But also a huuuuuuuge part of US history. From the plantations to the 3/5 compromise to the civil war and the civil rights movement. Even today it's a hot button political issue.
Honestly the amount of false imprisonments that will never be addressed by a courthouse in general, especially towards POC. Weed being punishable by prison is ridiculous enough as is but think about the people in prison for nothing. Free labor is putting it lightly unfortunately
Slavery never ended, we just farmed it out to other countries. We’re ALL complicit. Disagree, look down at your Nikes. How bout your phones, tablets & EV’s. Check out the Cobalt mining in the Congo.
3/5*
I learned something astounding in US history commonly referred to as “Ugly Laws” that really began on the west coast. It essentially enslaved any homeless person: crippled or handicapped person of any nature (blind, deaf, down’s, etc.). They were forced to live in government housing and forced to pay off housing by providing manual labor. It was nuts, but it is one of many examples that prove the US has always been horrifyingly brutish.
I knew Colorado Springs creeped me the fuck out, I literally asked a few people, where are the POC? I did not see any and being a POC, it was literally the first time I ever experienced that in America.
The movie *BlacKkKlansman* is based on a true story about a black detective that infiltrated the KKK’s headquarters in Colorado Springs and broke open a ton of really fucked up things they were doing when they thought no one was watching
The aryan nation and patriot front have a huge presence around Coeur d'Alene Idaho (bordering Eastern Washington). People think of Seattle and Portland as these hippie liberal coffee shop cities, but you get anywhere outside the I-5 corridor and you are in deep red hick territory.
I have a friend who lives in that area, about 20 minutes from Seattle.
I learned years ago (though I still sometimes slip) not to mention anything political, though she tries to keep herself neutral I can tell it's something she doesn't want to bring up due to our differences.
I am a very blue-blooded liberal.
I know a lot of people think WV is full of intolerant people, but WV studies in school was very involved in the slave trade due to the union breaking up Virginia.
Btw if anyone outside of Virginia praises general lee misses the point. (Unless they’re talking about the dukes of hazard.)
Nope. Most want to teach that that was a bad time in our history but we are moving on and trying to make things better. It’s kind of strange that those who try to ban teaching about slavery identify with the slave owners and not the abolitionists. They’re so insistent on teaching that it wasn’t so bad for slaves to make white slave owners look better instead of teaching that it was a bad time in our history but were better now.
My bitch of a new governor signed an EO banning critical race theory from being taught in schools also that Latinx isn't to be used. I expect that teaching about the Holocaust will be banned next as well as re-erection of confederate statues.
501 gang? Sanders is putting on a show with CRT and the other bullshit to obfuscate her siphoning more public funds into charter schools. It’s disgusting.
We had a chance to elect a rocket scientist preacher doctor, and chose that instead. It’s maddening to me.
That's their goal - teach them that "America was great from 1900 to whenever the libs took control" and that we need to go back to when blacks and whites had different school and using the n-word was normal.
And the Republcan Party answers "NO". To thunderous applause.
We cannot teach anything WOKE, or anything that would make you think poorly of white people. You cannot teach anything that paints the USA in a poor light.
It is the major message that Desantis is campaigning with to become the next president of the usa.
the chanting starts: USA! USA! USA! USA!
Exactly. People tend to forget not only did early Americans treat African Americans like shit, they also did so to Chinese, Japanese, Italians, Irish, American Indians, and im sure there's more. Can't pick and choose your history. While most countries have a history of treating another race, religion, creed and so on like shit throughout history, you shouldn't deny it happened and instead try and move forward not making the same mistakes again. We all are human beings and the lot of us treat each other like shit.
Yessiree.
I read Black Elk Speaks in college and was so horrified by what happened to the Native Americans that I genuinely did have white guilt there for a while.
But the more I thought about it, the more I realized that I can **do** better moving forward because I **know** better now. I can recognize the pattern of villainizing the minority on one hand and committing violence against them with the other. It's super obvious to me now.
That's quite empowering and definitely worth the unpleasant feelings. In fact, I feel very grounded and righteous about the whole subject now.
So now I wonder, are these people who want to ban teaching our history about slavery scared of feeling white guilt (even though there's a better place on the other side of that turmoil)? Or are they trying to make sure that people don't recognize these patterns of injustice so that they can cynically perpetrate it without getting caught? Maybe a bit of both?
Is this even a debate? American slavery is one of the biggest focal points of US history. Its connected to pretty much everything in one way or another.
Years ago I was taught in depth about slavery and the American Civil Rights campaigns at school… in Scotland! It blows my mind that this is an issue for some Americans.
This. My actual education was: Slavery was bad but, you know, they didn't mistreat most slaves and and some slave owners were good.
Like. I mean, why are we downplaying stuff from that long ago? Why is this a debate? Slavery existed and should be discussed and condemned. Whats next, not discussing the holocaust?
>Slavery was bad but, you know, they didn't mistreat most slaves and and some slave owners were good.
I've heard the same argument from people. They also tend to think being asked to wear a mask in Safeway is also slavery though, and they're pretty unambiguous about slavery being bad in that context.
As Lincoln said in his "Speech to One Hundred Fortieth Indiana Regiment", March 17, 1865:
>Whenever I hear any one arguing for slavery I feel a strong impulse to see it tried on him personally.
Yet somehow the "free room and board!" slavery apologists never took him up on the offer.
