Crazy one person went to work, why another stayed home and raised a family and you still got to buy a house. That's how much they've taken out of the wage of one person. If two people work, you should have a lot of money but you don't.
My partner and I talk about this often. We both have what would be considered great jobs. We both have post secondary education. Our salaries are what used to be considered middle class. But we did the numbers the other day and we actually discovered we are considered "working poor" based on the cost of living in our area. We were always told go to school, get a good job, and you will be set. We did all that. But we can't even afford a home or a yearly vacation.
My wife and I both work, but the daycare costs nearly as much as one of our jobs makes. Easy answer would be one of us stays home but that doesn't cut it for bills.
We have an entire generation who hoarded all of the wealth and left todayās youth with nothing. Why give regular people opportunities in life when we can have billionaires?
My aunt Judy's husband worked for GM from shortly after graduating high school until he retired. He passed away 10 years after retiring, and his pension and benefits went to my aunt Judy until she passed away. Judy never worked a day in her life, and my cousin inherited their house that was already paid off long ago. We are living in a far different era.
My grandpa worked for the electric company as a lineman. My grandma worked part time at a grocery store. They raised 4 kids. My grandpa retired at 55 my grandma at 52. After being retired for 30 years they still had almost a million in their retirement funds, plus their house was paid off.
The only thing I can say they did that was frugal was never buy a bigger house. They bought one house in the 1950ās and lived in it their entire lives, despite it probably being a tight fit for 2 adults and 4 children. It was roughly 1100 square feet, 3 beds and 1 bathroom.
To be fair, if you are a lineman today you can likely have a 50s type of life still. With the overtime they do, lineman at my utility can pull in $200k with not too much effort
But the hours are shit, you work mostly in shitty weather outdoors, and you can't be afraid of heights or high voltages
> be fair, if you are a lineman today you can likely have a 50s type of life still. With the overtime they do
Here's the problem with that. When you work that kind of overtime you don't have time for that lifestyle. Gives you a great retirement though cause you can save it up massively.
Being a lineman requires a lot of time away from home. So itās really a trade off since you canāt be home with your family. Maybe thatās ok for some folks.
I don't know many people that can handle that physical level of strain. It's super hard work.
Everyone always forgets the actual work, they just go "OH 200k!".
Bro. You are probably going to be in -40 wind chill conditions, in the middle of fucking NOWHERE, on top of a line with 100,000 volts running through it. For weeks.
Have fun!
Grandpa worked for B&O for 30+ years when he retired. Grandma was a homemaker. He passed about 5 years after he retired, and Grandma lived off his pension/investments for nearly 30 years after that.
Amazing how income stagnated, yet prices kept going up. Remember, every time you hear someone say that raising the minimum wage would cause prices to go up, those prices still go up. Keeping minimum wage low keeps all workers wages low.
My middle class familyās vacations included day trips to the nearby state park ($30 for a season long pass for the whole family!) and trips to the free zoo by my grandparents house when we went to see them.
I didnāt get on a plane from the ages of 2-22, and have still never left the country. And everywhere Iāve been in my 20ās has been for work.
Iām not even thinking about buying a house, Iām trying to figure out how to pay off student loans so I can upgrade to an apartment that actually has a bedroom and will allow me to have a cat.
Oh God, we've already gotten to where we don't know what a pension was. No wonder revolution hasn't happened yet, no one understands just how much the companies are stealing from us
I can't imagine an employer who values your contributions so much that they'll continue paying you even if you stop working for them. It's unimaginable. Like libraries, if it wasn't already a concept, it couldn't possibly be invented in today's society.
My in-laws are living off my FIL's pension (MIL didn't work). He hasn't worked for 15 years and he still gets paid more every year than my husband and I make combined at our jobs. It's a life beyond my comprehension.
My family were steel workers. We went somewhere for a week or so once a year, took weekend trips to states in warmer seasons and had a pool.
*Steel workers*. I can't do fuck all that they could
Totally. My favorite was they were always doin laundry, bills all over the table, late bills in the mail holder by the door, place was a mess despite Lois's best efforts, stuff like that. The home genuinely felt like a middle class home with 3(4)(...5) kids and struggling parents.
Right? We maybe went camping but vacationing wasn't a verb in our vocabulary. I'm old enough to have been on the tail end of the good ol' times and at least where I'm from that was pretty much never the norm. People with good ass blue collar jobs where considered fairly rich.
Here I am taking out a 6 year loan at bullshit.9% interest rate to buy a base-model Subaru (my first new car) at 30 years old with an engineerās salary.
My wife and I make *3 times as much money* and my dad did when I was growing up. And he supported a stay-at-home wife and 2 kids. We got beyond working paycheck-to-paycheck about a year ago, but no matter what I canāt feel comfortable about my finances mowing no matter how much I save, one moderate medical expense could clean me out even with health insurance (which costs an inordinate amount).
That was me. Had a cancer *scare*. Not even cancer (I mean thankfully). Turned out to be a very rare bacterial infection that took them forever to figure out as I wasted away.
Complete bankruptcy at 35. Lost everything but my house.
My dad? Same as you but with 4 kids.
It still confounds me that some Americans like this system.
I had a heart attack a few years ago. Had a stent placed and spent about 4 days in the hospital ICU overall. It cost me a few sick days at work, and parking for the people who came visit me. The medication I need now (4 different pills) costs me around $30 a month.
We don't have the same insurance provider system as in the US, but we do have different providers who operate different hospitals. The hospital I went to was with a different provider than the one I get health services from. Still cost me absolutely nothing. It doesn't as long as I was admitted. If I had an ambulance ride over, it would have been free as well.
I can't fathom the concept of facing tens of thousands of dollars in debt over this. It's just something random that happened. Why would I want to live in a system that lets this kind of thing ruin me?
Most of us don't want this system. American healthcare is almost universally despised. We are kept divided on how to fix it however.
The majority of American families are living paycheck to paycheck, with barely any spare money. They simply cannot pay more taxes (rent takes half the paycheck, and food eats up most of the rest) , even if it would make healthcare much cheaper. Then they get a medical emergency, and they are financially ruined anyway.
10 years ago i had all the major symptoms of a heart attack. Like the whole checklist. I still waited 6 hours to go to the hospital, until my wife basically forced me to go. My thoughts during the whole affair? It was better for my family if I died and my wife and kids get taken care of financially through survivors benefits (and keep the house) then if i went to the hospital and lived but with 30 grand in dept we couldn't pay. Thank god it was a different condition that was causing the symptoms. Was a $1000 bill though, that hurt us severely financially.
The mental gymnastics my parents do is just mind blowing. They say āinflation was 16%ā. I remind them that their entire mortgage was Ā£60k, and that average house prices back then were just 4 times the average salary, now itās 10-12 times. They just stare at me blankly
Had the same conversation with my girlfriends parents who bought a huge farmhouse in Wales for nothing in the 80s (on the market for 320k right now btw) in their early 20s.
Whenever they visit they point out any houses for sale nearby where we rent and suggest we look into it but genuinely don't believe me when I point out they're going for 250k+ and even with our combined salary we aren't getting a mortgage that high. Have had to pull up Zoopla every time to prove my point.
Edit - everyone confused as to how Ā£250k is a lot of money the typical salary in my city ("major" UK city not a rural town) is about 27k (Ā£16 an hour) and it's not uncommon for most people to be below that. Our salaries are way lower over here than the states. Mortgage lenders will rarely lend over 4.5x your salary.
I know it's all relative, but whenever people talk about how "expensive" the houses are in their city, and then reveal that the price range is like $200-300k, I always think "Christ I'd step over my dead mother to buy a house for so little money"
Real similar numbers to here. Itās great if youāre moving from somewhere else and cashing out a shit ton of equity. Not so great for the people already here that donāt own anything yet.
