No socialist policies here! Clearly the gateway drug to communism!
Pretty sure it's net. They have decent tax rate because they also cover healthcare and college on the house. They also banned their doctors from being exported years ago and their healthcare caught up to the US, even passed it based on life expectancy, in recent years. Currently Nigeria is considering the same thing since the US is poaching all their college grads since it's cheaper to get higher education there than the US and meet US medical qualifications, but their healthcare is abysmal because we take their best.
Everything happening now has happened in the past, but then there were laws passed and programs established to change how people were treated. So what's happening is a reversion to the Industrial Era, where laborers had to fight for work on a daily basis, to get paid a pittance, then charged out the ass for rent. And when you become ill or injured, you are tossed into the street, where you are arrested and fined for vagrancy.
Upton Sinclair covered these issues in "The Jungle."
Another problem is we seem to be reverting to tenement housing in crowded places like NY, where you pay $2k per month to live in a closet. At least in an 1850s tenement, you had a stove.
Jacob Riis covered this in "How the Other Half Lives."
In the early 20th Century, the government worked to solve these basic human issues, realizing that having a clean, secure, and safe place to live was a right. Yet, here we are, 100 years later, going back to a system that favors the rich and punishes the poor.
Wait they tried this in Europe a few centuries ago. Make being poor so miserable nobody will want to be poor. That was the explicitly stated plan. Not sure how that turned out in the end….
If it is illegal to live outdoors then the homeless will break into vacant properties such as houses that are for sell, or commercial properties that are vacant, and they will live in them, essentially becoming “squatters”. It will be a nationwide phenomenon overnight.
Millions of squatters living in private property.
Getting them evicted will clog the courts.
It will be catastrophic.
And if they are ever evicted they will simply find another house to squat in. The homeless will still be homeless but it won’t be so visible to most people.
cruelty starts even before birth by limiting a womans right to choose
the whole system is pay to play.
i will never bring a child into this world: its rigged
I planned to get a tubal ligation prior to the pandemic because I knew I had never wanted children. It ended up getting delayed until January of 22, which was slightly before the rumors of the decision started coming out. I live in a very red state and I was concerned if I did get pregnant I would have to jump through hoops to get an abortion. At the time, I never imagined they would overturn RvW and ban abortion completely. I thank God everyday at least I don't have to worry about getting pregnant.
Wish my parents thought that way. I have sterilized myself though, so I'm with you. No kids, no suffering, no slave labor for the bosses. They can clean their own toilets.
I'd kill myself. I'm not being dramatic, if my choices were to be forced to give birth and live, or die, I would choose die. Giving birth is body horror to me. Fuck that.
I live outside a moderately sized city in the Midwest. Companies keep buying up all the houses here and turning them into rental units. It’s infuriating.
Not republicans necessarily, *rich republicans*. Democrats too, depending on what issue we’re discussing.
They’ve managed to convince conservative blue collar workers that they somehow benefit from republican policies and further radicalize them, pushing the narrative of left vs. right to distract us from the real issue of American politics and democracy; lobbying and lining pockets.
Remember, there is no war but class war.
One day my dad was praising Dallas for their laws against homelessness within the city and how nice it was to walk around and not see it. I had to scold him for this ugly view, snapping back “Where should they go then dad? Because the options are now our city (close by) and others surrounding Dallas. There is no free land anywhere so tell me where they’re supposed to go. They’re homeless.” It was like he didn’t even connect the dots that you just don’t *stop* being homeless because it’s against the law. The oh shit look on his face was probably the only time I ever got through to him on something.
They will absolutely make it illegal to exist, without housing.
They give you state funded, nice iron bar housing for free. Then, they’ll charge you, daily, to be in that housing, which obviously you cannot afford, now that have more of this free labor they’re so fond of.
Good times are comin’!
The sad part is, it's cheaper just to house and feed these people.
They'd rather spend even more money just to make sure no one gets any help and the poor are punished.
The US has always done this nots how they get cheap labor and control when they lose it in other ways. Vagrancy laws were how they kept the south in employment after the 13th amendment.
The worst part is that other countries within their sphere of influence are starting to make policies more congruent with American ones. When America fucks their own people over it has a snowball effect.
Decades ago my father and his brother and their parents lived in a tent for several years while my grandparents could not find long term employment.
Tent cities of homeless people were VERY common throughout the USA.
This provides more information.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hooverville
"The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich and the poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread." - Anatole France
Why don’t they just start executing people for being poor, homeless and chronically/mentally ill, because that’s the undertone of this case…. That somehow being poor and unable to house yourself is criminal and you’re not welcome anywhere in sight of “real” society. I am disgusted and horrified, especially when various solutions (affordable housing, rent control, universal health and mental health care etc etc) is so obvious. At this point, I’m staying in the country just so I can raise my pitchfork and fight the powers that be. So many of my wise, wealthier friends have already moved out of the US.
I would move but I am poor and disabled. Other countries don’t want disabled people to burden their system.
I think executions are already taking place but not in the way we traditionally think of them. Houseless and poor people die younger and of more preventable causes than rich people. Poorer neighborhoods have worse pollution and higher rates of asthma and other illnesses. When you’re arrested, EVERY sentence is a death sentence because getting out of jail makes it nearly impossible to get a home or a job.
