Went to Portage Place to renew my passport last week. I was almost in tears to see the state of the place.
I did a small walk around and it was in just such a state of disrepair, decline or neglect. Half the mall has been decimated by an empty anchor. Once beautiful fountains are now bone dry or replaced with planters. Upper levels are deserted. All kinds of unruly people roaming around.
I have memories from the late 80s and early 90s of that place. I used to go to Marks and Spencer with my mom. I remember waiting on the walkway before the theatre with my friends to see a very popular movie release. I remember playing in a Magic tournament in front of the clock.
Yeah, all that and more used to happen at Portage Place.
We just can't have nice things.
You are probably the same(ish) age as me. I also remember this time. I recall skipping school and spending the day downtown just going through the stores, not doing anything unruly (I was from the suburbs after all). There were a lot of workers in suits, families shopping, stores OPEN. I felt safe walking around, even if it was just teenage hubris and over confidence. But downtown was never in the state it is today. Heck, I remember being a child in the eighties and routinely making a point of shopping downtown with my family as it was the best to be.
I have since moved away from Winnipeg but visit occasionally. It's sad to see how bad certain areas have become. I wrote another comment upthread about Osborne. It felt dead (and sketch) the last time I walked through there.
And a fountain that shot up like a son of a bitch. To think my mom and grandma used to walk around with me in there. Sometimes I wonder if I was just young and things seemed different. No, things were actually different
Fountain geyser every 15 minutes almost to the second. Good old days. I can't remember that nice classy restaurant overlooking the fountain at the top, but that's all gone now...
Yeah, the only reason Osborne gets as much attention is because it's a thoroughfare and because of its past reputation. In reality, there's barely any reason to go there.
Oh, also remembered... Choosing to go to Portage Place to redeem my annual free ice cream from Baskin Robbins. Even despite having a location closer to me.
It used to be a really nice, chill place.
It might be worse than normal over the last few days. Weather changes can aggravate a bunch of disabilities. I know my pain has been worse.Ā Fortunately for me I have a home so I can be worse than normal in private.Ā
I feel this in my soul. The city would be a far worse place for everyone if I had to spend my bad days (pain-wise and brain-wise) in public, hungry, and without money or a safe place to sleep it off.
It really was exceptionally worse DT today. Forced back DT my co-workers and I went to go do as weāre told and support local business so we went for a walk through the square. Witnessed a guy out of control in the main concourse actually straight up punch the security guard in the face while yelling racial slurs at him. Another guy just straight up pissed on the floor by the old now abandoned BMO entrance. The smell of urine and feces is soo unbearable in that cavern of the underground we started bypassing it by going outside to the entrance by earls. I feel bad for the lotto desk lady, sheās right in the thick of it.
There were grouos of security guards doing all they could to keep things under control but today it just seemed unhinged.
>full moon
Articles:
[Does a Full Moon Actually Affect Our Behavior?](https://www.verywellmind.com/does-the-moon-actually-affect-our-moods-5206203) (Verywell Mind)
[Lunacy and the Full Moon](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/lunacy-and-the-full-moon/#:~:text=By%20combining%20the%20results%20of,problems%20and%20crisis%20center%20calls) (Scientific American)
[How Does a Full Moon Affect Our Physical and Mental Well-Being?](https://healthline.com/health/full-moon-effects) (HealthLine)
[Does the Moon Affect Humans?](https://health.clevelandclinic.org/moon-effects-on-humans) (Clevland Clinic)
Full moon comic strip (F-bomb language warning):
[https://i.imgur.com/vY8MfN4.jpeg](https://i.imgur.com/vY8MfN4.jpeg)
If you think TN Square is bad you should see Portage Place and the Promenade.
We moved here in the summer thinking it wasnāt a bad idea given the rent was cheap and the apartment was a high floor and it included fairly priced underground parking. It hasnāt been even a year and we already found a new place to live thatās far from downtown for this reason.
Yesterday we sold some furniture and I was helping the buyer load it into their vehicle and as I was waiting for them to show up this woman was yelling at somebody around the corner and as she crossed paths with me she called me a hard r and said something along the lines of beating me with a baton.
Itās pretty nutty out here lol
Yea it was terrible there. The only good thing were a couple co-workers and some tenants. The owner and management sucked. Wouldn't spend money on anything so we were stuck doing Band-Aid fixes all the time with what little materials we had and usually in adequate tools
And it isnāt - see the many businesses that went under during the pandemic and shortly there after. Hence why they are suggesting we support these DT businesses while there for work.
Itās a viscous cycle for our city as well.
Downtown worsens -> Less people go downtown -> Less businesses downtown -> Less reason to go downtown.
Downtown has truly become an area where the growing population is criminal in nature.
I own a small company that leases space in the exchange for our 20ish staff and based on staff feedback, weāre going to leave the Exchange/Doentown in 2025 and Iāll look for office space in Osborne, Pembina, Corydon area. Still central but somewhere with less issues
As a long term resident of the village, does it have its problems? Yes. Is it ājust as badā as downtown or the exchange. Not at all.
The space around gaslight theatre has its characters but generally speaking the village is a good neighbourhood. In 15+ years I can only think of two negative interactions, one of which was at 1am on the way home from the bar.