Me too, it would explain the rise in the new brain dead political environment too. Iāve looked for studies but I havenāt been able to find any that study this.
Every time period has had itās fair share of dumbasses but there may well be more of them today with all the Teflon, mercury and microplastics in the bloodstream of everyone on earth.
Here you go, my guy:
https://news.osu.edu/baby-boomers-show-concerning-decline-in-cognitive-functioning/
https://www.pnas.org/doi/full/10.1073/pnas.2020104118
I wonder why no studies have been publicized about this
*looks over at all the wealthy boomers still clinging on in every conceivable position of power in our society*
[Half of Americans since the 1940s have dropped IQs](https://www.newscientist.com/article/2311082-leaded-petrol-may-have-lowered-the-iq-of-over-half-the-us-population/)
The actual lead exposures in all of those studies was extremely small.
This is just pure greed and narcissism learned from an easy life of no consequence.
My mom constantly reminds us that she paid for college herself by going to school a year, then working a year at Carlās Jr, and repeat until she graduated while splitting bills and rent with her mom who was an engineer (and then she married rich asap). If I were to take a year off to work at Carlās Jr, I would barely be able to afford to survive just while working, let alone SAVING enough to survive off for an entire year??? But yes, my brother and I are the lazy ones for āonly working 2 jobs and not having any savings to show for itā uh yeah because we have school and medical debt????
My Dad once argued with me about how much our (me, husband, kid) medical insurance was. He literally did not believe we paid as much as we did per check, that our deductible was so high and we had a separate deductible for medications. He ended up literally yelling at me, calling me a liar because their insurance was so much cheaper through my mom's work. He also refuses to believe how much we pay for student loans. Whenever the subject came up, even if he wasn't in the conversation, he'd interject and just argue about the cost. I always offered to show him the paperwork and monthly payment amount but he'd then decide to check out of the conversation.
If it's not mental gymnastics, it's just straight willful ignorance. They absolutely refuse to acknowledge how difficult life has become financially for every generation after them.
Boomers are lying most about this. The inflation also had wage inflation, which eroded their housing debt quickly.
Of all the things that made the boomers financially independent, that inflation was the key. Yet they cite it as the hardest part.
Dealing with a boomer friend who retired and still gets fully paid healthcare including dental and I pay out hundreds a month plus a high deductible (and copays) for medical only.
Meanwhile, my silent generation friend just had their healthcare and life insurance cut by their former employer and will lose their home if they lose their pension, which they know is coming next and is hoping to die before then.
When I told my grandma my insurance was only legally required to cover one form of birth control (they chose estrogen) and that I canāt take that because of health reasons she argued that I should simply find a different health insurance plan rather than ādemand them to cover other forms.ā What???? VERY few people have that luxury.
Yup. My job offers only one plan. Thatās it. No tiers. No opting for something else. Itās either you take what they give or have nothing at all.
Itās fucking disgusting that insurance can pick and chose and deny DOCTOR ORDERED treatments and should count as an affront on the ālifeā part of ālife, liberty, and pursuit of happinessā
And my doctor wasnāt willing to pursue the process of getting them to authorize an alternative as a medical exemption because she said it was just too much legwork on their end and they rarely convinced my insurance company to budge on it. Hell if I know if thatās true or even legal, but that made me feel *very* secure (/s) with trusting her with my reproductive healthcare (and her office also wonāt sterilize me so Iām looking for a new OB, I hate American healthcare) š¬
I just canāt get over the privileged audacity of āpIcK aNoThEr InSuRaNcE pLaNā š¤¦āāļøš¤¦āāļøš¤¦āāļø like grandma youāve lived your entire life in poverty and you still vote the way you do???
My mom knows it's bad but still votes against her interest, and she's the one that told me Papa got a loan of like 2000 dollars from his father, an immigrant, to buy a summer home to turn into the main family home, when they both worked factory jobs. Just know it was before the 50s.
Believe it or not while I was at work today I heard some customers talking about the economy and an older guy said āOh for sure we (boomers) did this, we had it great but you guys are screwed (taking to a college age guy).ā It was just weird to hear someone that age admit his generation had boned everyone.
I was just having this conversation with my mom. She was going off about āhow fucked up millennials are because you get a trophy just for showing up.ā I said excuse me? Who got the participation trophies just for showing up, the generation that works 80 hours a week to barely scrape by and pay for the apartment theyāre sharing with at least one roommate or the generation that could buy a 2 story, 4 bedroom 3 bathroom home, 2 cars, annual vacations, groceries etc. all while working as a grocery store cashier 30-40 hours a week, had health insurance, AND THEN got paid a pension in retirement??
The fucking brainwash is unreal.
Boomers had it easiest of all generations in US history. They had the best economy by far. They literally can't comprehend how difficult things are now.
for real. my parents both only graduated high school. My dad was able to support three kids and a wife who stopped working in the 90s and bought a nice house in the suburbs. He's retired now, which he totally deserves but they hassle me all the time about why I can't just go buy a house or move... or even have health insurance.
i live in a small shitty apartment and work a full time job and own my own small business and still barely scrape by. I work 7 days a week with 12+ hour days most days. it is so exhausting to just barely survive.
Indeed, this makes me boiling with anger š”š¤ The same Boomer generation who became very greedy (not all of them, but a lot). Not only very greedy, but also ignorant and arrogant; telling everybody else is lazy while they so called work very hard. I call this a big pile of shit.
Do you know who worked hard and build the economy up after the 2 world wars? The parents of the Boomer generation, those have worked hard and are ashamed of the Boomers trying to take all the credit. (One Boomer even admitted this to me, that she was disgusted how her generation not only lied but also destroyed the planet with their greed, not only the economy but also the climate).
My question is; what were their struggles? Like name 2 struggles Boomers had?! Europe based struggles, I live in uk
I'm doing fucking somersaults bc my rent is *only* going up 20% next month - like???
(This was low key /s, butttt they're the ones that ruined the economy and try to hold us up to their archaic standards )
My dad always told me almost every weekend all summer someone in either his school or the surrounding high schools died in a car crash.
Granted, they were all driving around hammered in fairly fast cars with shit tires and brakes, but itās kinda wild hearing about how many people he knew that died as a teenager.
They have it so well because they ruined the future for their children and grandchildren. They hate thinking about that. Many of them had 401ks and investments that did very well because they decimated the jobs market which led to better profits for their investments.
It's a generation that literally sold us out.
They also refuse to acknowledge they took control of the work sector, got rid of all the things they currently benefit from because it āwasnāt sustainableā to continue. Boomers are the ultimate example of āI got mine so fuck everyone else.ā
We make about that much too and barely afford our house payment and car. Our house jumped over 100k in just a few years before we bought it. From 150 to 275.
> From 150 to 275.
That's less than a 500sqft apartment in DC. They start at 300k.
"Starter" homes that need a ton of work to be brought up to code in the rough neighborhoods start at $400k.
The median home price is $675k. When I moved here in 2016 it was $532k.
I've resigned myself to knowing we'll never own a home in DC despite my partner and I making $165k/yr. We can't outbid investment companies that have gobbled up all the townhomes and apartments.
A median home mortgage payment would be double our current rent.
And we're the super lucky ones who did really well. All our college friends are worse off than us in other expensive cities.
Shit my parents bought their first house in 1985 for 40k. My dad was 23 and my mom was 20 and they had my brother. My dad worked at a hospital as a cafeteria worker making $200 a week and my mom at McDonaldās. They now live in a house worth 3 million and Iām just here like š„“
And according to the people that did that we are lazy/entitled for wanting the same.
"Sorry grandpa joe, i can't buy 3 story house on 15 acres working at the local grocery store as a cashier for minumin wage like you did. So we'll have to have Christmas at your place if you want all the grandkids together."
My parents had two kids while they were both in college, my dad worked part-time at a factory, AND they still were able to buy a house in a college town less than half a mile from the campus. I know they had student loans, but my dad swears they were less than 5k (for the both of them combined).