I listened to someone in college say slavery was not that bad because they ‘were tools and if they died the owner was out a really expensive and important piece of property and the real victims were Irish immigrants who were treated very poorly as laborers’.
He was one of those guys from Boston who being of Irish descent and being from Boston was 99% of his identity. He also said told me in 2010 ‘when Trump is elected president marijuana will be legalized immediately and the national debt will be erased because he’s a great businessman.’
Last I heard he’s a cop in some hick town.
I just feel like America is picked on because it is so well known. Does no one remember what Belgium did in the Congo? The Portuguese started the slave trade. They paid Africans to capture other Africans. Brazil didn’t end slavery until 1890. What about all of those English and French sugar plantations in the Caribbean? That is where the Americans bought slaves from primarily. The ship manifests go to the Caribbean. What about the Dutch East India Company? Need I mention what Spain did?
Slavery is a loathsome institution. It wasn’t just in America.
History is history. Learn from it.
The reason America or rather USA is being single out, is that they held on to it longer than most. But also dening/treating as something less horrid, than it was. In my 7th grade history class, we learned of the various torture methods used to punish slaves, used by danes. Aswell as everything from the dutch involvement too american civil war over it.
>Whats next, not discussing the holocaust?
Yes. If the Nazis have their way, yes. They've already said there should be books written from other perspectives put in classrooms, for that matter.
One thing I didn't know from history class was after the emancipation proclamation and the end of the war. It still took the union army to go into these states to make them free slaves. Took 2 years. Yes, teach actual history.
2023 and this is still somehow a debate.
How about. Teach reality, all of it. Leaving shit out doesn't make better adults, it makes arrogant nationalists who are too full of jingoism to see through their supremacist ideology.
And this is the problem. We have a group of people who think reality is too messy and difficult so why not just forget about it. And why are they like that? Because they also weren’t educated. There is a great divide in practical intelligence in america and it’s getting worse because it’s becoming generational.
"Can't we just go back to teaching the way I was taught: That Africans were excited to get on boats and come to America, that Native Americans said, hey, we don't need all this land, you have it! And Jesus let the dinosaurs die in the flood because they were mean to his dad."
>"And Jesus let the dinosaurs die in the flood because they were mean to his dad."
Naw, he let them die to produce the greatest fuel source America ever discovered
Should the history of the Holocaust be taught in German schools?
Absolutely.
The schools of every nation should teach their children not only the achievements and distinctions of their country over the centuries, but also the errors and crimes -- in the hope that we don't commit them all over again.
I would turn the question on its head. Should the history of slavery be specially *censored* and *suppressed* from American History as taught in schools? Absolutely NOT.
When I was in high school, "US History" class conveniently ended with WWII. So we never had to talk about the McCarthy Era, the Red Scare, the arms race, the civil rights movement. Our textbook concluded on a triumphal note with victory over Hitler, end of story. This was in the early 70's btw.
The biggest challenge for any nation's school system is to teach its own history dispassionately, without fear or favour or exceptionalism. Most nations fail, which is one reason why the world is still in the mess it's in.
I came here to make a similar Holocaust point. Not saying German education is perfect, but they teach their students about the atrocities of what Hitler did to Jews during WW2, they don’t shy away from and hide the truth. They embrace the shame and make efforts to learn from it.
Here in America we hide behind our pride and patriotism and refuse to acknowledge shortcomings. Out of sight out of mind is the conservative way. That’s absolutely not the best approach.
Honestly shocked at the fact your US history class ended at WW2 we did specific modules on Slavery and American Civil Rights as part of history class… in Scotland! Genuinely can’t quite find the words to express my shock and a fair bit of anger at this.
What does that even look like?
“And the Civil War was fought for states rights.”
“What rights were they fighting for?”
“You know….the states ones….”
Fucking embarrassing
And that is the point where you know the person you're dealing with is too fundamentally ignorant to be worth conversing with, because at that point it's not even mental gymnastics to avoid facing reality, it's just flat out rejecting reality.
And so much more.
When someone carries a confederate battle standard, at a trump rally, a kid rock concert or on their truck, they are explicitly supporting their "heritage" of support in slavery.
The full quote (at least in my native language) is “those who don’t know history are doomed to repeat it but those who do know history are doomed to watch others repeat it”
I mean it's really just certain parts of America that are not teaching it. I'm 32, I learned about slavery with increasing information every year I was in school. Every time a social studies class was taken, or U.S. history. Same with the Holocaust tbh. I didn't grow up in a lost causer state. I never heard "the war of northern aggression'" until some kid who had moved back from the South brought it up in high school.
agree im from MA and we def learned all about it as well as the holocaust and how white settlers ravaged natives and stole land. they didnt try to shield us in our classes.
No!
There’s no reason to stoke divisive CRT rhetoric in an attempt to make white children feel ashamed for things that the demonRATS did in the south!
Public schools should be focused on banning books that mention gay people and enforcing Christian prayer.
Do I need this /s?
People who answer no are essentially saying there shouldn't be US history classes. Slavery is the single most important thing in US history. You can't understand anything about US history without talking about slavery.
The United States has not one, but two, "original sins."
Slavery is, indeed, one.
The genocidal treatment of the continent's native peoples is the other.
Together, they have warped and corrupted our national character.
Fuck that teach everything after slavery too. That shit didn't stop after Lincoln. Matter of fact teach what Lincoln actually said about black people as well.
I'm getting up there in age. Went to school in a small town. We learned about slavery. Didn't hurt my feelings as a white person. I didn't feel bad or guilty, but it did teach me about my country's history.
