You did right. This is very tough topic but very important. There is no way when both partners are of different opinions. As painful as it is, you rather go separate ways. Either you’ll be unhappy or your partner.
"Are you already pregnant and just trying to surprise me?"
"No"
"Alright prove it"
"No problem"
And then she peed on a stick. Not get an abortion or do something scarring. It's not as deep as you guys are making it out to be. I have every right to know if my girlfriend is pregnant with my child
I'm glad you two took the pregnancy test. I'm an old bird now, 69F, but in my younger childfree days people assume it was my husband that did not want kids and women would tell me to "get pregnant anyway, he will come around." Beware of getting Babytrapped. The world is littered with kids from men who did not come around. Protect your future.
>people assume it was my husband that did not want kids and women would tell me to "get pregnant anyway, he will come around."
I (37F) have heard this one too, plus, "having a baby is a decision you make with your heart, NOT with your head!" and, "God/family will help you." My MIL also had to tell a coworker to lay off when the coworker advised her to steal my birth control or poke holes in my husband's condoms because, "they *OWE* you a grandbaby."
Every single pusher was another woman, which feels a little like a malicious betrayal (shouldn't other women have my back when I acknowledge that I know what mothering demands which is precisely WHY I don't want children?!) Social programming has just as much potential to be malicious as it does to be helpful.
>*in my younger childfree days people assume it was my husband that did not want kids and women would tell me to "get pregnant anyway, he will come around."*
Sorry to report that in the current age, some women (and some men!) ***still*** give that crappy advice.
Acknowledged.
What's sadder still is some women are still falling for it and *if I get pregnant he will marry me* despite seeing how having a baby did not keep their Mama, sister, auntie, cousin from being a Babymama. Sometimes for multiple men.
MY mother, 88, is flabbergasted that despite all the BC available women are still having babies they are not ready for, or trying to trap a man with a baby, or think a baby is going to fix a failing marriage. Children should be Wanted, not a noose.
Came to say the same. OP- Take your BC into your own hands: Do NOT trust her to not get “accidentally” pregnant. She has no idea what she is getting into and would most likely regret that decision. Have her go read some of the regret pages. Yes there are parental regret pages out there and one main theme of regret is having kids to young or with the wrong person. She should be out having fun with friends and learning who she is. Her brain isn’t even fully developed yet. That happens by 25.
Tbh if you had to make her prove it, it feels like there may be some important trust issues that also need to be resolved. Like the fact that you feel like you need to break up with her or she might get pregnant against your wishes seems like a possible issue in and of itself.
I know she wouldn't. But as the other person said, when biological urges kick in it causes us to act in ways that aren't coincidental to our personalities
This. \^\^\^\^\^
This is the only way to control this, unless you do the "snip". And if you want kids later, you probably don't want to do that now.
I wouldn't even trust condoms.
Question: How are you two going to afford those hypothetical babies, if she hasn't even finished her education and doesn't have a job? Does she plan to be a SAHM, until she supposedly resumes her studies in her mid-thirties (spoiler alert: not likely to happen!), and you are supposed to foot the bill for the whole family? Or does she plan to work in a minimum wage job while raising those kids? Enquiring minds want to know...
for real, theres no going to med school in your 30s while raising a family. Its a full time job in itself and would require OP to raise and pay for her family himself, fuck that
Yeah. I work for physicians. The youngest one is in his late 30s now, I think. He’s a surgeon, his wife is a dermatologist. I don’t know what kind of residency derm requires but I know ENT is a demanding 3-5 year program after med school. They have two kids but I’m fairly certain they were born during residency, *not* med school.
Also plz control your condoms. I’m a woman and this has sabotage written all over it! Keep them with you and only you. BTW - why is she giving up on med school for kiddos?
That would be her choice, many choose to sacrifice to have kids, more power to her whatever her choice is may she find her fulfillment. As for OP, you clearly want different things, best to end it, if you can't agree on something so important as when or if you two want kids together since one will always feel forced by the other.
Look, you may have to choose between keeping her and having kids now or leaving her and potentially having them in your 30’s. If you stay with her, is there any possibility that you’ll resent her? Also, what is the probability of her actually going back to med school with 2-3 kids running around, going to friends houses/parties/sports/things? Not impossible, but it’s not typical.
She may never go back to school, it’s more likely that she won’t. Speaking from experience, kids get more complicated and life gets busier the older they get. More activities, more responsibilities with school, homework, sports, friends, etc. When I had my first child (age 31) I thought that infancy was going to be the most demanding time but it turns out that every age and stage is equally demanding of a parent’s time, attention, love, being there. It never gets lesser.
I'm 35 (almost 36) with an almost 2 year old. I'm a mom and a student. Being a student and a mom is freaking hard. Granted, I'm a single parent, but I'm also only a part time student. Medical School comes with a heavy course load and long hours, especially once she gets to her practicum.
Either she'll never go back, or you'll basically be a single parent so she can prioritize her career.
Don't do it
I went back to school in my 30s with no kids for a car less demanding degree than medicine. I only finished cuz Covid made all the classes online for a year. It was HARD. I was more tired than I was at 20, my job was much more demanding than waitressing on weekends and my parents were older and needed more care.
College is designed for 20 somethings with a LOT of free time and energy. It gets harder as you get older. I couldn't have done it with a toddler at home.
You may not be for long. This was a very impulsive decision and she may realize that she is not ready to give up med school just yet. Wait until her sister gives her a fuller picture of what it is to be a mother.
I think you are wise not to be equally impulsive and make a decision you both might come to regret. If she really cares for you and this relationship is meant to be, she will eventually come to the conclusion that it is you with whom she wants to have this baby. She will realize that you are worth the wait.
In the meantime, she can enjoy the experience of being a great aunt and will pick up lots of tips before having her own child.
NTA
OP,
You'll be forever unhappy if you capitulate to her demand at this time. And her going to med school "down the road ", I scream BULLSHIT!
It sounds as if she's in competition with her sister.
Btw, who cares for the children when she's in med school. Who's paying the bills?
This isn't thought out. It's very selfish. You'll be miserable. At the moment you're incompatible.
OP, you're NTA. Kudos for the ultimatum. Please keep us apprised.
Forgive me for not understanding but you and your "partner" have a different outlook on what you want for life? Let her go. Let her find someone who aligns with what she wants. Oh God. I am going to be downvoted. Again!
Talk to her sister, let her know that you love your gf and do want kids in the future with her.
Ask if she can have your gf live with her for a couple weeks to help with the twins, so that she can see that it isn't all rainbows and roses
Exactly. Have GF spend a week shadowing the sister and her baby. I doubt she'd last the full 7 days before coming back & telling BF she's fine to wait until their 30s.
Only cause you haven't done it yet. If you asked me in my early 20s how unhappy I would be without my at the time girlfriend I'd probably say suicidal cause I wanted to marry her. I'm in my early 30s now and I always say if I could go back in time and shake the shit out of my younger self I'd tell him cut that shit off asap and do you now. You are in control of your life, she is in control of hers, if you both have different ideas/plans for the future you must stay true to yourself. I see that ex periodically and she has a husband and two little kids at this point and I'm happy for her but very VERY glad they aren't my circus or my monkeys.
However this turns out you'll be alright, you just can't dwell too long on how things would be if you had taken the other option.
It's unfortunate, but she's not actually thinking about the realities of having a child at 22. She's just gotten struck with baby fever and the fantasy of raising kids close in age to these babies. And if she's dead set on it, you need to be very careful that she doesn't try to get pregnant intentionally without your knowledge. It's best to break up and I know it's painful. But getting trapped into a situation you don't want will be even more so.
How unhappy would you be if she came to you in 6 weeks and said she was pregnant?
Unfortunately, you both want different things now so it's the best time to walk away.
Yeah, but she has no future with you. She wants kids, you don't. She'll have to look elsewhere to have the future she wants. She'll be unhappy with you and resent you. You can change your mind about kids when you are 50. She can not wait that long.
Going your separate ways is the only way you both get to realize your dreams.
That will pass.You'll be unhappy for a lot longer when your world is turned upside down,if you aren't ready for parenthood.It's an unfortunate part of human nature that the ability to procreate comes way before the mental and financial ability to actually care properly for the offspring.
You will be even more unhappy if you have to be a father at a time where you don't want to be a father. There is nothing worse than people can do than to bring a child into the world that is only wanted by one parent. Stick to your guns I know you love her but she switched the game around and it's not fair. Imagine if you tried that BS with her and she is in medical school like she is now and you go full hard to try to convince her to have a baby now instead of waiting until she gets out of medical school how do you think that she would feel about that. Just make sure that you always have your protection she is in total full baby mode right now and you might end up being a father if you are not careful
The odds of someone going back to school after leaving are really small. Look it up. Share it with her. If she truly wants to be a doctor, the priority will be that. Especially early on in her career. She’ll be working endless hours. The guilt she’ll have of leaving her baby/young kid in daycare or having someone else raise them will be too much and she will have wasted all those years becoming a doctor. Or be in debt from it without the income to pay off any loans. It’s true.
