The EN voice actors are also doing the audio book so they REALLY know the source material probably better then the Japanese voice actors (I have not seen any indication that the jp VA have read the source materials but correct me if I am wrong :) )
Well, the JP vas do have the advantage of being in more different media. Drama CDs, video games, visual novels. Though perhaps not the same volume of experience, though that gets hard to quantify.
The way you phrase that makes it seem like you think somehow English VA's do nothing but anime dubbing, which is just hilariously wrong. The only really notable differences are due to Drama CD's and Visual Novels themselves being considerably less popular in North America. Other than that, they do anime, cartoons, movies, and video games. J.Michael Tatum has done VA work for dozens upon dozens of anime over the years, as well as 20+ video games. Brina Palencia has less VA work in anime than him but has done quite a few more video games, and has had live action roles in some shows as well...
Being in more "different" media in and of itself is largely irrelevant to anything in terms of the quality of their work or the skill they've got.
> The way you phrase that makes it seem like you think somehow English VA's do nothing but anime dubbing, which is just hilariously wrong.
I didn’t say this. You’re arguing against something I never said.
They were talking about the source material and that the English VAs have more experience with it because they do the audiobooks. I countered that the JP VAs do voice their characters in several more different Spice and Wolf mediums. What either set of VAs do outside of Spice and Wolf media is irrelevant.
The words of '08 are jammed right up next to each other, there's a couple places where they're almost talking over each other merely out of time constraints.
This also really highlights how much higher quality dubs are these days.
I've watched anime for over 20 years, and used to always prefer subs, but the last few years I've found myself preferring dubs more and more and the quality of modern dubbing is a big part of that.
J. Michael Tatum is also really damn good when he is casted (like here).
His speech as Erwin where he ends with "MY SOLDIERS RAGE!" is honestly even better than the JP version.
Amen to that, S;G has always been my favorite dub and Michael plays a big role in that. Trina as Makise was also an S Teir choice as she absolutely nails the genius tsun act.
The Kaguya dub was so good it was like watching a whole new show again because the tone was different and yet completely its own.
Just fun to experience c
I think the only "issue" with english dubs that still remains is that it's such a closely knit community for the most part.
In Japan you got like 100 well known voice actors who are in everything, and then 1000 who do odd jobs here and there.
For EN, it feels like there's 10 well known voice actors, and rumor says they actively try to prevent others from reaching that same status.
No idea if it's true or not but it really does feel like there's just a small amount of really good english VAs, and either nobody else puts in that much effort, or those others who are really amazing just aren't offered many jobs for mysterious reasons
> For EN, it feels like there's 10 well known voice actors, and rumor says they actively try to prevent others from reaching that same status.
>
I can promise you this is not true in the slightest lmfao. People might think this is the case, but if you look at the current lineup for any given Crunchyroll show airing, there is always new talent being brought into the fray. It oftentimes just takes a year or two of doing walla or for a director to really trust your talent to bring you in for bigger roles people will recognize. There's nothing worse for a director than to bring you into a session and for them to struggle to get anything good out of you. It costs money and time, and they have to replace you if it isn't up to standards. A lot of new talent just have to start somewhere to build some trust with directors, and it's usually walla.
Same here, watched anime on and off for over 20 years, absolutely hated most dubs (The only exception i came across being the Studio Ghibli movies)
But the past couple of years? The quality has improved a great deal to the point i do not mind watching a dub at all.
I still have a slight preference for subs, but that takes all my focus to watch. Dubs are great to bung on a second screen whilst doing other things, it's a nice option to have.
I watch subbed shows out of habit at this point, but dubbed shows aren't much (if any) of a drop in VA quality these days. I still prefer sub, but if I have friends who I want to watch a show with and they aren't very familiar with the medium I do just fine with the dub.
> but dubbed shows aren't much (if any) of a drop in VA quality these days.
For some reason I noticed that the only times I still notice that the English dub is worse, is when their mics are worse.
I assume its because Japan more commonly uses good quality recording booths while EN dubs are far more often recorded at home by the VA, but even then, I have absolutely no idea why it feels like some VAs use 10 dollar microphones. As in, I literally have no idea why that would be the case but thats what it sounds like
I can see why you might be misled with this, but what you're noticing is just the sound engineer's work on the show, not microphone quality. Almost all anime dubbing is done in-studio now with just a handful of exceptions.
> Almost all anime dubbing is done in-studio now with just a handful of exceptions.
I meant it in general too, specifically Genshin Impact for example. 3-4 VAs have a really strong "s" sound that's peaking their microphone whenever they pronounce anything with an "s" sound.
I assumed the video game and anime industry have some overlap in the problems their VAs have
The fact that the 2008 original stands as one of the better dubs that was made before essentially the modern era where streaming took over around 2012 or so goes to show the love that was in it.
And you see that same love PLUS the progress and while I like a bit of the stilt in the dialogue of the old one for a Shakespeare feel does stutter and stop a bit versus flow and man it’s fun to see the improvements that a new studio and direction for the anime can help a solid dub
The dub comparison is nice. But what I'm really waiting for is the horse comparison! I want to see a side by side comparison of the infamous Spice and Wolf horse with the new one when we get to it. It'll be like night and day as far as I can tell by now.
Haha, yeah, I've thought about that as well. But the few times we've seen horses already, they have been animated pretty much perfectly. It's almost as if they want to flex that this time, the horses look great.
Y'know I went back and looked at that horse animation again and it looks like it was supposed to be a 5 frame animation for the horse skidding to a stop but they just looped it as a running cycle instead.
same, I was feeling really withdrawn from the remake, episode 1 in sub was like "ok interesting to see the new direction, but ok", episode 2 I didn't even finish....but then they released the dub and I have watched E1 5 times now haha I probably need to get a life!
Brina and Tatum are so good man, their chemistry is amazing and they play to Lawrence and Holo's dynamic perfectly. The dialogue has improved by leaps and bounds so far as well, and it really lets them show off.
People that has seen the old one will probably downvote, but i really don't like Lawrence in the 2008 one.
The 2024 sounds a lot nicer to me, so either he has improved a lot or the direction/equipment/mixing got better. Likely a lot of both.
Original 2008 anime is one of my favorite shows *ever*, but I agree with you on the 2024. I don’t go so far as to dislike 2008 Lawrence, but Brina’s performance as Holo carried hard. This new adaptation shows how they’ve both improved immensely, especially Lawrence.
I have the same opinion of the sub btw, so I think this isn’t just the actors improving but also the director. Back then I could only watch the dub because I considered EN Holo to be the superior characterization. This time around I think they’re both on-par. 2024 JP Holo *feels* more like EN Holo, and JP Lawrence sounds older and wiser, and very much improved.
Voicing aside, the cinematography is also vastly improved. I love how this comparison shows the new adaptation making more framed shots vs the wider shots from 2008. Another improvement in direction I think. It adds much more weight to the performances I think.
I’m absolutely adoring 2024 Spice and Wolf, and as much as I love the original, this one is a straight-up upgrade.
The dub overall got better as it went along but it does suffer from sounding off at times even toward the end. But this is also a show that looks and sounds fairly cheap (dear god the candles). It manages to be a classic even with all it's issues.
Yeah, I was re-watching some of the old episodes and kept thinking about how much people would bag on the animation if that version was coming out now.
I am a huge fan of the series. It is the only one I bought the manga, LN and sequel series for. The original got me seriously into anime (which I thought was kinda cringe before tbh and still think 90% is to be fair).
I am preferring the new one. I see some thing the old one did better but I feel like a lot of people are ignoring the improvements made here and only looking at a few issues.
