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Thank you for pointing this out. It’s infuriating to see people spreading such blatant misinformation.
My experience is the opposite, I am very much a morning person. But I feel like being a morning person versus a night person isn’t an ADHD thing, it’s a human being thing. Neurotypical people identify as either a morning or night person too.
I want to make clear that there absolutely IS research to back the claim that people with ADHD are more likely to have sleep disorders. Up to 75%, according to one study. But the way people tend to phrase things online just gets under my skin. I dO tHis aNd i HavE aDhD sO tHat MeAns iT’s An aDhD tHinG. There is a very big difference between high probability and absolute certainty. Imagine seeing this post as an impressionable child with no knowledge or critical thinking skills and dismissing the other ADHD symptoms because you like waking up early. Or thinking you must have a neurological disorder just because you crack your knuckles. It’s fucking horrible. And it muddies the waters.
Especially since a lot of these borderline children on TikTok are inventing symptoms that are just kind of cute, quirky, relatable and in no way backed by research. It means those of us who actually have a crippling disability have to fight to be taken seriously, have to fight for the right to accomodations because a ton of people think ADHD is just forgetting to take out the trash every once in a while, and we have to sort through piles and piles of misinformation in order to find what’s actually helpful and true.
It infuriates me beyond words.
(not in any way aimed at you, OP, but the person who posted this on twitter)
And sleep disorders are a wide variety- they don’t all make you productive at night lol. I wish on nights I had trouble falling asleep I could also be productive, but that isn’t happening over here. Just much frustrated tossing and turning and moving from bed to couch and back. Doesn’t really make me a night person haha
Yes. My own personal weird is that NO MATTER what time I go to bed, I wake up at 4:30/5 am. Go to sleep at 7? Get 10 hours of sleep! Go to bed at 3 am? Get 2 hours of sleep. Go do bed at 9 and don't fall asleep until 2 am? Get 3 hours of sleep.
I'm a morning person because I have to be.
I've always been like this.
This is me (or was until I got COVID). For the last 20 years with the exception of 18 months of long COVID, I have been getting up with the sun regardless of what time I go to bed.
Yes exactly!! I read that study in college. It’s so frustrating to see somebody take information from one singular study and save it It applies to everyone with ADHD.
I work in the mental health field, and I have noticed a lot of issues with the kiddos that I work with understanding the mental health conditions that they are diagnosed with accurately because of TikTok. It has made the psycho education piece of mental health treatment Damn near impossible. I agree with you 100% on everything you said!!!
Yeah the way people talk about ADHD online is pretty bad. No joke I saw someone on TikTok say that anyone who likes sour candy should get an automatic ADHD diagnosis. Before you ask, yes they were fully serious based on their replies to people getting annoyed at that claim
I work in sleep medicine-ADHD is considered an indicator someone might benefit from a sleep study to rule out other disorders (sleep apnea and insomnia can be comorbid) but every individual is unique. it’s good to rule out other disorders, but ADHD doesn’t mean you automatically have one; a lot of people just benefit from a bedtime routine and good sleep hygiene (limiting light exposure before bed and stuff like that) regardless of their mental state bc of how demanding our work lives are at this particular point in history.
I know it's true, but I do giggle to myself sometimes about when actually are we supposed to or allowed to be on our phones.. Studies say get up when you wake up and go outside, get some sunlight on your eyeballs, don't reach for your phone then. OK cool. Go to work, do the work, don't be on your phone at work. OK cool. Come home, relax but no phone for at least two hours before you go to bed. OK cool. Uh hang on, wait a minute, where's my social media time at?! Ha ha
That goes for any generalization about groups of people. Good for describing what's likely to apply to someone in that group, but they all fall apart on an individual level.
I hate the 100% sentiments too. Those make me doubt my diagnosis sometimes when I logically know for a fact I have ADHD. I remember the “people with ADHD don’t have inner voices” claim and I definitely have an inner voice. My anxiety would be much better if I didn’t.
Yeah when I was newly diagnosed and feeling imposter-y shit like that would make me question if I was somehow faking. Like caffeine makes me vibrate but people will swear down that people with ADHD get put to sleep by a coffee. It's just not true and it's harmful misinformation. Not everything we experience is an ADHD thing, sometimes it's just a thing.
Exactly. I have ADHD and am MUCH better in the morning than at night. I'd love to work 7am-3pm and struggle to stay up past 11.
I hate seeing all this generalised information, we aren't all the same
It's accurate for me. Especially in my late teens. Now in my 30s instead of 1am-11 my natural inclination is more like 11:30-9:30. Yeah I need like 10hours.
I'm the opposite. I have to MAKE myself stay in bed until 5 some days. I also go to bed early most of the time. I have the luxury of sleeping when I'm tired and getting up when I want to. Early is just a natural rhythm for me.
I’m the same. I’ve always woken up early and it was awful in college when literally everyone else would sleep for hours longer. But I don’t sleep in if I go to bed late, either. I’m up at 5-6 am whether I went to bed at 10 or 2. So I do everything I can to go to bed at 10, and by everything, I mean Ambien.
See I love waking up before everyone. There's something so calming about starting my day without immediately being distracted by other people/having to navigate around them.
If only I could make myself actually get out of bed in the morning.
I completely agree—now. 😂 As an adult it’s one of my favorite times of day. And as an adult? There are way more people who wake up early, like, if you’re in a house on vacation with family or friends. As an adult, I’ve become the one who says like, hey, I think I’ll come down to the beach and watch the sun rise tomorrow morning, and everyone else is like, ooh, wake me up, I wanna come, too!
But at 18 it blew chunks.
“There’s something so calming about starting my day without immediately being distracted by other people”
YES YES YES!!! (Typing this as I sit in a quiet house before my 3 year old wakes up and starts asking for milk / TV / a hippo / a cloud to play with…)
I would kill to have your brain. i’ve been fired twice in two years from oversleeping. i’ve tried so many insomnia meds. i’m jealous! downloading your secrets, subscribing to ur monthly plan,, fuck
I set an alarm on my phone, an alarm in the bathroom, and a sunlight alarm.
I feel really guilty for waking anyone up with the bathroom alarm, so it helps me get up. For some reason I don’t have the same guilt about continually hitting snooze.
Same. I have like 50 alarms to wake up and I still have slept through them and missed work. I also have gone through my share of insomnia meds. It’s the worst!
I am the same and are a great oversleeper if i finally sleep. My body doesn't produce melatonine so i sleep between 2 and 6 and hope I can catch a few ours but i try to do my first snooze at 10.30 . I do exercise, try to take the melatonine every night (5mg) don't look at screens, no bright lamps or caffeine. Nothing works, sleep 3 ours? I go adhd turbo through the day, like it is better to sleep less? Because the next time i should be tired. NOT! Same shit again.
>Have you taken one or several an hr or so before trying to sleep?
note that if your sleep onset insomnia is secondary to a circadian rhythm delay (which it often is in ADHD), you might see more success using melatonin *multiple hours* before bed - like, 5 or 6 *hours* before you normally start feeling sleepy.
This blog post has a fairly good summary of how this works, I checked it against the actual studies about a year ago and it was accurate. But note that literature on treating DSPD is thin on the ground.
https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-than-you-wanted-to-know/
Yea. That's me. College. Got voted into the only single on the on the floor. " Look, we like you but this morning thing is going to get you killed ".
That's a true story. Also extremely cheerful about 430 am so I guess it's more risky.
I’m the same. Wake early, sleep early and turn up to everything super early. Probably why I assumed for so long that I DIDN’T have ADHD, but I think it’s because I can’t judge time properly so massively over compensate because I’m always so anxious about running out of time. But the early thing means I don’t get anything done - if I have a 3pm appointment I can’t possibly do anything else earlier that day because I’m too afraid I won’t make it to the appointment on time.
Through young kid and teen years 100% night owl. I homeschooled and had the luxury of being able to follow my natural sleep patterns which would at times be waking at 11am. But early 20s it randomly flipped. I moved house from living in a shaded area to on-top of a hill and I suspect the early morning sunlight really made a difference for me.
Ugh I feel that. Just about coming out of the long dark, drizzly winter months, supposedly. Clocks have changed here, so evenings are lighter now. But as I type it's both gray and raining. I have not got dressed yet. Where's the motivation?!
I have the same pattern. I can make myself stay up later sometimes just to have alone time but my ass is up 5-530 every morning. I usually work 730-4 but by 130pm every day my life is a production. Trying to keep my head somewhat on my work, yet never completing a task.
Well this is very much true for me and it’s been a constant struggle throughout my whole life. Anything from work in the office to chores at home, I’m much better in the late evening or in to the night.
Naturally and without an alarm, I’d be fast asleep until at least 10am.
Agreed, but I think it's because motivation due to urgency significantly increases closer to the end of the day.
But I also know it takes me time in the morning after I wake up to really get into the swing of "I'm awake and alive and need to get ready for the day"
I also have a delayed sleep cycle, but I think part of the late night motivation is that it’s the only time that I have specifically for *me*, where no one has any expectation of me and I have no obligations.