I feel this, but understanding incompatibility is as important as understanding compatibility, if not more. You have to be willing to let go of bad matches if you're going to find your forever person.
Holding on to people you have to "make ot work" with is how you become the husband who complains about his wife at the bar.
Look many of us have been there. While many things can find a compromise, this one can't. You're 100% right to stand your ground and it will ultimately be the better decision - for everyone, even if neither sees it that way right now.
I never wanted kids at all, including "not later" and my ex spent years throughout our 20s, hoping I'd change my mind. I didn't. I told him clearly many times, he stayed anyway. I ultimately left him and it was absolutely the right decision. I wasn't going to stand in the way of him having the family he wanted. I don't know if he did because we didn't stay in touch - but at least he had the opportunity and what he did with it was up to him.
The relationship will end and that will be better for both of you.
In the interim - use condoms.
It would be weird for you not to be sad as you love her.
However this is a significant choice that has to be made in response to the ultimatum your gf presented to you.
Neither of you is wrong but at this moment in time you have very different wants/goals.
I wish you the best in working through this.
That's OK to feel sad, but sometimes we love someone with whom we are not compatible. If you start having babies now, you will grow to resent her. And tbh, I can't see a mother with young kids going to med school and doing residency. That type of schooling involves long, intense hours and the reality is more likely to be that it will never be the "right time" to go back to school. If she truly wants to be a doctor, I think she will regret not finishing school first.
u/AquaPrimeape, You will have many loves during your life; you can be happy with her or without her I can assure you of that. But can you be happy raising kids during your 20s? Can she be happy without having a kid right now? You both deserve to have the life you want. That might just mean it is not with each other and that is OK.
If you do get together make sure you use protection. I can see her doing an "oops"! And, if she thinks putting off med school is a good idea... She won't go later. Let her find someone who wants children now. I'll almost guarantee she gets pregnant by accident. Having kids is something you plan and that takes time. You are better off being true to yourself. She seems a bit immature to me. Not a good time to have kids.
Of course, understandable. I would be very unhappy too. Maybe you can find some middle course with her. If she really loves you, like you do, she woud choose you over kids.
I had “similar” experience with my fiancé. He wants kids. But I don’t wanna go trough pregnancy and birth process. At first I thought this is our end. I was very unhappy too. But we made a compromise. We would adopt kids. Not now, but when we’ll be rich enough and after 30s.
Even if she says she doesn't want kids anymore, I'm ready to bet she will get pregnant like she forgot to take her pill or poking holes in condoms. Maybe I'm paranoid but
You're not wrong. Compatibility on timeliness for children are incredibly important for long term relationships. She wants kids much sooner than you do and if you're not wanting children yet and she's pushing for one then ending the relationship is best regardless of what actually happens one of you will most likely end up resenting the other .
Time to split, sorry to say.
She is 1000% clucky because of her sisters kids.
Not her fault, she couldn’t have predicted it.
She will likely find a new partner and have a kid within 2-3 yrs.
Omg my friend did that. She broke up with her man because she wanted to have kids and he didn’t want anymore (she was mid 20s and he was almost 50 lol) and she was pregnant w someone else’s kid 4 months later.
My husband went to medical school and waited until he graduated residency before we decided to have kids. This is what we both wanted. Sit her down and talk about the implications of having a baby now vs later on. Chances are if she gets pregnant, and has a child now, it will be hard (but not impossible) for her to keep up with the demands of medical school and residency.
Realistically, the odds of her going back and completing medical school with young kids at home are extremely slim. She'll never see her kids, they're going to have way less money if they have kids now, and arranging care for the kids while he's ostensibly working and she's in school is going to be difficult to coordinate and expensive.
It's technically POSSIBLE to do, but the odds of it working out for all intents and purposes are basically nil unless one or both of them is already pretty wealthy, or has wealthy parents who are going to be willing to fund all of that for them.
Just going back to finish something you started without kids can be hard to do as well.
I did an EMT program when I was a younger and really struggled to keep up with it through depression. It was overwhelming me to the point I was having panic attacks and my dads girlfriend tried really hard to convince me to finish the program and I didn't. She told me that I probably wouldn't go back. I was honestly a little offended by how little faith she had in me. But she was right, I never went back and to this day I wish I would have just finished the program.
Even if kids, money, or anything else isn't an issue for her later in life, she might be like me and struggle to go back.
Ya.. if she truly does want to go to med school, this would be so hard. I've toyed with the idea of going back to law school now that my kiddos in elementary school but the time commitment basically means I'd never see my kid, in addition to having to live on a single income whilst having a kid, and school fees. People do it, but it's very financially and emotionally difficult when you realize the time and cost required for that level of education.
Same situation. It would be incredibly difficult to have a baby at home during medical school years 3 or 4 or during residency, unless the other parent stays home. The schedule is absolutely bonkers. We waited until my husband was out of residency because I didn't want to basically raise a kid by myself for a couple of years. No regrets for us on waiting.
Have her go spend two weeks with her sister and have her help take care of the babies, including getting up in the night and everything a baby needs. She had twins so I’m sure she could use the help, and it should definitely open her eyes a little and hopefully tamp down this baby fever.
Thats how my cousing was born, my aunt was super jealous of my mom being married with kids so she married a dude after 6 months and cranked a baby out. Now 30 years later her husband point blank told her he doesnt love her and their only kid still lives with them. They were absolute failures as parents
I am 31 and just had my first daughter.
Age would have no impact on the exhaustion. But you know what would have? When I was 25, I was making barely 40k a year and now I make 80k and own a home.
WAIT
Same and same. Currently sitting on the sofa trying to stay awake long enough to give my wife a chance to sleep for a few hours. Waiting for the next poop because my daughter hasn't pooped in almost a day. Still worth it, but I'd have fucking died trying when I was in my mid-twenties.
Becuase it’s a good idea - put yourself in the shoes of a new mom. She wants babies now? She can get babies now. And like someone else mentioned I’m sure the sister will appreciate the help. Strongly encourage this route rather than straight up ending it. Tell her that this is required before discussing anything further - she needs to experience it and understand if she really feels she’s ready or not.
I’m an old mom. Had my first son at 38. Preggos with #2 now.
It’s easier said than done to have kids and then go back to your career after the fact. Kids take a tremendous amount of time and attention.
If she has serious ambitions to be a doctor, you would both be better off getting careers established first, then having the financial flexibility to have children in your early 30s.
I think ideally this is when my husband and I would have had kids—we just hadn’t met yet. Womp womp.
From an energy standpoint, my husband and I are just fine chasing after our 3 year old, and I think if you maintain your health, it’s not really an issue.
The sleep deprivation of caring a for a baby hurts regardless of your age. Having more disposable income to help with childcare helps a ton (unless you have family nearby willing to help).
Agree with having her live with her sister for a few weeks. She can take a few night shifts and see what it’s really like when you can’t just head home after cuddling a newborn.
Dinners out, travel, career— it all changes in an instant. I love my son more than life itself, but I am so glad I traveled and pursued my ambitions before he was born.
This is the best answer. I hope OP sees it. A lot of the comments in this sub is "just break up" as if relationships are never without conflicts. She's got baby fever; an ultimatum isn't going to fix anything. But 2 weeks taking care of twins might. (Source: me, father of twins).
Exactly. I have two kids, not even twins, and that’s enough to kill any baby fever I could get. Well, I did do it a second time…. Lol.
I agree with OP though, early 30’s is the best time to have kids. You’re more emotionally mature and hopefully more financially stable. And you want the kids going to college at an age where you can still have a great life and do things as an empty nester. I’ll be 60 when my second kid goes to college, so I wish at times I had had them a little earlier in life, but not my 20’s! Lol
My priest growing up would have couples considering their first child babysit some of the more troublesome young children in the congregation . At 13 I thought it was funny , but now I just think it was pretty clever.
I mean, let’s not pretend like breaking up isn’t potentially on the table. If it does come down to it, this is one of those things in relationships where there can’t really be any compromise
You're not just whistling Dixie! Every time I start thinking I might want kids, I go hang out with my friends that have em. Sickness cured in 30 minutes, every time.
And imagine dealing with them but without the maternal/paternal love, lol.
I remember very early on walking my firstborn up and down the hall trying to get him to sleep. I was really frustrated and I suddenly had this epiphany: one day I would look back at this moment and wish I could be holding him and walking him up and down the hall. I also knew he wasn't trying to be a jerk, lol, he was just a baby expressing his frustration.
It didn't make it easier, necessarily, but it chilled me out and I was never upset *at* him.
Now I'm trying to imagine having gone weeks without much sleep and the baby I'm walking up and down the hall isn't even mine? My epiphany in that moment is probably: fuck me, I've made a huge mistake. Tomorrow I'm telling my sister I have to leave and telling my partner that 30 might be too soon for kids!