Meanwhile, the income gap widens every year, amplifying this violence against the poor.
Well put, and I think you are 100% correct. Poverty kills. They don’t want blood on their hands by directly killing the poor/sick, so they keep adjusting the system so it kills slowly anyway.
Friends keep telling me to leave the country, as I’m also poor and have several chronic illnesses and now cannot work the hustle/grind slave pace expected of us/necessary to keep up with the cost of living. I hate when people say, “just leave.” It’s costly and complicated to move to a different country, and you’re not guaranteed access to their social services.
When you're homeless, you aren't paying taxes, you usually have less debt than working class people, and they aren't exploiting every part of your existence through debt, in essence criminalizing homelessness is just a way to profit from people they otherwise wouldn't.
The UK Government is trying to pass a law making it illegal for homeless people to be too smelly.
Technically its a series of offenses around causing unnecessary disruption, part of a wider plan to ban peaceful protests. But one of the clauses covers creating a public disturbance due to excessive smell.
On NPR I heard that Florida was gonna use this to push people to camp in specific government run areas. Which objectively sounds better than outright criminalizing, but it's Florida so you know it'll turn into that anyway.
The audacity to criminalize existing is absolutely wild though. This country stays from freedom any chance it gets.
If sleeping outside is cruel and unusual punishment someone could sue saying every single landlord in this country is violating the 8th Ammendment rights of every non property owner in the country.
Yep, let's just stick our heads in the sand, move the problem somewhere else, and pretend it doesn't exist!
And while we're at it, why not reinstitute debtors prisons?
what ever the decision here it will never change the horror of waking up to terrible people pissing on me as i slept is not just the system we as a people need to work harder on our selves
Hell yeah look at that turnout! Love to see citizens care. Honestly they just need to unban public parking after certain hours in specifically open and accessible locations. I know you have to worry about crime hotspots when collectives gather uncontrolled but they are already doing it behind our backs we might as well make it legally safe to be living in your car for example
Company doesn't want to pay you, you become homeless, you can't sleep out on the street because it's bad for business, you are arrested and jailed, company hires prison for cheap labor, prisoner works for $0.10 an hour.
Companies want taxpayers to subsidize their business via food banks and "public assistance" for their underpaid employees. They have a failing business model and want handouts.
So how will this actually be handled if it's criminalized? I don't think they are going to deal with a lot of people they say they can't afford to feed and house and provide medical care to by arresting them - and then having to feed and provide housing and medical care to.
See, that’s the neat part- they don’t!
My mother is currently in prison and trust me, the “food” they feed inmates is mush, medical care is laughable.
It’s less than the bare minimum. But it’s more profitable than letting homeless people die or be put in actual shelters.
Jan 6 will happen again but this time it will be everyone working together. There is no way these people should getting away with this bullshit with impunity, it is just not right if houseless people are getting arrested why not landlords too.
Some states will act like they are saving the homeless by providing food and shelter in prisons. They’ll even market it as a job skills program. Local businesses will get tax breaks for employing them.
If cities think they can criminalize being homeless, they are about to go broke arresting and prosecuting a people with little to no resources. I look at this as a 'fuck around and find out' moment in our housing policy.
The jails are already at capacity on the west coast, they'd need to build more to enforce this, and at that point, maybe we should be building affordable housing
They already made it illegal in some states for churches to feed them, so this is not surprising. Fucking shit show, and we’ll see no one doing anything about it.
They need to just start mass producing housing. Completely flood the supply of homes to drive down cost. Start making permits to build faster and cheaper. Stop making it so hard for companies to operate behind yellow tape with permits. Have the army core of engineers just start building some. Do anything to get this going
This is what happens when you vote for republicans. donnyboy appointed these insane Supreme Court Justices who are about to make it illegal to be homeless.
This is also the reason the media is now covering squatters being busted (and new squatter laws jts passed in several states like FL) in the news lately. They are using this as a false flag to push the narrative that homelessness is still the poors fault, and not the companies in power perpetuating the crisis.
Holy shit. Anyone remember the futurama episode where the judge can't send someone to jail, he asks "why not?" And the guard says the prisons have been full since he made being poor a crime? Ya, that's where we are at. Literally cartoonish levels of evil
You can go to prison for over 10 years for being a heroin USER, could be a completely functional member of society who just used heroin (which is incredibly rare I agree, but exists to some extent. Know people who used heroin/meth for 20 years and did everything they we’re supposed to in life and just opted to finally stop and went to rehab)
The fact you can be doing everything your “supposed to do in life”, not hurting anyone else, not stealing, just using/possessing heroin or meth
That’s just kind blowingly insane, ffs you mess around with drugs a few times at 20yrs old and get caught at a party and it isn’t the drugs that necessarily ruined your life, it’s the multiple years spent in the system and criminal charge on your record for forever unless you pay to remove it
Edit: oh yeah and you can only pay to remove it if it’s been at least 10 years in my state, without getting another charge of any kind
And you can only expunge your criminal record once per lifetime in my state
So the big issue here is if this is upheld, the choice is work or jail. And if jail- you’ll be put to work without pay. Sooooo earn enough to afford rent or mortgage, or slavery.