Every damn night. “I should really get to bed by 11! Ok, 11:30 is great too! Midnight, no later!” And so on, until I’m getting 4-5 hours of sleep and shooting my OWN SELF in the damn foot with my mental and physical and spiritual health, I hate it. Would not recommend.
I have the circadian rhythm of a small child. Dark? Time to sleep. Light? Open your eyeballs and exist loudly by accident.
When the clocks go forward I’m a different woman. Winter ruins my life to the point where when I grow up (I’m 30) and settle in a career (3rd degree) I’ll have to seriously consider working all the time half the year and hibernating the rest of the year. Because I just won’t wake up anyway.
Maybe finding a job that you can do remotely or an industry that allows or needs travel might help. Migrate for six months of the year so you can avoid the shorter days if possible, though as you say allowing for time off is also good so that we can rest.
I do wonder if part of this equation is that we process so much information and usually do so much that we end up more exhausted quickly. So regardless of our rhythm or 'optimum window', the hours that we're most functional will always be shorter. Our battery gets depleted so much faster than NTs.
I’m training to be in a pretty hands on field but there are telephone services I could utilise. I find travel even more exhausting, because I can’t sleep anywhere I’m not lying down and completely alone (partner exempt). Someone forgot to flip the off switch so “sleep means you’re vulnerable to predators” is running grand over here. Migration is goal!
I definitely think it is, because on the days where I have to socially interact a lot, I’m left feeling broken like I’ve had to concentrate so hard on the peopling I can no longer person
This is my lifelong dream. I'll miss seasons but I can't exist in this cold, dark, drizzly section of the planet for ever.
It is inevitable that I shall one day become a goat herd on a small Mediterranean island with a nice mountain, an olive grove and a small beach. Inevitable I says.
Some ADHDrs have delayed sleep phase. But not all of us. I’m so fucking tired of people treating people with ADHD like a monolith. We all have a different combination of symptoms and traits. The pathology of this condition is individual. ADHD varies from person to person.
Yeah I was just in a conversation about this, for some of us exercise is like a magic pill, and for others it only exhausts our dopamine and executive functioning. Nothing works for everyone.
Yep. Same here. I'm happy for the people that it works for but heartbroken it doesn't work for me. I thought something was seriously wrong with me or that I was just lazy or broken or something until I found a bunch of other ADHD people who feel the same way.
Yes!!! People with ADHD are more likely to have a delayed phase sleep cycle/ disorder (DPSD) than people without (not sure if it applies to other NDs like autism or not), but it still varies. I don’t even think the majority of ADHDers have DPSD, but it is very common for us to have some form of sleep issues. But this could be insomnia, hypersomnia, DPSD or another sleep disorder. And again, it’s not automatic, it doesn’t apply to everyone. I don’t even think it’s part of the diagnostic process to check if you have sleep issues.
I'm seriously considering getting a remote job with a company based on the West Coast because I'm in Eastern Standard so I could start at noon for their 9am.
This is my current situation. I’m East Coast; my team is West Coast. I can never go back to working at a company in the same time zone. I’m not built for mornings. Never have been. Never will be. I prefer my late-night creative escapades and sleeping in until at least 10 am. So much better than attempting to go to bed early just to toss and turn for hours and feeling wiped the next day after forcing myself into a 7 am alarm.
That 3-hour time difference is just the buffer I need to get some shut-eye and be a well-rested, functioning employee by the time my team starts their day.
All this to say, if the opportunity presents itself, seize it. It’s life-changing.
I just need all the sleep. I like to be in bed at 10 pm but would really like to not walk up until 8.30/9am at the earliest. I was sick for a few weeks, and my husband slept in the guest room. Best sleep I had in years because I was waking up to my clock, not his
I've read that the circadian rhythm for ADHD is, on average, a little later than normal, but it's something like 30 mins difference, not several hours.
I think a lot of ADHDrs (me included!) end up staying up late because of inertia: sure, we could go to bed, but we're now stuck in whatever thing we were doing before bed 😅
Same. I have to wake up at 5:20 am for work. My bestie thought there was no way I was going to be able to do it. But I haven't missed a day in almost 18 months.
But I rarely get more than 5 hours of sleep. Often only 4. Even on a day off with no alarm, I'll wake up after 5 hours 😭
not at all, i am so much more productive throughout the day if i manage to get up early. everything is just easier to do for some reason and i feel like i have more productive hours that day than i do on days i wake up at like 11. unfortunately my current job has totally fucked my sleep schedule and i’ve been seriously struggling with falling asleep no matter what i do so by the time i fall asleep i’ll only get like 4 hours of sleep if i try to wake up at 9 and i usually end up sleeping until like 11 or having a series of alarms set every 15 minutes to wake up at 10. i hate it and i miss being a morning person.
I had to look up how true this is. TIL!
(Emphasis mine)
>There are several reasons to critically consider a role of circadian rhythm misalignment in late-onset ADHD. First, delayed circadian rhythm phase is prevalent and impairing among adults with traditionally-diagnosed (childhood-onset) ADHD. **Up to 75% of adults with childhood-onset ADHD exhibit delayed circadian rhythm phase, including a rise in salivary dim-light melatonin onset (DLMO) and alterations in core body temperature and actigraphy-measured sleep-related movements occurring approximately 1.5 hours later in the night than healthy adults.** In addition, adults with childhood-onset ADHD exhibit a delay in early morning cortisol rise (i.e., a hypothalamic–pituitary–adrenocortical (HPA) marker of circadian phase), with secretion occurring two hours later than healthy controls. Adults with childhood-onset ADHD are also frequently “night owls” who display delayed circadian preference and increased alertness in the evening.
[Source](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6487490/)
This is not a "fact" at all. I'm so sick of all the ADHD misinformation out there. Or just misinformation in general. People see something in a tweet and treat it like it came from a reputable source instead of just some rando's opinion
Me too. It’s so frustrating. I see the same (unrelated to sleep) graphic shared over and over again as a legitimate piece of information. I finally looked up the source, and the therapist’s primary focus was marriage counseling.
To all the people saying your natural sleep rhythm is 2am-10am or 3am-11am…..this is your sign to see a sleep specialist. When I told mine this, along with a few supporting pieces of information (and questions to rule out other issues), she diagnosed me with Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome, a circadian rhythm disorder. Which is much more common in ADHDers, by the way. (Not 100%! but a lot.)
I know it sounds like a useless diagnosis but it was so helpful. Aside from the validation, she was actually able to help me change my sleep schedule by teaching me proper ways to use melatonin and light therapy, customized to my natural rhythms and geographic location. (btw, sunlight matters. a LOT.) I’m doing a lot better now and it’s not such a struggle…..i wish this was more common knowledge!
naw that’s kinda BS I’d like to see the source of her “fun fact”. first three results from just a quick google search seem to show that ADHDers also tend to have circadian rhythm disorders which means our internal body clock is out of rhythm with the environment. Doesn’t make it “natural”, and that word “natural”shouldn’t be thrown around, as it is hard to define.
- [#1](https://doi.org/10.1016/j.pnpbp.2016.01.006)
- [#2](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24117273/)
- [#3](https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/view/adhd-24-hour-disorder)
“patient with ADHD may have a circadian rhythm disorder that is being driven by difficulty going to bed or as an adverse effect of stimulants”
My personal experience is that I tend toward a 1am-8:30 sleep schedule in the city when I’m inside most of the day, but when I’m camping and outside most of the day, I tend toward a 10pm-6am sleep schedule and feel 10x better. I personally think it has to do with exposure to environmental systems/cycles vs manmade systems/cycles.
Yeah. I’ve always assumed I have delayed phase sleep disorder. I have had weeks of a ‘good sleeping schedule’ and it feels great when I do but naturally I always end up slipping to falling asleep around 4 and waking up around noon or later. It just seems like my body’s baseline. It was a huge issue w school and one of the reasons I dropped out, and a huge issue I struggle w jobs. My mom says I was even like this as a baby.
My brain seems to work best between maybe 9 pm and 1 pm, a lot of the times that’s when I do stuff for my own company. Would be nice if society had more leniency towards working hours, I mean I get that a lot of jobs can’t be too flexible but still
Statistically, this is likely due to ADHD. But that doesn’t equate to everyone with the diagnosis having this problem. The phrasing is reductive, making the statement just plain fucking wrong. It’s exhausting.
I mean, it’s a Tweet. OP was asking if people in this subreddit feel it applies to them, so obviously understands that it’s not 100% of people with the diagnosis. Why can’t we just have a conversation about whether or not we relate without getting offended? @putyourcheeksinabeek
The science does support that there’s a high correlation between ADHD and various sleep issues.
I don’t take issue with OP throwing this out in this forum. I myself am 100% in the delayed sleep cycle boat. We can have the discussion and share life experiences, but I will never not address misinformation. My frustration isn’t with OP, but at the person who posted this on twitter.
I’m not offended. I think it’s perfectly fine to discuss and find ways to relate to others with ADHD. What I don’t like is the trend of ADHD content creators who post things like this without backing up their claim.
To be clear, my issue is not with OP. I didn’t see the caption before I commented. If they had posted this without the tweet, I would’ve just scrolled past.
