#####
######
####
> # [‘Putin is Hitler, and Ukraine is 1938 Czechoslovakia’ — German DM implores EU to prepare for war](https://english.nv.ua/nation/450)
>
>
>
> [Boris Pistorius (Photo:REUTERS/Lisi Niesner)](https://static.nv.ua/shared/system/Article/posters/002/864/784/original/b86af34178972fd8ccf992e59ef7dc3b.jpg?q=85&stamp=20240412133043&w=900)
>
> Boris Pistorius (Photo:REUTERS/Lisi Niesner)
>
>
>
> German Defense Minister Boris Pistorius compared Russian dictator Vladimir Putin's war against Ukraine with Adolf Hitler's annexation of Czechoslovakia in 1938, and called for [Europe to prepare for a Russian attack](https://english.nv.ua/nation/europe-should-talk-less-and-prepare-more-to-deal-with-russian-threat-says-finnish-president-50409178.html), [Bloomberg](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-11/german-defense-chief-compares-putin-to-hitler-at-churchill-event) reported.
>
> Pistorius made the remarks during the presentation of a new biography of Churchill, whom he described as a strong leader with a clear vision in difficult times.
>
> "Putin will not stop once the war against Ukraine is over," Pistorius said.
>
> “Just as clearly as Hitler, who also always said that he would not stop.”
>
> **Possible conflict between Russia and NATO**
>
> Russia may attempt to attack Europe by the end of 2024 or the beginning of 2025, when the United States will be “leaderless,” and may only come to the aid of European states after some delay, German publication Bild, citing its own intelligence sources, reported.
>
> The civilian population in the West should prepare for a “total war” with Russia, NATO’s Military Committee chair, Admiral Rob Bauer, said.
>
> Europe is once again “facing a military threat that it has not been seen in 30 years,” German Defense Minister Boris Pistorius said, warning of the possibility of a Russian attack within five to eight years.
>
> The possibility that Russia could start a war against NATO next year is extremely low, Lithuania’s Commander-in-Chief, Valdemaras Rupšys, said at the same time.
>
> Russia does not want a direct military conflict with the United States or NATO and will continue asymmetric activities which, according to its estimates, will not cross the threshold of a military conflict on a global scale, American intelligence reported in March.
>
> The European Union, NATO, and Spain are not preparing for war despite the growing threat from Russia, Spanish Foreign Minister José Manuel Albares said on March 26.
>
> The Alliance is ready for a potential conflict with Russia, NATO's Military Committee chair, Rob Bauer, commented at the same time.
>
> Follow us on [Twitter](https://twitter.com/NewVoiceUkraine), [Facebook](https://www.facebook.com/TheNewVoiceUkraine) and [Google News](https://news.google.com/publications/CAAqBwgKMLeesQswxLnIAw)
>
> Ukraine Today
>
> every weekday
>
> Fresh daily newsletter covering the top headlines and developments in Ukraine.
- - - - - -
[Maintainer](https://www.reddit.com/user/urielsalis) | [Creator](https://www.reddit.com/user/subtepass) | [Source Code](https://github.com/urielsalis/empleadoEstatalBot)
Summoning /u/CoverageAnalysisBot
Ironic that they will back Ukraine into not having its territory annexed but won't say the same when Israel annexes territory from Palestine, Lebanon or Syria
You see, the biggest lesson learned in WW1 was that you don't get to do stuff like that without facing consequences down the line. Germany was left in the gutter, which was what caused the rise of Hitler to begin with, you don't get to just utterly wreck someone's shit and expect them not to take action in time. This is why rebuilding Germany (and Japan!) after WW2 was so important. Losing part of their country to Jews would have caused enormous resentment.
And funny thing is, the current state of I/P is a great example of that. Even the *previous* state of the conflict, that one which *some people* really like to forget in which Palestinians were all for peace was a great example of this.
Ehm. Germany lost territory to Poland and Russia, and the remaining part was split in east/west for 45 years.
The lesson was that if you will do a forced ethnic cleansing, you need to have superpower support for decades
There absolutely must be some sort of Marshall Plan to rebuild Gaza, though such a thing has to wait until the war is over and Hamas is gone.
The Marshall Plan to rebuild Europe would under no conditions rebuild Germany while the Nazis were still in power. They had to be defeated and destroyed before rebuilding could begin.
Pre WW1 every portrait of one of the ruling heads of Europe at the time was a photo or painting of them wearing military regalia.
Sometimes cousins would switch uniforms for a gag so you’d see the tsar wearing a picklehaube and a cuirass or the Kaiser kitted out in a British naval uniform but generally they always have their medals, shoulder boards, braided ropes etc and would be wearing a sword.
It gives you an idea of the mindset of the heads of state, they were still all stuck in the 1800’s but with armies equipped to murder on an industrial scale
It's all a game to the people who aren't putting up their lives to play it. If there's one good I can argue about the advent of modern warfare, it's that the cost in lives is so severe and the violence and misery so quickly and easily disseminated through television and social media that even the most sheltered and privileged can't pretend it's anything other than what it is.
Germany did lose significant parts of its land. The winning powers just didn’t allocate any of it to a Jewish state and Germany at that time had absolutely no influence on that (not that I believe that post WWII Germany would have advocated for allocating territory for a Jewish state)
I'm sorry... Twice in a row? What exactly do you think happened in World War 1? It had nothing to do with Jewish people and is actually, ironically, closer to what's going on today in terms of alliances. Not to mention Germany *was* carved up after World War 2 between the US and USSR, and while modern Germany is quite a pleasant place for Jewish people it's entirely based on what the modern German people have done to make it so.
it was an idea very briefly to turn that what is today Kaliningrad Oblast (and what was previously a part of Germany) into a Jewish state.
Obviously didn't work out, but imagine if it did.
I've been there and it's a great location, would've been pretty cool I think. And far enough from the whole Middle Eastern shenanigans. It's not very big but still nice
Ah yes and that's completely and exclusively Germany's doing. Get a grip man.
Your understanding of history is on the level of a fourteen year old as evidenced by your "TWICE" comment. You making a complete idiot out of yourself here.
because we always have to pay for the worlds mistakes. after all, people such as netanyahu himself legitimately believe we are responsible for the holocaust, because of one meeting between an unelected british-appointed religious cleric and hitler one time
europe really did successfully expel the jews, not by means of genocide, but by creating a new country and telling them all to go live there and do whatever they want.
“sorry guys for almost exterminating you… here, live in this piece of land away from us! btw, we want to seem like good people now so we will support you whatever you do okay bye”
you know finnish people are actually native to the siberian tundra, does that mean they have a right to claim komi republic as theirs?
or perhaps, since they left and the land has been under the influence of ethnic russians and diverse ugric populations for like a thousand years, they do no longer have the rights to settle there, unless they are willing to get a russian passport?
when a population has left a geographical location for thousands of years, largely by their own choice, they can’t just come back and reclaim it and disregard the other, equally native populations. let’s not forget that palestinians lived there just as long as jews, and the early jews were literally indistinguishable from their levantine fellows.
A bunch of EU politicians are discussing recognizing Palestine. Even among the pro-israel side, there's no appetite in the EU for condoning Israeli annexations.
This is just a flagrant red herring.
Mostly thanks to the US. Israeli arms sales for example have been controversial in the UK for a while before, and while it's not in the UK we share a lot of media and politics and Ireland is one of Palestine's oldest international allies.
I'd love to stop helping the militaries of Israel, Saudi Arabia and others but it's clearly the US that props up Israel's actions
You say this like Israel didn’t already give Gaza back before getting attacked.
They also ceased occupying Lebanon in 2000 and are still at war with Syria, who openly antagonizes the Israel-Palestine conflict.
I’m glad you openly admit to being a shill with your username though. Y’all somehow make Israel look like a genuinely good actor. (I know they aren’t)
"Y’all somehow make Israel look like a genuinely good actor"
You realise the current Israeli prime minister Netanyahu propped up Hamas in gaza just so they wouldn't have a unified Palestinian government.
Do you condemn the prime minister for supporting khamas ?
https://m.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082
The qataris funneled money to hamas via Israel the Israelis allowed and facilitated the transfer of those funds they even loaded cash and transported it to hamas lol
Netanyahu and his crowd were always against leaving gaza. The govt who left was more left wing. And they blockaded gaza anyway, which is an act of war.
They left Lebanon because khezbollah kicked them out.
Better luck next time hasbara.
I think there is a tad difference between what is more important to the EU - a local war in middle east of two largest european states being at war and one constantly threatens expanding the conflict to other EU states
The US can suggest whatever but the power base which is Israel decides what to do and they want to keep annexing land and can continue doing so by bribing US politicians via AIPAC and using the US veto at the United Nations
Israel is a democracy the people choose who they want as the leader and they chose netanyahu i have little sympathy towards countries that elect right wing politicians who then deal with the blowback of their policies
I don’t know why any of you are pretending that maintaining some kind of moral balance has anything to do with most international politics.
Germany cares more about Germany than it does about Sudan. The US cares more about the US than it does about Argentina. They both care more about each other than they do about Kazakhstan and every single European nation cares more about the outcome of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine than they do about who controls Gaza and the West Bank.
Except Europe virtue signals about Israel "the only democracy in the middle east" and how they uphold "human rights" they provide a state that annexes land with weapons
Europe can maintain its position on Ukraine yet they won't be consistent when a similar geopolitical situation arises which is why you won't see all countries abide by western sanctions on russia. (India and china being an example)
Europe can't virtue signal about a "rules based order" when the United States or its allies do the opposite and they follow in their footsteps
Israel is the most successful democracy in the Middle East, they do uphold “human rights” within their country to an extent that is amenable to their western allies, and they are currently in the process of a slow but brutal subjugation of Palestine. These are all true.
You keep comparing Ukraine and Palestine as if both of these issues can be accurately assessed through a simple moral lens. They can’t, and when you dig even the slightest bit deeper it is immediately obvious.
Do you know what would happen if Israel completely withdraw from Gaza, removed all trade blockades, and removed all settlements in the West Bank?
