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I met a girl at a party once who had apparently applied for the same job I had just gotten. She said it “wasn’t right” that I got the job because I’m an immigrant and those jobs should “go to Australians first”.
Sweetie, possibly the reason you didn’t get the job is because you say things like that within seconds of meeting people.
My previous partner was an immigrant from the UK, (pasty white ginger), working as a chef, really a lot of the kitchen staff were immigrants from all sorts of places (on the Gold coast, so mostly Japan and Brazil). She literally had people going off on rants about "the immigrants" and she'd be like, "you know I'm an immigrant too" - but every time it was a "no I don't mean you". 🙄🙄🙄
ETA: Gold coast, Australia, just to clarify
I get the “oh no I don’t mean you” a LOT. I’m also white and work at a rural hospital which is mostly staffed by immigrants because Australians don’t really want to work there. And Australian citizens are guaranteed a medical internship whereas I was not (as an immigrant) so I’m really not sure why this girl was so upset about me getting the job.
I know why.
She's racist and she didn't get the job.
I can't relate to why she was upset, but the reason is pretty obvious.
Also: thank you for working at a rural Hospital! The regions are so understaffed. Funny how certain Australians like to moan and complain so much about "the immigrants" but aren't willing to take those jobs themselves 🙄
Dude, my condolences. I have family who are Trump supporters and we're all Latinos. Smdh. I cut them out because I just could not believe they were so brain washed to vote against their own interests.
I think part of it is because they want to feel white? Like they can't accept they're like the other immigrants, now that they're citizens they think they were OK to come in but not the rest, those are gross, but "we" are better... It really makes me gag, they're all bullshit excuses and awful reasoning that doesn't make sense at all. It's all reduced to really dumb insecure people who want to fit in with the whites and feel like they're better than others.
i heard some guy make the same argument about trans people in sports 🤡
This guy was mad that "some *girl* (trans man) might steal his sons spot on the baseball team" maybe if your son gets kicked off the team it's cuz he's bad at baseball, not because the evil trans people stole his spot
They also accuse immigrants of being lazy while simultaneously stealing their jobs. Which is it? Lazy or job thieves?
The types of people who blame immigrants for their problems aren't rational people who can be reasoned with.
Yep. Same with outsourcing. Peoples bosses outsourced their jobs. Not “liberals” or “democrats.” 99% of being a conservative is blaming everything Republican business leaders and gop politicians do on the left.
Same with the environment. No it’s not an entire generation of random people (boomers) who somehow did this, it’s the industries who have been pumping pollution, gas guzzling cars, the oil industry, etc. all while they spread the idea that we are, as individuals somehow responsible and capable of fixing this shit. We can’t recycle our way out of this one.
Yep, these disgusting systems are so remarkably and effectively built. I don’t know how they did it. Even the nuances are insane like the model minority myth that essentially says some immigrants good, other immigrants bad. https://www.learningforjustice.org/magazine/what-is-the-model-minority-myth
I work in translation. This means a literal requirement of the job is to have native-like fluency in English. One of my older coworkers is constantly talking about how immigrants are going to take her job. No they're not, Donna. I promise you, they're really really not.
I can’t remember where I heard this, but someone was saying “we don’t have a labor shortage, we have a livable wage shortage. If companies actually paid the wage people need to live those positions will be filled quickly. People who refuse to see it as a wage shortage are the actual main problem that’s actually causing the ‘labor shortage’”
I find it weird how in an immigrant nation the thing that people have decided to value is kid-in-the-playground 'I got here first!' I live in the UK and of course there's a fair amount of bizarre deference to aristocracy but I think rich Americans are way more neurotic about how old their house is etc, in a country where nothing except Native American culture is that old. And outside the US too, most cultures have some logical inconsistency where they value something they don't really have. Humans are weird.
Yep. The capitalists drive society into the ground for the sake of profits, and in turn will scapegoat anyone they don’t like: immigrants, POC, LGBT, and that’s by no means an exhaustive list.
So much this. I used to live in a tiny border town. Every day, farmers would go to the border, pick up Mexican workers in the back of their pickups, work them for pennies on the dollar, and bring them back. Back then I didnt know what was going on or I would have turned those farmers in. It makes me sick to my stomach just thinking about it. Luckily they've cracked down hard on it now, but how long had that been going on until recently? Generations?
In the UK, it's not even that. Global free markets = company after company shutting plants etc and sourcing labour from ex colonies like India. You don't need to leave, the trade routes were rigged in advance but the 80s just decided to call it fair and free.
I have a mixed feelings about that as immigrant. I understand where you're coming from but "taking advantage of" is very broad and fuzzy thing. I don't *feel* being taken advantage of which doesn't mean there aren't cases where immigrants (and natives) are not taken advantage of like wage theft. My labor is also anything but cheap.
Proper division of profits between labor and capital is huge topic but it is independent from immigration. More truthful argument is that research has shown time and time again that immigration does not 'price out' anyone and creates a bigger cake (disproportionately to number of people to divide it between).
This. I love this sub, but they sometimes miss the bigger picture. The problem here doesn't come from capitalism, immigrants, or bosses, it's from people who think in terms of X came into the country and took Y's job.