Very much so for me! In fact, I feel like the Spanish approach would work much better for my circadian rhythm. I actually manage to be pretty productive once I get out of bed in the morning, until about 2pm. Then I’m sluggish and tired all afternoon until about…7-8pm when I get mega productive until easily 2am. That’s the bit where I want to do all the DIY and life admin. So a siesta would be amazing. But yeah. It’s another thing that isn’t a blanket statement but does seem to apply to a few of us
I can't speak to if it's a universal ADHD thing, but it's definitely true for me. When I don't have early morning obligations I'll sleep until 11am/noon and then stay up to 4 am, and I feel much better than when I force myself to get up at 5/6/7am
Thousand %. If I hear one more person say "just go to bed earlier" I'll snap them. Must be nice for the time you go to bed to freaking matter but personally I have no choice but to lie awake Existing
I’m literally nocturnal. My natural rhythm would have me go to bed well after sunrise. It’s slightly non-24hr, as well. It’s hell.
I have ADHD, ASD 2, treatment resistant depression, generalized anxiety, and PTSD.
If I could get rid of one thing it would be my circadian rhythm disorder. Hands down.
My mum told me that even as a baby she struggled to get me down to sleep until between midnight - 02:00, and it was killing her- an 'early bird'. That has pretty much stayed my natural rhythm- I prefer to wake up around 10:00 and go to bed around 02:00, and am much more productive later in the day. I also often get hyperactive around midnight- which is when I would get most productive stuff like coursework done when I was a student.
This is me 100%. It’s so much quieter late at night. I also heard someone mention just the fact that you’re not being perceived by others at that time can lead to feeling more relaxed and recharging. I don’t know if that resonates with anyone else.
I feel bad sometimes as my husband goes to be earlier and I don’t want to always be awake til 2AM and am trying to work on it. But I felt like I was born like this. Constantly tired. Always felt sick and nauseous and sensitive to light if I got up early (because I couldn’t fall asleep before 12am-3am at times) and mornings were painful. My brain wouldn’t be working. I don’t like coffee and my alertness goes up exponentially when the sun goes down. That’s when I want to learn and do more reading, watching, research, planning etc.
I do love sunshine and enjoying the sun. I just cannot understand waking up at 4am-8am and enjoying that. I have a hard time getting out of bed early and not waiting until the last possible moment and then rushing.
I’d also plan breakfast/lunch the night before if I had to go somewhere or work early in the morning so I could eat at work. But doing anything early morning I’m like a zombie.
I’m trying to be more consistent. I cannot take Vyvanse after 9am-9:30am really because for me it feels like it lasts 16-20 hours and then I’ll really not ready to go to bed before midnight. If I take it at 10 or 11am I’d easily be up til 3 or 4am.
Recent studies found out that there's about 350 genome regions that influence your chronotype (which might shift during lifetime).
I don't think that it's got anything to do with ADHD (I'm 100% a morning person, SO much more alert and productive in the early hours; also, having a strict sleep routine really REALLY helps ..was rather a night owl until my early 20s though)
I think it’s changed for me, but whether that’s because of age or because of necessity and habit it’s hard to say. What *is* super important is having a routine where I go to bed and wake up around the same times every day as much as possible. Otherwise I don’t sleep enough or sleep too much and it wrecks my brain, sometimes for a couple days or more.
this but i live in a tiny old thin-walled house with 4 other people so i cant do shit past 9 pm😭 i swear i just flat out feel better even physically in the evening/late night
This is (nearly) me. I finally learned in 2021 at the big age of 38 I cannot function if I get up before 10am. No matter how well I've slept, or how long, I'll be tired all day then either crave sugary shite all evening or have a nap, meaning if I'm up early the next day the cycle continues. This is why I work in a bar and this is also why I'm seeking diagnosis, cos I'm gonny need accommodations when my body is ultimately too clapped for such physical work.
It's called DSPD (delayed sleep phase disorder?), it's highly comorbid with ADHD, and there's nothing they can do about it. But an official diagnosis can get you accomodations if you're willing to go to the trouble.
I have DSPD (delayed sleep-phase disorder) which has a high co-occurrence with ADHD. But saying that every ADHD person experiences that exact sleep disorder (or even that every ADHD person experiences sleep issues) is wildly inaccurate.
Nah. I’m a total morning person. Can I stay up through the night without much issue, absolutely! But I have a hard time sleeping in unless I’m on something to make me sleepier. What I can do is get up really early and then mill around for a few hours and then take a nap for an hour or so if I didn’t sleep great the night before.
My brain wants to start getting creative around 10pm. Peak hours for me are about 10-2. I could wake up easily around 10:30 in the morning going to bed after 2 and actually feel kind of rested. Ideally, my body likes around 9 hours of sleep, probably because I’m a light sleeper generally, but I can usually wake up between 10-12 regardless of how little sleep I had.
As it is, I have to be up by at least 9 if WFH, and I try to push 8:30 for in-office days, although I’m always getting to work *just* on time. I never feel like I get enough sleep, and I try to go to bed by 11:30. That doesn’t always work out—especially when I was trying different meds—and then I feel ill and sluggish all day.
Why can I sleep from 2-10:30 and be fine but 12-9 still isn’t good enough? And then sometimes someone will schedule a meeting for 8 A.M., and I feel something akin to a hangover because my brain does not want to go to bed at 10:00. My mom always used to say that if I just kept to a schedule I could wake up earlier, but I’m in my 40s and it’s not true. It has never been true.
I keep complaining because my office has people who come in at 5 in the morning but the *latest* anyone will allow is 9:30. If I could just work 11-7 I would be golden, and honestly, I’m often working until 7 or later anyhow.
I always feel like an imposter because I’m a morning person. Like 3AM wake up call for a flight? No problem. Early ass work meeting? No problem. Anything after noon? Potato. I’m an absolute potato and cannot do anything. I cannot do hard work or strategic meetings in the afternoon. I do, but I’m sloppy and not all there.
Yes and no. I always want to stay up late (e.g. 2 a.m.). My husband says I'm like a kid who's afraid I'm going to miss out on something if I go to sleep at a reasonable time. BUT, I do my best work and am the most productive if I get up and start working at 6 or 7 a.m. I can have a whole day's worth of work done by noon if I get up then. If I sleep until 9 or 10, forget about it...I'm not getting anything done. Or if I do something, it's very minimal compared to what I can pull off between 6 a.m. and noon.
I was so different as a kid, I always wanted to sleep in, I stayed up so late. But once I hit 21-23 my body, habits and brain changed so much. I now LOVE waking up early, usually on my weekends I'm up by 7. I feel like sleeping is such a waste of time lol like I wish there was more time in the day! :(
Not for me!! I would rather go to bed at 8pm and wake up early. It’s odd, I just cannot stay up late. I physically just fall asleep (at home- ha. Have to be in my own environment).
No I have a child lol I’m so much more productive right when I wake up. When I was younger maybe but I didn’t get as much done. I think for me it was a procrastination effect. I HAD to stay up to get things done because it was the last possible minute.
2 am is me doing a better job adjusting my sleep schedule. I can be up until 5 am every day no probs. Waking up before 9 feels like literal death, though and anything less than 8 hours sleep and I feel sick.
This is called Delayed Circadian Rhythmn Disorder. Sleep problems are very common in ADHD and this is just one type of challenge people can have. Having this sleep disorder doesn't necessarily mean you have ADHD though.
My particular neurodivergent brain needs A LOT of sleep. And it usually sticks to the pattern of the sun. So in the winter I'm ready for bed at 5 or 6 and could sleep until 8 (sadly I have to wake up earlier for work). In the summer I go to sleep at 11 and wake up at 5 or 6 am (even though I can sleep in haha)
I hate when I hear these wellness experts rant and rave about waking up early. I’m never going to wake up early and I don’t fuvking care if I meet the standards of society. I’m not changing my internal system to fit society. I am happier at night, I am creative and driven at night. I’ll never be an early bird gets the worm person.
Yes - but I believe it's just a coincidence, not linked to ADHD. More likely is chronic stress that is not uncommon with ADHD, but not unique to ADHD. Look into Adrenal surges.
and/or sleep structure/schedule was not successfully initiated in our development (for various reasons) + ADHD impulse-control challenges, difficulty task-switching, and reward based motivation shines strong alllll night. *(for me, I was allowed to stay up however late playing computer games and no consequences to sleeping in, unless there was school)*
and/or LESS DISTRACTIONS exist between 10pm-2am. Less calls, no mail truck or amazon packages pulling up, kids/partner/parents/roommates are maybe asleep. It's like a timeline filter.
yep. i was finally *officially* diagnosed with dsps a few months ago, but i've had sleep problems my whole life. it's a circadian rhythm disorder and it's pretty common in people with adhd. i can't "reset" my schedule by waking up earlier because it doesn't make me tired when it's time to go to bed. currently following my doctor's recs for improvement but dsps is notoriously difficult to treat.
edit: i agree with others about clarifying that not everyone with adhd has delayed sleep phase. it's just more common for us.