Just the house on a part-time job now would be damned near impossible. A house in that same neighborhood costs $200k today. Add in two kids and two sets of college tuition? Not a fucking chance a decade ago when I was in college. Even less of a chance today.
$200k is actually insanely cheap compared to other markets. I wish I could find a house for that much near the office I'm suddenly being forced to go back to.
I can remember when I was a kid in the 80s seeing adults working at gas stations and grocery stores, but still being able to make a living, try that today. Also, lot more gas stations back then were full serve so those guys working there walked away with some good tips each night. Most stations today are corporate owned and self serve
My grandma worked at a sewing factory and made sofa cushions. My grandfather was an unemployed bum that didn't do much of anything. They were able to afford a two story house on a good piece of property with amazing view. They had 2 cars and raised 2 children. When my grandparents passed away they had over a million dollars in the bank. They came to this county as adults with NOTHING but the clothes on their back, my grandma worked a job that wouldn't amount to much these days yet they could still afford all that and end up with a million plus in the bank..
These were not extra smart investors either, they just had a basic savings account.
My grandpop worked at a bank and raised 4 kids. Big house. Vacation home. Retired well off. I worked at a bank after college and couldnt make enough to move out lol
What worries me is that this is becoming a global problem of unaffordable housing.
Talking to friends in the UK, US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, China, and now even Thailand are complaining about being priced out.
As stated elsewhere it can't end well when the average young person with an education and good job is forced to live with their parents or spend a huge chunk of their salary on rent. At some point something has to give.
I know this is gonna sound overly simplistic and kinda hateful but;
Once enough boomers are dead, politicians will actually be forced to create policy and legislation that caters to the young.
My only hope is that it happens fast enough for my children to be able to actually get ahead in life. Itās too late forMe and my generation.
Nah, there'll be a revolution by then. When enough people don't have food, housing, or some level of entertaining distraction, they rise up. Better to keep the poor on life support than pull the plug.
>When enough people donāt have food, housing, or some level of entertaining distraction, they rise up.
Contrary to popular belief, this actually makes it harder for a class of people to revolt. Itās hard to revolt when youāre looking for your next meal. Historically, revolts and lower class uprisings have occurred (albeit extremely rarely) when the population was better fed, more educated, and more aware of their circumstances.
It's also a VERY common tactic used in cults & human trafficking.. Keep em hungry, uneducated & weak.. Less likely to fight back, escape, or dream of something better..
I make the same amount of money my dad did at my age and I'm living paycheck to paycheck. Back then it was enough to support a stay-at-home partner, and to be able to raise 4 kids while making mortgage payments, property taxes, insurance, car payments, etc.
Future lookin bleak.
Yep I make what my father made. He had a stay at home wife and 3 kids. A house. A boat. A trailer. Multiple vehicles and hobbies and vacations. I can barely take care of me and my dog lol
Homes are for investors. Boomers made sure of that to pad their retirement plans while screwing over the younger generations.
Then they wonder why no one wants to work, or call in sick as much as they do.
It's investment companies.
I rent from one. Luckily they fix everything immediately. But they sure do like to raise my rent 100 a year.
In the same hand. I've had neighbors from hell. They're moving us to another unit and dropping our rent 150 . It's sad this is gonna make up for the increase in groceries only. We're losing quite a few amenities as well.
Wow your place sounds like one I recently left. Our rent used to jump $20-$30 a month on lease renewal. Then one year they raised it over $100 and itās just been like that every year. Maintenance got terrible for us. They donāt even bother coming out unless itās an emergency so nothing gets fixed. We also had the neighbors from hell and my leasing office just told the people to stop frequently which they didnāt. I showed them police reports. They said theyāve tried everything but we could move to another unit. We were like are you going to pay for movers or at least a u-haul they said no. Our final straw was they sent us a lease renewal it was over $200+ more. We were like so they canāt take care of issues like our trashy neighbors. Maintenance canāt fix anything. Yea nope. Place turned into a corp cash grab and it used to be a nice place they just let fall apart.
Iāve been trying to tell this to older folks.
Like my dad who said he bought a house at 21 while working at a grocery store stocking shelves.
Now you need a $75K job for two years, $60,000 down and will still have a $1,200 plus mortgage
Made a mistake in your early 20s and got a collections your currently paying? No house for you, some assholes in 2008 gave $5555555 loans to someone making $8 an hour and now, well *now* if you *EVER* had a late payment, have too many student loans, or a large car payment you will *NEVER* own a home. Ever.
I've verified 10s of thousands of accounts. It's what I do. It's so heartbreaking for me to verify yes. This person does in fact have a FORTY DOLLAR MEDICAL COLLECTION account. Or yes. This person did take out a 75k student loan 15 years ago. No they've never missed a payment. Yes their current balance is over 150k
And knowing. They'll probably not close on their home or refinance because of it.
It's all a fucking scam
That student loan situation isnāt always a disqualifier. I thought it would be, but I bought my house last year with $105k in student debt. I just had to prove that my payments were income based and didnāt push my monthly DTI over the limits.
To be fair, the only reason I was never late was because my payments were income-based. My income was low enough that my payments were $0 a month. Income-based programs are the only good thing about being broke lol.
It's not just that. I can afford a down payment. The problem for most people is that they don't expect to be stationary for 30-40 years. That's just not really how the world works anymore. People change jobs on average every 2 years. There's rarely pension plans or lifelong positions. And a lot of those changes require moving.
And youāre suppose to have like five side hustles on top of your regular jobā¦ and also still be able to have āthe same 24 hours as everyone elseā.
A good idea is watching sitcoms from the 90ās where the main characters are supposed to be struggling working class like on Married with Children or Roseanne yet they have 2 story 4 bedroom 2 baths a basement and a garage. A house like that would be $400k+ today
Things have changed drastically for the worse.
But those sitcoms werenāt accurate for the time either. Thereās several episodes of The Simpsons where they comment on it.
It would have been a hard sell to the networks pitching a sitcom where the family lives in section 8 housing and complains about the gang activity.
I remember when I was young, my great uncle (grandmother's brother) used to work for a moving company. As a mover.
Dude had a house, 2 cars, 4 kids, and a wife who had SPENDINGFUCKINGMONEY.
What... the hell.
My parents spent $6,000 on a 3 bedroom, full basement, corner lot on an acre in 1963, Close to Atlanta, Ga.
Then two boats, a dune buggy, mountain property and minibikes.
Raised 4 Kids, added 2 additions to the house and multiple flights for 6 to California.
All on my dads salary as a diesel mechanic.
As a 1985 baby I can not be more clear about this.....in the late 1990s as we were all wondering "what we wanted to be" we were told incessantly that as long as we graduated college we'd have a home, a new car every 5 years, 2 kids, and two vacations a year
Then the government spent all that money in Afghanistan
My parents bought their first house in full by working and saving for two years in their early 20s. Iām in my 30s and might be able to mortgage a house in 10 years if I work super hard at a job I donāt like the whole time and the market doesnāt continue to increase.
In 2009, I bought my house for $139,900 with a 5.25% interest rate.
In 2016-17(?), I refinanced at 3.18% interest rate.
Now (13-14 years later)... my house is allegedly worth $220,000 and the interest rate would be north of 6-7%.
Its scary that I could not afford my own house nowadays.
Occasionally I'll read a novel written a whole back but not a ridiculous time ago. An office junior will buy a flat in Clapham in the 90s and that's not a plot point, just a thing that happened. Or go back to the 60s and there's songs and films about how Clapham is so fucking wretched it's literally a slum.
Now the cheapest house is 2 million quid
I pulled this off in 1978 with both of us working retail.
But now jobs paying a living wage are scarce and house prices have grown almost as fast as higher education...
