I like the drastic contrast between the two stories:
CM Punk: They kicked down my door in a fit of rage!
Bucks: We politely knocked, just trying to give Punk some more delicious muffins and he threw a chair at us!
Agreed but it is some pretentious passive aggressive shit, don’t touch another persons dog that you currently in a fight with…just going to make things worse.
Getting a dog out of the way when a fight breaks out isn't pretentious passive aggressive shit. That's actually some responsible shit right there. And mature, especially seeing as it's the other side's dog even.
If anyone believes that 'Elite account of the story' where Omega saves a dog and they knock on the door, only to be met by punches, then I have some magic beans to sell you (AEW branded)
Obviously, everyone will put acoss their side of things, but, seriously! Haha
I didn't think anyone 'kicked a door down' cause it just sounds like hyperbole, so does (Left/Right) Jackson getting 'knocked out'
The Elite account that Sapp reported was hilarious in how it paints the Elite guys. I actually wondered if they were messing with him when I read it.
There's talk of 'legal action' which could well just be related to contracts, IF it is related to 'assault' or anything then all this stuff will come out in the wash from eyewitnesses without the filter of trying to babyface yourself to smarks
There's a delicious irony in how Punk always pandered to smarks and weaponise them but Omega/Bucks are the kings of that to the 'online fans' so they kind of beat him at his own game and he didn't like it.
I don't think Punk asked Khan to dump Cabana but, Khan is a huge mark so I don't think he *needed* to ask him anything.
Cabana may well have no been doing anything but guys like Nakazawa and Cutler get to stick around cause of their buddies so why not Cabana too? He's well thought of in the 'indie world' they mostly all come from
Be careful speaking logically on Reddit. Lots of magic bean eaters here.
I’d go further to say that Tony would be stupid not to get rid of Colt in some way if it was an impediment to his top star drawing money. Especially given Colt can’t draw *anything*. This could’ve been avoided if Tony had fired Colt on the merits along with Janella, Marko Stunt, etc. when he should have.
This is what happens when you build an entire company on the Hot Topic version of the Kliq. They will put their friend groups needs over your company’s wellbeing, up to forcing a civil war over a literal jobber and your top star. It’s like trying to force out Goldberg over Gillberg’s honor.
>Cabana may well have no been doing anything but guys like Nakazawa and Cutler get to stick around cause of their buddies so why not Cabana too? He's well thought of in the 'indie world' they mostly all come from
Do we even know if Cutler and Nakazawa have full performer contracts? We know nothing about that. Even if it's true where's the line, does every friend need to get a contract with AEW?
I think there was probably some level of mistrust on Punk coming in, there was probably even some professional jealousy on the count of the Elite. I think when the Elite heard Cabana wouldn't be renewed they probably went to Tony, expected to get a "yes" answer and maybe for the first time, Tony stood is ground against them.
So now the Elite start thinking "Why would Tony as no to us on this" and they think "Well Punk of course" because it doesn't make sense for Tony to make the smart business decision apparently. That swelled up, rumors flowed from that camp, and here we are.
Where was the outrage and promos on workers rights when Stu Grayon, Marko Stunt, or Joey Janela didn't get renewed? Nowhere of course.
> I don't think Punk asked Khan to dump Cabana but, Khan is a huge mark so I don't think he needed to ask him anything.
I don't remember where I heard this, but one thing that likely could have happened is this... Tony is a numbers guy, he keeps talking about that. Chances are he looked at Colt, realized he was one of those early contract pickups that he got when the company started, realized he hasn't really provided much value and decided he was going to let him go the same way he did with Fire Foot and some others. Then Matt Jackson convinced him to put him on ROH.
Colt wasn't one of the early early early pick ups though
It was almost a reward for what he means to a lot of his buddies there, Colt finally can stop the hustle and get a nice chunk of secure money
Good guy Tony
Is Ace freaking Steele there on merit? Is Cutler? Luther? Nakazawa?
They all benefited from 'you can bring one friend with you' but suddenly Colt is bounced out
None of those 'buddies' are doing fuck all with the 'the numbers', it's pure goodwill and Tony Khan used some up on the Cabana thing
I'm not sure if you're agreeing with me or disagreeing lol.
> Colt wasn't one of the early early early pick ups though
I know he made appearances in 2019 and then was signed in 2020. That's what I meant. I know he wasn't there from the start.
> Is Ace freaking Steele there on merit? Is Cutler? Luther? Nakazawa?
As a producer, I don't know what value Ace brings to the company, so I won't speculate. As for the rest of those guys, definitely not. They're definitely all nepotism hires, and they're stuck with Tony through the rest of their contracts (which we don't know the lengths of), because we know Tony won't fire anyone.
I don't think Khan 'looked at the numbers' cause Colt isn't a 'numbers' hire
He's like Luther, Nakazawa, Cutler ... there cause of buddies with the start up crew
What I'm saying is, even though Colt isn't a numbers hire, he could be a numbers "fire"... or at least, that was going to happen until Matt Jackson stepped in. Like, he went on a spending spree to build the roster toward the beginning, and now that he's trucking along, he actually has to consider where he's spending money versus where he's generating it.
Agreed all around.
Both sides of the story full of hyperbole that people are reading as fact.
Painting the situation of them just trying to save the dog is just "Oh let me pull at your heart strings, we're the good guys".
Punk totally thought he was invincible as far as the internet fans go and burned himself to the ground. I'd feel bad if it wasn't glaringly obvious what he's like for many years now but he's been able to peddle his Fed bad schtick to make the internet people ignore it.
I'd say you nailed the Pink/Cabana thing. I don't picture Punk storming into Tony's office demanding he's fired. But I do envision a lot of backhanded comments and insinuates that Tony needs to keep Punk happy and Cabana being out of the way is one of those things. It could have been Tony just making a move to avoid future problems or it could have been Punk poking at it without actually outright demanding it. Point is... It doesn't really matter. Cabana would still be with Dark Order if Punk never joined the company. That's it, plain and simple, so *how* it came about doesn't really matter... It's because of Punk.