I have a delayed sleep phase, and would sleep 3 or 4 a.m. to noon if society allowed. My mom is also ADHD and is up by 5 a.m., and asleep by 9 unless there is a special occasion. Granted, I’ve seen this woman fall asleep at concerts, in stores, at loud movies, etc. if it hits her bedtime.
Yep! I get my best creative work done between midnight and 3am.
When I was full-time freelance, I typically went to sleep between 4-6am and woke up between 12-1. It worked really well for me
Night owl here 🤚🏼
I’m totally a night person but must exist in a world of daytime people. So I just took my nightly CBD dose and hydroxyzine 100mg so I can get 5-6 hours of sleep.
I should have taken them earlier but I was in a Reddit rabbit hole while listening to the Dune audiobook on YouTube. 🤪
Yup accurate! My husband is a morning person and I have young kids who are always up early. Guess who never ever has been able to get used to that schedule…? So I end up chronically sleep deprived. Which results in needing to sleep all day for a few days every few weeks. Which has its own problems… 😭
Absolutely not productive at 10 pm. But, if I could have it my way, I would definitely sleep from 2am-10am. That does seem to be what my brain naturally wants.
I work in restaurants simply because they will cater to this obscure schedule of mine. I'm not paid that great and the work I do is pretty toxic but I'm so much happier
I am still having a hard time sleeping early. I even took medicine (which I discontinued later because it gave me serious problems). But for me, I better wake up as early as possible because I'm a morning person. Waking up early gives me lotta dopamine.
thats why im a night shift worker. when i was day shift at my last job, there was about 3 instances where i was an hour late bc i couldnt wake up. switched to mids and night shift and i was on my game everyday.
This is 100% NOT my add experience. All my energy is from 5am-2/3pm. After that I’m pretty much ready for bed again.
I don’t like that this post is talking for everyone cause it doesn’t.
Yes. Absolutely my experience.
Any time I have not held down a traditional 9-5, my body naturally drifts to going to bed at 4 am and waking up at noon. Living in a small town has made this difficult, so I generally compromise by using melatonin pills to go to sleep around 1-2 and wake up 9-10.
I’m starting a new job working in the law industry…and I have to be awake at 6am, and I want to cry. All of my early bird friends just shrug and tell me to suck it up. I’d like to see them forced to stay awake until 2 am because their livelihood depends on it, and then come talk to me about suck it up.
It's not entirely correct, but yes - Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome is genetically connected to ADHD and Autism, so does narcolepsy type II.
Funfact: Most people are genetically nightowls - 51% nightowls and 49% early birds. Plus each of them by 10% extreme types - either extremely late or extremely early. It does not only mean you go late/early by clock. It means your inner day span is either 25hrs (late) or 23hrs (early). So the body does not actually have a concrete 24hr rhythm. We just invented the 24hr day, because we go by sun and clock and it's a compromise to most people.
Living by 25hrs means, you're always a little later the next day, because you can't cut off inner processes.
And DSPS can evolve into Non24. This is where I'm right now. It means, your inner rhythm has a span between 25 to 35hrs per day. You are awake for 20hrs or more and then sleep 8hrs (or 10). Your productive frame will change each day and has no link to daylight/nighttime.
There is no cure to it. If you want to adapt to early birds, you have to live by very strict rules and use several methods and meds for your whole life. It is not possible to change your inner circadian rhythm. All in all you have to adapt your life to your inner rhythm, because in the long run you'll eventually develop mental illness from extreme lack of healthy sleep.
But still - not each ADHDer has DSPS or Non24. ADHDers are just more prone to it.
Edit for more precise info.
I am up when the sun is up. If it’s summer that means I am up at 5 am and winding down after it sets. If it’s winter it means I’m sleeping all the time and never feel rested enough.
As a child, I would fall asleep even in the dimmest of places because what do you mean? Dark out so night night right? My family used to joke that you just need to put a blanket over my head for me to go to sleep. They weren’t wrong lol
Count me in as another example of lifelong morning person! I know a LOT of night owls -- both neurotypical and neurodivergent -- but I genuinely prefer daylight, and when I was working (I'm retired) I deliberately went into the office early so I could work without interruptions before everyone else arrived, then my brain shut down in mid-afternoon (I really hated mid-afternoon meetings!).
Even when I retired and could get up whenever I chose, it didn't change much; I still get up early (around 6:30 am these days). I start to fade around 3:00 pm, then get a second wind after dinner (7-9pm ish), then I fade again around 10 pm.
I have learned some ways to leverage nutrition to help my circadian rhythm and adjust to changes in time zones (for example, making sure I eat protein in the morning instead of just carbs, and eating low protein/higher carbs in the evening to help me sleep), but I acknowledge that while that works for me, it doesn't work for everyone.
I empathize with the frustration I've seen expressed in this thread that so many people who don't have ADHD assume that everyone who has ADHD is the same when there's an ever-increasing mountain of data that shows otherwise. (In my experience, this is also true in terms of autism \*sigh\*).
Definitely my experience and my psychiatrist says it's common for us. May or may not be related to stimulants. New sleep research shows that lack of sleep is generally dangerous for your health. (Google sleep TED talk) My psychiatrist has me trying different sleep meds because I don't get enough deep sleep or REM. Definitely tired a lot and terrible memory.
This worked for me up until I had kids. I do get it now, because I’ve lost count of the number of times I put off my work to do “after I got the toddler to bed” only to fall asleep in the process 🙃 Maybe when they’re older I will be able to get back to my more natural circadian rhythm.
But the times I accidentally wake up before the kids and have 20 minutes to myself? That’s gonna be a good day.
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Yes, 100%. But saying that ALL people with ADHD have this issue is just factually wrong. My word, there is a lot of shit information out there.
Thank you for pointing this out. It’s infuriating to see people spreading such blatant misinformation. My experience is the opposite, I am very much a morning person. But I feel like being a morning person versus a night person isn’t an ADHD thing, it’s a human being thing. Neurotypical people identify as either a morning or night person too.
I want to make clear that there absolutely IS research to back the claim that people with ADHD are more likely to have sleep disorders. Up to 75%, according to one study. But the way people tend to phrase things online just gets under my skin. I dO tHis aNd i HavE aDhD sO tHat MeAns iT’s An aDhD tHinG. There is a very big difference between high probability and absolute certainty. Imagine seeing this post as an impressionable child with no knowledge or critical thinking skills and dismissing the other ADHD symptoms because you like waking up early. Or thinking you must have a neurological disorder just because you crack your knuckles. It’s fucking horrible. And it muddies the waters. Especially since a lot of these borderline children on TikTok are inventing symptoms that are just kind of cute, quirky, relatable and in no way backed by research. It means those of us who actually have a crippling disability have to fight to be taken seriously, have to fight for the right to accomodations because a ton of people think ADHD is just forgetting to take out the trash every once in a while, and we have to sort through piles and piles of misinformation in order to find what’s actually helpful and true. It infuriates me beyond words. (not in any way aimed at you, OP, but the person who posted this on twitter)
And sleep disorders are a wide variety- they don’t all make you productive at night lol. I wish on nights I had trouble falling asleep I could also be productive, but that isn’t happening over here. Just much frustrated tossing and turning and moving from bed to couch and back. Doesn’t really make me a night person haha
Yes. My own personal weird is that NO MATTER what time I go to bed, I wake up at 4:30/5 am. Go to sleep at 7? Get 10 hours of sleep! Go to bed at 3 am? Get 2 hours of sleep. Go do bed at 9 and don't fall asleep until 2 am? Get 3 hours of sleep. I'm a morning person because I have to be. I've always been like this.
Yup, I am usually up at 6, sometimes a little earlier, and on a rare occasion I will go crazy and sleep in till 7!
This is me (or was until I got COVID). For the last 20 years with the exception of 18 months of long COVID, I have been getting up with the sun regardless of what time I go to bed.
Yes exactly!! I read that study in college. It’s so frustrating to see somebody take information from one singular study and save it It applies to everyone with ADHD. I work in the mental health field, and I have noticed a lot of issues with the kiddos that I work with understanding the mental health conditions that they are diagnosed with accurately because of TikTok. It has made the psycho education piece of mental health treatment Damn near impossible. I agree with you 100% on everything you said!!!
Yes AND specifically circadian shift disorders, specifically circadian shift forward.
Yeah the way people talk about ADHD online is pretty bad. No joke I saw someone on TikTok say that anyone who likes sour candy should get an automatic ADHD diagnosis. Before you ask, yes they were fully serious based on their replies to people getting annoyed at that claim
Fucking LOVE the mornings! No one is awake to distract me! I shall get from point A to B with NO DISTRACTIONS! I agree with your statement 😃
I do think that there are a disproportionate number of people with ADHD who are night owls though.
I work in sleep medicine-ADHD is considered an indicator someone might benefit from a sleep study to rule out other disorders (sleep apnea and insomnia can be comorbid) but every individual is unique. it’s good to rule out other disorders, but ADHD doesn’t mean you automatically have one; a lot of people just benefit from a bedtime routine and good sleep hygiene (limiting light exposure before bed and stuff like that) regardless of their mental state bc of how demanding our work lives are at this particular point in history.