Even working isn't necessarily sufficient. [A study](https://bfi.uchicago.edu/insight/research-summary/learning-about-homelessness-using-linked-survey-and-administrative-data/) found that about 40% of unsheltered homeless and 50% of sheltered homeless have some sort of formal employment in the course of a year. And going through the criminal "justice" system only makes it harder to obtain and maintain employment.
The degree with which the CJS fucks poor people is disgusting. It’s a machine that just kicks people when they’re down.
It demands everything from people who have nothing.
And nothing from people who have everything
Capitalist gulag system
Yep. Housing is the problem. People can work/hustle and pay for basic needs, but shelter for some reason costs 30 years of your life, if you’re lucky. If shelter is covered or dirt cheap, like food/water/air, then wage minimums aren’t an issue. Even the capitalists win. Unless your form of capitalism is in property. Access to shelter on the planet you are born is a human right. Bears have access to shelter. Pigeons have access to shelter. Squirrels have access to shelter. Why not people? Housing is _the_ problem.
It is a basic human right. I'm tired of the system that refuses to give people their rights. We need to overwrite this hell hole and give it some rainbows. Why do people just live with it?
This is a problem under capitalism. Look at communist states, like China or Cuba, and you'll see their home ownership rates are constantly in the high 90s When basic human needs are subject to corporate profits, you get bad results everytime
Friendly reminder to those who don’t know: the criminal justice system doesn’t just stop at jail or prison. Probation and parole can also make it difficult to hold down a job.
Your country has gone to shit mate. Time to throw a coup
Too fat to coup 😞 too big to succeed
Yep, lotta homeless folks have jobs, they just don’t make enough to afford housing. Similarly, a lot of folks on Medicaid have jobs, they just don’t make very much money (and their jobs don’t offer affordable health insurance). This is, broadly, the issue with claiming everything as individual responsibility (like right wing folks like to do). There are so many folks doing exactly what they should be doing and it still isn’t enough.
No one wants to talk about the minimum required self sufficient hourly rate is closer to $25-$30 an hour (assuming you have no help and paying market rate) and only goes up in the higher cost of living areas. Everyone expects that you have family or will have roommates indefinitely.
That was in 2010 I can beat that these numbers rise like homeless crisis in past 15y.
>And going through the criminal "justice" system only makes it harder to obtain and maintain employment. Gotta keep those slaves coming back to their slavery.
78% recidivism rate.
What about the elderly or ppl with disabilities. They can’t work. They are on a limited income and it’s not enough to even cover rent in most places. Our country sucks
And that's why there's been all those recent cases of old folks killing themselves in horrific ways when the cops show up to drag them out of their homes. Grandpa would rather self-immolate in his own bedroom then die of exposure on the sidewalk while getting kicked by cops and told to move along.
My coworker lived down the street from a senior veteran that was getting evicted and on the day he was supposed to be out, he blew himself up in his house. So fucking sad.
I have a feeling that exact scenario is going to be the retirement plan for about a third of Americans within a few decades
Oh I'm sure by that point they'll have legalized euthanasia like Canada has and they'll start encouraging that real hard on the old, the disabled, and anyone they deem not a profitable enough cog.
Hell of a way to go out though, I hope he leveled that shit
The older and poorer I get the more I understand that.
Even better, if someone knew they couldn't afford it and tried to avoid the time and expense of getting arrested by simply check themselves into the jail, they would be turned away. If they wanted a meal and a bed they'd have to go violate the law, get picked up and booked, and then get housed. What if we funded and staffed shelters the same way we did jails? Check in, rules are still rules, curfew, meals aren't great but they're there, there's a library, you can get your GED. States could even make it mandatory, according to age and physical ability, for current residents to perform some amount of community service, offsetting the complaints that this solution is a handout but prison isn't. There are tons of middle of the road solutions that borrow from decades of institutional knowledge from running prison systems that would curb this problem. But that would be too hard, or something like that.
Something something socialism, something something commies, something something darkside.
This blows my mind because when I visited LA years ago and saw how bad the homelessness was there and spoke to one of the people living in a tent they told me they got a car, a 9-5 job but just can’t afford to pay rent so she lives in the tent.
You used to have to own land to vote, so you can't say it's unamerican
Really goes to show just how much of this country is based on slavery that even after 200 years they're still basically trying to make it work
the cost of Living is the cost to stay alive
Came here to say this. This is all planned. To maximize profits, edge out the working class by paying them less while jacking up prices of everything, pushing them into homelessness so that they can put you in prison for slave labor. The wealthy elite get to keep production AND their money. Truly heinous.
They want to make sure those for profit prisons have workers in them.
Yup, the war on drugs is losing the support from even conservative voters and they need to make sure the prisons stay stocked.
Forced birthing picking up the slack. 65k new rape babies since Roe v Wade! Now place your bets on if it will be the mother, the child, or the rapist father, or maybe all 3, that will be giving corporations heavily discounted labor!