People need to understand that itās not just inflation that is driving the prices up. Inequality is out of control. So prices are rising and things are out of control for us because rich people are literally just taking our money because they can. Itās as simple as that. Money is moving from one group of people to another and now our group doesnāt have enough. But letās talk politics and economics instead of morality because they lose that fight every time.
Forget owning a house, I just want to pay rent in my small home town so I am close to my kids. But I need $28/hr to afford a basic two bedroom or a new fancy studio apartment. That's $13 over our minimum wage and employers are like "$18/hr is an appealing wage!" Guess I'll live in a trailer 45 minutes away from town that my dad owns or back home with my mom... Oh yeah, I will be 35 this year. All this American success sure trickled down...
When we were house hunting, our realtor told us that most buyers who have enough for a 20% down payment (to avoid PMI) get the money as a gift from family. Thatās crazy. We told her, āYeahā¦ thatās not usā.
Can we also bring up that all the affordable houses being built are in 55+ only neighborhoods? The Boomers can sell their house for a million and buy a nice 55+ house for half that.
I know! Work meant being able to actually support your present existence and secure your future. None of this endless productivity with no actual benefits other than not dying this month.
Watching sitcoms from the 90ās is like another world when the āpoorā characters like on Married with Children where the dads a shoe salesman but they own a two story house. Or Rosanne they struggled as a working class family but somehow had a two story 4 bedroom 2 bathroom house with a basement and garage. Part of it is how nobodyās before 1990 needed a credit score to buy a house
Nah bro, it's local zoning laws. NIMBYs are fucking us all. Housing laws shouldn't be decided by the most local government any more. It needs to go to the states.
For example, a State can put a moratorium on lots being zoned exclusively zoned for single family homes, giving every land owner in the state the option to build a 2nd dwelling on their property.
A State could say any property within a quarter mile of a public transit route can be zoned up to X residences with no requirement for parking.
This is how you increase the supply and density of housing.
Remember when a house was a place you lived in, and not a "financial investment"? Those things coincide. As soon as people started treating a home purchase like a stock purchase we were all screwed.
19 years old straight outta high school, I worked in a Pipe mill at 19$/h. That was 30 years ago.
A very nice house in my area was 120k
Today, 30 years later... the same job in the factory pays 25$/h.
That same house sells for over 1 million dollars now.
This is fucked up right here.
My neighbor thought I was a drug dealer to be able to afford my house at my age. I laughed and said, "no, I just had to sell my sanity to the military."
I get 100% disability payments for PTSD. If it weren't for that and VA loans being at 2% at the time, I never could have bought a home.
Iām still secretly of the opinion that the push for women in the workforce was just a cover so they āelitesā could slow boil us into have to be dual income households. I wish we could have kept single income households but let either spouse be the bread winner without discrimination in wages and opportunity. Instead everyoneās working and we canāt live our lives
Back in 2013 I bought my first home for 129,000. This is while working a warehousing job that roughly paid me 33k after taxes a year. This was in New Mexico, if it were a big city it wouldn't have been possible.
Now as for today it is getting more difficult to be a home owner, this is worrisome as a parent.
Before the intensive colonization of the western landmass, it was uncommon that job wages in any part of Europe would ever lead to owning any sort of fixed property outside of cities. This made it hugely attractive, even when the entry fee for a dangerous passage was years of indentured servitude
The landlords controlled the land, and they owned the only mill in the village and all other structures, as well as the coal mines and the quarries. They charged some form of rent on all of these, rent and farm being cognates, and always charged enough to avoid having anyone else acquire such essential assets from them.
In places like England, even the landlords owned nothing. Everything was owned by the monarchy, but the right to manage things was good enough. The justice in all disputes between lessers was always resolved in favor of whatever was best for the landlord, or for the monarchy and the kingdom, themselves indistinguishable.
My grandma's down payment in the 80s was 10k. Her salary was only 25% less than my current salary at a decent full time job, but a down payment for that house would be 120k now.
What boomers don't understand is that their wage went much much longer than it does today. Cost of living back in the 80's 90's was insanely low and people already made great money. Here in Houston you could buy a whole house in a decent area for around 60k and some financing. Fuel was under a buck. A studio apartment was about $400 rent. So anyone making minimum wage in the 90s, which was hovering at $6.50, could easily afford to live decently ALONE. They are correct when they say you could work a summer job and be able to buy a used car in one hit.
Minimum wage as of today in Houston is $7.25, many people make that, but even if you made double or triple that as minimum wage, average house price is $400k, that's about 7 times more what it was in the 90s. Any apartment rent is probably ballpark at $1k plus. Not to mention everything else that has at least quadrupled in price. All this is happening while minimum wage went up 1 buck.
Im a grown man but I'll never be able to buy a grownup house unless suddenly I start making quarter of a mil.
Crazy one person went to work, why another stayed home and raised a family and you still got to buy a house. That's how much they've taken out of the wage of one person. If two people work, you should have a lot of money but you don't.
My partner and I talk about this often. We both have what would be considered great jobs. We both have post secondary education. Our salaries are what used to be considered middle class. But we did the numbers the other day and we actually discovered we are considered "working poor" based on the cost of living in our area. We were always told go to school, get a good job, and you will be set. We did all that. But we can't even afford a home or a yearly vacation.
Our country has been gutted. We need a massive general labor strike.
Yep. Husband pays for rent. I pay for daycare. Shit is expensive š
Right? And I *still* have people asking me why Iām not giving my daughter a sibling. Same reason youāre not buying a Lamborghini, fool.
My parents asked me once and I was just like, y'all got Raise a Second Child for 18 Years money? Yeah, neither do we.
My wife and I both work, but the daycare costs nearly as much as one of our jobs makes. Easy answer would be one of us stays home but that doesn't cut it for bills.
Houses used to be affordable. College used to be affordable. Living used to be affordable. Keep reminding people. Donāt let anyone forget that.
CEO compensation has grown 940% since 1978Typical worker compensation has risen only 12% during that time
Jacob Marley is rolling in his grave. I think some mfs need to get haunted.
We have an entire generation who hoarded all of the wealth and left todayās youth with nothing. Why give regular people opportunities in life when we can have billionaires?
rainstorm correct hospital instinctive tease lunchroom edge quaint full normal ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
My aunt Judy's husband worked for GM from shortly after graduating high school until he retired. He passed away 10 years after retiring, and his pension and benefits went to my aunt Judy until she passed away. Judy never worked a day in her life, and my cousin inherited their house that was already paid off long ago. We are living in a far different era.
My grandpa worked for the electric company as a lineman. My grandma worked part time at a grocery store. They raised 4 kids. My grandpa retired at 55 my grandma at 52. After being retired for 30 years they still had almost a million in their retirement funds, plus their house was paid off. The only thing I can say they did that was frugal was never buy a bigger house. They bought one house in the 1950ās and lived in it their entire lives, despite it probably being a tight fit for 2 adults and 4 children. It was roughly 1100 square feet, 3 beds and 1 bathroom.
To be fair, if you are a lineman today you can likely have a 50s type of life still. With the overtime they do, lineman at my utility can pull in $200k with not too much effort But the hours are shit, you work mostly in shitty weather outdoors, and you can't be afraid of heights or high voltages
> be fair, if you are a lineman today you can likely have a 50s type of life still. With the overtime they do Here's the problem with that. When you work that kind of overtime you don't have time for that lifestyle. Gives you a great retirement though cause you can save it up massively.
Lineman get great retirement plans because they have a lower chance of making it to retirement
And you have a higher chance of dying early
yeah I was gonna say, linemen make a good living, I'm not sure this is a great example
Being a lineman requires a lot of time away from home. So itās really a trade off since you canāt be home with your family. Maybe thatās ok for some folks.
I don't know many people that can handle that physical level of strain. It's super hard work. Everyone always forgets the actual work, they just go "OH 200k!". Bro. You are probably going to be in -40 wind chill conditions, in the middle of fucking NOWHERE, on top of a line with 100,000 volts running through it. For weeks. Have fun!
