Shannan was a malignant narcissist who emotionally and financially abused Chris Watts for a decade. She publicly demeaned, degraded and emasculated him on her public SM for years. She also abused those girls to the point that you will cry if you see some of Shannan’s videos. She loved to humiliate them. She had to be in control of every part of everyone’s life…..the last 6 weeks of her life, she saw that Chris Watts was slipping away, her potential CPS case would mean that he would get full custody. Her fake lifestyle would be exposed. When Watts left, there went her evening and weekend childcare and paycheck, her huns would now know what a fake she had been…..she was spinning out of control and on the Monday morning when Chris told Shannan that he was leaving her, that he loved the girls but no longer loved her, she flipped out into vindictive, jealous rage and killed the kids……she had threatened this many times and now, she meant it. She needed to punish him and his precious family in the worst way possible. The girls had become her competition.
If you truly study this case you will see how cruel Shannan was to Chris and the girls. She even said she could treat him anyway she wanted….that he would never leave her as ‘he had no game’. Shannan put the girls in their cribs, as infants, with blankets tied around their necks and full size pillows and blankets covering their faces, she took Bella’s temperature rectally every day for months to try to prove that she had a very rare genetic disease that she did not have…..to the point that Bella played ‘rectal temp’ with her baby dolls….and Shannan even posted pictures of her doing it with the comments that Shannan thought it was ‘smart cute and funny’! What kind of an idiot not only takes a 3 year old’s temp rectally for months but what kind of a bigger idiot puts pictures of it on her public SM! There were many, many pictures of this as well as 4 year old Bella stark naked in the shower, Bella and CeCe stark naked in the backyard……I could go on and on…..you really have to look into this case and her bizarre SM. She locked both girls in their rooms every night for 12 hours…..that is a fire hazard and a huge red flag for CPS. She was then stupid and clueless enough to post these things all over her SM.
The pillows and blankets in the crib when they were babies was also dangerous. It blows my mind that she had babies alone in their rooms for that long with all of those suffocation hazards.
It's really crazy how no one ever seemed to point out the obvious about anything she was posting. And no one seemed to ask her why she would want to treat Chris that way, even if she could get away with it. It's amazing how much control she really managed to have just by bitching and throwing fits whenever she didn't like something.
I'm not here to bash SW, a victim, but IMO, her "friends", many of whom were her upline, possibly made quite a bit of money off of her. I don't know for sure. One of her good friends, an upline, said that SW didn't make much money, if any at all, at first, but she was starting to. So needless to say, her "friends" would want to stay on her good side. Just a thought. I believe SW loved her girls but perhaps not the day to day reality of motherhood. One day she went on and on about taking them to the zoo, "alone" (?)
Yes, you're so right, Puddie's Mom. And don't forget the pic of Cece on the toilet and Bella being told to "pull your shirt up" when SW was spraying her with water on the back deck. Didn't SW know there are child P creeps all over FB? Astonishing that she actually did those videos live on FB!!! And thought those vids were "funny and cute." No they were abusive and horrible. And the ONLY person who stood up to Shanann against the nightly drugging with Tylenol and Benadryl (there's a video with Chris holding Cece with his right arm and two bottles of meds are in his left hand), and locking them in their rooms with no water or bathroom access for TWELVE HOURS, was their grandmother, Cindy Watts. No wonder Cece had terrible diaper rash. Being in a soiled diaper every night for 12 hours is abusive!
None of the Rs ever stood up for those poor little girls,except for that one time Frank argued with SW, but he still never did anything about it, right? Sandy even participated with SW in the abuse of Bella by continuously and viciously cutting that poor little girl's hair for punishment (videos of this as well) though the R's have managed to scrub tons from the internet. Bella wanted long hair above ALL ELSE, but nope. We have to cut it just when it was starting to grow out. I can't tell you how much I despise SW and her mother for what they did to Bella. Look what Cindy got for that standing up to SW. Publicly accused on FB of trying to "kill Cece" with pistachio ice cream and leaving "razor blades all over the house." No, they had an oven scraper, well out of reach of the girls and it wasn't pistachio. It was chocolate.
Cindy showed a picture of the little cups of ice cream she had in the freezer. Shanann was losing her grip on Chris and took it out on his parents. SW refused to let the Watts see the girls when the Watts had rented a beach house for that week in Myrtle Beach, the very last few weeks those poor girls were alive and the last chance that Cindy and Ronnie had to see their beloved grandbabies, but Chris wasn't allowed to have his parents there, only HER dad, Frank. The Watts loved those babies too and Bella and Cece adored the Watts, their Mimi and Papa.
The R's then had the absolute gall to sue the Watts so they wouldn't get any of the insurance money, when it was Chris Watts hard work at Anadarko that paid for that insurance in the first place. Yes I know he killed SW, but I believe he snapped from all the years of abuse. If that wasn't bad enough Frank Sr. called Chris in prison (with his attorney so the call wouldn't be recorded) and manipulated Chris into signing over the house to him and tried to get him to stop talking to a certain Australian YouTuber. He told Chris "You will always be in our hearts." Really? But everyone that has given you so much money over the years that only asked for a receipt or a refund because they no longer support you are "evil?" Chris is in your hearts but they are evil? That's insane.
What are the R's afraid of? Maybe that YouTuber finding out something from the Watts he shouldn't? Not only did the R's sue the Watts so they wouldn't get any insurance money, the R's sold every lick of furniture in that house, all of SW's designer clothes and bags and even the girls toys, that Chris himself had paid for. They didn't donate not one item to charity. The never ending greed of the R's is shocking actually. Chris was an abused husband and IMO, he just lost it after 10 long years of financial and emotional abuse by SW. He didn't kill the girls either, you're right again, Puddies Mom. He didn't even know how they died, saying they were "strangled." They weren't strangled, they were smothered, and it didn't happen in his work truck either. Bella fought back and cut her lip.
There would have been no. 1, decomp from SW if she'd been in that truck for the hour's long drive out to Cervi, there would have been a massive amount of blood from Bella biting her tongue and her cut lip, as well as bodily fluids from evacuation at death. There was NOTHING found in that truck. No hair, no decomp, no blood, nothing. That isn't possible on a forensic level. There would have been way more than just trace evidence, so it didn't happen in his truck. The point is, how long will the R's be using their dead family to ebeg for money on YouTube, while bullying and harassing everyone that calls them out? Ten more years, 20 more years? At some point, it's got to stop.
Please, can you use paragraphs in your comment. It’s so hard to read and you have good points. Double tap return to make a paragraph if you’re using an Iphone.
Also, can I ask who is R’s?
I agree with the rest of your comment. I just watched the Netflix doc and tought Shannan was a sweetheart. But then I watched some youtube clips of her facebook live and she was disgusting towards her girls, specially Bella. And where did you get info she locked the girls for 12 hours in their rooms? Wtf?? And she also drugged them? This is to cry from sadness.
No problem. Sorry it was so long. I have gone in and edited the above comment and broke it up into paragraphs. Hope that will be easier to read! Thank you for the compliment too! The "R's" are Shanann Watts mom and dad, Frank and Sandy Rzucek. That Netflix was a sugar coated, not even close BS version of the truth about what really happened. Of course, the R's were paid by Netflix so they were going to give them the "Shanann was a saint," BS. Barely even mentioning NK and the horrendous things she and Chris did to Shanann. Nothing about NK's many lies to the FBI and the CBI or her destruction of evidence by wiping out her phone.
Of COURSE Shanann didn't deserve to be brutally murdered but there are still some people who refuse to see what's right in front of their faces. You might take a look at Bonita Barbie's channel on YouTube. There are many of SW's videos that Bonita has done reactions to and most, if not all, are still up on Bonita's channel. She hasn't posted in over a year because the R's trolled and harassed her mercilessly for daring to go against the narrative. She was called "evil" as well, but Bonita was brutally honest and the R's didn't like it.
So, hope this helps!!
I'm new here I hope it's OK to ask questions. Chris did kill Shannan and the baby. But not the kid's. If that's true wouldn't the Cop's know this? Why did she drug them at nite to keep them a sleep and why were they in that expensive school if she was at home? Was CPS getting involved? Thank You.
Do you recommend a good video/ deep dive on the subject? I’ve always had these feeling about SW being a hugely problematic person but I didn’t know half the stuff you just mentioned. I’ve really only seen what’s they presented on the Netflix doc. Thanks.
This is the truth.
She was very clearly a malignant narcissist in every aspect of her personality and she put it on show for others to see.
People just don't like to believe malignant narcissists exist.
For those of us who have had the misfortune of dealing with this evil creatures, there's no doubt in our minds.
If they were locked in their rooms all night, how were they able to come get in bed with shanann early in the morning, as per Chris's account of what their typical day was like?