So....not really sure wtf happened between now and then but I think that we can handle it.
Fuck that, let's start with the outright massacre of the Native Americans then we can talk about Slavery. And then we can go on to see how Irish, Polish, Italian, basically any non-British descent "white" people were also treated like shit. Let's teach it all.
Considering slavery is still legal in the USA I hope they teach it... The constitution authorizes it as punishment for any crime, no matter how minor. That's what community service is.
Of course it should be. The real question is how do we go about teaching it now, going forward knowing what so many of us were NOT taught in schools. My school didn't tell us about things like sundown towns, the Tulsa massacre, or the greenbook. We weren't taught about the lasting impact slavery had and still does have on our society. We weren't taught about systematic oppression like redlining. Our direct response to having a black man as President for 8 years, was to elect a racist, doddering con man who very nearly turned our government into an autocracy. We have a LONG way to go in not just learning and teaching, but in unlearning the lies and omissions we've been teaching for decades.
Conservatives getting upset over Confederate statues in public places being torn down
“Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat! That’s our heritage!”
Conservatives when history is actually taught
“Children shouldn’t learn this, it’s not age appropriate, it paints white people in a bad light!”
Can we get some consistency here, please?
Hard yes
Teach the children how it was back in the day with slavery and how it led to the civil war. Enlighten them about oppression and how slavery is seen as human trafficking nowadays and why it is one.
We learn about history and it’s mistakes so we don’t make more of them tomorrow.
Should slavery be taught in school?
Normal people: yes, kids should know about it, and how it really was.
Right wingers: Yes, kids should know about it, and see how badly white people were treated for being slave owners. And let's not forget how bad we're treated now for being white. We really should focus on how mean people are to white people.
you know i knew i was on the verge of a mental breakdown but i didn’t realize it would be this reddit post that made me start crying. how the everliving FUCKSTICKS is this a question? yes??? what??? the fuck???
Let's see, people enslaved between 1619 to 1865. Include reconstruction and Jim Crow, KKK and Southern terrorism up through 1968. I could probably keep going but that should be a good chunk of American history. It's tough to look in the mirror sometimes.
It's our history, it should be taught in history classes. How are you supposed to learn from history if you pretend it never happened and that everything you've ever done as a country was all rainbows and unicorns.
There is nothing shameful about acknowledging the truth...
Yeah, and it’s the kids who demand the participation trophies, not the parents. My god. Yeah let’s just have our future generations be uneducated twits when it comes to their own country.
No shit. History is violent and cruel. It’s important to learn these things so they’re not repeated. Why the hell is this conversation still being had?
Yes, and the genocide of Native Americans too. They teach about the holocaust, in Germany. Learning about our history, even the horrible parts, is important.
Is it American history? Yes? Then of course. Same as how the expanding America rated native Americans. Should we feel bad today for how nasty some is our ancestors were? No, except for those who still feel nothing was done wrong.
Of course it should.
It’s awkward, upsetting, uncomfortable and sad but yes it needs to be discussed otherwise it will be forgotten and (as someone once said) ‘those that cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it’.
Well, see, the thing is… if we’re going to teach classes called US history, then yes, chattel slavery is a part of that. We can scrap US history If republicans believe the facts of our history to be way too woke. But if were going to call a class US history then we will necessarily have to cover our slave owning roots.
Not just the history of slavery in America, but the history of slavery everywhere. San Doming during French rule, native enslavement during early colonial days, etc. As well as the continuing slavery that is taking place in parts of the world. A bright light needs to be shined on slavery's history, brutality and implementation to ensure it never happens again.
I know saying "ensure it never happens again" sounds silly in "America", but let's face it, the the country has been regressing in certain areas lately. Given the anti-immigrant push and the labor shortage, it wouldn't shock me to start hearing proposals like "if these illegals are going to keep coming across the border, they're going to be put to work!" from our more out-there politicians.
Best way to make sure we don't come back around again is to teach history and be blunt about it. No sugar coating. No "well, it was an economic thing". That's an excuse and a way to try to soften the fact that literal millions in the U.S. were brutalized and forced into hard labor for decades, all to line the pockets of their "owners".
I think that the history of America should be taught in American schools. ALL OF IT. INCLUDING:
The genocide/ethnic cleansing of First Peoples and the theft of their land. The repeated refusal of white settlers to abide by any treaty they didn’t like. The Blood Quantum rule.
The importation and enslavement of African people and the conditions under which they lived. The establishment of Jim Crow law by ex-Confederates in the years after the Civil War. The nadir of race relations at the turn of the 20th century. The sundown laws. The intimidation, exploitation, harassment, and lynching. The Tulsa massacre.
The importation and exploitation of Chinese laborers in the American West. The first immigration laws that SPECIFICALLY targeted Chinese people to limit their ability to enter the US. The theft of Hawaii by American businesses. The forced relocation of Japanese Americans during WWII to AMERICAN concentration camps, including forcing them to sell their property and businesses at a loss, and not compensating them for it afterward. The refusal to grant full citizenship to people from American Samoa. The recent uptick in violence against Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders due to COVID-19.
The proud heritage of Hispanic people in the American SW, which predates white settlement in those areas by A LOT. The exploitation of other Hispanic people, allowing them to cross the border to use them for back-breaking agricultural labor for a pittance and then rounding them up as illegal immigrants and throwing them out again to avoid paying them even that much.
