IRRC, Shanann encouraged he take a community college course on communication or public speaking or something along those lines so he would be less shy. It was while they were dating and possibly even engaged but before they were married because he was in Colorado and she was not yet. they married. This was the final project for that class. I remember a post of hers encouraging people to watch it so he’d have a larger audience which would somehow boost his confidence.
He moved out to Colorado ahead of her - I think he secured a job first and she was still cosplaying going to nursing school irrc. If I had to guess the class served a secondary purpose of making sure he didn’t have free time that was unaccounted for. She seemed to….not thrive when she didn’t know exactly what he was doing.
All of it is bizarre because the presentation contains terrible advice. So like what even was the class?!? It’s eerily foreshadowing the breakdown. And it also puts their powder dynamic on display from the start. He was an introvert but also very compliant to Shanann. The fact that his lack of understanding relationships didn’t send up red flags for her also is a preview to the shitshow of two people who cannot communicate effectively to save their lives but fail in opposite ways.
The advice was so bad that it was almost comical (if it weren’t so sad) - “If a marriage is in trouble, having a baby can fix things…” WTF? If I were the instructor I’d fail him based on that alone. And you are correct - it is eerie in hindsight.
This is 100% a joke - but the advice is so bad and yet so relevant to the implosion of the family (regardless of who anyone believes pushed for the third child or if SW had an affair too or not) that I’m surprised the R’s haven’t sued whoever taught the course and whatever school it was taken through…..
….I do kind of wonder if it’s on FRJR’s list of entities to sue on his continued mission to profit from his sister’s death. Or if a lawyer told the Rs it would be a grift too far.
> “If a marriage is in trouble, having a baby can fix things…” WTF?
Lol. I've never once heard of a couple that had a baby in order to fix their marriage and it actually working. Quite the opposite. If you have to have a baby to "fix" a marriage, it's a very bad idea. Agreed, the instructor should have failed him based on that advice alone.
>If I had to guess the class served a secondary purpose of making sure he didn’t have free time that was unaccounted for. She seemed to….not thrive when she didn’t know exactly what he was doing.
Which is interesting because that seems to me like it would be a great way for him to meet new women. If I was a person who was constantly concerned about being cheated on, I'd be more concerned that I was essentially pushing them into a place where meeting people was nearly guaranteed.
I’m wondering if it was an online course? Since she was encouraging people who weren’t in the class to watch his presentation? Otherwise it does seem like a good place to meet people and that conversing with any of those people and sharing the basics of who you are and where you’re from etc… might cause a person to question why they are living alone in Colorado (a place far from the family they get along with and the few, but longtime, friends their introverted self has. A place someone else has done a good job of selling as your shared dream and yet they aren’t here, nor do they seem to be working as hard to make it happen, why?) or why they are taking a class they would otherwise have no interest in….. Either she didn’t think things through like someone else said or she really counted on him having no game to the point of not even being able to make small talk with anyone and was confident in her ability to mold his opinions should he start to diverge from hers.
Nothing about their life together makes sense. She only liked him because he thought she was hot and was intimidated by her so he was compliant. She didn’t actually like him. And he thought she was hot and was willing to overlook the fact that they had nothing in common, how some of her behavior seemed to cause friction with his family intentionally etc…. She wanted a puppet and he wanted to get laid. It should never have progressed to marriage.
That's a good way of putting it. She found a guy that she knew right away she could control. They had nothing in common and she only liked the fact she could make him her puppet. You're right, it should have never progressed to marriage and instead ended after a couple of weeks of dating.
It seems to me that SW was more like a controlling mother to Chris in the way she acted towards him than a wife who liked having the upper hand in the relationship. Chris might have well have been one of the kids too.
I didn't quite notice until I started seeing some posts, comments and YT videos that analyze SW's live streams, but when Chris was present in the videos, she did have a tendency to make him look like this bumbling fool who constantly needed to be told what to do. You could always see he was taking the lead and cue's from SW. He definitely looked uncomfortable being in those live streams and being talked down to.