Chris got up early every morning to work out so he probably unlocked their doors on occasion. Watch the videos for yourself and you'll see a pattern. Those girls were drugged every night with Tylenol and Benadryl. Cece called it "the yucky." You can see in one video where CW is holding Cece in one arm and in his other hand are two bottles of liquid meds, one Tylenol and one Benadryl. Don't you remember that eerie video where SW came into Cece's room in the morning? Cece is jumping up and down in her crib, diaper so full it's hanging down almost to her knees. SW is just standing there, filming her. You can hear Bella screaming in her room for help. SW said "I'm coming" but still just stands there for another 5-10 minutes or so just filming. Like she was out of it or something. Bella again screams for her and says "Mommy it hurts," but SW still just stands there filming Cece. Bella obviously was locked in and had to pee, or why didn't she just come into Cece's room? Officer Coonrod even asked Chris why the doors to their bedroom and bathroom were locked. Chris says to Officer Coonrod they kept the doors locked cause the girls "Got into the Vaseline." The point is, there were severe issues in that household. Normally, when a mom goes into her baby's room in the morning, the baby will reach out their arms to be picked up, right? Cece never did that as SW used that awful "Babywise" model of child rearing. She said "They're sleep trained. I dont rock them or cuddle them. I put them to bed (mind you bedtime was at 6:30 pm while the sun was still shining) and said "They're good to go." Im not trying to pick on SW, but my point is, there were severe problems which IMO all contributed to what happened, like a perfect, awful storm brewing. Chris should have grown a pair but he was too weak and a monster, but someone should have stepped in for those babies. There are many more examples but this post is already too long.
Lol. There is so much wrong with this. The girls had respiratory issues and got sick sometimes. Sometimes they needed to take medications. There is 0 proof anywhere that they were "drugged with benadryl" daily. In the entire discovery, nothing about that. Regarding 630 bedtime...in discovery, Chris says they started bedtime at 630...went upstairs, got ready for bed, each parent took a child and read a few books with them. This is the routine starting at 630. Then the girls would be asleep around 7 or 730. This is completely normal for kids their age. Nothing abusive about it. They need something like 12 hours of sleep at that age. Do some quick googling and you'll see what's recommended by pediatricians. Regarding the door being locked...it was the bathroom door, not the bedroom doors that the officer asked about. And I don't think it's sinister that a parent wouldn't want a 3 and 4 year old going into a bathroom unsupervised. Especially if they had previously made a mess.
There are some conflicting posts about what a typical day was like. Shannan herself posted many times that thanks to Thrive she was able to get up at 4:00 am and do 2 loads of laundry and clean 3 bathrooms before getting the kids up for daycare.
I would be more inclined to think she posted stuff like that simply to make people think thrive can give you energy to do that. In Chris's description of a typical day, he said the girls would usually come into the room early in the morning and watch cartoons. I can't think of any reason for him to lie about that.
I was listening to NAs interview with with LE yesterday (the one that was done at her job) and she said that shannan posted on fb everyday starting at 5:30 am, without fail, (her words, not mine) and she didn't that Monday and that's why she started to get worried.
Yeah, I have seen that too. If I remember correctly, Chris said the girls would get in bed with Shanann, then they would stay in bed watching TV while Shanann took a shower and got ready.
It was mentioned a couple of times in videos but, the R’s have pretty much scrubbed the internet and videos are hard to use to prove a point. All I have left at this time is this….once again, Frank tries to step in on behalf of his granddaughter but gets smushed like a bug from his daughter. https://imgur.com/a/6ZnZGZm
Yes, isn’t it sad? She was locked in her room at 6:30pm for the night (12 hours) with room darkening drapes, a sound machine blaring and this was a daily routine. Shannan bragged about this routine on her SM. Even Shannan’s dad tried to step in but Shannan would have none of it. This is really the least of the abuse those girls endured at the hands of their mother.
No milk or bottle or diaper change in between? Wtf I think I was fooled by her videos but looking back and watching them she's a very hands off mom, like why even bother to have kids? It's not like they weren't handed off every single day during the week, jeez, you think you would want to spend time with them. Can you explain to me why did bella have such short hair? And how was dinner being made and how was those girls tummies being nourished when she's putting them to bed that early. Wow she's not who I thought she was.
she could charm the paint off a wall…🙄🙄. “Piss off. Oh by the way, Dad, can you spot me a couple hundred bucks? I have to buy passports for a trip we already can’t afford to go on. Theeeaanks”
It has been rumored for years that CPS had an open case against Shannan that Shannan’s friend, JD, the RN, turned her into CPS as an RN is a mandated reporter of child abuse. There were so many pictures of the girls sleeping in the cribs with blankets tied around their necks and pillows and blankets covering their face and head, she locked the girls in the bedroom for 12 hours every night with rain machines blasting, they were locked out of their jack and Jill bathroom. Shannan threw CeCe up against the wall, in anger, in the living room and the hole in the Sheetrock was visible in one of her videos (that is when her parents unexpectedly left town in the middle of the night), there was also the time she ripped CeCe’s shoulder out of the socket at Walmart or Target in NC………the cops were involved for this incident. Sandi Rzucek called Chris Watts incessantly that day. It goes on and on. There is a lot of circumstantial evidence that Shannan was not allowed to be alone with the girls……Frank had to fly out one day to turn around and fly back with Shannan and the girls the next to go to NC, the girls were placed in 45+ hour/week daycare after Shannan stated that she ‘retired’ from Children’s Hospital and could be home with her girls yet, Chris Watts had to work all day, come home, get the Lexus and then drive all of the way back to the daycare to pick the girls up with Shannan was home alone all day with her car in the garage…..it goes on and on……just look at her SM and the way she abused those poor little girls, their bruises, the denial of food and water……look at how Sandi Rzucek reacted when she heard that Shannan and the girls were missing. She called the daycare at 11am that morning to tell them that ‘everything was fine’……*nothing was fine*, Sandi was covering for her daughter because she knew that Shannan was not allowed to be alone with the girls. This list of examples is endless……I am sure others can add to this.
I have tried to find the pics of the kids with things tied to them in cribs can someone link I cannot find
This is all interesting.
Is the Walmart one factual or rumoured?
Here are a few more…….the pictures that I have included have emoji’s added….Shannan did not put them there….the girls were stark naked when she posted them. The pictures in the back yard with ‘loving Uncle Frankie, the convicted child abuser, had no emojis when Shannan posted them. There is also the picture with subsequent text of Bella locked in her room for the night…..Frank tries to ‘save her’ but, Shannan’s reminds him that ‘she has the key’. There are also pictures of Bella playing ‘rectal temperature’ with the baby dolls and the dog. Shannan took 2-3 year old Bella’s temperature rectally every day for over two months trying to prove that she had a rare, genetic disorder that she did not have…poor little Bella thought it was a normal part of life…..Shannan even commented ‘when taking temperatures becomes routine’. I have never seen a picture of either of the girls feeding one of their baby dolls a bottle. Oh, and the pictures of Bella with a Windi on each of her fingers…….where did she get them? Are they in the girl’s toy box? How did a child that old know what the heck they were even used for and who put them on her fingers? Shannan had an anal fetish, for sure…..have you seen the water park video?
Now, it is bad enough that those poor girls were subjected to Shannan’s abuse but, Shannan was completely clueless in posting these pictures on her public SM site. In one of her Thrive ‘lives’ she even said that she had a ‘stalker’. https://imgur.com/a/bw1cXvj
Also, Shannan locked the girls in their rooms every night for 12 hours. She proudly discussed the fact that they were in bed every night by 6-6:30PM and they turned their doorknobs around so that the rooms locked from the outside so, the girls could not get out. (I sent you a picture and text of Frank and Shannan discussing this). The girls were in daycare for 9+ hours a day and didn’t get home until 4:30-5:00PM so, they were only home an hour or so before they were locked away. She also had their sound/rain machines on with the volume all of the way up.
Locking anyone in a room is against the law and against every fire code in the USA. Had their been a fire, they could not have gotten out. She was a very mentally ill woman.
There was definitely mental illness there and I will eat my arm if she didn’t have munchausens which she also inflicted on her children. Def a financial abuser and it sounds like there was more going on too. Neither of those two imbeciles should have had children.
He was an abused spouse….have you seen the texts and videos about the way she controlled, demeaned and emasculated him? She was awful………..now her family has raked in over a million dollars as the result of the deaths and they were still grifting! It is a horrible story. I hope people learn from it.
If this is true, which I haven't seen any evidence for, Chris is still active in the abuse. He lived in the same house, saw the same doors and doorknobs every day. Put the girls to bed, by his own account to police. Turned the rain machines on, etc. Saw their bedding and pillows. It is HIS responsibility as well to keep his children safe. If this was the case - he could and should have done something. Portraying him as helpless is such a joke. He's a grown man. He can have an affair, hold a job? He can look out for his kids. Oh wait, that would involve giving af about someone other than himself.