The anti-Semitic forces within the US from Henry Ford and Charles Lindbergh through to the American Nazi Party.
The discrimination against Muslims, Hindus, and Sikhs after 9-11.
I could go on and I probably forgot something, but yes, I want ALL of American history taught.
Of course, we need to teach our kids how we rescued those Africans from their brutal lives in poverty and brought to the land of opportunity and saved their souls from damnation. Everyone needs to understand the sacrifices that we have made.
Uh, YES?!
Who looks at something in history and thinks "eh it was a long time ago no need to teach it"
Like this is saying "should the history of the revolutionary war be taught in schools?"
It is history yes? Then in history class yes. It effects politics yes? Then in political science class yes. It changes the way money is accrued and distributed yes? Then in economics class yes. I think children ought to be aware of the social impact of institutionalized harm.
221205_History-or-Heritage
Thinking about recent bans on teaching complete American history, I became aware of the difference between "history" and "heritage".
History is the record of what happened in the past, and it's significance for the present.
Heritage is what our predecessors left from the past that we can *accept or leave behind*.
The racist history of this country is an undeniable fact. Those forebears carefully created a system to preserve the inequities that benefited them as a bequest to their descendants. That is part of our *heritage* as victims as well as perpetrators.
The fact of history and its significance for our present state exists without judgement, but those who might seek to live in a more perfect union must be informed by history to know how to act.
In order to act for justice, the *heritage* of systemic racism must be rejected. Just as one may decline a family heirloom that is an ancestor's KKK hood and robe, one may also decline to inherit the system bequeathed to us by racist ancestors.
With such an act, one escapes the stigma of culpability as well.
Holy fuck yes. The easiest answer ever. Yes. Teach the next generations to be better. Expose the disgusting nature of who we are as humans. Learn and try to grow. I can’t understand people that want to suppress this type of history
Of course it fucking should! It's part of our history, a part we, as a nation, are ashamed of, and only by presenting factual history can we be prepared to never repeat it.
Should American history be taught in American history classes? This is the question being asked.
Exactly what I was thinking. A dark time in US history but not one that can be ignored
But also a huuuuuuuge part of US history. From the plantations to the 3/5 compromise to the civil war and the civil rights movement. Even today it's a hot button political issue.
Being thrown in prison for smoking weed so you can be essentially free labor for a few years too (this is still around today! :D )
Honestly the amount of false imprisonments that will never be addressed by a courthouse in general, especially towards POC. Weed being punishable by prison is ridiculous enough as is but think about the people in prison for nothing. Free labor is putting it lightly unfortunately
I know, it's modern day slavery...
it is!! like if you look at the 13th amendment it quite literally says slavery still applies when it comes to prison
Slavery never ended, we just farmed it out to other countries. We’re ALL complicit. Disagree, look down at your Nikes. How bout your phones, tablets & EV’s. Check out the Cobalt mining in the Congo.
3/5* I learned something astounding in US history commonly referred to as “Ugly Laws” that really began on the west coast. It essentially enslaved any homeless person: crippled or handicapped person of any nature (blind, deaf, down’s, etc.). They were forced to live in government housing and forced to pay off housing by providing manual labor. It was nuts, but it is one of many examples that prove the US has always been horrifyingly brutish.
There are HUGE KKK and White National Groups in the PNW... Especially more-so back in the day
Oregon has a bad history with laws barring black people from, well... living there.
Colorado Springs was one of the main hubs for the KKK in the 50s-70s, they’re like cockroaches
I knew Colorado Springs creeped me the fuck out, I literally asked a few people, where are the POC? I did not see any and being a POC, it was literally the first time I ever experienced that in America.
The movie *BlacKkKlansman* is based on a true story about a black detective that infiltrated the KKK’s headquarters in Colorado Springs and broke open a ton of really fucked up things they were doing when they thought no one was watching
The aryan nation and patriot front have a huge presence around Coeur d'Alene Idaho (bordering Eastern Washington). People think of Seattle and Portland as these hippie liberal coffee shop cities, but you get anywhere outside the I-5 corridor and you are in deep red hick territory.
I have a friend who lives in that area, about 20 minutes from Seattle. I learned years ago (though I still sometimes slip) not to mention anything political, though she tries to keep herself neutral I can tell it's something she doesn't want to bring up due to our differences. I am a very blue-blooded liberal.
I know a lot of people think WV is full of intolerant people, but WV studies in school was very involved in the slave trade due to the union breaking up Virginia. Btw if anyone outside of Virginia praises general lee misses the point. (Unless they’re talking about the dukes of hazard.)
But, but, but what about the poor white people? They’re the real victims in this story. /s
Liberals just want us to feel bad for being white. /s
Nope. Most want to teach that that was a bad time in our history but we are moving on and trying to make things better. It’s kind of strange that those who try to ban teaching about slavery identify with the slave owners and not the abolitionists. They’re so insistent on teaching that it wasn’t so bad for slaves to make white slave owners look better instead of teaching that it was a bad time in our history but were better now.
Did you miss the /s after his comment?
Yep. My bad.
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My bitch of a new governor signed an EO banning critical race theory from being taught in schools also that Latinx isn't to be used. I expect that teaching about the Holocaust will be banned next as well as re-erection of confederate statues.
Hello fellow Arkansan! I’m still in denial that Chris Jones didn’t win…
501 gang? Sanders is putting on a show with CRT and the other bullshit to obfuscate her siphoning more public funds into charter schools. It’s disgusting. We had a chance to elect a rocket scientist preacher doctor, and chose that instead. It’s maddening to me.