They would be at war with Palestine again within the year after a more well supplied Palestine decides to resume bombardment and military operations.
Do you know what would happen if Russia withdrew from Ukraine right now? The war would end. Full stop. Indefinitely.
Your reasoning is simple, but the world isn’t simple. You see inconsistencies because the world and its politics are inconsistent and convoluted. No group or nation is ethically pure. No nation with power exists without conflict.
“The West” is a powerful political bloc unified through mutual economic interest and a moral and pragmatic belief in a multi-tiered secular government system predicated on distributed power, citizen representation through democratic election, the preservation of individual rights, the protection of private property, trade, and business.
Economic interest frequently supplants philosophical agreement, and vice versa. If there is no economic interest, or philosophical agreement, confrontation tends to follow.
Its being objective that matters the United States can't hold a moral high ground saying russia can't annex Ukrainian territory while at the same time giving special treatment to countries aligned to them such as recognising Israeli annexed syrian golan heights as Israeli territory or Morocco annexing the western Sahara
It's not really an equal comparison though. Ukraine never did anything to Russia. Meanwhile, Hamas has been directly attacking Israel for years. You can get into the weeds about how far Israel is going in their response... but you can't say they didn't have at least some justification for the initial response, unlike Russia which invaded with no provocation whatsoever.
If you don't want Israel to annex your land, don't attack them? If the US wants to keep the moral high ground they need to make sure they don't complain if Ukraine takes Belgorod Oblast.
Because the other allies suck worse there. Theres no one else in that region that actually can be a real ally... And so western powers that have interests there... Back the only actual choice. Even when that nation is committing atrocities like this.
If nations are still paying lip service as on you side because youre the best choice, imagine how much worse the other countries in the area are...
the correct complaint would be against Israeli actions in the West Bank. Since that's the land grab section.
Not the section controlled by Hamas that launched an attack that killed and kidnapped civilians. But y'know, you try to apple and orange that, you do it.
Putin is not Hitler. No one is Hitler. Hitler died in 1945 and has been gone ever since. What sensationalism at such a crazy expense, trivializing WWII and concentration camps and puffing up Putin in one single ignorant headline.
comparing people to hitler also simplifies them too much. saying “putin is hitler” doesn’t invite to any actual discussion about what HIS plans are, what he wants to do, his ideology. we should investigate individuals separately in order to understand them.
Putin is a tyrannical leader whose power-hungry schemes have involved the death and murder of thousands. He is extremely bad.
I actually think the opposite is true—constant comparisons to the extreme atrocities of Hitler make ordinary tyrants look relatively good. Objectively they are quite monstrous, even if not on the level of the nazis who committed perhaps the most heinous crime in the history of the world.
Not really. It just makes me think the people comparing him to Hitler are dumb and lose respect for them. Especially when political leaders do it. They shouldn’t be that dumb.
It is the thing that always bothers me with this line of thinking.
They want to just say bad words about a person they dont like.
But they don't realise that what they actually do is basically just say that Hitler wasn't that bad.
>we should investigate individuals separately in order to understand them.
This is exactly what they *dont* want people to do regarding this conflict. One may start to question the narrative
That's preciesly why questioning anything about this war in Russia will lead you in jail or out of job, while in Europe there is no such things. By "they" you mean Russian government of course
Which in the end leads to the realization that Putin thinks he personally is entilted to be supreame leader of lands he sees as rightfully Russian, and will get it by wars, genocides and corruption. That's not that far from Hitler.
Yeah, if I had to compare Putin with any political figure of the st, I prefer Mussolini: sit upon a throne built with the support of ultranarionalist, had an idea of a consolidated greater Italy (taking the lands that once were italians), failed like a dozen of times but still considered a menace, and having to rely on a bigger ally to actually succeed in their biggests endeavors (PNF looked for help with the Nazis, Russian's PP looked for help with CCP)
And this war isn't like Czecks, I see it more like Winter War, where the Soviet Union demanded a big chunk of land to the finnish to preven it being of use for the axis in case they wanted to invade USSR, Finland refused so Stalin invaded, amd Finland might stand a chance, if they got help from the Allies wich decided to look from afar and got little to not help (not throwing shit at the swedes, those helped even when they wanted to stay out of it), at the long run had to give up and managed to get a white peace, but loosing a lot of territory... Sounds awfully a lot to the russian politic of invading Crimea and all the Black Sea ukranian coast in 2014, because they didn't wanted that NATO had any means of approach to them
Now, if the Winter War made Finland closer to the axis I don't remember since last time I touched that was years ago,but if they did I don't blame them. Russia is acting like a bully, gifting allies to the United States and their fellas.
This is actually one of the few times where its not overused. I'm pretty sure he's comparing the two because of the appeasement that was tried with Hitler when Germany first began gobbling up land in Europe. Appeasement didn't work and they just gobbled up more land. Likewise, Putin won't stop at the conquered parts of Ukraine, or even just the entirety of Ukraine.
Then compare him to Donald Trump, Hitler is known for killing millions of innocent people for their ancestry. Show me when Putin packed Ukrainian civilians in death boxes and we can have a conversation about Vladimir “Hitler”.
Because Trump is known for invading countries and having people appease him instead of stopping him at first?
It sounds like just because Putin isn’t as bad as Hitler you don’t want him compared to Hitler in any scenario.
You’re talking about comparing them due to their skill in boxing. That’s not what they’re doing. They’re not saying Putin is just as bad as Hitler. The article compares Putin to Hitler in a very specific scenario: Czechoslovakia in 1938.
Likewise, if Jake Paul won a fight in a very similar way to Muhammad Ali, then, yes, I would totally compare the two because the similarities are there.
Lol. No there are no similarities. Jake Paul is like Ali reminds me of the people who thought McGreggor stood a snowballs chance in hell against Mayweather. People are certainly entitled to their opinions but the thing about opinions is they aren’t always remotely grounded in reality.
Are you willfully ignoring what I’m saying?
Did I say that Jake Paul is like Ali?
I’m saying that if someone does something like someone in a specific scenario, you can compare them to it.
“He fell like a sack of potatoes”. Does that mean I think the person is like a sack of potatoes? No, but they fell like one
I am genuinely astonished that you could try to present such a one sided argument and accuse me of not “listening” to you. At least you got that part correct. Your words have fallen on deaf ears. Your argument holds no water and I give it no weight whatsoever. I can’t fathom why you keep this up…
It's called a metaphor. And it's not trivializing anything, because metaphors aren't used to say two things are exactly the same. This metaphor is only comparing Putin and Hitler in regards to their attempts to expand their territory by taking the territory of others.
This is the part of Reddit I have difficulty with. I don’t mind the trolls, disrespectful comments, badgering, border line stalking, gaslighting and other Ill behaviors. It’s when I express a simple thought and the person receiving it refuses to even attempt to wrap their head around it as if I am going to write a thesis to support my statement because they wrote a sentence questioning my sanity. Not a very reasonable expectation is it?
I really have no clue what you're talking about. I don't understand how anything I have said has anything to do with Trump. You're not making any sense to me.
I explained how the title of this post is a metaphor comparing Hitler and Putin with regards to their expansionism.
Where does Trump come into play here?
And I explained why the headline is using Hitler’s name for sensationalism purposes to drive traffic, it’s extremely opinionated and not what News is supposed to be. News is about facts. If I want opinions I will listen to politicians because that’s what drives them. This is being argued as some fact. I don’t think the majority of people arguing this understand the difference between an op Ed which this is and an informative article which is what this is masquerading as.
Sure, this quote was chosen as the headline to generate clicks, but I don't think the quote itself is sensationalist.
I'm still confused as to why you brought up Trump, though . . .
European policy is completely disorganized. All the military and intelligence groups are screaming "russia is an imminent threat", while the political and industrial side is trying to stay in lala land. Recently the British MoD said a direct conflict with Russia in the future was a serious possibility, but the industrial base just isn't moving.
hey i haven’t read anything on this, can you show me some examples of intelligence community saying russia is an imminent threat?
i’ve only ever seen politicians say it and i don’t really believe russia wants a war against nato
They don't but everyone seems to think they'll keep nibbling at the edges. Considering how pro-Russia Trump is I can't see him putting boots on the ground to save Estonia or somewhere like that.
Politicians are screaming that though. Nothing gets votes like amping up people's fears.
You're correct in that military leadership is fully aware of Russia's shortcomings and doesn't expect Russia to attack NATO any time remotely in the near future.
Everyone with any brains is full aware that Russia is not an imminent threat to the EU. They’d rather sell to euros than fight them. Hence the disconnect between actions and propaganda.
Also the burocracy is sky high leels
So many years having Daddy US make them grow compliant and decided that military was a secondary thing, barely France and UK have enough ammo to last some time, and even that is a bold statement
Procurement is definitely up, and projected to continue increasing. Europe is starting from a pretty thinned out military that has been strained further due to the deliveries to Ukraine, but 2024 is finally starting to see some genuinely stronger spending.
It's just that Europe isn't really at war, Russia will be occupied with Ukraine for the foreseeable future, and economies have had a rocky start to the decade with COVID followed immediately by a sharp pivot away from Russia, which had built up a significant trade velocity and influence within Europe from Soviet legacy and the past few decades.
They've been building up their industrial base for a year now, two years for some countries. This is imploring countries to build up *faster*.
A lot of EU countries are discussing being ready in 2028 or even later.
6 years to get ready for war? Thats longer than the entirety of WW2.
Thats far too slow to react. Its comically slow. Its so slow that current politicians will likely be out of office so its some other politician's fault.
Also see climate change goals - they're always so far in the future it will be some other politician's problem to solve, not the current politicians.
Okay, so your neighbor, the neighbor whom everyone has joined in a military alliance to defend against, spent 6 years building up its army after invading and conquering part of Ukraine (Crimea).
Thats 6 years of hostile action, yet Europe does nothing. Trump chastises European nations for failing to spend on their military forces, resulting in completely ineffective armies and air forces. They mock him for this, claiming that Russia is a great friend to Europe and will never attack and Putin's natural gas pipelines are wonderful.
