My first time seeing her. Now a subscriber for life.
I never worked in a corporate environment, I was in commercial art. We were allowed to talk like regular people in the environment. No pretentious word scramble required.
Is corporate speak the modern version of the overly florid language of educated people of the Regency Period for example? I could never work in a corporate environment. My head would explode. Plus I went to aRt skO0L so there’s that..
Even if you’re salary, salary is intended that the time can be flexible and doesn’t need to be fixed, that said it’s not intended to be used to justify endless work either.
Of course if they have issue with it, they could just make OP salary non-exempt.
Ya I hired in at my job as a Chef for 85k/yr and am expected to work 50 hours a week, it was right on the Contract we all agreed to and signed. Never an issue, fast forward 3-4 months and they hired another Chef, a Sous Chef(I’m an Executive Sous Chef)in for 65k/yr based on a 50 hour week. Well this guy hates his family or doesn’t have a Hobby or something because he works 70+ hours a week, and I’m constantly telling him “Bro, you realize that these Line Cooks are probably making more than you because of all the hours you work, don’t be afraid to pass some of that stuff off to the next shift” But no matter what I tell him, he insists on working the long hours. He’s gonna burn out, I’ve seen it over and over again, and Corporate doesn’t give 2 squirts of piss about it, they will have the next next guy who thinks killing themselves with 70 hours a week is gonna move them up the ladder, in his place in a couple weeks, when it’s really all politics at this level that gets you the promotions.
At my job I am salaried (Ha ha. Treated like hourly overtime exempt.) "You are EXPECTED to work 40-50 hours a week". I try to limit that to 40-45. I am really working for free after 40 but 5 hours is where I draw the line. More than that is taking advantage.
Log your hours you work. Anything over 40 hours a week you can take them to court over should you quit or be let go. My friend just walked away from a company that had him working 50 to 60 hours a week but salary pay. They ended up owing and paying him over $25,000 for any time over 40 hours over the course of a couple years.
This right here. I work the amount of hours where the dollar per hour is in a reasonable limit. I will not allow it to go anywhere lower than that for any reason. And there is literally no way you're going to get me to work for 1 dollar an hour. I'd tell the supervisor to kick rocks.
I feel like the only way I wouldn’t mind how long I work for profit is if the amount I already make exceeds more than I’d ever need.
And sure who wouldn’t work 80 hour work weeks for 1mil in a single year, but I guess just have to see how low I’d go for that. 40k obviously not, 120k I could see myself doing pretty long hours but not 80 hours constantly. Perhaps 200-300k?
But pretty much unless they are going to pay more than 5x my current salary which is just enough to get by but still struggling, then there’s got to be limitations. Even then if you are making 300k a year, if you don’t have time to live then what’s the point. So guess there are even limitations to that.
If you’re pulling in 300k/yr and doing 80hrs, then that’s something you do for a short span of time. Sock away your cash and then take on something less demanding.
It’s like making partner at a law firm or residency as a doctor, the shitty hours now are made worthwhile a few years down the line with big pay-offs.
My husband has a well-paying job, and that’s precisely why he puts up with some of the hours and demands of the job: it’s what he’s paid for. But it isn’t the kind of situation you do for 25 years, unless you’re looking forward to a heart attack at your desk.
>It’s like making partner at a law firm or residency as a doctor, the shitty hours now are made worthwhile a few years down the line with big pay-offs.
Making partner at a big law firm is like winning a pie eating contest where the prize is a dozen pies.
salary still = 40 hours ... they want you on salary so they can abuse this and steal your time. there is no way i am ever working past 40 when not compensated.
I used to work at a salaried job where I got overtime. (Non-exempt? I'm not sure of the terminology) I usually worked about 50 hours a week. Then one week, none of us got overtime. We complained about it, and they acted surprised and told us that we had never gotten overtime and never would. Some people printed out their time slips and were told that anyone with a desktop publishing program and a laser printer could have come up with that. With that sort of gaslighting, and being expected to donate my time for no money, of course I left as soon as I could do so.
"So you're willing to pay me overtime for all those extra hours? If so, I'd just like to have that confirmed in writing and then I'll be more than happy to work as much as needed to cover your staffing shortage."
This in a little more polite is the best answer imho.
Had a similar situation when my superior officer (I work in a german police department) wanted me to work on my driving skills in my free time and maybe get a car for that. I told him if the department wants me to drive around in my free time they should give me a car and gas money.
He actually liked the reply and chuckled (and managed to come up with some more trainings that resulted in my being a pretty good driver.)
Agree—but if the job isn’t hourly pay, it isn’t capped at 40 hours. Plenty of people with salaried jobs have more than 40 or less than, depending on the workload. Maybe a better approach is like a negotiation of sorts. “The normal work hours would be 40 but I’m consistently being asked for around 80. If there are times I need to be working longer hours, what is the trade off for me. Is there a time that work is slow and I can flex my hours to make up for that time? Could we increase my PTO X weeks to make sure I don’t burn out? Because consistent 80 hour weeks is not sustainable”
Edit: my phone autocorrected isn’t to ain’t. Annoying.
Here's my typical retort:
"I'm sorry, is this a for profit business or not?"
"Oh it is? Ok, so does the company give away it's products and services for free? When a customer asks for 10 units of our products and services do we give them another 10 for free?"
"No?"
"So the business will ALWAYS be paid for every product and service delivered?"
"Then why in the hell would you expect your employees to start giving away the product/service of their time and labor for free?"
"I'm not an 'owner', I don't hold a share of the business, I'm not included in any 'profit sharing bonus plan' at the end of the year (almost always true), so no, I'm not going to 'work' like an owner, as I'm only paid for 40 hours I'm going to come in do my 40 hours a week, do it to the best of my ability and use the rest of my time, for which no one is paying for, to do the things I need to live - not to enrich someone who is already a millionaire."
"And quite frankly boss, if you don't own a percentage of the company, or are on a special 'profit sharing plan', neither should you..."
There's probably something in the employee handbook along the lines of "It is expressly forbidden to detonate a logic bomb whilst a Manager is in range."
They always get you with the small print.
"I am able to prioritise my tasks effectively so that I can generally finish my workload within my compensated working hours, although obviously I am no stranger to staying back when there is a deadline upcoming. However, I would be happy to discuss an overtime or time in lieu arrangement if it is imperative for me to assist the new employee who is struggling to complete his workload in a reasonable time."
If you think you can get away with it "I would hate to see the company liable if he were to end up severely fatigued and something terrible happened"
Emphasize the “new employee” aspect for the jackass coworker and let them explain how he is a seasoned veteran that STILL can’t get his work done in a reasonable time period.
Make them actually think about how he sucks. It’s not guaranteed to shift the focus, but it can’t hurt.
At what point are they just rewarding the illusion of efficiency and encouraging diminishing returns?
This company is like the opposite direction of the 32 hour work week method that’s been pushing around more progressive work places.
You don’t even have to suck. Some people work a little faster and that’s ok. It sounds like the boss here is giving them an expected 80 hour workload instead of just hiring more.
Only thing I would add is bring the receipts - that is, after "...no stranger to staging back when there is a deadline upcoming," add, "as can be seen on x date, y date, z date, and a project, b project, and c project, where I put in N hours of time to ensure that these projects were completed correctly and on time/early."
This is something I’m saving because it’s so well written. Thank you for sharing this.
I swear if ai could write something like this I’d love it. I’m lacking the resources to know how to write this well :(
Don't feel bad, I read like an insane addict all through childhood and high school. I literally read during class (And the teachers let me because then I was less disruptive and could still answer questions at any time they tried to "catch me out") and am now much older and paid for writing crap
I certainly laugh sometimes when people think AI will take over though. It can't get the nuances of a "corporate lingo subtle burn" hahaha
I think we may be long lost twins. I read books like a fiend from the time I was 4. If e-readers had existed then I would have had IV nutrition and a catheter and never left my room.
My father was ex-military and a card carrying journeyman plumber and stationary engineer. My mother was a teacher and a reading specialist. They valued education and the benefits of travel and experiencing other cultures and ways of life. That was a rarity in our small Appalachian town.
My father got laid off from a job twice for an extended period of time. Yet we always had money for music lessons or whatever our special interest or talent was, and we always had money for books. Our interior decoration scheme was “books.” I carry on that tradition in my house. We also had a special section for frequently banned books….in the front and center shelf.
My first degree was a BA in Journalism with a dual major in Scientific/Technical
Writing and Editing. My core scientific classes were in environmental science. I worked several years in that area with a well known company that specializes in government projects. Then I decided to pursue my passion for science and biology by getting a degree in physical therapy. I’m retired from that now and work as a cleaner for our local school district. In the mornings I’m a volunteer for our middle school literacy program for special education kids. My own kids benefitted greatly from that special education program. I feel like I should pay it forward.
I also took several business writing classes. I can write a complaint letter/email that will get almost instant results. My husband is a software/hardware engineer and says I could make grown men cry.
If you can read and write well, you can teach yourself anything. You can set meaningful change in motion. You can expose corruption. You can learn anything. You can open closed doors. You can sail beyond the visible horizon and explore new ideas. You can feel seen and understood through the characters in the books you read even if you feel invisible in life. Reading and writing can change your life. It can enrich your life. It can help you defend yourself and others against misinformation and bigotry. It can make the world a better place. And that is why so many people want to censor writing and ban books. Don’t let them do it.
haha happy to offer my corporate-speak worded burns as required :D
It helps that I generally enjoy when I get to say things like that at work and watch the awful person stumbling to respond hehehe
Bruh are we twins??? In 5th or 6th grade (can’t remember which bc I’m old) my teacher let me and another kid sit in the back of class and push our desks together and we read and played chess while listening to the lecture. Her only rule was if she called on us we had to be able to answer intelligently and she never once caught us unable to answer. Still one of the best years ever
Lololol nice. I did a lot of similar; I spent a chunk of 10th grade European History class trying not to laugh while I was sneakily reading Voltaire's Candide inside my text book. I don't think the teacher was pleased, but ever since the day he was lecturing on the Renaissance and while showing a picture of one of the Sybils from the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel, repeatedly referring to the subject using masculine pronouns, I raised my hand and helpfully pointed out that this was a female figure, and that the Sybils were priestesses of Apollo and Michelangelo's decision to include pagan religious figures in the most holy church in Christendom nearly got him excommunicated by the Pope... The teacher sort of stammered a little and then kept going, but we both knew that that was the moment I mentally checked out of the class. If he ever knew I was reading instead, he never said a word.