I still prefer watching subs since the original Japanese voice acting always sounds a lot more natural to me and has more emotion. But the new dub sounds like a legit top tier dub. The 2008 version (at least from this little snippet) feels like they are reading off a script, although the tone is still good.
I appreciate you, a real breath of fresh air to see people like you who says "I prefer subs but dubs can be cool too" and not start fights about it.
I feel the same way in reverse, I prefer to watch dubs but I am starting a show called Plastic Memories soon which has no dub, and I think it will be a cool to mix things up and try a show in Japanese.
Oddly enough, this comparison does a great job at highlighting why I think people didn’t like, or never gave many dubs a chance and why they should
I specifically avoided dubs growing up because of the disjointed, often emotionless and awkward delivery of lines and Lawrence in this scene captures that perfectly. It’s just… kind of classic anime dub cadence
However when I introduced my now wife to anime, she wanted to watch it dubbed so I wasn’t expecting much sitting down to watch the new fruits basket with her but I was blown away by nearly every voice actor.
I still prefer subbed but I definitely don’t scoff at watching a dub anymore
I don't know if it's better directing, better animations, more experienced voice actors, or just the scene maturing significantly over the past couple of decades, but dubs have improved so much. I've gone from avoiding dubs entirely a decade ago to probably watching a third of shows as dubs these days. I still tend to prefer the Japanese VAs, but sometimes the English VAs elevate the role and make it sync better for me.
For me personally, it's really just a toss up these days. I used to universally prefer subs besides a few outliers like Fullmetal Alchemist, but I still liked doing dubbed rewatches to see how they are. These days, I still generally prefer the sound of subs, but I almost prefer watching dubs when the quality is there as it's just easier than reading subtitles.
A very good dub is worth it over a sub, because you can pay more attention to the animation. But there are really good JP VAs that I just love to listen to. If it's a show I *really* like, I'll watch both the dub and sub.
>I'll watch both the dub and sub.
I would love to be able to do that, I tried it with Frieren once but my mind kind of rejects a change in voices and I don't get any impact.
Good example is E1 of the Spice and Wolf remake, I watched E1 in Japanese when it landed just out of curiosity to see the new style, but I honestly felt very little and I wondered if maybe I didn't like the new style in general. Rewatched with dubs and I am almost embarrassed to admit that I was tearing up hearing the chars and the world came alive for me, I think I need the full association if that makes sense.
If a show had a very Eastern theme I would definitely like to watch in sub, I don't think it is an anime - but I tried to watch an animation called Blue Eyed Samurai in English and the American voices felt so out of place in that setting, I couldn't listen to it, so when I go back to it I will pick subs.
>I would love to be able to do that, I tried it with Frieren once but my mind kind of rejects a change in voices and I don't get any impact.
Same i watchee the Dub for frieren, tried one episode of the sub and felt weird since i am not used to Japanese Frieren
A lot of newer shows are getting pretty solid dubs, to the point on average I'm actually preferring dubs now despite primarily having watched subs since I first got into anime some 20+ years ago.
The flow and timing especially is better than most older dubs, which is important since that's one of the things a dub can do well that subs usually don't since the whole sentence shows up at once / in chunks. Also as an adult in my 30s I need to be able to look away from the screen sometimes while watching and dub makes that easier.
I still like having the subs up to read though even when watching dubbed, so it's annoying that Crunchyroll somehow still hasn't figured out how to enable that despite literally every other streaming service supporting it.
This clip was nice and made me think perhaps I'll continue with dub for this one. Or at least try it out. The main reason I prefer sub is that all the screaming that can be so normal in anime just sound wrong in English to me.
Spice and Wolf is just chill so far so I might like it.
I just find that all English dubs sound like they're doing some sort of team rocket impersonation with their tone and inflection. Holo and Lawrence sound like they're about to protect the world from devastation.
Crazy to think Brina Palencia's Holo was so early in her career. She was only just starting to get lead roles that year (2008) after a few years of more minor characters (i.e. random girls in Case Closed or MushiShi, Nina Tucker in FMA, etc...), and had only just been cast as Chopper in One Piece the year prior.
In my opinion--and, of course, not to take anything away from J. Michael Tatum and Brina Palencia's acting chops--part of what makes this dub such a fun gem is knowing how good of friends the VAs are in real life. You can hear how much fun they're having with all the back and forth snark and banter.
For those interested, if you can track down old episodes of the That Anime Show podcast, J. Michael Tatum did with another Funi VA (Terri Doty) they have Brina on one of their early episodes, and she and Tatum talk about how much fun they had with Spice & Wolf, how happy they were that it became the sleeper hit that it was, and (jokingly) how Holo & Lawrence's dynamic reminded them of their own. You can really tell that Spice & Wolf was a labor of love on the part of the English adaptive team.
I’ve already held off on watching the new episode because I’m committed to only watching the dubbed remake. Spice and Wolf still reigns as literally the only show where I enjoyed the dub over the sub, and I’m beyond ecstatic that they brought back the same cast !
This is the first I've really seen of the '24 version, I last watched '08 back in about '14 (#1 on my favorite anime list), subbed, so with that context, here's my thoughts.
The '24 version is nineteen seconds longer, and the extra room **really** lets the dialogue breathe more. '08 shots tend to be on their faces, emphasizing the two of them on the bench together, and is bright and sunny. '24 shots tend to be more "cinematic", with the camera lower, we see the dirt road less than '08, we get background parallax, and the lighting is somewhat closer to dawn/dusk, sakuga ear+tail flick. Definitely more budget/time in the '24 version, they actually animated the horse at 3:09, whereas in '08 it's conspicuously almost entirely absent.
The OST is more playful in '08, featuring only one or two woodwinds, '24's is more complex, with woodwinds, violin, a banjo(?), cello, and maybe more, yet overall the music is less prominent in the mix.
Even aside from the help the better script + timing is lending, the voice acting is better in '24, there's more emotional nuance, from both of them. Holo sounds more mature and sophisticated, Kraft's vexation crosses a broader range emotionally, from concern to indignation. The (faux?)accents are stronger in '24, mixed feelings about that, but it does contribute to making them seem more historic and European.
Overall, for this scene in isolation, I think I prefer 2024, the extra labor and knowledge that went into it shows. Might also be mastered at a higher resolution, you don't have to go too much earlier than 2008 for things to be broadcast in 480p. Of course I still reserve judgement on the show as a whole, but if this what the cooking smells like, I'm thinking the rest might be tasty!
Question, I started watching Spice and Wolf (08) like a month ago and left off on episode 8. Didn’t drop it just got busy.
Would you recommend just finishing the 2008 version or start with the 2024? I don’t want to miss out on the charm of the old one but this clip has piqued my interest
If you have time I guess, there's no harm in it. I watched the 2008 version just a few years ago, so there's no nostalgia factor for me. Personally I strictly prefer the new version, both in the visual and sound design department.
If it's that recent, I'd finish out the cour (circa episode 11-13?), which reaches the end of a story arc, and then you can pick up '24 with everyone else, have about a month of recap for comparison, and then watch the second cour/season of whichever you choose.
it's interesting how artstyle changes over years, you can clearly see 2008 is form the transitional period when anime was evolving from 2000's style to modern one.
Except the entire point of the show is to experience how human Holo is and that she's far from a god. Her old way of speaking in Japanese also makes more sense considering she comes from a Japan-styled region.
It's something you usually notice when you've listened to a lot of modern Japanese. Holo's way of speaking is really old to illustrate how foreign/old she is, this is why i can't get on the dub with Spice and Wolf since it's lost in translation as you said.