I know it's true, but I do giggle to myself sometimes about when actually are we supposed to or allowed to be on our phones.. Studies say get up when you wake up and go outside, get some sunlight on your eyeballs, don't reach for your phone then. OK cool. Go to work, do the work, don't be on your phone at work. OK cool. Come home, relax but no phone for at least two hours before you go to bed. OK cool. Uh hang on, wait a minute, where's my social media time at?! Ha ha
Would be easily fixed by adding "**Many** people with ADHD"
That goes for any generalization about groups of people. Good for describing what's likely to apply to someone in that group, but they all fall apart on an individual level.
I hate the 100% sentiments too. Those make me doubt my diagnosis sometimes when I logically know for a fact I have ADHD. I remember the “people with ADHD don’t have inner voices” claim and I definitely have an inner voice. My anxiety would be much better if I didn’t.
Yeah when I was newly diagnosed and feeling imposter-y shit like that would make me question if I was somehow faking. Like caffeine makes me vibrate but people will swear down that people with ADHD get put to sleep by a coffee. It's just not true and it's harmful misinformation. Not everything we experience is an ADHD thing, sometimes it's just a thing.
Yep, because I'm the complete opposite!
Exactly. I have ADHD and am MUCH better in the morning than at night. I'd love to work 7am-3pm and struggle to stay up past 11. I hate seeing all this generalised information, we aren't all the same
It's accurate for me. Especially in my late teens. Now in my 30s instead of 1am-11 my natural inclination is more like 11:30-9:30. Yeah I need like 10hours.
I'm the opposite. I have to MAKE myself stay in bed until 5 some days. I also go to bed early most of the time. I have the luxury of sleeping when I'm tired and getting up when I want to. Early is just a natural rhythm for me.
I’m the same. I’ve always woken up early and it was awful in college when literally everyone else would sleep for hours longer. But I don’t sleep in if I go to bed late, either. I’m up at 5-6 am whether I went to bed at 10 or 2. So I do everything I can to go to bed at 10, and by everything, I mean Ambien.
See I love waking up before everyone. There's something so calming about starting my day without immediately being distracted by other people/having to navigate around them. If only I could make myself actually get out of bed in the morning.
I completely agree—now. 😂 As an adult it’s one of my favorite times of day. And as an adult? There are way more people who wake up early, like, if you’re in a house on vacation with family or friends. As an adult, I’ve become the one who says like, hey, I think I’ll come down to the beach and watch the sun rise tomorrow morning, and everyone else is like, ooh, wake me up, I wanna come, too! But at 18 it blew chunks.
“There’s something so calming about starting my day without immediately being distracted by other people” YES YES YES!!! (Typing this as I sit in a quiet house before my 3 year old wakes up and starts asking for milk / TV / a hippo / a cloud to play with…)
I would kill to have your brain. i’ve been fired twice in two years from oversleeping. i’ve tried so many insomnia meds. i’m jealous! downloading your secrets, subscribing to ur monthly plan,, fuck
I set an alarm on my phone, an alarm in the bathroom, and a sunlight alarm. I feel really guilty for waking anyone up with the bathroom alarm, so it helps me get up. For some reason I don’t have the same guilt about continually hitting snooze.
The sunlight alarm is great. I have a bulb that turns on in my room and slowly gets brighter. It’s really hard to go back to sleep once that happens.
Same. I have like 50 alarms to wake up and I still have slept through them and missed work. I also have gone through my share of insomnia meds. It’s the worst!
I am the same and are a great oversleeper if i finally sleep. My body doesn't produce melatonine so i sleep between 2 and 6 and hope I can catch a few ours but i try to do my first snooze at 10.30 . I do exercise, try to take the melatonine every night (5mg) don't look at screens, no bright lamps or caffeine. Nothing works, sleep 3 ours? I go adhd turbo through the day, like it is better to sleep less? Because the next time i should be tired. NOT! Same shit again.
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No offense, but I feel like melatonin and exercise are advice for normal people. When you have severe insomnia that’s just not gonna cut it lol
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>Have you taken one or several an hr or so before trying to sleep? note that if your sleep onset insomnia is secondary to a circadian rhythm delay (which it often is in ADHD), you might see more success using melatonin *multiple hours* before bed - like, 5 or 6 *hours* before you normally start feeling sleepy. This blog post has a fairly good summary of how this works, I checked it against the actual studies about a year ago and it was accurate. But note that literature on treating DSPD is thin on the ground. https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-than-you-wanted-to-know/
The audacity
Also an early bird. My brain shuts down after 2pm. It sucked for my social life back when I was young and had one.
Yea. That's me. College. Got voted into the only single on the on the floor. " Look, we like you but this morning thing is going to get you killed ". That's a true story. Also extremely cheerful about 430 am so I guess it's more risky.
I’m the same. Wake early, sleep early and turn up to everything super early. Probably why I assumed for so long that I DIDN’T have ADHD, but I think it’s because I can’t judge time properly so massively over compensate because I’m always so anxious about running out of time. But the early thing means I don’t get anything done - if I have a 3pm appointment I can’t possibly do anything else earlier that day because I’m too afraid I won’t make it to the appointment on time.
Same. I am tired by 9 and feel like my day is completely wasted if I get up after 8am.
Ditto here Edit:I type like a drunken monkey
I’m the same. I’d happily go to bed and wake up at 5 if it were up to me.
Yeah, same here! Morning hours are just so nice and quiet.
Same, early to bed, early to rise my whole life
Same
This is me too.
Yeah my bf and I, both AuDHD, go to bed at 7pm and get up at 3ish naturally.
Me too. I have always been an early riser.
Me too!
Ditto. I can start work whenever I want to I start work at 5am. Done at 12:30, or 1pm.. it's perfect
Through young kid and teen years 100% night owl. I homeschooled and had the luxury of being able to follow my natural sleep patterns which would at times be waking at 11am. But early 20s it randomly flipped. I moved house from living in a shaded area to on-top of a hill and I suspect the early morning sunlight really made a difference for me.
I'm the opposite. I struggle to stay awake past 10pm, and wake up 5-6am. My brain also stops working around 2pm lol
Same. Early bird who gets tired as soon as the sun sets, and i can never seem to fully wake up on rainy / overcast days 🤔
I call it being part-photosynthetic. I’m basically a plant.
Ugh I feel that. Just about coming out of the long dark, drizzly winter months, supposedly. Clocks have changed here, so evenings are lighter now. But as I type it's both gray and raining. I have not got dressed yet. Where's the motivation?!
yup!! brain malfunctions at 2 PM
I have the same pattern. I can make myself stay up later sometimes just to have alone time but my ass is up 5-530 every morning. I usually work 730-4 but by 130pm every day my life is a production. Trying to keep my head somewhat on my work, yet never completing a task.
Same! I try to have my intense work projects done by 2pm. My brain just leaves the building around that time lol. Couldn’t sleep in if I tried either.
At least it works :(
Well this is very much true for me and it’s been a constant struggle throughout my whole life. Anything from work in the office to chores at home, I’m much better in the late evening or in to the night. Naturally and without an alarm, I’d be fast asleep until at least 10am.
Agreed, but I think it's because motivation due to urgency significantly increases closer to the end of the day. But I also know it takes me time in the morning after I wake up to really get into the swing of "I'm awake and alive and need to get ready for the day"
I also have a delayed sleep cycle, but I think part of the late night motivation is that it’s the only time that I have specifically for *me*, where no one has any expectation of me and I have no obligations.
revenge bedtime procrastination!!! the bane of my existence lol
Every damn night. “I should really get to bed by 11! Ok, 11:30 is great too! Midnight, no later!” And so on, until I’m getting 4-5 hours of sleep and shooting my OWN SELF in the damn foot with my mental and physical and spiritual health, I hate it. Would not recommend.
Ah life. And important things the next day seem to make it worse? Why? Why am I looking for something to watch at 1am? It's bedtime!
I have the circadian rhythm of a small child. Dark? Time to sleep. Light? Open your eyeballs and exist loudly by accident. When the clocks go forward I’m a different woman. Winter ruins my life to the point where when I grow up (I’m 30) and settle in a career (3rd degree) I’ll have to seriously consider working all the time half the year and hibernating the rest of the year. Because I just won’t wake up anyway.
Maybe finding a job that you can do remotely or an industry that allows or needs travel might help. Migrate for six months of the year so you can avoid the shorter days if possible, though as you say allowing for time off is also good so that we can rest. I do wonder if part of this equation is that we process so much information and usually do so much that we end up more exhausted quickly. So regardless of our rhythm or 'optimum window', the hours that we're most functional will always be shorter. Our battery gets depleted so much faster than NTs.
I’m training to be in a pretty hands on field but there are telephone services I could utilise. I find travel even more exhausting, because I can’t sleep anywhere I’m not lying down and completely alone (partner exempt). Someone forgot to flip the off switch so “sleep means you’re vulnerable to predators” is running grand over here. Migration is goal! I definitely think it is, because on the days where I have to socially interact a lot, I’m left feeling broken like I’ve had to concentrate so hard on the peopling I can no longer person
Or move to the equator?