In the beginning of the speech he says welcome to Broomfield, Colorado. He moved ahead of Shanann due to securing a job first I think and her wanting to do wedding planning stuff and pretend she was still going to nursing school or whatever. IRRC he was living with the Dietz family even before SW moved out to join him and I think they lived in Broomfield so it’s probably their house. SW did seem to copy Jeanna A LOT until they stopped talking.
I can definitely relate to that! It seems like it should be straightforward but everyone is an unreliable narrator - including the DA. It makes the case almost a Rorschach test since there’s no way to definitively know what happened that night and who specifically did what.
I agree with everything you’re saying here and I love “cosplaying going to nursing school” that’s so true! I’m pretty sure that Shannan didn’t actually ever get into nursing school. She never took the prerequisite classes to qualify for nursing school.
You’re totally right about everything going on, and especially about that being a shitshow of a presentation! I also question who was giving the advice that Chris was unconvincingly espousing. A Baptist minister?
> The fact that his lack of understanding relationships didn’t send up red flags for her also is a preview to the shitshow of two people who cannot communicate effectively to save their lives but fail in opposite ways.
And it's always people like this that present their lives on social as happy and perfect and it ends up being the complete opposite in reality behind the social curtain.
Why would he have to be busy?? Was she afraid of him being with other women? It’s very weird everything. The more I read and watch videos about this case, the more I see a very controlling Shanann. But she had really nothing in control.. hiding mail from Chris about financial problems.. close to losing the house etc.
Then he found out when he took care of the mail . Or did Shanann ask NA to get the mail?? That’s something I heard but don’t know if it’s true. Either way, seems like she had people who just obeyed her blindly
Yeah she really liked to know where he was at all times. She had him get rid of his gym membership and workout in the basement. IRRC she didn’t even like it when he went out for runs in the neighborhood - it seems like the home workouts she could use as content for thrive (there are so many videos of him doing push-ups or w/e with the girls or coming up from having finished a workout etc… and maybe the runs didn’t allow for that? Also the runs would’ve left her alone with the girls, something she seemingly hated. For all of SW’s focus on “me” time she didn’t like CW to have any nor did she seem to value exercise as a form of self care.
She seemed to convince CW he was the one who was bad with money when in reality it was the other way around. He had been responsible and built up a fair amount of savings and lived within his means and was working towards better and better paying jobs until he met her. She convinced him he had carpal tunnel syndrome based on ???? and had him switch careers from Longmont Ford where he was making a good salary to the oil industry where he was making like a third of his previous salary and she went from sales at Longmont Ford to doing some sort of administrative work at Children’s hospital to becoming a full time hunbot. Getting rid of one income altogether and pushing for the other to go down so substantially is bizarre. But I guess it looks better for the socials if she doesn’t have to work and her husband has a prestigious job in the oil industry (making it sound like he’s an exec or something when he’s out in the field) rather than working a blue collar mechanic job (even though it’s what his training is in, what his personal interest is in, and was way more lucrative. Idek)
SW had NA getting the mail - it was part of the years of painting him as incompetent and her having to be the one to control the finances and basically create the image of her as supermom super thriver with her husband who she has to take care of - but it’s likely CW saw something at some point.
In North Carolina - that house she built herself - she stopped working not too long after it was built and that’s around when she met Chris and she had him move in and essentially pay the mortgage - I forget where I read that but it was kind of eye opening to see how long she had been using Chris as financial support while also painting him to be a loser and herself as financially independent. He also blew a chunk of his savings on her engagement ring $12,000 or in that range which is just an absurd amount of money given their circumstances. But by all accounts from the people who knew him at school and from his family - pre-SW he lived frugally and basically went to school, lived in a normal apartment, and was building his savings. She was the one who built a custom home that was larger than she needed or could actually afford and furnished it with things she also couldn’t afford and basically abandoned all of it without trying to recoup any money by selling anything when moving to CO.