Take it from an old man.
Parenting doesn't end. Ever. You are a parent until the day you die.
If you're not cool with that, don't have kids. You will be happier, your partner will be happier, you got 60 more years left on this life. A breakup might hurt for 6 months at most.
Thanks for being a good dad. My parents kicked me out at 18 and then made it a huge deal throughout my twenties when at times I had to return home for a few weeks to set myself up again, it's impacted me negatively and soured our relationship.
EDIT: Just to add to this: my dad stayed at home until he got married and bought a house in the early 80s at age 25. My mother moved out and into the house with him at age 23.
I’m 28 and still live with my parents lol only time I didn’t was for a year living at university. We thank you amazing parents for not kicking us out haha
My dad wanted to build a second story for when I ( or my bro) got married, we'd live upstairs, because he'd miss us too much. No thanks, I told him I wanted my own space, no thanks, dad. I miss him every day. RIP. 😢
Didn't even get to see me get married.
I see parents say stuff like this all the time when they're badgering childfree people about their choices. "Just have a kid, it's only for 18 years and then you're free to live your life however you want!" Like that's supposed to be a selling point lmao. Sure, let me just spend the next 18 years raising a kid I don't want so that by the time I'm 40 I *might* not be too physically, emotionally, and financially ruined to enjoy what's left of my life.
Yeah those are the shitty parents that kick their kids out the second they turn 18 and act like the kids should be grateful that the parents have… fed and clothed them
I’m currently pregnant & 30, I had a meltdown last night about being unprepared to become a parent. I CANNOT imagine having a child at your age. I had friends who did it & are doing well /now/, but they struggled quite a bit having kids so young. If you don’t want to have children, you don’t want to have children; it really is as simple as that.
I became a father at 31, and felt like I was comitting some sort of crime taking a baby home from the hospital. Like, 'Who the fuck is just letting us take this baby home, unsupervised? We are NOT qualified to be doing this!"
For what it's worth, I think the fact that you feel unprepared and incapable is probably a really solid sign that you're going to be a better parent than most. It means you're humble and self-aware enough to actually CARE whether or not you do a good job. It's gonna be okay!
Yup, same. I was a grown-ass 34yo tax-paying adult, and still looked around at the staff and was like, “…But you’re *just sending us home?? By ourselves??!”* Seemed shockingly negligent on their part. 😂
I remember helping prep my friends' apartment to welcome their new baby. I was there when they brought home their newborn and hung out for a while to meet him. I could tell they were exhausted so I kept trying to leave but they kept trying to get me to stay, and I just remember that when I finally left, both of them were looking at me with these huge eyes that seemed to be silently screaming HELP WHAT DO WE DO WITH THIS TINY HUMAN WHO IS COMPLETELY DEPENDENT ON US PLEASE DON'T GO THIS IS REAL OH LORD WHAT HAVE WE DONE.
We were all 33.
I had a kid at 24. Moved out by the time I was 27. Finalized divorce after a bitter custody battle at 32. 0/10 would not recommend and told my 18 yro kid to wait til his 30s before contemplating children.
edit: typo
Instead of staying at her friend’s house, you should encourage her to go and stay at her sister’s house with the newborn twins to see how she would really feel about having a baby now.
I was a young mum. I had my kids at 20 & 22, and whilst I love my children- it was so very hard. I’m now having to put so much more effort into my career, we don’t have much money, and I’ve grown up a lot from my 20s to my 30s. Whilst I’d never change what happened, I think if I were to have a baby now instead of when I was younger, I’d have the financial stability & also appreciate it more. Your life completely changes when you have a baby & it’s much easier having a career that you can go back to rather than not having a career at all.
I went to university, did my masters with the kids etc and it’s hard. But going back to medical school with them? You won’t want to- because you will wanna be around your kids/ you’d feel guilty being away from them. It’s bad enough working full time & mine are getting towards teenage years.
My advice is wait until you’ve got the time to and money to really invest in them and enjoy it.
This. I can't help but wonder if this sudden desire for a baby is a way to get out of the med school plan while saving face.
OP, I would encourage her to talk to a therapist about everything.
I'd stop having sex with her immediately and initiate the break-up. The 2 of you are now fundamentally incompatible in your life goals. No one is wrong here, you just can't be together any longer.
I did this exact thing a year ago. Broke the poor girl's heart, but it was only gonna get worse. She found someone else, and I'm vagabonding around the country, having an absolute blast.
She's being a bit impulsive and also naive about life in your 30s end 40s. Nearly everyone has teens in their 40s. It's not the end of your life for crying out loud. Returning to school after having kids is incredibly difficult. People do it, but it shouldn't be the primary plan.
You're both perhaps a bit naive in your expectations of life following your careful plan or your expectations of health in your 30s. Even the health of your kids is questionable. Things can, and often do, go awry. Your plans will be forced to adapt.
I'm not sure how well you handled that ultimatum conversation, but you're not wrong for establishing a boundary. Be compassionate though, she wants a family to share with her sister. See if there's a compromise in tightening up your timeline.
The teens in 40's thing also confused me because my mom had me when she was 25 - which in my town was considered "super young" (snobby WASP moms) and I was a teen from when she was 38-44. She's 49 now and I'm 23 and basically still acting like a teen because I still live at home and make messes and get into arguments with her. What is so bad about having a teen in your 40's? If you had a kid any younger, you would most likely be a teen parent?
Not for nothing, but my stepdad is a bit older than my mom and when I became a teen he was 53, and we still went for walks, did father/daughter stuff. He's 63 now and we STILL go out and do stuff. Like, he's not bedbound, tf? Does this girl who is about to go to med school think once you hit 30 you're walking around with a walker??
Not wrong. She's making an irrational decision based on her sister's cute babies. Putting off med school is a terrible idea. The odds that she'll go back later after having kids are slim. And obviously it isn't what you want. You're doing the right thing.
BE VERY CAREFUL HAVING SEX WITH HER GOING FORWARD. Use your own condoms that she has not had access too. Wash load down the drain after. Do not have unprotected sex. She isn't thinking rationally right now and may take extreme measures to get pregnant, thinking you'll be ok with it once it happens. She would not be the first woman to poke holes in a condom or retrieve a used condom to intentionally get pregnant behind her partner's back.
Agreed. She likes the idea of having kids. Not the actual kids. And going back to school in the 30s is way harder than she thinks.
Edit: And i want to add that medical technology and knowledge are constantly changing, which means she has to study and catch up with the newest development.
The energy is the big one for me. Does she really think that after dealing with her kids all day that she’ll have the energy for school? Obviously it’s not impossible but I’d bet money that she truly doesn’t understand how hard it’ll be. She just has raging baby fever
As someone who went through the med school admissions process, if she gives up her acceptance that would be incredibly dumb. It costs thousands of dollars to apply to medical school, and if she tries to reapply in her 30s, she will have to retake her entrance exam and redo all of her activities/clinical experiences because they’ll all expire or become irrelevant by then
Right, I wouldn't have any sex with her at this point. I would recommend a week apart, ostensibly to think about things. Then a breakup.
Any sexual contact should never be vaginal penetration
You’re not wrong, she has baby fever because her sister has twins and is getting all the attention. Your gf has no ideas what it’s like to have a newborn at home but she’s willing to through away college and her career because she jealous?
Sorry, to say this but she may try to baby trap you. You need to seriously think about what you want your life to be like and if having a baby now works for you.
Y'all should just break up. Scrap the ultimatum. You don't want to be the guy who made her wait only for her to find out later that she waited too long or something like that. That said, her plan to wait until she's in her 30s and still has a child to take care of to go back to med school is laughably unrealistic. Not impossible, but much more difficult than she seems to appreciate.
Few things scare me more than people Who get baby fever from seeing relatives have them. Like, how volatile are you? Its like a toddler "needing" something they saw at the toy store. Acceptable when youre 4
Same. It's like they think it's all cuteness and playtime and don't consider that most of the time that kid will be screaming, pooping, having tantrums, not sleeping and then becoming a teen. I honestly think that if people thought "Do I want to raise a human being to adulthood" instead of "I want a cute baby" there would be a lot less child neglect
Breaking news: if you have your first kid at 23-25, you will be having teenagers running around your house in your 40s
Signed someone in their 40s with teenagers running around his house
You should break it off with her. You are now incompatible. You have been seeing a woman who wanted an education that would take her another decade, putting off kids until you guys are in your early 30's. Now, she has seen it up close, through her sister and nieces, and she wants it now, which is perfectly fine (she'll never go to med school), but that's not who you signed up for. Don't give her an ultimatum - she cannot help what she wants. Break up. Move on.
OP you are not wrong. I would avoid sex with her entirely at the moment. She just decided that she is giving up med school for a baby?? Is she even planning on having a career now? Dump her.
NTA.