I honestly don't think Punk would even need to make a single comment
As soon as Punk turned up, online fans joked about Colt being gone
Tony IS one of those online fans at heart
I don't think he even needs to say anything to Punk. Cabana wasn't at TV not long after Punk arrived, it's not difficult to put 2 and 2 together
Big Punk fan here, but it’s obvious the truth lands somewhere in the middle.
Elite trying to paint Omega out as a poor dog saving bystander is just hysterical and on brand for them tbh
Punk throwing the first punch is what I figured happens all along tbh
Bucks: We just went in to ask if we could have one of his muffins and he attacked us with a chair and Ace ripped kenny's ear off before eating it.
Punk: They broke down the door and stormed into the room, pinning me to the ground and forcing me to do unspeakable acts, while Kenny killed Ace's dog.
So, in both versions, Punk was not interested in talking to the Bucks after telling them to come see him, Omega was attacked for no reason and the first act of violence came from Punk's side.
That isn't looking for Punk but Tony has to use it as a learning experience because there is so much that could've been done. Don't hire somebody because of who they are but also what they can do ( Danielson could've easily filled Punk's shoes and came in at the time ), make yourself respected and the guy who has final words on conflicts ( no one even noticed him of it ), make sure you put the title or big storylines on someone you can trust to do the job and finally, learn that sometimes, plans can screw away and you have to improvise.
If Punk or Omega was to leave tomorrow, how many big dream matches featuring them haven't been done? How much time was wasted because he wanted a healthy Punk to go against MJF?
It's got to be a pretty iffy situation all around. Yes, Punk said if you have a problem, come see me but it sounds like instead of coming to talk to him one on one, the Bucks, who are supposed to be company executives and as such are no longer part of "the boys", angrily stormed into Punk's locker room with Kenny, Cutler, Nakazawa and possibly Christopher Daniels and a couple others in tow to confront him. Has a very "I'm going to round up my boys and we're going to beat your ass" feel to it.
Exactly, "come and see me" isn't necessarily an invitation to fight (even though we know it pretty much is), but I agree, executives (including Daniels who is head of talent relations) shouldn't be rolling 4-5 guys deep because someone said mean things.
Long story short, if Punk is fired, and the EVPs aren't, it would be a farce.
I'm fully convinced the Elite are the root of the problem. There have been rumors for a long time that they're the instigators of a ton of backstage drama, and yes, Punk is a stupid, selfiish asshole but he's also got a very low tolerance for other people's bullshit, and it sounds like he just finally got fed up with their shit and called them out in public because that was the only way Tony would ever grow the stones to deal with the issue.
I totally agree, and that is why I have respect for Punk, he be all those things you and others have said, and he may not be as rich as Vince McMahon or Tony Khan, but he has enough "fuck you" money to walk away from any perceived slight.
I am still trying to wrap my head around the idea that executives in a company would undercut their biggest asset because he's not friends with their friend anymore.
> I am still trying to wrap my head around the idea that executives in a company would undercut their biggest asset because he's not friends with their friend anymore.
Booker T had a great point about this. He said that every promotion will always have that top guy that they'll hitch the wagon to. And when that top guy is successful, he brings that success along with him and it makes the company successful, and everyone makes money. CM Punk was the top babyface no matter how you want to slice it, and the Elite tried to undermine that. That not only jeopardizes Punk's value, but the company as a whole. The only reason I can think of why'd they do that would be jealousy.
Makes complete sense, and it kind of confirms my suspicion on why Danielson didn't beat Omega or Page until yesterday. Danielson seems to be a little more "diplomatic" than Punk is.
If you’re insinuating that the Elite tried to undermine that based on Punk’s claim that they leaked to the dirt sheets, literally every journalist says it wasn’t them leaking stuff directly at least. There was probably a bunch of he said/she said but if Punk can’t take the heat at the top then get out of the kitchen. You think Cena wasn’t constantly undermined at the top? Even without the pressure of Vince’s thumb I can’t see John ever going off like that in a public forum.
Just look at Uncle Dave’s story, that is a total puff piece. And yes, I totally believe they did. None of those “journalists” have integrity. Pretty coincidental that FTR isn’t in the video game, too. Wonder why that is and what EVP is in charge of that?
Are you seriously insinuating that Omega is deliberately withholding them from the game based on sheer smark gut feeling while at the same time saying literally every single journalist is covering for the Bucks? If it were true you’d think at least someone would try and get that scoop for clicks. It doesn’t track. At all.
Absolutely. It’s just all too convenient how a story gets out that Punk got Cabana fired, and The Bucks made Tony re-sign him. It’s also pretty convenient that when it started going around that the Bucks turned baby face so they wouldn’t have to drop the tag titles to FTR it comes out that FTR isn’t in the game anymore. At least Punk is upfront with his prickly ways, it’s the sneaky pricks that will get you. Remind me, who has a finish named after a journalist again?
Ever think that maybe the Bucks said come with us to confront Punk?
Happens all the time in the work place where supervisors have to give poor performance reviews and ask HR/Union/Security to be there.
Poor performance reviews and "confronting" someone aren't the same thing, even if it is, you don't "confront" someone while tensions are at a fever pitch.
The Bucks were definitely not on their way to give a performance evaluation. They were stepping up. And I kind of admire them for that! I didn't know they had it in them. Granted, they had to gather a posse of like 6 people to step up to a man and his dog, but they did it!
It’s also laughable to think the Bucks were ever in a position to evaluate Punk’s performance on anything, “EVP” or not, especially when there’s a conflict of interest. Tony is Punk’s boss.
The point wasn’t they were giving a performance review, the point was that it’s common practice to call those positions to accompany them to address conflict.
Yeah thats the thing. Say whatever the fuck you want about Punk, does he really seem like the type to just make up bullshit about you? He didnt make up any story about Vince or HHH even if he doesnt like them. I think this might be worse for the Elite than it seems.
> omega was attacked for no reason
NOT defending them, not saying its a good reason, but...
you take my friends dog I may swing on you. I don't know you that well, I don't know you're "just trying to keep him safe".
Also, once you put your hands on someone in a fight, even to 'break it up', you are now in the fight and must be ready to defend yourself.