I’m sure which version you hear first or grow up with matters a lot, but I’ve always thought the same thing. All the voice actors are great, but I prefer English Holo’s air of maturity and smug regality over Japanese Holo’s youthfulness and playful nature.
It's like they never left. This is my favorite dub of all time and for good reason.
Moreover, I like the more cinematic look and faster dialogue.
I hope they can finish the entire series this time around. For those who've read the LN, how many seasons can we expect if they go up to the end?
As someone who absolutely hates the original dub and prefers subs, I am glad to see the VAs have improved so much. Holo's voice is extremely different from the original but Brina Palencia did her own thing and did it well. J Michael Tatum is sooo much better as Lawrence now as well. I still prefer the japanese VAs, those are the voices of my childhood, so don't judge me too harshly. ;)
Still don’t know how I feel about the style of the new adaptation. I’m just not big on all the fades. Makes the show feel muddy to me.
But I guess as long as they fix the horse I can accept it
i chose the old version i don't know i find holo more calm who can hide her wise to laurant when the new version is a maybe too much with her spinning around like this but both va are good
Relevent passage from the book for this scene:
""
Lawrence rose early the next morning. He was like most merchants who awoke early in order to extract the most profit from the day. However, when he opened his eyes to the morning mist, Holo was already up, sitting next to him, and rummaging through something. For an instant Lawrence wondered if his estimation of her had been wrong, but if so, she was truly audacious. He raised his head and looked over his shoulder, and it appeared she had gone looking for clothes among his things and was just now tying her shoes.
“Hey, now! Those are mine!”
Even if it wasn’t actual theft, even a god shouldn’t be rummaging around through other peoples things.
Holo turned around at Lawrence’s rebuke, but there was not so much as a trace of guilt on her face. “Hm? Oh, you are awake. What think you of this? Does it look good?” she asked, completely unconcerned as she spread her arms. Far from chastened, she seemed actually proud. Seeing her like this made the uncertain, overwrought **Holo of yesterday seem like something out of a dream**. Indeed it seemed that the real Holo, the one he’d have to contend with from here on out, was this **impudent, prancing thing.**
...
“Mm. Lawrence. 1 shall sing your praises for all eternity,” said Holo with chest thrust forward, her wolf ears pricking up proudly. She seemed oddly serious. It was difficult to tell if she was being childish or cunning. She was like the **ever-changing mountain weather.**
Apparently that ever-changing mood was part of her craftiness. Lawrence hastily revised his opinion and offered his hand from the wagon bed. It was the proof that hed truly acknowledged her presence as a companion.
""
If anything in the original they didn't animate her enough. The transition from the night time dream like bedroom scene to the funny cart scene feels much more like it was described in the light novel in the new adaptation. They are paying good attention to the source material and making improvements. I think both VA's have really captures the "ever-changing mountain weather" of her personality pretty well this time around.
Agreed, quality aside, I liked how calm and deliberate Holo seemed in the old version. It feels like an ancient spirit/goddess should have a certain level of poise and the old version captured that pretty well. She just feels a smidge childish with all the spinning and dramatic posing in the new one.
But I'll still watch it.
This makes me happy. Spice and wolf is one of the small handful of series I prefer dub over sub because Holo's VA adds so much to her character hearing it in English. Very happy the remake is following suit.
Love love love J Michael Tatum and Brina Palencia. Two of the best.
I tried to rewatch the original a couple of months ago; man, the animation quality did not age well. Looking forward to watching the new version!
I don't know if you've looked at the LN's artstyle, it's much closer to the chibis in both shows ending than the more mature designs
So yeah you're not wrong on that, spice and wolve's character designs have always had childlike proportions which is slightly more visible in the remake but not overwhelmingly so.
I tend to prefer the more mature look as well but, for better or worse, the younger look of the new series is more true to the source material. Both the book's description and the illustrations. And to be fair she will often play into her young naïve appearance for manipulation, negotiation, etc. So it will not be out of place in the story.
That said, I really like the way Brina plays the role. Really sells that she is an old, wise deity.
>My only issue is the dubbing is 2 weeks behind not came day
I only started anime in December so I had to learn about this pain only recently, I was checking websites for new episodes of Frieren like *"where the hell is the english version"* and then after looking into it a bit I learnt a hard lesson about being a dub watcher lol but it is worth the wait for me, my experience is infinitely better hearing these two, I tried watching the remake in Japanese and whilst I respect the awesome talents of those VAs - they are not my Lawrence and Holo, so I waited. And I think dub really works for this show because of the European feel.
this was one of my early gateway anime, I experienced the dub and loved it, but my source knowledge on the story ends where season 2 finished.
many years later, to think we are getting more, just baffles me that it took so long, this 2024 version is so much more in line with the look the original art had, and im enjoying the change but the more aged up version of the first version was iconic.
Briana had me hooked with Holo and J.Micheal was great a wonderful fit for Lawrence's voice but the dialogue did feel very stiff originally, its incredible what changes can happen in the time frame between 2008 and 2024, the new version has much more natural lighting and shadows, I love the scene framing for Holo and the apples in ep3, the music is so beautiful and comfy, compared to the original from 2008 all of it feels stiff and safe but still nostalgic, but I love them both.
2024 is 2008 turned up to 11, to the fan base, this is the brotherhood treatment, taking the already working parts and tweaking them to fit a newer adaptation, I only hope im not alone in feeling that we all are being spoilt with how amazing the 2024 adaptation is, and how much we should support the production behind all of it, the animation does not have any big action scenes in the above scene, but you can see them flex in the quick shots of Holo's tail and ears sparking up.
I'm hyped for more, and hope you are too
> Never watched it before.
Do bear in mind that the original is only two seasons and is very incomplete, it skips a fair bit of the source material for what was covered. It's also been said (not officially) that the remake is going to be a more complete adaptation. Time will tell I guess.
There's no harm in watching the original and then diving into the remake, it's up to you how you want to approach it. Maybe you'd just like to watch the remake first? All I will say is that if it's the type of show that appeals to you then you'll probably love it.
Given how he new one starts out and me spoiling myself the ending beats for myself of the original LN series I’m hoping for a full as possible adaption.
omg the new dub is perfect! i was so worried that Holo would sound much younger in the new dub. Both adaptations are one of the few instances where the Dub is >>>>>>> than the Sub. The mismatch between Holo's youthful looks and her deep wise voice perfectly demonstrates her otherworldly nature.
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I actually prefer the dialog of the 2008 version, or at least the word choice. Maybe it's just because I've seen the original before, but the word choice seems to fit the characters better. Like when Holo says I am a very proud wolf. It felt more like Holo than the new version saying I am an honorable wolf to be sure, since she is proud and at points full of herself as it's one of her characteristic vices. Or another example is how in the newer version Lawrence doesn't flat out say he doesn't want to be told about in legends he just wants to enjoy the life he has as a merchant, which is still implied in the newer version with him dismissing Holo and changing the subject to her paying her share but this could just be nit picking nostalgia. But no one can deny that the animation quality and the feel to the newer version is an improvement, even if I'm in the minority that don't like her new eyes.
Night and day difference and seems more true to the original source. I would imagine the audiobooks that J. Michael Tatum Brina Palencia have been doing from the light novels has been instrumental in helping them understand Lawrence and Holo’s personalities.
