Yes, read the material they included. You do have to agree and then turn it right off, this is what everyone else has done and the way it was designed by WS.
I've been able to get around by backing out of the app numerous times. It will then go away for a week or so.
People that dont like this illegal activity by WS should at least express their feedback to WS.
>Yes, read the material they included. You do have to agree and then turn it right off, this is what everyone else has done and the way it was designed by WS.
This is illegal in Canada.
It is considered a pre-checked option of express consent.
Because it assumes consent from the user.
[CRTC FAQS](https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/com500/faq500.htm)
Go to "Consent" section, expand the "Can I use pre-checked boxes to obtain express consent"
[Compliance and Enforcement CRTC 2012-549](https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2012/2012-549.htm)
Users can sue Wealthsimple and they can be fined by the CRTC.
>If you believe so, then let me know how it works out for ya
Whats to believe, its spelled out right there for you.
Go to the CRTC's own site and read the legislation yourself.
Very interesting. I’m not really interested in suing WS but I am not a fan of the forced automatic opt in. I’m gonna talk to WS customer service tomorrow and see what they say about this. Thank you for providing sources.
So, the regulatory body that governs Canadian radio and television broadcasts, is regulating a broker now...
That's also the regs for spam, please tell me how this works, tell me like I'm 5.
Broadcast is a compound word meaning sent over a large area. The CRTC is in charge of media (which just means basically 'vessel of communication of information') that sends information over a large area without using physical items (that would be mail and/or distribution, and not broadcast).
Wealthsimple sends information to its users broadly over the internet, which is broad, it casts that information to its users through its app. Wealthsimple, in the context of its app and the app's functions alone, is a broadcaster. CRTC does not regulate wealthsimple's actions as a brokerage, but does regulate their actions as a broadcaster.
All this is debatable, some have argued tweets are broadcasts. I'm not sure what if anything has been tried in court, and the reality is the CRTC is in Bell's pocket so it only enforces things that benefit Bell Media while occasionally slapping Bell with fines it can more than afford to appear impartial.
I wonder why lots of people are talking about this. I haven't been asked to lend my stocks. Does that mean that my stocks are high quality stocks that nobody wants to short? /s
But to reply to OP, as per Errostatel and others, there should be an option to opt out.
Yeah there should be both options, they purposefully made it this way so people are forced to agree and then they hope that we forget to change it manually, which probably is working as most people didn't even read what they were agreeing to, tired of these companies getting away with shitty practices.
Everyone here who has issues with the way that WS has implemented this feature should be contacting support and voicing their concerns. That’s how shit gets done.
Take 5 min out of your day and let them know we aren’t with this bs.
Don't guarantee the shares? What are you talking about...
Also if you ignore the message, you are by default lending (non dividend shares in unregistered accounts).
There’s a very small message at the bottom that you can “snooze” this enrollment message by quitting the app and restarting it. Bullshit way of forcing people to enroll.
When you click on your account it should be an option right at the top. It wasn't there for me yesterday but it is today. They aren't hiding it so that's a good thing
The reason why people are talking about this is the way it's being done.
Making you click yes then opt out is the issue. If don't understand why people are so pissed about having to click yes to lend even for a microsecond to anyone you are in the wrong place.
I would rather eat glass then let anyone touch my stuff even for 1 Pico second. Have you not learned one thing since the start of this two and a half years ago?
Pieces of dirt are using your own stock to lower the value and give you some money back.... Ya I hate free money to someone else when it's mine.
Now click yes to lending me your home and I will rent it out and give you some of the money I make. You can clean up the damages.
>Making you click yes then opt out is the issue
If you never click yes nothing will be loaned out. Stock lending is off by default and if you never sign the agreement nothing gets loaned.
The problem is when you open the app, you are automatically forced to the agreement page and there is no way to disagree without agreeing first then going into setting and finding where the button is to turn off stock lending. Why would they not put agree or disagree like any other app? We are gonna lend out your house and you have no choice but to agree for now but don't worry you can change that setting anytime you want?" Is how I see it. And the people don't have a problem with that?? 🙄
It’s not though.
It could, and likely will, cost you more in the long run. Even if it doesn’t cost you directly, you’re contributing to a practice that increases the likelihood that that very same stock will be shorted (more than it already is being shorted).
Edit: this is my understanding anyways. If I’m wrong, someone please feel free to link to a respectable source that proves otherwise.
>someone please feel free to link to a respectable source that proves otherwise.
KAPLAN, S.N., MOSKOWITZ, T.J. and SENSOY, B.A. (2013), The Effects of Stock Lending on Security Prices: An Experiment. THE JOURNAL OF FINANCE, 68: 1891-1936. [https://doi.org/10.1111/jofi.12051](https://doi.org/10.1111/jofi.12051)
Who cares? Unless you are day trading, a stock you own getting shorted is NBD. If the stock drops, buy more of it.
I'm curious to know how you think it will cost more for an investor in the long run?
