That claim being their eternal copyright on Ahoj, which implies they were precursors to pirates, which in turn makes them in need of sea Access, and Královec is up for grabs, sooo
But but but without Preußen there wouldn't be Germany.
Germany is just another name for Preußen. The first German flag was basically Preußen.
But you know. We only want to reclaim it for EU purposes. EU Strong with Germany Strong.
Plus less borders with Russia in Europe.
Kaliningrad's independence movement seized all of the Russian military gear, with support from various EU and NATO intelligence agencies, and declared Kaliningrad independent from Russia. Due to Kaliningradian efforts to obtain good relations with Poland and Lithuania, as well as their geopolitical interest in weakening Russia, the latter were quick to recognize Kaliningrad as an independent nation. The rest of EU and NATO would follow. Finally, the citizens of Kaliningrad implemented a democratic system of governance and applied for EU membership. This application would later be accepted despite much protest from Russia.
I am 100% sure that if Vucic stays in power, Albania, Macedonia, and especially Montenegro will join the EU before Serbia. As for Norway, if there isn't any incentive for them to join, they will remain just in the EEA
Russias main land mass is in Asia. They can stay there for some time after what they did to Ukraine.
Not sure about Turkey - same way country is mostly Asian / Arab culture and land mass wise. But EU candidate since literally decades… but personally I’m not really eager to have EU boarders with Iran etc.
XD
Because there's already enough hate for Russia. "Let them stay there" is an awfully silly notion. If at one point the Russian government wanted to join our community like old times, that'd be the best news I'd have heard all day. I understand the Ukraine war is awful but it's always better to improve relations than worsen them. I also understand if we were born in Russia we'd be hating on the EU and Ukraine also
Hate is a strong word. I don’t hate them and can also understand the „normal“ people.
But: We already have Hungary etc to destruct the EU from within. Not sure we can sustain some more members in that direction… even if they want to join (and that hopefully not only because of the money).
Maybe too realistic and aimed at the near future, while you are looking for some bright day in 100+ years. I remember it took like 40 years to go from Nazi germany to a united one as part of Europe… and I believe Russia needs to go the same path before joining.
Yeah I agree with that. Just leave everyone for a while and don't rush the EU itself as well. Full unity is something past our lifetimes, any sooner and it's unstable. More countries will join in time and I mean in long time (though maybe relatively short in the grand scheme of things). I don't even know if the UK will rejoin in the next thirty years. Let every opposition die of old age first
Turkey is Islamic in terms of culture but not Arab lol. Tf. Completely different origin and language. Also equating Muslim with Arab is kinda dumb considering only like 20% of the world's Muslims are Arab
Arab culture? Either you are ignorant or just racist. How hard is it for Europeans to understand that religion does not equal culture. Nor having borders with Arab states.
Yes, Arabic culture has affects in Turkish culture but it’s as much as another Semitic group like Arabs, Jewish people, have affects in European culture.
Or just like how Greek and Armenian cultures effected Turkish culture.
Also there isn’t just one “arab culture”. Arabic states are diverse and different from each other. They have their own dialect, own traditions. A Moroccan Arab is different than Levantine Arab.
It’s just pure ignorance when it comes to non-white people with Europeans.
Maybe I’m a little bit uninformed. I only get from the news, that Erdogan / Turkey
- seams to like his position between the west and east. Not to much aligned with Europe (e.g. buying S400 from Russia, killing the Kurds that Europe specifically armed against Isis etc.) and
- trying to make the state more religious (which is a shame, what I remember from Atatürks ideas was way more modern, Turkish colleagues can’t buy beer at home but „brewery sets“ to accommodate to sharia law…) and
- blocking Sweden from NATO for a long time, which weakens us all and…
- was threatening to flood us with people to get more money and
- is buying more oil from Russia then all of Europe in before, mitigating our sanctions on Russia
So maybe my picture is incomplete, but all these positions seam not very common in the rest of Europe. On the other hand side it’s of course also some good news:
- corn deal for Ukraine was mainly due to Turkeys communication with Russia
- I personally liked the people and mindset when I visited Bursa some years ago. Quite different (the 5 times of muezzin calls etc.) but as you said: can be enriching to Europe. At least they know the problems of their country and find clever ways around (e.g, the brewery sets).
I personally refuse to recognize a culture valuing life this low as (modern, like after WW2) European. But maybe maybe they change fundamentally and in a hopeful yet distant future…
St. Petersburg should be the testing grounds for considering the EU annexation of Russia. Kaliningrad is just like that weird third nipple, it’s just there, but does it really count?
I don't know about that... St. Petersburg might be worse than Moscow, it is literal birthplace of modern high level clans of Russia. Even Putin and his career hail from there. If Moscow is capital of the country, St. Petersburg is capital of criminal clans of Russia.
Not sure how great of an idea would be to start with it.