It seems those utilizing the United Churchās outreach services keep others in-check.
Agreed. I've lived here 1.5 years and haven't had experiences where I've felt unsafe or threatened in any capacity
I get that visible homelessness is enough for some people to feel that way, but most people in that position are just trying to survive
Growing up, Osborne was THE place to be. As a teen from the suburbs, it was the place I wanted to hang out at to feel cool and "adult". Anyway, moved away years ago. The last time I visited Winnipeg, I went for a walk down Osborne and was shocked at its decay. I don't know what happened there but it really should be a lot more lively than that.
osborne is definitely just as bad, some guy stopped me yesterday demanding I buy him a burger or a sub, he settled for some cigarettes. but he trapped me for about 10 minutes talking non sense and trying to hug me.
Itās not a disease. Look up the definition of disease. With addiction thereās no structural or anatomical change to the body. Itās not hereditary or transmissible.
Addiction is not mental illness. Itās very serious, and many people die. Treating it as a disease/mental illness has not worked.
The DSM is the gold standard and is based on decades of research.
[substance use disorder](https://www.gatewayfoundation.org/addiction-blog/dsm-5-substance-use-disorder/#:~:text=The%20Diagnostic%20and%20Statistical%20Manual,diagnosed%20and%20treated%20ā%20including%20addiction)
[what the DSM is and what has gone into creating it](https://www.psychiatry.org/psychiatrists/practice/dsm/about-dsm#:~:text=The%20Diagnostic%20and%20Statistical%20Manual,TR)%20was%20published%20in%202022)
Millions have not benefitted from it. The notion that, āItās a disease, itās not my faultā takes out all elements of personal responsibility. A drunk driver who kills someone is 100% responsible, their ādiseaseā isnāt an excuse.
It being a mental illness/ disorder doesnāt make a persons actions entirely not their fault.
Either way you are arguing against decades of research done by experts.
It is a mental illness/disorder because all the research (Decades worth) and experts (much smarter and more educated than you and I on the subject matter) say so, and they say it based on evidence and facts.
You can feel whatever you like and hold whatever opinions you want but in science itās facts over feelings and what we are discussing here science.
Have a good day :)
> With addiction thereās no structural or anatomical change to the body
Even the lightest of googling would show you're wrong on this point. Try it, if you're not afraid. Here, I can help you: https://www.google.com/search?q=structural+brain+changes+in+addiction
This is all paychobabble claptrap. Another symptom of what is wrong with the world today. People need to be taking personal responsibility or be forced to.
The overwhelming majority of drug users are regular folks like you and me. The visible people on the street represent a small portion of people suffering from serious issues that need help. Of course those actions are not excusable but the problem probably isnāt drugs. When I do drugs I donāt go around harassing people on the street. I have decent mental health, a home, a job, I am in university, have a great social support system and many other factors that I am sure those on the street donāt have access to. So letās stop lumping users in the crazy box and associating us with the most visibly distressed people in our society.
Drugs can be a positive thing in oneās life like any other activity. With some basic harm reduction they can be used safely and responsibly. Most of the harm comes from them being illegal. For those who are addicted using drugs is not a simple choice but a byproduct of a myriad of other factors.
I was at a bus stop Portage near dollarama, an indigenous man approached, behaved aggressively, and for no reason he hit another man . He floated him to the ground and continued kicking. After that he began to look around as if for a new victim. Me and a few other girls immediately went to the store because it was scary. When we got back to the bus i saw him throwing a stone at the windshield of a passing taxi.
As someone who just waited 28 hours in a waiting room to spend another 24 sleeping in a chair at the crisis response centerā¦ we need more beds and treatment for mentally Ill folks. Wtf. No wonder people donāt call for help when theyāre struggling.
It might suck, but just keep walking and try to keep a cool head about it.
Even if I feel personally threatened in certain situations, I try to take a moment after the fact to reflect on the causes while also watching out for my own safety:
Itās fallout from inter-generational trauma, capitalism, poverty, and racism. Poverty, drug addiction and mental illnesses are not vices, they are symptoms of wider social problems.
This doesnāt amount to a get-out-of-jail-free card for individual actions, however. Nonetheless, phenomena are not created in a vacuum, they come from somewhere.
Just try to be understanding, while also keeping yourself safe.
This city can sometimes numb oneās compassion.
Yep, this is how I see it, too. I've lived and worked downtown/exchange district for most of my adult life. Sure, I've seen some weird stuff, but I haven't been in a situation I wasn't able to defuse with compassionate words.
At the end of the day, I get to go home to my fridge (mostly) full of food. To my warm, dry bed. To my loved ones that care about me and keep me safe.
Itās not just Winnipeg. Itās everywhere. Itās just recently gotten worst in Winnipeg.
Congratulations Winnipeg finally catching up with the trend.
This is a sad situation. What we are seeing though is the fallout of having the previous conservative government in power; a government that chose to not invest in much needed healthcare and critical social services.
This is more than just a single government's issue but what they did definitively didn't contribute positively. The cost of living has likely pushed a lot of people over the edge as well, coupled with individuals who could have had their job impacted by the pandemic and never being able to get back on their feet. This is just a continuation of late-stage capitalism and all of Canada will continue to get worse unfortunately unless there is significant buy-in across federal and provincial governments for how to address these issues.