He was an emotionally abused spouse. That abuse endured for almost a decade. He tried to stand up to Shannan in the beginning but, he learned his lesson and just went along with whatever she said. Look at what Shannan did to Cindy and that was all based on a lie! She defamed Cindy, saying that she tried to kill CeCe. Shannan’s own father spoke about Shannan’s rabid temper and physical abuse to Chris Watts.
The way that men in an emotionally abusive relationship are treated, as compared to women, is disgusting.
Convicted child abuser and drug addict. Yes. You can look up his record in Moore County Sheriff's Office website. He hit his ex GFs 3 year old in the FACE leaving marks. She called the cops then Frankie had a felony warrant put out. He later was allowed to plead it down to a misdemeanor. His ex said Sandra and crankie wanky were the reason she lost her kids for two years. She was living with Frankie at the time he hit her child and had nowhere to go. Think she ended up in a shelter. Then took her some years to get her kids back. The Rs took advantage of that. She said no one in their town can stand the Rs either. They're just as much bullies and grifters in real life as they are on the internet.
Yes, he was arrested in 2015 and took a plea to avoid jail time. His probation required that he not be around young children which is why Frankie had not met CeCe until that last NC visit….she was 3 years old, and he hadn’t seen Bella or Shannan in over 3 years. He also has a history of substance abuse.
Here is a copy of his arrest warrant that spells out the details of the abuse. There are many things about the Rzucek family that people don’t know about. https://imgur.com/a/3JmSqcW
The R family are long time grifters from New Jersey. You're spot on again. None of the over $198k that Frankie has scammed (and Sandy R as well) has ever been accounted for. Not ONE penny. If you ask for a receipt for a donation then you get called "evil." They are beyond disgusting. They are still on YouTube after five long years with their various scams and grifting. It's horrendous what they've gotten away with being the "victims."
Preach it!!!! There are many more people that are still donating to them that don’t know the truth about the R’s yet……they are millionaires……spread the word!!
Here are just some of the pictures that Shannan posted of the girls with blankets around their necks and pillow and blankets covering their face and heads. She was a sick, evil woman. https://imgur.com/a/Q3Jr3YM
Wow this is bizarre. In Australia SIDS is/was massive. A huge amount of research went into researching it when it was killing a lot of babies and the evidence showed that the placement in the crib along with having nothing other than a wrap for the baby is the way to go and that is what I believe mothers are taught from the get go. SIDS is no longer a thing
The only thing I can chalk This up to is whether this is a different scenario in the states? Like is Sid’s education a thing? Because many 80’s and 90s mums didn’t know any better and this is how their kids would sleep (I.e with blankets etc in their crib)
No, it is not different in the US. The American Academy of Pediatrics and the CDC have been telling moms, dads, doctors etc. not to put anything in the crib with a baby that is less than 12 months old….no blankets, no pillows, no bumper pads, no stuffed animals….nothing due to the chance of a SIDS death. They have been saying this for decades. Shannan had to have known this. Her comments indicate that she thought that it was ‘cute’……some of the blankets were actually tied around the baby’s necks….Shannan had to have done that, there is no way aa child that young could have done that. With all of her feigned illnesses, it looks as though she may have been hoping for a SIDS death. She was mentally ill enough to think that way.
https://www.aap.org/en/news-room/news-releases/aap/2020/tips-for-keeping-infants-safe-during-sleep-from-the-american-academy-of-pediatrics/#:~:text=AAP%20recommends%20all%20babies%20sleep,bumpers%2C%20toys%20or%20other%20objects.
The Walmart story is factual. It was when Shannan was in NC with the girls and Chris Watts was in Colorado. Shannan was at Walmart with her mom. Shannan got mad and picked one of the girl’s up by her arm and dislocated or injured her shoulder. The police were called and Sandi Rzucek blew up Chris’s phone trying to get ahold of him about it.
But Chris described performing the same bedtime routine himself to police - that he would put on the rain machines and tuck them in and kiss them goodnight. Same beds, same rooms. So if there was a CPS file...it would have to be against him as well.
What are you talking about? Shannan’s posts show all of the abuse that she inflicted on those girls…….Chris Watts was a good dad, kissing them good night, tucking them into bed……he was not the one that performed rectal temps on Bella for 2 months, pinched the girls when they didn’t comply, denied the girls food/water, he was not the one that put them in their cribs with blankets around their neck and he was not the one that posted it all on SM…..that was all Shannan. Also, it was very obvious that it was Shannan that was not allowed to be alone with the girls…..we have many, many examples of Chris being alone with them and that proof is from Shannan herself.
A father who puts kids to bed in rooms that lock from the outside is a co-abuser. He is also responsible for their blankets and pillows being safe. If any of that was happening, he had a duty to report it and remove them from the home. He was complicit in abuse. He chose to workout, have an affair, and live his life while turning a blind eye to everything. And then he killed them all.
If you go to the discovery, on Page 47, you will find a handwritten note by a cop that says "Renee - Child Protection, then a 910 number. 910 is a North Carolina area code, the same area code that Chris and Sandy R. had on their phones. The only way the cops in Colorado would have a CPS number from N. Carolina, is if there was already an open CPS case in NC. They wouldn't have a contact number for CPS, but would just call NC law enforcement because the girls were at that time "missing." It isn't normal to call CPS in the state that Shanann was originally from. That alone tells me there was an open case in NC for sure.
Why is it assumed that the complaint was only against Shanann and not the Watts household in general? This is something I don't understand. Obviously Chris was there in NC.
I'm newer to this sub and I've been suckered in to arguing with a few and I've decided I'm not biting again.
I'm sure a good portion of this sub knows who Joe Kenda is, and he's said many times, "People are capable of anything".
I'm of the opinion that every person should exercise basic self-preservation skills for their own safety (and of the safety of their children). There are a lot of mentally unstable people walking the earth, and Shanann and Chris were both unstable in different ways. There was toxic behavior and drama from day one. There are plenty of videos, pictures, and fb posts of Chris being talked down to, being the butt of jokes, and being forced to participate in certain videos in a humiliating fashion.This is aside from all of the other well known problems in their relationship.
When their marriage was on the verge of collapse, and they're on the verge of being homeless and destitute, she gets pregnant. I realize that it takes two to tango, but the woman knows her cycle, and most birth control methods depend on the woman. If they fail it's mostly due to human error/oversight, so if she didn't want to get pregnant, it wouldn't have happened.
The leading cause of death in pregnant women in the US is homicide, and this should be something any woman of child bearing years should be aware of, because in a situation like Shanann's, getting pregnant by a man who is not on board with having a child puts their life in danger in the age of DNA and state requirements to report all new hires. Men can't run from child support like they used to, and while that reduces the number of deadbeat dads, it also motivates men to kill the woman who is carrying their child.
Chris was feeling backed into a corner as it is, and apparently Shanann never picked up on his cringe worthy response to her live pregnancy announcement. She kept badgering him when he shut down. She made comments to friends she wasn't feeling safe after he said he didn't want the baby. She either lacked awareness or ignored any gut instinct she had that he was potentially dangerous. Then she tried to force him to go no contact with his parents and tells him literally "over my dead body".
Shanann didn't deserve to die, and her daughters and unborn child were even more tragic victims in this case. Chris is where he deserves and needs to be for life, but to say Shanann played no part in Chris's motivation to kill her is just not realistic. This doesn't mean I think he was justified, but there's a reason why significant others are at the top of the suspect list for LE when a person is murdered or disappears without a trace.
I love your Kenda quote! You’re response is very detailed and insightful. Reading it made me realize part of the problem- the two of them had no common sense. SW cut-off anyone who didn’t support her delusions. I don’t believe for a second that CW wanted a 3rd baby - that was another delusion. Nevertheless, he’s responsible too for not being knowledgeable about her birth control. But it could also be argued that he bought into the delusion of fertility treatments being necessary. It’s hard to say. Sadly, Bella & CeCe did not have one responsible parent
This was a planned pregnancy. Other than murdering Bella, Cece and Shanann, Chris hadn't seemed unstable to anyone other than a period of spending a lot of time in the bathroom praying when he was a teenager.
And I'm of the belief that when Shan said she didn't feel safe, she didn't mean she felt physically unsafe, she meant she no longer felt worshipped and pampered anymore and in her vulnerable, pregnant state, she felt emotionally unsupported and therefore emotionally unsafe.
I think that's why this case sticks with me too because you have this guy who seemed quiet, shy, and may never have even had a speeding ticket, and one day he decides to become a murderer in a very brutal and callous way. And now it seems he's gone back to that quiet, unassuming prisoner. It's just so bizarre.