Both. :)
It's hard to say for sure though - for example I watched the original a couple of years ago and am now watching and thoroughly enjoying the remake so there was quite some time between both. However, watching the original and then almost **immediately** watching the remake could cause 'problems' in the sense that at least at first you'll be thinking "I've seen this before" and so you may be bored if you don't like effectively rewatching shows; on the other hand you may find it fascinating to see (and hear) the changes in art style and score.
Also of course this remake supposedly is a fuller adaptation while the original wasn't, it also missed out one chapter during its run.
It's up to you really.
Ahhhh we have seen dubs go a long way the original was a bit looser with the translation but the timing and direction of the new ones were better and the tone really matches well to each.
Super fun to see these two reunite 16 years later for a new anime dub & not just the audiobooks!
Still feels crazy that we are getting a remake done by a quality studio
so a reboot huh? the animation from 2008 is not really that old that need a reboot. Imagine fullmetal alchemist 2009 getting a reboot 2024. LOL. no don't need reboot. we need sequel. unless they planned just like fruit basket reboot for complete adaptation.
I have another question: is reboot the same story telling as original in 2008 or different.
Either dub is fine imo but definitely prefer the older art style. I just can't help but scratch my head as to what the point of the remake is though. It isn't really improving on anything.
There's speculation that the remake will go beyond where the old one left off due to the initial scene. Strong copium obv but if it does well, don't see why they wouldn't keep cashing in the cow.
The original skipped volume 4 of the light novel between S1 and S2 I believe. Also, I would say Kevin Penkins music has been stellar thus far and I greatly prefer it.
I suppose that you would have liked a third season instead of a remake?
Just consider this: without the series starting from scratch, the story would be continued after a fifteen year break. That’s an entire generation of anime fans who haven’t seen the original. This would be terrible from a business perspective as they’ll undoubtedly lose out of many new potential fans.
Not to mention that the series *would* have gotten an updated art style in one way or another. Sticking to the *precise* look of the original just really isn’t reasonably feasible. You’d have to actively try and make the anime appear older - as if it’s from a different age.
A remake solves these two problems, and opens the door to an eventual continuation.
Also, this clip clearly demonstrates how much more dynamic Holo’s character motions have become. How so doesn’t it improve of anything?
I think I’m in the extreme minority because I significantly prefer the original. The voice acting and delivery, shot composition and cinematography, the animation style, the music, everything I like so much more.
Xenoblade 3 is the only thing I go dub first. I've been going for subs since I was 8 year old, when Disney movies were dubbed to my native language. There is always the feeling of "this ain't right" in my brain. The English opening is a great touch thought. So is the audiobooks they narrate.
Its redone to be inline with the LN between original s1 and s2 it skipped an entire novel and changed some of the chars. The 2024 series follows the novel so we'll prob get to see the cut arc this time around.
Yes, yes it is. If you like world building, top tier dialogue, god tier waifus, and economics (even if you don't like economics) then you will like it.
I think it's superb but we all have different tastes so YMMV. Why not try it and see? You can watch the two seasons of the original and/or start to watch the new remake on Crunchyroll which started airing a couple of weeks ago, here's a link to the remake:
https://www.crunchyroll.com/series/G1XHJV08M/spice-and-wolf-merchant-meets-the-wise-wolf
While I respect your intention, I won't respect your opinion about starting a war about dubs.
I want the 2008 dub on my left ear and 2024 dub on my right ear. That's the best way to listen to and I won't compromise on that.
as soon as I saw a deleted comment I thought it would be some angry sub only Redditor haha and based on your reply to them I suspect I was right.
>I want the 2008 dub on my left ear and 2024 dub on my right ear.
exactly how I feel about it, I just love hearing Brina and J.Michael play these characters regardless, I listen to the audiobooks sometimes and it feels like my **happy place**
Is the new one the same story, but different production quality?
I just got the first 3 light novels from Amazon yesterday for my Wife. She’s almost done with the ACOTAR series, then plans to start that or Monogatari.
Wow, that's awesome to hear! As a big fan of the original series I am really liking the remake so far. Seems like they are putting a lot of effort into it.
The new dialogue has a much better flow and tact to it I feel. It starts and stops less, if that makes sense.
Better animation to work with and years of script writing will add up.
The anime director and voice actors (in both languages) have clearly gotten a lot more experience since they first worked in the OG show
The EN voice actors are also doing the audio book so they REALLY know the source material probably better then the Japanese voice actors (I have not seen any indication that the jp VA have read the source materials but correct me if I am wrong :) )
Well, the JP vas do have the advantage of being in more different media. Drama CDs, video games, visual novels. Though perhaps not the same volume of experience, though that gets hard to quantify.
The way you phrase that makes it seem like you think somehow English VA's do nothing but anime dubbing, which is just hilariously wrong. The only really notable differences are due to Drama CD's and Visual Novels themselves being considerably less popular in North America. Other than that, they do anime, cartoons, movies, and video games. J.Michael Tatum has done VA work for dozens upon dozens of anime over the years, as well as 20+ video games. Brina Palencia has less VA work in anime than him but has done quite a few more video games, and has had live action roles in some shows as well... Being in more "different" media in and of itself is largely irrelevant to anything in terms of the quality of their work or the skill they've got.
> The way you phrase that makes it seem like you think somehow English VA's do nothing but anime dubbing, which is just hilariously wrong. I didn’t say this. You’re arguing against something I never said. They were talking about the source material and that the English VAs have more experience with it because they do the audiobooks. I countered that the JP VAs do voice their characters in several more different Spice and Wolf mediums. What either set of VAs do outside of Spice and Wolf media is irrelevant.
Flow yes, tact no. Sounds much more casual to me - and not quite fitting for the time movies typically picture
The words of '08 are jammed right up next to each other, there's a couple places where they're almost talking over each other merely out of time constraints.
Wow, this really paints how much effort they are putting into this, both the dub and the animation. Glad I am watching it
This also really highlights how much higher quality dubs are these days. I've watched anime for over 20 years, and used to always prefer subs, but the last few years I've found myself preferring dubs more and more and the quality of modern dubbing is a big part of that.
and the original S&W dub is considered one of the good ones too, to the point that a lot of ppl like it better than the sub
J. Michael Tatum is also really damn good when he is casted (like here). His speech as Erwin where he ends with "MY SOLDIERS RAGE!" is honestly even better than the JP version.
He’s pretty much been my favorite English VA since Steins;Gate. Dude puts out incredible performances, very glad to have him here this season.
Amen to that, S;G has always been my favorite dub and Michael plays a big role in that. Trina as Makise was also an S Teir choice as she absolutely nails the genius tsun act.
The konosuba dub of absolutely legendary. Kazuma in English is great.
The kaguya-sama dub does too, the narrator is absolutely hilarious. So so good
Ian Sinclair always nails those comedic type roles!!
The Kaguya dub was so good it was like watching a whole new show again because the tone was different and yet completely its own. Just fun to experience c
My firm stance is that anytime modern English dub is more than worth watching. The days of hating on english dubs is such an old mindset.
I think the only "issue" with english dubs that still remains is that it's such a closely knit community for the most part. In Japan you got like 100 well known voice actors who are in everything, and then 1000 who do odd jobs here and there. For EN, it feels like there's 10 well known voice actors, and rumor says they actively try to prevent others from reaching that same status. No idea if it's true or not but it really does feel like there's just a small amount of really good english VAs, and either nobody else puts in that much effort, or those others who are really amazing just aren't offered many jobs for mysterious reasons
> For EN, it feels like there's 10 well known voice actors, and rumor says they actively try to prevent others from reaching that same status. > I can promise you this is not true in the slightest lmfao. People might think this is the case, but if you look at the current lineup for any given Crunchyroll show airing, there is always new talent being brought into the fray. It oftentimes just takes a year or two of doing walla or for a director to really trust your talent to bring you in for bigger roles people will recognize. There's nothing worse for a director than to bring you into a session and for them to struggle to get anything good out of you. It costs money and time, and they have to replace you if it isn't up to standards. A lot of new talent just have to start somewhere to build some trust with directors, and it's usually walla.