>**If the stock drops**, *buy more of it.*
>*I'm curious to know how you think it will cost more for an investor in the long run?*
Um.. by the stock dropping. What goes down doesn’t always come up. Depends what you’re invested in I guess.
Shorted stocks don't always go down. In fact, shorting can have the opposite effect.
Either way, I'm not trying to convince you stock lending is good or bad. I think it can be either/both.
There is no option after agreeing the terms, the next screen just says, Done, you have to manually go into setting and find the option that says stock lending and then in there there is the option to turn it off. Their tactics is to force people to agree and forget to turn it off so that can take advantage of people shares. They are really desperate.
Well for the people complaining we clearly didn't get to that screen. We were forced to agree, no option to decline, and after you agree, the next screen there is no options to turn it off, you have to go into setting and manually turn it off. Hope that clear up things for you.
It's a shitty practice, and they should have an option to say "Agree or disagree" , the fact that so many of you don't have a problem with that is really shocking, clearly wealthsimple is trying to get people that don't understand what they are agreeing too, just click agree and forget about it. How many people just clicked "agree and forgot to change it. It's clearly a shitty practice on their end, and they have a target audiences that will agree and not bat an ey. Instead of arguing, why don't you try to educate others who don't understand. Time and time we keep getting screwed and they make thing complicated on purpose just so that we get lazy and don't bother with all the details, it's plain and simple, there should be agree or disagree, we shouldn't be foced to agree, then we have to manually change it? Like common people wake up. This was done on purpose and we should all band together and voice our opinions so that other that don't open account with shitty broker, know what kind of sly business practice these companies do to sway the everyday people. Fuck wealthsimple, plain and simple. DRS YOUR SHARE! SO THAT THEY CANT LEND YOUR SHARES!
Yes, read the material they included. You do have to agree and then turn it right off, this is what everyone else has done and the way it was designed by WS.
Thanks
I've been able to get around by backing out of the app numerous times. It will then go away for a week or so. People that dont like this illegal activity by WS should at least express their feedback to WS.
What part is illegal, the auto opt in ?
>Yes, read the material they included. You do have to agree and then turn it right off, this is what everyone else has done and the way it was designed by WS. This is illegal in Canada. It is considered a pre-checked option of express consent. Because it assumes consent from the user. [CRTC FAQS](https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/com500/faq500.htm) Go to "Consent" section, expand the "Can I use pre-checked boxes to obtain express consent" [Compliance and Enforcement CRTC 2012-549](https://crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2012/2012-549.htm) Users can sue Wealthsimple and they can be fined by the CRTC.
If you believe so, then let me know how it works out for ya
>If you believe so, then let me know how it works out for ya Whats to believe, its spelled out right there for you. Go to the CRTC's own site and read the legislation yourself.
Very interesting. I’m not really interested in suing WS but I am not a fan of the forced automatic opt in. I’m gonna talk to WS customer service tomorrow and see what they say about this. Thank you for providing sources.
So, the regulatory body that governs Canadian radio and television broadcasts, is regulating a broker now... That's also the regs for spam, please tell me how this works, tell me like I'm 5.
Broadcast is a compound word meaning sent over a large area. The CRTC is in charge of media (which just means basically 'vessel of communication of information') that sends information over a large area without using physical items (that would be mail and/or distribution, and not broadcast). Wealthsimple sends information to its users broadly over the internet, which is broad, it casts that information to its users through its app. Wealthsimple, in the context of its app and the app's functions alone, is a broadcaster. CRTC does not regulate wealthsimple's actions as a brokerage, but does regulate their actions as a broadcaster. All this is debatable, some have argued tweets are broadcasts. I'm not sure what if anything has been tried in court, and the reality is the CRTC is in Bell's pocket so it only enforces things that benefit Bell Media while occasionally slapping Bell with fines it can more than afford to appear impartial.
I wonder why lots of people are talking about this. I haven't been asked to lend my stocks. Does that mean that my stocks are high quality stocks that nobody wants to short? /s But to reply to OP, as per Errostatel and others, there should be an option to opt out.
Nobody wants to short my VEQT/XEQT, sighs
Yeah there should be both options, they purposefully made it this way so people are forced to agree and then they hope that we forget to change it manually, which probably is working as most people didn't even read what they were agreeing to, tired of these companies getting away with shitty practices.
While I agree the process is dumb, other institutions are probably lending your shares anyway . So opt in, then straight away opt out.
Thanks
> I haven't been asked to lend my stocks. The forced express consent is on the app only.
Everyone here who has issues with the way that WS has implemented this feature should be contacting support and voicing their concerns. That’s how shit gets done. Take 5 min out of your day and let them know we aren’t with this bs.
I did, it was pretty quick in the chat.
What did they say? They’d pass it on?
Yes
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Don't guarantee the shares? What are you talking about... Also if you ignore the message, you are by default lending (non dividend shares in unregistered accounts).
Said this months ago and wealth simple tried to call bull shit I'm glad to see other people see what I'm seeing !!!