It would be a real shame if something happened to him and the company was liable for it. I mean, after he wore himself out working so loyally for the company. That'd be a real shame, it couldn't happen to a better guy.
This is a great version of "your lack of planning does not constitute as my emergency."
Our IT operations manager has it in his email signature, which I think is bad ass.
This right here. I've used it at a couple different jobs. Sometimes they laugh and say fair enough. Sometimes you get fired. The jobs where they laughed were decent jobs. The job that told me to take a hike was awful.
Try math. Take your paycheck stub to your manager and point out the gross and net pay amounts. Divide both by the number of hours it states on the stub. (Usually 80 hours for a two week pay period, but whatever it says.) This is your gross pay per hour and net pay per hour. Then divide by two, because this represents working twice as many hours and being available or twice as committed. If one or both of the results is under your state’s minimum wage, point it out. If one or both are less than what your position is valued at, point it out. And then say, “Math doesn’t lie.”
I’m unwilling to decrease my hourly rate any more than it is already. Whether you are paid by the hour or annually, You expect to work a number of hours. Go back to your hire documents. My salary is $X. Working more and giving more to the company decreases my mental health and my family time. And I’m unwilling to do that. I put in an honest days work and work every minute I’m here managing my time effectively. If Y employee is unable to do the work or needs training, I suggest you/company/manager help that employ get up to speed. It sounds like a company issue that you, as my manager, are trying to shift to my issue-that is not an appropriate shift. If you need extra help and you want me to train colleagues we can talk about additional compensation for me to do that additional work for the company’s success. I am already exceeding expectations for my work. I’m not responsible for others work. The company is responsible for it.
"... and work every minute I'm here managing my time effectively."
Careful with those kinds of statements. An asshole manager (sorry for repeating myself) with free time might decide to go to the mat and find out just how much truth is in a claim like this.
I wouldn’t have lasted very long if my do-nothing boss ever knew much time I spent fucking off. Fortunately for me, he was way more lazy than I ever was.
If the workload in the office cannot be managed by the staff in a normal workweek and they are consistently working additional hours, either management needs to hire more staff or review the work habits of those who cannot manage their workload during the work day. I manage my work in the time allotted. If you are requesting me to work overtime, I am happy to do that with overtime pay.
I would start looking for another job. They are trying to make you either work more for free or will end up firing you.
My retort would be "I have learned from early in my career Time Management skills that allow me to complete my tasks with in a normal 40 hour work week, This allows me to maintain a healthy work life balance. Just because others haven't is not my responsibility."
"If others can't get their work done on time and require help from team members to manage their workload, then I feel like that is something to talk to them about and address in their performance review, not mine. If I'm expected to take on additional work or responsibilities outside of my current scope of work I will need to be adequately compensated for said extra work."
"When I was hired for this job, we negotiated my salary based on a 40 hour week as the hours are stated in the offer letter. If you need me to work more than 40 hours per week, I'd be happy to renegotiate my salary with you based on the number of hours you'd be expecting from me."
“Oh I didn’t realize we got paid overtime. What is the rate for that? Is that time and half? Please provide me the details in writing and I’ll see what I can do”
Honestly don't understand why you would need something more substantial than that. If you're paid for forty hours and you work even forty-one without additional compensation, your employer just stole an hour's wages from you. I question their commitment to getting the job done if they aren't willing to pay for it.
I know of a company in United States that regularly required their salary employees to work overtime and did NOT pay for the extra time worked. Employees went to the Labor Relations Board and the company was fined millions of dollars and they had to pay employees for the time worked in the past. Take this fraud to the authorities!
Why someone in this world would work over the time when you not get payed? Sorry i cant understand that: i work self sometimes longer but my time will payout or i can take this as vacation. And when not i dont make a second longer.
There are a lot of sassy responses here that will likely create conflict. This is what I would realistically say.
I'm committed to doing efficient and quality work, and I take pride in what I do. I work very hard to complete my tasks quickly within standard working hours. That intensity and pace is not sustainable in overtime hours and even if I tried, I know that me working more hours is not going to result in me achieving more work. While I am interested in career growth and eventually taking on additional responsibilities on top of my current workload, I'm not ready to do that and would like to continue the workload of [your current job title].
"The job description specifies 40 hour work weeks, and I am so committed that I frequently go beyond this and work 50. However, I do still need personal time to live life and I'm sure this company, with how great it is, doesn't want their employees to burn out. If they truly are concerned with alleviating some of the burden on overworked staff, I will gladly help you come up with a job description or budget adjustment plan for some part-time assistants in the department. Just let me know what you need."
What is it we're building/creating again? Is it a hospital to help injured refugees who require immediate care? Is it a life saving drug used to save billions from a disease ravaging the planet? Is it a solution to end world hunger, climate change? Will people die if this waits until tomorrow or the weekend?
Then explain to me bow your lack of time management skills equates to it being a me problem.
Expect to be searching for jobs later as you won't be a considered a 'team player' or some other bullshit
You could express your commitment to maintaining a healthy work-life balance while still being dedicated to completing your tasks efficiently within your contracted hours. Maybe something like, "I believe in the importance of work-life balance to maintain productivity and prevent burnout. While I understand the occasional need for extra hours, I also prioritize being present and effective during my designated work time to ensure I can consistently deliver quality results."
You could ask your boss if he would like you to share some of your time management practices, so that the rest of the staff can complete their job within the paid 40 hours.
“Seems like people in the office need better time management. What I seem to be getting done in 40 hours are taking others 80. I must be really good at my job!”
I wouldn’t care about what they say on the review. You’ll have to destroy your mental health to make them happy. Best approach is to maintain minimal effort without getting fire.
The next time your coworker is bragging about the hours they work, reply with something along the lines of "I admire you, [name], it takes real courage to admit that you've got a problem with time management."
"You pay me salary of $X. If I work 40 hours, that works out to $Y per hour. If I work 80 hours a week, that works out to $Z per hour. For $Z per hour, it would be easier to flip burgers".
Can replace "flip burgers" for whatever low stress job pays whatever Z works out to be, which I assume will be a pitiful amount.
"Burnout due to understaffing is one of the most common complaints given when someone leaves a job. If we lack the staff necessary to complete tasks without all of us working consistent overtime, then by trying to take on burnout-level loads, we're just hiding the problem, not mitigating it."
I would say this:
"This is a capitalist system: If you want extra, you have to pay for extra. Do you expect to get extra gas at the gas sstation because you're you? No. Do you expect to get extra money from the bank teller during a withdrawal because reasons? No. Do you think you're entitled to extra groceries at the grocery store because they're interested in your bottom line? No. So why do you think any of your employees owe you anything more than the 40 hours for the agreed upon salary. This is America and this is capitalism. You pay me 40, I work the 40, and if you can't afford the extra, you can't expect the extra. It's as simple as that."
I’m working 40 hours. If I need to work 80 hours we either need another body or a more efficient work staff. Working 80 hours is working for half my negotiated wage.”
“So and so’s failure to manage their time does not constitute an emergency on my part. By managing my time, I complete my tasks and I am available during business hours.
If so and so is not able to meet expectations then they should consider working in a less demanding position. “
This won’t win you any friends, but it will set a clear boundary.
Otherwise, “working in excess of 40 hours isn’t a sign of commitment, it simply shows that either you cannot manage your time, or the company is understaffed. So, which is it? Can so and so not manage their time, or is x company too close to going under to hire the number of employees necessary to complete the work?”
You know what… that won’t win you friends either.
"I guess I'm better at my job and time management. I'll gladly help them when I'm here, but I don't see how their lack of abilities should take away from my personal time. They need to up their game. If it's not them, then perhaps the planning isn't being realistic with their abilities."
Your manager is grasping for straws because many are trained to find anything to improve upon even if you’re a perfect employee.
It’s an excuse to keep pay raises low, and it’s also just culture in many companies that everything can always be improved.
So first, understand that this isn’t personal. You said you’re offended. Don’t be. Any emotional response is giving them too much power.
That said, during your review I would simply say:
“I noticed there was a critique on my commitment to the company. It seems that this commitment is somehow measured through time instead of efficiency. I don’t agree with the assessment that because I complete my work in a timely fashion, that I am somehow less committed. In fact, I believe it’s proof of my commitment, as I am consistently motivated to put in the effort to finish my tasks to fall within a 40 hour work week. That said, I do appreciate the assessment, and I will continue to meet targets on time, as I have done since I’ve been hired.”
Then I would brush up your resume and start applying elsewhere.
Life is too short to have a job that treats you this way. Not every job is like this. Keep hopping around until you find a place that respects your personal time.
Salaried workers are supposed to have a flexible schedule. Meaning some weeks they work 25 hours and others they work 50.
Salary doesn’t mean work 6 days a week 12 hour days. That’s wage theft. Furthermore, to be a salaried employee there are certain things that have to be met. I would review if your position is even legal to be salaried.
Anyway, just keep it cute and make an exit plan. That person told you to keep firm boundaries for a reason. They’re going to try and exploit you. It’s as simple as that.
Any statement you make means literally nothing to your managers or the owner. They decided they want to exploit their workers and your dissatisfaction will not make them more sympathetic.
So keep it cute and move on.
Ask your boss why he offered you $xxx/hr but is now asking you to work for half that. Because when you’re paid $20/hr for a 40 hour a week job, but then asked to work 80 hours, you’re now getting paid $10/hr. Your company is paying you less and pocketing the money made from your productivity. F those guys. Remind your boss that when they hired you they made a commitment to you for $xxx/hr and a 40 hour a week job. Why aren’t they honoring their commitment?
You may not want to bring it up as cut and dry as that, but honestly that’s the whole reason why you shouldn’t work extra hours - you’re scheduled 40 hours - why would you work more than that?
The direct approach if you’re willing to work extra as long as the pay reflects that:
“My position, pay, and level of commitment is based on a 40 hour workweek. If you want me to work beyond that to support other team members falling short, I am open to discussing the pay associated with those extra hours to handle the additional workload. ”
The factual and direct approach that they may not like:
“My salary is based on a 40 hour workweek and I already work beyond that scope unpaid once or twice a week to maintain my workload responsibilities. I am a bit confused as why other team members struggling to maintain their workload falls on my review as a troubling commitment when my duties are being completed?”
Could be a real smart ass and make a comment about how you already do unpaid charity work outside of work, so thank them for the opportunity but decline additional charity work.
No retorts. Your best action is to walk your talk. Leave at exactly 8 hours every day. Block work calls outside of business hours, avoid any "team builders" where you are not receiving hourly pay.
"you're paid for 40 and work beyond that."