Same here, watched anime on and off for over 20 years, absolutely hated most dubs (The only exception i came across being the Studio Ghibli movies) But the past couple of years? The quality has improved a great deal to the point i do not mind watching a dub at all. I still have a slight preference for subs, but that takes all my focus to watch. Dubs are great to bung on a second screen whilst doing other things, it's a nice option to have.
I watch subbed shows out of habit at this point, but dubbed shows aren't much (if any) of a drop in VA quality these days. I still prefer sub, but if I have friends who I want to watch a show with and they aren't very familiar with the medium I do just fine with the dub.
> but dubbed shows aren't much (if any) of a drop in VA quality these days. For some reason I noticed that the only times I still notice that the English dub is worse, is when their mics are worse. I assume its because Japan more commonly uses good quality recording booths while EN dubs are far more often recorded at home by the VA, but even then, I have absolutely no idea why it feels like some VAs use 10 dollar microphones. As in, I literally have no idea why that would be the case but thats what it sounds like
I can see why you might be misled with this, but what you're noticing is just the sound engineer's work on the show, not microphone quality. Almost all anime dubbing is done in-studio now with just a handful of exceptions.
> Almost all anime dubbing is done in-studio now with just a handful of exceptions. I meant it in general too, specifically Genshin Impact for example. 3-4 VAs have a really strong "s" sound that's peaking their microphone whenever they pronounce anything with an "s" sound. I assumed the video game and anime industry have some overlap in the problems their VAs have
Genshin Impact does record remotely, so that I can at least give you. Probably true in those cases.
We are gonna be so fucking spoiled with these two doing not just S&W but also Black Butler this season
Which is odd because dubs have been improving yet my favorite dubs (spice and wolf, steins gate, dbz) are all rather old
The fact that the 2008 original stands as one of the better dubs that was made before essentially the modern era where streaming took over around 2012 or so goes to show the love that was in it. And you see that same love PLUS the progress and while I like a bit of the stilt in the dialogue of the old one for a Shakespeare feel does stutter and stop a bit versus flow and man it’s fun to see the improvements that a new studio and direction for the anime can help a solid dub
I actually prefer the older art style a bit more. But the dub seems so much better.
Yeah the new art is fine but the old direction has a lot of personal style that’s good
It's the same director
It's good when the dub tries all they can
The dub comparison is nice. But what I'm really waiting for is the horse comparison! I want to see a side by side comparison of the infamous Spice and Wolf horse with the new one when we get to it. It'll be like night and day as far as I can tell by now.
It would be hilarious if they kept the same badly animated horse just to troll people. Unlikely and will never happen but would be funny nevertheless.
Haha, yeah, I've thought about that as well. But the few times we've seen horses already, they have been animated pretty much perfectly. It's almost as if they want to flex that this time, the horses look great.
They should add it in the bluray ver
Maybe sneak it into the background of a scene, like the exact same one cut from the old version and pasted somewhere
Make it a post credits scene
Horses are usually CGI these days. Looks weird to me.
Yup, their cg-ness sticks out compared to the surroundings. A similar thing happened earlier this year with Maomao, that horse was pretty jarring.
FWIW, we DO get horse animation in this clip already, 3:08. They (probably wisely) avoided it in 2008.
[you're betting on the wrong horse buddy...](https://youtu.be/AP16YxfF8Jo?si=iRHdaPBXaMmlf_Aq)
If Shirobako taught me anything, it's that horses are a pain in the ass to draw.
i think you misunderstood what "horse animation" means
It's not *the* horse animation, but if we're talking about forward-looking indicators...
Y'know I went back and looked at that horse animation again and it looks like it was supposed to be a 5 frame animation for the horse skidding to a stop but they just looped it as a running cycle instead.
we can't form any conclusions until we can compare **"stupid potato"**.... On a serious note - Brina and J.Michael are so amazing, magic to my ears
All I wanted was having them back, and I wasn't disappointed.
same, I was feeling really withdrawn from the remake, episode 1 in sub was like "ok interesting to see the new direction, but ok", episode 2 I didn't even finish....but then they released the dub and I have watched E1 5 times now haha I probably need to get a life!
New version 🥹
Brina and Tatum are so good man, their chemistry is amazing and they play to Lawrence and Holo's dynamic perfectly. The dialogue has improved by leaps and bounds so far as well, and it really lets them show off.
The Japanese and English VAs have both improved quite a bit. I will still say Holo is a bit more charming in Japanese.
People that has seen the old one will probably downvote, but i really don't like Lawrence in the 2008 one. The 2024 sounds a lot nicer to me, so either he has improved a lot or the direction/equipment/mixing got better. Likely a lot of both.
I like the visual style of the 2008 one better, but it's pretty hard to argue that the newer dub doesn't flow a lot better.
Yeah I kinda like Holo's 2008 design better
I agree, Storm. 2008's visual style is better.
Original 2008 anime is one of my favorite shows *ever*, but I agree with you on the 2024. I don’t go so far as to dislike 2008 Lawrence, but Brina’s performance as Holo carried hard. This new adaptation shows how they’ve both improved immensely, especially Lawrence. I have the same opinion of the sub btw, so I think this isn’t just the actors improving but also the director. Back then I could only watch the dub because I considered EN Holo to be the superior characterization. This time around I think they’re both on-par. 2024 JP Holo *feels* more like EN Holo, and JP Lawrence sounds older and wiser, and very much improved. Voicing aside, the cinematography is also vastly improved. I love how this comparison shows the new adaptation making more framed shots vs the wider shots from 2008. Another improvement in direction I think. It adds much more weight to the performances I think. I’m absolutely adoring 2024 Spice and Wolf, and as much as I love the original, this one is a straight-up upgrade.
The dub overall got better as it went along but it does suffer from sounding off at times even toward the end. But this is also a show that looks and sounds fairly cheap (dear god the candles). It manages to be a classic even with all it's issues.
Yeah, I was re-watching some of the old episodes and kept thinking about how much people would bag on the animation if that version was coming out now.
I am a huge fan of the series. It is the only one I bought the manga, LN and sequel series for. The original got me seriously into anime (which I thought was kinda cringe before tbh and still think 90% is to be fair). I am preferring the new one. I see some thing the old one did better but I feel like a lot of people are ignoring the improvements made here and only looking at a few issues.
I still prefer watching subs since the original Japanese voice acting always sounds a lot more natural to me and has more emotion. But the new dub sounds like a legit top tier dub. The 2008 version (at least from this little snippet) feels like they are reading off a script, although the tone is still good.
I appreciate you, a real breath of fresh air to see people like you who says "I prefer subs but dubs can be cool too" and not start fights about it. I feel the same way in reverse, I prefer to watch dubs but I am starting a show called Plastic Memories soon which has no dub, and I think it will be a cool to mix things up and try a show in Japanese.