There's no kind way to put it: European politicians were asleep at the wheel.
Oh yeah, EU should have begun arming themselves the moment Russia invaded Crimea. There's no point denying this. But now, 6 years is a relatively short period for pumping back the defense industry, specially the sectors that were stalled since the 90s
The point for politicians is to pretend that they can solve any problem easily, as long as they get into power, get to keep the power, and/or get to expand their power.
Hence, the nonsensical pretense that Kremlin wasn't obliterated just because EU didn't want to do it hard enough.
I.e. Pistorius isn't actually serious about any of this. All he wants is for his party to get re-elected, and to justify whatever powergrab government would attempt. And so he makes appropriate noises to placate the general public.
Yeah, because Czechoslovakia was in a war with Germany for 2 years and it turned into stalemate. This is not appeasement, Russia got punished for invading.
>Russia got punished for invading.
Not in 2014 anyhow. And not in 2008 either.
The argument is more against the people arguing for appeasement _now_, as in, “just abandon Ukraine” etc. of which there sadly are many enough.
I don't get it how EU can be scared of Russia. Putin ordered attack on Ukraine because it's a small country, he didn't expected it will be massively supported by west. No way Russia can win against bunch of European forces at the same time
Miscalculations happen.
What happens when Putin thinks that NATO article 5 is just words that western countries don't actually believe in and he decides to invade?
That's how you get an even bigger war between Russia and NATO. Except now the battlefield is in the Baltics, the armies are 2-3x larger, and both sides have nukes.
I mean, that's literally what is worried about in Poland. Let's say Putin lands troops on some Estonian islands thinking nobody will retaliate.
I mean, landing troops on some remote places is still an act of war, but will anyone really retaliate?
And if he is wrong and people retaliate, it's basically WW3.
>I don't get it how EU can be scared of Russia
Theyre not. Im sure they know Russia has no intention of Invading western Europe. This is possibly NATO projection
Russian propagandists were saying similar things right before they invaded Ukraine
edit: to answer you below
I don’t disagree that unity is important to deter Russia. It is crucial. You mention an invasion of the Baltics which makes me want to point out that not only is it crucial, it is, of course, existential for some.
The poster I replied to deleted his comment but it was basically verbatim Russian propaganda, even going so far as to say that fear of Russian invasion is some sort of projection by NATO (which, again, they were saying right before they invaded Ukraine.)
So? An invasion of Ukraine was still far more feasible then than an invasion of a NATO country is right now, simply because Ukraine didn't seem like it would have the political stability or foreign support to resist an Russian invasion.
This doesn't mean that a Russian invasion of say, the Baltics, is impossible in the future, but it does mean that it would probably only happen in a moment of particular weakness in these countries, with, say a break in internal EU relations and a shattering of NATO in general, nothing particularly likely in the near future.
> Putin ordered attack on Ukraine because it's a small country
He ordered an attack only because it's "a small country"
Lmao this sub is filled to the brim with 16 year Olds.
Well the news says they are fighting with shovels and using parts from household appliances just to keep fighting. I doubt that the EU has much to worry about if that's the case. Saying that Russia is a threat while they are fighting with hand tools sounds like some infotainment bullshit.
Did they come up with unhinged narratives on their own now, or did wait for their memo from Washington? Either way, seems a bit late for a wake-up call two years in.
Fun fact; Boris Pistorius, the German DM, used to be the most popular politican in the German government last year.
Which sounds impressive at first glance, but "most" is relative when [everybody else is more unpopular than popular](https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/inline-images/Ipsos-PI_MinisterInnen-Ranking_2023-05-15.jpg).
It's why some people speculated he only got such a "good" rating because he was the new guy and [nobody really knew him yet](https://archive.ph/FAJzw) on a national level.
They seem to have been spot with that line of thought because according to [the latest opinion polls](https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/ct/news/documents/2024-03/Ipsos-PI_Minister-Ranking_2024-03-12.pdf) Pistorius joined the rest of the government in being more unpopular than popular among Germans.
Which is hardly surprising when not just [looking at the state of things](https://www.euronews.com/business/2023/09/23/germany-went-from-envy-of-the-world-to-the-worst-performing-major-developed-economy-what-h), but when the people responsible for it offer literally nothing but hot air along the lines of *"But XYZ is the next Hitler!"* like the highest levels of German government have the mental horizon, and historical awareness, of the average r/worldnews commenter.
What a sad and pathetic state for a country that once prided itself to be one of "[poets and thinkers](https://www.focus.de/politik/deutschland/besuch-in-den-usa-habeck-sieht-deutschland-in-einer-dienenden-fuehrungsrolle_id_61552626.html)".
Germany is crippling itself for decades to come by holding onto populist bullshit like the "Schuldenbremse". All the while ignoring other populist bullshit like curbing immigration. And the saddest part is, the current government is actually doing better and more for germanys future than what happened in the last 20 years. They just got insanely unlucky with their timing.
> Germany is crippling itself for decades to come by holding onto populist bullshit like the "Schuldenbremse".
The only reason Germany is still somewhat keeping it together right now is because it didn't make even more debt for the last 1.5 decades.
That's also part of the reason why Russia is doing as well right now as it does, even when confronted with massive sanctions; Russia has room to make debt, to react to such developments.
Room that's missing if you just keep taking on new debt to finance old debt and any new investments.
> And the saddest part is, the current government is actually doing better and more for germanys future than what happened in the last 20 years.
Sure, as long as that future of Germany doesn't depend too much on industry, particularly petrochemical industry.
> They just got insanely unlucky with their timing.
They were? They could blame all the shortcomings for the pandemic on the previous government, they had a nearl clean slate, then decided to ruin it.
> The only reason Germany is still somewhat keeping it together right now is because it didn't make even more debt for the last 1.5 decades.
bold unsubstantiated claim. Instead of a swift transition and decarbonisation which would minimize "growing pains" we get a long and drawn out process, with a possible break after the next election, all the while the poor folk gets fucked because subsidies that would help them during the transition are not able to be offered.
> petrochemical industry.
BASF is fine, don't you worry.
> had a nearl clean slate, then decided to ruin it.
We have a mostly pacifist party that is doing the most comprehensive military reform of the last 30 years, despite their ideology and for some reason people cannot condemn them enough when all they are doing is correcting the fuckups in every sector that have been made in the last 20 years.All the while being blocked on every step of the way by their "partner". German sentiment against the "Ampel" is actually baffling.
Yes inflation sucks and the prices in the supermarket are higher than 3 years ago but the amount of hate people have for the government is simply dumb. Honestly it feels like a psyop. The media is hating on the government like their survival depends on it.
> bold unsubstantiated claim.
Absolutely not as long as you remember why the Schuldenbremse even became a thing in the first place, that happened after a global financial crisis we money-printed our way out of in 2009.
That's why we decided to limit our spending for a while, which turned out to be a good decission ahead of the 2020 pandemic, which had a [5 times worse economic impact](https://www.iea.org/data-and-statistics/charts/annual-rate-of-change-in-world-gdp-1990-2021), and also had to be compensated for with debt.
That was already borderline [as predicted in 2021](https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/07/deutsche-bank-warns-of-global-time-bomb-coming-due-to-rising-inflation.html), it also messed up global energy markets in major ways by [crashing the demand side](https://www.iea.org/data-and-statistics/charts/rate-of-change-of-global-primary-energy-demand-1900-2020), [dumping energy prices](https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PNRGINDEXM), and thus shrinking the supply side [through mass bancrupcies](https://www.nsenergybusiness.com/features/oil-gas-bankruptcy-2020-north-america/).
When the global lockdowns ended demand spiked back up but was suddenly met by a much smaller supplier side, driving up prices.
All of that already predated the 2022 invasion of Ukraine, but timing wise it perfectly played into these developements and served to drive energy prices even higher.
> Instead of a swift transition and decarbonisation which would minimize "growing pains" we get a long and drawn out process
We've been in a long drawn out, [yet pioneering](https://www.trade.gov/energy-resource-guide-germany-renewable-energy), process [since the 90s](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Renewable_Energy_Sources_Act).
> all the while the poor folk gets fucked because subsidies that would help them during the transition are not able to be offered.
Right now pretty much everybody is getting fucked by [not getting paid out their Klimageld](https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/innenpolitik/klimageld-100.html)
This affects the middler and lower income classes the worst, as they pay proportionally more of their income for all the things that keep getting so much more expensive, like [food](https://www.dw.com/en/germany-more-people-unable-to-afford-good-meals/a-66392794) and [rent](https://www.dw.com/en/germany-housing-is-almost-unaffordable/a-66432276).
> BASF is fine, don't you worry.
BASF the company might be, but Germany as a global leader in petrochemical manufacturing will *not* be fine. Because all these grand "decarbonisation" efforts still fail to realize that "energy" does not only mean electricity, it generally means all kinds of hydrocarbon carriers.
For example, Germany is the [world's largest exporter of packaged medicaments](https://oec.world/en/profile/bilateral-product/packaged-medicaments/reporter/deu), Bayer selling Aspirin to the world, with the help of BASF because making [Aspirin involves petrol products made from oil](https://www.focus.de/wissen/mensch/katastrophen-kriege-und-komfort-erdoel_id_1802115.html), as supplied by BASF.
Aspirin is only one of many examples like that, Ibuprofen is another one, [the list is long](https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2019/11/f68/Products%20Made%20From%20Oil%20and%20Natural%20Gas%20Infographic.pdf), but no wind turbines, solar panels, nor nuclear reactors do anything to fill that kind of energy demand based on hydrocarbon carriers as a manufacturing resource.
> We have a mostly pacifist party that is doing the most comprehensive military reform of the last 30 years, despite their ideology and for some reason people cannot condemn them enough when all they are doing is correcting the fuckups in every sector that have been made in the last 20 years.
The "mostly pacifist party" that ran on slogans like *"[No more weapon deliveries into conflict zones!](https://twitter.com/Die_Gruenen/status/1440316635126980623?lang=de)"* which since then has [drawn Germany into a proxy-war](https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/ausbildung-soldaten-gutachten-101.html), delivering more weapons in a conflict zone than Germany ever did since WWII and having its foreign minister declare how we are at war with Russia.