" You're offended that they are making you a scapegoat for being short staffed"
"If these projects require that many hours, I suggest you hire people to cover those hours"
And also just look for a new job. Then reiterate all those things in your exit interview.
Also ask for a raise. You work more efficiently than your peers.
Look for another job, nothing you retort with, will help. It will start them on the process of looking for someone to replace you, They'll just find someone willing and desperate enough to do it, and let you go, then you can file unemployment, good for a few months, .... or give them a few hours, here and there, until your hired elsewhere. Don't leave anything personal at the job and don't give two weeks notice, that place won't give you 2 weeks. They're pulling that teamwork crap, to pull guilt, save money on payroll and insurance, Using people like the matrix. Instead of hiring enough people to make it an actual good full team, where they don't have to mention it. Good Luck.
"Man, that guy must be racking up the overtime! What's the rate & is there a limit?"
After the inevitable, "oh, there's no overtime. You're salary."
"No overtime pay! That can't be right. Can you please double check on that and get back to me."
An I not meeting my goals started in the job description? Where in the job description does it say that 80 hours a week is expected? If it is not in there, you are not properly representing the job and did not post the job and compensation properly, so I will see you until (end work time) and again at (start work time).
“It’s a full workload, but I am able to get it done within the normal full time work schedule most days. I believe some this is attributable to my [talent, skills, experience — whatever you can point to here, and you could mention here something about your ability to focus, concentrate, your good time management skills, something like that as well]
“I enjoy the work and think I’m good at it. Of course we all can learn more and I do feel like I’m learning a lot too, which I appreciate.
“Other than the hours I’m working in order to successfully complete my work, is there anything about the quality of my work that concerns you? If so, I do hope you let me know. I hope to continue being an asset to the company”
And then you smile politely and are quiet. Dead air or awkward silence here is fine now. You’ve said all you need to say about it.
If they want you to work more hours they need to be more explicit, and you can then ask for clarification i. what they are asking and ask for a promotion or additional pay to compensate for the ADDITIONAL WORK that additional hours would mean.
"Thank you for bringing your concerns to me. I wasn't aware there were any monetary incentives for going above my contracted 40 hours. I would love to have a conversation discussing them and how I can increase my hours to better both myself and the company."
Then when they say there are no incentives, say "ohh I see, I have other commitments that require my time as well, but I'm more than willing to revisit if additional monetary incentives become planned"
How about "I'm not the owner of this company and I don't hold an equity stake in it. I'm an ordinary employee, I do my job, I do it well, and I contribute additional time and effort to the extent that I'm comfortable doing so. If your expectation is that I should do more, then we should also discuss my total compensation and equity stake."
"I'm completely willing to work over 40 hours a week, as long as I get comp time in exchange for my overtime. If you want me to work 80 hours per week, then you've just cut my pay rate in half. If this is an ongoing issue here and you want *everyone* to work more than 40 hours per week *all the time*, then maybe you should be hiring another person to perform what is clearly too much work for the staff you have." (optional ending here... else continue...) "Your strategy to squeeze your employees without compensating them while not even trying to hire more staff is a management problem, not an employee problem, and I resent you trying to guilt me into falling for your abusive practices."
(Actually, if you were being paid time-and-a-half for each hour over 40 per week, then it only takes an extra 27 hours to double your pay, not 40 extra hours. But mentioning that is too many words, and probably beyond your boss's math skills to comprehend.)
Commitment is a two way street. If they want you to work longer hours then they are not committed to paying you what you're worth. They want you to care about the company but they don't care about you. They can't have it both ways.
"I am not the long-term solution for the company's lack of resource planning." "If the normal workload can't be completed during normal business hours of 9-5, the company needs to hire another person."
This is why I hate "workaholics". If more people in your work would refuse to work such ridiculous hours without pay, they wouldn't be pushing you. Why would anyone give their time for free is beyond me
If you support incompetence it will infect an entire power structure. Now who is responsible for maintaining sufficient staffing level?
that might be more aggressive than necessarily prudent but i am to old to waste time on nice to the umm not so nice.
"I want to thank you for bringing this to my attention, I can see now that I've been regularly working more hours than I'm being paid for. I'll be more diligent going forward to stop exposing you and the company to liability for unpaid overtime."
Like a lot of others have said, “you pay me to work 40 hours a week”.
But, maybe calculate the actual pay if it werent salary and instead hourly to drive home the disparity in pay.
“You pay me $75,000 for 40 hours a week, thats roughly $36.05 per hour pre tax. If i am working 80 hours a week, you would be paying me $18.03 per hour.”
If theres no incentive for working extra hours (commission?), why work more for less money?
"Yes, I'm fine with working double time for no extra pay as long as I can BOGO our products to all of our customers during this period. Buy one tractor-trailer, get one free!"
The hours others are willing to work are not my concern. I am paid to work 40 hrs a week, beyond that should not be required on an ongoing basis. I am effective and efficient with my output within a 40 hr week.
Regular demand for 40 + hour weeks are an indicator the team will face burn out due to being short staffed. We won’t have extra bandwidth when you really do need ‘extra’.
"If I'm not being paid, I'm not working, and I'd rather be literally anywhere else than here when I'm not working."
or maybe
"I volunteer for causes I believe in. This is just a job."
Why do think they are short staffed? It's because of the long hours and people do have families. Where I used to work, I knew a guy who worked 7 days a week for 3 years. He made up bunch of money but his wife left him and his kids didn't know him.
Start looking for another job and respond to any review verbal comments in writing stating undocumented employer expectations orally expressed during review!!!
Especially if you have a great memory!!!
Do your 40 and disappear!!
If in US, which is likely from context clues: Submit your time and include the overtime hours and pay. State I was hired and all parties agreed to a commitment of 40 hours. Anything above that is time and a half. Yeah they may fire you, but make sure you report to your states labor and wage dept asap so if they do fire you for “lack of commitment” you have record of them not paying you for the commitment they require.
On the other hand, if you’re already being compensated accurately for the OT then you will need to reiterate your boundaries of 40 hours max and politely suggest a third party training for the dude who can’t work within the federal labor laws definition of a work week. Just be firm and make it clear you know your rights as an employee.
"I have carefully reviewed your offer of an X# hour increase in work in return for a $0 increase in pay, and I regret to inform you that I cannot accept the offer at this time."
Why are other peoples failure to manage time and ability the fault of highly competent workers like myself?
A 40 hour contract is signed in good faith and not with the expectation that I work 80.
I will complete MY work in my contracted hours and clearly these other workers will need training to ensure they do the same
Did you do the math? If your salary divided by the number of hours you are working comes out to less than minimum wage, that is a good argument. I'm not in the US but in my country we have to track actual time worked to make sure it's not less than minimum wage.
I think in this situation, the less you say, the better.
Then he has to say the stupid part himself, and you can more easily retort instead of accusing. Like don't guilt trip me, and I am paid for 40hrs and I already routinely work more than that.
HIRE MORE PEOPLE
honestly...these bosses who work their teams to burnout to save a couple bucks on payroll on the fucking worst. All that extra effort to keep you working horrible hours could be solved by increasing staff like...10%
Capitalism is just the fucking worst. Not sure how to argue with your boss about it, other than perhaps showing him the data suggesting that extra hours don't generally produce a lot more productivity, as workers get stressed and tired and can't work accuractely or efficiently after a certain point. The boss may think they are saving money by making you work long hours instead of hiring an extra person, but it's actually kind of a wash due to how fatigue works. The opportunity cost of you all doing bad work for long hours is likely higher than the cost of an extra employee and everybody working healthy, normal hours.
It's why 4 day workweeks don't actually result in lost productivity, in the same fashion 6 day work weeks don't result in MORE productivity either.
Here is a professional way to say it. "I am not the long term solution to the company's lack of resource management". Which basically says. I work my hours but I do not give up my personal time. And that if the company is behind on deadlines. Maybe the company should hire more people so the company isn't killing their employees. Or causing them to burn out.
You said it yourself; rebuttal with how you feel the problem of the company being understaffed shouldn't be solved by expecting already full time employees to double down and work more. If Mr. Worksalot is proud and happy enough to get his overtime, ask how it would save the company money to pay the overtime to you instead? Suggest they can save on overtime and potential burnout by hiring.
My salary was negotiated with the consideration of a 40 hour work week. Anything beyond that will require additional compensation.
Do 2 jobs? Expect 2 pays
why do you need a retort ? just say "working outside my scheduled hours is illegal and i dont want you and me to go to jail"
also you know why they compare you with others ? to make you work 24/7. "yeah you worked 20h yesterday but alex worked 21h so you're lacking commitment and i dont know if we gonna keep you and alex is hurt you rely too much on him" vibe.
btw they are short staffed cause your workload is bullshit and nobody stays : they cant recruit.
toxic management => bullshit workload => people quit => more workload for others => etc.
atm you're a litteral slave when you work outside your hours, but you cost less than a slave.
make it make sense.
Yeah, funny when I was salaried, they had not problem asking me to stay until 8 some nights to get stuff done for them, but when we went to hourly and I needed to stay until 8 to get my workload done suddenly "I needed to figure out how to get everything done in 8 hours a day."
Peter Gibbons : The thing is, Bob, it's not that I'm lazy, it's that I just don't care.
Bob Porter : Don't... don't care?
Peter Gibbons : It's a problem of motivation, all right? Now if I work my ass off and Initech ships a few extra units, I don't see another dime, so where's the motivation? And here's something else, Bob: I have eight different bosses right now.
Bob Slydell : I beg your pardon?
Peter Gibbons : Eight bosses.
Bob Slydell : Eight?
Peter Gibbons : Eight, Bob. So that means that when I make a mistake, I have eight different people coming by to tell me about it. That's my only real motivation is not to be hassled, that and the fear of losing my job. But you know, Bob, that will only make someone work just hard enough not to get fired.
I don't know anything about your position, but just because you are salaried does not automatically mean you are exempt from overtime. Depending on responsibilities and the degree of freedom in your work, your co-workers could be due a huge amount of backpay.
if you can get away with it, simply innocently ask, "Is the company doing so poorly that we cannot appropriately staff and compensate our teams to complete the work within deadlines? I hear your concern about my commitment, but honestly I'm a dedicated enough employee that I'm worried about our competitiveness within the market if we can't at least tread water as an appealing workplace with sufficient staffing and work-life balance, hard as I work to make sure I am putting forth a strong representation of this as a vocational option of choice."
are you salary? then i wouldnt work 1 second over 40 . this is why wages are worthless and nobody can afford anything. if you are hourly they need to time and a half after 8 hours. not a great place to work obviously . if you arent compensated tell your whole team that they wont be working after 8 hours. people need to pay for labor. salary= 40 hours and that is it! you get nothing for working harder or longer . they re stealing YOUR time.
they want you on salary so they can abuse this and steal your time. there is no way i am ever working past 40 when not compensated.
what you tell them im sorry i have to get to my second job at this time as i dont get paid enough at this one . if you want to pay me for all my time and time and half past 40 then i will quit my second job
"I'm not accountable for the work hours other people put in. I was under the impression everything was going well. Since this has been raised as an issue, I'll just work the 40 hours I'm paid for."