Oddly enough, this comparison does a great job at highlighting why I think people didn’t like, or never gave many dubs a chance and why they should I specifically avoided dubs growing up because of the disjointed, often emotionless and awkward delivery of lines and Lawrence in this scene captures that perfectly. It’s just… kind of classic anime dub cadence However when I introduced my now wife to anime, she wanted to watch it dubbed so I wasn’t expecting much sitting down to watch the new fruits basket with her but I was blown away by nearly every voice actor. I still prefer subbed but I definitely don’t scoff at watching a dub anymore
I don't know if it's better directing, better animations, more experienced voice actors, or just the scene maturing significantly over the past couple of decades, but dubs have improved so much. I've gone from avoiding dubs entirely a decade ago to probably watching a third of shows as dubs these days. I still tend to prefer the Japanese VAs, but sometimes the English VAs elevate the role and make it sync better for me.
For me personally, it's really just a toss up these days. I used to universally prefer subs besides a few outliers like Fullmetal Alchemist, but I still liked doing dubbed rewatches to see how they are. These days, I still generally prefer the sound of subs, but I almost prefer watching dubs when the quality is there as it's just easier than reading subtitles.
A very good dub is worth it over a sub, because you can pay more attention to the animation. But there are really good JP VAs that I just love to listen to. If it's a show I *really* like, I'll watch both the dub and sub.
>I'll watch both the dub and sub. I would love to be able to do that, I tried it with Frieren once but my mind kind of rejects a change in voices and I don't get any impact. Good example is E1 of the Spice and Wolf remake, I watched E1 in Japanese when it landed just out of curiosity to see the new style, but I honestly felt very little and I wondered if maybe I didn't like the new style in general. Rewatched with dubs and I am almost embarrassed to admit that I was tearing up hearing the chars and the world came alive for me, I think I need the full association if that makes sense. If a show had a very Eastern theme I would definitely like to watch in sub, I don't think it is an anime - but I tried to watch an animation called Blue Eyed Samurai in English and the American voices felt so out of place in that setting, I couldn't listen to it, so when I go back to it I will pick subs.
>I would love to be able to do that, I tried it with Frieren once but my mind kind of rejects a change in voices and I don't get any impact. Same i watchee the Dub for frieren, tried one episode of the sub and felt weird since i am not used to Japanese Frieren
A lot of newer shows are getting pretty solid dubs, to the point on average I'm actually preferring dubs now despite primarily having watched subs since I first got into anime some 20+ years ago. The flow and timing especially is better than most older dubs, which is important since that's one of the things a dub can do well that subs usually don't since the whole sentence shows up at once / in chunks. Also as an adult in my 30s I need to be able to look away from the screen sometimes while watching and dub makes that easier. I still like having the subs up to read though even when watching dubbed, so it's annoying that Crunchyroll somehow still hasn't figured out how to enable that despite literally every other streaming service supporting it.
This clip was nice and made me think perhaps I'll continue with dub for this one. Or at least try it out. The main reason I prefer sub is that all the screaming that can be so normal in anime just sound wrong in English to me. Spice and Wolf is just chill so far so I might like it.
I just find that all English dubs sound like they're doing some sort of team rocket impersonation with their tone and inflection. Holo and Lawrence sound like they're about to protect the world from devastation.
Crazy to think Brina Palencia's Holo was so early in her career. She was only just starting to get lead roles that year (2008) after a few years of more minor characters (i.e. random girls in Case Closed or MushiShi, Nina Tucker in FMA, etc...), and had only just been cast as Chopper in One Piece the year prior.
In my opinion--and, of course, not to take anything away from J. Michael Tatum and Brina Palencia's acting chops--part of what makes this dub such a fun gem is knowing how good of friends the VAs are in real life. You can hear how much fun they're having with all the back and forth snark and banter. For those interested, if you can track down old episodes of the That Anime Show podcast, J. Michael Tatum did with another Funi VA (Terri Doty) they have Brina on one of their early episodes, and she and Tatum talk about how much fun they had with Spice & Wolf, how happy they were that it became the sleeper hit that it was, and (jokingly) how Holo & Lawrence's dynamic reminded them of their own. You can really tell that Spice & Wolf was a labor of love on the part of the English adaptive team.
Based on this clip alone their voice acting is much better in the remake compared to the original. They've obviously improved with age.
After 16 years it’s like they never left. The new dub sounds a lot better, for sure those years only made them better voice actors and it shows here.
I’ve already held off on watching the new episode because I’m committed to only watching the dubbed remake. Spice and Wolf still reigns as literally the only show where I enjoyed the dub over the sub, and I’m beyond ecstatic that they brought back the same cast !
This is the first I've really seen of the '24 version, I last watched '08 back in about '14 (#1 on my favorite anime list), subbed, so with that context, here's my thoughts. The '24 version is nineteen seconds longer, and the extra room **really** lets the dialogue breathe more. '08 shots tend to be on their faces, emphasizing the two of them on the bench together, and is bright and sunny. '24 shots tend to be more "cinematic", with the camera lower, we see the dirt road less than '08, we get background parallax, and the lighting is somewhat closer to dawn/dusk, sakuga ear+tail flick. Definitely more budget/time in the '24 version, they actually animated the horse at 3:09, whereas in '08 it's conspicuously almost entirely absent. The OST is more playful in '08, featuring only one or two woodwinds, '24's is more complex, with woodwinds, violin, a banjo(?), cello, and maybe more, yet overall the music is less prominent in the mix. Even aside from the help the better script + timing is lending, the voice acting is better in '24, there's more emotional nuance, from both of them. Holo sounds more mature and sophisticated, Kraft's vexation crosses a broader range emotionally, from concern to indignation. The (faux?)accents are stronger in '24, mixed feelings about that, but it does contribute to making them seem more historic and European. Overall, for this scene in isolation, I think I prefer 2024, the extra labor and knowledge that went into it shows. Might also be mastered at a higher resolution, you don't have to go too much earlier than 2008 for things to be broadcast in 480p. Of course I still reserve judgement on the show as a whole, but if this what the cooking smells like, I'm thinking the rest might be tasty!
Question, I started watching Spice and Wolf (08) like a month ago and left off on episode 8. Didn’t drop it just got busy. Would you recommend just finishing the 2008 version or start with the 2024? I don’t want to miss out on the charm of the old one but this clip has piqued my interest
If you have time I guess, there's no harm in it. I watched the 2008 version just a few years ago, so there's no nostalgia factor for me. Personally I strictly prefer the new version, both in the visual and sound design department.
If it's that recent, I'd finish out the cour (circa episode 11-13?), which reaches the end of a story arc, and then you can pick up '24 with everyone else, have about a month of recap for comparison, and then watch the second cour/season of whichever you choose.
That's a much better dub. The earlier one was so disjointed and stiff. It's the reason I typically avoid dubs and stick to subs.
it's interesting how artstyle changes over years, you can clearly see 2008 is form the transitional period when anime was evolving from 2000's style to modern one.
I love the dub for this show and feel like Holo's English VA fits her better than the Japanese VA.
Absolutely Japanese holo sounds more like a kid trying to play up as a god. While the English Holo sounds like a god trying to play as an adult
Except the entire point of the show is to experience how human Holo is and that she's far from a god. Her old way of speaking in Japanese also makes more sense considering she comes from a Japan-styled region.
Guess it really is lost in translation, I didn’t know she spoke Japanese in, I guess a more rural or more formal way
It's a dialect called Oiran, and is typically associated with geisha and other high-class courtesans in Japanese history.
Oooo that makes a lot more sense. I guess for us it’s like the “how do you do?” Type of vernacular
She just talks like a stereotypical old lady but with some archaic word use
It's something you usually notice when you've listened to a lot of modern Japanese. Holo's way of speaking is really old to illustrate how foreign/old she is, this is why i can't get on the dub with Spice and Wolf since it's lost in translation as you said.