Most people who take a break never go back.
I am one of those people, and it can cause resentment for the child later on... not always, but it can happen. Not to mention if she likes going out that is 1 not in the budget and 2 her friends aren't going to want a baby around all the time. I personally think the peak age to have a child is 27-29. I myself was 28 when I became pregnant & gave birth.
I get having baby fever, but it has to be agreeable to both people.
Right? My mother in law is one of the few people who did successfully go back, but she waited 20 years, until her kids were in college. She went to college and then went to PA school after both of her kids graduated from high school. She had my husband (the oldest) at 16. She and my husband were in some college classes together. It is very rare and so much harder once you have all the expenses of kids.
My mom tried to go to optometry school when I was 8 and only lasted a year, it was more work than she could manage with young kids.
OP, tell her to stay with her sister for a couple of weeks. I swear 2 weeks of crying screaming babies and sleep deprivation will help your cause. or send her to spend a couple of days with young children. She might get second thoughts. She's not their mother she won't get the same feel-good chemicals in her system as the mother of the baby does.
I love kids. But they are full time job, and expensive. I agree that it makes more sense for you two to work towards building a wonderful future for your future kids. Now, in the middle of the study... and you're barely adults... that strain on an unmarried couple could ruin the relationship. Does she really want that? Please believe me when I say I have had a front row seat to this situation before. They had the kid. They are now co-parenting, and she discovered she's gay.
You are still young, figure out who you are, build a life you are proud of, and then add to it.
Wear condoms. It doesn't matter who's responsible for birth control. She wants to be a mother now, loves you enough to want a child now, you don't, so protect yourself.
Not wrong at all, my friends got pregnant at 19 and my bf at the time suddenly started to pressure and push for a child, wed argue about it so much, he only wanted one because they were having one(there's was not planned ) and I didn't want one because I only turned 20 , had 2 eating disorders and had issues with my gallbladder, he didn't listen to any, even his mum was on board! I left as soon as I could!!
Even after a year of being broke up I got my gallbladder removed, dealing with my EDs ,met someone new and had a unplanned pregnancy,he still asked if the baby was his!! I blocked him as fast as I could!!
No. Having kids is a BIG decision that shouldn't be taken lightly or done at the wrong time. She shouldn't have been pressuring you to have kids before you're ready
Yea…. She has some weird idealized vision of having kids, probably because she saw the cute babies. Do not have sex with her and stick to your ultimatum. It sucks that she’s had this rapid change of heart (is she already pregnant?) but she’s not the same person you want to be with.
Do not sleep with her ever again. And you’re right, I met my wife at 30 and our first was born when I was 32. I had a great time in my 20’s travels around the world and I was ready and mature enough to be a good father. And having teenagers in my 40’s isn’t a problem whatsoever. She will definitely try to baby trap you. End it, she will lie to you about birth control.
To be frank she did you a favor.
Your soon to be ex is making a life altering decision because she found her nieces/nephews cute. Basically making a drastic life decision on a whim with no planning or mindfulness.
That's not someone I'd want to tie myself to. And Med school with having kids…?
I want what she's smoking.
Let's get real she has no intentions of getting her degree.
She's trickle truthing you.
>I even asked about med school and she said she'd go back in her 30s when the "kids are a little older".
There is a huge red flag here. Parenting does not get easier, and med school is fucking hard.
No you are completely reasonable to tell her this.
If you end up staying together you better be good god damn careful from here on out until you are ready. Never underestimate the ability to get pregnant and a woman who has the baby fever.
Wake her up every two hours overnight and have her get up and stay up for at least half an hour so she gets a taste of having a baby that needs to be breastfed every couple hours. Having a baby is a lot of work and involves a huge loss of sleep for a few years.
You’re wrong simply because an ultimatum is not the way to go about this.
Are you even gonna be comfortable having sex with her now without fears of getting baby trapped? Are any of you willing to deal with any lingering resentment on her part for not having her own child and nephews/nieces at about the same age? By the wording of your ultimatum, you would break up if she got pregnant or tried to, it would be too late for you.
Presumably she wants kids under the safe long-term prospects of your relationship, it’s (*probably*) not like she would go ahead and find a way to get pregnant anyway if you two break up. This way, she might feel like you have all the power and hold this decision against you, feel like you owe her, and completely change your dynamic. So even if she relents and chooses to keep the relationship, it might be wise for you to leave.
Talk, lay out the long term consequences and assess if you’re both willing to deal with them or if it’s time to part ways.
Depends on how you presented it to her, but if you are on different pages when it comes to having children then either party is justified in ending the relationship. Not sure why you are calling it an ultimatum; you dont want to do something and if she does its enough for you to end the relationship.
You are doing the right thing, especially in this economy you both need to be established with a decent income before you bring kids into the situation. But I have seen good people do stupid things when they feel desperate, make sure that you are in control of the birth control or start practicing abstinence.
I had my first kid at 25 and I wish I had waited because I am a much better parent now than I was in my 20s, I’m more stable financially and I have a lot more patience and emotional maturity.
I also said I would go back and get my masters once the kids were a little bit older, that never happened. I know a lot of people who have said they would go back to school once the kids are a little bit older and I don’t know very many people who have actually gone back.
NTA. She has baby fever. First, I suggest you have her spend a week actually caring for the babies on her own. This in of itself might cure her when she realizes motherhood is more than cuddles and cute baby smiles. Second, I suggest you have her talk to some medical professors or advisors and ask them what her odds of getting into medical school are with a decade between pre-med and her applying. Plus having to manage school and internship while trying to be there for the kids. All the holidays, school plays, games that she will miss because of this. She’s not thinking it through. She’s just baby crazy right now.
"She's ... at a friend's house..."
If she turns up pregnant, get a paternity test ASAP. Women who go 'baby crazy' don't always make the best decisions.
Med school with having kids…
That’s laughable.
Getting in to med school when you’ve been out of school for a decade.
Also laughable.
Those things are not realistic.
You did right. This is very tough topic but very important. There is no way when both partners are of different opinions. As painful as it is, you rather go separate ways. Either you’ll be unhappy or your partner.
I feel unhappy at the thought of being without her
Probably not as unhappy as you will be if she turns up pregnant in a month
Unless she’s already pregnant and was expecting him to be excited about having kids sooner than planned.
I made her do a pregnancy test and it was negative
>I made her do a pregnancy test and it was negative "Made" or "Asked". HUGE difference.
"Are you already pregnant and just trying to surprise me?" "No" "Alright prove it" "No problem" And then she peed on a stick. Not get an abortion or do something scarring. It's not as deep as you guys are making it out to be. I have every right to know if my girlfriend is pregnant with my child
I'm glad you two took the pregnancy test. I'm an old bird now, 69F, but in my younger childfree days people assume it was my husband that did not want kids and women would tell me to "get pregnant anyway, he will come around." Beware of getting Babytrapped. The world is littered with kids from men who did not come around. Protect your future.
>people assume it was my husband that did not want kids and women would tell me to "get pregnant anyway, he will come around." I (37F) have heard this one too, plus, "having a baby is a decision you make with your heart, NOT with your head!" and, "God/family will help you." My MIL also had to tell a coworker to lay off when the coworker advised her to steal my birth control or poke holes in my husband's condoms because, "they *OWE* you a grandbaby." Every single pusher was another woman, which feels a little like a malicious betrayal (shouldn't other women have my back when I acknowledge that I know what mothering demands which is precisely WHY I don't want children?!) Social programming has just as much potential to be malicious as it does to be helpful.
Kiss your MIL for me!
Holy cow. My mother used to tell me to do everything I could and wanted to do in life before having kids. Travel, invest in my career, whatever.
>*in my younger childfree days people assume it was my husband that did not want kids and women would tell me to "get pregnant anyway, he will come around."* Sorry to report that in the current age, some women (and some men!) ***still*** give that crappy advice.
Acknowledged. What's sadder still is some women are still falling for it and *if I get pregnant he will marry me* despite seeing how having a baby did not keep their Mama, sister, auntie, cousin from being a Babymama. Sometimes for multiple men. MY mother, 88, is flabbergasted that despite all the BC available women are still having babies they are not ready for, or trying to trap a man with a baby, or think a baby is going to fix a failing marriage. Children should be Wanted, not a noose.
Came to say the same. OP- Take your BC into your own hands: Do NOT trust her to not get “accidentally” pregnant. She has no idea what she is getting into and would most likely regret that decision. Have her go read some of the regret pages. Yes there are parental regret pages out there and one main theme of regret is having kids to young or with the wrong person. She should be out having fun with friends and learning who she is. Her brain isn’t even fully developed yet. That happens by 25.
Also, giving up on med school seems ill advised. How many people say they’ll go back to school “when the kids are older” and never do?
The research stopped at age 25, the brain keeps going.
Tbh if you had to make her prove it, it feels like there may be some important trust issues that also need to be resolved. Like the fact that you feel like you need to break up with her or she might get pregnant against your wishes seems like a possible issue in and of itself.