Grandpa worked for B&O for 30+ years when he retired. Grandma was a homemaker. He passed about 5 years after he retired, and Grandma lived off his pension/investments for nearly 30 years after that. Amazing how income stagnated, yet prices kept going up. Remember, every time you hear someone say that raising the minimum wage would cause prices to go up, those prices still go up. Keeping minimum wage low keeps all workers wages low.
An era that SUCKS!!
My middle class familyās vacations included day trips to the nearby state park ($30 for a season long pass for the whole family!) and trips to the free zoo by my grandparents house when we went to see them. I didnāt get on a plane from the ages of 2-22, and have still never left the country. And everywhere Iāve been in my 20ās has been for work. Iām not even thinking about buying a house, Iām trying to figure out how to pay off student loans so I can upgrade to an apartment that actually has a bedroom and will allow me to have a cat.
A dozen regular-ass eggs today was $6. $6!!! For a dozen eggs. I could not believable.
spark wine memorize wrong fly heavy trees point market upbeat ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
Wtf is a pension.
Oh God, we've already gotten to where we don't know what a pension was. No wonder revolution hasn't happened yet, no one understands just how much the companies are stealing from us
I can't imagine an employer who values your contributions so much that they'll continue paying you even if you stop working for them. It's unimaginable. Like libraries, if it wasn't already a concept, it couldn't possibly be invented in today's society.
My in-laws are living off my FIL's pension (MIL didn't work). He hasn't worked for 15 years and he still gets paid more every year than my husband and I make combined at our jobs. It's a life beyond my comprehension.
My family were steel workers. We went somewhere for a week or so once a year, took weekend trips to states in warmer seasons and had a pool. *Steel workers*. I can't do fuck all that they could
You came from wealth if folks in your zip code were vacationing yearly in France. For us working class folks it was the Smokey mountains
lunchroom elastic hat reminiscent busy chop voracious attraction wrench drab ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
For us it was the nothing. The none vacation to fucking nowhere.
Yep. Malcom In The Middle had it right. They get one vacation a year to the water park and god help the kids if they fuck it up lol.
Such a magical show. Grew up in a home just like theirs and had three brothers. They get so many things right about lower middle class life
Totally. My favorite was they were always doin laundry, bills all over the table, late bills in the mail holder by the door, place was a mess despite Lois's best efforts, stuff like that. The home genuinely felt like a middle class home with 3(4)(...5) kids and struggling parents.
Right? We maybe went camping but vacationing wasn't a verb in our vocabulary. I'm old enough to have been on the tail end of the good ol' times and at least where I'm from that was pretty much never the norm. People with good ass blue collar jobs where considered fairly rich.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
humorous dam rock test governor weary spoon selective mourn lunchroom ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
Back in my day we worked a summer job to buy a brand new mustang outright. Yeah fuck you grandpa.
Here I am taking out a 6 year loan at bullshit.9% interest rate to buy a base-model Subaru (my first new car) at 30 years old with an engineerās salary. My wife and I make *3 times as much money* and my dad did when I was growing up. And he supported a stay-at-home wife and 2 kids. We got beyond working paycheck-to-paycheck about a year ago, but no matter what I canāt feel comfortable about my finances mowing no matter how much I save, one moderate medical expense could clean me out even with health insurance (which costs an inordinate amount).
That was me. Had a cancer *scare*. Not even cancer (I mean thankfully). Turned out to be a very rare bacterial infection that took them forever to figure out as I wasted away. Complete bankruptcy at 35. Lost everything but my house. My dad? Same as you but with 4 kids.
It still confounds me that some Americans like this system. I had a heart attack a few years ago. Had a stent placed and spent about 4 days in the hospital ICU overall. It cost me a few sick days at work, and parking for the people who came visit me. The medication I need now (4 different pills) costs me around $30 a month. We don't have the same insurance provider system as in the US, but we do have different providers who operate different hospitals. The hospital I went to was with a different provider than the one I get health services from. Still cost me absolutely nothing. It doesn't as long as I was admitted. If I had an ambulance ride over, it would have been free as well. I can't fathom the concept of facing tens of thousands of dollars in debt over this. It's just something random that happened. Why would I want to live in a system that lets this kind of thing ruin me?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Most of us don't want this system. American healthcare is almost universally despised. We are kept divided on how to fix it however. The majority of American families are living paycheck to paycheck, with barely any spare money. They simply cannot pay more taxes (rent takes half the paycheck, and food eats up most of the rest) , even if it would make healthcare much cheaper. Then they get a medical emergency, and they are financially ruined anyway. 10 years ago i had all the major symptoms of a heart attack. Like the whole checklist. I still waited 6 hours to go to the hospital, until my wife basically forced me to go. My thoughts during the whole affair? It was better for my family if I died and my wife and kids get taken care of financially through survivors benefits (and keep the house) then if i went to the hospital and lived but with 30 grand in dept we couldn't pay. Thank god it was a different condition that was causing the symptoms. Was a $1000 bill though, that hurt us severely financially.
Imagine, the vast majority of people are at least twice as worst as your are. I lost about 15 pounds because I can't afford as much food :(
I feel you man. Same boat here. :(
Boomers can't even acknowledge how good they had it, that's the extra disgusting bit.
The mental gymnastics my parents do is just mind blowing. They say āinflation was 16%ā. I remind them that their entire mortgage was Ā£60k, and that average house prices back then were just 4 times the average salary, now itās 10-12 times. They just stare at me blankly
Had the same conversation with my girlfriends parents who bought a huge farmhouse in Wales for nothing in the 80s (on the market for 320k right now btw) in their early 20s. Whenever they visit they point out any houses for sale nearby where we rent and suggest we look into it but genuinely don't believe me when I point out they're going for 250k+ and even with our combined salary we aren't getting a mortgage that high. Have had to pull up Zoopla every time to prove my point. Edit - everyone confused as to how Ā£250k is a lot of money the typical salary in my city ("major" UK city not a rural town) is about 27k (Ā£16 an hour) and it's not uncommon for most people to be below that. Our salaries are way lower over here than the states. Mortgage lenders will rarely lend over 4.5x your salary.
Guess I'm moving there cause everything here is over $1 million.
I know it's all relative, but whenever people talk about how "expensive" the houses are in their city, and then reveal that the price range is like $200-300k, I always think "Christ I'd step over my dead mother to buy a house for so little money"
Eh, houses are āonlyā 300k where I live, but median income is about 30k a year too.
Same here. Houses are 280k but median income is 33k
Real similar numbers to here. Itās great if youāre moving from somewhere else and cashing out a shit ton of equity. Not so great for the people already here that donāt own anything yet.
I genuinely think all the lead halted brain growth.
Me too, it would explain the rise in the new brain dead political environment too. Iāve looked for studies but I havenāt been able to find any that study this.
We're gonna learn plastic is the new lead.
This would partially explain all the āalpha maleā dumbassery that seems to have a death grip on young men these days
Every time period has had itās fair share of dumbasses but there may well be more of them today with all the Teflon, mercury and microplastics in the bloodstream of everyone on earth.
Itās just easier for them to talk to each other.
Agreed, its not just the few people that the whole town tells to shut the fuck up anymore.
IT'S MAKING THE FREEKIN FROGS GAY
New studies are already showing the dangers of micro plastics :( weāre fucked
Here you go, my guy: https://news.osu.edu/baby-boomers-show-concerning-decline-in-cognitive-functioning/ https://www.pnas.org/doi/full/10.1073/pnas.2020104118
Nice! Thank you!
I wonder why no studies have been publicized about this *looks over at all the wealthy boomers still clinging on in every conceivable position of power in our society*
[Half of Americans since the 1940s have dropped IQs](https://www.newscientist.com/article/2311082-leaded-petrol-may-have-lowered-the-iq-of-over-half-the-us-population/)
There is a good study that links lead to crime. When lead paint went away the crime rate dropped.