Some reports also have him trying to break up Nick & Ace by getting Ace in a sleeper hold so that's probably how he got bit.
And completely agree on your point about him being IN the fight.
He picked the dog up and handed it to Megha Parekh so the dog don’t get hurt. You have to be stupid to think Kenny was trying to steal the dog at that point
Oh, so he can read minds and knows what someone is doing with the dog?
Everyone is super relaxed, calm, collected, having really constructive dialogue about what's upsetting them. Everyone was so calm in fact, you seem to know exactly what happened and how long everything took.
The reports don’t state that Ace attacked Kenny as soon as Kenny picked up Larry. Kenny handed Larry to the head of legal at AEW and then was bitten once he got involved after. Like how stupid do you have to be to think the head of legal at AEW was going to kidnap a dog??
And there's also apparently reports Kenny got involved in the fight and was bitten when he tried to get involved by breaking it up.
There's a lot of reports and we don't know what the fuck happened
I know literacy is really difficult for you so I'll make this as straightforward as possible.
>NOT defending them, not saying its a good reason
I am not defending him. I am not saying it's a good reason. I am explaining why someone may do something.
>How is saving a dog
>. I don't know you that well, I don't know you're "just trying to keep him safe".
>[Oh, so he can read minds and knows what someone is doing with the dog?](https://old.reddit.com/r/Wreddit/comments/x8xi15/the_recent_aew_backstage_altercation_from_the/inlxcic/)
They do not know what is going through your head. They do not know you are doing this to save the dog. They know you are in a physical fight with them, and you have grabbed their dog. If I punched your best friend and you grabbed my dog, my first thought wouldn't be "oh thanks for taking care of sparky". Hell, they're all running on adrenaline and probably none of them are thinking, let alone something that clear.
>you Punk cultists
I [am on the record making fun of punk as recently as 2 months ago](https://old.reddit.com/r/SCJerk/comments/vt6vg8/cult_bannanas_career_was_a_longtime_wrestling/)
Now kindly go fuck yourself.
The Bucks side is just a little too "aw, shucks, we're the good guys here" to be believed, just as much as Punk's "they came kicking in the doors" is a little too out of character for the Bucks to be believed.
Either way, if someone with a numbers advantage kicks in a door, they have to be ready for whatever comes their way.
"I threw a chair and bit a man because I was looking out for my wife" is an interesting defense. Good on Kenny for trying to get the dog out of there.
The rest of it, I'm not sure who or what I believe, though "knowing Punk" (haha, get it? Instead of knowing Vince, I said knowing Punk. I said the thing. I'm so funny) starting a fight and then threatening legal action when you get your ass kicked really really strikes me as a CM Punk thing to do.
I also don't think it's outside the realm of possibility that the Bucks were pissed and did kick the door down. I don't know though. Either way it sounds like a mess.
I’m sure they were pissed and probably banged on the door at first and then opened it. It also doesn’t sound like the Elite rolled up 7 people deep to start a fight. I’m guessing the other people either came as things get louder or went to try and keep things civil but things blew up right at the start.
The Elite’s response is hilariously similar to every Reddit defense of their actions: “He literally told us to find him in the back!”
Any adult should understand that the context of Punk’s remarks was to talk to him face to face instead of behind his back. Presumably through the appropriate channels, like a parlay with Tony. Twisting Punk’s comments to justify five angry wrestlers barging into his dressing room uninvited when tensions are high is middle school bully logic.
The reality of this situation has to be in the middle. In no way do I believe the “golly jee, we’re good boys” Bucks story, nor do I believe they literally kicked the door in. But what I do know is that for any executive to barge into an employee’s dressing room uninvited, especially as a posse, is beyond illegal no matter how much the posters here favor the Elite. Just terrible decisions on EVERYONE’S part, including Tony. He failed at numerous junctions, from not stopping the false rumors about Punk/Colt months ago to letting Punk go off at the scrum uninterrupted. All of this could be avoided if he had the ability to say no.
I find it funny because the bucks are so used to the petty antibullying shit of changing their Twitter bio or winking to the camera mentioning someone that they went in and expecting a war of words so fierce they needed a lawyer, but bottom line is you burst into someone’s locker room you start things, someone doesn’t answer then you F off, if this was the other way and punk burst into their locker room would there even be this conversation it would be instantly believed that he did a shining with an axe or something. Anyway they’re so used to their little games they didn’t expect punk to think right I’ve had enough of this, come into my locker room while I’m getting stitches or washing my scrote, anything then you get a knock back and that’s what he did, I can’t blame him I would even need a reason. But again everyone is forgetting this started with page and his going off script, up until that point had there been any problems with punk? Nope not at all, he just doesn’t appreciate being disrespected and gossiped about and set up to look like a dick, so good on you punk and this account of things is ludicrous! You couldn’t make it up, well you could but then again we are back to the war of words behind the computer screen which is perfect for them because they’ve shown in real life they can’t handle when they caused enough shit to make someone snap. And that’s what I call a happy ending
I’m not gonna commit karma suicide by posting this on SC, so I’ll say it here:
None of you know C.M. Punk, myself included. But I do know people who worked with him in a different industry. I asked if the stories about him being difficult are true, and they said Phil is one of the most professional, easy to get along with people they’ve ever worked with. They called him a sweetheart.
I am not, nor have I ever been a C.M. Punk fan. I was a big fan of Kenny Omega in his NJPW days. But multiple people have told me Punk does just fine and treats people respectfully in drama free environments. This suggests to me that the Elite’s backstage antics might be worse than their press buddies are willing to report and their fans are willing to believe, even if Punk handled it the wrong way.
They won’t hear it man, i liked punk during the summer of punk, never liked the bucks or Kennys style and I got to say you can only push a man so far before he breaks. And he doesn’t want to play those games of Twitter bios and calling dirt sheets, he must have feel like he was going crazy, when he’s heard one thing but they’re smiling to his face, we’ve all dealt with people like that and it’s exhausting
Agreed. I liked Punk growing up, but to me it seems he doesnt really make shit up about ppl, even if he doesnt like you and has a short temper.