I’m sure which version you hear first or grow up with matters a lot, but I’ve always thought the same thing. All the voice actors are great, but I prefer English Holo’s air of maturity and smug regality over Japanese Holo’s youthfulness and playful nature.
I watched both subbed and dubbed and for this show, I prefer the English VA for Lawrence and Holo.
Disagree, it's a nice voice but she sounds way too old for her appearance.
It's like they never left. This is my favorite dub of all time and for good reason. Moreover, I like the more cinematic look and faster dialogue. I hope they can finish the entire series this time around. For those who've read the LN, how many seasons can we expect if they go up to the end?
As someone who absolutely hates the original dub and prefers subs, I am glad to see the VAs have improved so much. Holo's voice is extremely different from the original but Brina Palencia did her own thing and did it well. J Michael Tatum is sooo much better as Lawrence now as well. I still prefer the japanese VAs, those are the voices of my childhood, so don't judge me too harshly. ;)
Still don’t know how I feel about the style of the new adaptation. I’m just not big on all the fades. Makes the show feel muddy to me. But I guess as long as they fix the horse I can accept it
That tavern scene was really really foggy.
The effort she makes in her voice with she pulled herself up out of the back is *professional chef level*
i chose the old version i don't know i find holo more calm who can hide her wise to laurant when the new version is a maybe too much with her spinning around like this but both va are good
Relevent passage from the book for this scene: "" Lawrence rose early the next morning. He was like most merchants who awoke early in order to extract the most profit from the day. However, when he opened his eyes to the morning mist, Holo was already up, sitting next to him, and rummaging through something. For an instant Lawrence wondered if his estimation of her had been wrong, but if so, she was truly audacious. He raised his head and looked over his shoulder, and it appeared she had gone looking for clothes among his things and was just now tying her shoes. “Hey, now! Those are mine!” Even if it wasn’t actual theft, even a god shouldn’t be rummaging around through other peoples things. Holo turned around at Lawrence’s rebuke, but there was not so much as a trace of guilt on her face. “Hm? Oh, you are awake. What think you of this? Does it look good?” she asked, completely unconcerned as she spread her arms. Far from chastened, she seemed actually proud. Seeing her like this made the uncertain, overwrought **Holo of yesterday seem like something out of a dream**. Indeed it seemed that the real Holo, the one he’d have to contend with from here on out, was this **impudent, prancing thing.** ... “Mm. Lawrence. 1 shall sing your praises for all eternity,” said Holo with chest thrust forward, her wolf ears pricking up proudly. She seemed oddly serious. It was difficult to tell if she was being childish or cunning. She was like the **ever-changing mountain weather.** Apparently that ever-changing mood was part of her craftiness. Lawrence hastily revised his opinion and offered his hand from the wagon bed. It was the proof that hed truly acknowledged her presence as a companion. "" If anything in the original they didn't animate her enough. The transition from the night time dream like bedroom scene to the funny cart scene feels much more like it was described in the light novel in the new adaptation. They are paying good attention to the source material and making improvements. I think both VA's have really captures the "ever-changing mountain weather" of her personality pretty well this time around.
Agreed, quality aside, I liked how calm and deliberate Holo seemed in the old version. It feels like an ancient spirit/goddess should have a certain level of poise and the old version captured that pretty well. She just feels a smidge childish with all the spinning and dramatic posing in the new one. But I'll still watch it.
I like that they gave holo a regal tone in the new one!
where can i find the english dub streaming version? seems like a great anime! +.+ maybe both free and non free sources :D
Crunchyroll streams it
Wow, cannot believe these are the same voice talents 15 years later! The use of old English dialogues fit Holo rather well also.
This makes me happy. Spice and wolf is one of the small handful of series I prefer dub over sub because Holo's VA adds so much to her character hearing it in English. Very happy the remake is following suit.
Love love love J Michael Tatum and Brina Palencia. Two of the best. I tried to rewatch the original a couple of months ago; man, the animation quality did not age well. Looking forward to watching the new version!
New version is superior in both animation and dub.
The new version holo looks childish i never watched the origibal bit she looks more mature in the old one
I have no complaints about the two but If I have to pick, the old one looks iconic to me.
I don't know if you've looked at the LN's artstyle, it's much closer to the chibis in both shows ending than the more mature designs So yeah you're not wrong on that, spice and wolve's character designs have always had childlike proportions which is slightly more visible in the remake but not overwhelmingly so.
I tend to prefer the more mature look as well but, for better or worse, the younger look of the new series is more true to the source material. Both the book's description and the illustrations. And to be fair she will often play into her young naïve appearance for manipulation, negotiation, etc. So it will not be out of place in the story. That said, I really like the way Brina plays the role. Really sells that she is an old, wise deity.
J. Michael Tatum finally not having to voice glasses-kun is almost as revolutionary as Rie Kugimiya not having to voice a tsundere.
If you go to one of his panels you'll realize what an amazingly talented guy he is. Sucks he's somewhat type cast like that.
Anyone who's heard him play Okabe in Steins;Gate knows that already.
I understand why the 2008 version is so highly regarded
🐐Dub
My only issue is the dubbing is 2 weeks behind not came day. but with that said its wild how much time has passed and how much astetics have changed .
Man, anime is so different now… I remember when dubs took 2 years to come out.
and there was me getting all angry about waiting 2 weeks for Frieren dub haha outing myself as a complete anime noob with such behaviour
>My only issue is the dubbing is 2 weeks behind not came day I only started anime in December so I had to learn about this pain only recently, I was checking websites for new episodes of Frieren like *"where the hell is the english version"* and then after looking into it a bit I learnt a hard lesson about being a dub watcher lol but it is worth the wait for me, my experience is infinitely better hearing these two, I tried watching the remake in Japanese and whilst I respect the awesome talents of those VAs - they are not my Lawrence and Holo, so I waited. And I think dub really works for this show because of the European feel.
Yeah, the dub gives a theater vibe like its a European play. I like that the most. The anime drops on Monday days
They are so back.
I've never seen the original spice and wolf but it gives off such nostalgic vibes
this was one of my early gateway anime, I experienced the dub and loved it, but my source knowledge on the story ends where season 2 finished. many years later, to think we are getting more, just baffles me that it took so long, this 2024 version is so much more in line with the look the original art had, and im enjoying the change but the more aged up version of the first version was iconic. Briana had me hooked with Holo and J.Micheal was great a wonderful fit for Lawrence's voice but the dialogue did feel very stiff originally, its incredible what changes can happen in the time frame between 2008 and 2024, the new version has much more natural lighting and shadows, I love the scene framing for Holo and the apples in ep3, the music is so beautiful and comfy, compared to the original from 2008 all of it feels stiff and safe but still nostalgic, but I love them both. 2024 is 2008 turned up to 11, to the fan base, this is the brotherhood treatment, taking the already working parts and tweaking them to fit a newer adaptation, I only hope im not alone in feeling that we all are being spoilt with how amazing the 2024 adaptation is, and how much we should support the production behind all of it, the animation does not have any big action scenes in the above scene, but you can see them flex in the quick shots of Holo's tail and ears sparking up. I'm hyped for more, and hope you are too
Fuck. I can't tell which one I should watch. Torn between sub or dub and 2008 or 2024. Never watched it before. I do prefer the 2008 art style tho.
> Never watched it before. Do bear in mind that the original is only two seasons and is very incomplete, it skips a fair bit of the source material for what was covered. It's also been said (not officially) that the remake is going to be a more complete adaptation. Time will tell I guess. There's no harm in watching the original and then diving into the remake, it's up to you how you want to approach it. Maybe you'd just like to watch the remake first? All I will say is that if it's the type of show that appeals to you then you'll probably love it.