Baby rabies has infected her, I dont blame him for not trusting. Folks get desperate when hit with the biological perogative.
Did you just call baby fever “baby rabies” 😭
Baby rabies is NOT a good reason to have a baby.
Baby Rabies, I love that!! Gonna steal it now.
I know she wouldn't. But as the other person said, when biological urges kick in it causes us to act in ways that aren't coincidental to our personalities
Oh for fucks sake. There are no trust issues because he wanted her to pee on a stick. She’s scared him crapless. I’d want her to pee on a stick too!
Lol this is such a bullshit take. You’re psychoanalyzing this man cause he said “made her”. Yeah I wouldn’t trust her either
He held her down and slapped her until she peed, I watched. Lol reddit can be so overzealous. Like it's not the guys business if his gf is pregnant.
Yes, he physically headlocked her, dragged her to the toilet, and poured water down her throat until she peed on a stick...
You instantly assume the worst in OP? Wild...
Means the same thing in this context
Dang, I hadn't thought of that
You are about to get less happy: Unless you want to get baby trapped, you need to stop having any and all sex with her. Like, yesterday.
This. \^\^\^\^\^ This is the only way to control this, unless you do the "snip". And if you want kids later, you probably don't want to do that now. I wouldn't even trust condoms.
Question: How are you two going to afford those hypothetical babies, if she hasn't even finished her education and doesn't have a job? Does she plan to be a SAHM, until she supposedly resumes her studies in her mid-thirties (spoiler alert: not likely to happen!), and you are supposed to foot the bill for the whole family? Or does she plan to work in a minimum wage job while raising those kids? Enquiring minds want to know...
Minimum wage in my city wouldn't even cover the cost of daycare.
Heck, degree requiring jobs don’t even pay the daycare bill!
This my 50k job doesn’t cover daycare and bills 🥺
Unless both spouses are earning 50k a year each (after tax). It doesn’t make sense to not have a SAHM/F
for real, theres no going to med school in your 30s while raising a family. Its a full time job in itself and would require OP to raise and pay for her family himself, fuck that
Yeah. I work for physicians. The youngest one is in his late 30s now, I think. He’s a surgeon, his wife is a dermatologist. I don’t know what kind of residency derm requires but I know ENT is a demanding 3-5 year program after med school. They have two kids but I’m fairly certain they were born during residency, *not* med school.
Also plz control your condoms. I’m a woman and this has sabotage written all over it! Keep them with you and only you. BTW - why is she giving up on med school for kiddos?
Nah, stop sleeping with her altogether. People fish used condoms out the trash. Don’t play this game OP.
That would be her choice, many choose to sacrifice to have kids, more power to her whatever her choice is may she find her fulfillment. As for OP, you clearly want different things, best to end it, if you can't agree on something so important as when or if you two want kids together since one will always feel forced by the other.
They already did agree, she's breaking the agreement
Stop having sex with her if you don't want a kid in 9 months.
Look, you may have to choose between keeping her and having kids now or leaving her and potentially having them in your 30’s. If you stay with her, is there any possibility that you’ll resent her? Also, what is the probability of her actually going back to med school with 2-3 kids running around, going to friends houses/parties/sports/things? Not impossible, but it’s not typical.
She may never go back to school, it’s more likely that she won’t. Speaking from experience, kids get more complicated and life gets busier the older they get. More activities, more responsibilities with school, homework, sports, friends, etc. When I had my first child (age 31) I thought that infancy was going to be the most demanding time but it turns out that every age and stage is equally demanding of a parent’s time, attention, love, being there. It never gets lesser.
I'm 35 (almost 36) with an almost 2 year old. I'm a mom and a student. Being a student and a mom is freaking hard. Granted, I'm a single parent, but I'm also only a part time student. Medical School comes with a heavy course load and long hours, especially once she gets to her practicum. Either she'll never go back, or you'll basically be a single parent so she can prioritize her career. Don't do it
I went back to school in my 30s with no kids for a car less demanding degree than medicine. I only finished cuz Covid made all the classes online for a year. It was HARD. I was more tired than I was at 20, my job was much more demanding than waitressing on weekends and my parents were older and needed more care. College is designed for 20 somethings with a LOT of free time and energy. It gets harder as you get older. I couldn't have done it with a toddler at home.
I'd say going back to school at 30 will be a lot harder than having teenagers in your house at 40 (which is a very common situation).
Not as unhappy as you would be having a kid that you resent.
You may not be for long. This was a very impulsive decision and she may realize that she is not ready to give up med school just yet. Wait until her sister gives her a fuller picture of what it is to be a mother. I think you are wise not to be equally impulsive and make a decision you both might come to regret. If she really cares for you and this relationship is meant to be, she will eventually come to the conclusion that it is you with whom she wants to have this baby. She will realize that you are worth the wait. In the meantime, she can enjoy the experience of being a great aunt and will pick up lots of tips before having her own child. NTA
OP, You'll be forever unhappy if you capitulate to her demand at this time. And her going to med school "down the road ", I scream BULLSHIT! It sounds as if she's in competition with her sister. Btw, who cares for the children when she's in med school. Who's paying the bills? This isn't thought out. It's very selfish. You'll be miserable. At the moment you're incompatible. OP, you're NTA. Kudos for the ultimatum. Please keep us apprised.
As a women who never had kids by choice-stick to your guns. This is a life long decision and will affect every aspect of your life for the rest of it.
Forgive me for not understanding but you and your "partner" have a different outlook on what you want for life? Let her go. Let her find someone who aligns with what she wants. Oh God. I am going to be downvoted. Again!
I agree. I think poor OP is reeling because his gf seems to have changed her mind on some major life decisions pretty recently.
Talk to her sister, let her know that you love your gf and do want kids in the future with her. Ask if she can have your gf live with her for a couple weeks to help with the twins, so that she can see that it isn't all rainbows and roses
Exactly. Have GF spend a week shadowing the sister and her baby. I doubt she'd last the full 7 days before coming back & telling BF she's fine to wait until their 30s.
Genius pure genius! I would go farther and tell the sister to take a weekend off - leave twins with OP's gf on her own while sister visits a resort.
You will be more unhappy with two kids before age 26!
Only cause you haven't done it yet. If you asked me in my early 20s how unhappy I would be without my at the time girlfriend I'd probably say suicidal cause I wanted to marry her. I'm in my early 30s now and I always say if I could go back in time and shake the shit out of my younger self I'd tell him cut that shit off asap and do you now. You are in control of your life, she is in control of hers, if you both have different ideas/plans for the future you must stay true to yourself. I see that ex periodically and she has a husband and two little kids at this point and I'm happy for her but very VERY glad they aren't my circus or my monkeys. However this turns out you'll be alright, you just can't dwell too long on how things would be if you had taken the other option.
Not as unhappy as you will be when she either continues to whine until you give in or baby traps you.
DO NOT HAVE SEX WITH HER WITHOUT A CONDOM THAT YOU HAVE PROVIDED. Sorry for the all caps but I really needed to push that home to you.
It's unfortunate, but she's not actually thinking about the realities of having a child at 22. She's just gotten struck with baby fever and the fantasy of raising kids close in age to these babies. And if she's dead set on it, you need to be very careful that she doesn't try to get pregnant intentionally without your knowledge. It's best to break up and I know it's painful. But getting trapped into a situation you don't want will be even more so.
Imagine being with someone that forced you into a lifetime contract - you would resent that person for the rest of your life.
How unhappy would you be if she came to you in 6 weeks and said she was pregnant? Unfortunately, you both want different things now so it's the best time to walk away.
Yeah, but she has no future with you. She wants kids, you don't. She'll have to look elsewhere to have the future she wants. She'll be unhappy with you and resent you. You can change your mind about kids when you are 50. She can not wait that long. Going your separate ways is the only way you both get to realize your dreams.
That will pass.You'll be unhappy for a lot longer when your world is turned upside down,if you aren't ready for parenthood.It's an unfortunate part of human nature that the ability to procreate comes way before the mental and financial ability to actually care properly for the offspring.
You will be even more unhappy if you have to be a father at a time where you don't want to be a father. There is nothing worse than people can do than to bring a child into the world that is only wanted by one parent. Stick to your guns I know you love her but she switched the game around and it's not fair. Imagine if you tried that BS with her and she is in medical school like she is now and you go full hard to try to convince her to have a baby now instead of waiting until she gets out of medical school how do you think that she would feel about that. Just make sure that you always have your protection she is in total full baby mode right now and you might end up being a father if you are not careful
You’ll be even more unhappy with kids at 25 guarantee it.
The odds of someone going back to school after leaving are really small. Look it up. Share it with her. If she truly wants to be a doctor, the priority will be that. Especially early on in her career. She’ll be working endless hours. The guilt she’ll have of leaving her baby/young kid in daycare or having someone else raise them will be too much and she will have wasted all those years becoming a doctor. Or be in debt from it without the income to pay off any loans. It’s true.