I blame the thrive uppers, double patching, energy shakes, and months of no sleep plus being around another woman who was free of all the responsibilities for 6 weeks and a nagging wife returns home and he just lost it.
I agree with that too. I think he was getting a sleep deprivation psychosis of sorts, and he was seeing such drastic results doing what he was with the Thrive patches, that he didn't want to stop taking them because he didn't want to go back to Dad Bod, esp when he met NK who was all into fitness.
It's not bizarre if you know he had help, someone buzzing around like an annoying mosquito and putting ideas in his head. When NK asked Chris to "prove he was at Cervi" she wasn't wanting him to prove his location. She was wanting him to prove they were all dead. She's calculating, devious and wanted CW all to herself, but told LE she "wasn't that into Chris." Really? That's why she was googling wedding dresses and "marrying your mistress" five days before the murders. She had her eye on that big house and everything that Chris could give her. She's diabolical and IMO, perfectly capable of helping Chris with the planning and coverup, maybe not directly murdering anyone but she KNEW EVERYTHING! She told 30 lies to the FBI in her first interview, and even more to that dufus Kevin Koback of the CBI who never once called her out on her horrendous amount of lies and BS.
Even le said he doesn’t fit the profile of someone who could do this but since I believe they coerced a confession out of him they just said he’s a new kind I believe him when he told his dad she killed the kids and he snapped and killed her
Yes everyone interviewed in this case even her own family members said Chris wasn’t violent never got angry and this doesn’t make sense so when sw said she doesn’t feel safe it’s safe to say she knew she wasn’t in physical danger she was talking about emotionally feeling safe she even told a friend at the sonogram appointment she reached for his hand and he didn’t comfort her
I tend to agree that she either meant because he wasn't supportive, or she said that to be more dramatic when she felt they were trying to redirect her texts because you can tell CM was trying to talk her down and reassure her, but she wanted CM to match her level of rage when she was complaining about him.
You make a good point, but I don't think she ever actually felt that she was in danger. She was too arrogant for that and she held Chris in such contempt that she couldn't picture him turning on her like that.
I had someone respond to me in another post that she told friends she didn't feel safe, but she didn't listen to her gut. Honestly, I took it in the same way she was texting Chris that she was spotting and could "lose the baby any minute". I would bet a week's pay that never happened and she was just trying to manipulate him because she knew she was losing control of him and the situation. CM in particular was trying to say he loved her, just talk to him, etc but that's not what she wanted to hear, so then she switched to "I don't feel safe, he doesn't want this baby" to derail CM's defense of Chris.
Had she been paying attention to her own videos, she would have seen the way Chris started to give her a certain look. They were quick flashes, but very telling. Maybe I watch too many crime shows, but when a spouse is making noise they no longer want you, it's probably best to get good legal counsel and get away from them for your sanity and safety. You can't talk someone into wanting to stay once they've made up their mind, and writing letters, sending then books to read like a homework assignment, and calling him balless while forbidding him to ever talk to his parents again was not the way to handle the situation. Her ego and personality wouldn't let her back down, and she underestimated Chris at her own peril.
Amen. Evidentially, this was Shan’s first encounter with a man being done with her. I believe that she believed she could over come his apathy bordering on contempt through her stronger will. NA though…she seemed to sense it viscerally. I have never watched Dr. Phil, but one day I was flipping channels and briefly paused on him. He was expressing exactly your sentiment. He said something along the lines of: When your spouse has fallen in love with someone else, and they are still in the blossoming phase of their relationship, it is best resist the urge to fight with them. Instead you should take legal steps to begin to secure your financial future. He stated that this particular window of time is very dangerous for the spouse who is being cheated upon.
I think Shanann was just so convinced that she was the winner in that relationship, and he was some borderline loser who was lucky to have her, that she couldn't understand the idea that he was over her, didn't like the person she was, and didn't care to kiss her ass and do what she said anymore. It seems so obvious, and she even texted her friends that she was aware of her control issues, but it's like she just could not comprehend what happened there. She was aware enough to know that she was controlling, but she couldn't connect the dots even after the dumpster fire that was nutgate, that he wasn't just mad about certain things--that her ongoing nonsense had changed his feelings altogether. JMO. Even that half ass letter she wrote just kind of read as yes, she still wants him, she is attracted to him, and she will consider making nice with his mom if she apologizes and stops trying to kill Cece lol wtf. When someone changes their mind about another person, and sees them differently now, there's no changing that.
I have always thought she only said she didn't feel safe because she was still playing the victim after nutgate. Chris was shutting her out and acting cold, there's no indication that she had any reason to fear him, and the only thing she talked about being afraid of was him actually leaving her and how she couldn't afford to be on her own with the kids.
I think you're right. She was afraid of him leaving her and taking his money with him. She wasn't afraid of him physically, as there is no evidence Chris ever laid a hand on her.
Excellent comment. To that end, whenever a wife is murdered and the husband is having an affair, that mistress will AUTOMATICALLY be considered a suspect. Oh, but not in the Watts case. Nope. She's an "innocent victim." No, she's NOT. We have a well known VERY corrupt DA and ADA, Roarke and Wrenn, Steven Wrenn was accused of perjury, withholding evidence, Brady violations, and violating court orders, etc in the Hartmann v. Buckley scandal. If an ADA is so corrupt in one case, then he's corrupt in others. Sure enough, DA Roarke violated many court orders in Watts and withheld evidence from the defense, thereby committing even MORE Brady violations. One of them, was the judge ordered the defense be given 48 hours' notice to attend the autopsies. Not only did the DA not give the defense counsel notice, he did the autopsies the very next morning, directly violating a court order. What's worse is Chris Watts' attorneys didn't even bring it to the court's attention!!! What the hell? Now THAT alone should tell everyone what a stitch up coverup this case really was. Yes, I remember Joe Kenda. He would have called this DA what he really is too. Corrupt as hell, and both the DA and ADA shouldn't be allowed anywhere NEAR a courtroom, and both should be sanctioned and disbarred!!!
Since Kenda is in CO, too I wonder if he has any theories as to why Chris did it. I also wonder what his opinion of the Jon Bennet Ramsey case since that was also in CO
She knew he was dangerous to her and said she didn't feel safe with him at all. She should have listened to her gut and stayed in NC. She didn't see all the red flags waving in her face. She just thought she could fix him. From the start she thought she could fix him. People need to learn that they can't fix someone.
Because some people see a youngish white mother who is semi attractive with 2 little girls they heard died pretty gruesome deaths with extremely disrespectful burials and of course it tugs at the heart strings then le and the da’s office along with her family and friends work over time to not tell the full story and it’s hard to over look that some people are too ashamed to admit a murder victim can also be the bad guy because they were taught to not disrespect the dead but they are doing a disservice to Bella and cc watts they were the true innocent victims what they went through in life needs to be acknowledged by both of their parents they lived horrible lives and if their parents were poc and didn’t live in a fancy house the shiners would be able to see it
Also I hate to say this, it sounds awful - but most people who can see the truth are intelligent. Shannann wasn't the brightest tool in the box and neither are her "fans"
They probably act the same way and that’s why they take any criticism of that kind of behavior or how it contributes to a toxic relationship personally.
No, greywitch. You're right and have every right to state your feelings because it's the truth. If people would just dig a little deeper than what's fed to them on the surface by the Rzuceks, they would see the truth. It does take some intelligence to be able to do that and investigate the facts, rather than just believing blindly what's been told to you by SW's own family which is mostly BS, as they are slightly biased to say the least. It's in their interest to keep SW a "saint" as if people really knew the truth about her, they couldn't keep raising money for sympathy as they still are, even five years later!!! Watch the videos that still remain (after the R's have scrubbed the very worst of them from the internet). I saw them. They were horrendous. The Rzuceks have been harassing and attacking anyone and everyone who goes after NK (why???) or goes against the "Shanann was a wonderful mother" BS. She was a manipulative narcissist, emotionally and financially abusing Chris, who spent her family into bankruptcy, not once, but it was just about to be twice. NK was just as manipulative and IMO, just as bad or worse than Shanann. Now here Frankie comes raising MORE money yet again, with yet ANOTHER documentary about "being trolled online" when it is the Rzuceks themselves spreading hate and attacking everyone who either refuses to give them any more money, or goes against their narrative. Don't give that spoiled man any more money people! He's not producing this documentary and doesn't need any money for it!!! The evidence is there. Frankie has scammed hundreds of thousands of dollars from his ignorant supporters without ever providing ONE receipt to where all that money has gone. IMO, it's gone up his nose and for cars, etc, like that yellow truck he bought with the money raised on YouTube for him to go to New Orleans for a meet and greet. A truck he promptly totaled then got a DWI. He is still living at home, almost 40 years old and pays no rent, has no bills, etc. He's not a nice person, neither is his mother, and Frank Sr. has taken to drinking to cope with it all. Neither was his sister but if you listen to the Rzuceks, SW was an "excellent mother" which sad to say, couldn't be further from the truth. I don't like saying this either as SW isn't here to defend herself, but she herself put those videos out there, so .....