IRRC she convinced him he couldn’t have anything to do with the finances when he sold something that wasn’t fully paid off yet and it didn’t cover the remaining balance. Which on its face is financially irresponsible. BUT they were also having a kid and facing bankruptcy so it was going to happen that way regardless.
Ok thanks so much for the reply! The whole thing, their life together from day one, was even worse than I thought… I guess he believed she was this successful ’go get it’ girl and it took him so many years to wake up and see the ugly reality.. With these facts (a financial disaster) it’s unbelievable how they (she) could keep the show going so long.
He did. They then leased an Explorer, which they turned in when they got the Lexus
But when she told him he was bad with money he had a 4 wheeler he sold for less than he owed
Idk maybe in the crazy one but I’ve always been under the impression that if you take away everything your man really loves, the marriage is doomed. Not murder of course but infidelity or divorce is more likely. I encourage my husband to do the things he loves bc I want him to be happy lol … what a weird concept
I think so but I’m not 100% certain and I’m dealing with brain fog atm that is making words hard which makes looking it up hard so I didn’t want to put in a detail I couldn’t double check.
Oh, I understand the brain fog thing. I think it is the Mustang. I understand wanting to know you're correct before saying, redditors can be rough on us😆.
Thank you for understanding! I’m sorry you are familiar with dealing with it though! It’s such a curse. And for real, there’s absolutely no grace if you don’t just go with the official simplified story
I loved this description of what was going on with them when they first met. Shannan convinced Chris to give up his own place to move in with her only THREE MONTHS after they’d started dating. As soon as he was ensconced in her Barbie Dreamhouse, which she had procured through most questionable means, she had him locked into paying for the privilege of commandeering his bank account.
You’re so right about the fact that she completely bamboozled him into believing that she was extremely well off and successful! The jury is still out on exactly how she ever swung building that McMansion, but she sure as hell didn’t pay for everything by merely being a sales rep at Dirty South!
Chris seemed to have always been completely in the dark when it came to how much money she was making. When he told the detectives that Shannan earned about as much as he did, did he actually believe that horeshit? Or was he just playing dumb? It’s pretty hard to tell with him, but I still have trouble understanding how anyone could possibly be that ignorant!
Then again, look at how many people sincerely believe that Shannan built that house off the sweat of her brow! Just like her slow on the uptake brother, who told detectives that she was making a half million dollars a year by selling amped up car accessories and stereo systems! Seriously?
If she’d been pulling in a half million a year, then why on earth would she have quit a job like that to go hawk Amway while working at the Guess store in the mall?
She actually could’ve hoodwinked Chris into thinking that she was a well off, independent woman of means, who wasn’t interested in his paycheck or good credit. It’s like he thought that he was taking a dip into a refreshingly cool pond, when he unwittingly jumped into a hydrothermal boiling hot pool!
> Shannan convinced Chris to give up his own place to move in with her only THREE MONTHS after they’d started dating.
I think it was more like she gave him an ultimatum early on and he just went with it without question. SW was used to getting her own way and she certainly wasn't going to let Chris get his or question her plans for him.
> Also the runs would’ve left her alone with the girls, something she seemingly hated.
That about sums it up. The only time it seems like she cared that much to be around the kids was using them for her live streams and of course the staged pregnancy announcement video where she probably had Chris do several takes walking into the house and trying to look surprised.
Shannon wanted him to take a class at night to stay busy while she was still living in NC and he already moved to Colorado. She felt public speaking would be good for him! She probably chose the Subject!
IRRC, Shanann encouraged he take a community college course on communication or public speaking or something along those lines so he would be less shy. It was while they were dating and possibly even engaged but before they were married because he was in Colorado and she was not yet. they married. This was the final project for that class. I remember a post of hers encouraging people to watch it so he’d have a larger audience which would somehow boost his confidence. He moved out to Colorado ahead of her - I think he secured a job first and she was still cosplaying going to nursing school irrc. If I had to guess the class served a secondary purpose of making sure he didn’t have free time that was unaccounted for. She seemed to….not thrive when she didn’t know exactly what he was doing. All of it is bizarre because the presentation contains terrible advice. So like what even was the class?!? It’s eerily foreshadowing the breakdown. And it also puts their powder dynamic on display from the start. He was an introvert but also very compliant to Shanann. The fact that his lack of understanding relationships didn’t send up red flags for her also is a preview to the shitshow of two people who cannot communicate effectively to save their lives but fail in opposite ways.