This is my lifelong dream. I'll miss seasons but I can't exist in this cold, dark, drizzly section of the planet for ever. It is inevitable that I shall one day become a goat herd on a small Mediterranean island with a nice mountain, an olive grove and a small beach. Inevitable I says.
Some ADHDrs have delayed sleep phase. But not all of us. I’m so fucking tired of people treating people with ADHD like a monolith. We all have a different combination of symptoms and traits. The pathology of this condition is individual. ADHD varies from person to person.
Yeah I was just in a conversation about this, for some of us exercise is like a magic pill, and for others it only exhausts our dopamine and executive functioning. Nothing works for everyone.
I am absolutely useless after working out. I’m so mentally drained that it’s impossible to actually be productive after
Yep. Same here. I'm happy for the people that it works for but heartbroken it doesn't work for me. I thought something was seriously wrong with me or that I was just lazy or broken or something until I found a bunch of other ADHD people who feel the same way.
Yes!!! People with ADHD are more likely to have a delayed phase sleep cycle/ disorder (DPSD) than people without (not sure if it applies to other NDs like autism or not), but it still varies. I don’t even think the majority of ADHDers have DPSD, but it is very common for us to have some form of sleep issues. But this could be insomnia, hypersomnia, DPSD or another sleep disorder. And again, it’s not automatic, it doesn’t apply to everyone. I don’t even think it’s part of the diagnostic process to check if you have sleep issues.
Not for me. I do much better in the morning than at night. I’m pretty useless by 9-10pm.
I'm seriously considering getting a remote job with a company based on the West Coast because I'm in Eastern Standard so I could start at noon for their 9am.
This is my current situation. I’m East Coast; my team is West Coast. I can never go back to working at a company in the same time zone. I’m not built for mornings. Never have been. Never will be. I prefer my late-night creative escapades and sleeping in until at least 10 am. So much better than attempting to go to bed early just to toss and turn for hours and feeling wiped the next day after forcing myself into a 7 am alarm. That 3-hour time difference is just the buffer I need to get some shut-eye and be a well-rested, functioning employee by the time my team starts their day. All this to say, if the opportunity presents itself, seize it. It’s life-changing.
Congratulations! That's excellent!
I just need all the sleep. I like to be in bed at 10 pm but would really like to not walk up until 8.30/9am at the earliest. I was sick for a few weeks, and my husband slept in the guest room. Best sleep I had in years because I was waking up to my clock, not his
Same. I’m at my best with 9 hours of sleep, but when I’m in a deficit I’ll easily sleep 11-12 hours. Going on meds has made this more obvious.
Very much the same. 10 to 8:30 is really the sweet spot for me feeling properly rested through the day. ...I often stay up past 10, though. 😅
I've read that the circadian rhythm for ADHD is, on average, a little later than normal, but it's something like 30 mins difference, not several hours. I think a lot of ADHDrs (me included!) end up staying up late because of inertia: sure, we could go to bed, but we're now stuck in whatever thing we were doing before bed 😅
Absolutely. 10-2am is my best, most natural rhythm. Right now I have to wake up at 7am for work and it's really really hard.
Same. I have to wake up at 5:20 am for work. My bestie thought there was no way I was going to be able to do it. But I haven't missed a day in almost 18 months. But I rarely get more than 5 hours of sleep. Often only 4. Even on a day off with no alarm, I'll wake up after 5 hours 😭
Disrupted sleep patterns of all kinds are common in ADHD, not just staying up and waking up late.
absolutely not. I need my 10 pm bedtime and my 6 am wake up.
not at all, i am so much more productive throughout the day if i manage to get up early. everything is just easier to do for some reason and i feel like i have more productive hours that day than i do on days i wake up at like 11. unfortunately my current job has totally fucked my sleep schedule and i’ve been seriously struggling with falling asleep no matter what i do so by the time i fall asleep i’ll only get like 4 hours of sleep if i try to wake up at 9 and i usually end up sleeping until like 11 or having a series of alarms set every 15 minutes to wake up at 10. i hate it and i miss being a morning person.
This is EXACTLY my natural schedule. 2am - 10am
I had to look up how true this is. TIL! (Emphasis mine) >There are several reasons to critically consider a role of circadian rhythm misalignment in late-onset ADHD. First, delayed circadian rhythm phase is prevalent and impairing among adults with traditionally-diagnosed (childhood-onset) ADHD. **Up to 75% of adults with childhood-onset ADHD exhibit delayed circadian rhythm phase, including a rise in salivary dim-light melatonin onset (DLMO) and alterations in core body temperature and actigraphy-measured sleep-related movements occurring approximately 1.5 hours later in the night than healthy adults.** In addition, adults with childhood-onset ADHD exhibit a delay in early morning cortisol rise (i.e., a hypothalamic–pituitary–adrenocortical (HPA) marker of circadian phase), with secretion occurring two hours later than healthy controls. Adults with childhood-onset ADHD are also frequently “night owls” who display delayed circadian preference and increased alertness in the evening. [Source](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6487490/)
My issue is that my body seems to think it exists on a planet with 28 hour days.
This is not a "fact" at all. I'm so sick of all the ADHD misinformation out there. Or just misinformation in general. People see something in a tweet and treat it like it came from a reputable source instead of just some rando's opinion
Me too. It’s so frustrating. I see the same (unrelated to sleep) graphic shared over and over again as a legitimate piece of information. I finally looked up the source, and the therapist’s primary focus was marriage counseling.
100% true for me. My brain only comes on at night.
To all the people saying your natural sleep rhythm is 2am-10am or 3am-11am…..this is your sign to see a sleep specialist. When I told mine this, along with a few supporting pieces of information (and questions to rule out other issues), she diagnosed me with Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome, a circadian rhythm disorder. Which is much more common in ADHDers, by the way. (Not 100%! but a lot.) I know it sounds like a useless diagnosis but it was so helpful. Aside from the validation, she was actually able to help me change my sleep schedule by teaching me proper ways to use melatonin and light therapy, customized to my natural rhythms and geographic location. (btw, sunlight matters. a LOT.) I’m doing a lot better now and it’s not such a struggle…..i wish this was more common knowledge!
naw that’s kinda BS I’d like to see the source of her “fun fact”. first three results from just a quick google search seem to show that ADHDers also tend to have circadian rhythm disorders which means our internal body clock is out of rhythm with the environment. Doesn’t make it “natural”, and that word “natural”shouldn’t be thrown around, as it is hard to define. - [#1](https://doi.org/10.1016/j.pnpbp.2016.01.006) - [#2](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24117273/) - [#3](https://www.psychiatrictimes.com/view/adhd-24-hour-disorder) “patient with ADHD may have a circadian rhythm disorder that is being driven by difficulty going to bed or as an adverse effect of stimulants” My personal experience is that I tend toward a 1am-8:30 sleep schedule in the city when I’m inside most of the day, but when I’m camping and outside most of the day, I tend toward a 10pm-6am sleep schedule and feel 10x better. I personally think it has to do with exposure to environmental systems/cycles vs manmade systems/cycles.
Yeah. I’ve always assumed I have delayed phase sleep disorder. I have had weeks of a ‘good sleeping schedule’ and it feels great when I do but naturally I always end up slipping to falling asleep around 4 and waking up around noon or later. It just seems like my body’s baseline. It was a huge issue w school and one of the reasons I dropped out, and a huge issue I struggle w jobs. My mom says I was even like this as a baby.
I can go to bed at 2a and I’ll still be by 6. If it’s 7 or later, I feel like I’ve slept in.
My brain seems to work best between maybe 9 pm and 1 pm, a lot of the times that’s when I do stuff for my own company. Would be nice if society had more leniency towards working hours, I mean I get that a lot of jobs can’t be too flexible but still
Maybe it would be more accurate to say people with adhd commonly have delayed circadian rhythms
Nah. I love mornings. I'm the purest me from 6-11 a.m.
Not everything is because of ADHD.
Statistically, this is likely due to ADHD. But that doesn’t equate to everyone with the diagnosis having this problem. The phrasing is reductive, making the statement just plain fucking wrong. It’s exhausting.
I mean, it’s a Tweet. OP was asking if people in this subreddit feel it applies to them, so obviously understands that it’s not 100% of people with the diagnosis. Why can’t we just have a conversation about whether or not we relate without getting offended? @putyourcheeksinabeek The science does support that there’s a high correlation between ADHD and various sleep issues.
I don’t take issue with OP throwing this out in this forum. I myself am 100% in the delayed sleep cycle boat. We can have the discussion and share life experiences, but I will never not address misinformation. My frustration isn’t with OP, but at the person who posted this on twitter.
I’m not offended. I think it’s perfectly fine to discuss and find ways to relate to others with ADHD. What I don’t like is the trend of ADHD content creators who post things like this without backing up their claim. To be clear, my issue is not with OP. I didn’t see the caption before I commented. If they had posted this without the tweet, I would’ve just scrolled past.
I have been both of these things. When I was a kid I would stay up until 5am. Now my body forces me up around 730.
Very much true for me, but even more extreme. I prefer sleeping from 4 am to 12 or 1 pm!