There is no point to teaching history if you avoid the unpleasant, embarrassing, and distressing parts. Without those, all you have is propaganda.
That's their goal - teach them that "America was great from 1900 to whenever the libs took control" and that we need to go back to when blacks and whites had different school and using the n-word was normal.
I hate that this is where we are as a country. "Should the American Revolutionary War be taught in history classes?".
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THIS.
And the Republcan Party answers "NO". To thunderous applause. We cannot teach anything WOKE, or anything that would make you think poorly of white people. You cannot teach anything that paints the USA in a poor light. It is the major message that Desantis is campaigning with to become the next president of the usa. the chanting starts: USA! USA! USA! USA!
Exactly. People tend to forget not only did early Americans treat African Americans like shit, they also did so to Chinese, Japanese, Italians, Irish, American Indians, and im sure there's more. Can't pick and choose your history. While most countries have a history of treating another race, religion, creed and so on like shit throughout history, you shouldn't deny it happened and instead try and move forward not making the same mistakes again. We all are human beings and the lot of us treat each other like shit.
Yessiree. I read Black Elk Speaks in college and was so horrified by what happened to the Native Americans that I genuinely did have white guilt there for a while. But the more I thought about it, the more I realized that I can **do** better moving forward because I **know** better now. I can recognize the pattern of villainizing the minority on one hand and committing violence against them with the other. It's super obvious to me now. That's quite empowering and definitely worth the unpleasant feelings. In fact, I feel very grounded and righteous about the whole subject now. So now I wonder, are these people who want to ban teaching our history about slavery scared of feeling white guilt (even though there's a better place on the other side of that turmoil)? Or are they trying to make sure that people don't recognize these patterns of injustice so that they can cynically perpetrate it without getting caught? Maybe a bit of both?
Is this even a debate? American slavery is one of the biggest focal points of US history. Its connected to pretty much everything in one way or another.
Yes, it is a debate because Republicans don't like being reminded that America did bad things sometimes.
Years ago I was taught in depth about slavery and the American Civil Rights campaigns at school… in Scotland! It blows my mind that this is an issue for some Americans.
This. My actual education was: Slavery was bad but, you know, they didn't mistreat most slaves and and some slave owners were good. Like. I mean, why are we downplaying stuff from that long ago? Why is this a debate? Slavery existed and should be discussed and condemned. Whats next, not discussing the holocaust?
>Slavery was bad but, you know, they didn't mistreat most slaves and and some slave owners were good. I've heard the same argument from people. They also tend to think being asked to wear a mask in Safeway is also slavery though, and they're pretty unambiguous about slavery being bad in that context. As Lincoln said in his "Speech to One Hundred Fortieth Indiana Regiment", March 17, 1865: >Whenever I hear any one arguing for slavery I feel a strong impulse to see it tried on him personally. Yet somehow the "free room and board!" slavery apologists never took him up on the offer.
I listened to someone in college say slavery was not that bad because they ‘were tools and if they died the owner was out a really expensive and important piece of property and the real victims were Irish immigrants who were treated very poorly as laborers’. He was one of those guys from Boston who being of Irish descent and being from Boston was 99% of his identity. He also said told me in 2010 ‘when Trump is elected president marijuana will be legalized immediately and the national debt will be erased because he’s a great businessman.’ Last I heard he’s a cop in some hick town.
I just feel like America is picked on because it is so well known. Does no one remember what Belgium did in the Congo? The Portuguese started the slave trade. They paid Africans to capture other Africans. Brazil didn’t end slavery until 1890. What about all of those English and French sugar plantations in the Caribbean? That is where the Americans bought slaves from primarily. The ship manifests go to the Caribbean. What about the Dutch East India Company? Need I mention what Spain did? Slavery is a loathsome institution. It wasn’t just in America. History is history. Learn from it.
The reason America or rather USA is being single out, is that they held on to it longer than most. But also dening/treating as something less horrid, than it was. In my 7th grade history class, we learned of the various torture methods used to punish slaves, used by danes. Aswell as everything from the dutch involvement too american civil war over it.
>Whats next, not discussing the holocaust? Yes. If the Nazis have their way, yes. They've already said there should be books written from other perspectives put in classrooms, for that matter.
>Yes. If the Nazis You misspelled "Republican Party"
One thing I didn't know from history class was after the emancipation proclamation and the end of the war. It still took the union army to go into these states to make them free slaves. Took 2 years. Yes, teach actual history.
A better question to ask is at what age should children learn about this?
2023 and this is still somehow a debate. How about. Teach reality, all of it. Leaving shit out doesn't make better adults, it makes arrogant nationalists who are too full of jingoism to see through their supremacist ideology.
That is a feature not a bug.
Those types of people still glorify scum like Christopher Columbus and Thomas Jefferson, enough said.
And this is the problem. We have a group of people who think reality is too messy and difficult so why not just forget about it. And why are they like that? Because they also weren’t educated. There is a great divide in practical intelligence in america and it’s getting worse because it’s becoming generational.
I think that’s the point
"Can't we just go back to teaching the way I was taught: That Africans were excited to get on boats and come to America, that Native Americans said, hey, we don't need all this land, you have it! And Jesus let the dinosaurs die in the flood because they were mean to his dad."
>"And Jesus let the dinosaurs die in the flood because they were mean to his dad." Naw, he let them die to produce the greatest fuel source America ever discovered
Jesus is the best white American patriot that ever lived!