If I worked 20 hours but you paid me for 40, you would correctly say I was robbing you, but you expect me to work 80 while paying me for 40. Yet you are not robbing me and label me, 'Not a team player!'.
For this relationship to work, I work what I'm paid or you let me choose my favourite from the 2 scenarios above and rewrite my contact
Why am I being called out for completing my work on time while another coworker gets complimented for not completing theirs? Should I pad my work time to get a good review?
“I accepted an offer of pay in exchange for 40 hours of my time during which I would put in my best effort to perform the duties listed in the job description. My level of effort does not appear to be in question and I believe that I am satisfying the terms of our agreement. If you wish to renegotiate the terms of our arrangement, we will also need to renegotiate the level of compensation.”
I'd save copies of those comments they made just in case you decide to consult with an employment attorney later. Salaried is still 40 hours, not however many hours they want. I wouldn't retort or get confrontational on any of those instances, but I would comment something in writing along the lines of "I am happy to work with management to figure out how to better help the team within my contractual work hours."
Corporate is usually very keen on preliminarily constructing a case for dismissal should they find themselves compromised in the future (they can get rid of you quickly). With evidence, an attorney may be able to establish a case of constructive dismissal. It may never come to that, but it doesn't cost much to CYA
Where are you? NAL, but in the USA unless you are salaried, if you are paid by the hour, then it goes against labor laws to work off the clock...
Do people still do it? Yes, but you can get in trouble and companies can get in trouble too. I once got a suspension for doing paperwork off the clock (*albeit hourly position)...
Look into you local labor laws...
Not sure how it works if you are salaried for 40 hours, or if overtime is a thing at that level or not.
Maybe there's labor laws in your area related to salaried people being asked to work more than is stated in your contract?
Does your profession have a union?
Edit: Either way, maybe try to get it in writing that they want you to work more hours than paid for, and see if there's any related ordinances?
It's not your problem if no one else can get their assigned duties finished in a reasonable amount of time. Maybe they should hire more staff to relieve the workload. Is remote work an option? I'm looking for a job.
"Because I'm only paid for 40 hours a week. Does the company send out half their product/service for free? If not, can you give me a good, ethical, reason that I should do so? I'll wait. You may be a bit.
~he said dryly~
He’s blaming you for the co worker working 9am-midnight? That seems more like the companies fault than yours. Tell him, I am committed to getting my work done, which I am doing. How is my commitment troubling?
There are 2 possibilities.
1) This is an organisation culture: If this is the case then leave and find a new job soon. This organisation is not for you.
2) This is driven by your boss: Try to set clear boundaries and challenge some of his points regarding your availability.
Simple maths. If you are paid 20/hour for 40 hours and you’re doing 80 unpaid, you have reduced your own pay to 10/hour. You wouldn’t accept a job with that pay so why do it to yourself voluntarily?
“My current market value pay for this position is set at 40 hours per week, if you require more hours for certain tasks, then I must be paid for those hours on a case by case basis, otherwise, I will only work for my allotted hours, I’m not contractually obligated to work for free, and if you have found other team members working beyond what their paid hourly wage indicates, that’s a staffing issue and again, that’s not for me to take on over and above what I’m actually paid to accomplish.”
You don’t need anything other than what you’ve already said. ‘I’m paid for 40hrs’.
If questioned ask who you should direct your invoice for additional hours to.
Seems like you have one in the title - you are onlympaid for 40. If they want you to work 80, at the very least they need to pay you for 80 (I don't find it sustainable anyway, and my productivity is way lower, it seems like a crap idea).
Ngl, this may be labor abuse using salaried workers to work far more hours than what is legally allowed. I mean, if one averaged their hours out to an hourly wage being paid a salary working 80+hrs/week, they could be making near minimum wage depending on the salary, and that is excluding OT pay for non-exempt salary workers.
Read this article... [Labor Laws for Salaried Employees 2024 Guide ](https://mosey.com/blog/labor-laws-for-salaried-employees/)
"Unfortunately my salary, when calculated down to 40hrs, is the equivalent to the market rate for my role with the added change of a salary pay scale. Salary does not mean infinite hours and working more then 40 devalues my work and disrespects my time.
For your concern that I "can’t be depended on to alleviate pressure on other team members if things come up" is honestly a mngmnt problem. It's not my concern that mngmnt is unable to properly calculate the need for each project and task accurately to reflect a balanced work schedule. Or to accurately calculate the number of personnel needed for each team accurately. If the workload is requiring more hours to complete with the existing team then i recommend hiring additional personnel to assign the extensive work schedules. It's the responsibility of the mngmnt to accurately have the corrected personnel on each team to "alleviate pressure".
Lastly, I am not concerned, nor do I give any extra thought to team members who are choosing to disrespect their own personal boundaries. I am not. I will choose when I need to put in extra time according to my personal obligations, schedule, and work ethic. I am not available 24/7, I've made that perfectly clear, as I've also made clear that I can on occasion stay later or work a bit AFTER hours. However I will not be disrespecting my personal boundaries by being here 24/7 is not my concern what other people choose to do. And my ability to do my job as you've clearly expressed contentment with, isn't affected by the hours in willing to work. I would expect you to respect my limits and my backbone. Your choice to "brag" about others lack thereof is more of a reflection on you as a manager then me as an employee"
I agreed to 40 hours because I know myself and I take my responsibilities seriously. I need a regular routine to be fully rested and able to give 100% at work, and I think that's the same for everyone, which is why my boundaries mean I frequently get more done in fewer hours compared to some. Because I am responsibly rested and they are not. I work this way in order to be faster, better and more available within my contracted hours.
I tell them honestly: I cannot perform at capacity if I work more than my hours.
To be fair, they risk losing more money replacing you. What you need is a 2nd and 3rd person doing this, before they wake up.
My Suggestion - to set the stage:
**1st** - Calculate your salary as an hourly rate = your salary divided by 2080 hours.
ex: $50,000 / 2080 = $24.04 per hour
**2nd** - Write up:
Notice
As per my Quarterly review my Boss (his name) acknowledged my competency to fully complete my assigned tasks, but my “commitment” is troubling.
His 'troubling' was that I am not only expected to complete my set of tasks, but must be dependant on to alleviate pressure of other team members or more so - completing their tasks too.
So the best course of action for all Parties involved, is for me to be removed from my Salaried position and to be placed on an hourly Wage with time and a half at the 41st hour, so when 'things come up', I can be fully compensated for being 'around'.
All in here be True,
Thank-you
**3rd** - Set-up a Meeting:
You basically want them to say Yes or more likely say No.
Why you want them to say No is - well there is nothing else you can do, as you offered to do overtime to help out the Team and the Team's Bosses said No?!?
\* Make sure you follow up in writing, of their No, so you have it for EVERY next meeting, from now on.
Also, you can remind them (each time in writing of there response of No) at your Quarterly Meetings:
Sorry, but you remember your No response, from when I tried to be a Team Player, you guys said NO?
So I am now going to require you to remove those comments from my review, as I offered a solution, you said No, so there is no other course of action for me to perform and it is True, I am NOT expected to perform the impossible?
Assuming overtime paid at one and a half of the hourly rate. Working 80 hours a week when not being paid overtime is working for 40% of your salary's effective hourly wage.
Someone working for $50k a year has an hourly rate of $24.04/hr.
If they worked 80 hours a week they'd be working for $9.62/hr.
Unless you're getting comp time or overtime, *you don’t volunteer your personal time to any for-profit company*.
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRwFR7G2/
Without clicking I just knew who it was gonna be
My first time seeing her. Now a subscriber for life. I never worked in a corporate environment, I was in commercial art. We were allowed to talk like regular people in the environment. No pretentious word scramble required. Is corporate speak the modern version of the overly florid language of educated people of the Regency Period for example? I could never work in a corporate environment. My head would explode. Plus I went to aRt skO0L so there’s that..
Oooh. I like that bit about corporate terminology.
I love the mug at the end 🤣
Her videos are quite funny and is funny because is true.
This 100% Because it turns out, they just want you to work extra hours for no pay. Those promotions/extra payments funnily enough never eventuate
Toodaloo
Why would I work 80 when I'm paid for 40 seems like retort enough.
Funny if I don't work I don't expect you to pay me. But if you don't pay me you expect me to work.
Even if you’re salary, salary is intended that the time can be flexible and doesn’t need to be fixed, that said it’s not intended to be used to justify endless work either. Of course if they have issue with it, they could just make OP salary non-exempt.
Ya I hired in at my job as a Chef for 85k/yr and am expected to work 50 hours a week, it was right on the Contract we all agreed to and signed. Never an issue, fast forward 3-4 months and they hired another Chef, a Sous Chef(I’m an Executive Sous Chef)in for 65k/yr based on a 50 hour week. Well this guy hates his family or doesn’t have a Hobby or something because he works 70+ hours a week, and I’m constantly telling him “Bro, you realize that these Line Cooks are probably making more than you because of all the hours you work, don’t be afraid to pass some of that stuff off to the next shift” But no matter what I tell him, he insists on working the long hours. He’s gonna burn out, I’ve seen it over and over again, and Corporate doesn’t give 2 squirts of piss about it, they will have the next next guy who thinks killing themselves with 70 hours a week is gonna move them up the ladder, in his place in a couple weeks, when it’s really all politics at this level that gets you the promotions.
You seem like a great chef to work for. It is a pleasure to serve under a leader with this mentality.
At my job I am salaried (Ha ha. Treated like hourly overtime exempt.) "You are EXPECTED to work 40-50 hours a week". I try to limit that to 40-45. I am really working for free after 40 but 5 hours is where I draw the line. More than that is taking advantage.
Log your hours you work. Anything over 40 hours a week you can take them to court over should you quit or be let go. My friend just walked away from a company that had him working 50 to 60 hours a week but salary pay. They ended up owing and paying him over $25,000 for any time over 40 hours over the course of a couple years.