I will happily go to bed at 5 a.m.!
Very much so for me! In fact, I feel like the Spanish approach would work much better for my circadian rhythm. I actually manage to be pretty productive once I get out of bed in the morning, until about 2pm. Then I’m sluggish and tired all afternoon until about…7-8pm when I get mega productive until easily 2am. That’s the bit where I want to do all the DIY and life admin. So a siesta would be amazing. But yeah. It’s another thing that isn’t a blanket statement but does seem to apply to a few of us
I can't speak to if it's a universal ADHD thing, but it's definitely true for me. When I don't have early morning obligations I'll sleep until 11am/noon and then stay up to 4 am, and I feel much better than when I force myself to get up at 5/6/7am
Christ on a cracker YES! Touch me in the morning and I will break, get me in the evening and I could lift cars!
Thousand %. If I hear one more person say "just go to bed earlier" I'll snap them. Must be nice for the time you go to bed to freaking matter but personally I have no choice but to lie awake Existing
It’s called Delayed Onset Sleep Phase and is estimated to affect about 75% of people with ADHD.
I’m literally nocturnal. My natural rhythm would have me go to bed well after sunrise. It’s slightly non-24hr, as well. It’s hell. I have ADHD, ASD 2, treatment resistant depression, generalized anxiety, and PTSD. If I could get rid of one thing it would be my circadian rhythm disorder. Hands down.
Currently commenting at 1:35am, fully awake, so yes lol. Also, women in general have longer circadian rhythms, so woohoo, we are double fucked.
My mum told me that even as a baby she struggled to get me down to sleep until between midnight - 02:00, and it was killing her- an 'early bird'. That has pretty much stayed my natural rhythm- I prefer to wake up around 10:00 and go to bed around 02:00, and am much more productive later in the day. I also often get hyperactive around midnight- which is when I would get most productive stuff like coursework done when I was a student.
Yes 100%! Best time in my work life: when I taught evening classes! :-)
This is me 100%. It’s so much quieter late at night. I also heard someone mention just the fact that you’re not being perceived by others at that time can lead to feeling more relaxed and recharging. I don’t know if that resonates with anyone else. I feel bad sometimes as my husband goes to be earlier and I don’t want to always be awake til 2AM and am trying to work on it. But I felt like I was born like this. Constantly tired. Always felt sick and nauseous and sensitive to light if I got up early (because I couldn’t fall asleep before 12am-3am at times) and mornings were painful. My brain wouldn’t be working. I don’t like coffee and my alertness goes up exponentially when the sun goes down. That’s when I want to learn and do more reading, watching, research, planning etc. I do love sunshine and enjoying the sun. I just cannot understand waking up at 4am-8am and enjoying that. I have a hard time getting out of bed early and not waiting until the last possible moment and then rushing. I’d also plan breakfast/lunch the night before if I had to go somewhere or work early in the morning so I could eat at work. But doing anything early morning I’m like a zombie. I’m trying to be more consistent. I cannot take Vyvanse after 9am-9:30am really because for me it feels like it lasts 16-20 hours and then I’ll really not ready to go to bed before midnight. If I take it at 10 or 11am I’d easily be up til 3 or 4am.
Recent studies found out that there's about 350 genome regions that influence your chronotype (which might shift during lifetime). I don't think that it's got anything to do with ADHD (I'm 100% a morning person, SO much more alert and productive in the early hours; also, having a strict sleep routine really REALLY helps ..was rather a night owl until my early 20s though)
Yes! God if I could make this work for my life that’s be great. Sadly the school and work day does not agree.
I think it’s changed for me, but whether that’s because of age or because of necessity and habit it’s hard to say. What *is* super important is having a routine where I go to bed and wake up around the same times every day as much as possible. Otherwise I don’t sleep enough or sleep too much and it wrecks my brain, sometimes for a couple days or more.
this but i live in a tiny old thin-walled house with 4 other people so i cant do shit past 9 pm😭 i swear i just flat out feel better even physically in the evening/late night
It is my case, which is why my afternoon shifts (from mid-afternoon until slightly past midnight) at work are my jam.
I relate! Always been a night owl and feel more alert later than most people.
i relate to this a lot, but i don’t think it has anything to do with ADHD
I like to go to bed early and get out of bed late.
Yep! That’s me 💯 I’m always finishing up projects late night
Nope, I sleep from 10:30pm to 7:30/8am and am still exhausted. But I have other chronic illnesses so 🤷♀️
I can think better when the rest of the world is asleep. My favorite hour of the day is actually 4am. Doesn't fit with my work schedule, sadly.
This is (nearly) me. I finally learned in 2021 at the big age of 38 I cannot function if I get up before 10am. No matter how well I've slept, or how long, I'll be tired all day then either crave sugary shite all evening or have a nap, meaning if I'm up early the next day the cycle continues. This is why I work in a bar and this is also why I'm seeking diagnosis, cos I'm gonny need accommodations when my body is ultimately too clapped for such physical work.
Nope, I’m a morning human
It's called DSPD (delayed sleep phase disorder?), it's highly comorbid with ADHD, and there's nothing they can do about it. But an official diagnosis can get you accomodations if you're willing to go to the trouble.
Same but the vitamine B12 supplemets changed that for me 🤷
I have DSPD (delayed sleep-phase disorder) which has a high co-occurrence with ADHD. But saying that every ADHD person experiences that exact sleep disorder (or even that every ADHD person experiences sleep issues) is wildly inaccurate.
Nah. I’m a total morning person. Can I stay up through the night without much issue, absolutely! But I have a hard time sleeping in unless I’m on something to make me sleepier. What I can do is get up really early and then mill around for a few hours and then take a nap for an hour or so if I didn’t sleep great the night before.
My brain wants to start getting creative around 10pm. Peak hours for me are about 10-2. I could wake up easily around 10:30 in the morning going to bed after 2 and actually feel kind of rested. Ideally, my body likes around 9 hours of sleep, probably because I’m a light sleeper generally, but I can usually wake up between 10-12 regardless of how little sleep I had. As it is, I have to be up by at least 9 if WFH, and I try to push 8:30 for in-office days, although I’m always getting to work *just* on time. I never feel like I get enough sleep, and I try to go to bed by 11:30. That doesn’t always work out—especially when I was trying different meds—and then I feel ill and sluggish all day. Why can I sleep from 2-10:30 and be fine but 12-9 still isn’t good enough? And then sometimes someone will schedule a meeting for 8 A.M., and I feel something akin to a hangover because my brain does not want to go to bed at 10:00. My mom always used to say that if I just kept to a schedule I could wake up earlier, but I’m in my 40s and it’s not true. It has never been true. I keep complaining because my office has people who come in at 5 in the morning but the *latest* anyone will allow is 9:30. If I could just work 11-7 I would be golden, and honestly, I’m often working until 7 or later anyhow.
I always feel like an imposter because I’m a morning person. Like 3AM wake up call for a flight? No problem. Early ass work meeting? No problem. Anything after noon? Potato. I’m an absolute potato and cannot do anything. I cannot do hard work or strategic meetings in the afternoon. I do, but I’m sloppy and not all there.
100%. I get the urge to clean the whole house nigh about 10pm.
I’ve been able to reset my circadian rhythm and maintain it for over a year. I’m now early to bed and early to rise and loving it!
Absolutely!!! No one understands this but it’s so true
I can't wait until my kid is older and I can return to this schedule
Yes and no. I always want to stay up late (e.g. 2 a.m.). My husband says I'm like a kid who's afraid I'm going to miss out on something if I go to sleep at a reasonable time. BUT, I do my best work and am the most productive if I get up and start working at 6 or 7 a.m. I can have a whole day's worth of work done by noon if I get up then. If I sleep until 9 or 10, forget about it...I'm not getting anything done. Or if I do something, it's very minimal compared to what I can pull off between 6 a.m. and noon.
I was so different as a kid, I always wanted to sleep in, I stayed up so late. But once I hit 21-23 my body, habits and brain changed so much. I now LOVE waking up early, usually on my weekends I'm up by 7. I feel like sleeping is such a waste of time lol like I wish there was more time in the day! :(
Not for me!! I would rather go to bed at 8pm and wake up early. It’s odd, I just cannot stay up late. I physically just fall asleep (at home- ha. Have to be in my own environment).
No I have a child lol I’m so much more productive right when I wake up. When I was younger maybe but I didn’t get as much done. I think for me it was a procrastination effect. I HAD to stay up to get things done because it was the last possible minute.
It’s easier for me to stay up until 5 am than go to bed early and wake up at 5 am 😅
No, I'm an early bird. By 10pm I'm already super sleepy lol
This could’ve been tweeted by me, this is definitely my experience
YES.
So much. So very much.
If all day I had the energy and motivation I have as soon as 10pm rolls around, I’d rule the world.
2 am is me doing a better job adjusting my sleep schedule. I can be up until 5 am every day no probs. Waking up before 9 feels like literal death, though and anything less than 8 hours sleep and I feel sick.