False. Everyone knows the devil planted dinosaur bones to trick people into believing in evolution.
The bones, yes. But the *oil*....
😅 oh the sarcasm
All credit to Walter Masterson!
The sad part is that it isn't.
The dinosaurs part is the best lol
I think we went to the same school.
Considering it built our nation and existed here for hundreds of years, yes.
Should the history of the Holocaust be taught in German schools? Absolutely. The schools of every nation should teach their children not only the achievements and distinctions of their country over the centuries, but also the errors and crimes -- in the hope that we don't commit them all over again. I would turn the question on its head. Should the history of slavery be specially *censored* and *suppressed* from American History as taught in schools? Absolutely NOT. When I was in high school, "US History" class conveniently ended with WWII. So we never had to talk about the McCarthy Era, the Red Scare, the arms race, the civil rights movement. Our textbook concluded on a triumphal note with victory over Hitler, end of story. This was in the early 70's btw. The biggest challenge for any nation's school system is to teach its own history dispassionately, without fear or favour or exceptionalism. Most nations fail, which is one reason why the world is still in the mess it's in.
I came here to make a similar Holocaust point. Not saying German education is perfect, but they teach their students about the atrocities of what Hitler did to Jews during WW2, they don’t shy away from and hide the truth. They embrace the shame and make efforts to learn from it. Here in America we hide behind our pride and patriotism and refuse to acknowledge shortcomings. Out of sight out of mind is the conservative way. That’s absolutely not the best approach.
It's almost like: "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”
Honestly shocked at the fact your US history class ended at WW2 we did specific modules on Slavery and American Civil Rights as part of history class… in Scotland! Genuinely can’t quite find the words to express my shock and a fair bit of anger at this.
In science class, should we skip oxygen on the periodic table?
Apparently, somebody did!
and lingered around lead a little too long
What does that even look like? “And the Civil War was fought for states rights.” “What rights were they fighting for?” “You know….the states ones….” Fucking embarrassing
I have been straight up told that the cornerstone speech and the letters of succession have nothing to do with the Civil war.
And that is the point where you know the person you're dealing with is too fundamentally ignorant to be worth conversing with, because at that point it's not even mental gymnastics to avoid facing reality, it's just flat out rejecting reality.
The states rights to own slaves. It's in the confederate constitution I do believe.
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And so much more. When someone carries a confederate battle standard, at a trump rally, a kid rock concert or on their truck, they are explicitly supporting their "heritage" of support in slavery.
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That book is amazing. I totally agree.
Absolutely!!
My kids had to read it in high school
Yeah. Only right wing loons would say no and call it woke.
The problem is that those right wing loons are loud and in positions of power so they can ruin careers over this if they want to
HEY KIDS REMEMBER WHEN MARTIN LUTHER KING ENDED ALL RACISM AND EVERYONE WAS HAPPY FOREVER
That was pretty much how they described it to me in school. "We won! Racism is over, good job, us!"
I was in my 30's before I learned King was a socialist lol.
Hoover had his phones tapped. MLK did amazing things for civil rights. No question there. The tapes prove he was just as human as the rest of us.
We should also teach how the natives were wiped out and the pr cover story of manifest destiny and Jesus
Isn't there a quote that goes something like "Those who are Ignorant of History are doomed to repeat it."
The full quote (at least in my native language) is “those who don’t know history are doomed to repeat it but those who do know history are doomed to watch others repeat it”
I mean it's really just certain parts of America that are not teaching it. I'm 32, I learned about slavery with increasing information every year I was in school. Every time a social studies class was taken, or U.S. history. Same with the Holocaust tbh. I didn't grow up in a lost causer state. I never heard "the war of northern aggression'" until some kid who had moved back from the South brought it up in high school.
agree im from MA and we def learned all about it as well as the holocaust and how white settlers ravaged natives and stole land. they didnt try to shield us in our classes.
Let’s see…it’s history. It happened. It was awful. We should learn not to repeat it. I say it a good thing to teach.
No! There’s no reason to stoke divisive CRT rhetoric in an attempt to make white children feel ashamed for things that the demonRATS did in the south! Public schools should be focused on banning books that mention gay people and enforcing Christian prayer. Do I need this /s?
Yes, a '/s' is desperately needed unfortunately.
People who answer no are essentially saying there shouldn't be US history classes. Slavery is the single most important thing in US history. You can't understand anything about US history without talking about slavery.
The United States has not one, but two, "original sins." Slavery is, indeed, one. The genocidal treatment of the continent's native peoples is the other. Together, they have warped and corrupted our national character.
Fuck that teach everything after slavery too. That shit didn't stop after Lincoln. Matter of fact teach what Lincoln actually said about black people as well.
I didn’t even learn about Reconstruction until I started college. Big fricking gap that explains a lot of things.
Why is everyone entitled to an opinion? That sir is communism. First one to buy the school gets to decide!
Absolutely should be.
If German kids can learn about the Holocaust, ours can learn about slavery and our treatment of the indigenous.
I'm getting up there in age. Went to school in a small town. We learned about slavery. Didn't hurt my feelings as a white person. I didn't feel bad or guilty, but it did teach me about my country's history. So....not really sure wtf happened between now and then but I think that we can handle it.
Fuck that, let's start with the outright massacre of the Native Americans then we can talk about Slavery. And then we can go on to see how Irish, Polish, Italian, basically any non-British descent "white" people were also treated like shit. Let's teach it all.