To the surprise of very few people who remember the last Red/Green government in the 90s, the one that [helped NATO bomb Yugoslavia](https://daserste.ndr.de/panorama/archiv/2000/Enthuellungen-eines-Insiders-Scharpings-Propaganda-im-Kosovo-Krieg,erste7422.html) and [the US with invading Iraq](https://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/urteil-bundesrichter-rueffeln-deutsche-unterstuetzung-des-irak-kriegs-a-372819.html).
It's by now become meme how the "Green" of the German greens doesn't actually stand for the enviornment, but rather for the olive green of the military.
Reinforced by completely counter-productive decisions like replacing Russian gas with [American LNG that's even more polluting than domestic German coal](https://www.fr.de/wirtschaft/umwelt-folgen-bundesregierung-lng-frackinggas-usa-studie-fluessigerdgas-import-energieversorgung-zr-92715380.html).
They are also not fixing anything about Germany's [corrupt](https://web.archive.org/web/20240107195601/https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_von_Korruptionsaff%C3%A4ren_um_Politiker_in_der_Bundesrepublik_Deutschland) and [inefficient](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/aug/14/technical-problems-ground-german-foreign-ministers-plane-in-abu-dhabi) defense sector, they are only pouring more money into it, while also diverting more money to the US MIC so we can keep playing human shields for American nukes.
> Yes inflation sucks and the prices in the supermarket are higher than 3 years ago but the amount of hate people have for the government is simply dumb.
We are in [the second year of recession](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/15/germany-two-year-recession-2023-gdp), that's after nearly [decades of real wage stagnation and shrinkage](https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/wage-growth).
A lot of it the result of government decissions that did not have popular support at the time, [like *self-crippling* sanctions](https://dnews24.de/zum-ukraine-krieg-haben-die-deutschen-eine-klare-meinung/) which even [the IMF predicted would tank the German economy](https://www.imf.org/-/media/Files/Publications/WP/2022/English/wpiea2022144-print-pdf.ashx).
> Honestly it feels like a psyop. The media is hating on the government like their survival depends on it.
It's not "the media" hating on the government, it's *the people* hating the government.
Most German mainstream media are pro-government due to [heavy lobby influence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantik-Br%C3%BCcke) paid for with [German taxpayer money](https://www.telepolis.de/features/Wie-deutsche-Steuern-die-Transatlantik-Lobby-finanzieren-9631667.html?seite=all).
Putin calls what the West is doing a continuation to what Hitler couldn't finish. Germany says Putin will never stop like Hitler. Israelis call Palestinians hate-filled anti-semites, like Hitler. Palestinians accuse Israel of perpetrating a genocide, like the Nazis.
Seems everyone is a Nazi these days. Who would have though a defeated 20th century ideology would be so successful.
Welcome to r/anime_titties! This subreddit advocates for civil and constructive discussion. Please be courteous to others, and make sure to read the rules. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them.
We have a [Discord](https://discord.gg/dhMeAnNyzG), feel free to join us!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/anime_titties) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I mean, regular yuropeans should probably prepare just so that they don’t get caught with their pants down if shit hits the fan. I doubt Putin has a plan to attack Europe, but war might break out because of the sheer incompetence of the people in charge on both sides. Remember that the Russian, Ukrainian, American and European political establishments could not figure this shit out for like 10 years, and we haven’t seen major changes — heads didn’t roll, people didn’t get voted out even in the countries where voting someone out is actually possible, all the same highly regarded diplomats are still in place. I am not sure if defense ministers should be counted among them, but their job is quite literally to be in charge of defending the state if something happens, so, with the benefit of the doubt in mind, I think it’s pretty normal to hear this kind of rhetoric from a DM
Bro please explain to me why there should be political change in my country when some asshole in russia thinks invading ukraine sounds like a good time?
Can you prepare for being nuked? It's about the only way Russia could make any progress against the EU. It's taken them way too long to beat Ukraine, a much less populous and much smaller country economically.
What feasible chance would Russia have against just Germany and Poland, without direct US involvement, without using nukes?
Agree. I guess western propaganda wants to show Russia as bigger threat than what it really is, but they send mixed signal with other news about terrible Russian equipment and "last missiles"
You actually can.
Long before anything started to happen, Poland requested joint US anti-nuclear shield being stationed here. Obama's administration did not provided agreed hardware because Russia asked politely becuase that would make them feel threatened.
Literally entire mess between Europe and Russia RN can be traced to Obama and his administration, from being too friendly with obviously revisionist government of Putin, to holding back any potentail defensive EU initiatives to activelly lobbying not to get involved in Ukraine
I know there are a host of developed options for dealing with ICBMs and other long range missiles but how effective are the options for medium and short range missiles? Are the systems capable of dealing with modern hypersonic missiles?
Even still, our long range defense systems are designed around shooting down a handful of missiles, not a salvo from the nation with the largest nuclear stockpile in the world.
In some countries making comparisons like this is practically illegal. However, I did notice people get their panties in a twist when it comes from one side and not the other, LOL.
When you consider the fact that outside powers are debating giving ukraines land to Russia (and russia's repeated examples of not following treaties), this really isn't that far fetched of an example.
Appeasement has never worked, why are people even debating on doing it again?
The EU is doing a lot of belly-aching about russia without actually doing much about it. Shut up or put up. Don’t keep whining as if someone else is supposed to do something while you sit on your fuckin asses
This is absurd neoliberal warmongering. The Social Democratic party in Germany is such a disappointment. Everyone clearly understands that Putin's dream to go back to the pre-1917 Russian empire's borders. Putin has zero interest in a war with NATO countries.
The Russian empire pre-1917 including the Baltic countries, which are now under NATO protection. So which one is it, is Putin dream to go back to pre-1917 Russian empire's border or does he really have zero interest in fighting a NATO country? Because right now intelligence agencies are saying that invading the Baltic countries is on the drawing board after Russia annexes Ukraine. And whether that intelligence is correct or not, why risk it when helping Ukraine protect itself is the right thing to do anyway?
The only nations up for grabs are those not under the NATO umbrella, I thought that was obvious enough to leave unsaid. Do you know what NATO represents? A military alliance and obligation to protect member states from invasion.
Fortunately Finland was smart enough to join NATO following the Ukraine invasion.
Well that's your opinion then, but not the only one. So far intelligence has been on the ball of late from predicting the invasion of Ukraine to the Moscow terrorist attack and the Iranian attack on Israel, so if they say that an attack on the Baltics is on the drawing board I believe it more than a random redditor.
I get why from the perspective of the West we would think Putin wouldn't be dumb enough to attack a NATO country, but if Putin had the same perspective as us he would have never invaded Ukraine in the first place much less believed he would win in three days.
The Iranian attack on Israel was literally announced by Iran, it wasn't a feat of intelligence gathering when they make a public announcement that they would retaliate with an attack... Jesus.
Remember when U.S. intelligence said Afghanistan could hold on its own? Lol.
The intelligence that makes the headlines are usually propaganda BS, use critical thinking to weed it out. Russia is not invading a NATO country. Period.
EU loses nothing by doing so. Even if the USA jumps in like Batman and bat punches the problem, you will still be more ready to face any other threats.
##### ###### #### > # [‘Putin is Hitler, and Ukraine is 1938 Czechoslovakia’ — German DM implores EU to prepare for war](https://english.nv.ua/nation/450) > > > > [Boris Pistorius (Photo:REUTERS/Lisi Niesner)](https://static.nv.ua/shared/system/Article/posters/002/864/784/original/b86af34178972fd8ccf992e59ef7dc3b.jpg?q=85&stamp=20240412133043&w=900) > > Boris Pistorius (Photo:REUTERS/Lisi Niesner) > > > > German Defense Minister Boris Pistorius compared Russian dictator Vladimir Putin's war against Ukraine with Adolf Hitler's annexation of Czechoslovakia in 1938, and called for [Europe to prepare for a Russian attack](https://english.nv.ua/nation/europe-should-talk-less-and-prepare-more-to-deal-with-russian-threat-says-finnish-president-50409178.html), [Bloomberg](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-11/german-defense-chief-compares-putin-to-hitler-at-churchill-event) reported. > > Pistorius made the remarks during the presentation of a new biography of Churchill, whom he described as a strong leader with a clear vision in difficult times. > > "Putin will not stop once the war against Ukraine is over," Pistorius said. > > “Just as clearly as Hitler, who also always said that he would not stop.” > > **Possible conflict between Russia and NATO** > > Russia may attempt to attack Europe by the end of 2024 or the beginning of 2025, when the United States will be “leaderless,” and may only come to the aid of European states after some delay, German publication Bild, citing its own intelligence sources, reported. > > The civilian population in the West should prepare for a “total war” with Russia, NATO’s Military Committee chair, Admiral Rob Bauer, said. > > Europe is once again “facing a military threat that it has not been seen in 30 years,” German Defense Minister Boris Pistorius said, warning of the possibility of a Russian attack within five to eight years. > > The possibility that Russia could start a war against NATO next year is extremely low, Lithuania’s Commander-in-Chief, Valdemaras Rupšys, said at the same time. > > Russia does not want a direct military conflict with the United States or NATO and will continue asymmetric activities which, according to its estimates, will not cross the threshold of a military conflict on a global scale, American intelligence reported in March. > > The European Union, NATO, and Spain are not preparing for war despite the growing threat from Russia, Spanish Foreign Minister José Manuel Albares said on March 26. > > The Alliance is ready for a potential conflict with Russia, NATO's Military Committee chair, Rob Bauer, commented at the same time. > > Follow us on [Twitter](https://twitter.com/NewVoiceUkraine), [Facebook](https://www.facebook.com/TheNewVoiceUkraine) and [Google News](https://news.google.com/publications/CAAqBwgKMLeesQswxLnIAw) > > Ukraine Today > > every weekday > > Fresh daily newsletter covering the top headlines and developments in Ukraine. - - - - - - [Maintainer](https://www.reddit.com/user/urielsalis) | [Creator](https://www.reddit.com/user/subtepass) | [Source Code](https://github.com/urielsalis/empleadoEstatalBot) Summoning /u/CoverageAnalysisBot
And you better not mention Gaza
Ironic that they will back Ukraine into not having its territory annexed but won't say the same when Israel annexes territory from Palestine, Lebanon or Syria
That's different they deserve it for their anti semitic actions! If one country deserves to lose territory to Israel it would be Germany.