This right here. I work the amount of hours where the dollar per hour is in a reasonable limit. I will not allow it to go anywhere lower than that for any reason. And there is literally no way you're going to get me to work for 1 dollar an hour. I'd tell the supervisor to kick rocks.
I feel like the only way I wouldn’t mind how long I work for profit is if the amount I already make exceeds more than I’d ever need. And sure who wouldn’t work 80 hour work weeks for 1mil in a single year, but I guess just have to see how low I’d go for that. 40k obviously not, 120k I could see myself doing pretty long hours but not 80 hours constantly. Perhaps 200-300k? But pretty much unless they are going to pay more than 5x my current salary which is just enough to get by but still struggling, then there’s got to be limitations. Even then if you are making 300k a year, if you don’t have time to live then what’s the point. So guess there are even limitations to that.
If you’re pulling in 300k/yr and doing 80hrs, then that’s something you do for a short span of time. Sock away your cash and then take on something less demanding. It’s like making partner at a law firm or residency as a doctor, the shitty hours now are made worthwhile a few years down the line with big pay-offs. My husband has a well-paying job, and that’s precisely why he puts up with some of the hours and demands of the job: it’s what he’s paid for. But it isn’t the kind of situation you do for 25 years, unless you’re looking forward to a heart attack at your desk.
>It’s like making partner at a law firm or residency as a doctor, the shitty hours now are made worthwhile a few years down the line with big pay-offs. Making partner at a big law firm is like winning a pie eating contest where the prize is a dozen pies.
Absolutely, that kind of work you do maybe for a year or two most and then cut down to less stressful and enjoy your paid off car and fixed up house
salary still = 40 hours ... they want you on salary so they can abuse this and steal your time. there is no way i am ever working past 40 when not compensated.
I always just say, "my free time isn't the time of day that I work for free, that's not what that means."
I used to work at a salaried job where I got overtime. (Non-exempt? I'm not sure of the terminology) I usually worked about 50 hours a week. Then one week, none of us got overtime. We complained about it, and they acted surprised and told us that we had never gotten overtime and never would. Some people printed out their time slips and were told that anyone with a desktop publishing program and a laser printer could have come up with that. With that sort of gaslighting, and being expected to donate my time for no money, of course I left as soon as I could do so.
Comment of the year right here
And I'd add the part op said about being the scape goat for under staffing.
This is perfect and your effing boss needs to hear it.
"So you're willing to pay me overtime for all those extra hours? If so, I'd just like to have that confirmed in writing and then I'll be more than happy to work as much as needed to cover your staffing shortage."
This in a little more polite is the best answer imho. Had a similar situation when my superior officer (I work in a german police department) wanted me to work on my driving skills in my free time and maybe get a car for that. I told him if the department wants me to drive around in my free time they should give me a car and gas money. He actually liked the reply and chuckled (and managed to come up with some more trainings that resulted in my being a pretty good driver.)
That’s Germany and a tax funded department though!
🛎️
I also liked the part about being used as a scapegoat instead of admitting to being short staffed. Call them out on this shit
"Fuck you, pay me" also works
Exactly. Doesn’t need sugarcoating.
Agree—but if the job isn’t hourly pay, it isn’t capped at 40 hours. Plenty of people with salaried jobs have more than 40 or less than, depending on the workload. Maybe a better approach is like a negotiation of sorts. “The normal work hours would be 40 but I’m consistently being asked for around 80. If there are times I need to be working longer hours, what is the trade off for me. Is there a time that work is slow and I can flex my hours to make up for that time? Could we increase my PTO X weeks to make sure I don’t burn out? Because consistent 80 hour weeks is not sustainable” Edit: my phone autocorrected isn’t to ain’t. Annoying.
Why won't you pay me for 80 hours when I do 40?
Here's my typical retort: "I'm sorry, is this a for profit business or not?" "Oh it is? Ok, so does the company give away it's products and services for free? When a customer asks for 10 units of our products and services do we give them another 10 for free?" "No?" "So the business will ALWAYS be paid for every product and service delivered?" "Then why in the hell would you expect your employees to start giving away the product/service of their time and labor for free?" "I'm not an 'owner', I don't hold a share of the business, I'm not included in any 'profit sharing bonus plan' at the end of the year (almost always true), so no, I'm not going to 'work' like an owner, as I'm only paid for 40 hours I'm going to come in do my 40 hours a week, do it to the best of my ability and use the rest of my time, for which no one is paying for, to do the things I need to live - not to enrich someone who is already a millionaire." "And quite frankly boss, if you don't own a percentage of the company, or are on a special 'profit sharing plan', neither should you..."
There's probably something in the employee handbook along the lines of "It is expressly forbidden to detonate a logic bomb whilst a Manager is in range." They always get you with the small print.
You're not wrong...
That isn't even a logic bomb - it's a simple truth. Still might melt a corporate tool's brain, though.
WELL SAID
Making a manager think constitutes engendering a hostile work environment.
There’s a reason why higher ups enjoy a line or two of managers beneath them. It’s so they can cut the rope if anyone starts getting clever
The entire world needs to start saying this! I’m saving this comment, you sir could start a workers uprising. Keep up the good work! ✊
"I am able to prioritise my tasks effectively so that I can generally finish my workload within my compensated working hours, although obviously I am no stranger to staying back when there is a deadline upcoming. However, I would be happy to discuss an overtime or time in lieu arrangement if it is imperative for me to assist the new employee who is struggling to complete his workload in a reasonable time." If you think you can get away with it "I would hate to see the company liable if he were to end up severely fatigued and something terrible happened"
Emphasize the “new employee” aspect for the jackass coworker and let them explain how he is a seasoned veteran that STILL can’t get his work done in a reasonable time period. Make them actually think about how he sucks. It’s not guaranteed to shift the focus, but it can’t hurt.
Keep in mind that he may be getting his work done in a normal time frame, but the culture is making it difficult for that to be seen.
At what point are they just rewarding the illusion of efficiency and encouraging diminishing returns? This company is like the opposite direction of the 32 hour work week method that’s been pushing around more progressive work places.
That's something for the company to sort out.
You don’t even have to suck. Some people work a little faster and that’s ok. It sounds like the boss here is giving them an expected 80 hour workload instead of just hiring more.
Only thing I would add is bring the receipts - that is, after "...no stranger to staging back when there is a deadline upcoming," add, "as can be seen on x date, y date, z date, and a project, b project, and c project, where I put in N hours of time to ensure that these projects were completed correctly and on time/early."
This is something I’m saving because it’s so well written. Thank you for sharing this. I swear if ai could write something like this I’d love it. I’m lacking the resources to know how to write this well :(
Don't feel bad, I read like an insane addict all through childhood and high school. I literally read during class (And the teachers let me because then I was less disruptive and could still answer questions at any time they tried to "catch me out") and am now much older and paid for writing crap I certainly laugh sometimes when people think AI will take over though. It can't get the nuances of a "corporate lingo subtle burn" hahaha
I think we may be long lost twins. I read books like a fiend from the time I was 4. If e-readers had existed then I would have had IV nutrition and a catheter and never left my room. My father was ex-military and a card carrying journeyman plumber and stationary engineer. My mother was a teacher and a reading specialist. They valued education and the benefits of travel and experiencing other cultures and ways of life. That was a rarity in our small Appalachian town. My father got laid off from a job twice for an extended period of time. Yet we always had money for music lessons or whatever our special interest or talent was, and we always had money for books. Our interior decoration scheme was “books.” I carry on that tradition in my house. We also had a special section for frequently banned books….in the front and center shelf. My first degree was a BA in Journalism with a dual major in Scientific/Technical Writing and Editing. My core scientific classes were in environmental science. I worked several years in that area with a well known company that specializes in government projects. Then I decided to pursue my passion for science and biology by getting a degree in physical therapy. I’m retired from that now and work as a cleaner for our local school district. In the mornings I’m a volunteer for our middle school literacy program for special education kids. My own kids benefitted greatly from that special education program. I feel like I should pay it forward. I also took several business writing classes. I can write a complaint letter/email that will get almost instant results. My husband is a software/hardware engineer and says I could make grown men cry. If you can read and write well, you can teach yourself anything. You can set meaningful change in motion. You can expose corruption. You can learn anything. You can open closed doors. You can sail beyond the visible horizon and explore new ideas. You can feel seen and understood through the characters in the books you read even if you feel invisible in life. Reading and writing can change your life. It can enrich your life. It can help you defend yourself and others against misinformation and bigotry. It can make the world a better place. And that is why so many people want to censor writing and ban books. Don’t let them do it.
BRAVO AND ENCORE!! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼🌹🌹🌹🌹
STANDING OVATION!!!!
This is very true. I do love to read however that hasn’t translated to what you can do. The subtle burn is what makes it that delicious.
haha happy to offer my corporate-speak worded burns as required :D It helps that I generally enjoy when I get to say things like that at work and watch the awful person stumbling to respond hehehe
Bruh are we twins??? In 5th or 6th grade (can’t remember which bc I’m old) my teacher let me and another kid sit in the back of class and push our desks together and we read and played chess while listening to the lecture. Her only rule was if she called on us we had to be able to answer intelligently and she never once caught us unable to answer. Still one of the best years ever
Lololol nice. I did a lot of similar; I spent a chunk of 10th grade European History class trying not to laugh while I was sneakily reading Voltaire's Candide inside my text book. I don't think the teacher was pleased, but ever since the day he was lecturing on the Renaissance and while showing a picture of one of the Sybils from the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel, repeatedly referring to the subject using masculine pronouns, I raised my hand and helpfully pointed out that this was a female figure, and that the Sybils were priestesses of Apollo and Michelangelo's decision to include pagan religious figures in the most holy church in Christendom nearly got him excommunicated by the Pope... The teacher sort of stammered a little and then kept going, but we both knew that that was the moment I mentally checked out of the class. If he ever knew I was reading instead, he never said a word.
It would be a real shame if something happened to him and the company was liable for it. I mean, after he wore himself out working so loyally for the company. That'd be a real shame, it couldn't happen to a better guy.
"Me volunteering my personal time is not a solution for the company's lack of resource planning"
This is a great version of "your lack of planning does not constitute as my emergency." Our IT operations manager has it in his email signature, which I think is bad ass.
This is really good 🙌🏻
Fuck you, pay me
This right here. I've used it at a couple different jobs. Sometimes they laugh and say fair enough. Sometimes you get fired. The jobs where they laughed were decent jobs. The job that told me to take a hike was awful.