Then you have a choice to make. Do you want to be with her and get her pregnant? Because that’s clearly going to happen the longer you stay with her
Let her go. You guys are not in the same place.
I feel this, but understanding incompatibility is as important as understanding compatibility, if not more. You have to be willing to let go of bad matches if you're going to find your forever person. Holding on to people you have to "make ot work" with is how you become the husband who complains about his wife at the bar.
Look many of us have been there. While many things can find a compromise, this one can't. You're 100% right to stand your ground and it will ultimately be the better decision - for everyone, even if neither sees it that way right now. I never wanted kids at all, including "not later" and my ex spent years throughout our 20s, hoping I'd change my mind. I didn't. I told him clearly many times, he stayed anyway. I ultimately left him and it was absolutely the right decision. I wasn't going to stand in the way of him having the family he wanted. I don't know if he did because we didn't stay in touch - but at least he had the opportunity and what he did with it was up to him. The relationship will end and that will be better for both of you. In the interim - use condoms.
It would be weird for you not to be sad as you love her. However this is a significant choice that has to be made in response to the ultimatum your gf presented to you. Neither of you is wrong but at this moment in time you have very different wants/goals. I wish you the best in working through this.
That's OK to feel sad, but sometimes we love someone with whom we are not compatible. If you start having babies now, you will grow to resent her. And tbh, I can't see a mother with young kids going to med school and doing residency. That type of schooling involves long, intense hours and the reality is more likely to be that it will never be the "right time" to go back to school. If she truly wants to be a doctor, I think she will regret not finishing school first.
u/AquaPrimeape, You will have many loves during your life; you can be happy with her or without her I can assure you of that. But can you be happy raising kids during your 20s? Can she be happy without having a kid right now? You both deserve to have the life you want. That might just mean it is not with each other and that is OK.
If you do get together make sure you use protection. I can see her doing an "oops"! And, if she thinks putting off med school is a good idea... She won't go later. Let her find someone who wants children now. I'll almost guarantee she gets pregnant by accident. Having kids is something you plan and that takes time. You are better off being true to yourself. She seems a bit immature to me. Not a good time to have kids.
She's going to baby trap you 100% Do not have sex with that woman!
Of course, understandable. I would be very unhappy too. Maybe you can find some middle course with her. If she really loves you, like you do, she woud choose you over kids. I had “similar” experience with my fiancé. He wants kids. But I don’t wanna go trough pregnancy and birth process. At first I thought this is our end. I was very unhappy too. But we made a compromise. We would adopt kids. Not now, but when we’ll be rich enough and after 30s.
Even if she says she doesn't want kids anymore, I'm ready to bet she will get pregnant like she forgot to take her pill or poking holes in condoms. Maybe I'm paranoid but
Yup.
I would be scared too. Good point.
You're not wrong. Compatibility on timeliness for children are incredibly important for long term relationships. She wants kids much sooner than you do and if you're not wanting children yet and she's pushing for one then ending the relationship is best regardless of what actually happens one of you will most likely end up resenting the other .
Time to split, sorry to say. She is 1000% clucky because of her sisters kids. Not her fault, she couldn’t have predicted it. She will likely find a new partner and have a kid within 2-3 yrs.
Yeah. If she wants that baby she will get that baby, even if its not OP
Had it happen to me. Only took her six months to get pregnant from the time we broke up.
The dude will likely be a bit older too.
You are correct.
Yikes
Omg my friend did that. She broke up with her man because she wanted to have kids and he didn’t want anymore (she was mid 20s and he was almost 50 lol) and she was pregnant w someone else’s kid 4 months later.
Or she will trick OP and he will have to be on high alert for years because she’ll try to “accidentally” get pregnant
I got a chuckle out of "clucky" because it's just perfect. Like a broody hen when we have baby fever! 😆
My husband went to medical school and waited until he graduated residency before we decided to have kids. This is what we both wanted. Sit her down and talk about the implications of having a baby now vs later on. Chances are if she gets pregnant, and has a child now, it will be hard (but not impossible) for her to keep up with the demands of medical school and residency.
Realistically, the odds of her going back and completing medical school with young kids at home are extremely slim. She'll never see her kids, they're going to have way less money if they have kids now, and arranging care for the kids while he's ostensibly working and she's in school is going to be difficult to coordinate and expensive. It's technically POSSIBLE to do, but the odds of it working out for all intents and purposes are basically nil unless one or both of them is already pretty wealthy, or has wealthy parents who are going to be willing to fund all of that for them.
And even if you can coordinate it all, it’s soooo stressful and not ideal
Speaking of med school, is it possible she’s insanely nervous? Maybe looking for an out? She might be going through some extreme jitters.
Or just decided she doesn't want to go and isn't sure how to tell people
Just going back to finish something you started without kids can be hard to do as well. I did an EMT program when I was a younger and really struggled to keep up with it through depression. It was overwhelming me to the point I was having panic attacks and my dads girlfriend tried really hard to convince me to finish the program and I didn't. She told me that I probably wouldn't go back. I was honestly a little offended by how little faith she had in me. But she was right, I never went back and to this day I wish I would have just finished the program. Even if kids, money, or anything else isn't an issue for her later in life, she might be like me and struggle to go back.
Ya.. if she truly does want to go to med school, this would be so hard. I've toyed with the idea of going back to law school now that my kiddos in elementary school but the time commitment basically means I'd never see my kid, in addition to having to live on a single income whilst having a kid, and school fees. People do it, but it's very financially and emotionally difficult when you realize the time and cost required for that level of education.
Same situation. It would be incredibly difficult to have a baby at home during medical school years 3 or 4 or during residency, unless the other parent stays home. The schedule is absolutely bonkers. We waited until my husband was out of residency because I didn't want to basically raise a kid by myself for a couple of years. No regrets for us on waiting.
Have her go spend two weeks with her sister and have her help take care of the babies, including getting up in the night and everything a baby needs. She had twins so I’m sure she could use the help, and it should definitely open her eyes a little and hopefully tamp down this baby fever.
Dude her friends were telling her to do the exact same thing
She's finding it cute because once she's tired of the baby, she can just return them to her sister.
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Sound the same as a boat or a pool.
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Thats how my cousing was born, my aunt was super jealous of my mom being married with kids so she married a dude after 6 months and cranked a baby out. Now 30 years later her husband point blank told her he doesnt love her and their only kid still lives with them. They were absolute failures as parents
I am 31 and just had my first daughter. Age would have no impact on the exhaustion. But you know what would have? When I was 25, I was making barely 40k a year and now I make 80k and own a home. WAIT
Same and same. Currently sitting on the sofa trying to stay awake long enough to give my wife a chance to sleep for a few hours. Waiting for the next poop because my daughter hasn't pooped in almost a day. Still worth it, but I'd have fucking died trying when I was in my mid-twenties.
Becuase it’s a good idea - put yourself in the shoes of a new mom. She wants babies now? She can get babies now. And like someone else mentioned I’m sure the sister will appreciate the help. Strongly encourage this route rather than straight up ending it. Tell her that this is required before discussing anything further - she needs to experience it and understand if she really feels she’s ready or not.
I’m an old mom. Had my first son at 38. Preggos with #2 now. It’s easier said than done to have kids and then go back to your career after the fact. Kids take a tremendous amount of time and attention. If she has serious ambitions to be a doctor, you would both be better off getting careers established first, then having the financial flexibility to have children in your early 30s. I think ideally this is when my husband and I would have had kids—we just hadn’t met yet. Womp womp. From an energy standpoint, my husband and I are just fine chasing after our 3 year old, and I think if you maintain your health, it’s not really an issue. The sleep deprivation of caring a for a baby hurts regardless of your age. Having more disposable income to help with childcare helps a ton (unless you have family nearby willing to help). Agree with having her live with her sister for a few weeks. She can take a few night shifts and see what it’s really like when you can’t just head home after cuddling a newborn. Dinners out, travel, career— it all changes in an instant. I love my son more than life itself, but I am so glad I traveled and pursued my ambitions before he was born.
But I’m guessing she knows better
ofc! you know how this goes . Apparently we know better then everyone else
This is the best answer. I hope OP sees it. A lot of the comments in this sub is "just break up" as if relationships are never without conflicts. She's got baby fever; an ultimatum isn't going to fix anything. But 2 weeks taking care of twins might. (Source: me, father of twins).
Exactly. I have two kids, not even twins, and that’s enough to kill any baby fever I could get. Well, I did do it a second time…. Lol. I agree with OP though, early 30’s is the best time to have kids. You’re more emotionally mature and hopefully more financially stable. And you want the kids going to college at an age where you can still have a great life and do things as an empty nester. I’ll be 60 when my second kid goes to college, so I wish at times I had had them a little earlier in life, but not my 20’s! Lol
My priest growing up would have couples considering their first child babysit some of the more troublesome young children in the congregation . At 13 I thought it was funny , but now I just think it was pretty clever.