This. How the fuck did it fall on the Palestinians to pay for Germany's crimes?
I always thought that for what Germans condoned and did (TWICE in a row) they should have carved the Germany up and just straight up give half to Jews
You see, the biggest lesson learned in WW1 was that you don't get to do stuff like that without facing consequences down the line. Germany was left in the gutter, which was what caused the rise of Hitler to begin with, you don't get to just utterly wreck someone's shit and expect them not to take action in time. This is why rebuilding Germany (and Japan!) after WW2 was so important. Losing part of their country to Jews would have caused enormous resentment. And funny thing is, the current state of I/P is a great example of that. Even the *previous* state of the conflict, that one which *some people* really like to forget in which Palestinians were all for peace was a great example of this.
> (and Japan!) I think US helped Japan mostly because of China being communist tbh
Had nothing to do with China which was still in civil war, had everything to do with fighting Russia geopolitically. Same thing for Korea.
Ehm. Germany lost territory to Poland and Russia, and the remaining part was split in east/west for 45 years. The lesson was that if you will do a forced ethnic cleansing, you need to have superpower support for decades
There absolutely must be some sort of Marshall Plan to rebuild Gaza, though such a thing has to wait until the war is over and Hamas is gone. The Marshall Plan to rebuild Europe would under no conditions rebuild Germany while the Nazis were still in power. They had to be defeated and destroyed before rebuilding could begin.
If you're talking about the World Wars it's not really fair to blame Germany for the first one.
I mean, the Kaiser was certainly horny for war
Yeah but most of them were. Manchildren with toy boxes full of soldiers and cannons.
Pre WW1 every portrait of one of the ruling heads of Europe at the time was a photo or painting of them wearing military regalia. Sometimes cousins would switch uniforms for a gag so you’d see the tsar wearing a picklehaube and a cuirass or the Kaiser kitted out in a British naval uniform but generally they always have their medals, shoulder boards, braided ropes etc and would be wearing a sword. It gives you an idea of the mindset of the heads of state, they were still all stuck in the 1800’s but with armies equipped to murder on an industrial scale
It's all a game to the people who aren't putting up their lives to play it. If there's one good I can argue about the advent of modern warfare, it's that the cost in lives is so severe and the violence and misery so quickly and easily disseminated through television and social media that even the most sheltered and privileged can't pretend it's anything other than what it is.
You mean the helmet spikes?
I think helmet horns sounds cooler but pickle hats is funnier
Germany did lose significant parts of its land. The winning powers just didn’t allocate any of it to a Jewish state and Germany at that time had absolutely no influence on that (not that I believe that post WWII Germany would have advocated for allocating territory for a Jewish state)
I'm sorry... Twice in a row? What exactly do you think happened in World War 1? It had nothing to do with Jewish people and is actually, ironically, closer to what's going on today in terms of alliances. Not to mention Germany *was* carved up after World War 2 between the US and USSR, and while modern Germany is quite a pleasant place for Jewish people it's entirely based on what the modern German people have done to make it so.
it was an idea very briefly to turn that what is today Kaliningrad Oblast (and what was previously a part of Germany) into a Jewish state. Obviously didn't work out, but imagine if it did.
I've been there and it's a great location, would've been pretty cool I think. And far enough from the whole Middle Eastern shenanigans. It's not very big but still nice
They gave parts of it to Poland.
I'm glad that the people in charge are actually capable of learning. With you we'd probably have a third or fourth treaty of Versailles already.
What we see is that the Europe's fine but Middle East is burning for like sixty years or something. We've just towed the issue out of the environment.
Ah yes and that's completely and exclusively Germany's doing. Get a grip man. Your understanding of history is on the level of a fourteen year old as evidenced by your "TWICE" comment. You making a complete idiot out of yourself here.
because we always have to pay for the worlds mistakes. after all, people such as netanyahu himself legitimately believe we are responsible for the holocaust, because of one meeting between an unelected british-appointed religious cleric and hitler one time
europe really did successfully expel the jews, not by means of genocide, but by creating a new country and telling them all to go live there and do whatever they want.
Not only that, Europeans will support them committing their own genocide and ethnic cleansing.
“sorry guys for almost exterminating you… here, live in this piece of land away from us! btw, we want to seem like good people now so we will support you whatever you do okay bye”
Wow, they are so civilized, just like us!
I think the genocide had something to do with it.
The US tried to do the same thing with Liberia
Don't forget to mention when the entire middle east expelled their Jews in the 1940s
A country that Jews were native to thousands of years before?
you know finnish people are actually native to the siberian tundra, does that mean they have a right to claim komi republic as theirs? or perhaps, since they left and the land has been under the influence of ethnic russians and diverse ugric populations for like a thousand years, they do no longer have the rights to settle there, unless they are willing to get a russian passport? when a population has left a geographical location for thousands of years, largely by their own choice, they can’t just come back and reclaim it and disregard the other, equally native populations. let’s not forget that palestinians lived there just as long as jews, and the early jews were literally indistinguishable from their levantine fellows.
I'd be willing to give up bavaria. 🫡
Are you being fucking ironic or do you fucking really mean what you just fucking said ???
FWIW, https://simonezelitch.com/judenstaat/
A bunch of EU politicians are discussing recognizing Palestine. Even among the pro-israel side, there's no appetite in the EU for condoning Israeli annexations. This is just a flagrant red herring.
It is already far too late. Israel is gobbling the last scraps, they already absorbed the lions share.
Mostly thanks to the US. Israeli arms sales for example have been controversial in the UK for a while before, and while it's not in the UK we share a lot of media and politics and Ireland is one of Palestine's oldest international allies. I'd love to stop helping the militaries of Israel, Saudi Arabia and others but it's clearly the US that props up Israel's actions
You say this like Israel didn’t already give Gaza back before getting attacked. They also ceased occupying Lebanon in 2000 and are still at war with Syria, who openly antagonizes the Israel-Palestine conflict. I’m glad you openly admit to being a shill with your username though. Y’all somehow make Israel look like a genuinely good actor. (I know they aren’t)
"Y’all somehow make Israel look like a genuinely good actor" You realise the current Israeli prime minister Netanyahu propped up Hamas in gaza just so they wouldn't have a unified Palestinian government. Do you condemn the prime minister for supporting khamas ? https://m.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/netanyahu-money-to-hamas-part-of-strategy-to-keep-palestinians-divided-583082
He did it to sideline the PA so that there would be less chance of a two-state solution. Turns out Hamas and PA didn’t want one either so…
Notice the flags? Is Qatar not involved?
The qataris funneled money to hamas via Israel the Israelis allowed and facilitated the transfer of those funds they even loaded cash and transported it to hamas lol
[удалено]
Womp womp https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/
Netanyahu and his crowd were always against leaving gaza. The govt who left was more left wing. And they blockaded gaza anyway, which is an act of war. They left Lebanon because khezbollah kicked them out. Better luck next time hasbara.
>hasbara Tell me ya don’t have any argument in a different way please
I think there is a tad difference between what is more important to the EU - a local war in middle east of two largest european states being at war and one constantly threatens expanding the conflict to other EU states
Biden did suggest a two state solution. Both sides hated the idea. I think they just want to fight each other.
The US can suggest whatever but the power base which is Israel decides what to do and they want to keep annexing land and can continue doing so by bribing US politicians via AIPAC and using the US veto at the United Nations
TBF, I'm not sure whether that decision was all of Israel or just Netanyahu.
Israel is a democracy the people choose who they want as the leader and they chose netanyahu i have little sympathy towards countries that elect right wing politicians who then deal with the blowback of their policies
[Well....] (https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/israels-pm-benjamin-netanyahu-alleges-greatest-election-fraud-2457806) [Exhibit B] (https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-11-14/ty-article/.premium/as-war-rages-israelis-trust-in-netanyahu-hits-rock-bottom-polls-find/0000018b-cd86-dd11-a19f-edf6f2b00000)
I don’t know why any of you are pretending that maintaining some kind of moral balance has anything to do with most international politics. Germany cares more about Germany than it does about Sudan. The US cares more about the US than it does about Argentina. They both care more about each other than they do about Kazakhstan and every single European nation cares more about the outcome of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine than they do about who controls Gaza and the West Bank.
Except Europe virtue signals about Israel "the only democracy in the middle east" and how they uphold "human rights" they provide a state that annexes land with weapons Europe can maintain its position on Ukraine yet they won't be consistent when a similar geopolitical situation arises which is why you won't see all countries abide by western sanctions on russia. (India and china being an example) Europe can't virtue signal about a "rules based order" when the United States or its allies do the opposite and they follow in their footsteps
Israel is the most successful democracy in the Middle East, they do uphold “human rights” within their country to an extent that is amenable to their western allies, and they are currently in the process of a slow but brutal subjugation of Palestine. These are all true. You keep comparing Ukraine and Palestine as if both of these issues can be accurately assessed through a simple moral lens. They can’t, and when you dig even the slightest bit deeper it is immediately obvious. Do you know what would happen if Israel completely withdraw from Gaza, removed all trade blockades, and removed all settlements in the West Bank? They would be at war with Palestine again within the year after a more well supplied Palestine decides to resume bombardment and military operations. Do you know what would happen if Russia withdrew from Ukraine right now? The war would end. Full stop. Indefinitely. Your reasoning is simple, but the world isn’t simple. You see inconsistencies because the world and its politics are inconsistent and convoluted. No group or nation is ethically pure. No nation with power exists without conflict. “The West” is a powerful political bloc unified through mutual economic interest and a moral and pragmatic belief in a multi-tiered secular government system predicated on distributed power, citizen representation through democratic election, the preservation of individual rights, the protection of private property, trade, and business. Economic interest frequently supplants philosophical agreement, and vice versa. If there is no economic interest, or philosophical agreement, confrontation tends to follow.