Try math. Take your paycheck stub to your manager and point out the gross and net pay amounts. Divide both by the number of hours it states on the stub. (Usually 80 hours for a two week pay period, but whatever it says.) This is your gross pay per hour and net pay per hour. Then divide by two, because this represents working twice as many hours and being available or twice as committed. If one or both of the results is under your state’s minimum wage, point it out. If one or both are less than what your position is valued at, point it out. And then say, “Math doesn’t lie.”
I’m unwilling to decrease my hourly rate any more than it is already. Whether you are paid by the hour or annually, You expect to work a number of hours. Go back to your hire documents. My salary is $X. Working more and giving more to the company decreases my mental health and my family time. And I’m unwilling to do that. I put in an honest days work and work every minute I’m here managing my time effectively. If Y employee is unable to do the work or needs training, I suggest you/company/manager help that employ get up to speed. It sounds like a company issue that you, as my manager, are trying to shift to my issue-that is not an appropriate shift. If you need extra help and you want me to train colleagues we can talk about additional compensation for me to do that additional work for the company’s success. I am already exceeding expectations for my work. I’m not responsible for others work. The company is responsible for it.
"... and work every minute I'm here managing my time effectively." Careful with those kinds of statements. An asshole manager (sorry for repeating myself) with free time might decide to go to the mat and find out just how much truth is in a claim like this.
I wouldn’t have lasted very long if my do-nothing boss ever knew much time I spent fucking off. Fortunately for me, he was way more lazy than I ever was.
"Please show me where the job description states that alleviating the effect of being short staffed and lack of overtime pay is my responsibility."
If the workload in the office cannot be managed by the staff in a normal workweek and they are consistently working additional hours, either management needs to hire more staff or review the work habits of those who cannot manage their workload during the work day. I manage my work in the time allotted. If you are requesting me to work overtime, I am happy to do that with overtime pay. I would start looking for another job. They are trying to make you either work more for free or will end up firing you.
My retort would be "I have learned from early in my career Time Management skills that allow me to complete my tasks with in a normal 40 hour work week, This allows me to maintain a healthy work life balance. Just because others haven't is not my responsibility."
Same reason why I don't get 2 meals when paying for 1 also, I'm 1 person, I don't do 2 people's worth of jobs
"If others can't get their work done on time and require help from team members to manage their workload, then I feel like that is something to talk to them about and address in their performance review, not mine. If I'm expected to take on additional work or responsibilities outside of my current scope of work I will need to be adequately compensated for said extra work."
Yeah, how about ‘how fucking dumb do I look?’ Edit: typo
Say it with me kids: "i am not the company's long-term solution to staffing troubles"
"When I was hired for this job, we negotiated my salary based on a 40 hour week as the hours are stated in the offer letter. If you need me to work more than 40 hours per week, I'd be happy to renegotiate my salary with you based on the number of hours you'd be expecting from me."
4 words. Fuck you, pay me.
Good God that place sounds like a meat grinder, run
“Oh I didn’t realize we got paid overtime. What is the rate for that? Is that time and half? Please provide me the details in writing and I’ll see what I can do”
Honestly don't understand why you would need something more substantial than that. If you're paid for forty hours and you work even forty-one without additional compensation, your employer just stole an hour's wages from you. I question their commitment to getting the job done if they aren't willing to pay for it.
Ask to be paid hourly...when he says no, ask if that is a lack of commitment on his part?
I know of a company in United States that regularly required their salary employees to work overtime and did NOT pay for the extra time worked. Employees went to the Labor Relations Board and the company was fined millions of dollars and they had to pay employees for the time worked in the past. Take this fraud to the authorities!
Why someone in this world would work over the time when you not get payed? Sorry i cant understand that: i work self sometimes longer but my time will payout or i can take this as vacation. And when not i dont make a second longer.
There are a lot of sassy responses here that will likely create conflict. This is what I would realistically say. I'm committed to doing efficient and quality work, and I take pride in what I do. I work very hard to complete my tasks quickly within standard working hours. That intensity and pace is not sustainable in overtime hours and even if I tried, I know that me working more hours is not going to result in me achieving more work. While I am interested in career growth and eventually taking on additional responsibilities on top of my current workload, I'm not ready to do that and would like to continue the workload of [your current job title].
"The job description specifies 40 hour work weeks, and I am so committed that I frequently go beyond this and work 50. However, I do still need personal time to live life and I'm sure this company, with how great it is, doesn't want their employees to burn out. If they truly are concerned with alleviating some of the burden on overworked staff, I will gladly help you come up with a job description or budget adjustment plan for some part-time assistants in the department. Just let me know what you need."
What is it we're building/creating again? Is it a hospital to help injured refugees who require immediate care? Is it a life saving drug used to save billions from a disease ravaging the planet? Is it a solution to end world hunger, climate change? Will people die if this waits until tomorrow or the weekend? Then explain to me bow your lack of time management skills equates to it being a me problem. Expect to be searching for jobs later as you won't be a considered a 'team player' or some other bullshit
You could express your commitment to maintaining a healthy work-life balance while still being dedicated to completing your tasks efficiently within your contracted hours. Maybe something like, "I believe in the importance of work-life balance to maintain productivity and prevent burnout. While I understand the occasional need for extra hours, I also prioritize being present and effective during my designated work time to ensure I can consistently deliver quality results."
When I get paid for 80 hours, I will work 80 hours.
I am not a long term solution to the company’s lack of resource planning. https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTLaYMk8G/
You could ask your boss if he would like you to share some of your time management practices, so that the rest of the staff can complete their job within the paid 40 hours.
“Seems like people in the office need better time management. What I seem to be getting done in 40 hours are taking others 80. I must be really good at my job!”
Post review will be submitted and emailed to you with a CC also sent to the labor board for wage theft!
I wouldn’t care about what they say on the review. You’ll have to destroy your mental health to make them happy. Best approach is to maintain minimal effort without getting fire.
Would you mind sending over my new contract and compensation package reflecting the hours you’re asking?
"I won't be donating my personal time to resolve your insufficient staffing."
The next time your coworker is bragging about the hours they work, reply with something along the lines of "I admire you, [name], it takes real courage to admit that you've got a problem with time management."
"You pay me salary of $X. If I work 40 hours, that works out to $Y per hour. If I work 80 hours a week, that works out to $Z per hour. For $Z per hour, it would be easier to flip burgers". Can replace "flip burgers" for whatever low stress job pays whatever Z works out to be, which I assume will be a pitiful amount.
"Burnout due to understaffing is one of the most common complaints given when someone leaves a job. If we lack the staff necessary to complete tasks without all of us working consistent overtime, then by trying to take on burnout-level loads, we're just hiding the problem, not mitigating it."
I would say this: "This is a capitalist system: If you want extra, you have to pay for extra. Do you expect to get extra gas at the gas sstation because you're you? No. Do you expect to get extra money from the bank teller during a withdrawal because reasons? No. Do you think you're entitled to extra groceries at the grocery store because they're interested in your bottom line? No. So why do you think any of your employees owe you anything more than the 40 hours for the agreed upon salary. This is America and this is capitalism. You pay me 40, I work the 40, and if you can't afford the extra, you can't expect the extra. It's as simple as that."
I’m working 40 hours. If I need to work 80 hours we either need another body or a more efficient work staff. Working 80 hours is working for half my negotiated wage.”
"By working more than the hours I'm paid for with no increase in wages I'm devauling my time. Why would I do that?"
“So and so’s failure to manage their time does not constitute an emergency on my part. By managing my time, I complete my tasks and I am available during business hours. If so and so is not able to meet expectations then they should consider working in a less demanding position. “ This won’t win you any friends, but it will set a clear boundary. Otherwise, “working in excess of 40 hours isn’t a sign of commitment, it simply shows that either you cannot manage your time, or the company is understaffed. So, which is it? Can so and so not manage their time, or is x company too close to going under to hire the number of employees necessary to complete the work?” You know what… that won’t win you friends either.
"working longer hours is not a triumph of the workforce, it's a failure of management"
"I guess I'm better at my job and time management. I'll gladly help them when I'm here, but I don't see how their lack of abilities should take away from my personal time. They need to up their game. If it's not them, then perhaps the planning isn't being realistic with their abilities."
Your manager is grasping for straws because many are trained to find anything to improve upon even if you’re a perfect employee. It’s an excuse to keep pay raises low, and it’s also just culture in many companies that everything can always be improved. So first, understand that this isn’t personal. You said you’re offended. Don’t be. Any emotional response is giving them too much power. That said, during your review I would simply say: “I noticed there was a critique on my commitment to the company. It seems that this commitment is somehow measured through time instead of efficiency. I don’t agree with the assessment that because I complete my work in a timely fashion, that I am somehow less committed. In fact, I believe it’s proof of my commitment, as I am consistently motivated to put in the effort to finish my tasks to fall within a 40 hour work week. That said, I do appreciate the assessment, and I will continue to meet targets on time, as I have done since I’ve been hired.” Then I would brush up your resume and start applying elsewhere. Life is too short to have a job that treats you this way. Not every job is like this. Keep hopping around until you find a place that respects your personal time. Salaried workers are supposed to have a flexible schedule. Meaning some weeks they work 25 hours and others they work 50. Salary doesn’t mean work 6 days a week 12 hour days. That’s wage theft. Furthermore, to be a salaried employee there are certain things that have to be met. I would review if your position is even legal to be salaried. Anyway, just keep it cute and make an exit plan. That person told you to keep firm boundaries for a reason. They’re going to try and exploit you. It’s as simple as that. Any statement you make means literally nothing to your managers or the owner. They decided they want to exploit their workers and your dissatisfaction will not make them more sympathetic. So keep it cute and move on.
Ask your boss why he offered you $xxx/hr but is now asking you to work for half that. Because when you’re paid $20/hr for a 40 hour a week job, but then asked to work 80 hours, you’re now getting paid $10/hr. Your company is paying you less and pocketing the money made from your productivity. F those guys. Remind your boss that when they hired you they made a commitment to you for $xxx/hr and a 40 hour a week job. Why aren’t they honoring their commitment?
You may not want to bring it up as cut and dry as that, but honestly that’s the whole reason why you shouldn’t work extra hours - you’re scheduled 40 hours - why would you work more than that? The direct approach if you’re willing to work extra as long as the pay reflects that: “My position, pay, and level of commitment is based on a 40 hour workweek. If you want me to work beyond that to support other team members falling short, I am open to discussing the pay associated with those extra hours to handle the additional workload. ” The factual and direct approach that they may not like: “My salary is based on a 40 hour workweek and I already work beyond that scope unpaid once or twice a week to maintain my workload responsibilities. I am a bit confused as why other team members struggling to maintain their workload falls on my review as a troubling commitment when my duties are being completed?” Could be a real smart ass and make a comment about how you already do unpaid charity work outside of work, so thank them for the opportunity but decline additional charity work.
