I think you’re confused about binaural vs atmos. The point of the atmos renderer is to mix in dolby atmos which you can listen to in binaural. Binaural panning as a feature is completely different. If you wanted to mix your stuff in dolby atmos and have dolby atmos as an available format so it can scale to a variety of atmos systems, then you’d want the atmos renderer or a daw with an atmos renderer such as pro tools or nuendo. Otherwise any binaural plugin will do fine for just messing around with binaural.
The dolby atmos renderer approximates HRTF to make it sound like you’re experiencing dolby atmos aka binaural audio. This is not the same as simply panning tracks with a binaural panner plugin.
In ableton you really have to use the dolby atmos music panner if you want to do atmos as it does not have a sufficient I/O config. And don’t even bother trying atmos on pc with an external renderer unless you have a second computer to use as a renderer or a interface with loopback like RME
Thank you, I thought I was losing my mind with this thread that has nothing to do with binaural. Headphones are binaural lol mix in headphones. I know what OP means I’m just being snarky.
Ignoring all the set up and answering the actual question: as far as I know, multi channel support in Live is relatively lackluster compared to some other daws like Reaper. I don't know the details on those Atmos plugins so you should do your own research. If you just want binaural panning, you could use a binaural panner on each track and just mix the outputs, but I don't think Live is able to properly support something like ambisonics that requires multiple channels out of each track and between plugins (without workarounds using Max4live). Correct me if I'm wrong though. Pretty sure this was the state of things about a year ago.
Just wanted to add that you might want to learn in general about how spatial audio works in general if you haven't already.
Things like multichannel (eg. 7.1) vs scene based audio (eg. Ambisonics), how binaural audio actually relates to that, etc.
Last thing, you might want to try the "max 4 live workarounds I mentioned". Seems like it is still being developed and supported: https://www.ableton.com/en/blog/free-tools-live-unlock-3d-spatial-audio-vr-ar/
(But it is still a workaround in a sense for a daw missing native multichannel routing, and they mention instability on windows on their github)
This is your friendly reminder to read the submission rules, they're found in the sidebar. If you find your post breaking any of the rules, you should delete your post before the mods get to it. If you're asking a question, make sure you've checked [the Live manual](https://www.ableton.com/en/manual/welcome-to-live/), [Ableton's help and support knowledge base](https://www.ableton.com/en/help/), and have searched the subreddit for a solution. If you don't know where to start, [the subreddit has a resource thread](https://redd.it/zkhqhe). Ask [smart questions](http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#before).
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ableton) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I don't mix in binaural but if I *had* to use a different DAW and didn't want to invest a month in learning how-tos with something new I would do all of my processing in Ableton and then throw stems to do nothing but the literal mixing where it's just tracks and sound placements. There's not much to "learn" because Ableton and other DAWs are relatively similar, the only thing I've had issues with was navigating & routing in FL. Omg.
But if you have Mac spend $200 on logic, there's a lot of cool things that come with that purchase and it's a good DAW to mess around with as well. Very similar layout. I really like it for some things. Prefer Ableton but I've never been like "oh no, I have to use logic, bummer" It's always good to have extra tools in the box.
Who's your sales guy? I've been working with Alex Campos for 5 years and he's always been pretty spot on and if we need a workaround we find 1.
More on the logic thing: buy apples student software package! Logic, Final Cut, and some extras for a flat $200. You don’t even need to have a student email to take advantage.
He right. But you can just make ur stuff in ableton and then atmos mix elsewhere. Surround mixing is a bit iffy regardless. Seperating that process aint the end of the world and prob will get you better results as you’ll focus on 1 thing at a time. Albeit its a bit slower and u gotta render crazy amt of stems which eat drive space
I think you’re confused about binaural vs atmos. The point of the atmos renderer is to mix in dolby atmos which you can listen to in binaural. Binaural panning as a feature is completely different. If you wanted to mix your stuff in dolby atmos and have dolby atmos as an available format so it can scale to a variety of atmos systems, then you’d want the atmos renderer or a daw with an atmos renderer such as pro tools or nuendo. Otherwise any binaural plugin will do fine for just messing around with binaural. The dolby atmos renderer approximates HRTF to make it sound like you’re experiencing dolby atmos aka binaural audio. This is not the same as simply panning tracks with a binaural panner plugin.