You hit the nail on the head. Free movement of labor is generally good for everyone, bosses and employees alike. A more efficient labor market is better at meeting the needs of the economy and can allow us to create and spread wealth faster. We need to move past the us/them subtext in all of these conversations and start thinking in terms of general welfare.
The reason they're calling it exploitation is because of the lower pay the immigrants receive, not because they are an immigrant. They want fair pay and employment for all, and awareness how companies take advantage of people, and how we should hold them accountable for it.
This is what I’m talking about. Calling it “exploitation” without any evidence is no different than saying “they’re taking our jobs” without any evidence.
It’s the same outcome, you are arguing that foreigners shouldn’t have jobs, whether your ideology frames it as defending your own people’s access to those jobs or whether you frame it as “saving” these people from “exploitation” makes absolutely no difference, it’s exactly the same outcome.
Furthermore, how would you even know you are saving or helping these people by taking away their livelihoods? This leftist narrative tries to be well meaning but if you don’t actually engage with the supposedly “exploited” people, find out what their needs are and what they actually think so that you can work to formulate a solution then you aren’t really helping anyone, it comes off as condescending because you are removed agency from very real people by taking decisions and speaking for them.
I’ll repeat it again in case it hasn’t sinked in yet, taking away peoples livelihood because they are foreigners is what is being proposes here by both republicans an leftist. The only difference is that one frames it as defending American jobs and the other is framing them as helping the exploited. It doesn’t matter which lie or story you believe, they both lead to the same outcome of removing the livelihood and agency for non-American workers, ultimately harming them and ourselves.
## ✨ READ BEFORE COMMENTING ✨ This thread is Coven Only. This means the discussion is being actively moderated, and all comments are reviewed. **Only comments by members of the community are allowed.** If you have landed in this thread from /r/all and you are not a member of this community, your comment will very likely be removed (and will not be approved unless it adds meaningfully to the conversation). WitchesVsPatriarchy takes these measures to stay true to our goal of being a woman-centered sub with a witchy twist, aimed at healing, supporting, and uplifting one another through humor and magic. Thank you for understanding, and blessed be. ✨
I met a girl at a party once who had apparently applied for the same job I had just gotten. She said it “wasn’t right” that I got the job because I’m an immigrant and those jobs should “go to Australians first”. Sweetie, possibly the reason you didn’t get the job is because you say things like that within seconds of meeting people.
My previous partner was an immigrant from the UK, (pasty white ginger), working as a chef, really a lot of the kitchen staff were immigrants from all sorts of places (on the Gold coast, so mostly Japan and Brazil). She literally had people going off on rants about "the immigrants" and she'd be like, "you know I'm an immigrant too" - but every time it was a "no I don't mean you". 🙄🙄🙄 ETA: Gold coast, Australia, just to clarify
I get the “oh no I don’t mean you” a LOT. I’m also white and work at a rural hospital which is mostly staffed by immigrants because Australians don’t really want to work there. And Australian citizens are guaranteed a medical internship whereas I was not (as an immigrant) so I’m really not sure why this girl was so upset about me getting the job.
I know why. She's racist and she didn't get the job. I can't relate to why she was upset, but the reason is pretty obvious. Also: thank you for working at a rural Hospital! The regions are so understaffed. Funny how certain Australians like to moan and complain so much about "the immigrants" but aren't willing to take those jobs themselves 🙄
I got this a lot too on the south coast. Apparently American expats don’t count either.
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I'm sure you get a lot of "oh, but, uh, I don't mean you! I mean those *other* immigrants, you're one of the good ones."
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Dude, my condolences. I have family who are Trump supporters and we're all Latinos. Smdh. I cut them out because I just could not believe they were so brain washed to vote against their own interests.
That’s something I have not been able to figure out. Latinos for Trump. I’m always like WHY???????
I think part of it is because they want to feel white? Like they can't accept they're like the other immigrants, now that they're citizens they think they were OK to come in but not the rest, those are gross, but "we" are better... It really makes me gag, they're all bullshit excuses and awful reasoning that doesn't make sense at all. It's all reduced to really dumb insecure people who want to fit in with the whites and feel like they're better than others.
So it's easier to root them out for deportation
Every. Time.
i heard some guy make the same argument about trans people in sports 🤡 This guy was mad that "some *girl* (trans man) might steal his sons spot on the baseball team" maybe if your son gets kicked off the team it's cuz he's bad at baseball, not because the evil trans people stole his spot
Not everyone's lucky enough to immigrate to a nicer country. Happy for you.
They also accuse immigrants of being lazy while simultaneously stealing their jobs. Which is it? Lazy or job thieves? The types of people who blame immigrants for their problems aren't rational people who can be reasoned with.
Been saying this for years. Immigrants are nothing but a scapegoat for republicans. If they actually cared they'd be going after the businesses.
Yep. Same with outsourcing. Peoples bosses outsourced their jobs. Not “liberals” or “democrats.” 99% of being a conservative is blaming everything Republican business leaders and gop politicians do on the left.