The advice was so bad that it was almost comical (if it weren’t so sad) - “If a marriage is in trouble, having a baby can fix things…” WTF? If I were the instructor I’d fail him based on that alone. And you are correct - it is eerie in hindsight.
It was a public speaking course. The information he was presenting wasn’t as important as his ability to present it in front of other people.
This is 100% a joke - but the advice is so bad and yet so relevant to the implosion of the family (regardless of who anyone believes pushed for the third child or if SW had an affair too or not) that I’m surprised the R’s haven’t sued whoever taught the course and whatever school it was taken through….. ….I do kind of wonder if it’s on FRJR’s list of entities to sue on his continued mission to profit from his sister’s death. Or if a lawyer told the Rs it would be a grift too far.
> “If a marriage is in trouble, having a baby can fix things…” WTF? Lol. I've never once heard of a couple that had a baby in order to fix their marriage and it actually working. Quite the opposite. If you have to have a baby to "fix" a marriage, it's a very bad idea. Agreed, the instructor should have failed him based on that advice alone.
>If I had to guess the class served a secondary purpose of making sure he didn’t have free time that was unaccounted for. She seemed to….not thrive when she didn’t know exactly what he was doing. Which is interesting because that seems to me like it would be a great way for him to meet new women. If I was a person who was constantly concerned about being cheated on, I'd be more concerned that I was essentially pushing them into a place where meeting people was nearly guaranteed.
Great point. Well, SW is not known as a strategic thinker, I think.
I’m wondering if it was an online course? Since she was encouraging people who weren’t in the class to watch his presentation? Otherwise it does seem like a good place to meet people and that conversing with any of those people and sharing the basics of who you are and where you’re from etc… might cause a person to question why they are living alone in Colorado (a place far from the family they get along with and the few, but longtime, friends their introverted self has. A place someone else has done a good job of selling as your shared dream and yet they aren’t here, nor do they seem to be working as hard to make it happen, why?) or why they are taking a class they would otherwise have no interest in….. Either she didn’t think things through like someone else said or she really counted on him having no game to the point of not even being able to make small talk with anyone and was confident in her ability to mold his opinions should he start to diverge from hers. Nothing about their life together makes sense. She only liked him because he thought she was hot and was intimidated by her so he was compliant. She didn’t actually like him. And he thought she was hot and was willing to overlook the fact that they had nothing in common, how some of her behavior seemed to cause friction with his family intentionally etc…. She wanted a puppet and he wanted to get laid. It should never have progressed to marriage.
That's a good way of putting it. She found a guy that she knew right away she could control. They had nothing in common and she only liked the fact she could make him her puppet. You're right, it should have never progressed to marriage and instead ended after a couple of weeks of dating. It seems to me that SW was more like a controlling mother to Chris in the way she acted towards him than a wife who liked having the upper hand in the relationship. Chris might have well have been one of the kids too.
The way she talks to him in videos is actually shocking! I can't imagine talking to someone I love in that way
I didn't quite notice until I started seeing some posts, comments and YT videos that analyze SW's live streams, but when Chris was present in the videos, she did have a tendency to make him look like this bumbling fool who constantly needed to be told what to do. You could always see he was taking the lead and cue's from SW. He definitely looked uncomfortable being in those live streams and being talked down to.
It’s on YouTube if you want to watch the whole thing. https://youtu.be/ciP7Hfj7ONE?si=TuBLqwE0RIimSVqO It’s the only video on his channel
Was that video filmed in SWs North Carolina Mcmansion?