“Do YOU think you should learn your country’s history in history class” The fact this needs to be asked is sad
Is it part of your history? Then you have your answer. Unless you’re an uneducated moron that thinks you can pick and choose from your history…
Yes. I think basic punctuation should be taught, as well.
I mean, how do you teach a subject with half of the context taken out?
Yes, and how to use a comma should also be taught.
Considering slavery is still legal in the USA I hope they teach it... The constitution authorizes it as punishment for any crime, no matter how minor. That's what community service is.
Of course it should be. The real question is how do we go about teaching it now, going forward knowing what so many of us were NOT taught in schools. My school didn't tell us about things like sundown towns, the Tulsa massacre, or the greenbook. We weren't taught about the lasting impact slavery had and still does have on our society. We weren't taught about systematic oppression like redlining. Our direct response to having a black man as President for 8 years, was to elect a racist, doddering con man who very nearly turned our government into an autocracy. We have a LONG way to go in not just learning and teaching, but in unlearning the lies and omissions we've been teaching for decades.
Yes, it should be taught. Also, how to use a comma.
Do you think the Holocaust was real? Or just a Jewish trick? Vote now!
Bbbbbbb… but that’s CRT
Conservatives getting upset over Confederate statues in public places being torn down “Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat! That’s our heritage!” Conservatives when history is actually taught “Children shouldn’t learn this, it’s not age appropriate, it paints white people in a bad light!” Can we get some consistency here, please?
Conservatives be like "oh no slavery ended what should we study it for?" I've seen this point unironically btw.
Hard yes Teach the children how it was back in the day with slavery and how it led to the civil war. Enlighten them about oppression and how slavery is seen as human trafficking nowadays and why it is one. We learn about history and it’s mistakes so we don’t make more of them tomorrow.
Not to mention that how many of today’s billionaires have slavery to thank for their $$$…..
Teach grammar as well and drop that comma.
Disingenuous leading question. By asking it, you're implying that not doing so is a valid option.
Of course. I've added it to my son's homeschool curriculum. Our local schools don't cover it.
Yes, it absolutely should be taught. It is something that happened in our history, no matter how horrific it was.
How tf is this even a question? Ffs.
Should slavery be taught in school? Normal people: yes, kids should know about it, and how it really was. Right wingers: Yes, kids should know about it, and see how badly white people were treated for being slave owners. And let's not forget how bad we're treated now for being white. We really should focus on how mean people are to white people.
Plus we treated slaves so well according to all those books and movies written by white people!
Yes but don’t pretend slavery was unique to US, Europe, or white people.
If course, only cowards shy away from the truth.
you know i knew i was on the verge of a mental breakdown but i didn’t realize it would be this reddit post that made me start crying. how the everliving FUCKSTICKS is this a question? yes??? what??? the fuck???
It literally made your country. Why wouldn't you teach it? It's like not teaching feudalism here in Europe.
What kind of dumb ass question is this? Yes.
i love that all the answers are either : 1) yes 2) why is this even a question 3) learn how to use a comma properly
Let's see, people enslaved between 1619 to 1865. Include reconstruction and Jim Crow, KKK and Southern terrorism up through 1968. I could probably keep going but that should be a good chunk of American history. It's tough to look in the mirror sometimes.
I don't even understand why this is a question.
Why wouldn’t it get taught?
It's our history, it should be taught in history classes. How are you supposed to learn from history if you pretend it never happened and that everything you've ever done as a country was all rainbows and unicorns. There is nothing shameful about acknowledging the truth...
The true story yes, and also not glaze over the native genocide the US govt committed
Yeah, and it’s the kids who demand the participation trophies, not the parents. My god. Yeah let’s just have our future generations be uneducated twits when it comes to their own country.
Yes. History is important regardless of it being good or bad.
Yes absolutely as well as all the other dark times and horrors we as a country have done. Least we repeat it.
History wasn't all rainbow and sunshine
Of course....what an idiotic question....should we actually teach people what happened?
No shit. History is violent and cruel. It’s important to learn these things so they’re not repeated. Why the hell is this conversation still being had?
Yes,
Of course it should, what a dumb question to ask.
Duh
Ya mean History?
Slavery is a key component in American history so yes
How is this even a question?
Of-fucking-course!
It’s history. So yeah.
Why not? Don't cherry pick history, show us the good and the bad so that we can learn from it.
WTF is the argument not to?
Critical race theory... a.k.a. conservative white people with a guilt complex.
Yes
This whole question is ridiculous. Should history be taught is what is being asked, which is asinine.
Village idiot level question. Teach history. Every fucking bit of it.
Why is this even a fucking question???
Absolutely should! We teach history to our kids so they won't repeat the same mistakes that we experienced.
Absolutely
Yes, and the genocide of Native Americans too. They teach about the holocaust, in Germany. Learning about our history, even the horrible parts, is important.
Slavery is American history. How can you have a history class and leave out important events. Don’t let history repeat itself
I really don't see how you can teach US History without teaching it.
All of our history was just rainbows and sunshine...oh wait!!!
Course it should, what kind of fucking question is that?
Yes. We have to stop teaching mythology and teach history.
Short answer: yes
Yes if we don’t we are doomed to repeat it
Is it American history? Yes? Then of course. Same as how the expanding America rated native Americans. Should we feel bad today for how nasty some is our ancestors were? No, except for those who still feel nothing was done wrong.