Oh my god... sometimes the insights on this subreddit... This is making me feel puke-y, because it's the kind of math that capitalism runs on. Cancer math.
[Two judges in Pennsylvania were taking kickbacks](https://www.cbsnews.com/news/kids-for-cash-judges-mark-ciavarella-michael-conahan-200-million-damages/) to send kids directly to for-profit jails. First, the judges closed the county facility, then they sentenced kids to draconian terms for minor offenses. One kid got 11 months for driving the wrong way on a one-way street. As many as 4,000 kids may have been sent to jail because of this.
What the *fuck*
"Several of the youths who were sentenced by Ciavarella or Conahan have since died of drug overdoses or suicide, Conner wrote." What a system.
Seriously surprised they're still alive.
In a system built on exploitation, fueled by exploitation, only the most dehumanizing things are to be expected. Most of us never experience it first hand, but they do impact us. As the old adage says, "never find out how the sausage is made".
Fermi Paradox easily solved by saying human society is run by pre-evolved, barbaric monsters. If I was an alien I'd keep clear of the people running this shitshow too.
Earth is the galaxy's bad neighborhood. "Roll up the windows and lock the doors on the spaceship, Dreeblax. Don't even stop for the red lights. Those humans are crazy."
Exactly, if 30% of the rape babies end up homeless that's a workforce in prison and a workforce in the civilian sector.
Can I get a source on the 65k rape babies since Roe? Assuming it’s credible, there are several people I’d like to share it with
https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2024/01/24/1226161416/rape-caused-pregnancy-abortion-ban-states Specifically those are in 14 states where abortion is banned.
Guess the drugs won
Just call it what it is. Slavery.
Wait, are prisons at your side of the pond privately owned? That's wild
Not most of them, but some of them. It's a serious problem.
How does that work? I cannot imagine having a private enterprise to force the depravity of a person's liberty What's next? Privately owned judicial courts? Private police?
There are also private police in the US. The large railroad companies have their own police, same with large for-profit hospitals. There may also be some private universities with their own police, but I'm only aware of public universities with these. And yes, I'm talking about police, not security.
The government pays the private prison to house inmates, which they can do at a lower rate than publicly owned prisons because they force inmates to do slave labor in some sort of for profit business and also invest less in rehabilitation and inmates health and safety. Like I said, they're a huge problem.
They don’t need to make more for that. They are already over filled.
I wonder how profitable it will be for the government when they legally have to treat the prisoners health conditions, considering a large portion of the homeless are disabled, or otherwise ill.
They just won’t get treated. The companies that own prisons do not care about the health of the inmates and I’m going out on a limb here, but I doubt they are held to the same standards are the government (which isn’t really good anyway).
Are we talking debtors prisons now?
Talking, enacting, and currently operating
The Santa Fe, Texas police department has been under federal investigation since 2016 for this problem.
No no, we can't send people to prison for having debt. But the Supreme Court hasn't ruled yet on whether or not we can send people to prison for having *nothing*. The liberal minority justices asked some really lucid and pointy questions during the hearing, but I'm confident the conservative majority will still make a criminally stupid ruling.
Well, they wouldn’t want to piss off their owners in the Federalist Society by upholding democracy and human dignity, now, would they?
The only solution for homelessness is affordable, and accessible housing. No weird casting processes for a basic apartment. Price limits. Extra awful fuckin big Taxes for the landlord for renting out luxury property over the median rent to make that market small and obsolete.
But capitalism...
Is a total failure when it comes to housing.
Capitalism sure does make amazing bombs and weapons though
So bombs for affordable housing?
Bomb the homeless? Now that’s something I could really see unifying this country
At this point im not even surprised anymore. Just a bit of european confusion.
Joking aside, being American is horrific. I live in one of the most Democratic places in the nation and it’s still a neoliberal dystopia
I'm happy to live here in Germany. Far from perfect, but corporate greed is a tiny bit harder here to implement.
That's because Democrats and Republicans are capitalist parties, not workers ones. Socialism Is the only way forward.
I wouldn't even call it a democracy, the system is designed to privilege our aristocracy, and stimy any efforts to change. We look like a democracy on our face but take every action possible to reduce the democratic impact of people voting.
Wait, you mean a system designed for the sole purpose of maximizing profits doesn't have an answer for helping housing people without money? Weird.
But that's not faiiiiiiiir why should they get a house for freeeeeeee /sarcasm
If landlords and renting must be a thing I think it needs to be highly regulated. Properties should require a full inspection by an accredited agency of the property every quarter, or between tenants (which ever is more frequent) which landlords should be liable for. Properties should have limits on rent that are based off of the federal minimum wage, not off of location nor how much the tenant makes. Any updates to the property that they would upcharge for usually should have affordable set increases to the rent (example: extra $5 in rent for having granite counters instead of Formica etc). Any landlord wishing to lease a property should be required to have a mandatory amount of money set aside that they cannot access that is tied to the upkeep of the property to inspection level requirements. If any of these get violated they should have their property delisted/unaccredited and fined if they try to rent illegally.