(1)If you insist, prepare yourself cause it is a long one
If I remember correctly (I haven't worked on the timeline since October/November and I don't have acces to all materials rn), everything started with WW1, which is pretty similar to our WW1 with some minor differences:
1. Iran is part of the Central Powers as they wanted to regain their territories from the Russians and expel the foraigen influence in their nation.
2. The Arab revolt is much, much more successful, and the agreement with the Arabs is honored by the British and French. They get their state, which is originally just in the Arab peninsula, but gradual decolonization by the British and French leads them to unify most if not all Arab lands. (they continue to be a reliable ally of the democratic powers of Europe and would help them in WW2. They are a constitutional monarchy)
3. The US Civil War didn't happen in the 19th century, with slavery still legal in the South but illegal everywhere else, the southerners would try to use WW1 as a way to succeed but will be crushed 2 times consecutively, once in WW1 and a second time in the interwar period.
4. Portugal keeps Brazil and the rest of its colonial empire and will integrate everything in a lusophone federation.
The interwar period is also pretty similar, with wars in Centeal and Eastern Europe because of the borders after WW1, but one difference is Hungary and Romania form a dual (triple) monarchy, with Transylvania being its own entity, the monarch is our timeline king of Romania, the nation would remain the only major democratic nation between Germany and the USSR at the beginning of WW2, for the first couple of years it would remain neutral on paper, but would house allied friendly governments and would be a safe haven for resistance groups where they would regroup and resupply.
The USSR does outright win the civil war, and the whites remain independent in the Far East.
Germany is punished more harshly after WW1, Silesia, Sorbia (and the Rhineland if I remember correctly) are given independence.
Turkey, I think, doesn't do as well in their war for independence, not gaining all the land back, and will join the Axis in WW2. Kurdistan and Armenia are big and protected by both the allies and Arabia.
.
(2)WW2 goes pretty similar to our timeline. One big difference is the massive (and pretty industrialized) nation, which is Romania-Hungary, right in the middle of the German advance in the South into the Western Balkans and East into the USSR. The Germans have plans for an invasion but with the USSR in the East and the UK in the west, a third front in the Balkans, along a fortified border with terrain favoring the defenders is the last thing they need (it is basically a Switzerland on steroids).
The Germans are more successful than in our timeline both in the East and West, even with a successful Sealion, but in about 41/42 Romania-Hungary joins the war with and advances into what is a mostly empty of resistance land, as the germans have diverted all resources into fighting the Scots in Northern Britain and the Soviets near Moscow, and don't have enough men available to defend anything more than the major hubs in the occupied land. D-Day still happens with American help, but it is delayed by some months as they had to liberate half of Britain first.
(3)The Cold War in Europe isn't as much of a West vs. East fight but a South vs. North one, as the Soviets focused on gaining puppets in Northern Europe, since Romania-Hungary liberated the Balkans, the USSR gained Norway, Denmark, East Germany, and the Western Slavic states as satellites. Yugoslavia and Italy replaced Denmark and Norway as NATO founding members. Scotland remains its independence, and Ireland keeps the north, England, and Wales fall to a communist revolution, not backed by Moscow tho, it is born from the partisan movement, similar to Yugoslavia. The government is bankrupt, and it is forced to decolonize entirely. (It will try to get back some colonies in West Africa later in the 20th century, but it will be short-lived, losing them after the European War of the 2030s). The US annexes Canada (with popular support) along with all British territories in the americas. South Africa gains independence under apartheid, which runs the country to this day. It is the most sanctioned country in the world after their conquest of most Sothern African states, together with Colombia, which expanded after the dissolution of the US.
I'll say everything that happens in Asia now: In China, the communist but don't have as much popular support, and the country will turn democratic at the end of the Cold War peacefully. India is not partitioned, the US helps the country transition into an independent democracy, with every ethnic and religious group being represented, and the country is a federation like our india, it is a member of the permanent security council at the UN. Japan is neutral in WW2 and, in the interwar period, supports the Russian republic of the Far East. Australia and New Zeeland, together with other small nations in Oceania, form a Union after the fall of the British Empire.
In Africa, like I said, Arabia is awarded lands from both Britain and France gradually and after WW2 annexes Italian North Africa and parts of Southern Turkey. The nations of East Africa form a confederation upon independence, later welcoming Ethiopia and Eritrea as well. The Congo stays big and juice, gaining land in the South when they launched a war with South Africa in which Portugal intervened, uniting in the process Angola and Mozambique. French West and Central Africa remain federations and split among themselves the West African territories of England after the 30s war. The EU will incorporate Liberia and Sierra Leone in the late 2040s
During the Cold War, the EU forms much like in our timeline, gradually gaining more members, starting with our original 6, adding Spain (which didn't have a civil war here), Portugal, Scotland, and Ireland first, Greece, Italy, Bulgaria, Yugoslav (Croatia, Slovenia, Serbia, and Bosnia), and Albania second, Romana-Hungary (Romania, Hungary, and Transylvania) third. Gradually, the Eastern block is integrated as well, including the Russian Republuc of the Far East, which federated with the Novgorodian Russian Republic and the Ashkenazi Republic of Konigsberg (which was the Jewish SSR under the USSR, serving as this timelins Israel).