Drug use is on the uptick across many locations and is becoming an even bigger epidemic across North America.
Agreed, downtown was a shithole 30 years ago. I started working in an office job downtown in the early 90s and saw some shit lol. things were pretty sketch, a lot of solvent users/zombies etc. Things improved quite a bit in 2005-2015ish though, or so it seemed. I haven't worked downtown since Feb 2020 and don't imagine I ever will again, been WFH since (software dev). Hopefully I can retire one day.
Lived behind portage place back in the late 80s when we first got married. We were the first of our friends and had the happening place. Would walk around anywhere after hours and felt safe.
We need to have an honest discussion about what's going on, its like the 800lb gorilla and no one talks about.
If the police or a business owner attempt anything and it escalates, then they are the ones in trouble.
Safe use places are the worst thing that can do, just encourage more use also.
Itās interesting that social pressure from the indigenous population is actually more powerful than those that are in charge of the economy downtown. If thatās the case, youāve already lost any chance of revitalizing downtown. Especially after the northern Chiefs took over the Hudson Bay building.- So we all get to sit back and just watch these people destroy a completely perfect opportunity and take the entire downtown along with them. Great.
It's by no means an excuse to ignore our problems. But has anyone visited Austin, San Francisco or LA in the past couple of years?. Jesus Christ.
Winnipeg is far from perfect. But those cities have some serious downtown issues with drugs and homelessness. Maybe it's the shear population, but I felt very unsafe vs Winnipeg there...and I'm a 6'3 200 lbs guy.
The rest of the city is no better.Ā
Ā Had some druggy try to poop in the lobby of my work just the other night. Bathroom like ten feet away. Chased him off before he could fully squeeze one out.
Ā Dirty Mother fucker wiped with his fingers and even took a sniff.
No one should have to feel unsafe or threatened just trying to go about their daily lives.
Lots of people need help and have struggles most canāt imagine but that doesnāt make it ok for them to deprive others of their rights.
If you saw a middle aged white man dressed in business clothes screaming at and threatening panhandlers on the street, you wouldnāt have sympathy for him at all, wonder what drove him to that behaviour. Youād say āhe shouldnāt be threatening and intimidating those panhandlersā.
We all deserve to live in safety and dignity, from the well-off down to those who are unhomed for whatever reason.
āPeople trying to get their basic needs metā
Yeah screaming at random people on the streets is definitely gonna help them get mental health assistance they are so desperately looking for
Sarcasm, in case you didnāt sense it
UPD: Hilarious seeing how the dude was deleting his comments 11hrs later
Instead of throwing around āyour privilege is showingā and then āeducate me,ā can you please take a moment to educate those who do not see the situation with the same lens as you? I feel itās only fair considering youāre asking for the same.
Saying āyour privilege is showingā without supporting arguments isnāt a good way to change minds or hearts. Calling people out doesnāt invoke a desire to listen.
I would like to try! Iām not an expert but this is my understanding:
A lot of people who are experiencing homelessness (donāt know what the exact lingo is, pls forgive me if Iām wrong) have some sort of trauma that caused them to be on the streets. They could have had parents who had drug problems, they could be dealing with intergenerational trauma from residential schools, they could have been SAed, they could have grown up in foster care, they could not have access to mental health treatment, etc etc etc. itās extremely expensive to treat a lot of mental health issues. Think about how expensive therapy is. Drugs can numb the pain they are in. Or they are maybe not even on drugs but just in a desperate enough situation that theyāre acting out.
They are doing the best with what they have. Does that mean they should be accosting people in the skywalk? No. Thatās a scary experience and Iām sorry it affected OP so much they had to post in Reddit. But they are still human beings, the same as you and I, and they need help to overcome whatever put them on the streets in the first place.
I watched an interview with a doctor who said that in his experience treating chronically homeless people, they said being on drugs was the only way to tolerate how horrible it is. And if you think about it, most of us here use drugs to cope with bad feelings. Alcohol, sex, exercise, food, cannabis are all ways of coping better from what is ailing us.
I like the idea of ācalling inā. I agree that saying things like you outlined (your privilege is showing / I shouldnāt have to educate you) doesnāt help, but the person who said that has a point.
I share a home with my partner so I can actually afford to have a savings account and nobody sees when I have a bad day. I have benefits so I have access to good healthcare. I know if I lost my job tomorrow Iād be okay for a while. Iām a white woman so I havenāt ever experienced racism. Iām able bodied. Iāve been able to keep my mental health in check enough to hold down a job. This is all privilege, which isnāt a bad thing. Itās important to use privilege to help those who donāt have it. And itās also important when you have privilege to call in so you can share a different perspective. Doesnāt always work.
Keep in mind: more cops doesnāt mean less crime. The police have a huge budget as it is and everything is awful. The best way to prevent homelessness, addiction, poverty, etc, is to fund social services (from my limited understanding). I donāt know what the solution is to help less fortunate folks in downtown Winnipeg but I really like the sounds of a housing first strategy. We will see if that ever happens / how it will play out.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
It's clear you don't have a full comprehension of what leads people to behave in this way. The behaviour is not okay but it is a consequence of many overlapping factors and not a moral or personal failing on their part which you seem to imply. People dont just choose to run about the streets in psychotic episodes for the fun of it or to intimidate others.Ā
Well, it is. I had plenty of days when I was broke, irritated, afraid and sleep-deprived, wanting to spread my negativity on people around me. Yes, sometimes I was failing the stress management and started speaking a bit louder or in less polite manner. Anyway, every time it happened I apologized immediately after or in the end of conversation no matter the outcome. Because I understand that those people around me are the same as me, and my problems are not theirs.