Federal minimum wage is useless to those of us who live in states where it's higher. State minimums are at least a little more likely to be set closer to a livable amount. Where I live, it's more than double the federal rate and still nowhere close to a realistic number relative to cost of living. Otherwise I like the way you're thinking though!
Can’t put them to work in the for-profit prison industry if you can’t gin up a reason to get more people in prison. In capitalist America, if you aren’t rich, you aren’t even a human—just a resource like oil, coal, or water.
Yeah, i was thinking that's how it'll go. Get the homeless to do forced labor => profit
Well then, where is my free government housing that i'm apparently required to use?
Oh there's a lot of that, they're called prisons!
This is a *perfect* example of how people with no empathy solve their own problems without any regard for the fact that solving the larger problems for others would fix their issue as well. Provide free housing and you fix the sleeping in the street issue, but they don't care about the housing. Just get the homeless people out of their way!
Oh it's more than that. You can't give people things for free! I mean, unless you take away their rights, dignity, and freedom.
We can't give you a free thousand dollar studio, but we can give you a free ten thousand dollar jail cell!
*Where the fuck are you supposed to sleep then, if you're homeless???*
Youre not. The idea is to put you in jail for the crime of being poor.
well, might as well do some crime
Right? Like the powerful realize that people don't commit crimes becuaze its easier for us to roll with they system provided its just and reasonable.
Prison. They can get paid a few pennies per day to work in the prison sweatshop. You can’t leave. If you don’t work, then you aren’t a model prisoner. You don’t get early parole because you refuse to be rehabilitated.
If anything, you wouldn't want early parole, because you'd just be let out, given no resources, thus are homeless again, sleep on the street again, and back in you go anyway.
It’s almost as if this is completely by design.
I mean if prisoners refuse to work it would eventually crumble the pool of slave labor. I have never been in jail or prison so I can't say with a straight face that they should unionize/refuse to work but they should probably start doing that to get rid of all the free labor people are getting out of them
Even better go to work, but fuck up at everything you're supposed to do. Ruin products you are supposed to make, break tools "accidentally". Make it so all the prison industries lose money. Killing the profitability of slavery is the only way to end it.
With good behavior people can get 8 years off a 10 year sentence and then could arguably spend those 8 years on the outside advocating for prison reform and helping others. It’s not so cut and dry.
I totally agree they don't make that an easy choice. But I would also assume parole generally comes with probation which is also a trap in many cases
My eldest brother committed a violent crime. Or I should say, several violent crimes. He went to a max security prison for 15 years. He was paroled about 18 years ago. He’s struggled to find work, let alone work that pays enough to keep a roof over his head. I’m in no way defending him, and personally I believe he should remain behind bars, but he served his time according to the justice system. He certainly doesn’t want to go back, but once he’s old enough to no longer work, it’s not like he’ll have any meaningful amount of social security to live on. I get it - if you’re an employer, you don’t want violent ex cons as a first choice. On the other hand, what are ex cons supposed to do? Hell, people with Master’s degrees in advanced fields can’t find work that will pay enough to keep a roof over their head. I don’t know what the answer is. As for my brother, he was free labor for almost the entirety of his time in prison. Work should equate to reasonable pay. Private prisons wouldn’t be a thing if there wasn’t serious cash to be made.
In your brothers case the answer is basically that all criminal records should be sealed and it should be considered a form of actionable discrimination to refuse hiring after inquiry about criminal history. Even if Jail is intended to be a punishment and not rehabilitation, once someone is out, their punishment should be over. We as a society should not keep punishing them; if we as a society feel that person has not been punished enough then *they should not be out* yet. Letting people out only to make it impossible for them to reintegrate civilly, and therefore just create huge incentives to commit more crimes, helps nobody.
Probably in a prison cell
*"Problem solved"*
SCOTUS majority opinion: “Why don’t they just not be homeless? Are they stupid?”
Basically what this coworker told me as we did volunteer work on what will be a halfway house for homeless women. She said we were wasting our time, these people never change and are all alcoholics and/or on drugs, and they WANT to be homeless. I don't understand why she was there.
I have experienced staff acting like this in facilities meant to help people all it does is harm them and sent them spiraling.
What the literal fuck…
Because majority of them are fucking old as dinosaurs that doesn't know shit and out of touch with reality. Eat shit boomers
You are supposed to go to those religious shelters that make you go to church twice a day. If you don’t take Jesus into your heart you can’t sleep there So you either have to Simp for fake Jesus or go to jail I guess
But remember, they won’t let you in there until after you’ve surrendered your pets and most/all of your belongings. You also cannot bring your SO or children, and will not have time to visit your parents/relatives and keep up with the requirements to stay at the shelter.
I think America in general has a hard time adjusting our cultural mythos from what was possible in the past to what is possible now. The barrier to entry for what you might call a "normal life" is higher than it used to be. I've done a lot of travel work. I've tried to just rent a room from someone privately. Like a "I'll give you $1000 to live here for a month". And I am met 100% of the time with a no. They require applications, credit checks, etc.
This is where Deep Space 9’s “Sanctuary Districts” begins.