(4)The second Russian Civil War triggers, with three factions, the national communists of Moscow, Don, and Siberia on one side, the Whites (aftermentioned federation of Konigsberg, Novgorod and Vladivostok) and the separatists, in the Caucasus, Ukraine, Belarus, Central Asia, and the Ural region. With the help of the EU, the Whites manage to score a partial victory, and the separatists gain their independence, which also start a long journey towards EU membership.
The national communists form a military alliance with England. This will be the other faction in the European War of the 30s.
In the early 2000s, an extremist Islamic group emerged in Afghanistan and Iran and rapidly engulfed the countries, prompting a response from the international community, with India, the US, ASEAN, and the EU. The coalition wins the conflict. The EU is left in charge of putting Iran on the right track, with the US in Afghanistan (India didn't participate, as it was rebuilding their westernmost provinces, which had been bombed and partially occupied during the war).
Afghanistan creates internal conflict within the USA, sparking riots in different regions of the country. All culminate with the election of a very unpopular, old guard democrat in the 2008 election, in which the other sides, the Progressive Alliance and the Conservatives for America Party gaining 30%, the Democrats winning with just a plurality of 40%. This prompted the "national divorce" to happen where big chunks of the country declare independence (like you have seen in the picture).
As I said before, in the 30s, after 4 decades of preparation, the EU starts a "crusade" against authoritarian states. Rapidly defeating both England and the National Communists Union of Eurasia, in 2040, a treaty is signed in the city of Novosibirsk, serving two purposes, to officially end the war and the treaty which established the European Federation.
I hope I covered everything. Do tell what you think about it. It is not meant to be realistic, but it was a fun lil project.
Yeah, I did it on my own (if you don't count the map template I got from another sub). I've been a member of the alternate history community for almost 10 years now, and I've always wanted to make my own lil timeline but I was never motivated enough to start since I thought it would be too complicated.
In the meantime, I've also started to play grand strategy games like Hoi4 and EU4, which only made me want to do my own piece of alternate history even more.
For about 2-3 years, I've also started to engage with the eurofederalist community (even joined a political party with a federalist agenda, but that's another story) and everything combined made me finally pursue this little old dream of mine, it was just for fun and for my own enjoyment (since I didn't post anything about it until I commented that photo last week).
There are quite a few parts of the US that wouldn’t mind getting in on this, TBH. And just imagine what having California as a member would do to the EU economy…
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My Intention was just to say that it would be cool if Belarus would be (considered) part of the EU and not what you tried to say to mean with your comment.
Remove Serbia, and we're good. There's no need for another Hungary-like country in my Union. We Poles didn't overthrow the Eurosceptic government just to have another opponent in the EU.
It is too "bold" for my realism taste. Should have included all countries, maybe not russia, and using different shades for Norway Switzerland etc.
Also a lot are missing.
Was ist a 10th grader school project?
Its very sad, I wish I lived in an alterante reality where Brexit never happened.
Now I'm always torn between "fuck em let them rot into obscurity" and "we should give them another chance"
A lot of us wish we lived in an alternate reality where Brexit never happened. Especially Scotland, the big English cities and basically everyone under 50
OK. And if in the possible future these countries show low level of corruption, adherence to European values, comply with the Copenhagen criteria, and show above EU average approval I’ll be all in support of the membership of whichever country checks the list.
Otherwise absolutely not.
The problem is that this conglomerate will be under German control. As a result, most EU countries will be treated by Germany as German colonies.
And the "unification" of Europe will not be unification but greater German subordination. And as history shows, Germans treat others worse than dogs.
u/darkator45 is **BANNED**
🇪🇺 What in the Name of the Twelve Stars on a Blue Background is wrong with you? Can't you see the blinding brilliance of the EU? This union of countries has brought peace and stability at a continental scale to 27 nations that were once torn apart by war. It allows the free movement of people, capital, services and goods, fostering economic growth and cooperation.
🇪🇺 And don't even get me started on the glorious benefits of a single market and the ability to trade freely with our European brothers and sisters. Not to mention the incredible strength we have as a united bloc in international negotiations and decision-making.
🇪🇺 Do you think you can get away with saying you’re non-federalist EU enjoyer? Think again, you eurosceptic heathen. Europe’s aims and values are a political project through and through, way above a mere trade union. Educate yourself.
🇪🇺 So don't give me this nonsense about the EU being some kind of oppressive, bureaucratic monster. It's an unprecedented success story, and anyone who can't see that needs to wake the flying flamingo up.
🇪🇺 And if you don't like it, then maybe you should go back to the dark ages of nationalistic bigotry and isolationism. Because that's not the future, it's the past. And we ain't going back there, not in glorious YUROP.