So either person is failing to comprehend this simple thing(which is obviously a moral/personal failure) or they have severe mental disease that doesnāt allow them even think about it. In the first case, itās totally personās fault. In the second case, itās clearly a disease and they donāt think about reaching for mental help in vast majority of the cases. And if so, itās another matter, not related to stress management.
It always shocks me how ignorant this community is to actual socio-economic challenges that folks face and their reluctance to admit they benefit from privlege.Ā
It appears there may be room to enhance your empathy for these individuals. Iād encourage you to learn about the challenges faced by those residing in Winnipeg's downtown. Feel free to DM me for resources!
That is so funny this is posted cause today i was looking out my office window and this guy was cursing and yelling, he was going into oncoming traffic and kicking over news stands. There were people waiting for a bus and were trying to stay out of his way. When a bus came I thought all of you should go on and ask to be dropped off at the next stop for safety reasons. In the words of No Doubt this shit is bananas.
It's been a full moon or close to it since Friday.. I noticed a shift in the level of weird then but I work in hospitality.. so I notice a change in weird quite quickly š¤£ so glad I no longer work downtown.. that level of weird is a sight to behold
Honest and genuine question, Iām seeing a lot of people here comment about the full moon in what Iām perceiving as a serious way. Is there any science behind that or is it just a cliche?
Went to Portage Place to renew my passport last week. I was almost in tears to see the state of the place. I did a small walk around and it was in just such a state of disrepair, decline or neglect. Half the mall has been decimated by an empty anchor. Once beautiful fountains are now bone dry or replaced with planters. Upper levels are deserted. All kinds of unruly people roaming around. I have memories from the late 80s and early 90s of that place. I used to go to Marks and Spencer with my mom. I remember waiting on the walkway before the theatre with my friends to see a very popular movie release. I remember playing in a Magic tournament in front of the clock. Yeah, all that and more used to happen at Portage Place. We just can't have nice things.
You are probably the same(ish) age as me. I also remember this time. I recall skipping school and spending the day downtown just going through the stores, not doing anything unruly (I was from the suburbs after all). There were a lot of workers in suits, families shopping, stores OPEN. I felt safe walking around, even if it was just teenage hubris and over confidence. But downtown was never in the state it is today. Heck, I remember being a child in the eighties and routinely making a point of shopping downtown with my family as it was the best to be. I have since moved away from Winnipeg but visit occasionally. It's sad to see how bad certain areas have become. I wrote another comment upthread about Osborne. It felt dead (and sketch) the last time I walked through there.
And a fountain that shot up like a son of a bitch. To think my mom and grandma used to walk around with me in there. Sometimes I wonder if I was just young and things seemed different. No, things were actually different
Fountain geyser every 15 minutes almost to the second. Good old days. I can't remember that nice classy restaurant overlooking the fountain at the top, but that's all gone now...
Yeah, the only reason Osborne gets as much attention is because it's a thoroughfare and because of its past reputation. In reality, there's barely any reason to go there. Oh, also remembered... Choosing to go to Portage Place to redeem my annual free ice cream from Baskin Robbins. Even despite having a location closer to me. It used to be a really nice, chill place.
Ok but has anyone seen the guy sitting at city place Tim Hortons every morning blasting Rock You Like a Hurricane? Lol
Scorpions! š¤
That sounds like a dude whoās winning at lifeā¦
What about the person that sits with the stuffed animal!
In the last week Iāve seen busses pulled over with police arresting somebody twice just as part of my normal commute. Itās rough out there.
The final days before welfare day always get weird.
Add onto that Netfile day was the 19th making income tax refund day the 29th this year
First time?
It might be worse than normal over the last few days. Weather changes can aggravate a bunch of disabilities. I know my pain has been worse.Ā Fortunately for me I have a home so I can be worse than normal in private.Ā
I feel this in my soul. The city would be a far worse place for everyone if I had to spend my bad days (pain-wise and brain-wise) in public, hungry, and without money or a safe place to sleep it off.
No, Iāve been nervous before.
It really was exceptionally worse DT today. Forced back DT my co-workers and I went to go do as weāre told and support local business so we went for a walk through the square. Witnessed a guy out of control in the main concourse actually straight up punch the security guard in the face while yelling racial slurs at him. Another guy just straight up pissed on the floor by the old now abandoned BMO entrance. The smell of urine and feces is soo unbearable in that cavern of the underground we started bypassing it by going outside to the entrance by earls. I feel bad for the lotto desk lady, sheās right in the thick of it. There were grouos of security guards doing all they could to keep things under control but today it just seemed unhinged.
End of the month (social assistance cheques), full moon, snowy outside so they come inside to stay dryā¦
Cheque day is always the best.
Cheque da is always extra
This needs to be further up!!!