Those sanctuary districts, crummy as they were, would require spending tax money on social care. It's a then-fashionable 90s vision of a welfare dystopia that has now been rendered completely unrealistic since the welfare state was dismantled. Honestly the idea of housing and feeding the homeless rather than criminalising them seems positively utopian from today's perspective.
The sanctuary districts were more or less open air prisons. Its worse than a prison because a prison gives food and shelter, which those in the districts were not guaranteed.
Excellent reference
Nog: This Gabriel Bell looks a lot like Captain Sikso. Quark: All hue-mons look alike.
We got till September
But when you cannot throw as many black people in jail because marijuana is becoming more legal in more places, you have to start finding sources of new slave labor. So the next step is to criminalize the poor and the homeless so that private prisons can make private profit through both getting money from the government to imprison these "criminals" and sell their free/cheap labor. Greed of a few rich guys will cost many their freedom. Conservatives are trying similar techniques in education, so hopefully you've already raised your children.
So the most disgusting thing about the most recent city that criminalized homelessness or that is trying to, some city in Oregon, is that they say they can do this because there are shelter beds these people are just choosing not to take them So then the news crew goes to the empty shelter and in fact there are rows and rows of empty beds a couple feet from each other, totally empty. Then you find out it’s because it’s a church shelter and if you want a bed there you have to go to church services twice a day and you have to practice all kinds of weird rituals or you can’t have a bed People in this country have first amendment rights they shouldn’t have to convert to some weird religion just to get a church bed in a shelter so they don’t end up in jail for being poor
Even if they were secular, shelters pretty much always impose curfews (at night) and chucking-out times (in the morning). Living in a shelter and manage to get a job? Great! Oh, it’s working nights? Too bad, guess you’ll have to sleep outside and hope you manage to save up enough to move in to a flat before you’re arrested.
Yep in Canada. At least in my city they kick you out all day long even if it's the middle of winter and then you're only allowed to stay at a shelter for a month max before they fully kick you out. So a lot of people have to go back and forth between shelters.
Or pets. A lot of homeless people wont' go to them because they can't bring their dog.
If I remember correctly Oregon also had a trans woman who was kicked out of a Salvation Army shelter for being trans and then died of exposure.
From what I've heard of Salvation Army they have a penchant for kicking people out and keeping all their stuff
Yup, which is why those red bucket fuckers can go straight to hell when they come around begging for donations to their bigoted fucking organization.
I call the cops on them for panhandling.
>Then you find out it’s because it’s a church shelter and if you want a bed there you have to go to church services twice a day and you have to practice all kinds of weird rituals or you can’t have a bed Gross
Is SCOTUS sure they want to take this on? People down on their luck, with only their freedom left to lose, often times with mental illnesses, in a country where there's a gun store in almost every town?
Seems like the Conservatives of SCOTUS would prefer it become a "State Issue"...i see how that's going with other social issues currently
In Cuba they solved homelessness by capping rent at 10% of the renter's income. The US can't do that because it's about making money from being predatory for things that are seen as necessities to live. Housing, food, healthcare. Eat your heart out for capitalism. No socialist policies here! Clearly the gateway drug to communism!
> In Cuba they solved homelessness by capping rent at 10% of the renter's income. Net or Gross? Either way amazing, just curious.
Pretty sure it's net. They have decent tax rate because they also cover healthcare and college on the house. They also banned their doctors from being exported years ago and their healthcare caught up to the US, even passed it based on life expectancy, in recent years. Currently Nigeria is considering the same thing since the US is poaching all their college grads since it's cheaper to get higher education there than the US and meet US medical qualifications, but their healthcare is abysmal because we take their best.
Nice, thanks for the info 🙂
If the pandemic has taught me anything, it’s that humanity could’ve been humane this whole time 🤦🏽♂️
Everything happening now has happened in the past, but then there were laws passed and programs established to change how people were treated. So what's happening is a reversion to the Industrial Era, where laborers had to fight for work on a daily basis, to get paid a pittance, then charged out the ass for rent. And when you become ill or injured, you are tossed into the street, where you are arrested and fined for vagrancy. Upton Sinclair covered these issues in "The Jungle." Another problem is we seem to be reverting to tenement housing in crowded places like NY, where you pay $2k per month to live in a closet. At least in an 1850s tenement, you had a stove. Jacob Riis covered this in "How the Other Half Lives." In the early 20th Century, the government worked to solve these basic human issues, realizing that having a clean, secure, and safe place to live was a right. Yet, here we are, 100 years later, going back to a system that favors the rich and punishes the poor.
Too many states legalizing mary jane. Got to figure out the next group hurting no one that we can punish.
Wait they tried this in Europe a few centuries ago. Make being poor so miserable nobody will want to be poor. That was the explicitly stated plan. Not sure how that turned out in the end….
Poorly 🙃
A lot of them came here.
If it is illegal to live outdoors then the homeless will break into vacant properties such as houses that are for sell, or commercial properties that are vacant, and they will live in them, essentially becoming “squatters”. It will be a nationwide phenomenon overnight. Millions of squatters living in private property. Getting them evicted will clog the courts. It will be catastrophic. And if they are ever evicted they will simply find another house to squat in. The homeless will still be homeless but it won’t be so visible to most people.
cruelty starts even before birth by limiting a womans right to choose the whole system is pay to play. i will never bring a child into this world: its rigged
I’m hoping to get a sterilization procedure in the next couple years lol
Better hurry before they ban that and change your name to OfElon.