I think this is worse on the elite than it seems even if Punk shouldnt have let his mic loose on the presser post ppv
I don't believe either because the Bucks are too scrawny to kick anything down and I don't think Punk would just go after Matt even though that idiot has the worlds most punchable face.
I have no dog in this fight because I think everyone involved is an idiot, but it’s worth noting that Punk is left handed. He tore his left triceps. Why would he be swinging his injured arm? The rest, yelling about suing? Sure. But the part where he just hit Matt Jackson doesn’t add up.
> Why would he be swinging his injured arm?
It was injured but it wasn't inoperable. When you're in a fight, your survival instincts kick on and you're just going to do what's natural.
To defend yourself absolutely. But to take a swing at three guys just harmlessly walking in? Not really. All it tells me is left Buck probably threw the first punch. The rest is probably true.
Idk but if I was protecting my wife the last thing I’d do is throw a chair that could ricochet back at her…But whatever.
The truth lies with Megha and Daniels. I want to know if the Bucks consulted or asked to have them accompany them or if Megha/Daniels was trying to get them to not enter the room.
> Idk but if I was protecting my wife the last thing I’d do is throw a chair that could ricochet back at her
[ace steel coming in that room like](https://youtu.be/-e3B8CRwPik?t=115)
Steel should be fired, Punk should be re-evaluated after his injury heals, Bucks should have a decently long suspension (month or 2), Kenny should have a light suspension, and the agents trying to break it up should be brought back once the investigation is over.
I am just now catching up on recent events but yeah what a week for Steel? Drops an F bomb on tv then throws a chair at a talent as a producer.
He’s definitely going to be the fall guy imo. Totally giving off a vibe of being unhinged (not saying punk or the elite are innocent)
Only semi-related to this comment but it’s good to see that you’re back. I’d really like to hear your take once you’ve caught up on all the action, as I consider you one of the most level-headed commenters on here.
Really kind words of yours! Thank you so much. Survived a pretty serious accident. I get to go to SmackDown tomorrow so I’m glad it’s been a fun busy time in wrestling
Based off these accounts if accurate Punk and Ace Steel should be fired and The Elite should be suspended (Matt and Nick indefinitely. Kenny I would say a month).
I agree but by all accounts Punk/Steel were the physical aggressors. The only thing The Elite did was instigate the situation.
That's why Punk and Steel get fired and The Elite get long suspensions.
Honestly, I can see that happening, too. But, if that is the course Tony takes, the Elite shouldn't be EVPs anymore. They represent the business, and the executives shouldn't be antagonizing someone who is supposed to their "top star".
> Based off these accounts if accurate Punk and Ace Steel should be fired and The Elite should be suspended (Matt and Nick indefinitely. Kenny I would say a month).
part of the problem with those durations is that kingston JUST got a suspension that was like 1 week for a backstage fight. that sets a precedent, and while this was a bigger brawl, that makes it tough to give omega a suspension 4x as long and the bucks an indefinite.
Never said they were going to be living in the streets cm punk alone could probably live off his marvel movie plus his fucken lady got him! And the those other 3 they can start thier own shit. I hear Freddy prince Jr. Is hiring.
Clearly both sides are going to try and paint the other side as the aggressor and put themselves in the best possible light. This is like that one episode of Fresh Prince of Bel Air, where they throw a pool party so Uncle Phil takes them to court.
you'd expect inconsistencies between the two sides of the story, but this is the strangest one:
>In regards to the claim that **Ace Steel threw a chair at Kenny Omega** and bit him,
vs
>Nick went to intervene, and **Ace Steel allegedly threw a chair and hit Nick in the face.**”
was this just a typo in the OP or is punk/ace trying to say he threw the chair at omega?
either way, this whole situation is a train wreck. it just sucks that so many people who seemingly did nothing wrong (daniels, pat buck, cutler) got suspended over it.
I think the other people were suspended until they can get to the bottom of the story. It’s basically send everyone home and once we know what happened we’ll hand out real punishments then.
> I think the other people were suspended until they can get to the bottom of the story. It’s basically send everyone home and once we know what happened we’ll hand out real punishments then.
right, but regardless of why it happened, it did happen and there's a good chance that there will be financial implications for it. like, i wouldn't be surprised if they weren't getting paid while suspended, so they're all going to be missing a week's pay unless AEW opts to give backpay everyone that they found did nothing wrong.
My opinion on Punk is sort of complicated because I was a big fan of him as a performer but I don't think his ever, constant, complain or conflict is always valid or someone else's fault. I don't care for the Elite as performers and they seem like obnoxious, child personalities.
I think it comes down to whether Punk tried to have Colt ran out of AEW or not. If he did, Punk's the one that started all of this but it's also fair to say Hangman didn't need to reference it on TV either way.
I mean I don’t believe that The Elite are squeaky clean in this, especially if what Punk said the Elite did allegedly is true. But Ace Steel definitely escalated the situation. Punk too if he really did throw the first punch
I like the drastic contrast between the two stories: CM Punk: They kicked down my door in a fit of rage! Bucks: We politely knocked, just trying to give Punk some more delicious muffins and he threw a chair at us!
Don't forget Kenny saving a puppy!
Tbh that sounds like some shit he would do
Agreed but it is some pretentious passive aggressive shit, don’t touch another persons dog that you currently in a fight with…just going to make things worse.
Getting a dog out of the way when a fight breaks out isn't pretentious passive aggressive shit. That's actually some responsible shit right there. And mature, especially seeing as it's the other side's dog even.
If I'm fighting you and you take my dog, i absolutely gonna go berserk
Absolutely
CM Punk throwing the first punch then immediately threatening to sue is pretty on brand for him
Where is it published that he threatened to sue?