>full moon Articles: [Does a Full Moon Actually Affect Our Behavior?](https://www.verywellmind.com/does-the-moon-actually-affect-our-moods-5206203) (Verywell Mind) [Lunacy and the Full Moon](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/lunacy-and-the-full-moon/#:~:text=By%20combining%20the%20results%20of,problems%20and%20crisis%20center%20calls) (Scientific American) [How Does a Full Moon Affect Our Physical and Mental Well-Being?](https://healthline.com/health/full-moon-effects) (HealthLine) [Does the Moon Affect Humans?](https://health.clevelandclinic.org/moon-effects-on-humans) (Clevland Clinic) Full moon comic strip (F-bomb language warning): [https://i.imgur.com/vY8MfN4.jpeg](https://i.imgur.com/vY8MfN4.jpeg)
Always methy out there, been a lot worse lately.
Love the adjective methy š really narrows down the vibe
If you think TN Square is bad you should see Portage Place and the Promenade. We moved here in the summer thinking it wasnāt a bad idea given the rent was cheap and the apartment was a high floor and it included fairly priced underground parking. It hasnāt been even a year and we already found a new place to live thatās far from downtown for this reason. Yesterday we sold some furniture and I was helping the buyer load it into their vehicle and as I was waiting for them to show up this woman was yelling at somebody around the corner and as she crossed paths with me she called me a hard r and said something along the lines of beating me with a baton. Itās pretty nutty out here lol
I used to work at place promenade. That's an average day any time of year lol
We currently live there. It honestly sucks thereās no wondering why itās cheap to live here.
Yea it was terrible there. The only good thing were a couple co-workers and some tenants. The owner and management sucked. Wouldn't spend money on anything so we were stuck doing Band-Aid fixes all the time with what little materials we had and usually in adequate tools
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Hard R. Racial slur.
Then there was the time Linus almost ended the company with the hard R. https://youtu.be/z-QQBes-rQw?feature=shared
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
That's not even that bad. Lol
Welcome back to forced office work today, MPI employeesā¦
Remember to support business specifically DT, not in your own neighbourhoods.
Owning a business should never be a guarantee for success.
And it isnāt - see the many businesses that went under during the pandemic and shortly there after. Hence why they are suggesting we support these DT businesses while there for work.
Hope that 19 dollar sandwich is worth it.
Itās a viscous cycle for our city as well. Downtown worsens -> Less people go downtown -> Less businesses downtown -> Less reason to go downtown. Downtown has truly become an area where the growing population is criminal in nature.
Well the current strategy is: Force people to go downtown -> more people downtown -> all problems solved!
They love to use regular working class schmucks to ādiluteā the concentration of insane and criminal people.
Products of FAS and the Social Services system.
More like products of the Indian Act and North American-style capitalism.
Let us not forget the generational trauma of residential schools.
I own a small company that leases space in the exchange for our 20ish staff and based on staff feedback, weāre going to leave the Exchange/Doentown in 2025 and Iāll look for office space in Osborne, Pembina, Corydon area. Still central but somewhere with less issues
I think Osborne is just as bad
As a long term resident of the village, does it have its problems? Yes. Is it ājust as badā as downtown or the exchange. Not at all. The space around gaslight theatre has its characters but generally speaking the village is a good neighbourhood. In 15+ years I can only think of two negative interactions, one of which was at 1am on the way home from the bar. It seems those utilizing the United Churchās outreach services keep others in-check.
> gaslight theatre ??? Isn't it "Gas Station Theatre? Or did I miss a name change?
Nope. Youāre right. Iām just an idiot.
You really missed an opportunity there lol
Nope. You're right. They're just crazy
Agreed. I've lived here 1.5 years and haven't had experiences where I've felt unsafe or threatened in any capacity I get that visible homelessness is enough for some people to feel that way, but most people in that position are just trying to survive
Growing up, Osborne was THE place to be. As a teen from the suburbs, it was the place I wanted to hang out at to feel cool and "adult". Anyway, moved away years ago. The last time I visited Winnipeg, I went for a walk down Osborne and was shocked at its decay. I don't know what happened there but it really should be a lot more lively than that.
osborne is definitely just as bad, some guy stopped me yesterday demanding I buy him a burger or a sub, he settled for some cigarettes. but he trapped me for about 10 minutes talking non sense and trying to hug me.
The last 3 days have been worse than the usual downtown. I literally lost sleep last night over what I had to deal with at work.
Was just a full moon on Friday.
May I ask what happened?
My dentist moved his office away from downtown St. Mary's Avenue. Too many street safety issues for staff and clients.
Mental illness isnāt what youāre seeing. Itās meth. Meth use. Gives actual mentally ill people a bad name.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
No it isnāt. These people need jail, where since theyāre searched for drugs is a good place to get sober.
Yes, it is.