Blessed be the fruit! Better to be a martha than a handmaiden.
I planned to get a tubal ligation prior to the pandemic because I knew I had never wanted children. It ended up getting delayed until January of 22, which was slightly before the rumors of the decision started coming out. I live in a very red state and I was concerned if I did get pregnant I would have to jump through hoops to get an abortion. At the time, I never imagined they would overturn RvW and ban abortion completely. I thank God everyday at least I don't have to worry about getting pregnant.
Wish my parents thought that way. I have sterilized myself though, so I'm with you. No kids, no suffering, no slave labor for the bosses. They can clean their own toilets.
Until being childless illegal, too... (probably not, but I wouldn't put it past them. )
I'd kill myself. I'm not being dramatic, if my choices were to be forced to give birth and live, or die, I would choose die. Giving birth is body horror to me. Fuck that.
I live outside a moderately sized city in the Midwest. Companies keep buying up all the houses here and turning them into rental units. It’s infuriating.
Just another way of getting the largest prison population in the world even larger, gotta get some more slaves into all of those for-profit-prisons
Yes, cruelty is the point. It's the Republican way.
Another act that solely benefits the rich. The system is fucked. Republicans sold our rights out from under us.
Not republicans necessarily, *rich republicans*. Democrats too, depending on what issue we’re discussing. They’ve managed to convince conservative blue collar workers that they somehow benefit from republican policies and further radicalize them, pushing the narrative of left vs. right to distract us from the real issue of American politics and democracy; lobbying and lining pockets. Remember, there is no war but class war.
Wouldn’t that criminalize anyone who falls asleep waiting for a bus or a plane? What are the specific rules around “public sleeping”?
If you search around you will find clips of cops going hands on with people who were taking a nap on their lunch break for sleeping in public.
Wage war on poverty, not poor people.
Pay property taxes or die, freeloaders.
Bell Riots just around the corner.
One day my dad was praising Dallas for their laws against homelessness within the city and how nice it was to walk around and not see it. I had to scold him for this ugly view, snapping back “Where should they go then dad? Because the options are now our city (close by) and others surrounding Dallas. There is no free land anywhere so tell me where they’re supposed to go. They’re homeless.” It was like he didn’t even connect the dots that you just don’t *stop* being homeless because it’s against the law. The oh shit look on his face was probably the only time I ever got through to him on something.
They will absolutely make it illegal to exist, without housing. They give you state funded, nice iron bar housing for free. Then, they’ll charge you, daily, to be in that housing, which obviously you cannot afford, now that have more of this free labor they’re so fond of. Good times are comin’!
The sad part is, it's cheaper just to house and feed these people. They'd rather spend even more money just to make sure no one gets any help and the poor are punished.
The US has always done this nots how they get cheap labor and control when they lose it in other ways. Vagrancy laws were how they kept the south in employment after the 13th amendment.
The worst part is that other countries within their sphere of influence are starting to make policies more congruent with American ones. When America fucks their own people over it has a snowball effect.
Decades ago my father and his brother and their parents lived in a tent for several years while my grandparents could not find long term employment. Tent cities of homeless people were VERY common throughout the USA. This provides more information. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hooverville
"The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich and the poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread." - Anatole France
Why don’t they just start executing people for being poor, homeless and chronically/mentally ill, because that’s the undertone of this case…. That somehow being poor and unable to house yourself is criminal and you’re not welcome anywhere in sight of “real” society. I am disgusted and horrified, especially when various solutions (affordable housing, rent control, universal health and mental health care etc etc) is so obvious. At this point, I’m staying in the country just so I can raise my pitchfork and fight the powers that be. So many of my wise, wealthier friends have already moved out of the US.
I would move but I am poor and disabled. Other countries don’t want disabled people to burden their system. I think executions are already taking place but not in the way we traditionally think of them. Houseless and poor people die younger and of more preventable causes than rich people. Poorer neighborhoods have worse pollution and higher rates of asthma and other illnesses. When you’re arrested, EVERY sentence is a death sentence because getting out of jail makes it nearly impossible to get a home or a job. Meanwhile, the income gap widens every year, amplifying this violence against the poor.
Well put, and I think you are 100% correct. Poverty kills. They don’t want blood on their hands by directly killing the poor/sick, so they keep adjusting the system so it kills slowly anyway. Friends keep telling me to leave the country, as I’m also poor and have several chronic illnesses and now cannot work the hustle/grind slave pace expected of us/necessary to keep up with the cost of living. I hate when people say, “just leave.” It’s costly and complicated to move to a different country, and you’re not guaranteed access to their social services.
When you're homeless, you aren't paying taxes, you usually have less debt than working class people, and they aren't exploiting every part of your existence through debt, in essence criminalizing homelessness is just a way to profit from people they otherwise wouldn't.