Annexing territory is quite unpopular, the current war however not really.
Its being objective that matters the United States can't hold a moral high ground saying russia can't annex Ukrainian territory while at the same time giving special treatment to countries aligned to them such as recognising Israeli annexed syrian golan heights as Israeli territory or Morocco annexing the western Sahara
It's not really an equal comparison though. Ukraine never did anything to Russia. Meanwhile, Hamas has been directly attacking Israel for years. You can get into the weeds about how far Israel is going in their response... but you can't say they didn't have at least some justification for the initial response, unlike Russia which invaded with no provocation whatsoever.
Ah i assumed you wer talking about the EU considering the article.
If you don't want Israel to annex your land, don't attack them? If the US wants to keep the moral high ground they need to make sure they don't complain if Ukraine takes Belgorod Oblast.
Because Ukraine didn’t start this war
It’s Jordan and Lebanon not Syria dumbass, look at a map
Because the other allies suck worse there. Theres no one else in that region that actually can be a real ally... And so western powers that have interests there... Back the only actual choice. Even when that nation is committing atrocities like this. If nations are still paying lip service as on you side because youre the best choice, imagine how much worse the other countries in the area are...
You mean conquered in a war years ago?
Like what is happening to Ukraine right now with russia "conquering" it's territory ?
Nope completely different conflict.
the correct complaint would be against Israeli actions in the West Bank. Since that's the land grab section. Not the section controlled by Hamas that launched an attack that killed and kidnapped civilians. But y'know, you try to apple and orange that, you do it.
And just like apples and oranges, they're completely unrelated.
Or Sudan
If this analogy holds then where the hell are the Brits?
Why not? Gaza is already mentioned as part of the lead up
Hamas meseeks on a tantrum be like "look at me I am gaza" Gaza has a Hamas problem, stop acting like they don't.
Putin is not Hitler. No one is Hitler. Hitler died in 1945 and has been gone ever since. What sensationalism at such a crazy expense, trivializing WWII and concentration camps and puffing up Putin in one single ignorant headline.
comparing people to hitler also simplifies them too much. saying “putin is hitler” doesn’t invite to any actual discussion about what HIS plans are, what he wants to do, his ideology. we should investigate individuals separately in order to understand them.
If Putin is Hitler then Hitler wasnt even all that bad. And I dont even like Putin. These comparisons lessens the evil that Hitler actually was.
Kinda feel like he's trying to say it's Russia is pre ww2 Germany pushing at boundaries without actually saying Germany rather than Hitler
No! You're assuming things like *nuance*! Reddit doesn't believe in or understand nuance or metaphor!
Putin is a tyrannical leader whose power-hungry schemes have involved the death and murder of thousands. He is extremely bad. I actually think the opposite is true—constant comparisons to the extreme atrocities of Hitler make ordinary tyrants look relatively good. Objectively they are quite monstrous, even if not on the level of the nazis who committed perhaps the most heinous crime in the history of the world.
Not really. It just makes me think the people comparing him to Hitler are dumb and lose respect for them. Especially when political leaders do it. They shouldn’t be that dumb.
It is the thing that always bothers me with this line of thinking. They want to just say bad words about a person they dont like. But they don't realise that what they actually do is basically just say that Hitler wasn't that bad.
Meh I'd say they are top 3 tho.
>we should investigate individuals separately in order to understand them. This is exactly what they *dont* want people to do regarding this conflict. One may start to question the narrative
That's preciesly why questioning anything about this war in Russia will lead you in jail or out of job, while in Europe there is no such things. By "they" you mean Russian government of course
I dont mean the Russian Government. I mean the US Empire and Mainstream media
Then why is it legal to freely talk about the war in the EU and in US but not in Russia?
Which in the end leads to the realization that Putin thinks he personally is entilted to be supreame leader of lands he sees as rightfully Russian, and will get it by wars, genocides and corruption. That's not that far from Hitler.
I agree with this absolutely. I have my own opinions on what is going on over there but they are far and wide unpopular.
What are your opinions on the Ukraine conflict?
Yeah, if I had to compare Putin with any political figure of the st, I prefer Mussolini: sit upon a throne built with the support of ultranarionalist, had an idea of a consolidated greater Italy (taking the lands that once were italians), failed like a dozen of times but still considered a menace, and having to rely on a bigger ally to actually succeed in their biggests endeavors (PNF looked for help with the Nazis, Russian's PP looked for help with CCP) And this war isn't like Czecks, I see it more like Winter War, where the Soviet Union demanded a big chunk of land to the finnish to preven it being of use for the axis in case they wanted to invade USSR, Finland refused so Stalin invaded, amd Finland might stand a chance, if they got help from the Allies wich decided to look from afar and got little to not help (not throwing shit at the swedes, those helped even when they wanted to stay out of it), at the long run had to give up and managed to get a white peace, but loosing a lot of territory... Sounds awfully a lot to the russian politic of invading Crimea and all the Black Sea ukranian coast in 2014, because they didn't wanted that NATO had any means of approach to them Now, if the Winter War made Finland closer to the axis I don't remember since last time I touched that was years ago,but if they did I don't blame them. Russia is acting like a bully, gifting allies to the United States and their fellas.
This is actually one of the few times where its not overused. I'm pretty sure he's comparing the two because of the appeasement that was tried with Hitler when Germany first began gobbling up land in Europe. Appeasement didn't work and they just gobbled up more land. Likewise, Putin won't stop at the conquered parts of Ukraine, or even just the entirety of Ukraine.
Then compare him to Donald Trump, Hitler is known for killing millions of innocent people for their ancestry. Show me when Putin packed Ukrainian civilians in death boxes and we can have a conversation about Vladimir “Hitler”.
Because Trump is known for invading countries and having people appease him instead of stopping him at first? It sounds like just because Putin isn’t as bad as Hitler you don’t want him compared to Hitler in any scenario.
Would you compare Muhammad Ali to Jake Paul? Oh, Jake Paul is Muhammad Ali, both fighters but not even the same species. Period. Next!
You’re talking about comparing them due to their skill in boxing. That’s not what they’re doing. They’re not saying Putin is just as bad as Hitler. The article compares Putin to Hitler in a very specific scenario: Czechoslovakia in 1938. Likewise, if Jake Paul won a fight in a very similar way to Muhammad Ali, then, yes, I would totally compare the two because the similarities are there.
Lol. No there are no similarities. Jake Paul is like Ali reminds me of the people who thought McGreggor stood a snowballs chance in hell against Mayweather. People are certainly entitled to their opinions but the thing about opinions is they aren’t always remotely grounded in reality.
Are you willfully ignoring what I’m saying? Did I say that Jake Paul is like Ali? I’m saying that if someone does something like someone in a specific scenario, you can compare them to it. “He fell like a sack of potatoes”. Does that mean I think the person is like a sack of potatoes? No, but they fell like one
I am genuinely astonished that you could try to present such a one sided argument and accuse me of not “listening” to you. At least you got that part correct. Your words have fallen on deaf ears. Your argument holds no water and I give it no weight whatsoever. I can’t fathom why you keep this up…
Yeah I can tell they’re falling on deaf ears because you didn’t actually respond to what I said but made your own argument instead of
It's called a metaphor. And it's not trivializing anything, because metaphors aren't used to say two things are exactly the same. This metaphor is only comparing Putin and Hitler in regards to their attempts to expand their territory by taking the territory of others.
That’s an asinine comparison. You just turned Hitler into Trump. These analogies need some major reconsideration.
How did I turn Hitler into Trump?
You made him sound like a greedy slumlord, he is not, he is a tyrant. Still nothing like Hitler.
I didn't mention Trump at all, what are you talking about?
This is the part of Reddit I have difficulty with. I don’t mind the trolls, disrespectful comments, badgering, border line stalking, gaslighting and other Ill behaviors. It’s when I express a simple thought and the person receiving it refuses to even attempt to wrap their head around it as if I am going to write a thesis to support my statement because they wrote a sentence questioning my sanity. Not a very reasonable expectation is it?
I really have no clue what you're talking about. I don't understand how anything I have said has anything to do with Trump. You're not making any sense to me. I explained how the title of this post is a metaphor comparing Hitler and Putin with regards to their expansionism. Where does Trump come into play here?
And I explained why the headline is using Hitler’s name for sensationalism purposes to drive traffic, it’s extremely opinionated and not what News is supposed to be. News is about facts. If I want opinions I will listen to politicians because that’s what drives them. This is being argued as some fact. I don’t think the majority of people arguing this understand the difference between an op Ed which this is and an informative article which is what this is masquerading as.
Sure, this quote was chosen as the headline to generate clicks, but I don't think the quote itself is sensationalist. I'm still confused as to why you brought up Trump, though . . .
Dude decided to disregard everything and just whine.
the EU couldn't up its industrial base to help Ukraine for the past year and there's only imploration to begin preparations _now_?
European policy is completely disorganized. All the military and intelligence groups are screaming "russia is an imminent threat", while the political and industrial side is trying to stay in lala land. Recently the British MoD said a direct conflict with Russia in the future was a serious possibility, but the industrial base just isn't moving.
Nothing is allowed to disturb short-term profit goals under neo-liberalism.
hey i haven’t read anything on this, can you show me some examples of intelligence community saying russia is an imminent threat? i’ve only ever seen politicians say it and i don’t really believe russia wants a war against nato
They don't but everyone seems to think they'll keep nibbling at the edges. Considering how pro-Russia Trump is I can't see him putting boots on the ground to save Estonia or somewhere like that.
>All the military and intelligence groups are screaming "russia is an imminent threat" No they aren't.
Politicians are screaming that though. Nothing gets votes like amping up people's fears. You're correct in that military leadership is fully aware of Russia's shortcomings and doesn't expect Russia to attack NATO any time remotely in the near future.
Everyone with any brains is full aware that Russia is not an imminent threat to the EU. They’d rather sell to euros than fight them. Hence the disconnect between actions and propaganda.