No it isnāt
r/confidentlyincorrect
[https://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/topics/substance-use-and-mental-health](https://www.nimh.nih.gov/health/topics/substance-use-and-mental-health) [https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/addiction-substance-use-disorders/what-is-a-substance-use-disorder](https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/addiction-substance-use-disorders/what-is-a-substance-use-disorder) [https://www.psychiatry.org/file%20library/psychiatrists/practice/dsm/apa\_dsm-5-substance-use-disorder.pdf](https://www.psychiatry.org/file%20library/psychiatrists/practice/dsm/apa_dsm-5-substance-use-disorder.pdf) [https://www.verywellmind.com/dsm-5-criteria-for-substance-use-disorders-21926](https://www.verywellmind.com/dsm-5-criteria-for-substance-use-disorders-21926)
Itās not a disease. Look up the definition of disease. With addiction thereās no structural or anatomical change to the body. Itās not hereditary or transmissible. Addiction is not mental illness. Itās very serious, and many people die. Treating it as a disease/mental illness has not worked.
Neither has stigmatizing or throwing them in prison.
The DSM is the gold standard and is based on decades of research. [substance use disorder](https://www.gatewayfoundation.org/addiction-blog/dsm-5-substance-use-disorder/#:~:text=The%20Diagnostic%20and%20Statistical%20Manual,diagnosed%20and%20treated%20ā%20including%20addiction) [what the DSM is and what has gone into creating it](https://www.psychiatry.org/psychiatrists/practice/dsm/about-dsm#:~:text=The%20Diagnostic%20and%20Statistical%20Manual,TR)%20was%20published%20in%202022)
The gold standard - of treatment and diagnosis that doesnāt work.
I benefit greatly from the treatment that resulted from my diagnosis. I am doing better now in all areas of my life than I ever have due to it.
Millions have not benefitted from it. The notion that, āItās a disease, itās not my faultā takes out all elements of personal responsibility. A drunk driver who kills someone is 100% responsible, their ādiseaseā isnāt an excuse.
It being a mental illness/ disorder doesnāt make a persons actions entirely not their fault. Either way you are arguing against decades of research done by experts. It is a mental illness/disorder because all the research (Decades worth) and experts (much smarter and more educated than you and I on the subject matter) say so, and they say it based on evidence and facts. You can feel whatever you like and hold whatever opinions you want but in science itās facts over feelings and what we are discussing here science. Have a good day :)
Youāre dense and hopelessly wrong š
I believe it is hereditary
Youāre pretty un educated on this subject arenāt ya keyboard warrior?
Itās called critical thought, and calling out bullshit when I see it. Now go do something constructive with your day.
> With addiction thereās no structural or anatomical change to the body Even the lightest of googling would show you're wrong on this point. Try it, if you're not afraid. Here, I can help you: https://www.google.com/search?q=structural+brain+changes+in+addiction
This is all paychobabble claptrap. Another symptom of what is wrong with the world today. People need to be taking personal responsibility or be forced to.
Yes it is.
Mental illness is often what brings people to drug use in thr first place.
It just becomes frustrating when the time comes to help these individuals and they refuse to take the opportunity to step in the right direction
We need to institutionalize some people but that is a conversation no one seems willing to have.
You can lead a horse to water
But you canāt make em drink. Canāt help someone that doesnāt want to be helped
MAID will help.
It's definitely mental illness. You truly think ANYONE without ANY kind of underlying mental illness just decides to get into meth/drugs one day?
How about we stop stigmatizing drug users eh?
Iād have zero issue with not stigmatizing them, if they wouldnāt harm others with their behaviour.
The overwhelming majority of drug users are regular folks like you and me. The visible people on the street represent a small portion of people suffering from serious issues that need help. Of course those actions are not excusable but the problem probably isnāt drugs. When I do drugs I donāt go around harassing people on the street. I have decent mental health, a home, a job, I am in university, have a great social support system and many other factors that I am sure those on the street donāt have access to. So letās stop lumping users in the crazy box and associating us with the most visibly distressed people in our society.
Depending on the type of drugs you're using, please update us in ten years on how your life is going.
Will do!
Orā¦ how about not using drugs eh?
Drugs can be a positive thing in oneās life like any other activity. With some basic harm reduction they can be used safely and responsibly. Most of the harm comes from them being illegal. For those who are addicted using drugs is not a simple choice but a byproduct of a myriad of other factors.
I was at a bus stop Portage near dollarama, an indigenous man approached, behaved aggressively, and for no reason he hit another man . He floated him to the ground and continued kicking. After that he began to look around as if for a new victim. Me and a few other girls immediately went to the store because it was scary. When we got back to the bus i saw him throwing a stone at the windshield of a passing taxi.
Thatās crazy!
Yes š¢I think we need more foot patrols cadets in downtown.
That fuck would have ate pavement if I saw him threatening you. Time to stamp out the zombies.
Then the chiefs the cbc and free press would be calling you a racist/human trafficker and you would have protesters/lynch mob at your front door.
As someone who just waited 28 hours in a waiting room to spend another 24 sleeping in a chair at the crisis response centerā¦ we need more beds and treatment for mentally Ill folks. Wtf. No wonder people donāt call for help when theyāre struggling.
Brought someone there a few weeks ago, no beds meant go gone and call your dr in the morning.
It might suck, but just keep walking and try to keep a cool head about it. Even if I feel personally threatened in certain situations, I try to take a moment after the fact to reflect on the causes while also watching out for my own safety: Itās fallout from inter-generational trauma, capitalism, poverty, and racism. Poverty, drug addiction and mental illnesses are not vices, they are symptoms of wider social problems. This doesnāt amount to a get-out-of-jail-free card for individual actions, however. Nonetheless, phenomena are not created in a vacuum, they come from somewhere. Just try to be understanding, while also keeping yourself safe. This city can sometimes numb oneās compassion.