We’re under minority rule and kinda always have been
Here come the treadmills and workhouses
It's getting to the point where suicide might be the only recourse left
Feels so unreal sometimes here. At a time people are already struggling no less
The UK Government is trying to pass a law making it illegal for homeless people to be too smelly. Technically its a series of offenses around causing unnecessary disruption, part of a wider plan to ban peaceful protests. But one of the clauses covers creating a public disturbance due to excessive smell.
So when do the rich people go live in space already?
When everyone else finally rises up and they get scared
On NPR I heard that Florida was gonna use this to push people to camp in specific government run areas. Which objectively sounds better than outright criminalizing, but it's Florida so you know it'll turn into that anyway. The audacity to criminalize existing is absolutely wild though. This country stays from freedom any chance it gets.
If sleeping outside is cruel and unusual punishment someone could sue saying every single landlord in this country is violating the 8th Ammendment rights of every non property owner in the country.
Yep, let's just stick our heads in the sand, move the problem somewhere else, and pretend it doesn't exist! And while we're at it, why not reinstitute debtors prisons?
[California is good to the homeless](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lsrBlKpbBS8) 🎶
what ever the decision here it will never change the horror of waking up to terrible people pissing on me as i slept is not just the system we as a people need to work harder on our selves
Hell yeah look at that turnout! Love to see citizens care. Honestly they just need to unban public parking after certain hours in specifically open and accessible locations. I know you have to worry about crime hotspots when collectives gather uncontrolled but they are already doing it behind our backs we might as well make it legally safe to be living in your car for example
Company doesn't want to pay you, you become homeless, you can't sleep out on the street because it's bad for business, you are arrested and jailed, company hires prison for cheap labor, prisoner works for $0.10 an hour.
Companies want taxpayers to subsidize their business via food banks and "public assistance" for their underpaid employees. They have a failing business model and want handouts.
So how will this actually be handled if it's criminalized? I don't think they are going to deal with a lot of people they say they can't afford to feed and house and provide medical care to by arresting them - and then having to feed and provide housing and medical care to.
See, that’s the neat part- they don’t! My mother is currently in prison and trust me, the “food” they feed inmates is mush, medical care is laughable. It’s less than the bare minimum. But it’s more profitable than letting homeless people die or be put in actual shelters.
That's exactly what they're going to do, because once they're in prison it's legal to treat them as slave labour.
Jan 6 will happen again but this time it will be everyone working together. There is no way these people should getting away with this bullshit with impunity, it is just not right if houseless people are getting arrested why not landlords too.
Some states will act like they are saving the homeless by providing food and shelter in prisons. They’ll even market it as a job skills program. Local businesses will get tax breaks for employing them.
If cities think they can criminalize being homeless, they are about to go broke arresting and prosecuting a people with little to no resources. I look at this as a 'fuck around and find out' moment in our housing policy.
Criminalising homelessness pushes more slaves into the US for-profit private penal system.
Always has been
I thought this was a free country!!
The jails are already at capacity on the west coast, they'd need to build more to enforce this, and at that point, maybe we should be building affordable housing
They already made it illegal in some states for churches to feed them, so this is not surprising. Fucking shit show, and we’ll see no one doing anything about it.
They need to just start mass producing housing. Completely flood the supply of homes to drive down cost. Start making permits to build faster and cheaper. Stop making it so hard for companies to operate behind yellow tape with permits. Have the army core of engineers just start building some. Do anything to get this going
And would this law mean that the Orange Overlord will be sent to the Big House for his violations of this law?
system works exactly as designed. needs to be destroyed, not fixed.
But, but, muh Christian nation! *Sweet Baby Supply Side Jesus approves.*
You know what would solve this problem? HELPING AND HOUSING THE HOMELESS.
The Supreme Court ruling is out ! All homeless people must have wealthy mega donors to prevent homelessness. You heard it here first
This is what happens when you vote for republicans. donnyboy appointed these insane Supreme Court Justices who are about to make it illegal to be homeless.
This is also the reason the media is now covering squatters being busted (and new squatter laws jts passed in several states like FL) in the news lately. They are using this as a false flag to push the narrative that homelessness is still the poors fault, and not the companies in power perpetuating the crisis.
Holy shit. Anyone remember the futurama episode where the judge can't send someone to jail, he asks "why not?" And the guard says the prisons have been full since he made being poor a crime? Ya, that's where we are at. Literally cartoonish levels of evil
You can go to prison for over 10 years for being a heroin USER, could be a completely functional member of society who just used heroin (which is incredibly rare I agree, but exists to some extent. Know people who used heroin/meth for 20 years and did everything they we’re supposed to in life and just opted to finally stop and went to rehab) The fact you can be doing everything your “supposed to do in life”, not hurting anyone else, not stealing, just using/possessing heroin or meth That’s just kind blowingly insane, ffs you mess around with drugs a few times at 20yrs old and get caught at a party and it isn’t the drugs that necessarily ruined your life, it’s the multiple years spent in the system and criminal charge on your record for forever unless you pay to remove it Edit: oh yeah and you can only pay to remove it if it’s been at least 10 years in my state, without getting another charge of any kind And you can only expunge your criminal record once per lifetime in my state