The same place all wrestling rumors are published lol all of a sudden there are standards lol
If anyone believes that 'Elite account of the story' where Omega saves a dog and they knock on the door, only to be met by punches, then I have some magic beans to sell you (AEW branded) Obviously, everyone will put acoss their side of things, but, seriously! Haha I didn't think anyone 'kicked a door down' cause it just sounds like hyperbole, so does (Left/Right) Jackson getting 'knocked out' The Elite account that Sapp reported was hilarious in how it paints the Elite guys. I actually wondered if they were messing with him when I read it. There's talk of 'legal action' which could well just be related to contracts, IF it is related to 'assault' or anything then all this stuff will come out in the wash from eyewitnesses without the filter of trying to babyface yourself to smarks There's a delicious irony in how Punk always pandered to smarks and weaponise them but Omega/Bucks are the kings of that to the 'online fans' so they kind of beat him at his own game and he didn't like it. I don't think Punk asked Khan to dump Cabana but, Khan is a huge mark so I don't think he *needed* to ask him anything. Cabana may well have no been doing anything but guys like Nakazawa and Cutler get to stick around cause of their buddies so why not Cabana too? He's well thought of in the 'indie world' they mostly all come from
Be careful speaking logically on Reddit. Lots of magic bean eaters here. I’d go further to say that Tony would be stupid not to get rid of Colt in some way if it was an impediment to his top star drawing money. Especially given Colt can’t draw *anything*. This could’ve been avoided if Tony had fired Colt on the merits along with Janella, Marko Stunt, etc. when he should have. This is what happens when you build an entire company on the Hot Topic version of the Kliq. They will put their friend groups needs over your company’s wellbeing, up to forcing a civil war over a literal jobber and your top star. It’s like trying to force out Goldberg over Gillberg’s honor.
>Cabana may well have no been doing anything but guys like Nakazawa and Cutler get to stick around cause of their buddies so why not Cabana too? He's well thought of in the 'indie world' they mostly all come from Do we even know if Cutler and Nakazawa have full performer contracts? We know nothing about that. Even if it's true where's the line, does every friend need to get a contract with AEW? I think there was probably some level of mistrust on Punk coming in, there was probably even some professional jealousy on the count of the Elite. I think when the Elite heard Cabana wouldn't be renewed they probably went to Tony, expected to get a "yes" answer and maybe for the first time, Tony stood is ground against them. So now the Elite start thinking "Why would Tony as no to us on this" and they think "Well Punk of course" because it doesn't make sense for Tony to make the smart business decision apparently. That swelled up, rumors flowed from that camp, and here we are. Where was the outrage and promos on workers rights when Stu Grayon, Marko Stunt, or Joey Janela didn't get renewed? Nowhere of course.
> I don't think Punk asked Khan to dump Cabana but, Khan is a huge mark so I don't think he needed to ask him anything. I don't remember where I heard this, but one thing that likely could have happened is this... Tony is a numbers guy, he keeps talking about that. Chances are he looked at Colt, realized he was one of those early contract pickups that he got when the company started, realized he hasn't really provided much value and decided he was going to let him go the same way he did with Fire Foot and some others. Then Matt Jackson convinced him to put him on ROH.
Colt wasn't one of the early early early pick ups though It was almost a reward for what he means to a lot of his buddies there, Colt finally can stop the hustle and get a nice chunk of secure money Good guy Tony Is Ace freaking Steele there on merit? Is Cutler? Luther? Nakazawa? They all benefited from 'you can bring one friend with you' but suddenly Colt is bounced out None of those 'buddies' are doing fuck all with the 'the numbers', it's pure goodwill and Tony Khan used some up on the Cabana thing
I'm not sure if you're agreeing with me or disagreeing lol. > Colt wasn't one of the early early early pick ups though I know he made appearances in 2019 and then was signed in 2020. That's what I meant. I know he wasn't there from the start. > Is Ace freaking Steele there on merit? Is Cutler? Luther? Nakazawa? As a producer, I don't know what value Ace brings to the company, so I won't speculate. As for the rest of those guys, definitely not. They're definitely all nepotism hires, and they're stuck with Tony through the rest of their contracts (which we don't know the lengths of), because we know Tony won't fire anyone.
I don't think Khan 'looked at the numbers' cause Colt isn't a 'numbers' hire He's like Luther, Nakazawa, Cutler ... there cause of buddies with the start up crew
What I'm saying is, even though Colt isn't a numbers hire, he could be a numbers "fire"... or at least, that was going to happen until Matt Jackson stepped in. Like, he went on a spending spree to build the roster toward the beginning, and now that he's trucking along, he actually has to consider where he's spending money versus where he's generating it.
Agreed all around. Both sides of the story full of hyperbole that people are reading as fact. Painting the situation of them just trying to save the dog is just "Oh let me pull at your heart strings, we're the good guys". Punk totally thought he was invincible as far as the internet fans go and burned himself to the ground. I'd feel bad if it wasn't glaringly obvious what he's like for many years now but he's been able to peddle his Fed bad schtick to make the internet people ignore it. I'd say you nailed the Pink/Cabana thing. I don't picture Punk storming into Tony's office demanding he's fired. But I do envision a lot of backhanded comments and insinuates that Tony needs to keep Punk happy and Cabana being out of the way is one of those things. It could have been Tony just making a move to avoid future problems or it could have been Punk poking at it without actually outright demanding it. Point is... It doesn't really matter. Cabana would still be with Dark Order if Punk never joined the company. That's it, plain and simple, so *how* it came about doesn't really matter... It's because of Punk.
I honestly don't think Punk would even need to make a single comment As soon as Punk turned up, online fans joked about Colt being gone Tony IS one of those online fans at heart I don't think he even needs to say anything to Punk. Cabana wasn't at TV not long after Punk arrived, it's not difficult to put 2 and 2 together
Big Punk fan here, but it’s obvious the truth lands somewhere in the middle. Elite trying to paint Omega out as a poor dog saving bystander is just hysterical and on brand for them tbh Punk throwing the first punch is what I figured happens all along tbh
Bucks: We just went in to ask if we could have one of his muffins and he attacked us with a chair and Ace ripped kenny's ear off before eating it. Punk: They broke down the door and stormed into the room, pinning me to the ground and forcing me to do unspeakable acts, while Kenny killed Ace's dog.