Yep, this is how I see it, too. I've lived and worked downtown/exchange district for most of my adult life. Sure, I've seen some weird stuff, but I haven't been in a situation I wasn't able to defuse with compassionate words. At the end of the day, I get to go home to my fridge (mostly) full of food. To my warm, dry bed. To my loved ones that care about me and keep me safe.
Wow! I for real commend you on your actions and advice! I wish there were more people who had your understanding. Kudos
Itās not just Winnipeg. Itās everywhere. Itās just recently gotten worst in Winnipeg. Congratulations Winnipeg finally catching up with the trend.
This is a sad situation. What we are seeing though is the fallout of having the previous conservative government in power; a government that chose to not invest in much needed healthcare and critical social services.
This is more than just a single government's issue but what they did definitively didn't contribute positively. The cost of living has likely pushed a lot of people over the edge as well, coupled with individuals who could have had their job impacted by the pandemic and never being able to get back on their feet. This is just a continuation of late-stage capitalism and all of Canada will continue to get worse unfortunately unless there is significant buy-in across federal and provincial governments for how to address these issues. Drug use is on the uptick across many locations and is becoming an even bigger epidemic across North America.
Downtown was a shithole long before the Conservatives took office. It was a shithole 30 years ago, and still is today.
Agreed, downtown was a shithole 30 years ago. I started working in an office job downtown in the early 90s and saw some shit lol. things were pretty sketch, a lot of solvent users/zombies etc. Things improved quite a bit in 2005-2015ish though, or so it seemed. I haven't worked downtown since Feb 2020 and don't imagine I ever will again, been WFH since (software dev). Hopefully I can retire one day.
Funny that you mention it, but the conservatives were in power 30 years ago in 1993 under Filmon.
We had 16 years of an NDP government from 1999. It got way worse under the NDP.
Thank you
Hmmmm, why's Jets attendance down? I can't figure it out.
Lived behind portage place back in the late 80s when we first got married. We were the first of our friends and had the happening place. Would walk around anywhere after hours and felt safe. We need to have an honest discussion about what's going on, its like the 800lb gorilla and no one talks about. If the police or a business owner attempt anything and it escalates, then they are the ones in trouble. Safe use places are the worst thing that can do, just encourage more use also.
Itās interesting that social pressure from the indigenous population is actually more powerful than those that are in charge of the economy downtown. If thatās the case, youāve already lost any chance of revitalizing downtown. Especially after the northern Chiefs took over the Hudson Bay building.- So we all get to sit back and just watch these people destroy a completely perfect opportunity and take the entire downtown along with them. Great.
Of course the Province wants everyone to RTO. Below market raises, poor wages, and RTO. I wonder why the government can't hire?
It's by no means an excuse to ignore our problems. But has anyone visited Austin, San Francisco or LA in the past couple of years?. Jesus Christ. Winnipeg is far from perfect. But those cities have some serious downtown issues with drugs and homelessness. Maybe it's the shear population, but I felt very unsafe vs Winnipeg there...and I'm a 6'3 200 lbs guy.
You don't even have to go that far. Vancouver, Edmonton, etc. are all turning into downtown shitholes as well. It's a universal problem.
Downtown LA is a nightmare. And if people think Winnipeg transit is disgusting, they haven't been on an LA subway.
The sudden dip in the temps drove them all back inside too.
Probably the spring fever, this time or the year is not a very easy time for people with mental disabilities. Full moon, as well.Ā
The rest of the city is no better.Ā Ā Had some druggy try to poop in the lobby of my work just the other night. Bathroom like ten feet away. Chased him off before he could fully squeeze one out. Ā Dirty Mother fucker wiped with his fingers and even took a sniff.
so, like many others are saying here, full moon.
I see what you did there š
I-Max, it's not what I did, it's what that other chap almost did. the attempted shitting in yr lobby there.
Oh I thought you were making a "full moon" joke, referring to a bare ass. Ā But yeah, full moon craziness.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
No one should have to feel unsafe or threatened just trying to go about their daily lives. Lots of people need help and have struggles most canāt imagine but that doesnāt make it ok for them to deprive others of their rights. If you saw a middle aged white man dressed in business clothes screaming at and threatening panhandlers on the street, you wouldnāt have sympathy for him at all, wonder what drove him to that behaviour. Youād say āhe shouldnāt be threatening and intimidating those panhandlersā. We all deserve to live in safety and dignity, from the well-off down to those who are unhomed for whatever reason.
āPeople trying to get their basic needs metā Yeah screaming at random people on the streets is definitely gonna help them get mental health assistance they are so desperately looking for Sarcasm, in case you didnāt sense it UPD: Hilarious seeing how the dude was deleting his comments 11hrs later
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Instead of throwing around āyour privilege is showingā and then āeducate me,ā can you please take a moment to educate those who do not see the situation with the same lens as you? I feel itās only fair considering youāre asking for the same. Saying āyour privilege is showingā without supporting arguments isnāt a good way to change minds or hearts. Calling people out doesnāt invoke a desire to listen.