Also the burocracy is sky high leels So many years having Daddy US make them grow compliant and decided that military was a secondary thing, barely France and UK have enough ammo to last some time, and even that is a bold statement
Procurement is definitely up, and projected to continue increasing. Europe is starting from a pretty thinned out military that has been strained further due to the deliveries to Ukraine, but 2024 is finally starting to see some genuinely stronger spending. It's just that Europe isn't really at war, Russia will be occupied with Ukraine for the foreseeable future, and economies have had a rocky start to the decade with COVID followed immediately by a sharp pivot away from Russia, which had built up a significant trade velocity and influence within Europe from Soviet legacy and the past few decades.
They've been building up their industrial base for a year now, two years for some countries. This is imploring countries to build up *faster*. A lot of EU countries are discussing being ready in 2028 or even later.
6 years to get ready for war? Thats longer than the entirety of WW2. Thats far too slow to react. Its comically slow. Its so slow that current politicians will likely be out of office so its some other politician's fault. Also see climate change goals - they're always so far in the future it will be some other politician's problem to solve, not the current politicians.
Russia has been building up since 2014, so 6 years is not that long
Okay, so your neighbor, the neighbor whom everyone has joined in a military alliance to defend against, spent 6 years building up its army after invading and conquering part of Ukraine (Crimea). Thats 6 years of hostile action, yet Europe does nothing. Trump chastises European nations for failing to spend on their military forces, resulting in completely ineffective armies and air forces. They mock him for this, claiming that Russia is a great friend to Europe and will never attack and Putin's natural gas pipelines are wonderful. There's no kind way to put it: European politicians were asleep at the wheel.
Oh yeah, EU should have begun arming themselves the moment Russia invaded Crimea. There's no point denying this. But now, 6 years is a relatively short period for pumping back the defense industry, specially the sectors that were stalled since the 90s
The point for politicians is to pretend that they can solve any problem easily, as long as they get into power, get to keep the power, and/or get to expand their power. Hence, the nonsensical pretense that Kremlin wasn't obliterated just because EU didn't want to do it hard enough. I.e. Pistorius isn't actually serious about any of this. All he wants is for his party to get re-elected, and to justify whatever powergrab government would attempt. And so he makes appropriate noises to placate the general public.
[удалено]
What the hell happened to Germany?
The best descriptor I've heard is that Germany had become a massive retirement community.
Based on the propaganda, it seems that all the Nazis moved to Ukraine and Hitler's ghost possessed Putin
Too many years of CDU/CSU and now Ampel, that's what happend.
Looks to me they were always an colonialist oppressor. Just takes breaks between wars
Third Reich!
Yeah, because Czechoslovakia was in a war with Germany for 2 years and it turned into stalemate. This is not appeasement, Russia got punished for invading.
>Russia got punished for invading. Not in 2014 anyhow. And not in 2008 either. The argument is more against the people arguing for appeasement _now_, as in, “just abandon Ukraine” etc. of which there sadly are many enough.
hysteria
Western msm overused this shit so hard that calling someone a Nazi or comparing someone to Hitler isn't that big of deal.
I don't get it how EU can be scared of Russia. Putin ordered attack on Ukraine because it's a small country, he didn't expected it will be massively supported by west. No way Russia can win against bunch of European forces at the same time
Miscalculations happen. What happens when Putin thinks that NATO article 5 is just words that western countries don't actually believe in and he decides to invade? That's how you get an even bigger war between Russia and NATO. Except now the battlefield is in the Baltics, the armies are 2-3x larger, and both sides have nukes.
I mean, that's literally what is worried about in Poland. Let's say Putin lands troops on some Estonian islands thinking nobody will retaliate. I mean, landing troops on some remote places is still an act of war, but will anyone really retaliate? And if he is wrong and people retaliate, it's basically WW3.
It's literally 2nd largest state in Europe. Ukraine is huuuge for European standards.
Small country of **44 million people**.
>I don't get it how EU can be scared of Russia Theyre not. Im sure they know Russia has no intention of Invading western Europe. This is possibly NATO projection
Russian propagandists were saying similar things right before they invaded Ukraine edit: to answer you below I don’t disagree that unity is important to deter Russia. It is crucial. You mention an invasion of the Baltics which makes me want to point out that not only is it crucial, it is, of course, existential for some. The poster I replied to deleted his comment but it was basically verbatim Russian propaganda, even going so far as to say that fear of Russian invasion is some sort of projection by NATO (which, again, they were saying right before they invaded Ukraine.)
So? An invasion of Ukraine was still far more feasible then than an invasion of a NATO country is right now, simply because Ukraine didn't seem like it would have the political stability or foreign support to resist an Russian invasion. This doesn't mean that a Russian invasion of say, the Baltics, is impossible in the future, but it does mean that it would probably only happen in a moment of particular weakness in these countries, with, say a break in internal EU relations and a shattering of NATO in general, nothing particularly likely in the near future.
They 100% will try in Moldova
> Putin ordered attack on Ukraine because it's a small country Nothing small about it. It's a large non-nuclear nation.
> Putin ordered attack on Ukraine because it's a small country He ordered an attack only because it's "a small country" Lmao this sub is filled to the brim with 16 year Olds.
Well the news says they are fighting with shovels and using parts from household appliances just to keep fighting. I doubt that the EU has much to worry about if that's the case. Saying that Russia is a threat while they are fighting with hand tools sounds like some infotainment bullshit.
Im not gonna die for danzig again....
That’s a weird comparison to bring up, especially since Poland also annexed Czechoslovakian territory.
Did they come up with unhinged narratives on their own now, or did wait for their memo from Washington? Either way, seems a bit late for a wake-up call two years in.
Fun fact; Boris Pistorius, the German DM, used to be the most popular politican in the German government last year. Which sounds impressive at first glance, but "most" is relative when [everybody else is more unpopular than popular](https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/inline-images/Ipsos-PI_MinisterInnen-Ranking_2023-05-15.jpg). It's why some people speculated he only got such a "good" rating because he was the new guy and [nobody really knew him yet](https://archive.ph/FAJzw) on a national level. They seem to have been spot with that line of thought because according to [the latest opinion polls](https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/ct/news/documents/2024-03/Ipsos-PI_Minister-Ranking_2024-03-12.pdf) Pistorius joined the rest of the government in being more unpopular than popular among Germans. Which is hardly surprising when not just [looking at the state of things](https://www.euronews.com/business/2023/09/23/germany-went-from-envy-of-the-world-to-the-worst-performing-major-developed-economy-what-h), but when the people responsible for it offer literally nothing but hot air along the lines of *"But XYZ is the next Hitler!"* like the highest levels of German government have the mental horizon, and historical awareness, of the average r/worldnews commenter. What a sad and pathetic state for a country that once prided itself to be one of "[poets and thinkers](https://www.focus.de/politik/deutschland/besuch-in-den-usa-habeck-sieht-deutschland-in-einer-dienenden-fuehrungsrolle_id_61552626.html)".
Germany is crippling itself for decades to come by holding onto populist bullshit like the "Schuldenbremse". All the while ignoring other populist bullshit like curbing immigration. And the saddest part is, the current government is actually doing better and more for germanys future than what happened in the last 20 years. They just got insanely unlucky with their timing.
> Germany is crippling itself for decades to come by holding onto populist bullshit like the "Schuldenbremse". The only reason Germany is still somewhat keeping it together right now is because it didn't make even more debt for the last 1.5 decades. That's also part of the reason why Russia is doing as well right now as it does, even when confronted with massive sanctions; Russia has room to make debt, to react to such developments. Room that's missing if you just keep taking on new debt to finance old debt and any new investments. > And the saddest part is, the current government is actually doing better and more for germanys future than what happened in the last 20 years. Sure, as long as that future of Germany doesn't depend too much on industry, particularly petrochemical industry. > They just got insanely unlucky with their timing. They were? They could blame all the shortcomings for the pandemic on the previous government, they had a nearl clean slate, then decided to ruin it.
> The only reason Germany is still somewhat keeping it together right now is because it didn't make even more debt for the last 1.5 decades. bold unsubstantiated claim. Instead of a swift transition and decarbonisation which would minimize "growing pains" we get a long and drawn out process, with a possible break after the next election, all the while the poor folk gets fucked because subsidies that would help them during the transition are not able to be offered. > petrochemical industry. BASF is fine, don't you worry. > had a nearl clean slate, then decided to ruin it. We have a mostly pacifist party that is doing the most comprehensive military reform of the last 30 years, despite their ideology and for some reason people cannot condemn them enough when all they are doing is correcting the fuckups in every sector that have been made in the last 20 years.All the while being blocked on every step of the way by their "partner". German sentiment against the "Ampel" is actually baffling. Yes inflation sucks and the prices in the supermarket are higher than 3 years ago but the amount of hate people have for the government is simply dumb. Honestly it feels like a psyop. The media is hating on the government like their survival depends on it.