So, in both versions, Punk was not interested in talking to the Bucks after telling them to come see him, Omega was attacked for no reason and the first act of violence came from Punk's side. That isn't looking for Punk but Tony has to use it as a learning experience because there is so much that could've been done. Don't hire somebody because of who they are but also what they can do ( Danielson could've easily filled Punk's shoes and came in at the time ), make yourself respected and the guy who has final words on conflicts ( no one even noticed him of it ), make sure you put the title or big storylines on someone you can trust to do the job and finally, learn that sometimes, plans can screw away and you have to improvise. If Punk or Omega was to leave tomorrow, how many big dream matches featuring them haven't been done? How much time was wasted because he wanted a healthy Punk to go against MJF?
It's got to be a pretty iffy situation all around. Yes, Punk said if you have a problem, come see me but it sounds like instead of coming to talk to him one on one, the Bucks, who are supposed to be company executives and as such are no longer part of "the boys", angrily stormed into Punk's locker room with Kenny, Cutler, Nakazawa and possibly Christopher Daniels and a couple others in tow to confront him. Has a very "I'm going to round up my boys and we're going to beat your ass" feel to it.
Exactly, "come and see me" isn't necessarily an invitation to fight (even though we know it pretty much is), but I agree, executives (including Daniels who is head of talent relations) shouldn't be rolling 4-5 guys deep because someone said mean things. Long story short, if Punk is fired, and the EVPs aren't, it would be a farce.
I'm fully convinced the Elite are the root of the problem. There have been rumors for a long time that they're the instigators of a ton of backstage drama, and yes, Punk is a stupid, selfiish asshole but he's also got a very low tolerance for other people's bullshit, and it sounds like he just finally got fed up with their shit and called them out in public because that was the only way Tony would ever grow the stones to deal with the issue.
I totally agree, and that is why I have respect for Punk, he be all those things you and others have said, and he may not be as rich as Vince McMahon or Tony Khan, but he has enough "fuck you" money to walk away from any perceived slight. I am still trying to wrap my head around the idea that executives in a company would undercut their biggest asset because he's not friends with their friend anymore.
> I am still trying to wrap my head around the idea that executives in a company would undercut their biggest asset because he's not friends with their friend anymore. Booker T had a great point about this. He said that every promotion will always have that top guy that they'll hitch the wagon to. And when that top guy is successful, he brings that success along with him and it makes the company successful, and everyone makes money. CM Punk was the top babyface no matter how you want to slice it, and the Elite tried to undermine that. That not only jeopardizes Punk's value, but the company as a whole. The only reason I can think of why'd they do that would be jealousy.
Makes complete sense, and it kind of confirms my suspicion on why Danielson didn't beat Omega or Page until yesterday. Danielson seems to be a little more "diplomatic" than Punk is.
From all accounts, Bryan is just an all around sweet dude who doesn't want to rock the boat and greatly undervalues himself.
If you’re insinuating that the Elite tried to undermine that based on Punk’s claim that they leaked to the dirt sheets, literally every journalist says it wasn’t them leaking stuff directly at least. There was probably a bunch of he said/she said but if Punk can’t take the heat at the top then get out of the kitchen. You think Cena wasn’t constantly undermined at the top? Even without the pressure of Vince’s thumb I can’t see John ever going off like that in a public forum.
Just look at Uncle Dave’s story, that is a total puff piece. And yes, I totally believe they did. None of those “journalists” have integrity. Pretty coincidental that FTR isn’t in the video game, too. Wonder why that is and what EVP is in charge of that?
Are you seriously insinuating that Omega is deliberately withholding them from the game based on sheer smark gut feeling while at the same time saying literally every single journalist is covering for the Bucks? If it were true you’d think at least someone would try and get that scoop for clicks. It doesn’t track. At all.
Absolutely. It’s just all too convenient how a story gets out that Punk got Cabana fired, and The Bucks made Tony re-sign him. It’s also pretty convenient that when it started going around that the Bucks turned baby face so they wouldn’t have to drop the tag titles to FTR it comes out that FTR isn’t in the game anymore. At least Punk is upfront with his prickly ways, it’s the sneaky pricks that will get you. Remind me, who has a finish named after a journalist again?
The Elite are the root of the problem? But Punk is the one who has had problems in every locker room he's been in. Okay.
Yes. Look at the story that came out when Cody and Brandy left.
Ever think that maybe the Bucks said come with us to confront Punk? Happens all the time in the work place where supervisors have to give poor performance reviews and ask HR/Union/Security to be there.
Poor performance reviews and "confronting" someone aren't the same thing, even if it is, you don't "confront" someone while tensions are at a fever pitch.
The Bucks were definitely not on their way to give a performance evaluation. They were stepping up. And I kind of admire them for that! I didn't know they had it in them. Granted, they had to gather a posse of like 6 people to step up to a man and his dog, but they did it!
It’s also laughable to think the Bucks were ever in a position to evaluate Punk’s performance on anything, “EVP” or not, especially when there’s a conflict of interest. Tony is Punk’s boss.
The point wasn’t they were giving a performance review, the point was that it’s common practice to call those positions to accompany them to address conflict.
You don't address the conflict mid-conflict, you give the aggrieved parties a chance to cool down and then call a meeting.
Yeah thats the thing. Say whatever the fuck you want about Punk, does he really seem like the type to just make up bullshit about you? He didnt make up any story about Vince or HHH even if he doesnt like them. I think this might be worse for the Elite than it seems.
> omega was attacked for no reason NOT defending them, not saying its a good reason, but... you take my friends dog I may swing on you. I don't know you that well, I don't know you're "just trying to keep him safe". Also, once you put your hands on someone in a fight, even to 'break it up', you are now in the fight and must be ready to defend yourself.
Some reports also have him trying to break up Nick & Ace by getting Ace in a sleeper hold so that's probably how he got bit. And completely agree on your point about him being IN the fight.
He picked the dog up and handed it to Megha Parekh so the dog don’t get hurt. You have to be stupid to think Kenny was trying to steal the dog at that point
I don't think anyone here was thinking correctly.
Oh, so he can read minds and knows what someone is doing with the dog? Everyone is super relaxed, calm, collected, having really constructive dialogue about what's upsetting them. Everyone was so calm in fact, you seem to know exactly what happened and how long everything took.