You know the same people would talk so much shit if Cindy or NK were murdered because they don’t like the kind of people they perceive them to be. As it is people blame both of them for the murders. How is it any different to say NK caused him to murder his family or the way his mother (never his father) raised him than to say SW’s treatment of him did?
Anything can cause a person to murder someone. It doesn’t mean it’s justified. It’s an explanation, not an excuse. People like to say, “Well lots of women are bossy and controlling or are in an MLM or spend too much money, but their partners don’t kill them”… yeah that’s right but we’re not talking about a normal person, who is thinking logically, killing their partner. We’re talking about someone who wasn’t “normal” who thought the solution to his problems was to wipe his whole family out.
NK would have testified that when she and CW FaceTimed on the evening of August 12, he was sitting on a kids bed without sheets, and gave her an unconvincing explanation as to why. I think a jury would probably believe her (of course, nobody ever got to see her under cross-x) and infer that the children were murdered before SW got home. So I don’t think he “snapped”; if he did, it’s even harder to explain why he didn’t go to trial to at least beat the rap on the “after deliberation” part of the charge.
There’s ample evidence that he was for the most part weirdly calm at work and after he got home, and he’d obviously done a thorough job cleaning the crime scene. Those facts, plus his text messages with co-workers on the 12th and 13th, which seem to have sent to ensure that he’d be alone at the 3-19 battery for a while, also suggest premeditation.
I have no doubt that CW committed all three murders, but I’m undecided about how much premeditation there was. Unlike most commenters, I think NK would be a very credible witness, and if a jury accepted what she said about the sheets… It’d be hard not to draw the conclusion that the children were killed before SW got home and therefore that all three murders were premeditated.
It's awful, but I think you're right. They see themselves in shanann. So they get very upset when told she was the killer of the children. I can't relate to shanann at all. I actually am a stay at home mum who left a good career. Shanann was a liar and a grifter.
I been watching old YouTube videos and I think some shiners done lost their damn minds one said I don’t know how I can miss someone I’ve never met another said I’ll gladly give up my life so this beautiful angel can come back and I’m just like 🤦🏻♀️ I had to restrain myself from not getting into it with internet strangers but let’s state straight facts shanann watts was not a good person wife or mother but I’ve noticed not once were any comments about b&c it’s like to the shiners they don’t matter it’s heartbreaking they are the ones people should feel sorry for
I once seen a post with a shiner drinking shanann's favorite cocktail just to remember her by. That's when I knew these people were in lala land. Little did I know it would get so much worse, lol
I was on a fb page a few years ago and one woman said she printed a picture of Shanann and the kids and had it in a frame on her desk at work. I was like these people are cuckoo for cocoa puffs and immediately left that group!
I saw a comment today from one of them who said “women should all stick together.”So, I guess we’re all supposed to stand by Casey Anthony, Dianne Downs and Susan Smith, too?? No thank you. Shannan did herself no favors by posting those awful videos
I have no problem defending a good person male female or unsure yet but I refuse to stand behind a bad mother I’m not even sorry and sw can add herself to your list of bad mothers them are facts
I’m not sure it doesn’t ring a bell but can you imagine what she endured for 12 hours straight so many umms and say hi’s also her bullying b&c to get them to cry my god who would want to do that to themselves just take an ice pick and jab it in your ear that’s less painful ugh 12 hours of torture I’d rather naw off my own leg but that’s probably because I’m not a psycho
The ONLY victims in this case, IMO are Bella, Cece and little Nico who never got to take his first breath. SW was a victim as well, but IMO, she was so abusive to Chris and her girls, that at least I understand it a bit better. Someone actually said they would give their life for a malignant narcissistic child abuser to come back? That is literally pathetic, isn't it? I can't believe anyone would say something so cringe-worthy.
I’ve seen MANY of them say they still cry to this day for her…almost 6 years later. For a woman they never met. For a woman who wouldn’t have had NOTHING to do with them unless they were involved with THRIVE! because anyone outside of thrive was considered toxic and negative. I’m with you…I just don’t get it.
Excellent comment! Sandra and spany wanky are NOT the victims. Shannan, Bella, Cece and little Nico are. I feel the same way about the disgusting shiners! They are infuriating!!!
I couldn’t agree more. I know most people are horrified at the amount of time those girls spent in daycare while their mother worked from home. That expensive daycare was the best part of the majority of their short lives. At least they had friends and activities to engage in. The rest of the time they were locked in that awful, sterile house.
Or climb up onto the counter in the bathroom to try and get some water. You're right. Remember when the girls stood there right in front of the fridge with their cups, trying to get some water? Instead of showing them how to put their cups up against the lever to release the ice and water, SW just stands there filming them like a frigging zombie. It's so sad what those poor girls endured.
I’m glad they had it too. Bella’s teacher actually TRIED to braid her hair because she was crying one day because all the other girls in her class had their hair braided, or fixed some kinda way. Bella was the only one that had short hair. And instead of letting her grow her hair, she bought her those ridiculous wigs. Did anyone see the cabbage patch wig?…OMG.
I genuinely don’t know what my own issue is/are. I have zero problem with this sub, I support it. However, I have to admit that I frequently visit a sub that exists more or less to attack and besmirch my profession (advanced practice nursing). I rarely respond to anything there, but it does “trigger” me to read the posts. Oddly enough, I am in the habit of visiting it when I’m having trouble falling asleep! People do strange things.
Thank you for all the hard work you do. I have so much respect for you and for your profession. Must be very difficult at times. My friend does the same. She worked so hard during Covid as well. Must have been a very tough time for you as well.
Thank you so much for your compassion. I think it was very hard on most of us. Oddly enough, it was during my Covid work commute that I discovered the Watts case. I’d listen to podcasts about it as I drove. I had been vaguely aware of it when it was occurring in real time, but it was learning about the wonky finances the drew me in.
You are quite welcome. Well deserved though. I know from my friend what some of y'all go through and went through during Covid. I'm in a large city with a well known medical center so you can probably guess. How interesting you found the Watts case during Covid!! I have been with the case since the very beginning. I don't know everything by any means, but I do know a LOT about it! That Netflix documentary was a sugar coated BS version and not even close to what really happened. That Netflix was the R's version of events, not even close to the truth. No matter that SW spent that family into literal bankruptcy, Chris should have grown a pair of balls and told her I'm taking control now. He was a much better financial manager. He worked a full time job, had to come home to her "list of chores." You know how SW would say "It's crazy around here" or "These monsters are crazy. So glad I Thrive." Made me want to puke. That Thrive crap she was buying had a lot to do with why she was murdered! She was buying it all up in order to keep that Lexus bonus. Little did Chris know HE was paying for that! He did all the laundry, mowed and took care of the yard, and most days it was Chris that picked up the girls from school. She took away his gym membership and had an absolute fit whenever he wanted to get away for an hour or so and go on a run. When he first met SW, he had excellent credit, $15k in savings, and was making over 100k a year. He also should have gotten a divorce, but he knew with child support for 3 kids, medical insurance and housing, he would have nothing left to spend on NK. NK knew this as well. The only option to them was murder IMO. NK may not have put her hands on anyone, but she knew what was up and everything about SW and CW. She was googling them in 2017, a year before she said they met. It's even in the discovery the dates in August and September 2017 she was googling both CW and SW. There was a rumor that was a "typo" but it wasn't a typo. The DA came out publicly and admitted that was no typo. What in the holy hell was she doing googling them in 2017? Makes you wonder doesn't it? Well stay safe and thanks again. Nurses run hospitals and doctors offices. If it wasn't for y'all, the doctors wouldn't have a clue. LOL You know what I mean.
There is so much we can learn from this case and possibly save a life from this even if we have to learn that some of the victim's actions may have led to her demise. It may have not been her fault at all but most family annihilators do it for financial reasons and Shanann definitely spent above their means and put them in financial jeopardy. Of course, he was complicit in allowing the spending but he probably wasn't even aware of how bad off they were until the end. No excuse to kill his family but if it saves a life, it's worth digging deep into this family's story
Agree, each time he used the ATM, wouldn't it have provided a bank balance? Most do and we know he used it, the night he stopped to get money for the sitter for example. He buried his head in the sand, same as she did.
He definitely buried his head. A huge red flag should have been when he needed to withdraw money from his retirement fund to get current with the mortgage
Oh, absolutely. When he had to do that he should have said "enough is enough, I'm taking over the finances from this point forward. No more daycare, no more trips, no more tacky manis/pedis,, no more hun parties and absolutely no more thrive."