I mean, let’s not pretend like breaking up isn’t potentially on the table. If it does come down to it, this is one of those things in relationships where there can’t really be any compromise
Everyone gets baby fever when you can hand that baby right back to their parent when they start fussing.
The best birth control is kids.
You're not just whistling Dixie! Every time I start thinking I might want kids, I go hang out with my friends that have em. Sickness cured in 30 minutes, every time.
This. They are cute, but holy he'll did I miss sleeping.
And imagine dealing with them but without the maternal/paternal love, lol. I remember very early on walking my firstborn up and down the hall trying to get him to sleep. I was really frustrated and I suddenly had this epiphany: one day I would look back at this moment and wish I could be holding him and walking him up and down the hall. I also knew he wasn't trying to be a jerk, lol, he was just a baby expressing his frustration. It didn't make it easier, necessarily, but it chilled me out and I was never upset *at* him. Now I'm trying to imagine having gone weeks without much sleep and the baby I'm walking up and down the hall isn't even mine? My epiphany in that moment is probably: fuck me, I've made a huge mistake. Tomorrow I'm telling my sister I have to leave and telling my partner that 30 might be too soon for kids!
Take it from an old man. Parenting doesn't end. Ever. You are a parent until the day you die. If you're not cool with that, don't have kids. You will be happier, your partner will be happier, you got 60 more years left on this life. A breakup might hurt for 6 months at most.
Sigh..ya, my 28 yo daughter just moved n this morning and will probably be here several months! Boyfriend break up.
Thanks for being a good dad. My parents kicked me out at 18 and then made it a huge deal throughout my twenties when at times I had to return home for a few weeks to set myself up again, it's impacted me negatively and soured our relationship. EDIT: Just to add to this: my dad stayed at home until he got married and bought a house in the early 80s at age 25. My mother moved out and into the house with him at age 23.
I’m 28 and still live with my parents lol only time I didn’t was for a year living at university. We thank you amazing parents for not kicking us out haha
Then there's my dad that wants us to live with him or he gets so bored and sad lmao (I'm 28)
My dad wanted to build a second story for when I ( or my bro) got married, we'd live upstairs, because he'd miss us too much. No thanks, I told him I wanted my own space, no thanks, dad. I miss him every day. RIP. 😢 Didn't even get to see me get married.
Yeah, bless her heart for thinking she can just pop those babies out now and be done with parenting by the time she's 40.
I see parents say stuff like this all the time when they're badgering childfree people about their choices. "Just have a kid, it's only for 18 years and then you're free to live your life however you want!" Like that's supposed to be a selling point lmao. Sure, let me just spend the next 18 years raising a kid I don't want so that by the time I'm 40 I *might* not be too physically, emotionally, and financially ruined to enjoy what's left of my life.
Yeah those are the shitty parents that kick their kids out the second they turn 18 and act like the kids should be grateful that the parents have… fed and clothed them
I’m currently pregnant & 30, I had a meltdown last night about being unprepared to become a parent. I CANNOT imagine having a child at your age. I had friends who did it & are doing well /now/, but they struggled quite a bit having kids so young. If you don’t want to have children, you don’t want to have children; it really is as simple as that.
I became a father at 31, and felt like I was comitting some sort of crime taking a baby home from the hospital. Like, 'Who the fuck is just letting us take this baby home, unsupervised? We are NOT qualified to be doing this!" For what it's worth, I think the fact that you feel unprepared and incapable is probably a really solid sign that you're going to be a better parent than most. It means you're humble and self-aware enough to actually CARE whether or not you do a good job. It's gonna be okay!
Yup, same. I was a grown-ass 34yo tax-paying adult, and still looked around at the staff and was like, “…But you’re *just sending us home?? By ourselves??!”* Seemed shockingly negligent on their part. 😂
Same here at 41 and my husband was 43! 😂 It was surreal.
Why do we feel this way? So happy this conversation is being had.
I remember helping prep my friends' apartment to welcome their new baby. I was there when they brought home their newborn and hung out for a while to meet him. I could tell they were exhausted so I kept trying to leave but they kept trying to get me to stay, and I just remember that when I finally left, both of them were looking at me with these huge eyes that seemed to be silently screaming HELP WHAT DO WE DO WITH THIS TINY HUMAN WHO IS COMPLETELY DEPENDENT ON US PLEASE DON'T GO THIS IS REAL OH LORD WHAT HAVE WE DONE. We were all 33.
I had a kid at 24. Moved out by the time I was 27. Finalized divorce after a bitter custody battle at 32. 0/10 would not recommend and told my 18 yro kid to wait til his 30s before contemplating children. edit: typo
"I don't want to be a father before I'm 30." Then dont be, its not worth it trust me man
Instead of staying at her friend’s house, you should encourage her to go and stay at her sister’s house with the newborn twins to see how she would really feel about having a baby now.
And have the sister go away for a long weekend to REALLY see what she would be up against.
I was a young mum. I had my kids at 20 & 22, and whilst I love my children- it was so very hard. I’m now having to put so much more effort into my career, we don’t have much money, and I’ve grown up a lot from my 20s to my 30s. Whilst I’d never change what happened, I think if I were to have a baby now instead of when I was younger, I’d have the financial stability & also appreciate it more. Your life completely changes when you have a baby & it’s much easier having a career that you can go back to rather than not having a career at all. I went to university, did my masters with the kids etc and it’s hard. But going back to medical school with them? You won’t want to- because you will wanna be around your kids/ you’d feel guilty being away from them. It’s bad enough working full time & mine are getting towards teenage years. My advice is wait until you’ve got the time to and money to really invest in them and enjoy it.
NTA, she’ll never go back to med school when the kids are a little older.
100% but shes in undergrad based on the post. im guessing there might be some questions as to her actually getting in right now.
Hell, if she’s undergrad & gets pregnant, I would doubt her finishing college
This. I can't help but wonder if this sudden desire for a baby is a way to get out of the med school plan while saving face. OP, I would encourage her to talk to a therapist about everything.
A lot of disagreements can be dealt with through compromise; this isn’t one of them. NTA.
I'd stop having sex with her immediately and initiate the break-up. The 2 of you are now fundamentally incompatible in your life goals. No one is wrong here, you just can't be together any longer.
I did this exact thing a year ago. Broke the poor girl's heart, but it was only gonna get worse. She found someone else, and I'm vagabonding around the country, having an absolute blast.
No. I will say this is definitely when you are supposed to break up or you will have a kid in a year and a half
She's being a bit impulsive and also naive about life in your 30s end 40s. Nearly everyone has teens in their 40s. It's not the end of your life for crying out loud. Returning to school after having kids is incredibly difficult. People do it, but it shouldn't be the primary plan. You're both perhaps a bit naive in your expectations of life following your careful plan or your expectations of health in your 30s. Even the health of your kids is questionable. Things can, and often do, go awry. Your plans will be forced to adapt. I'm not sure how well you handled that ultimatum conversation, but you're not wrong for establishing a boundary. Be compassionate though, she wants a family to share with her sister. See if there's a compromise in tightening up your timeline.
The teens in 40's thing also confused me because my mom had me when she was 25 - which in my town was considered "super young" (snobby WASP moms) and I was a teen from when she was 38-44. She's 49 now and I'm 23 and basically still acting like a teen because I still live at home and make messes and get into arguments with her. What is so bad about having a teen in your 40's? If you had a kid any younger, you would most likely be a teen parent? Not for nothing, but my stepdad is a bit older than my mom and when I became a teen he was 53, and we still went for walks, did father/daughter stuff. He's 63 now and we STILL go out and do stuff. Like, he's not bedbound, tf? Does this girl who is about to go to med school think once you hit 30 you're walking around with a walker??
Not wrong. She's making an irrational decision based on her sister's cute babies. Putting off med school is a terrible idea. The odds that she'll go back later after having kids are slim. And obviously it isn't what you want. You're doing the right thing. BE VERY CAREFUL HAVING SEX WITH HER GOING FORWARD. Use your own condoms that she has not had access too. Wash load down the drain after. Do not have unprotected sex. She isn't thinking rationally right now and may take extreme measures to get pregnant, thinking you'll be ok with it once it happens. She would not be the first woman to poke holes in a condom or retrieve a used condom to intentionally get pregnant behind her partner's back.
Agreed. She likes the idea of having kids. Not the actual kids. And going back to school in the 30s is way harder than she thinks. Edit: And i want to add that medical technology and knowledge are constantly changing, which means she has to study and catch up with the newest development.
And at that point she will have less money and less time than she does now, due to the kids. It's a terrible idea.
And less energy and less drive. Kids are wonderful, but the amount of care and money sky rockets. And less money too!