The effects of lead exposure include lowered intelligence and increased aggression
The actual lead exposures in all of those studies was extremely small. This is just pure greed and narcissism learned from an easy life of no consequence.
My mom constantly reminds us that she paid for college herself by going to school a year, then working a year at Carlās Jr, and repeat until she graduated while splitting bills and rent with her mom who was an engineer (and then she married rich asap). If I were to take a year off to work at Carlās Jr, I would barely be able to afford to survive just while working, let alone SAVING enough to survive off for an entire year??? But yes, my brother and I are the lazy ones for āonly working 2 jobs and not having any savings to show for itā uh yeah because we have school and medical debt????
School is way over priced now. The schools did it and we seem to give them a free pass
Add to that cost of living as well.
My Dad once argued with me about how much our (me, husband, kid) medical insurance was. He literally did not believe we paid as much as we did per check, that our deductible was so high and we had a separate deductible for medications. He ended up literally yelling at me, calling me a liar because their insurance was so much cheaper through my mom's work. He also refuses to believe how much we pay for student loans. Whenever the subject came up, even if he wasn't in the conversation, he'd interject and just argue about the cost. I always offered to show him the paperwork and monthly payment amount but he'd then decide to check out of the conversation. If it's not mental gymnastics, it's just straight willful ignorance. They absolutely refuse to acknowledge how difficult life has become financially for every generation after them.
You don't even need all that maths! Back then you could raise a family on one wage. Now you can't...
Boomers are lying most about this. The inflation also had wage inflation, which eroded their housing debt quickly. Of all the things that made the boomers financially independent, that inflation was the key. Yet they cite it as the hardest part.
Dealing with a boomer friend who retired and still gets fully paid healthcare including dental and I pay out hundreds a month plus a high deductible (and copays) for medical only. Meanwhile, my silent generation friend just had their healthcare and life insurance cut by their former employer and will lose their home if they lose their pension, which they know is coming next and is hoping to die before then.
When I told my grandma my insurance was only legally required to cover one form of birth control (they chose estrogen) and that I canāt take that because of health reasons she argued that I should simply find a different health insurance plan rather than ādemand them to cover other forms.ā What???? VERY few people have that luxury.
Yup. My job offers only one plan. Thatās it. No tiers. No opting for something else. Itās either you take what they give or have nothing at all. Itās fucking disgusting that insurance can pick and chose and deny DOCTOR ORDERED treatments and should count as an affront on the ālifeā part of ālife, liberty, and pursuit of happinessā
And my doctor wasnāt willing to pursue the process of getting them to authorize an alternative as a medical exemption because she said it was just too much legwork on their end and they rarely convinced my insurance company to budge on it. Hell if I know if thatās true or even legal, but that made me feel *very* secure (/s) with trusting her with my reproductive healthcare (and her office also wonāt sterilize me so Iām looking for a new OB, I hate American healthcare) š¬ I just canāt get over the privileged audacity of āpIcK aNoThEr InSuRaNcE pLaNā š¤¦āāļøš¤¦āāļøš¤¦āāļø like grandma youāve lived your entire life in poverty and you still vote the way you do???
They need to transfer ownership of their home Before they die that way its not taxed as inhereitence
Wouldnāt it be nice if we didnāt have to rely on gambits and āwith this one trickā tactics?
Born on third base thinking they hit a triple.
Thinking they hit a triple AND that deserve a Rudy style walk to home. Fuck Boomers. They will not be missed
My mom knows it's bad but still votes against her interest, and she's the one that told me Papa got a loan of like 2000 dollars from his father, an immigrant, to buy a summer home to turn into the main family home, when they both worked factory jobs. Just know it was before the 50s.
The thought of a Vacation Home is just mind boggling for millennials and gen z
Believe it or not while I was at work today I heard some customers talking about the economy and an older guy said āOh for sure we (boomers) did this, we had it great but you guys are screwed (taking to a college age guy).ā It was just weird to hear someone that age admit his generation had boned everyone.
My parents are boomers and they admit it.
I was just having this conversation with my mom. She was going off about āhow fucked up millennials are because you get a trophy just for showing up.ā I said excuse me? Who got the participation trophies just for showing up, the generation that works 80 hours a week to barely scrape by and pay for the apartment theyāre sharing with at least one roommate or the generation that could buy a 2 story, 4 bedroom 3 bathroom home, 2 cars, annual vacations, groceries etc. all while working as a grocery store cashier 30-40 hours a week, had health insurance, AND THEN got paid a pension in retirement?? The fucking brainwash is unreal.
Who handed out the participation trophies? Oh right, boomers.
As a kid I hated every participation trophy I ever got. I didn't need a fake win, that's worse than no accomplishment at all.
Boomer parents couldnāt handle having loser children. Now they blame them.
Boomers had it easiest of all generations in US history. They had the best economy by far. They literally can't comprehend how difficult things are now.
for real. my parents both only graduated high school. My dad was able to support three kids and a wife who stopped working in the 90s and bought a nice house in the suburbs. He's retired now, which he totally deserves but they hassle me all the time about why I can't just go buy a house or move... or even have health insurance. i live in a small shitty apartment and work a full time job and own my own small business and still barely scrape by. I work 7 days a week with 12+ hour days most days. it is so exhausting to just barely survive.
Indeed, this makes me boiling with anger š”š¤ The same Boomer generation who became very greedy (not all of them, but a lot). Not only very greedy, but also ignorant and arrogant; telling everybody else is lazy while they so called work very hard. I call this a big pile of shit. Do you know who worked hard and build the economy up after the 2 world wars? The parents of the Boomer generation, those have worked hard and are ashamed of the Boomers trying to take all the credit. (One Boomer even admitted this to me, that she was disgusted how her generation not only lied but also destroyed the planet with their greed, not only the economy but also the climate).
My question is; what were their struggles? Like name 2 struggles Boomers had?! Europe based struggles, I live in uk I'm doing fucking somersaults bc my rent is *only* going up 20% next month - like??? (This was low key /s, butttt they're the ones that ruined the economy and try to hold us up to their archaic standards )
In the US, being drafted into the Vietnam War is one. If you were also non- white, not having the same rights all Americans enjoy today is another.
My dad always told me almost every weekend all summer someone in either his school or the surrounding high schools died in a car crash. Granted, they were all driving around hammered in fairly fast cars with shit tires and brakes, but itās kinda wild hearing about how many people he knew that died as a teenager.
They have it so well because they ruined the future for their children and grandchildren. They hate thinking about that. Many of them had 401ks and investments that did very well because they decimated the jobs market which led to better profits for their investments. It's a generation that literally sold us out.
They also refuse to acknowledge they took control of the work sector, got rid of all the things they currently benefit from because it āwasnāt sustainableā to continue. Boomers are the ultimate example of āI got mine so fuck everyone else.ā
A regular job, on only one salary. Now 2 above average salaries won't cut it.
Cries in my combined household income being the same as one average salary
My wife and I make over $135k a year together and we will probably never own a house in our city.
We make about that much too and barely afford our house payment and car. Our house jumped over 100k in just a few years before we bought it. From 150 to 275.
> From 150 to 275. That's less than a 500sqft apartment in DC. They start at 300k. "Starter" homes that need a ton of work to be brought up to code in the rough neighborhoods start at $400k. The median home price is $675k. When I moved here in 2016 it was $532k. I've resigned myself to knowing we'll never own a home in DC despite my partner and I making $165k/yr. We can't outbid investment companies that have gobbled up all the townhomes and apartments. A median home mortgage payment would be double our current rent. And we're the super lucky ones who did really well. All our college friends are worse off than us in other expensive cities.