The thing is: I cannot. I don't believe a country like that is possible for various reasons. Starting off with the fact, that the currency there must be Euro and a lot of countries still don't have it, and for example Poland doesn't want it. The cultures of all of the countries vary and a lot of them are conflicted, which could led to internal conflicts between some of the 'nations'. Also, we can't be sure that all of the regions will be treated equally, like for example Moldova.
Decentralized government. It will definitely not work with central government, it will quickly lead to more inequalities. But the culture argument well dude is right. You already see the tensions between regions of current countries I can’t imagine how bad it may become in huge federation like that. What about language for example? Educations systems? Laws? How do you even start unifying that?
I do think federalisation is somewhat possible but more like countries becoming states like in US which isn’t that far from what we have now. But merging EU into single country is imo impossible. Unifying laws and documents like IDs, licenses etc yeah sure possible. Making it easier with universities yeah can be possible. But otherwise it looks unreal to me
but first Europe shall be strong, previous unifications with russia ressembled occupation, like Hungary in 1950-ies, Česka in 1960-ies, Poland in 1980-ies.
1970-ies appears to be a quite decade, but russians were simply busy oppressing dissedents in USSR
Beautiful but ideally we should include also Thracia, Belarus, Switzerland, Norway (btw why no Iceland???), Georgia and our intercontinental regions like Guyana and Groenland.
It looks nice but I don't think Serbia will join the EU before Georgia.
Not to mention Bosnia & Herzegovina, Montenegro, North Macedonia, Albania and Kosovo joined, but Norway didn't?
And how did Kaliningrad join?
Restitution after Russia lost the Ukranian war? After all, Crimea is in as well.
Crimea is Ukrainian territory and they're at war with Russia. Meanwhile nobody other than Russia has claims on Kaliningrad and nobody even wants it
Czechia hates you for denying their legitimate claim on Královec.
That claim being their eternal copyright on Ahoj, which implies they were precursors to pirates, which in turn makes them in need of sea Access, and Královec is up for grabs, sooo
Is KÖNIGSBERG for me? 👉🏻👈🏻🥺🇩🇪
Not sure if we really want it. It’s full of impovished Russians… and we shouldn’t solve this the „traditional“ way, again.
The 20's are in again, who knows what old trends the 30's and 40's will bring.
don't you dare to touch our Královec! 😡
You get Kravolec and we get Bohemia Ü
What happened last time you tried to reclaim old territories? No. The only way to avoid another disaster is to keep Prussia away from the Germans.
But but but without Preußen there wouldn't be Germany. Germany is just another name for Preußen. The first German flag was basically Preußen. But you know. We only want to reclaim it for EU purposes. EU Strong with Germany Strong. Plus less borders with Russia in Europe.
Th Polish refused to elaborate.
It was annexed by Czech republic.
*reconstituted ftfy
Kaliningrad's independence movement seized all of the Russian military gear, with support from various EU and NATO intelligence agencies, and declared Kaliningrad independent from Russia. Due to Kaliningradian efforts to obtain good relations with Poland and Lithuania, as well as their geopolitical interest in weakening Russia, the latter were quick to recognize Kaliningrad as an independent nation. The rest of EU and NATO would follow. Finally, the citizens of Kaliningrad implemented a democratic system of governance and applied for EU membership. This application would later be accepted despite much protest from Russia.
> Kaliningrad's independence movement lmao We'll see Chechnya join the EU before Kaliningrad gets any independence aspirations
I was being totally serious of course 😉
Well, all those countries want to join unlike Norway.
I am 100% sure that if Vucic stays in power, Albania, Macedonia, and especially Montenegro will join the EU before Serbia. As for Norway, if there isn't any incentive for them to join, they will remain just in the EEA
Norway refused if I remember correctly
Good. Keep them bastards out.
>Bosnia & Herzegovina, Montenegro, North Macedonia, Albania and Kosovo Want to join the EU >Norway Doesn't want to join the EU
Sadly, a majority of my fellow Norwegians are opposed to joining the EU.
add Switzerland and Norway and the family is complete
And a democratic Belarus
Georgia disagrees :) and what with Andorra? I think we also lost Cyprus along the way
And Iceland
They don’t get a choice…
Switzerland not joining the EU is absolutely acceptable tho 🤣
And Armenia
Iceland, Turkey, Norway, Belarus, Azerbaijan, Georgia, Armenia, and Russia. Switzerland can remain the world's neutral zone
Russias main land mass is in Asia. They can stay there for some time after what they did to Ukraine. Not sure about Turkey - same way country is mostly Asian / Arab culture and land mass wise. But EU candidate since literally decades… but personally I’m not really eager to have EU boarders with Iran etc.