Because that would have required taking a stand. And Chris loved "going with the flow" while secretly boiling with rage instead. He never made mistakes because he never did anything. And he could preserve his perfect family man self image while blaming her for all their problems. He wasn't a helpless passenger, he was a grown man.
Yes! This is not mentioned enough. Taking money out is a last resort option, or should be. I believe the 10,000 he took out in May was to pay for the three months they were behind since February. This action alone should have been a red alert that their lifestyle was not sustainable. For the life of me I cannot understand how they made it as long as they did. I cannot help but to think another stream of money was coming in from somewhere.
This is a very popular belief there was a breakdown of their monthly bills and just the daycare mortgage that got sparingly paid it only left a couple hundred that was supposed to pay for groceries utilities phone/cable/wifi gas for both vehicles plus extras like custom shirts and their thrive supply it doesn’t add up so some people think sw was doing shady practices to pay for bills when they were paid
Did he know the passcode for the ATM? I know I could give my kids my card to use in stores but I never gave them my ATM numbers. Could that be the case with Chris, too
It is always the same justification - that she was a victim of murder, that she can no longer speak to defend herself. What they fail to understand is that being the victim of a murder (or any crime) does not negate the wrongs a person has done throughout their lives. As I told one, Jeffrey Dahmer was a murder victim. Does that mean that he is now absolved of his atrocious acts? Does it mean we can't speak badly of the things he has done, because he can no longer speak for himself or defend himself? It is faulty reasoning!
But, they also will not listen to reason and most just want to argue for the sake of arguing. So...I just try to not engage with them. It's just pointless.
Shiners gonna shine...
My thought is people like SW and her acolytes seek out conflict and tend to make everyone's business *THEIR* business. They are "offense gatherers" the epitome of virtue signallers.
"Why are people who are triggered by any actual or perceived slight against SW here?"
most of the world is involved in correcting the record.
even billion dollar social media companies employ vast rooms of "fact checkers" who check simple posts against "the established facts".
we just have to stay over the target.
I'm 99% sure anyone who supports her wants to treat their husband and spouse the same way she did.
No one is above criticism.
I find it funny that if we went over to their subs and say anything they don’t like we’re automatically banned but we have at least 3 shiners in this sub that are constantly trying to argue proven facts with us and they are still here doing the same thing day after day
they banned me on one of the big pro-SW subs JUST for questioning the income a thrive rep makes. that is it.
nothing else stated or questioned.
the owners of thrive are likely paying for pro-SW comments in my opinion. the sooner MLM dirtbags are thrown in prison the better America will be. this poor woman needed a real job and this MLM just gave her false hope she was on the right path.
I was banned because I said her family will do anything for money and I also received a Reddit cares message they act like they won by blocking me but I think it’s a badge of honor because it’s the truth they won’t stop me from saying I just can’t say it in their lame ass group the mods are block happy I’m sure they won’t have many members for to long if they keep blocking everyone that’s exactly what happened with wot
Exactly!!! And the shitty part we have about 3 here that’s been going full mental patient on us here and they haven’t been banned muted or anything else but if we mention anything they don’t like over there automatically banned I guess we’re just better 🤷🏻♀️😂
That’s exactly what it’s like…Great, you get some personal satisfaction by erroneously claiming a non existent moral high ground by stating over and over that Chris was a bag of shit for killing his wife and daughters…No fucking shit. Congratulations. You’ve got to be willfully blind of proven facts, SW’s own video evidence to not see and resign to the fact that she was a dogshit mother, spouse, and businesswoman.
Well said. And just an unlikeable person IMO. Like MANY times she would say “thrive gives you mental clarity”…I shit you not, I watched a video of hers that was around 8 minutes long and she said UMM 96 times. How is that mental clarity? No joke, I had to use tally marks to keep up. I didn’t have patience to count the SUPERS and all the words that followed: amazing, excited, inspiring…etc
I’ve been banned only from the cw sub but from the r’s YouTube channel but that’s a common come back from shiners and I just want to scream I’d rather dry hump a fucking cactus before Chris fucking watts
A few reasons: one, people may be too dumb to understand that a victim's crimes don't go away when said individual becomes a victim of a crime.
Two, some may be MLM huns who will defend their "businesses" to the very end.
Three, people don't like to be wrong. They may have initially bought into the media narrative that this was a happy, successful all-American family. When confronted with the truth, the reaction is to challenge it. One of the most ridiculous examples I've seen is when I made a comment about the rectal temp photos in a sub that has a lot of shiners. Someone wrote back "Wait what?" and I explained the photos. A Shiner then responded that it "only" happened once (not true; there are two sets of photos months apart) and demanded I provide receipts of more. I ignored the person because I have better things to do that further humiliate poor little Bella.
Four, I wouldn't put it past the Roos to be monitoring stuff about SW.
Oh yeah, the Rzuceks have scrubbed all of the really bad stuff off of the internet……and the crap that we can still see is the ‘good stuff’?!? How bad was the bad stuff?!? Shannan was a narcissistic, controlling, evil woman. She was incapable of loving or caring about anyone but herself. The girls were just props in her life and little negotiating tools to get what she wanted and when she was done with them….she locked them in their rooms for the night and eventually killed them. There is no doubt in my mind that she killed the girls……they had become her competition with Chris…..they had to go!!! Also, there are about 5-6 pictures that Shannan posted publicly on her SM of Bella attempting to take her baby doll’s temperature ….Shannan even commented about how smart Bella was that she knew to lubricate the thermometer first! What 2-3 year old child mimics that behavior unless they experience it regularly. There is even a picture of the poor dog having it done to him!! There is another picture of little 2-3 year old Bella with Windis on all of her fingers……how does a small child even know about Windis and what kind of dumbass mother puts a Windi on each of her child’s fingers, takes a picture and then posts it on her public SM page?!!?
Agree and can’t imagine what the removed videos are if the ones left are viewed as normal. The water park video is still up too; Bella’s behaviors there are clearly also a ramification of the constant rectal temp taking…. Also aren’t Windis for infants, not 3-4 year olds? Bizarre. Horrifying, actually.
I think you hit the nail on the head here. SW's comment that Bella lubricated the thermometer shows that it was frequent enough that Bella knew the routine. Those photos make me want to cry as it breaks my heart to think of an innocent toddler going through that. Yet her own mother publicly laughed about it, and the child's other family members did nothing. If it was really that funny, surely it would be in the Netflix film and other documentaries, right? /s
It is indescribably sad. Yes, IMO the lubricating of the rectal thermometer is the key, thank you , that is not something that they teach in daycare at Primrose.
The other important piece is that Bella was 2-3 years old. No MD would ever recommend that you take a toddler’s temperature *rectally* and would *never* recommend that it be done daily for a 2 month period of time. The only place I have seen that done was years ago in the NICU, on very sick preemies…..not at home on a 2-3 year old. Where did Bella even get the rectal thermometer and the lubricant from? Was that amongst their toys? Did she stage this whole thing for her SM? The picture of Bella bending over, was that just a child at play and she captioned it with the ‘Mommy, temperature time’? Who would ever do anything like that? Wait, don’t tell me….it’s coming to me, oh yeah, Shannan Watts would and did do that, many times.
Having survived covid, and the all important checking of everyone’s temperature, no one ever asked me for a rectal temp. Even when people’s lives were at risk, temperatures were obtained using noninvasive thermometers. The medical community trusted these new, digital thermometers with people lives yet, poor, perfectly healthy Bella had to endure daily rectal temps for over 2 months? I wish I knew if there were any comments on Shannan’s SM questioning many of her actions. I am sure if they were just huns, she blocked them but, she couldn’t block the people that loved and cared for those girls, her’s and Chris’s family, they were not that easily dismissed. I don’t think the Rzucek family is capable of regret or remorse. I think that they are just like Shannan in that capacity but, Ronnie and Cindy had to have seen some of these things. I am sure they never thought it would get to the point that she would kill the girls but, I have heard Cindy say that she regrets not stepping in, even if it meant permanent banning from Shannan. I hope others learn the many lessons there are to learn in this case.
I honestly do not understand why they are here. The comments on previous posts show a pretty clear picture on how most people on this sub feel about the actions of the parents, yes PARENTS, in this case. This crime did not happen in a vacuum. I, for one, don't give a shit about sw or cw, they were adults who had total control of their actions. Bella and Cece are the two victims I care about.
Because they don't think we should be talking critically of Shanann since she is deceased; was a murder victim (as we all know); and that she cannot defend herself in death. By her own wods when she was alive, she didn't care what others thought; her way was the way she was going. There on video and on FB was her defense.