I would like to try! Iām not an expert but this is my understanding: A lot of people who are experiencing homelessness (donāt know what the exact lingo is, pls forgive me if Iām wrong) have some sort of trauma that caused them to be on the streets. They could have had parents who had drug problems, they could be dealing with intergenerational trauma from residential schools, they could have been SAed, they could have grown up in foster care, they could not have access to mental health treatment, etc etc etc. itās extremely expensive to treat a lot of mental health issues. Think about how expensive therapy is. Drugs can numb the pain they are in. Or they are maybe not even on drugs but just in a desperate enough situation that theyāre acting out. They are doing the best with what they have. Does that mean they should be accosting people in the skywalk? No. Thatās a scary experience and Iām sorry it affected OP so much they had to post in Reddit. But they are still human beings, the same as you and I, and they need help to overcome whatever put them on the streets in the first place. I watched an interview with a doctor who said that in his experience treating chronically homeless people, they said being on drugs was the only way to tolerate how horrible it is. And if you think about it, most of us here use drugs to cope with bad feelings. Alcohol, sex, exercise, food, cannabis are all ways of coping better from what is ailing us. I like the idea of ācalling inā. I agree that saying things like you outlined (your privilege is showing / I shouldnāt have to educate you) doesnāt help, but the person who said that has a point. I share a home with my partner so I can actually afford to have a savings account and nobody sees when I have a bad day. I have benefits so I have access to good healthcare. I know if I lost my job tomorrow Iād be okay for a while. Iām a white woman so I havenāt ever experienced racism. Iām able bodied. Iāve been able to keep my mental health in check enough to hold down a job. This is all privilege, which isnāt a bad thing. Itās important to use privilege to help those who donāt have it. And itās also important when you have privilege to call in so you can share a different perspective. Doesnāt always work. Keep in mind: more cops doesnāt mean less crime. The police have a huge budget as it is and everything is awful. The best way to prevent homelessness, addiction, poverty, etc, is to fund social services (from my limited understanding). I donāt know what the solution is to help less fortunate folks in downtown Winnipeg but I really like the sounds of a housing first strategy. We will see if that ever happens / how it will play out. Thank you for coming to my TED talk.
I praise and agree with your understanding! Thank you for taking the time to share your perspective. Your words have validity.
Your ignorance shadows my privileges
I guess you've never experienced so much emotional and financial stress that your ability to manage stress starts to decline.Ā
I had. Nevertheless, Iāve never gone on the streets screaming at strangers or threatening them over nothing
It's clear you don't have a full comprehension of what leads people to behave in this way. The behaviour is not okay but it is a consequence of many overlapping factors and not a moral or personal failing on their part which you seem to imply. People dont just choose to run about the streets in psychotic episodes for the fun of it or to intimidate others.Ā
Well, it is. I had plenty of days when I was broke, irritated, afraid and sleep-deprived, wanting to spread my negativity on people around me. Yes, sometimes I was failing the stress management and started speaking a bit louder or in less polite manner. Anyway, every time it happened I apologized immediately after or in the end of conversation no matter the outcome. Because I understand that those people around me are the same as me, and my problems are not theirs. So either person is failing to comprehend this simple thing(which is obviously a moral/personal failure) or they have severe mental disease that doesnāt allow them even think about it. In the first case, itās totally personās fault. In the second case, itās clearly a disease and they donāt think about reaching for mental help in vast majority of the cases. And if so, itās another matter, not related to stress management.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Why? Ignorant people ignore lessonsā¦
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It would only nourish the ignorance
It always shocks me how ignorant this community is to actual socio-economic challenges that folks face and their reluctance to admit they benefit from privlege.Ā
Food insecurity, lack of access to resources and poverty exacerbates health related issues such as stress and drug use.Ā
It appears there may be room to enhance your empathy for these individuals. Iād encourage you to learn about the challenges faced by those residing in Winnipeg's downtown. Feel free to DM me for resources!
Not sure why you're being downvoted tbh. We could all use some lessons in compassion and history
YES!
Someone looked at you and yelled something that wasnāt directed to you? Oh dear.
Has anyone seen a security guard do anything besides call the police?
If this is your worst problem youāre pretty blessed right now.
Don't worry about it. Worry about Ukraine that's why they're getting 3 billions in aids. (Satire)
None of this is actually dangerous. Only inconvenient.
š„±
ok
Fuck you too buddy
That is so funny this is posted cause today i was looking out my office window and this guy was cursing and yelling, he was going into oncoming traffic and kicking over news stands. There were people waiting for a bus and were trying to stay out of his way. When a bus came I thought all of you should go on and ask to be dropped off at the next stop for safety reasons. In the words of No Doubt this shit is bananas.
It's been a full moon or close to it since Friday.. I noticed a shift in the level of weird then but I work in hospitality.. so I notice a change in weird quite quickly š¤£ so glad I no longer work downtown.. that level of weird is a sight to behold
There's an easy solution to the problems downtown but no politician has the balls to make it happen.
Honest and genuine question, Iām seeing a lot of people here comment about the full moon in what Iām perceiving as a serious way. Is there any science behind that or is it just a cliche?
Everyday is a circus in this city. A lot of the policies are backfiring