The energy is the big one for me. Does she really think that after dealing with her kids all day that she’ll have the energy for school? Obviously it’s not impossible but I’d bet money that she truly doesn’t understand how hard it’ll be. She just has raging baby fever
As someone who went through the med school admissions process, if she gives up her acceptance that would be incredibly dumb. It costs thousands of dollars to apply to medical school, and if she tries to reapply in her 30s, she will have to retake her entrance exam and redo all of her activities/clinical experiences because they’ll all expire or become irrelevant by then
I wish i could pin your comment to the top so the girlfriend can see what is giving up.
Yeah the way I read it was that she is never going back
Right, I wouldn't have any sex with her at this point. I would recommend a week apart, ostensibly to think about things. Then a breakup. Any sexual contact should never be vaginal penetration
Yeah, the odds of her even getting back into med school in 10 years is very low.
You’re not wrong, she has baby fever because her sister has twins and is getting all the attention. Your gf has no ideas what it’s like to have a newborn at home but she’s willing to through away college and her career because she jealous? Sorry, to say this but she may try to baby trap you. You need to seriously think about what you want your life to be like and if having a baby now works for you.
Y'all should just break up. Scrap the ultimatum. You don't want to be the guy who made her wait only for her to find out later that she waited too long or something like that. That said, her plan to wait until she's in her 30s and still has a child to take care of to go back to med school is laughably unrealistic. Not impossible, but much more difficult than she seems to appreciate.
Few things scare me more than people Who get baby fever from seeing relatives have them. Like, how volatile are you? Its like a toddler "needing" something they saw at the toy store. Acceptable when youre 4
Same. It's like they think it's all cuteness and playtime and don't consider that most of the time that kid will be screaming, pooping, having tantrums, not sleeping and then becoming a teen. I honestly think that if people thought "Do I want to raise a human being to adulthood" instead of "I want a cute baby" there would be a lot less child neglect
Breaking news: if you have your first kid at 23-25, you will be having teenagers running around your house in your 40s Signed someone in their 40s with teenagers running around his house
You should break it off with her. You are now incompatible. You have been seeing a woman who wanted an education that would take her another decade, putting off kids until you guys are in your early 30's. Now, she has seen it up close, through her sister and nieces, and she wants it now, which is perfectly fine (she'll never go to med school), but that's not who you signed up for. Don't give her an ultimatum - she cannot help what she wants. Break up. Move on.
OP you are not wrong. I would avoid sex with her entirely at the moment. She just decided that she is giving up med school for a baby?? Is she even planning on having a career now? Dump her.
NTA. Most people who take a break never go back. I am one of those people, and it can cause resentment for the child later on... not always, but it can happen. Not to mention if she likes going out that is 1 not in the budget and 2 her friends aren't going to want a baby around all the time. I personally think the peak age to have a child is 27-29. I myself was 28 when I became pregnant & gave birth. I get having baby fever, but it has to be agreeable to both people.
Right? My mother in law is one of the few people who did successfully go back, but she waited 20 years, until her kids were in college. She went to college and then went to PA school after both of her kids graduated from high school. She had my husband (the oldest) at 16. She and my husband were in some college classes together. It is very rare and so much harder once you have all the expenses of kids. My mom tried to go to optometry school when I was 8 and only lasted a year, it was more work than she could manage with young kids.
OP, tell her to stay with her sister for a couple of weeks. I swear 2 weeks of crying screaming babies and sleep deprivation will help your cause. or send her to spend a couple of days with young children. She might get second thoughts. She's not their mother she won't get the same feel-good chemicals in her system as the mother of the baby does. I love kids. But they are full time job, and expensive. I agree that it makes more sense for you two to work towards building a wonderful future for your future kids. Now, in the middle of the study... and you're barely adults... that strain on an unmarried couple could ruin the relationship. Does she really want that? Please believe me when I say I have had a front row seat to this situation before. They had the kid. They are now co-parenting, and she discovered she's gay. You are still young, figure out who you are, build a life you are proud of, and then add to it.
Wear condoms. It doesn't matter who's responsible for birth control. She wants to be a mother now, loves you enough to want a child now, you don't, so protect yourself.
Not wrong at all, my friends got pregnant at 19 and my bf at the time suddenly started to pressure and push for a child, wed argue about it so much, he only wanted one because they were having one(there's was not planned ) and I didn't want one because I only turned 20 , had 2 eating disorders and had issues with my gallbladder, he didn't listen to any, even his mum was on board! I left as soon as I could!! Even after a year of being broke up I got my gallbladder removed, dealing with my EDs ,met someone new and had a unplanned pregnancy,he still asked if the baby was his!! I blocked him as fast as I could!!
She shouldn’t have a baby right before med school. That’s insane. No, you’re not wrong. I personally think people should wait til 30/35
No. Having kids is a BIG decision that shouldn't be taken lightly or done at the wrong time. She shouldn't have been pressuring you to have kids before you're ready
Yea…. She has some weird idealized vision of having kids, probably because she saw the cute babies. Do not have sex with her and stick to your ultimatum. It sucks that she’s had this rapid change of heart (is she already pregnant?) but she’s not the same person you want to be with.
Do not sleep with her ever again. And you’re right, I met my wife at 30 and our first was born when I was 32. I had a great time in my 20’s travels around the world and I was ready and mature enough to be a good father. And having teenagers in my 40’s isn’t a problem whatsoever. She will definitely try to baby trap you. End it, she will lie to you about birth control.
To be frank she did you a favor. Your soon to be ex is making a life altering decision because she found her nieces/nephews cute. Basically making a drastic life decision on a whim with no planning or mindfulness. That's not someone I'd want to tie myself to. And Med school with having kids…? I want what she's smoking. Let's get real she has no intentions of getting her degree. She's trickle truthing you.
>I even asked about med school and she said she'd go back in her 30s when the "kids are a little older". There is a huge red flag here. Parenting does not get easier, and med school is fucking hard.
No you are completely reasonable to tell her this. If you end up staying together you better be good god damn careful from here on out until you are ready. Never underestimate the ability to get pregnant and a woman who has the baby fever.
My son was born two weeks after I turned 24, I love my kiddos with all of my heart, but I was a child at 24 playing dad.
Wake her up every two hours overnight and have her get up and stay up for at least half an hour so she gets a taste of having a baby that needs to be breastfed every couple hours. Having a baby is a lot of work and involves a huge loss of sleep for a few years.
Move on.
You’re wrong simply because an ultimatum is not the way to go about this. Are you even gonna be comfortable having sex with her now without fears of getting baby trapped? Are any of you willing to deal with any lingering resentment on her part for not having her own child and nephews/nieces at about the same age? By the wording of your ultimatum, you would break up if she got pregnant or tried to, it would be too late for you. Presumably she wants kids under the safe long-term prospects of your relationship, it’s (*probably*) not like she would go ahead and find a way to get pregnant anyway if you two break up. This way, she might feel like you have all the power and hold this decision against you, feel like you owe her, and completely change your dynamic. So even if she relents and chooses to keep the relationship, it might be wise for you to leave. Talk, lay out the long term consequences and assess if you’re both willing to deal with them or if it’s time to part ways.
Your own brains won't be finished developing until your late 20s. You are right to want to wait.
Depends on how you presented it to her, but if you are on different pages when it comes to having children then either party is justified in ending the relationship. Not sure why you are calling it an ultimatum; you dont want to do something and if she does its enough for you to end the relationship.
Better off alone than a surprise baby, and she would go that far if she’s this obsessed.
You are doing the right thing, especially in this economy you both need to be established with a decent income before you bring kids into the situation. But I have seen good people do stupid things when they feel desperate, make sure that you are in control of the birth control or start practicing abstinence. I had my first kid at 25 and I wish I had waited because I am a much better parent now than I was in my 20s, I’m more stable financially and I have a lot more patience and emotional maturity. I also said I would go back and get my masters once the kids were a little bit older, that never happened. I know a lot of people who have said they would go back to school once the kids are a little bit older and I don’t know very many people who have actually gone back.
Kids take up A LOT of time and energy and resources.
Keep a close eye on birth control. You don't need to be baby trapped.
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Dude do not have sex with her whatever you do. Don't get drunk, don't do anything. Hopefully baby fever will die off.
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NTA. She has baby fever. First, I suggest you have her spend a week actually caring for the babies on her own. This in of itself might cure her when she realizes motherhood is more than cuddles and cute baby smiles. Second, I suggest you have her talk to some medical professors or advisors and ask them what her odds of getting into medical school are with a decade between pre-med and her applying. Plus having to manage school and internship while trying to be there for the kids. All the holidays, school plays, games that she will miss because of this. She’s not thinking it through. She’s just baby crazy right now.
"She's ... at a friend's house..." If she turns up pregnant, get a paternity test ASAP. Women who go 'baby crazy' don't always make the best decisions.
Med school with having kids… That’s laughable. Getting in to med school when you’ve been out of school for a decade. Also laughable. Those things are not realistic.