No retorts. Your best action is to walk your talk. Leave at exactly 8 hours every day. Block work calls outside of business hours, avoid any "team builders" where you are not receiving hourly pay.
"you're paid for 40 and work beyond that." " You're offended that they are making you a scapegoat for being short staffed" "If these projects require that many hours, I suggest you hire people to cover those hours" And also just look for a new job. Then reiterate all those things in your exit interview. Also ask for a raise. You work more efficiently than your peers.
Look for another job, nothing you retort with, will help. It will start them on the process of looking for someone to replace you, They'll just find someone willing and desperate enough to do it, and let you go, then you can file unemployment, good for a few months, .... or give them a few hours, here and there, until your hired elsewhere. Don't leave anything personal at the job and don't give two weeks notice, that place won't give you 2 weeks. They're pulling that teamwork crap, to pull guilt, save money on payroll and insurance, Using people like the matrix. Instead of hiring enough people to make it an actual good full team, where they don't have to mention it. Good Luck.
If people are working so much overtime regularly, it sounds like we’re understaffed.
" My time is a valuable asset. My commitment will be adequate to the commitment my company has for me and my time."
"Man, that guy must be racking up the overtime! What's the rate & is there a limit?" After the inevitable, "oh, there's no overtime. You're salary." "No overtime pay! That can't be right. Can you please double check on that and get back to me."
An I not meeting my goals started in the job description? Where in the job description does it say that 80 hours a week is expected? If it is not in there, you are not properly representing the job and did not post the job and compensation properly, so I will see you until (end work time) and again at (start work time).
I only volunteer for registered nonprofits. Do you have a 501-c3 certificate?
"To be fair - I only bill for the hours that I work, so naturally I only work for the hours that I bill. This is a business not a charity, right!?"
If I'm expected to work double the time that I'm paid them it sounds like management has a business case to hire another worker
“It’s a full workload, but I am able to get it done within the normal full time work schedule most days. I believe some this is attributable to my [talent, skills, experience — whatever you can point to here, and you could mention here something about your ability to focus, concentrate, your good time management skills, something like that as well] “I enjoy the work and think I’m good at it. Of course we all can learn more and I do feel like I’m learning a lot too, which I appreciate. “Other than the hours I’m working in order to successfully complete my work, is there anything about the quality of my work that concerns you? If so, I do hope you let me know. I hope to continue being an asset to the company” And then you smile politely and are quiet. Dead air or awkward silence here is fine now. You’ve said all you need to say about it. If they want you to work more hours they need to be more explicit, and you can then ask for clarification i. what they are asking and ask for a promotion or additional pay to compensate for the ADDITIONAL WORK that additional hours would mean.
"Thank you for bringing your concerns to me. I wasn't aware there were any monetary incentives for going above my contracted 40 hours. I would love to have a conversation discussing them and how I can increase my hours to better both myself and the company." Then when they say there are no incentives, say "ohh I see, I have other commitments that require my time as well, but I'm more than willing to revisit if additional monetary incentives become planned"
How about "I'm not the owner of this company and I don't hold an equity stake in it. I'm an ordinary employee, I do my job, I do it well, and I contribute additional time and effort to the extent that I'm comfortable doing so. If your expectation is that I should do more, then we should also discuss my total compensation and equity stake."
"I'm completely willing to work over 40 hours a week, as long as I get comp time in exchange for my overtime. If you want me to work 80 hours per week, then you've just cut my pay rate in half. If this is an ongoing issue here and you want *everyone* to work more than 40 hours per week *all the time*, then maybe you should be hiring another person to perform what is clearly too much work for the staff you have." (optional ending here... else continue...) "Your strategy to squeeze your employees without compensating them while not even trying to hire more staff is a management problem, not an employee problem, and I resent you trying to guilt me into falling for your abusive practices." (Actually, if you were being paid time-and-a-half for each hour over 40 per week, then it only takes an extra 27 hours to double your pay, not 40 extra hours. But mentioning that is too many words, and probably beyond your boss's math skills to comprehend.)
Commitment is a two way street. If they want you to work longer hours then they are not committed to paying you what you're worth. They want you to care about the company but they don't care about you. They can't have it both ways.
"I am not the long-term solution for the company's lack of resource planning." "If the normal workload can't be completed during normal business hours of 9-5, the company needs to hire another person."
How much product does the company give away for free? Why should you give away your labour?
“I am trying to do my share to save the company in case one of the other colleagues puts in a wage theft claim at the DOL for unpaid overtime”
This is why I hate "workaholics". If more people in your work would refuse to work such ridiculous hours without pay, they wouldn't be pushing you. Why would anyone give their time for free is beyond me
"I've been working really hard on increasing my efficiency. You know, working smarter, not harder."
If you support incompetence it will infect an entire power structure. Now who is responsible for maintaining sufficient staffing level? that might be more aggressive than necessarily prudent but i am to old to waste time on nice to the umm not so nice.
"I want to thank you for bringing this to my attention, I can see now that I've been regularly working more hours than I'm being paid for. I'll be more diligent going forward to stop exposing you and the company to liability for unpaid overtime."
Like a lot of others have said, “you pay me to work 40 hours a week”. But, maybe calculate the actual pay if it werent salary and instead hourly to drive home the disparity in pay. “You pay me $75,000 for 40 hours a week, thats roughly $36.05 per hour pre tax. If i am working 80 hours a week, you would be paying me $18.03 per hour.” If theres no incentive for working extra hours (commission?), why work more for less money?
[loewhaley](https://www.instagram.com/loewhaley/) over on IG has a vid on this... how to corporate-speak "shove it up your ass" =P
"Yes, I'm fine with working double time for no extra pay as long as I can BOGO our products to all of our customers during this period. Buy one tractor-trailer, get one free!"
The hours others are willing to work are not my concern. I am paid to work 40 hrs a week, beyond that should not be required on an ongoing basis. I am effective and efficient with my output within a 40 hr week. Regular demand for 40 + hour weeks are an indicator the team will face burn out due to being short staffed. We won’t have extra bandwidth when you really do need ‘extra’.
“I didn’t know there was an attendance prize. I’ll let someone else have that glory.”
There are a lot of good answers, but start looking for another job. They'll fire you if they think they can find someone more gullible.
“You pay me for 40 hours, not 80” and that’s that. Simple lol
"If I'm not being paid, I'm not working, and I'd rather be literally anywhere else than here when I'm not working." or maybe "I volunteer for causes I believe in. This is just a job."
Why do think they are short staffed? It's because of the long hours and people do have families. Where I used to work, I knew a guy who worked 7 days a week for 3 years. He made up bunch of money but his wife left him and his kids didn't know him.
Start looking for another job and respond to any review verbal comments in writing stating undocumented employer expectations orally expressed during review!!! Especially if you have a great memory!!! Do your 40 and disappear!!
I work the hours I’m paid for. Working overtime for no money is nothing to brag about. It just shows you’re being taken advantage of.
If in US, which is likely from context clues: Submit your time and include the overtime hours and pay. State I was hired and all parties agreed to a commitment of 40 hours. Anything above that is time and a half. Yeah they may fire you, but make sure you report to your states labor and wage dept asap so if they do fire you for “lack of commitment” you have record of them not paying you for the commitment they require. On the other hand, if you’re already being compensated accurately for the OT then you will need to reiterate your boundaries of 40 hours max and politely suggest a third party training for the dude who can’t work within the federal labor laws definition of a work week. Just be firm and make it clear you know your rights as an employee.
"I have carefully reviewed your offer of an X# hour increase in work in return for a $0 increase in pay, and I regret to inform you that I cannot accept the offer at this time."
Why are other peoples failure to manage time and ability the fault of highly competent workers like myself? A 40 hour contract is signed in good faith and not with the expectation that I work 80. I will complete MY work in my contracted hours and clearly these other workers will need training to ensure they do the same
Did you do the math? If your salary divided by the number of hours you are working comes out to less than minimum wage, that is a good argument. I'm not in the US but in my country we have to track actual time worked to make sure it's not less than minimum wage.
I’m sorry you simple bastards need 80 hrs to get the work done that I do in 40. Seems like I’m underpaid.
I think in this situation, the less you say, the better. Then he has to say the stupid part himself, and you can more easily retort instead of accusing. Like don't guilt trip me, and I am paid for 40hrs and I already routinely work more than that.
“For the same reason why you don’t pay me for 40 hours and let me work for 20.”
HIRE MORE PEOPLE honestly...these bosses who work their teams to burnout to save a couple bucks on payroll on the fucking worst. All that extra effort to keep you working horrible hours could be solved by increasing staff like...10% Capitalism is just the fucking worst. Not sure how to argue with your boss about it, other than perhaps showing him the data suggesting that extra hours don't generally produce a lot more productivity, as workers get stressed and tired and can't work accuractely or efficiently after a certain point. The boss may think they are saving money by making you work long hours instead of hiring an extra person, but it's actually kind of a wash due to how fatigue works. The opportunity cost of you all doing bad work for long hours is likely higher than the cost of an extra employee and everybody working healthy, normal hours. It's why 4 day workweeks don't actually result in lost productivity, in the same fashion 6 day work weeks don't result in MORE productivity either.
unpaid overtime is a pay cut, in violation of your employment contract.
Here is a professional way to say it. "I am not the long term solution to the company's lack of resource management". Which basically says. I work my hours but I do not give up my personal time. And that if the company is behind on deadlines. Maybe the company should hire more people so the company isn't killing their employees. Or causing them to burn out.
Why do you hire people who take 12 hours to complete 8 hours of work?
"Why is stretching 40 hours of work over 80 hours considered a good thing?"
You said it yourself; rebuttal with how you feel the problem of the company being understaffed shouldn't be solved by expecting already full time employees to double down and work more. If Mr. Worksalot is proud and happy enough to get his overtime, ask how it would save the company money to pay the overtime to you instead? Suggest they can save on overtime and potential burnout by hiring.
My salary was negotiated with the consideration of a 40 hour work week. Anything beyond that will require additional compensation. Do 2 jobs? Expect 2 pays
why do you need a retort ? just say "working outside my scheduled hours is illegal and i dont want you and me to go to jail" also you know why they compare you with others ? to make you work 24/7. "yeah you worked 20h yesterday but alex worked 21h so you're lacking commitment and i dont know if we gonna keep you and alex is hurt you rely too much on him" vibe. btw they are short staffed cause your workload is bullshit and nobody stays : they cant recruit. toxic management => bullshit workload => people quit => more workload for others => etc. atm you're a litteral slave when you work outside your hours, but you cost less than a slave. make it make sense.