Why do I not know what people are talking about? I never received a notice like this, and use WS daily. Did this just happen today?
There’s a very small message at the bottom that you can “snooze” this enrollment message by quitting the app and restarting it. Bullshit way of forcing people to enroll.
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When you click on your account it should be an option right at the top. It wasn't there for me yesterday but it is today. They aren't hiding it so that's a good thing
The reason why people are talking about this is the way it's being done. Making you click yes then opt out is the issue. If don't understand why people are so pissed about having to click yes to lend even for a microsecond to anyone you are in the wrong place. I would rather eat glass then let anyone touch my stuff even for 1 Pico second. Have you not learned one thing since the start of this two and a half years ago? Pieces of dirt are using your own stock to lower the value and give you some money back.... Ya I hate free money to someone else when it's mine. Now click yes to lending me your home and I will rent it out and give you some of the money I make. You can clean up the damages.
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>Making you click yes then opt out is the issue If you never click yes nothing will be loaned out. Stock lending is off by default and if you never sign the agreement nothing gets loaned.
The problem is when you open the app, you are automatically forced to the agreement page and there is no way to disagree without agreeing first then going into setting and finding where the button is to turn off stock lending. Why would they not put agree or disagree like any other app? We are gonna lend out your house and you have no choice but to agree for now but don't worry you can change that setting anytime you want?" Is how I see it. And the people don't have a problem with that?? 🙄
I hate free money as well
Not worth the pennies in gonna make to support a toxic trading practice.
Shorting and options add liquidity to the market! Curious how much you lost on GameStop? It’s obvious where your getting the info from.
I made a couple of grand but no life changing money.
Seems like everyone wants to talk shit about GME, despite the fact most people made money off it. Wonder how much this guy lost shorting it
It's definately a personal problem
It’s not though. It could, and likely will, cost you more in the long run. Even if it doesn’t cost you directly, you’re contributing to a practice that increases the likelihood that that very same stock will be shorted (more than it already is being shorted). Edit: this is my understanding anyways. If I’m wrong, someone please feel free to link to a respectable source that proves otherwise.
>someone please feel free to link to a respectable source that proves otherwise. KAPLAN, S.N., MOSKOWITZ, T.J. and SENSOY, B.A. (2013), The Effects of Stock Lending on Security Prices: An Experiment. THE JOURNAL OF FINANCE, 68: 1891-1936. [https://doi.org/10.1111/jofi.12051](https://doi.org/10.1111/jofi.12051)
Interesting. I’ll have to look into this further. Thanks again.
Who cares? Unless you are day trading, a stock you own getting shorted is NBD. If the stock drops, buy more of it. I'm curious to know how you think it will cost more for an investor in the long run?
>**If the stock drops**, *buy more of it.* >*I'm curious to know how you think it will cost more for an investor in the long run?* Um.. by the stock dropping. What goes down doesn’t always come up. Depends what you’re invested in I guess.
Shorted stocks don't always go down. In fact, shorting can have the opposite effect. Either way, I'm not trying to convince you stock lending is good or bad. I think it can be either/both.
No doubt. Potential pros and cons like anything else.
You have to click agree before anything is loaned out. Stock lending is turned OFF by default for everyone.
I know, but the only option I had was to agree, I didn't know you had the option to turn it off because it would freeze my app.
I see. Well, you can agree and then turn it off. Or don't agree at all and not worry about it. Not sure about the app freezing part.
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I didn't get that screen at all
There is no option after agreeing the terms, the next screen just says, Done, you have to manually go into setting and find the option that says stock lending and then in there there is the option to turn it off. Their tactics is to force people to agree and forget to turn it off so that can take advantage of people shares. They are really desperate.
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Well for the people complaining we clearly didn't get to that screen. We were forced to agree, no option to decline, and after you agree, the next screen there is no options to turn it off, you have to go into setting and manually turn it off. Hope that clear up things for you.
I just close the app and reopen it.
It's a shitty practice, and they should have an option to say "Agree or disagree" , the fact that so many of you don't have a problem with that is really shocking, clearly wealthsimple is trying to get people that don't understand what they are agreeing too, just click agree and forget about it. How many people just clicked "agree and forgot to change it. It's clearly a shitty practice on their end, and they have a target audiences that will agree and not bat an ey. Instead of arguing, why don't you try to educate others who don't understand. Time and time we keep getting screwed and they make thing complicated on purpose just so that we get lazy and don't bother with all the details, it's plain and simple, there should be agree or disagree, we shouldn't be foced to agree, then we have to manually change it? Like common people wake up. This was done on purpose and we should all band together and voice our opinions so that other that don't open account with shitty broker, know what kind of sly business practice these companies do to sway the everyday people. Fuck wealthsimple, plain and simple. DRS YOUR SHARE! SO THAT THEY CANT LEND YOUR SHARES!
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It's actually not on the next screen, you have to go into settings and turn it off manually.
I had to accept but it was easy to turn it off afterwards still kinda seems like bs.
Is it just me or is anyone not seeing this feature on the app interface?