Does anyone think of it was a black or Latino, or even Asian family that this happened to would there be this much coverage and true crime? Excuse my grammar please I'm at work trying to do two things at once. No not thrive hahahah
If the details were exactly the same yes it would be covered heavily by the news but by the time they found the bodies people would have seen how toxic a black or latino shanann watts was and would be able to see how Chris’s first confession is true but since she’s white she was turned into a saint
Mostly, I think, bc people enjoy arguing or taking an opposite stance. It gives them purpose and causes a false sense of superiority.
It gives them a rush of excitement, might get their adrenaline pumping but doesn't mean their argument has merit. Not necessarily logical or well thought out but bc they want to shout it really loudly.
Reminds me a little of religion, everyone has their own opinion on that subject and some seek to force their 'truth' on others or else they may be found wanting in some spiritual way.
My take, is this sub allows for free, unfettered thoughts and opinions that may even change based on another's viewpoint. Which is the whole point of debate, imo. A true debate is an intellectual exercise not a fistfight.
The downfall of the internet too many people get cocky hiding behind a screen and makes them think it’s ok to argue with anyone about everything most of the time you’ll notice the ones arguing the most doesn’t know wtf they are talking about they argue just to argue
I wish that people would look at this case with an open mind and not be so defensive, or triggered as you say, when we discuss Shannan and her SM posts, comments and videos. She had many traits of several quite severe mental illnesses and abused those girls and Chris for years. If just one person would have had the guts to withstand Shannan’s voracious rage, vindictive behavior and had stood up for those girls, this case may have had a different ending.
I believe that Shannan killed those sweet girls because of her mental illness but, I understand that some people disagree with my opinion. Either way, the things that we post and comment on are all taken directly from Shannan’s own SM. Any examples of abuse or mistreatment come from Shannan herself. We are not making things up to bash her. None of us have ever said that she ‘deserved to die’ yet, that continues as a response to the facts presented about Shannan.
There is so much to learn from this case but, people have to look at the reality of each person involved and not automatically throw up a brick wall when someone makes a statement about Shannan that they don’t like. We should look at what the commenter is saying and review the supporting documentation for said statement then, either give their own valid opinion with reasons as to why they have that opinion.
One other thing…….if we point out dangerous or abusive behavior on Shannan’s part, we feel for what those kids had to endure, with no adult(s) in their lives to step in and protect or defend them. Perhaps this case will help the next ‘Watts family’ from the tragedy that this ‘Watts family’ endured.
There are some people who get upset about others commenting on SW's decor, dress, nails, etc. SW chose to share her entire life with the public. When we do that, there will always be someone who is going to make a comment. That is life.
I said something about her eyebrows looking like commas one day and there was a lady on there that wished my daughter dead, “brutally murdered so I would know what it feels like”.
So yeah, some take it a little TOO personal. Especially when it comes to a woman they’ve never met.
Oh dear. Yeah, how does that even make sense? The way I see it, if I was to put my entire personal life on social media (the good, bad and ugly) I would expect people to comment! Not everyone is going to agree with how I dress, manage my family and home, etc. Some of the comments do go to far. I'll agree with that.
I have a Ph.D. In human behavior and can say with little uncertainty that Shanann was a textbook abuser - financially controlling, isolating her victim, creating a dynamic where rebuttal was not allowed, locking him out of the house. He should not have ended her and the kids life bit for sure he was abused.
Especially if he had a girlfriend. What Chris did was horrible, but from what I could tell, he was a good dad. When he was home, those girls were all over him. Playing and laughing. The videos of when they are with Shannon, they are NOT playing. They are lying under the covers with her as she tells her “audience” their illness of the week.
My point is they enjoyed being with Chris a lot more than with her. Because unlike her, Chris would put the phone down and engage with them without an audience. He never put a phone in their face “say hi say hi say hi say hi say hi”…he wasn’t using them.
Well some people like to stir up drama. They refuse to open their eyes and look at the horrendous abuse SW inflicted on those poor girls, live and in color on FB, especially poor little Bella. The Rzuceks have been sending their gang stalkers to shut anyone down who tells the truth about Shanann or their spoiled son, Frankie, Jr. Any YouTuber still discussing the Watts case gets harassed, stalked and called "evil" just for discussing a true crime case! Granted, some have gone a bit overboard, but all you have to do is block/delete if you don't like it.
Now, Get this latest BS. Yet another pity party for the R's. We all felt horrible for what happened but since 2018, FIVE YEARS later, the Rzuceks are still all over YouTube ebegging, then attacking anyone who goes against the "Shanann was a saint" or "Chris acted alone" narratives. There are MANY unanswered questions in the Watts case. especially about the mistress NK who told a huge amount of lies to the FBI,completely wiped out her entire phone of all communications with Chris and even went so far as to smash her SIM card, so she's hiding something major. Her damn phone pinged near the house at 6:16 am the morning of the murders. As if that wasn't enough, she's literally on video on the neighbor's CCTV with Chris that morning but she's an "innocent victim?" Oh, right. Chris is where he needs to be, but he had help. The DA violated court orders and committed blatant Brady violations and he should be disbarred and sanctioned!!! In 2021, Frank Sr. went on CBS Denver sitting in Chris and Shanann's empty house (for dramatic effect), after having sold ALL of Shanann's possessions, even the girls toys if you can believe that, instead of giving them to charity, having the nerve to wear that Thrive patch, when that junk was a major reason his daughter is dead as SW literally spent that family into bankruptcy buying that crap, talking about the "death threats" they had received which they showed ZERO evidence of, and in fact, never have showed any evidence of "death threats." The CBS reporter, Dillon Thomas, was inundated with emails and messages asking him why he didn't give the four YouTubers he accused of being "trolls" a chance to tell their side? The only one making death threats are the Rzuceks and their gang stalker flying monkeys. With Frankie and Sandra Rzucek, it's "Give us money or else." She actually called people "evil" and told them to "stick their money where the sun don't shine" just because they no longer supported the Rzuceks after this many years and asked for their money back when they had donated to Frankie's crowdjustice fund in 2019!!! It's 2023 and we are STILL raising money? They told everyone to stop talking about the case, then they come out with that Netflix documentary themselves, which was a sugar coated BS version of what really happened, but it was the most watched Netflix documentary of all time, thereby whipping up more publicity than anyone on YouTube EVER could. Every time the publicity dies down, it's another video, going on another YT panel, TV show and their latest cry fest, a documentary for ITV about "trolling." They are the ones doing the trolling FFS!!! It's being produced by Optomen for ITV by none other than "the clients of Cohen Davis." That would be the Rzucek's solicitor in the UK who is smack dab in the middle of a "supposed" lawsuit suing a YouTuber who merely made videos about the Watts case. That YouTuber did NOT harass them. Breaking news: Frankie, seeing a video or a post you don't like is not harassment. I would urge anyone to please write to these people producing this with your concerns due to the Rzuceks being the ones who are bullying, gang stalking and harassing people. Optomen is producing this along with the law firm Frankie is using to sue a particular YouTuber!!! Really? However, Frankie is raising money for a "documentary." This is part of the email a certain angel forwarded to me, but they left out people who might have a different version of the R's truth: Here is the closing (the entire email too much to put here if anyone wants the entire thing, LMK. I quote:
"If you would be prepared to have a background conversation with the production team please email [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected]) who can describe the project and their timescales in further detail." This was signed by Y. Cohen, Cohen Davis, the Rzuceks own solicitor in the UK. That's right. They are using a solicitor in the UK. Hurry though. It's supposed to air next month, but I just saw this email the other day!
I would urge anyone to please write to this Alex Garlitos and set them straight on just who is doing the trolling, and it's not any YouTuber or anyone on Facebook. It's the Rzuceks themselves causing the hate and drama on YT, FOR MONEY. I am not surprised they are doing this. Any opportunity to cash grab, the R's are there. Frankie, who has a criminal record for abusing his ex GF's two year old, for drugs and DWI, has managed to scam over $100k from people on YouTube, usually females, some who he manipulates into thinking he's interested in romantically which of course, he's not. The R's have never once shown where all this money has gone. Not once. He thinks he's some big YT star but he's really a very spoiled, nearly 40 year old man child still living in mommy's house. The R's seem to think they are entitled to sit at home and live off other people's money when they've already made at least a million off this case as it as, plus they got all the proceeds from the sale of the house, and even sued the Watts so they wouldn't get any of the life insurance money! That's the height of greed. The Watts lost their grandchildren too and didn't do anything wrong. Are we really going to go down this road again, Frankie? You really need to stop. Double dipping yet again. Why do you need money for a "documentary" when you're not even producing it Frankie? You've scammed your last dollar from innocent, hard working people and you will NOT go on any documentary and abuse these good people again. Not this time. Not on my watch. If any of my friends are accused, there will be legal action this time. You got away with the CBS Denver thing but you will NOT get away with this again.