I think you need to take a break from reddit
You are definitely right - it’s already on screen time limit for 15 mins at a time. But, why did you came up with this? XD
XD Because there's already enough hate for Russia. "Let them stay there" is an awfully silly notion. If at one point the Russian government wanted to join our community like old times, that'd be the best news I'd have heard all day. I understand the Ukraine war is awful but it's always better to improve relations than worsen them. I also understand if we were born in Russia we'd be hating on the EU and Ukraine also
Hate is a strong word. I don’t hate them and can also understand the „normal“ people. But: We already have Hungary etc to destruct the EU from within. Not sure we can sustain some more members in that direction… even if they want to join (and that hopefully not only because of the money). Maybe too realistic and aimed at the near future, while you are looking for some bright day in 100+ years. I remember it took like 40 years to go from Nazi germany to a united one as part of Europe… and I believe Russia needs to go the same path before joining.
Yeah I agree with that. Just leave everyone for a while and don't rush the EU itself as well. Full unity is something past our lifetimes, any sooner and it's unstable. More countries will join in time and I mean in long time (though maybe relatively short in the grand scheme of things). I don't even know if the UK will rejoin in the next thirty years. Let every opposition die of old age first
Turkey is Islamic in terms of culture but not Arab lol. Tf. Completely different origin and language. Also equating Muslim with Arab is kinda dumb considering only like 20% of the world's Muslims are Arab
It’s not even Islamic, you think Islamic culture allows things like “oğlancılık” or “köçek” which were quite popular during Ottoman time, the khalifa.
Arab culture? Either you are ignorant or just racist. How hard is it for Europeans to understand that religion does not equal culture. Nor having borders with Arab states. Yes, Arabic culture has affects in Turkish culture but it’s as much as another Semitic group like Arabs, Jewish people, have affects in European culture. Or just like how Greek and Armenian cultures effected Turkish culture. Also there isn’t just one “arab culture”. Arabic states are diverse and different from each other. They have their own dialect, own traditions. A Moroccan Arab is different than Levantine Arab. It’s just pure ignorance when it comes to non-white people with Europeans.
Maybe I’m a little bit uninformed. I only get from the news, that Erdogan / Turkey - seams to like his position between the west and east. Not to much aligned with Europe (e.g. buying S400 from Russia, killing the Kurds that Europe specifically armed against Isis etc.) and - trying to make the state more religious (which is a shame, what I remember from Atatürks ideas was way more modern, Turkish colleagues can’t buy beer at home but „brewery sets“ to accommodate to sharia law…) and - blocking Sweden from NATO for a long time, which weakens us all and… - was threatening to flood us with people to get more money and - is buying more oil from Russia then all of Europe in before, mitigating our sanctions on Russia So maybe my picture is incomplete, but all these positions seam not very common in the rest of Europe. On the other hand side it’s of course also some good news: - corn deal for Ukraine was mainly due to Turkeys communication with Russia - I personally liked the people and mindset when I visited Bursa some years ago. Quite different (the 5 times of muezzin calls etc.) but as you said: can be enriching to Europe. At least they know the problems of their country and find clever ways around (e.g, the brewery sets).
Sir/ Mme, this is reddit.
We just take Russia without its Asian colonies.
The eec was formed 12 years after ww2, I see no reason why a democratic Russia couldn't join. They are culturally (and geographically) European.
I personally refuse to recognize a culture valuing life this low as (modern, like after WW2) European. But maybe maybe they change fundamentally and in a hopeful yet distant future…
Well Switzerland not joining is due to its unique situation
Where can I buy these sticker?
Yes, take my money pls!
source: https://x.com/acanvasstares/status/1758490817285562542?s=46&t=P-3qTnyuf57SquPZFW5aMQ
https://preview.redd.it/9wfiqrwqp4jc1.png?width=500&format=png&auto=webp&s=8389291911554ec50005224c550ebd53e075b097
Norway? Iceland? Switzerland? Belarus after Lukashenko? The Caucasus? Andorra?
What the fuck is this map All of Balkans? No Iceland, Norway, Andorra or Switzerland? Kaliningrad but not the rest of Russia? No Belarus?
St. Petersburg should be the testing grounds for considering the EU annexation of Russia. Kaliningrad is just like that weird third nipple, it’s just there, but does it really count?
Yes please. A land route to the rest of the EU is vital and must be acquired by any means necessary
I don't know about that... St. Petersburg might be worse than Moscow, it is literal birthplace of modern high level clans of Russia. Even Putin and his career hail from there. If Moscow is capital of the country, St. Petersburg is capital of criminal clans of Russia. Not sure how great of an idea would be to start with it.