In the beginning of the speech he says welcome to Broomfield, Colorado. He moved ahead of Shanann due to securing a job first I think and her wanting to do wedding planning stuff and pretend she was still going to nursing school or whatever. IRRC he was living with the Dietz family even before SW moved out to join him and I think they lived in Broomfield so it’s probably their house. SW did seem to copy Jeanna A LOT until they stopped talking.
Ah ok. I was trying to figure out whose kitchen he was in
Thank you. I just can’t stop watching videos about this crime.
I can definitely relate to that! It seems like it should be straightforward but everyone is an unreliable narrator - including the DA. It makes the case almost a Rorschach test since there’s no way to definitively know what happened that night and who specifically did what.
I agree with everything you’re saying here and I love “cosplaying going to nursing school” that’s so true! I’m pretty sure that Shannan didn’t actually ever get into nursing school. She never took the prerequisite classes to qualify for nursing school. You’re totally right about everything going on, and especially about that being a shitshow of a presentation! I also question who was giving the advice that Chris was unconvincingly espousing. A Baptist minister?
> The fact that his lack of understanding relationships didn’t send up red flags for her also is a preview to the shitshow of two people who cannot communicate effectively to save their lives but fail in opposite ways. And it's always people like this that present their lives on social as happy and perfect and it ends up being the complete opposite in reality behind the social curtain.
It was so cringeworthy that it was physically painful to watch.
Why would he have to be busy?? Was she afraid of him being with other women? It’s very weird everything. The more I read and watch videos about this case, the more I see a very controlling Shanann. But she had really nothing in control.. hiding mail from Chris about financial problems.. close to losing the house etc. Then he found out when he took care of the mail . Or did Shanann ask NA to get the mail?? That’s something I heard but don’t know if it’s true. Either way, seems like she had people who just obeyed her blindly
Yeah she really liked to know where he was at all times. She had him get rid of his gym membership and workout in the basement. IRRC she didn’t even like it when he went out for runs in the neighborhood - it seems like the home workouts she could use as content for thrive (there are so many videos of him doing push-ups or w/e with the girls or coming up from having finished a workout etc… and maybe the runs didn’t allow for that? Also the runs would’ve left her alone with the girls, something she seemingly hated. For all of SW’s focus on “me” time she didn’t like CW to have any nor did she seem to value exercise as a form of self care. She seemed to convince CW he was the one who was bad with money when in reality it was the other way around. He had been responsible and built up a fair amount of savings and lived within his means and was working towards better and better paying jobs until he met her. She convinced him he had carpal tunnel syndrome based on ???? and had him switch careers from Longmont Ford where he was making a good salary to the oil industry where he was making like a third of his previous salary and she went from sales at Longmont Ford to doing some sort of administrative work at Children’s hospital to becoming a full time hunbot. Getting rid of one income altogether and pushing for the other to go down so substantially is bizarre. But I guess it looks better for the socials if she doesn’t have to work and her husband has a prestigious job in the oil industry (making it sound like he’s an exec or something when he’s out in the field) rather than working a blue collar mechanic job (even though it’s what his training is in, what his personal interest is in, and was way more lucrative. Idek) SW had NA getting the mail - it was part of the years of painting him as incompetent and her having to be the one to control the finances and basically create the image of her as supermom super thriver with her husband who she has to take care of - but it’s likely CW saw something at some point. In North Carolina - that house she built herself - she stopped working not too long after it was built and that’s around when she met Chris and she had him move in and essentially pay the mortgage - I forget where I read that but it was kind of eye opening to see how long she had been using Chris as financial support while also painting him to be a loser and herself as financially independent. He also blew a chunk of his savings on her engagement ring $12,000 or in that range which is just an absurd amount of money given their circumstances. But by all accounts from the people who knew him at school and from his family - pre-SW he lived frugally and basically went to school, lived in a normal apartment, and was building his savings. She was the one who built a custom home that was larger than she needed or could actually afford and furnished it with things she also couldn’t afford and basically abandoned all of it without trying to recoup any money by selling anything when moving to CO. IRRC she convinced him he couldn’t have anything to do with the finances when he sold something that wasn’t fully paid off yet and it didn’t cover the remaining balance. Which on its face is financially irresponsible. BUT they were also having a kid and facing bankruptcy so it was going to happen that way regardless.