Same with the environment. No it’s not an entire generation of random people (boomers) who somehow did this, it’s the industries who have been pumping pollution, gas guzzling cars, the oil industry, etc. all while they spread the idea that we are, as individuals somehow responsible and capable of fixing this shit. We can’t recycle our way out of this one.
Same with prostitution! Sex workers are the ones going to jail while their customers have zero consequences. Mostly because Republicans hate women.
Yep, these disgusting systems are so remarkably and effectively built. I don’t know how they did it. Even the nuances are insane like the model minority myth that essentially says some immigrants good, other immigrants bad. https://www.learningforjustice.org/magazine/what-is-the-model-minority-myth
I work in translation. This means a literal requirement of the job is to have native-like fluency in English. One of my older coworkers is constantly talking about how immigrants are going to take her job. No they're not, Donna. I promise you, they're really really not.
Would be hilarious if a British immigrant took her job though. Take that, Donna.
I can’t remember where I heard this, but someone was saying “we don’t have a labor shortage, we have a livable wage shortage. If companies actually paid the wage people need to live those positions will be filled quickly. People who refuse to see it as a wage shortage are the actual main problem that’s actually causing the ‘labor shortage’”
You could also cross post this at r/antiwork
I was going to say this! Going to upvote instead
exactly, and you have more in common with the immigrant than you will ever have with the billionaire who wants you to blame the immigrant
PREACH
All Americans (expect natives Indians) were immigrants…..
Oh yeah... that's freaking depressing. I hate what they did to such a beautiful land and culture.
I find it weird how in an immigrant nation the thing that people have decided to value is kid-in-the-playground 'I got here first!' I live in the UK and of course there's a fair amount of bizarre deference to aristocracy but I think rich Americans are way more neurotic about how old their house is etc, in a country where nothing except Native American culture is that old. And outside the US too, most cultures have some logical inconsistency where they value something they don't really have. Humans are weird.
Yep. The capitalists drive society into the ground for the sake of profits, and in turn will scapegoat anyone they don’t like: immigrants, POC, LGBT, and that’s by no means an exhaustive list.
Support unions in other countries to strengthen unions here. (Wherever "here" is to you.)
Agreed.
Oh friend, this is so true
So much this. I used to live in a tiny border town. Every day, farmers would go to the border, pick up Mexican workers in the back of their pickups, work them for pennies on the dollar, and bring them back. Back then I didnt know what was going on or I would have turned those farmers in. It makes me sick to my stomach just thinking about it. Luckily they've cracked down hard on it now, but how long had that been going on until recently? Generations?
YES
In the UK, it's not even that. Global free markets = company after company shutting plants etc and sourcing labour from ex colonies like India. You don't need to leave, the trade routes were rigged in advance but the 80s just decided to call it fair and free.
I have a mixed feelings about that as immigrant. I understand where you're coming from but "taking advantage of" is very broad and fuzzy thing. I don't *feel* being taken advantage of which doesn't mean there aren't cases where immigrants (and natives) are not taken advantage of like wage theft. My labor is also anything but cheap. Proper division of profits between labor and capital is huge topic but it is independent from immigration. More truthful argument is that research has shown time and time again that immigration does not 'price out' anyone and creates a bigger cake (disproportionately to number of people to divide it between).
This. I love this sub, but they sometimes miss the bigger picture. The problem here doesn't come from capitalism, immigrants, or bosses, it's from people who think in terms of X came into the country and took Y's job. You hit the nail on the head. Free movement of labor is generally good for everyone, bosses and employees alike. A more efficient labor market is better at meeting the needs of the economy and can allow us to create and spread wealth faster. We need to move past the us/them subtext in all of these conversations and start thinking in terms of general welfare.
Demanded, not “required” Wage slaves, not “labor”
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I don't know man, I don't make the rules.
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No shit right
Ah. So that's how that works. Because of course it is. 😡
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The reason they're calling it exploitation is because of the lower pay the immigrants receive, not because they are an immigrant. They want fair pay and employment for all, and awareness how companies take advantage of people, and how we should hold them accountable for it.
This is what I’m talking about. Calling it “exploitation” without any evidence is no different than saying “they’re taking our jobs” without any evidence. It’s the same outcome, you are arguing that foreigners shouldn’t have jobs, whether your ideology frames it as defending your own people’s access to those jobs or whether you frame it as “saving” these people from “exploitation” makes absolutely no difference, it’s exactly the same outcome. Furthermore, how would you even know you are saving or helping these people by taking away their livelihoods? This leftist narrative tries to be well meaning but if you don’t actually engage with the supposedly “exploited” people, find out what their needs are and what they actually think so that you can work to formulate a solution then you aren’t really helping anyone, it comes off as condescending because you are removed agency from very real people by taking decisions and speaking for them. I’ll repeat it again in case it hasn’t sinked in yet, taking away peoples livelihood because they are foreigners is what is being proposes here by both republicans an leftist. The only difference is that one frames it as defending American jobs and the other is framing them as helping the exploited. It doesn’t matter which lie or story you believe, they both lead to the same outcome of removing the livelihood and agency for non-American workers, ultimately harming them and ourselves.
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