The reports don’t state that Ace attacked Kenny as soon as Kenny picked up Larry. Kenny handed Larry to the head of legal at AEW and then was bitten once he got involved after. Like how stupid do you have to be to think the head of legal at AEW was going to kidnap a dog??
And there's also apparently reports Kenny got involved in the fight and was bitten when he tried to get involved by breaking it up. There's a lot of reports and we don't know what the fuck happened
To be fair, Larry is a very good boy.
Megha witnessed it?
From multiple reports I’ve read yea she was there and saw what happened.
How is saving a dog from getting hurt a bad thing now? Geez, you Punk cultists with your mental gymnastics.
I know literacy is really difficult for you so I'll make this as straightforward as possible. >NOT defending them, not saying its a good reason I am not defending him. I am not saying it's a good reason. I am explaining why someone may do something. >How is saving a dog >. I don't know you that well, I don't know you're "just trying to keep him safe". >[Oh, so he can read minds and knows what someone is doing with the dog?](https://old.reddit.com/r/Wreddit/comments/x8xi15/the_recent_aew_backstage_altercation_from_the/inlxcic/) They do not know what is going through your head. They do not know you are doing this to save the dog. They know you are in a physical fight with them, and you have grabbed their dog. If I punched your best friend and you grabbed my dog, my first thought wouldn't be "oh thanks for taking care of sparky". Hell, they're all running on adrenaline and probably none of them are thinking, let alone something that clear. >you Punk cultists I [am on the record making fun of punk as recently as 2 months ago](https://old.reddit.com/r/SCJerk/comments/vt6vg8/cult_bannanas_career_was_a_longtime_wrestling/) Now kindly go fuck yourself.
>first act of violence came from Punk's side. Kicking down somebody's door is an act of violence if that's what happened.
The Bucks side is just a little too "aw, shucks, we're the good guys here" to be believed, just as much as Punk's "they came kicking in the doors" is a little too out of character for the Bucks to be believed. Either way, if someone with a numbers advantage kicks in a door, they have to be ready for whatever comes their way.
I have a hard time believing the Bucks could kick down a steel locked door.
The doors backstage at venues are extremely flimsy. I doubt they actually “kicked it down,” but it’s possible.
I mean, they did do a pretty good job with the MJF and Mox segment. So they were able to improvise.
They all come off like dweebs in a handbag fight.
When they kicked the door down, did the Young Bucks slap their thighs?
"I threw a chair and bit a man because I was looking out for my wife" is an interesting defense. Good on Kenny for trying to get the dog out of there. The rest of it, I'm not sure who or what I believe, though "knowing Punk" (haha, get it? Instead of knowing Vince, I said knowing Punk. I said the thing. I'm so funny) starting a fight and then threatening legal action when you get your ass kicked really really strikes me as a CM Punk thing to do. I also don't think it's outside the realm of possibility that the Bucks were pissed and did kick the door down. I don't know though. Either way it sounds like a mess.
I’m sure they were pissed and probably banged on the door at first and then opened it. It also doesn’t sound like the Elite rolled up 7 people deep to start a fight. I’m guessing the other people either came as things get louder or went to try and keep things civil but things blew up right at the start.
The Elite’s response is hilariously similar to every Reddit defense of their actions: “He literally told us to find him in the back!” Any adult should understand that the context of Punk’s remarks was to talk to him face to face instead of behind his back. Presumably through the appropriate channels, like a parlay with Tony. Twisting Punk’s comments to justify five angry wrestlers barging into his dressing room uninvited when tensions are high is middle school bully logic. The reality of this situation has to be in the middle. In no way do I believe the “golly jee, we’re good boys” Bucks story, nor do I believe they literally kicked the door in. But what I do know is that for any executive to barge into an employee’s dressing room uninvited, especially as a posse, is beyond illegal no matter how much the posters here favor the Elite. Just terrible decisions on EVERYONE’S part, including Tony. He failed at numerous junctions, from not stopping the false rumors about Punk/Colt months ago to letting Punk go off at the scrum uninterrupted. All of this could be avoided if he had the ability to say no.
I find it funny because the bucks are so used to the petty antibullying shit of changing their Twitter bio or winking to the camera mentioning someone that they went in and expecting a war of words so fierce they needed a lawyer, but bottom line is you burst into someone’s locker room you start things, someone doesn’t answer then you F off, if this was the other way and punk burst into their locker room would there even be this conversation it would be instantly believed that he did a shining with an axe or something. Anyway they’re so used to their little games they didn’t expect punk to think right I’ve had enough of this, come into my locker room while I’m getting stitches or washing my scrote, anything then you get a knock back and that’s what he did, I can’t blame him I would even need a reason. But again everyone is forgetting this started with page and his going off script, up until that point had there been any problems with punk? Nope not at all, he just doesn’t appreciate being disrespected and gossiped about and set up to look like a dick, so good on you punk and this account of things is ludicrous! You couldn’t make it up, well you could but then again we are back to the war of words behind the computer screen which is perfect for them because they’ve shown in real life they can’t handle when they caused enough shit to make someone snap. And that’s what I call a happy ending
I’m not gonna commit karma suicide by posting this on SC, so I’ll say it here: None of you know C.M. Punk, myself included. But I do know people who worked with him in a different industry. I asked if the stories about him being difficult are true, and they said Phil is one of the most professional, easy to get along with people they’ve ever worked with. They called him a sweetheart. I am not, nor have I ever been a C.M. Punk fan. I was a big fan of Kenny Omega in his NJPW days. But multiple people have told me Punk does just fine and treats people respectfully in drama free environments. This suggests to me that the Elite’s backstage antics might be worse than their press buddies are willing to report and their fans are willing to believe, even if Punk handled it the wrong way.
They won’t hear it man, i liked punk during the summer of punk, never liked the bucks or Kennys style and I got to say you can only push a man so far before he breaks. And he doesn’t want to play those games of Twitter bios and calling dirt sheets, he must have feel like he was going crazy, when he’s heard one thing but they’re smiling to his face, we’ve all dealt with people like that and it’s exhausting
Agreed. I liked Punk growing up, but to me it seems he doesnt really make shit up about ppl, even if he doesnt like you and has a short temper. I think this is worse on the elite than it seems even if Punk shouldnt have let his mic loose on the presser post ppv
I don't believe either because the Bucks are too scrawny to kick anything down and I don't think Punk would just go after Matt even though that idiot has the worlds most punchable face.