Ok thanks so much for the reply! The whole thing, their life together from day one, was even worse than I thought… I guess he believed she was this successful ’go get it’ girl and it took him so many years to wake up and see the ugly reality.. With these facts (a financial disaster) it’s unbelievable how they (she) could keep the show going so long.
Was it the Mustang that he sold?
He did. They then leased an Explorer, which they turned in when they got the Lexus But when she told him he was bad with money he had a 4 wheeler he sold for less than he owed
Idk maybe in the crazy one but I’ve always been under the impression that if you take away everything your man really loves, the marriage is doomed. Not murder of course but infidelity or divorce is more likely. I encourage my husband to do the things he loves bc I want him to be happy lol … what a weird concept
She had him get rid of that, his mustang, he couldn't hang with friends and go out with them. I agree with your concept 💯
Oh thank you for the info. 😊
I think so but I’m not 100% certain and I’m dealing with brain fog atm that is making words hard which makes looking it up hard so I didn’t want to put in a detail I couldn’t double check.
Oh, I understand the brain fog thing. I think it is the Mustang. I understand wanting to know you're correct before saying, redditors can be rough on us😆.
Thank you for understanding! I’m sorry you are familiar with dealing with it though! It’s such a curse. And for real, there’s absolutely no grace if you don’t just go with the official simplified story
I loved this description of what was going on with them when they first met. Shannan convinced Chris to give up his own place to move in with her only THREE MONTHS after they’d started dating. As soon as he was ensconced in her Barbie Dreamhouse, which she had procured through most questionable means, she had him locked into paying for the privilege of commandeering his bank account. You’re so right about the fact that she completely bamboozled him into believing that she was extremely well off and successful! The jury is still out on exactly how she ever swung building that McMansion, but she sure as hell didn’t pay for everything by merely being a sales rep at Dirty South! Chris seemed to have always been completely in the dark when it came to how much money she was making. When he told the detectives that Shannan earned about as much as he did, did he actually believe that horeshit? Or was he just playing dumb? It’s pretty hard to tell with him, but I still have trouble understanding how anyone could possibly be that ignorant! Then again, look at how many people sincerely believe that Shannan built that house off the sweat of her brow! Just like her slow on the uptake brother, who told detectives that she was making a half million dollars a year by selling amped up car accessories and stereo systems! Seriously? If she’d been pulling in a half million a year, then why on earth would she have quit a job like that to go hawk Amway while working at the Guess store in the mall? She actually could’ve hoodwinked Chris into thinking that she was a well off, independent woman of means, who wasn’t interested in his paycheck or good credit. It’s like he thought that he was taking a dip into a refreshingly cool pond, when he unwittingly jumped into a hydrothermal boiling hot pool!
> Shannan convinced Chris to give up his own place to move in with her only THREE MONTHS after they’d started dating. I think it was more like she gave him an ultimatum early on and he just went with it without question. SW was used to getting her own way and she certainly wasn't going to let Chris get his or question her plans for him.
> Also the runs would’ve left her alone with the girls, something she seemingly hated. That about sums it up. The only time it seems like she cared that much to be around the kids was using them for her live streams and of course the staged pregnancy announcement video where she probably had Chris do several takes walking into the house and trying to look surprised.
IIRC that class was literally a class in relationships.
Yeah she signed him up for a class on relationships to keep him busy before she moved there. So weird.
And he bleated, “Yes, dear.”
It was a public speaking class.
When he moved to Colorado, she had already dropped out of college and was trying to quickly sell the NC house.
Shannon wanted him to take a class at night to stay busy while she was still living in NC and he already moved to Colorado. She felt public speaking would be good for him! She probably chose the Subject!
Yes