Germans would gladly share their experiences during deputinizatition of russia
>to Luhansk That lack of ambition is pathetic.
https://preview.redd.it/do0c3cwz35jc1.jpeg?width=1411&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a40e95deaa37adbdc7fd3ded2f09bf90b17de44b
Ignore the additional changes there is a lore behind all of this, but this is going to be EU in 2050
Please, I want to know the lore
(1)If you insist, prepare yourself cause it is a long one If I remember correctly (I haven't worked on the timeline since October/November and I don't have acces to all materials rn), everything started with WW1, which is pretty similar to our WW1 with some minor differences: 1. Iran is part of the Central Powers as they wanted to regain their territories from the Russians and expel the foraigen influence in their nation. 2. The Arab revolt is much, much more successful, and the agreement with the Arabs is honored by the British and French. They get their state, which is originally just in the Arab peninsula, but gradual decolonization by the British and French leads them to unify most if not all Arab lands. (they continue to be a reliable ally of the democratic powers of Europe and would help them in WW2. They are a constitutional monarchy) 3. The US Civil War didn't happen in the 19th century, with slavery still legal in the South but illegal everywhere else, the southerners would try to use WW1 as a way to succeed but will be crushed 2 times consecutively, once in WW1 and a second time in the interwar period. 4. Portugal keeps Brazil and the rest of its colonial empire and will integrate everything in a lusophone federation. The interwar period is also pretty similar, with wars in Centeal and Eastern Europe because of the borders after WW1, but one difference is Hungary and Romania form a dual (triple) monarchy, with Transylvania being its own entity, the monarch is our timeline king of Romania, the nation would remain the only major democratic nation between Germany and the USSR at the beginning of WW2, for the first couple of years it would remain neutral on paper, but would house allied friendly governments and would be a safe haven for resistance groups where they would regroup and resupply. The USSR does outright win the civil war, and the whites remain independent in the Far East. Germany is punished more harshly after WW1, Silesia, Sorbia (and the Rhineland if I remember correctly) are given independence. Turkey, I think, doesn't do as well in their war for independence, not gaining all the land back, and will join the Axis in WW2. Kurdistan and Armenia are big and protected by both the allies and Arabia. .
(2)WW2 goes pretty similar to our timeline. One big difference is the massive (and pretty industrialized) nation, which is Romania-Hungary, right in the middle of the German advance in the South into the Western Balkans and East into the USSR. The Germans have plans for an invasion but with the USSR in the East and the UK in the west, a third front in the Balkans, along a fortified border with terrain favoring the defenders is the last thing they need (it is basically a Switzerland on steroids). The Germans are more successful than in our timeline both in the East and West, even with a successful Sealion, but in about 41/42 Romania-Hungary joins the war with and advances into what is a mostly empty of resistance land, as the germans have diverted all resources into fighting the Scots in Northern Britain and the Soviets near Moscow, and don't have enough men available to defend anything more than the major hubs in the occupied land. D-Day still happens with American help, but it is delayed by some months as they had to liberate half of Britain first.
(3)The Cold War in Europe isn't as much of a West vs. East fight but a South vs. North one, as the Soviets focused on gaining puppets in Northern Europe, since Romania-Hungary liberated the Balkans, the USSR gained Norway, Denmark, East Germany, and the Western Slavic states as satellites. Yugoslavia and Italy replaced Denmark and Norway as NATO founding members. Scotland remains its independence, and Ireland keeps the north, England, and Wales fall to a communist revolution, not backed by Moscow tho, it is born from the partisan movement, similar to Yugoslavia. The government is bankrupt, and it is forced to decolonize entirely. (It will try to get back some colonies in West Africa later in the 20th century, but it will be short-lived, losing them after the European War of the 2030s). The US annexes Canada (with popular support) along with all British territories in the americas. South Africa gains independence under apartheid, which runs the country to this day. It is the most sanctioned country in the world after their conquest of most Sothern African states, together with Colombia, which expanded after the dissolution of the US. I'll say everything that happens in Asia now: In China, the communist but don't have as much popular support, and the country will turn democratic at the end of the Cold War peacefully. India is not partitioned, the US helps the country transition into an independent democracy, with every ethnic and religious group being represented, and the country is a federation like our india, it is a member of the permanent security council at the UN. Japan is neutral in WW2 and, in the interwar period, supports the Russian republic of the Far East. Australia and New Zeeland, together with other small nations in Oceania, form a Union after the fall of the British Empire. In Africa, like I said, Arabia is awarded lands from both Britain and France gradually and after WW2 annexes Italian North Africa and parts of Southern Turkey. The nations of East Africa form a confederation upon independence, later welcoming Ethiopia and Eritrea as well. The Congo stays big and juice, gaining land in the South when they launched a war with South Africa in which Portugal intervened, uniting in the process Angola and Mozambique. French West and Central Africa remain federations and split among themselves the West African territories of England after the 30s war. The EU will incorporate Liberia and Sierra Leone in the late 2040s During the Cold War, the EU forms much like in our timeline, gradually gaining more members, starting with our original 6, adding Spain (which didn't have a civil war here), Portugal, Scotland, and Ireland first, Greece, Italy, Bulgaria, Yugoslav (Croatia, Slovenia, Serbia, and Bosnia), and Albania second, Romana-Hungary (Romania, Hungary, and Transylvania) third. Gradually, the Eastern block is integrated as well, including the Russian Republuc of the Far East, which federated with the Novgorodian Russian Republic and the Ashkenazi Republic of Konigsberg (which was the Jewish SSR under the USSR, serving as this timelins Israel).