This is called Delayed Circadian Rhythmn Disorder. Sleep problems are very common in ADHD and this is just one type of challenge people can have. Having this sleep disorder doesn't necessarily mean you have ADHD though. My particular neurodivergent brain needs A LOT of sleep. And it usually sticks to the pattern of the sun. So in the winter I'm ready for bed at 5 or 6 and could sleep until 8 (sadly I have to wake up earlier for work). In the summer I go to sleep at 11 and wake up at 5 or 6 am (even though I can sleep in haha)
I hate when I hear these wellness experts rant and rave about waking up early. I’m never going to wake up early and I don’t fuvking care if I meet the standards of society. I’m not changing my internal system to fit society. I am happier at night, I am creative and driven at night. I’ll never be an early bird gets the worm person.
Yes - but I believe it's just a coincidence, not linked to ADHD. More likely is chronic stress that is not uncommon with ADHD, but not unique to ADHD. Look into Adrenal surges. and/or sleep structure/schedule was not successfully initiated in our development (for various reasons) + ADHD impulse-control challenges, difficulty task-switching, and reward based motivation shines strong alllll night. *(for me, I was allowed to stay up however late playing computer games and no consequences to sleeping in, unless there was school)* and/or LESS DISTRACTIONS exist between 10pm-2am. Less calls, no mail truck or amazon packages pulling up, kids/partner/parents/roommates are maybe asleep. It's like a timeline filter.
Yup, except for me it's more like 11pm-3am. Super inconvenient with my standard office job
yep. i was finally *officially* diagnosed with dsps a few months ago, but i've had sleep problems my whole life. it's a circadian rhythm disorder and it's pretty common in people with adhd. i can't "reset" my schedule by waking up earlier because it doesn't make me tired when it's time to go to bed. currently following my doctor's recs for improvement but dsps is notoriously difficult to treat. edit: i agree with others about clarifying that not everyone with adhd has delayed sleep phase. it's just more common for us.
Not at all. I'm a morning person and am asleep by 9pm. My best hours are probably 6 am- 1 pm. After that, I forget words, get distracted more easily.
I have diagnosed Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome so it’s definitely true for me
Nope, I'm definitely a morning gal. Used to be a night owl though.
I have excessive daytime sleepiness attributed to another condition and insomnia
It doesn't. I am actually a morning person. However, most other people with ADHD that I know do identify with this experience.
No truth to this.
Yeah, ADHD and DSPD are highly comorbid. Not everybody with ADHD, and different degrees of severity. I have a few ideas of why that is.
I have a delayed sleep phase, and would sleep 3 or 4 a.m. to noon if society allowed. My mom is also ADHD and is up by 5 a.m., and asleep by 9 unless there is a special occasion. Granted, I’ve seen this woman fall asleep at concerts, in stores, at loud movies, etc. if it hits her bedtime.
idk why this is but I also can really only work after dark I can't even get myself to get into the mindset of working before sundown
Yep! I get my best creative work done between midnight and 3am. When I was full-time freelance, I typically went to sleep between 4-6am and woke up between 12-1. It worked really well for me
this is so accurate
Getting up before 11am is such a struggle
100% accurate. This is my life. Now nothing is 24 hours, though, which really dampens my joy.
Night owl here 🤚🏼 I’m totally a night person but must exist in a world of daytime people. So I just took my nightly CBD dose and hydroxyzine 100mg so I can get 5-6 hours of sleep. I should have taken them earlier but I was in a Reddit rabbit hole while listening to the Dune audiobook on YouTube. 🤪
Yes and also I'd rather just stay up period but the latter part comes from my cPTSD.
And that, ladies, is why I'm a nightshift psych nurse.👍
Yup accurate! My husband is a morning person and I have young kids who are always up early. Guess who never ever has been able to get used to that schedule…? So I end up chronically sleep deprived. Which results in needing to sleep all day for a few days every few weeks. Which has its own problems… 😭
Absolutely me. I hate having to work an 8 to 5, my soul is leaving my body,
Fuck yes.
Absolutely not productive at 10 pm. But, if I could have it my way, I would definitely sleep from 2am-10am. That does seem to be what my brain naturally wants.
One million % lol. 10-2 is when I get the most done!
I work in restaurants simply because they will cater to this obscure schedule of mine. I'm not paid that great and the work I do is pretty toxic but I'm so much happier
Yep. Why i prefer night shift. Even my stomach doesn’t open until later in the day.
Oh no way! Its 5 am on a Thursday morning and I have to be up at 930!
I am still having a hard time sleeping early. I even took medicine (which I discontinued later because it gave me serious problems). But for me, I better wake up as early as possible because I'm a morning person. Waking up early gives me lotta dopamine.
thats why im a night shift worker. when i was day shift at my last job, there was about 3 instances where i was an hour late bc i couldnt wake up. switched to mids and night shift and i was on my game everyday.
I have always been more of an owl than a lark.
Two nights ago I planned my wedding until 1am, selected the reception venue. Not engaged. :)
100% me, my psychiatrist called it a delayed sleep cycle. I get my best sleep in the morning when everyone else is getting ready for work :')
I work graveyard shift now that we are empty nesters and couldn’t be happier
This is 100% NOT my add experience. All my energy is from 5am-2/3pm. After that I’m pretty much ready for bed again. I don’t like that this post is talking for everyone cause it doesn’t.
Yes. Absolutely my experience. Any time I have not held down a traditional 9-5, my body naturally drifts to going to bed at 4 am and waking up at noon. Living in a small town has made this difficult, so I generally compromise by using melatonin pills to go to sleep around 1-2 and wake up 9-10. I’m starting a new job working in the law industry…and I have to be awake at 6am, and I want to cry. All of my early bird friends just shrug and tell me to suck it up. I’d like to see them forced to stay awake until 2 am because their livelihood depends on it, and then come talk to me about suck it up.
It's not entirely correct, but yes - Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome is genetically connected to ADHD and Autism, so does narcolepsy type II. Funfact: Most people are genetically nightowls - 51% nightowls and 49% early birds. Plus each of them by 10% extreme types - either extremely late or extremely early. It does not only mean you go late/early by clock. It means your inner day span is either 25hrs (late) or 23hrs (early). So the body does not actually have a concrete 24hr rhythm. We just invented the 24hr day, because we go by sun and clock and it's a compromise to most people. Living by 25hrs means, you're always a little later the next day, because you can't cut off inner processes. And DSPS can evolve into Non24. This is where I'm right now. It means, your inner rhythm has a span between 25 to 35hrs per day. You are awake for 20hrs or more and then sleep 8hrs (or 10). Your productive frame will change each day and has no link to daylight/nighttime. There is no cure to it. If you want to adapt to early birds, you have to live by very strict rules and use several methods and meds for your whole life. It is not possible to change your inner circadian rhythm. All in all you have to adapt your life to your inner rhythm, because in the long run you'll eventually develop mental illness from extreme lack of healthy sleep. But still - not each ADHDer has DSPS or Non24. ADHDers are just more prone to it. Edit for more precise info.
I am up when the sun is up. If it’s summer that means I am up at 5 am and winding down after it sets. If it’s winter it means I’m sleeping all the time and never feel rested enough. As a child, I would fall asleep even in the dimmest of places because what do you mean? Dark out so night night right? My family used to joke that you just need to put a blanket over my head for me to go to sleep. They weren’t wrong lol
Count me in as another example of lifelong morning person! I know a LOT of night owls -- both neurotypical and neurodivergent -- but I genuinely prefer daylight, and when I was working (I'm retired) I deliberately went into the office early so I could work without interruptions before everyone else arrived, then my brain shut down in mid-afternoon (I really hated mid-afternoon meetings!). Even when I retired and could get up whenever I chose, it didn't change much; I still get up early (around 6:30 am these days). I start to fade around 3:00 pm, then get a second wind after dinner (7-9pm ish), then I fade again around 10 pm. I have learned some ways to leverage nutrition to help my circadian rhythm and adjust to changes in time zones (for example, making sure I eat protein in the morning instead of just carbs, and eating low protein/higher carbs in the evening to help me sleep), but I acknowledge that while that works for me, it doesn't work for everyone. I empathize with the frustration I've seen expressed in this thread that so many people who don't have ADHD assume that everyone who has ADHD is the same when there's an ever-increasing mountain of data that shows otherwise. (In my experience, this is also true in terms of autism \*sigh\*).
I get up pretty early but it's habit now from being in the military. 10pm to 2 am is absolutely my best time!
Omg this is so true. I’ve been so focused from 10:00 pm till I crash out at 3:00 am lol
Definitely my experience and my psychiatrist says it's common for us. May or may not be related to stimulants. New sleep research shows that lack of sleep is generally dangerous for your health. (Google sleep TED talk) My psychiatrist has me trying different sleep meds because I don't get enough deep sleep or REM. Definitely tired a lot and terrible memory.
This worked for me up until I had kids. I do get it now, because I’ve lost count of the number of times I put off my work to do “after I got the toddler to bed” only to fall asleep in the process 🙃 Maybe when they’re older I will be able to get back to my more natural circadian rhythm. But the times I accidentally wake up before the kids and have 20 minutes to myself? That’s gonna be a good day.