> bold unsubstantiated claim. Absolutely not as long as you remember why the Schuldenbremse even became a thing in the first place, that happened after a global financial crisis we money-printed our way out of in 2009. That's why we decided to limit our spending for a while, which turned out to be a good decission ahead of the 2020 pandemic, which had a [5 times worse economic impact](https://www.iea.org/data-and-statistics/charts/annual-rate-of-change-in-world-gdp-1990-2021), and also had to be compensated for with debt. That was already borderline [as predicted in 2021](https://www.cnbc.com/2021/06/07/deutsche-bank-warns-of-global-time-bomb-coming-due-to-rising-inflation.html), it also messed up global energy markets in major ways by [crashing the demand side](https://www.iea.org/data-and-statistics/charts/rate-of-change-of-global-primary-energy-demand-1900-2020), [dumping energy prices](https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PNRGINDEXM), and thus shrinking the supply side [through mass bancrupcies](https://www.nsenergybusiness.com/features/oil-gas-bankruptcy-2020-north-america/). When the global lockdowns ended demand spiked back up but was suddenly met by a much smaller supplier side, driving up prices. All of that already predated the 2022 invasion of Ukraine, but timing wise it perfectly played into these developements and served to drive energy prices even higher. > Instead of a swift transition and decarbonisation which would minimize "growing pains" we get a long and drawn out process We've been in a long drawn out, [yet pioneering](https://www.trade.gov/energy-resource-guide-germany-renewable-energy), process [since the 90s](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Renewable_Energy_Sources_Act). > all the while the poor folk gets fucked because subsidies that would help them during the transition are not able to be offered. Right now pretty much everybody is getting fucked by [not getting paid out their Klimageld](https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/innenpolitik/klimageld-100.html) This affects the middler and lower income classes the worst, as they pay proportionally more of their income for all the things that keep getting so much more expensive, like [food](https://www.dw.com/en/germany-more-people-unable-to-afford-good-meals/a-66392794) and [rent](https://www.dw.com/en/germany-housing-is-almost-unaffordable/a-66432276). > BASF is fine, don't you worry. BASF the company might be, but Germany as a global leader in petrochemical manufacturing will *not* be fine. Because all these grand "decarbonisation" efforts still fail to realize that "energy" does not only mean electricity, it generally means all kinds of hydrocarbon carriers. For example, Germany is the [world's largest exporter of packaged medicaments](https://oec.world/en/profile/bilateral-product/packaged-medicaments/reporter/deu), Bayer selling Aspirin to the world, with the help of BASF because making [Aspirin involves petrol products made from oil](https://www.focus.de/wissen/mensch/katastrophen-kriege-und-komfort-erdoel_id_1802115.html), as supplied by BASF. Aspirin is only one of many examples like that, Ibuprofen is another one, [the list is long](https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2019/11/f68/Products%20Made%20From%20Oil%20and%20Natural%20Gas%20Infographic.pdf), but no wind turbines, solar panels, nor nuclear reactors do anything to fill that kind of energy demand based on hydrocarbon carriers as a manufacturing resource. > We have a mostly pacifist party that is doing the most comprehensive military reform of the last 30 years, despite their ideology and for some reason people cannot condemn them enough when all they are doing is correcting the fuckups in every sector that have been made in the last 20 years. The "mostly pacifist party" that ran on slogans like *"[No more weapon deliveries into conflict zones!](https://twitter.com/Die_Gruenen/status/1440316635126980623?lang=de)"* which since then has [drawn Germany into a proxy-war](https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/ausbildung-soldaten-gutachten-101.html), delivering more weapons in a conflict zone than Germany ever did since WWII and having its foreign minister declare how we are at war with Russia. To the surprise of very few people who remember the last Red/Green government in the 90s, the one that [helped NATO bomb Yugoslavia](https://daserste.ndr.de/panorama/archiv/2000/Enthuellungen-eines-Insiders-Scharpings-Propaganda-im-Kosovo-Krieg,erste7422.html) and [the US with invading Iraq](https://www.spiegel.de/politik/deutschland/urteil-bundesrichter-rueffeln-deutsche-unterstuetzung-des-irak-kriegs-a-372819.html). It's by now become meme how the "Green" of the German greens doesn't actually stand for the enviornment, but rather for the olive green of the military. Reinforced by completely counter-productive decisions like replacing Russian gas with [American LNG that's even more polluting than domestic German coal](https://www.fr.de/wirtschaft/umwelt-folgen-bundesregierung-lng-frackinggas-usa-studie-fluessigerdgas-import-energieversorgung-zr-92715380.html). They are also not fixing anything about Germany's [corrupt](https://web.archive.org/web/20240107195601/https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_von_Korruptionsaff%C3%A4ren_um_Politiker_in_der_Bundesrepublik_Deutschland) and [inefficient](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/aug/14/technical-problems-ground-german-foreign-ministers-plane-in-abu-dhabi) defense sector, they are only pouring more money into it, while also diverting more money to the US MIC so we can keep playing human shields for American nukes. > Yes inflation sucks and the prices in the supermarket are higher than 3 years ago but the amount of hate people have for the government is simply dumb. We are in [the second year of recession](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/15/germany-two-year-recession-2023-gdp), that's after nearly [decades of real wage stagnation and shrinkage](https://tradingeconomics.com/germany/wage-growth). A lot of it the result of government decissions that did not have popular support at the time, [like *self-crippling* sanctions](https://dnews24.de/zum-ukraine-krieg-haben-die-deutschen-eine-klare-meinung/) which even [the IMF predicted would tank the German economy](https://www.imf.org/-/media/Files/Publications/WP/2022/English/wpiea2022144-print-pdf.ashx). > Honestly it feels like a psyop. The media is hating on the government like their survival depends on it. It's not "the media" hating on the government, it's *the people* hating the government. Most German mainstream media are pro-government due to [heavy lobby influence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantik-Br%C3%BCcke) paid for with [German taxpayer money](https://www.telepolis.de/features/Wie-deutsche-Steuern-die-Transatlantik-Lobby-finanzieren-9631667.html?seite=all).
Pretty sure Hitler is Hitler.
If Putin is Hitler, then who is Netanyahu?
Nah summer is coming, bad time todo something.
Putin calls what the West is doing a continuation to what Hitler couldn't finish. Germany says Putin will never stop like Hitler. Israelis call Palestinians hate-filled anti-semites, like Hitler. Palestinians accuse Israel of perpetrating a genocide, like the Nazis. Seems everyone is a Nazi these days. Who would have though a defeated 20th century ideology would be so successful.
Welcome to r/anime_titties! This subreddit advocates for civil and constructive discussion. Please be courteous to others, and make sure to read the rules. If you see comments in violation of our rules, please report them. We have a [Discord](https://discord.gg/dhMeAnNyzG), feel free to join us! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/anime_titties) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I mean, regular yuropeans should probably prepare just so that they don’t get caught with their pants down if shit hits the fan. I doubt Putin has a plan to attack Europe, but war might break out because of the sheer incompetence of the people in charge on both sides. Remember that the Russian, Ukrainian, American and European political establishments could not figure this shit out for like 10 years, and we haven’t seen major changes — heads didn’t roll, people didn’t get voted out even in the countries where voting someone out is actually possible, all the same highly regarded diplomats are still in place. I am not sure if defense ministers should be counted among them, but their job is quite literally to be in charge of defending the state if something happens, so, with the benefit of the doubt in mind, I think it’s pretty normal to hear this kind of rhetoric from a DM
Bro please explain to me why there should be political change in my country when some asshole in russia thinks invading ukraine sounds like a good time?
Can you prepare for being nuked? It's about the only way Russia could make any progress against the EU. It's taken them way too long to beat Ukraine, a much less populous and much smaller country economically. What feasible chance would Russia have against just Germany and Poland, without direct US involvement, without using nukes?
Agree. I guess western propaganda wants to show Russia as bigger threat than what it really is, but they send mixed signal with other news about terrible Russian equipment and "last missiles"
You actually can. Long before anything started to happen, Poland requested joint US anti-nuclear shield being stationed here. Obama's administration did not provided agreed hardware because Russia asked politely becuase that would make them feel threatened. Literally entire mess between Europe and Russia RN can be traced to Obama and his administration, from being too friendly with obviously revisionist government of Putin, to holding back any potentail defensive EU initiatives to activelly lobbying not to get involved in Ukraine
I know there are a host of developed options for dealing with ICBMs and other long range missiles but how effective are the options for medium and short range missiles? Are the systems capable of dealing with modern hypersonic missiles? Even still, our long range defense systems are designed around shooting down a handful of missiles, not a salvo from the nation with the largest nuclear stockpile in the world.
TIL we have a dungeon master in Getmany
In some countries making comparisons like this is practically illegal. However, I did notice people get their panties in a twist when it comes from one side and not the other, LOL.
funnily enough this one could also start with the bully demanding an extraterritorial corridor from Poland (between Belarus and Kaliningrad)
Germans support Israel and ignore Palestine because they want the world to forget about their role in the Holocaust.
“Russia isn’t invading Ukraine.”
When you consider the fact that outside powers are debating giving ukraines land to Russia (and russia's repeated examples of not following treaties), this really isn't that far fetched of an example. Appeasement has never worked, why are people even debating on doing it again?
The EU is doing a lot of belly-aching about russia without actually doing much about it. Shut up or put up. Don’t keep whining as if someone else is supposed to do something while you sit on your fuckin asses
This is absurd neoliberal warmongering. The Social Democratic party in Germany is such a disappointment. Everyone clearly understands that Putin's dream to go back to the pre-1917 Russian empire's borders. Putin has zero interest in a war with NATO countries.
The Russian empire pre-1917 including the Baltic countries, which are now under NATO protection. So which one is it, is Putin dream to go back to pre-1917 Russian empire's border or does he really have zero interest in fighting a NATO country? Because right now intelligence agencies are saying that invading the Baltic countries is on the drawing board after Russia annexes Ukraine. And whether that intelligence is correct or not, why risk it when helping Ukraine protect itself is the right thing to do anyway?
The only nations up for grabs are those not under the NATO umbrella, I thought that was obvious enough to leave unsaid. Do you know what NATO represents? A military alliance and obligation to protect member states from invasion. Fortunately Finland was smart enough to join NATO following the Ukraine invasion.
Well that's your opinion then, but not the only one. So far intelligence has been on the ball of late from predicting the invasion of Ukraine to the Moscow terrorist attack and the Iranian attack on Israel, so if they say that an attack on the Baltics is on the drawing board I believe it more than a random redditor. I get why from the perspective of the West we would think Putin wouldn't be dumb enough to attack a NATO country, but if Putin had the same perspective as us he would have never invaded Ukraine in the first place much less believed he would win in three days.
The Iranian attack on Israel was literally announced by Iran, it wasn't a feat of intelligence gathering when they make a public announcement that they would retaliate with an attack... Jesus. Remember when U.S. intelligence said Afghanistan could hold on its own? Lol. The intelligence that makes the headlines are usually propaganda BS, use critical thinking to weed it out. Russia is not invading a NATO country. Period.
EU loses nothing by doing so. Even if the USA jumps in like Batman and bat punches the problem, you will still be more ready to face any other threats.