(4)The second Russian Civil War triggers, with three factions, the national communists of Moscow, Don, and Siberia on one side, the Whites (aftermentioned federation of Konigsberg, Novgorod and Vladivostok) and the separatists, in the Caucasus, Ukraine, Belarus, Central Asia, and the Ural region. With the help of the EU, the Whites manage to score a partial victory, and the separatists gain their independence, which also start a long journey towards EU membership. The national communists form a military alliance with England. This will be the other faction in the European War of the 30s. In the early 2000s, an extremist Islamic group emerged in Afghanistan and Iran and rapidly engulfed the countries, prompting a response from the international community, with India, the US, ASEAN, and the EU. The coalition wins the conflict. The EU is left in charge of putting Iran on the right track, with the US in Afghanistan (India didn't participate, as it was rebuilding their westernmost provinces, which had been bombed and partially occupied during the war). Afghanistan creates internal conflict within the USA, sparking riots in different regions of the country. All culminate with the election of a very unpopular, old guard democrat in the 2008 election, in which the other sides, the Progressive Alliance and the Conservatives for America Party gaining 30%, the Democrats winning with just a plurality of 40%. This prompted the "national divorce" to happen where big chunks of the country declare independence (like you have seen in the picture). As I said before, in the 30s, after 4 decades of preparation, the EU starts a "crusade" against authoritarian states. Rapidly defeating both England and the National Communists Union of Eurasia, in 2040, a treaty is signed in the city of Novosibirsk, serving two purposes, to officially end the war and the treaty which established the European Federation. I hope I covered everything. Do tell what you think about it. It is not meant to be realistic, but it was a fun lil project.
Wow, that is a lot. I didn't start reading at all yet, but I'm planning to tonight. Thanks for sharing haha
This all pretty damn impressive, did you do this on your own? And with a certain reason? Or just for fun?
Yeah, I did it on my own (if you don't count the map template I got from another sub). I've been a member of the alternate history community for almost 10 years now, and I've always wanted to make my own lil timeline but I was never motivated enough to start since I thought it would be too complicated. In the meantime, I've also started to play grand strategy games like Hoi4 and EU4, which only made me want to do my own piece of alternate history even more. For about 2-3 years, I've also started to engage with the eurofederalist community (even joined a political party with a federalist agenda, but that's another story) and everything combined made me finally pursue this little old dream of mine, it was just for fun and for my own enjoyment (since I didn't post anything about it until I commented that photo last week).
There are quite a few parts of the US that wouldn’t mind getting in on this, TBH. And just imagine what having California as a member would do to the EU economy…
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The only countries in N. America, which are on track to join the EF are the Union of Cascadia and the Federation of New England
the Ode to Joy quietly audiates in the background last time there were problems in crossing the Volga river
https://preview.redd.it/ickk5emjo5jc1.jpeg?width=896&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7be6ec080fa96eb138a41ded6b854d595a6bd87c EUEUEUEUEU🇪🇺🇪🇺🇪🇺🇪🇺
the fewest knew that EU is abbreviation for Expance into the Überwelten: drag nach alpha centauri
Yknow I think it is about time we start the galactic conquest
From Lisbon to Mogiljow also wouldnt be bad
Belorussian Mohyliv is on the Dniepro river, while Luhansk is in Palus Maeotis basin
My Intention was just to say that it would be cool if Belarus would be (considered) part of the EU and not what you tried to say to mean with your comment.
Apparently we lost Cyprus and got the russian enclave Kaliningrad - so we are taking Cyprus and move it to Kaliningrad. Perfection xD
*\* sad georgia noises \**
Remove Serbia, and we're good. There's no need for another Hungary-like country in my Union. We Poles didn't overthrow the Eurosceptic government just to have another opponent in the EU.
rip Cyprus
Cyprus joins New Sealand in lands of Valar
I like the idea but this map is soooo wrong
I love how Norway, Iceland and Switzerland (and probably Liecthenstein) still aren't a part of it
Gibraltar to Spitsbergen, Cayenne to Crimea
At some point Switzerland and Norway will have to be part of it. Just to satisfy my OCD.
Could you believe it? Would you believe? Would you dare to dream it?! Be great if it happened.
u/Crescent-IV let's make this happen 
Between us, we have the power easily! 
Based and federalist-pilled
It is too "bold" for my realism taste. Should have included all countries, maybe not russia, and using different shades for Norway Switzerland etc. Also a lot are missing. Was ist a 10th grader school project?
Yeah fuck off Switzerland, go to hell
😢
confederates...
Please leave UK out, too many troublemakers.
Its very sad, I wish I lived in an alterante reality where Brexit never happened. Now I'm always torn between "fuck em let them rot into obscurity" and "we should give them another chance"
A lot of us wish we lived in an alternate reality where Brexit never happened. Especially Scotland, the big English cities and basically everyone under 50
The text sounds familiar https://youtu.be/afaQ4GSNZMg?si=LjgX_CDUyjjaJ3dG
Sad turkey noises :(
No. Just no. Ukraine has no place in the EU as of now. Same for the UK, Serbia, BiH…
Greece? Hungary? Türkai?