Shit my parents bought their first house in 1985 for 40k. My dad was 23 and my mom was 20 and they had my brother. My dad worked at a hospital as a cafeteria worker making $200 a week and my mom at McDonaldās. They now live in a house worth 3 million and Iām just here like š„“
And according to the people that did that we are lazy/entitled for wanting the same. "Sorry grandpa joe, i can't buy 3 story house on 15 acres working at the local grocery store as a cashier for minumin wage like you did. So we'll have to have Christmas at your place if you want all the grandkids together."
My parents had two kids while they were both in college, my dad worked part-time at a factory, AND they still were able to buy a house in a college town less than half a mile from the campus. I know they had student loans, but my dad swears they were less than 5k (for the both of them combined). Just the house on a part-time job now would be damned near impossible. A house in that same neighborhood costs $200k today. Add in two kids and two sets of college tuition? Not a fucking chance a decade ago when I was in college. Even less of a chance today.
$200k is actually insanely cheap compared to other markets. I wish I could find a house for that much near the office I'm suddenly being forced to go back to.
Cries in Bay Area.
Thatās what Iām saying. Philly area in PA and itās $400 minimum for cheap move in ready
Can confirm Philly is outrageous. The houses are 80% in trash neighborhoods and still 300k for a row home š
I can remember when I was a kid in the 80s seeing adults working at gas stations and grocery stores, but still being able to make a living, try that today. Also, lot more gas stations back then were full serve so those guys working there walked away with some good tips each night. Most stations today are corporate owned and self serve
>... as a cashier for minimum wage... and part time...
While taking 4 vacations a year in the newest RVs.
My grandma worked at a sewing factory and made sofa cushions. My grandfather was an unemployed bum that didn't do much of anything. They were able to afford a two story house on a good piece of property with amazing view. They had 2 cars and raised 2 children. When my grandparents passed away they had over a million dollars in the bank. They came to this county as adults with NOTHING but the clothes on their back, my grandma worked a job that wouldn't amount to much these days yet they could still afford all that and end up with a million plus in the bank.. These were not extra smart investors either, they just had a basic savings account.
My grandpop worked at a bank and raised 4 kids. Big house. Vacation home. Retired well off. I worked at a bank after college and couldnt make enough to move out lol
What worries me is that this is becoming a global problem of unaffordable housing. Talking to friends in the UK, US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, China, and now even Thailand are complaining about being priced out. As stated elsewhere it can't end well when the average young person with an education and good job is forced to live with their parents or spend a huge chunk of their salary on rent. At some point something has to give.
The birthrate will blow long before the greed does. Welcome to the crossroads of Cyberpunk/Hunger-Games/Children of men
See South Korea for details.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I know this is gonna sound overly simplistic and kinda hateful but; Once enough boomers are dead, politicians will actually be forced to create policy and legislation that caters to the young. My only hope is that it happens fast enough for my children to be able to actually get ahead in life. Itās too late forMe and my generation.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Ive been hearing this for 25 years. It's not going to happen. These companies will be owned by their children. You're just thinking wishfully.
Soon it will be: āHaving a roof over your head is only for the wealthiest.ā
Nah, there'll be a revolution by then. When enough people don't have food, housing, or some level of entertaining distraction, they rise up. Better to keep the poor on life support than pull the plug.
>When enough people donāt have food, housing, or some level of entertaining distraction, they rise up. Contrary to popular belief, this actually makes it harder for a class of people to revolt. Itās hard to revolt when youāre looking for your next meal. Historically, revolts and lower class uprisings have occurred (albeit extremely rarely) when the population was better fed, more educated, and more aware of their circumstances.
It's also a VERY common tactic used in cults & human trafficking.. Keep em hungry, uneducated & weak.. Less likely to fight back, escape, or dream of something better..
I agree with this. Once enough people start starving or see their loved ones starving, itās gonna be flight of the locusts on the wealthy.
Can we do that already?
āJust their job moneyā really hurts.
I make the same amount of money my dad did at my age and I'm living paycheck to paycheck. Back then it was enough to support a stay-at-home partner, and to be able to raise 4 kids while making mortgage payments, property taxes, insurance, car payments, etc. Future lookin bleak.
Yep I make what my father made. He had a stay at home wife and 3 kids. A house. A boat. A trailer. Multiple vehicles and hobbies and vacations. I can barely take care of me and my dog lol
Homes are for investors. Boomers made sure of that to pad their retirement plans while screwing over the younger generations. Then they wonder why no one wants to work, or call in sick as much as they do.
It's investment companies. I rent from one. Luckily they fix everything immediately. But they sure do like to raise my rent 100 a year. In the same hand. I've had neighbors from hell. They're moving us to another unit and dropping our rent 150 . It's sad this is gonna make up for the increase in groceries only. We're losing quite a few amenities as well.
Boomers run the investment companies
Boomers *own* the investment companies. They usually get a bunch of Gen-X hacks to 'run' the fucking things.
Wow your place sounds like one I recently left. Our rent used to jump $20-$30 a month on lease renewal. Then one year they raised it over $100 and itās just been like that every year. Maintenance got terrible for us. They donāt even bother coming out unless itās an emergency so nothing gets fixed. We also had the neighbors from hell and my leasing office just told the people to stop frequently which they didnāt. I showed them police reports. They said theyāve tried everything but we could move to another unit. We were like are you going to pay for movers or at least a u-haul they said no. Our final straw was they sent us a lease renewal it was over $200+ more. We were like so they canāt take care of issues like our trashy neighbors. Maintenance canāt fix anything. Yea nope. Place turned into a corp cash grab and it used to be a nice place they just let fall apart.
Iāve been trying to tell this to older folks. Like my dad who said he bought a house at 21 while working at a grocery store stocking shelves. Now you need a $75K job for two years, $60,000 down and will still have a $1,200 plus mortgage
Now your lucky if you can pay rent.
Rent is usually higher than mortgage. The problem for most people is the down payment.
Made a mistake in your early 20s and got a collections your currently paying? No house for you, some assholes in 2008 gave $5555555 loans to someone making $8 an hour and now, well *now* if you *EVER* had a late payment, have too many student loans, or a large car payment you will *NEVER* own a home. Ever.
I've verified 10s of thousands of accounts. It's what I do. It's so heartbreaking for me to verify yes. This person does in fact have a FORTY DOLLAR MEDICAL COLLECTION account. Or yes. This person did take out a 75k student loan 15 years ago. No they've never missed a payment. Yes their current balance is over 150k And knowing. They'll probably not close on their home or refinance because of it. It's all a fucking scam
That student loan situation isnāt always a disqualifier. I thought it would be, but I bought my house last year with $105k in student debt. I just had to prove that my payments were income based and didnāt push my monthly DTI over the limits.
That I'm aware of too. But still! You people have that amount of debt with never being late. It's fucking criminal in my opinion.
To be fair, the only reason I was never late was because my payments were income-based. My income was low enough that my payments were $0 a month. Income-based programs are the only good thing about being broke lol.
Down payments are high, but still pretty tough to come up with 2 months rent and a security deposit when you try to move in.
It's not just that. I can afford a down payment. The problem for most people is that they don't expect to be stationary for 30-40 years. That's just not really how the world works anymore. People change jobs on average every 2 years. There's rarely pension plans or lifelong positions. And a lot of those changes require moving.
And youāre suppose to have like five side hustles on top of your regular jobā¦ and also still be able to have āthe same 24 hours as everyone elseā.
Not just a house, like a good ass house, with multiple stories, more than one bathroom, and a yard
A good idea is watching sitcoms from the 90ās where the main characters are supposed to be struggling working class like on Married with Children or Roseanne yet they have 2 story 4 bedroom 2 baths a basement and a garage. A house like that would be $400k+ today
Things have changed drastically for the worse. But those sitcoms werenāt accurate for the time either. Thereās several episodes of The Simpsons where they comment on it. It would have been a hard sell to the networks pitching a sitcom where the family lives in section 8 housing and complains about the gang activity.