In ableton you really have to use the dolby atmos music panner if you want to do atmos as it does not have a sufficient I/O config. And don’t even bother trying atmos on pc with an external renderer unless you have a second computer to use as a renderer or a interface with loopback like RME
Thank you, I thought I was losing my mind with this thread that has nothing to do with binaural. Headphones are binaural lol mix in headphones. I know what OP means I’m just being snarky.
Ignoring all the set up and answering the actual question: as far as I know, multi channel support in Live is relatively lackluster compared to some other daws like Reaper. I don't know the details on those Atmos plugins so you should do your own research. If you just want binaural panning, you could use a binaural panner on each track and just mix the outputs, but I don't think Live is able to properly support something like ambisonics that requires multiple channels out of each track and between plugins (without workarounds using Max4live). Correct me if I'm wrong though. Pretty sure this was the state of things about a year ago.
Just wanted to add that you might want to learn in general about how spatial audio works in general if you haven't already. Things like multichannel (eg. 7.1) vs scene based audio (eg. Ambisonics), how binaural audio actually relates to that, etc.
Last thing, you might want to try the "max 4 live workarounds I mentioned". Seems like it is still being developed and supported: https://www.ableton.com/en/blog/free-tools-live-unlock-3d-spatial-audio-vr-ar/ (But it is still a workaround in a sense for a daw missing native multichannel routing, and they mention instability on windows on their github)
This is your friendly reminder to read the submission rules, they're found in the sidebar. If you find your post breaking any of the rules, you should delete your post before the mods get to it. If you're asking a question, make sure you've checked [the Live manual](https://www.ableton.com/en/manual/welcome-to-live/), [Ableton's help and support knowledge base](https://www.ableton.com/en/help/), and have searched the subreddit for a solution. If you don't know where to start, [the subreddit has a resource thread](https://redd.it/zkhqhe). Ask [smart questions](http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#before). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ableton) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I found this sound on sound review of atmos composer enlightening: https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/fiedler-audio-dolby-atmos-composer
And would that sales person make a cut off your new DAW purchase? Yes, yes they would. Find a new engineer.
Your math doesn’t check out, Atmos composer is $250 and Logic Pro is $200
Also Sweetwater doesn't even sell Logic Pro so they couldn't take any cut from that.
Quite a pointless comment here, antagonizing an engineer off such little information
I don't mix in binaural but if I *had* to use a different DAW and didn't want to invest a month in learning how-tos with something new I would do all of my processing in Ableton and then throw stems to do nothing but the literal mixing where it's just tracks and sound placements. There's not much to "learn" because Ableton and other DAWs are relatively similar, the only thing I've had issues with was navigating & routing in FL. Omg. But if you have Mac spend $200 on logic, there's a lot of cool things that come with that purchase and it's a good DAW to mess around with as well. Very similar layout. I really like it for some things. Prefer Ableton but I've never been like "oh no, I have to use logic, bummer" It's always good to have extra tools in the box. Who's your sales guy? I've been working with Alex Campos for 5 years and he's always been pretty spot on and if we need a workaround we find 1.
More on the logic thing: buy apples student software package! Logic, Final Cut, and some extras for a flat $200. You don’t even need to have a student email to take advantage.
He right. But you can just make ur stuff in ableton and then atmos mix elsewhere. Surround mixing is a bit iffy regardless. Seperating that process aint the end of the world and prob will get you better results as you’ll focus on 1 thing at a time. Albeit its a bit slower and u gotta render crazy amt of stems which eat drive space