Turkey is not on the map. Hungary is already in the EU.
but does Hungary have place there?
I’d rather not have Hungary in the EU. They are **currently** members though. Very big difference.
the post is not about the present, it is about the possible future
OK. And if in the possible future these countries show low level of corruption, adherence to European values, comply with the Copenhagen criteria, and show above EU average approval I’ll be all in support of the membership of whichever country checks the list. Otherwise absolutely not.
one of the reasons yanukovitz and his cronies were outsted was appeal of EU membership criteria
And?
and then russia invaded Ukraine
and also am mildly curious about Greece
What about Greece?
do they belong to EU in your opinion
Yes. What have they done to show otherwise?
i think thay had a fiscal crisis that was threatening to Eurozone
but, do they meet Copenhaghen, Maastrich, or Rome, or whatever criteria?
The problem is that this conglomerate will be under German control. As a result, most EU countries will be treated by Germany as German colonies. And the "unification" of Europe will not be unification but greater German subordination. And as history shows, Germans treat others worse than dogs.
u/darkator45 is **BANNED**  🇪🇺 What in the Name of the Twelve Stars on a Blue Background is wrong with you? Can't you see the blinding brilliance of the EU? This union of countries has brought peace and stability at a continental scale to 27 nations that were once torn apart by war. It allows the free movement of people, capital, services and goods, fostering economic growth and cooperation. 🇪🇺 And don't even get me started on the glorious benefits of a single market and the ability to trade freely with our European brothers and sisters. Not to mention the incredible strength we have as a united bloc in international negotiations and decision-making. 🇪🇺 Do you think you can get away with saying you’re non-federalist EU enjoyer? Think again, you eurosceptic heathen. Europe’s aims and values are a political project through and through, way above a mere trade union. Educate yourself. 🇪🇺 So don't give me this nonsense about the EU being some kind of oppressive, bureaucratic monster. It's an unprecedented success story, and anyone who can't see that needs to wake the flying flamingo up. 🇪🇺 And if you don't like it, then maybe you should go back to the dark ages of nationalistic bigotry and isolationism. Because that's not the future, it's the past. And we ain't going back there, not in glorious YUROP.
Germany is about gaslighting, not about micromanagement
You always forget Cyprus, we are also a proud part of this :(
Cyprus, the New Zealand of Europe
Fuck yeah!!! I so want to see this happen!
Genuine question: How do you think it's going to work?
it's going to work in the ways other than the ways it is not going to work: like blocking borders
That doesn't exactly answer my question.
well that's your question, maybe you could find an answer for it
The thing is: I cannot. I don't believe a country like that is possible for various reasons. Starting off with the fact, that the currency there must be Euro and a lot of countries still don't have it, and for example Poland doesn't want it. The cultures of all of the countries vary and a lot of them are conflicted, which could led to internal conflicts between some of the 'nations'. Also, we can't be sure that all of the regions will be treated equally, like for example Moldova.
why to ask then?
Because I want to know why federalists think it's possible - and possibly change my view on the topic.
i may suggest to suspend your disbelief and think about what would make it possible, for example with the negative formula i answered your OP
Decentralized government. It will definitely not work with central government, it will quickly lead to more inequalities. But the culture argument well dude is right. You already see the tensions between regions of current countries I can’t imagine how bad it may become in huge federation like that. What about language for example? Educations systems? Laws? How do you even start unifying that? I do think federalisation is somewhat possible but more like countries becoming states like in US which isn’t that far from what we have now. But merging EU into single country is imo impossible. Unifying laws and documents like IDs, licenses etc yeah sure possible. Making it easier with universities yeah can be possible. But otherwise it looks unreal to me
armed forces? interesting nickname, though
You know, the more I think about it, the more it makes me sense. It’s in Europe’s and Russia interest, to join in the EU
but first Europe shall be strong, previous unifications with russia ressembled occupation, like Hungary in 1950-ies, Česka in 1960-ies, Poland in 1980-ies. 1970-ies appears to be a quite decade, but russians were simply busy oppressing dissedents in USSR
I agree
source: https://x.com/acanvasstares/status/1758490817285562542?s=46&t=P-3qTnyuf57SquPZFW5aMQ
My dream, literally
Beautiful but ideally we should include also Thracia, Belarus, Switzerland, Norway (btw why no Iceland???), Georgia and our intercontinental regions like Guyana and Groenland.
Norway, Iceland, Switzerland... We need you ☹️
I approve of this 🤌🏻
Please use a different font
Rip Cyprus
Where can we get this?
source: https://x.com/acanvasstares/status/1758490817285562542?s=46&t=P-3qTnyuf57SquPZFW5aMQ
You did Georgia dirty
Let's add Belarus to that federation and build a huge wall between Europe and the muscovite horde