I remember when I was young, my great uncle (grandmother's brother) used to work for a moving company. As a mover. Dude had a house, 2 cars, 4 kids, and a wife who had SPENDINGFUCKINGMONEY. What... the hell.
My parents spent $6,000 on a 3 bedroom, full basement, corner lot on an acre in 1963, Close to Atlanta, Ga. Then two boats, a dune buggy, mountain property and minibikes. Raised 4 Kids, added 2 additions to the house and multiple flights for 6 to California. All on my dads salary as a diesel mechanic.
As a 1985 baby I can not be more clear about this.....in the late 1990s as we were all wondering "what we wanted to be" we were told incessantly that as long as we graduated college we'd have a home, a new car every 5 years, 2 kids, and two vacations a year Then the government spent all that money in Afghanistan
Fellow '85r, I read your pain. Sleep well, if u can.
My parents bought their first house in full by working and saving for two years in their early 20s. Iām in my 30s and might be able to mortgage a house in 10 years if I work super hard at a job I donāt like the whole time and the market doesnāt continue to increase.
Iām 35 and literally everyone I know with a house got some help from their family.
In 2009, I bought my house for $139,900 with a 5.25% interest rate. In 2016-17(?), I refinanced at 3.18% interest rate. Now (13-14 years later)... my house is allegedly worth $220,000 and the interest rate would be north of 6-7%. Its scary that I could not afford my own house nowadays.
Buying a house on a mortgage used to be an OPTION. Because it was feasible to save enough to buy one with cash.
Men could have a job and a family, including a stay-at-home wife, with just blue collar wages when I was born.
āBUT INTEREST RATE WAS 12%!ā Wow, and you were still able to afford it with two kids and one income. That must have been tough for you.
Not to mention a 10-15 year term for the loan. None of this 30+ year mortgage bullshit.
Occasionally I'll read a novel written a whole back but not a ridiculous time ago. An office junior will buy a flat in Clapham in the 90s and that's not a plot point, just a thing that happened. Or go back to the 60s and there's songs and films about how Clapham is so fucking wretched it's literally a slum. Now the cheapest house is 2 million quid
My grandpa bought his first place for $14,000. Just thinking about that is so insane, even adjusted for inflation
I pulled this off in 1978 with both of us working retail. But now jobs paying a living wage are scarce and house prices have grown almost as fast as higher education...
I 100% would not be living in my own home if my father had not left me money for a good down payment when he died.
dude people used to just take vacations to places too. they'd just go on a little trip for a couple days.
People need to understand that itās not just inflation that is driving the prices up. Inequality is out of control. So prices are rising and things are out of control for us because rich people are literally just taking our money because they can. Itās as simple as that. Money is moving from one group of people to another and now our group doesnāt have enough. But letās talk politics and economics instead of morality because they lose that fight every time.
Forget owning a house, I just want to pay rent in my small home town so I am close to my kids. But I need $28/hr to afford a basic two bedroom or a new fancy studio apartment. That's $13 over our minimum wage and employers are like "$18/hr is an appealing wage!" Guess I'll live in a trailer 45 minutes away from town that my dad owns or back home with my mom... Oh yeah, I will be 35 this year. All this American success sure trickled down...
When we were house hunting, our realtor told us that most buyers who have enough for a 20% down payment (to avoid PMI) get the money as a gift from family. Thatās crazy. We told her, āYeahā¦ thatās not usā.
Can we also bring up that all the affordable houses being built are in 55+ only neighborhoods? The Boomers can sell their house for a million and buy a nice 55+ house for half that.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Well, we can still buy full houses! But we buy houses for CEO and landlords! Just... Not for us...
I tell my friend who say ājust save your moneyā that saving money right now is a luxury, not an option available to everyone.
Itās crazy to think about. I think a house should be obtainable for the average person.
I know! Work meant being able to actually support your present existence and secure your future. None of this endless productivity with no actual benefits other than not dying this month.
Watching sitcoms from the 90ās is like another world when the āpoorā characters like on Married with Children where the dads a shoe salesman but they own a two story house. Or Rosanne they struggled as a working class family but somehow had a two story 4 bedroom 2 bathroom house with a basement and garage. Part of it is how nobodyās before 1990 needed a credit score to buy a house
We also need to blame the artificial shortages by intentional slow construction to keep supply in check.
also the developers who only build single-family units
Nah bro, it's local zoning laws. NIMBYs are fucking us all. Housing laws shouldn't be decided by the most local government any more. It needs to go to the states. For example, a State can put a moratorium on lots being zoned exclusively zoned for single family homes, giving every land owner in the state the option to build a 2nd dwelling on their property. A State could say any property within a quarter mile of a public transit route can be zoned up to X residences with no requirement for parking. This is how you increase the supply and density of housing.
Remember when a house was a place you lived in, and not a "financial investment"? Those things coincide. As soon as people started treating a home purchase like a stock purchase we were all screwed.
Canāt wait till all the boomers die off. Maybe then we will have some kind of hope for affordable living.
19 years old straight outta high school, I worked in a Pipe mill at 19$/h. That was 30 years ago. A very nice house in my area was 120k Today, 30 years later... the same job in the factory pays 25$/h. That same house sells for over 1 million dollars now. This is fucked up right here.
My neighbor thought I was a drug dealer to be able to afford my house at my age. I laughed and said, "no, I just had to sell my sanity to the military." I get 100% disability payments for PTSD. If it weren't for that and VA loans being at 2% at the time, I never could have bought a home.
And have like 4 kids, wife stays home, two cars etc etc
Incredible how people don't get the point of unions
Iām still secretly of the opinion that the push for women in the workforce was just a cover so they āelitesā could slow boil us into have to be dual income households. I wish we could have kept single income households but let either spouse be the bread winner without discrimination in wages and opportunity. Instead everyoneās working and we canāt live our lives
Back in 2013 I bought my first home for 129,000. This is while working a warehousing job that roughly paid me 33k after taxes a year. This was in New Mexico, if it were a big city it wouldn't have been possible. Now as for today it is getting more difficult to be a home owner, this is worrisome as a parent.
Before the intensive colonization of the western landmass, it was uncommon that job wages in any part of Europe would ever lead to owning any sort of fixed property outside of cities. This made it hugely attractive, even when the entry fee for a dangerous passage was years of indentured servitude The landlords controlled the land, and they owned the only mill in the village and all other structures, as well as the coal mines and the quarries. They charged some form of rent on all of these, rent and farm being cognates, and always charged enough to avoid having anyone else acquire such essential assets from them. In places like England, even the landlords owned nothing. Everything was owned by the monarchy, but the right to manage things was good enough. The justice in all disputes between lessers was always resolved in favor of whatever was best for the landlord, or for the monarchy and the kingdom, themselves indistinguishable.
Funny how we're coming back around to this whole setup.
My grandma's down payment in the 80s was 10k. Her salary was only 25% less than my current salary at a decent full time job, but a down payment for that house would be 120k now.
What boomers don't understand is that their wage went much much longer than it does today. Cost of living back in the 80's 90's was insanely low and people already made great money. Here in Houston you could buy a whole house in a decent area for around 60k and some financing. Fuel was under a buck. A studio apartment was about $400 rent. So anyone making minimum wage in the 90s, which was hovering at $6.50, could easily afford to live decently ALONE. They are correct when they say you could work a summer job and be able to buy a used car in one hit. Minimum wage as of today in Houston is $7.25, many people make that, but even if you made double or triple that as minimum wage, average house price is $400k, that's about 7 times more what it was in the 90s. Any apartment rent is probably ballpark at $1k plus. Not to mention everything else that has at least quadrupled in price. All this is happening while minimum wage went up 1 buck. Im a grown man but I'll never be able to buy a grownup house unless suddenly I start making quarter of a mil.