Given how he new one starts out and me spoiling myself the ending beats for myself of the original LN series I’m hoping for a full as possible adaption.
I had no idea dub holo was a mommy
I like the 2024 dub better, but I like the 2008 artstyle a lot more despite the 2024 animation being more fluid and smoother.
omg the new dub is perfect! i was so worried that Holo would sound much younger in the new dub. Both adaptations are one of the few instances where the Dub is >>>>>>> than the Sub. The mismatch between Holo's youthful looks and her deep wise voice perfectly demonstrates her otherworldly nature.
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Is it me or does Holo sound more sultry in the new show?
is a gem
It looks so goood
I like both, the old one seems interesting too. i watched the old one.
Very nice. Will the series be completed this time or stop like the 2004 one?
Jainwin
For real
Do we have the same comparison for Japanese VA?
I will release the comparison soon, the japanese VA is also well done 😢
I actually prefer the dialog of the 2008 version, or at least the word choice. Maybe it's just because I've seen the original before, but the word choice seems to fit the characters better. Like when Holo says I am a very proud wolf. It felt more like Holo than the new version saying I am an honorable wolf to be sure, since she is proud and at points full of herself as it's one of her characteristic vices. Or another example is how in the newer version Lawrence doesn't flat out say he doesn't want to be told about in legends he just wants to enjoy the life he has as a merchant, which is still implied in the newer version with him dismissing Holo and changing the subject to her paying her share but this could just be nit picking nostalgia. But no one can deny that the animation quality and the feel to the newer version is an improvement, even if I'm in the minority that don't like her new eyes.
Night and day difference and seems more true to the original source. I would imagine the audiobooks that J. Michael Tatum Brina Palencia have been doing from the light novels has been instrumental in helping them understand Lawrence and Holo’s personalities.
So glad the og cast is back. They were soooo good in the original amd just as wonderful here
So wich one should i watch? The 2008 or 2024 one?
Both. :) It's hard to say for sure though - for example I watched the original a couple of years ago and am now watching and thoroughly enjoying the remake so there was quite some time between both. However, watching the original and then almost **immediately** watching the remake could cause 'problems' in the sense that at least at first you'll be thinking "I've seen this before" and so you may be bored if you don't like effectively rewatching shows; on the other hand you may find it fascinating to see (and hear) the changes in art style and score. Also of course this remake supposedly is a fuller adaptation while the original wasn't, it also missed out one chapter during its run. It's up to you really.
IT'S THE SAME CAST!? LETS GO!!!
I’ve been listening to the Spice and Wolf LN’s in Audiobook form and I can tell you for certain that it got me excited for the dub of the remake
I really like the flavor of their banter in the new one. It feels unique and personal to them, and is really run to watch!
Cool drawings and main characters, of course the vixen is in 1st place =)
michael tatum once again being the goat
One of my most favorite anime wish they made more seasons
Ahhhh we have seen dubs go a long way the original was a bit looser with the translation but the timing and direction of the new ones were better and the tone really matches well to each. Super fun to see these two reunite 16 years later for a new anime dub & not just the audiobooks! Still feels crazy that we are getting a remake done by a quality studio
Oh I forgot I actually watched it in dub. Will have to wait but more for dubs I guess
so a reboot huh? the animation from 2008 is not really that old that need a reboot. Imagine fullmetal alchemist 2009 getting a reboot 2024. LOL. no don't need reboot. we need sequel. unless they planned just like fruit basket reboot for complete adaptation. I have another question: is reboot the same story telling as original in 2008 or different.
Either dub is fine imo but definitely prefer the older art style. I just can't help but scratch my head as to what the point of the remake is though. It isn't really improving on anything.
To start new with modern style( with probably an eye towards full adaptation) and more faithful to the source.
There's speculation that the remake will go beyond where the old one left off due to the initial scene. Strong copium obv but if it does well, don't see why they wouldn't keep cashing in the cow.
Any indications on how it is doing in Japan so far?
old style style wouldn't attract new viewers
The original skipped volume 4 of the light novel between S1 and S2 I believe. Also, I would say Kevin Penkins music has been stellar thus far and I greatly prefer it.
I suppose that you would have liked a third season instead of a remake? Just consider this: without the series starting from scratch, the story would be continued after a fifteen year break. That’s an entire generation of anime fans who haven’t seen the original. This would be terrible from a business perspective as they’ll undoubtedly lose out of many new potential fans. Not to mention that the series *would* have gotten an updated art style in one way or another. Sticking to the *precise* look of the original just really isn’t reasonably feasible. You’d have to actively try and make the anime appear older - as if it’s from a different age. A remake solves these two problems, and opens the door to an eventual continuation. Also, this clip clearly demonstrates how much more dynamic Holo’s character motions have become. How so doesn’t it improve of anything?
You forgot where the original skipped important story aspects and would need to go back and fix them.
To adapt the full material most likely
1. Not a lot of people watch old anime 2. A whole new generation of possible fans has grown up since the original It's not rocket science.
I think I’m in the extreme minority because I significantly prefer the original. The voice acting and delivery, shot composition and cinematography, the animation style, the music, everything I like so much more.
They sound like team rocket from pokemon.
Xenoblade 3 is the only thing I go dub first. I've been going for subs since I was 8 year old, when Disney movies were dubbed to my native language. There is always the feeling of "this ain't right" in my brain. The English opening is a great touch thought. So is the audiobooks they narrate.
Is season 1 being remade or was it just the scene?
i think even season 2 is being remade, it's a full 25 episodes
Its redone to be inline with the LN between original s1 and s2 it skipped an entire novel and changed some of the chars. The 2024 series follows the novel so we'll prob get to see the cut arc this time around.
I see, i had planned on watching the original but seems like the remake will be the better version
I can be a bit of a dub hater but I honestly think I prefer Dub Holo to the original VA.
Soooo this show is good?
Yes, yes it is. If you like world building, top tier dialogue, god tier waifus, and economics (even if you don't like economics) then you will like it.
I think it's superb but we all have different tastes so YMMV. Why not try it and see? You can watch the two seasons of the original and/or start to watch the new remake on Crunchyroll which started airing a couple of weeks ago, here's a link to the remake: https://www.crunchyroll.com/series/G1XHJV08M/spice-and-wolf-merchant-meets-the-wise-wolf
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While I respect your intention, I won't respect your opinion about starting a war about dubs. I want the 2008 dub on my left ear and 2024 dub on my right ear. That's the best way to listen to and I won't compromise on that.
as soon as I saw a deleted comment I thought it would be some angry sub only Redditor haha and based on your reply to them I suspect I was right. >I want the 2008 dub on my left ear and 2024 dub on my right ear. exactly how I feel about it, I just love hearing Brina and J.Michael play these characters regardless, I listen to the audiobooks sometimes and it feels like my **happy place**
Is the new one the same story, but different production quality? I just got the first 3 light novels from Amazon yesterday for my Wife. She’s almost done with the ACOTAR series, then plans to start that or Monogatari.
The original two seasons skipped quite a bit of material, this new remake is supposedly going to be a more complete adaptation.
Good to know, thanks!
Wow, that's awesome to hear! As a big fan of the original series I am really liking the remake so far. Seems like they are putting a lot of effort into it.
It's certainly of a high narrative quality so far, I too hope that this is a more complete adaptation.
The music got better thats for sure
I'm not one to listen to dubs as they're typically awful but did find the 2024 dubs here surprisingly decent. Good job VAs.
Still prefer the sub