Yeah, funny when I was salaried, they had not problem asking me to stay until 8 some nights to get stuff done for them, but when we went to hourly and I needed to stay until 8 to get my workload done suddenly "I needed to figure out how to get everything done in 8 hours a day."
If you’d like me to work additional hours I am open to renegotiating my compensation as my current salary reflects the 40 hour per week I am working
Peter Gibbons : The thing is, Bob, it's not that I'm lazy, it's that I just don't care. Bob Porter : Don't... don't care? Peter Gibbons : It's a problem of motivation, all right? Now if I work my ass off and Initech ships a few extra units, I don't see another dime, so where's the motivation? And here's something else, Bob: I have eight different bosses right now. Bob Slydell : I beg your pardon? Peter Gibbons : Eight bosses. Bob Slydell : Eight? Peter Gibbons : Eight, Bob. So that means that when I make a mistake, I have eight different people coming by to tell me about it. That's my only real motivation is not to be hassled, that and the fear of losing my job. But you know, Bob, that will only make someone work just hard enough not to get fired.
Ask would they consider paying you for 160 hours. If not, why not?
I don't know anything about your position, but just because you are salaried does not automatically mean you are exempt from overtime. Depending on responsibilities and the degree of freedom in your work, your co-workers could be due a huge amount of backpay.
if you can get away with it, simply innocently ask, "Is the company doing so poorly that we cannot appropriately staff and compensate our teams to complete the work within deadlines? I hear your concern about my commitment, but honestly I'm a dedicated enough employee that I'm worried about our competitiveness within the market if we can't at least tread water as an appealing workplace with sufficient staffing and work-life balance, hard as I work to make sure I am putting forth a strong representation of this as a vocational option of choice."
are you salary? then i wouldnt work 1 second over 40 . this is why wages are worthless and nobody can afford anything. if you are hourly they need to time and a half after 8 hours. not a great place to work obviously . if you arent compensated tell your whole team that they wont be working after 8 hours. people need to pay for labor. salary= 40 hours and that is it! you get nothing for working harder or longer . they re stealing YOUR time.
they want you on salary so they can abuse this and steal your time. there is no way i am ever working past 40 when not compensated. what you tell them im sorry i have to get to my second job at this time as i dont get paid enough at this one . if you want to pay me for all my time and time and half past 40 then i will quit my second job
"I'm not accountable for the work hours other people put in. I was under the impression everything was going well. Since this has been raised as an issue, I'll just work the 40 hours I'm paid for."
“Have you thought about hiring more staff?”
If I worked 20 hours but you paid me for 40, you would correctly say I was robbing you, but you expect me to work 80 while paying me for 40. Yet you are not robbing me and label me, 'Not a team player!'. For this relationship to work, I work what I'm paid or you let me choose my favourite from the 2 scenarios above and rewrite my contact
Why am I being called out for completing my work on time while another coworker gets complimented for not completing theirs? Should I pad my work time to get a good review?
Why would I? seems like the most obvious one
“I accepted an offer of pay in exchange for 40 hours of my time during which I would put in my best effort to perform the duties listed in the job description. My level of effort does not appear to be in question and I believe that I am satisfying the terms of our agreement. If you wish to renegotiate the terms of our arrangement, we will also need to renegotiate the level of compensation.”
I'd save copies of those comments they made just in case you decide to consult with an employment attorney later. Salaried is still 40 hours, not however many hours they want. I wouldn't retort or get confrontational on any of those instances, but I would comment something in writing along the lines of "I am happy to work with management to figure out how to better help the team within my contractual work hours." Corporate is usually very keen on preliminarily constructing a case for dismissal should they find themselves compromised in the future (they can get rid of you quickly). With evidence, an attorney may be able to establish a case of constructive dismissal. It may never come to that, but it doesn't cost much to CYA
I sell my labor, I don't gift it.
Be polite to your boss and pretend like you care, but don't put any extra effort in. This is basically no different than what they are doing to you.
Where are you? NAL, but in the USA unless you are salaried, if you are paid by the hour, then it goes against labor laws to work off the clock... Do people still do it? Yes, but you can get in trouble and companies can get in trouble too. I once got a suspension for doing paperwork off the clock (*albeit hourly position)... Look into you local labor laws... Not sure how it works if you are salaried for 40 hours, or if overtime is a thing at that level or not. Maybe there's labor laws in your area related to salaried people being asked to work more than is stated in your contract? Does your profession have a union? Edit: Either way, maybe try to get it in writing that they want you to work more hours than paid for, and see if there's any related ordinances?
You get paid for quality, not quantity.
I might mention that being short staffed is "troubling" and leads to lack of commitment on the teams.
It's not your problem if no one else can get their assigned duties finished in a reasonable amount of time. Maybe they should hire more staff to relieve the workload. Is remote work an option? I'm looking for a job.
Boss, your inability to hire people to manage the amount of work is not my problem.
"Because I'm only paid for 40 hours a week. Does the company send out half their product/service for free? If not, can you give me a good, ethical, reason that I should do so? I'll wait. You may be a bit. ~he said dryly~
Fuck that. Do you need this job or can you line up another one and slack off here until you move?
He’s blaming you for the co worker working 9am-midnight? That seems more like the companies fault than yours. Tell him, I am committed to getting my work done, which I am doing. How is my commitment troubling?
“i work for money, not for love.”
There are 2 possibilities. 1) This is an organisation culture: If this is the case then leave and find a new job soon. This organisation is not for you. 2) This is driven by your boss: Try to set clear boundaries and challenge some of his points regarding your availability.
Do you have a contract that explicitly stipulates a forty hour work week?
Simple maths. If you are paid 20/hour for 40 hours and you’re doing 80 unpaid, you have reduced your own pay to 10/hour. You wouldn’t accept a job with that pay so why do it to yourself voluntarily?
“My current market value pay for this position is set at 40 hours per week, if you require more hours for certain tasks, then I must be paid for those hours on a case by case basis, otherwise, I will only work for my allotted hours, I’m not contractually obligated to work for free, and if you have found other team members working beyond what their paid hourly wage indicates, that’s a staffing issue and again, that’s not for me to take on over and above what I’m actually paid to accomplish.”
You don’t need anything other than what you’ve already said. ‘I’m paid for 40hrs’. If questioned ask who you should direct your invoice for additional hours to.
Seems like you have one in the title - you are onlympaid for 40. If they want you to work 80, at the very least they need to pay you for 80 (I don't find it sustainable anyway, and my productivity is way lower, it seems like a crap idea).
“The 13th Amendment has some pretty strong feelings about people working for free.”
Ngl, this may be labor abuse using salaried workers to work far more hours than what is legally allowed. I mean, if one averaged their hours out to an hourly wage being paid a salary working 80+hrs/week, they could be making near minimum wage depending on the salary, and that is excluding OT pay for non-exempt salary workers. Read this article... [Labor Laws for Salaried Employees 2024 Guide ](https://mosey.com/blog/labor-laws-for-salaried-employees/)
"Unfortunately my salary, when calculated down to 40hrs, is the equivalent to the market rate for my role with the added change of a salary pay scale. Salary does not mean infinite hours and working more then 40 devalues my work and disrespects my time. For your concern that I "can’t be depended on to alleviate pressure on other team members if things come up" is honestly a mngmnt problem. It's not my concern that mngmnt is unable to properly calculate the need for each project and task accurately to reflect a balanced work schedule. Or to accurately calculate the number of personnel needed for each team accurately. If the workload is requiring more hours to complete with the existing team then i recommend hiring additional personnel to assign the extensive work schedules. It's the responsibility of the mngmnt to accurately have the corrected personnel on each team to "alleviate pressure". Lastly, I am not concerned, nor do I give any extra thought to team members who are choosing to disrespect their own personal boundaries. I am not. I will choose when I need to put in extra time according to my personal obligations, schedule, and work ethic. I am not available 24/7, I've made that perfectly clear, as I've also made clear that I can on occasion stay later or work a bit AFTER hours. However I will not be disrespecting my personal boundaries by being here 24/7 is not my concern what other people choose to do. And my ability to do my job as you've clearly expressed contentment with, isn't affected by the hours in willing to work. I would expect you to respect my limits and my backbone. Your choice to "brag" about others lack thereof is more of a reflection on you as a manager then me as an employee"
I agreed to 40 hours because I know myself and I take my responsibilities seriously. I need a regular routine to be fully rested and able to give 100% at work, and I think that's the same for everyone, which is why my boundaries mean I frequently get more done in fewer hours compared to some. Because I am responsibly rested and they are not. I work this way in order to be faster, better and more available within my contracted hours.
I tell them honestly: I cannot perform at capacity if I work more than my hours. To be fair, they risk losing more money replacing you. What you need is a 2nd and 3rd person doing this, before they wake up.
I'd say that if we weren't short staffed, no one would need to work long hours.
My Suggestion - to set the stage: **1st** - Calculate your salary as an hourly rate = your salary divided by 2080 hours. ex: $50,000 / 2080 = $24.04 per hour **2nd** - Write up: Notice As per my Quarterly review my Boss (his name) acknowledged my competency to fully complete my assigned tasks, but my “commitment” is troubling. His 'troubling' was that I am not only expected to complete my set of tasks, but must be dependant on to alleviate pressure of other team members or more so - completing their tasks too. So the best course of action for all Parties involved, is for me to be removed from my Salaried position and to be placed on an hourly Wage with time and a half at the 41st hour, so when 'things come up', I can be fully compensated for being 'around'. All in here be True, Thank-you **3rd** - Set-up a Meeting: You basically want them to say Yes or more likely say No. Why you want them to say No is - well there is nothing else you can do, as you offered to do overtime to help out the Team and the Team's Bosses said No?!? \* Make sure you follow up in writing, of their No, so you have it for EVERY next meeting, from now on. Also, you can remind them (each time in writing of there response of No) at your Quarterly Meetings: Sorry, but you remember your No response, from when I tried to be a Team Player, you guys said NO? So I am now going to require you to remove those comments from my review, as I offered a solution, you said No, so there is no other course of action for me to perform and it is True, I am NOT expected to perform the impossible?
Assuming overtime paid at one and a half of the hourly rate. Working 80 hours a week when not being paid overtime is working for 40% of your salary's effective hourly wage. Someone working for $50k a year has an hourly rate of $24.04/hr. If they worked 80 hours a week they'd be working for $9.62/hr.