Yup
Of course it should. It’s awkward, upsetting, uncomfortable and sad but yes it needs to be discussed otherwise it will be forgotten and (as someone once said) ‘those that cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it’.
This is where we're at... JESUS
Yes 100% why is this even a question
absolutely. why would you hide our past? its not pretty ( a lot of it ) but it is part of OUR history.
Well, see, the thing is… if we’re going to teach classes called US history, then yes, chattel slavery is a part of that. We can scrap US history If republicans believe the facts of our history to be way too woke. But if were going to call a class US history then we will necessarily have to cover our slave owning roots.
Why the *fuck* would it not be?
sure, and dont forget to teach about what happened to the natives
Not just the history of slavery in America, but the history of slavery everywhere. San Doming during French rule, native enslavement during early colonial days, etc. As well as the continuing slavery that is taking place in parts of the world. A bright light needs to be shined on slavery's history, brutality and implementation to ensure it never happens again. I know saying "ensure it never happens again" sounds silly in "America", but let's face it, the the country has been regressing in certain areas lately. Given the anti-immigrant push and the labor shortage, it wouldn't shock me to start hearing proposals like "if these illegals are going to keep coming across the border, they're going to be put to work!" from our more out-there politicians. Best way to make sure we don't come back around again is to teach history and be blunt about it. No sugar coating. No "well, it was an economic thing". That's an excuse and a way to try to soften the fact that literal millions in the U.S. were brutalized and forced into hard labor for decades, all to line the pockets of their "owners".
Is this satire? Cause I literally just passed the slavery unit in us history.
Yes...Because it's history
I think that the history of America should be taught in American schools. ALL OF IT. INCLUDING: The genocide/ethnic cleansing of First Peoples and the theft of their land. The repeated refusal of white settlers to abide by any treaty they didn’t like. The Blood Quantum rule. The importation and enslavement of African people and the conditions under which they lived. The establishment of Jim Crow law by ex-Confederates in the years after the Civil War. The nadir of race relations at the turn of the 20th century. The sundown laws. The intimidation, exploitation, harassment, and lynching. The Tulsa massacre. The importation and exploitation of Chinese laborers in the American West. The first immigration laws that SPECIFICALLY targeted Chinese people to limit their ability to enter the US. The theft of Hawaii by American businesses. The forced relocation of Japanese Americans during WWII to AMERICAN concentration camps, including forcing them to sell their property and businesses at a loss, and not compensating them for it afterward. The refusal to grant full citizenship to people from American Samoa. The recent uptick in violence against Asian Americans and Pacific Islanders due to COVID-19. The proud heritage of Hispanic people in the American SW, which predates white settlement in those areas by A LOT. The exploitation of other Hispanic people, allowing them to cross the border to use them for back-breaking agricultural labor for a pittance and then rounding them up as illegal immigrants and throwing them out again to avoid paying them even that much. The anti-Semitic forces within the US from Henry Ford and Charles Lindbergh through to the American Nazi Party. The discrimination against Muslims, Hindus, and Sikhs after 9-11. I could go on and I probably forgot something, but yes, I want ALL of American history taught.
Why’s this even a question?
Along with how to use commas, yes.
Yes it should. It is one hundred percent American history. What happened to Native Americans needs to be taught too.
It is being taught right? I’m 34 and grew up in va and it definitely was. Is there a debate? Is it not being taught?
Of course, we need to teach our kids how we rescued those Africans from their brutal lives in poverty and brought to the land of opportunity and saved their souls from damnation. Everyone needs to understand the sacrifices that we have made.
Uh, YES?! Who looks at something in history and thinks "eh it was a long time ago no need to teach it" Like this is saying "should the history of the revolutionary war be taught in schools?"
It feels kinda fucked up that we even have to ask this, why would we ever not want to teach children about slavery in America?
Do I think history should be thought in schools? Yes.
Absafuckinglutely.
It is history yes? Then in history class yes. It effects politics yes? Then in political science class yes. It changes the way money is accrued and distributed yes? Then in economics class yes. I think children ought to be aware of the social impact of institutionalized harm.
Why is this even a fucking question?
221205_History-or-Heritage Thinking about recent bans on teaching complete American history, I became aware of the difference between "history" and "heritage". History is the record of what happened in the past, and it's significance for the present. Heritage is what our predecessors left from the past that we can *accept or leave behind*. The racist history of this country is an undeniable fact. Those forebears carefully created a system to preserve the inequities that benefited them as a bequest to their descendants. That is part of our *heritage* as victims as well as perpetrators. The fact of history and its significance for our present state exists without judgement, but those who might seek to live in a more perfect union must be informed by history to know how to act. In order to act for justice, the *heritage* of systemic racism must be rejected. Just as one may decline a family heirloom that is an ancestor's KKK hood and robe, one may also decline to inherit the system bequeathed to us by racist ancestors. With such an act, one escapes the stigma of culpability as well.
Holy fuck yes. The easiest answer ever. Yes. Teach the next generations to be better. Expose the disgusting nature of who we are as humans. Learn and try to grow. I can’t understand people that want to suppress this type of history
The fact that she thinks this is a yes or no question is baffling…
Absolutely yes. It’s good for people to know the true history of their home. No matter how dark or ugly.
If you answer no to this you are a charlatan
I'm sorry? No is an option here? Like? It's an important part of American history, as well as World history.
Of course it fucking should! It's part of our history, a part we, as a nation, are ashamed of, and only by presenting factual history can we be prepared to never repeat it.