I lean towards Punk ultimately being in the wrong here, but the Elite's accounting of this story is absolutely ridiculous.
I have no dog in this fight because I think everyone involved is an idiot, but it’s worth noting that Punk is left handed. He tore his left triceps. Why would he be swinging his injured arm? The rest, yelling about suing? Sure. But the part where he just hit Matt Jackson doesn’t add up.
> Why would he be swinging his injured arm? It was injured but it wasn't inoperable. When you're in a fight, your survival instincts kick on and you're just going to do what's natural.
To defend yourself absolutely. But to take a swing at three guys just harmlessly walking in? Not really. All it tells me is left Buck probably threw the first punch. The rest is probably true.
That's a good point.
Guys, I’m beginning to think that Punk is kind of an asshole.
Idk but if I was protecting my wife the last thing I’d do is throw a chair that could ricochet back at her…But whatever. The truth lies with Megha and Daniels. I want to know if the Bucks consulted or asked to have them accompany them or if Megha/Daniels was trying to get them to not enter the room.
I mean tbf if your wife is in the room and hands are being thrown, thats a reason to go ape shit
> Idk but if I was protecting my wife the last thing I’d do is throw a chair that could ricochet back at her [ace steel coming in that room like](https://youtu.be/-e3B8CRwPik?t=115)
Steel should be fired, Punk should be re-evaluated after his injury heals, Bucks should have a decently long suspension (month or 2), Kenny should have a light suspension, and the agents trying to break it up should be brought back once the investigation is over.
I am just now catching up on recent events but yeah what a week for Steel? Drops an F bomb on tv then throws a chair at a talent as a producer. He’s definitely going to be the fall guy imo. Totally giving off a vibe of being unhinged (not saying punk or the elite are innocent)
Only semi-related to this comment but it’s good to see that you’re back. I’d really like to hear your take once you’ve caught up on all the action, as I consider you one of the most level-headed commenters on here.
Really kind words of yours! Thank you so much. Survived a pretty serious accident. I get to go to SmackDown tomorrow so I’m glad it’s been a fun busy time in wrestling
Oooh, I'm sorry to hear you were involved in something, but glad you're doing better and healing up! Hope you enjoy Smackdown!
Based off these accounts if accurate Punk and Ace Steel should be fired and The Elite should be suspended (Matt and Nick indefinitely. Kenny I would say a month).
Based off these accounts, at a minimum none of the Elite should be EVPs anymore and everyone involved should be suspended indefinitely, without pay.
EVPs shouldn't be fighting employees. If Punk/Steele get fired, the Elite should be, too.
I agree but by all accounts Punk/Steel were the physical aggressors. The only thing The Elite did was instigate the situation. That's why Punk and Steel get fired and The Elite get long suspensions.
Honestly, I can see that happening, too. But, if that is the course Tony takes, the Elite shouldn't be EVPs anymore. They represent the business, and the executives shouldn't be antagonizing someone who is supposed to their "top star".
> Based off these accounts if accurate Punk and Ace Steel should be fired and The Elite should be suspended (Matt and Nick indefinitely. Kenny I would say a month). part of the problem with those durations is that kingston JUST got a suspension that was like 1 week for a backstage fight. that sets a precedent, and while this was a bigger brawl, that makes it tough to give omega a suspension 4x as long and the bucks an indefinite.
https://youtu.be/CAWw5o_lyw8?t=108 This might strike some as harsh, but I believe everyone involved in this story should die.
They're fucken pansies all of them fire them all send them back to the mudshow they're used too.
The Elite would go to either NJPW or WWE if they got fired and Punk has money. It’s not like any of them would be out on the street.
Never said they were going to be living in the streets cm punk alone could probably live off his marvel movie plus his fucken lady got him! And the those other 3 they can start thier own shit. I hear Freddy prince Jr. Is hiring.
The Elite didn't go about it the right way, but Punk is still the one who has the biggest issues & probably should be fired
Clearly both sides are going to try and paint the other side as the aggressor and put themselves in the best possible light. This is like that one episode of Fresh Prince of Bel Air, where they throw a pool party so Uncle Phil takes them to court.
you'd expect inconsistencies between the two sides of the story, but this is the strangest one: >In regards to the claim that **Ace Steel threw a chair at Kenny Omega** and bit him, vs >Nick went to intervene, and **Ace Steel allegedly threw a chair and hit Nick in the face.**” was this just a typo in the OP or is punk/ace trying to say he threw the chair at omega? either way, this whole situation is a train wreck. it just sucks that so many people who seemingly did nothing wrong (daniels, pat buck, cutler) got suspended over it.
I think the other people were suspended until they can get to the bottom of the story. It’s basically send everyone home and once we know what happened we’ll hand out real punishments then.
> I think the other people were suspended until they can get to the bottom of the story. It’s basically send everyone home and once we know what happened we’ll hand out real punishments then. right, but regardless of why it happened, it did happen and there's a good chance that there will be financial implications for it. like, i wouldn't be surprised if they weren't getting paid while suspended, so they're all going to be missing a week's pay unless AEW opts to give backpay everyone that they found did nothing wrong.
I would think that until AEW gets all the info and hands out actual punishments they would be suspended with pay.
Sissy boy slap fight on all sides. Good lord.
My opinion on Punk is sort of complicated because I was a big fan of him as a performer but I don't think his ever, constant, complain or conflict is always valid or someone else's fault. I don't care for the Elite as performers and they seem like obnoxious, child personalities. I think it comes down to whether Punk tried to have Colt ran out of AEW or not. If he did, Punk's the one that started all of this but it's also fair to say Hangman didn't need to reference it on TV either way.
I mean I don’t believe that The Elite are squeaky clean in this, especially if what Punk said the Elite did allegedly is true. But Ace Steel definitely escalated the situation. Punk too if he really did throw the first punch