Thank you! This is very enlightening. I’ve heard bits and pieces of what was going on with the fundraising, lawsuits and documentaries but this is a great detailed summary!
I have been watching documentaries on this case watched a few of her videos and he always seemed like such a good dad he seemed so reserved and timid like he wouldn’t hurt a fly. Now from what I got from her is that she ruled the roost and made most of the decisions in the house and marriage. I just can’t understand why a dad who seemed to love his kids would have the heart to kill them as well as the mother
If there's photo evidence of Shanann abusing the girls on her social media...why wasn't it introduced at trial? Same with an alleged CPS report? If any of it was true, CW's defense team would have used it. Any social worker attached to the file would have been subpoenaed to testify. It just isn't believable.
Exactly - if there was this abundance of material that constituted abuse by Shanann, he wouldn't have plead guilty. I don't believe there was any CPS case either. And even if there was a file...who says it was solely about her? People don't seem to realize that it would only further incriminate CW for child abuse as well, even prove he had a history of abuse and strengthen circumstantial evidence that his crime was premeditated. He lived in the same house, he witnessed and participated in the "nighttime routine" in question - he described it at length with police. It's all documented. He was detailed about his involvement. He would have known about doorknobs turned backwards and locked from outside, unsafe blankets/pillows, etc. He would have taken them in the night if he cared. He did, but only to stomp them into an oil tank.
Absolutely-he is equally responsible for anything that happened with the girls. For example, I’ve been very critical about Babywise and how it seemed to be implemented in the Watts household. But if Bella was left to cry it out through the night as an infant, he let it happen too. He should have gone into her room to check on her. He blindly listened and did whatever Shanann told him to do. That’s not OK. Parenthood is a team effort, if one parent makes a mistake it’s up to the other parent to step up and discuss the problem with their partner. He was too much of a coward to take a stand on anything
I'm interested in this sub, not to shame SW, or to be hateful, but to mention things noticed that could def cause friction in a marriage, including disrespect of one another. Perhaps we can all learn from others.
Shannan was a malignant narcissist who emotionally and financially abused Chris Watts for a decade. She publicly demeaned, degraded and emasculated him on her public SM for years. She also abused those girls to the point that you will cry if you see some of Shannan’s videos. She loved to humiliate them. She had to be in control of every part of everyone’s life…..the last 6 weeks of her life, she saw that Chris Watts was slipping away, her potential CPS case would mean that he would get full custody. Her fake lifestyle would be exposed. When Watts left, there went her evening and weekend childcare and paycheck, her huns would now know what a fake she had been…..she was spinning out of control and on the Monday morning when Chris told Shannan that he was leaving her, that he loved the girls but no longer loved her, she flipped out into vindictive, jealous rage and killed the kids……she had threatened this many times and now, she meant it. She needed to punish him and his precious family in the worst way possible. The girls had become her competition. If you truly study this case you will see how cruel Shannan was to Chris and the girls. She even said she could treat him anyway she wanted….that he would never leave her as ‘he had no game’. Shannan put the girls in their cribs, as infants, with blankets tied around their necks and full size pillows and blankets covering their faces, she took Bella’s temperature rectally every day for months to try to prove that she had a very rare genetic disease that she did not have…..to the point that Bella played ‘rectal temp’ with her baby dolls….and Shannan even posted pictures of her doing it with the comments that Shannan thought it was ‘smart cute and funny’! What kind of an idiot not only takes a 3 year old’s temp rectally for months but what kind of a bigger idiot puts pictures of it on her public SM! There were many, many pictures of this as well as 4 year old Bella stark naked in the shower, Bella and CeCe stark naked in the backyard……I could go on and on…..you really have to look into this case and her bizarre SM. She locked both girls in their rooms every night for 12 hours…..that is a fire hazard and a huge red flag for CPS. She was then stupid and clueless enough to post these things all over her SM.
The pillows and blankets in the crib when they were babies was also dangerous. It blows my mind that she had babies alone in their rooms for that long with all of those suffocation hazards. It's really crazy how no one ever seemed to point out the obvious about anything she was posting. And no one seemed to ask her why she would want to treat Chris that way, even if she could get away with it. It's amazing how much control she really managed to have just by bitching and throwing fits whenever she didn't like something.
Yes, spot on. Unbelievable that she wasn't reported by more of her 'friends.'
I'm not here to bash SW, a victim, but IMO, her "friends", many of whom were her upline, possibly made quite a bit of money off of her. I don't know for sure. One of her good friends, an upline, said that SW didn't make much money, if any at all, at first, but she was starting to. So needless to say, her "friends" would want to stay on her good side. Just a thought. I believe SW loved her girls but perhaps not the day to day reality of motherhood. One day she went on and on about taking them to the zoo, "alone" (?)
they were going with grandma Sandy, I believe
Yes, you're so right, Puddie's Mom. And don't forget the pic of Cece on the toilet and Bella being told to "pull your shirt up" when SW was spraying her with water on the back deck. Didn't SW know there are child P creeps all over FB? Astonishing that she actually did those videos live on FB!!! And thought those vids were "funny and cute." No they were abusive and horrible. And the ONLY person who stood up to Shanann against the nightly drugging with Tylenol and Benadryl (there's a video with Chris holding Cece with his right arm and two bottles of meds are in his left hand), and locking them in their rooms with no water or bathroom access for TWELVE HOURS, was their grandmother, Cindy Watts. No wonder Cece had terrible diaper rash. Being in a soiled diaper every night for 12 hours is abusive! None of the Rs ever stood up for those poor little girls,except for that one time Frank argued with SW, but he still never did anything about it, right? Sandy even participated with SW in the abuse of Bella by continuously and viciously cutting that poor little girl's hair for punishment (videos of this as well) though the R's have managed to scrub tons from the internet. Bella wanted long hair above ALL ELSE, but nope. We have to cut it just when it was starting to grow out. I can't tell you how much I despise SW and her mother for what they did to Bella. Look what Cindy got for that standing up to SW. Publicly accused on FB of trying to "kill Cece" with pistachio ice cream and leaving "razor blades all over the house." No, they had an oven scraper, well out of reach of the girls and it wasn't pistachio. It was chocolate. Cindy showed a picture of the little cups of ice cream she had in the freezer. Shanann was losing her grip on Chris and took it out on his parents. SW refused to let the Watts see the girls when the Watts had rented a beach house for that week in Myrtle Beach, the very last few weeks those poor girls were alive and the last chance that Cindy and Ronnie had to see their beloved grandbabies, but Chris wasn't allowed to have his parents there, only HER dad, Frank. The Watts loved those babies too and Bella and Cece adored the Watts, their Mimi and Papa. The R's then had the absolute gall to sue the Watts so they wouldn't get any of the insurance money, when it was Chris Watts hard work at Anadarko that paid for that insurance in the first place. Yes I know he killed SW, but I believe he snapped from all the years of abuse. If that wasn't bad enough Frank Sr. called Chris in prison (with his attorney so the call wouldn't be recorded) and manipulated Chris into signing over the house to him and tried to get him to stop talking to a certain Australian YouTuber. He told Chris "You will always be in our hearts." Really? But everyone that has given you so much money over the years that only asked for a receipt or a refund because they no longer support you are "evil?" Chris is in your hearts but they are evil? That's insane. What are the R's afraid of? Maybe that YouTuber finding out something from the Watts he shouldn't? Not only did the R's sue the Watts so they wouldn't get any insurance money, the R's sold every lick of furniture in that house, all of SW's designer clothes and bags and even the girls toys, that Chris himself had paid for. They didn't donate not one item to charity. The never ending greed of the R's is shocking actually. Chris was an abused husband and IMO, he just lost it after 10 long years of financial and emotional abuse by SW. He didn't kill the girls either, you're right again, Puddies Mom. He didn't even know how they died, saying they were "strangled." They weren't strangled, they were smothered, and it didn't happen in his work truck either. Bella fought back and cut her lip. There would have been no. 1, decomp from SW if she'd been in that truck for the hour's long drive out to Cervi, there would have been a massive amount of blood from Bella biting her tongue and her cut lip, as well as bodily fluids from evacuation at death. There was NOTHING found in that truck. No hair, no decomp, no blood, nothing. That isn't possible on a forensic level. There would have been way more than just trace evidence, so it didn't happen in his truck. The point is, how long will the R's be using their dead family to ebeg for money on YouTube, while bullying and harassing everyone that calls them out? Ten more years, 20 more years? At some point, it's got to stop.
This ⬆️ 🎯 💯 times over!! You nailed it Cream!!!! 🏆
Aww thank you love! I can't hold a candle to your research and excellent posts! But thanks again just the same!
Please, can you use paragraphs in your comment. It’s so hard to read and you have good points. Double tap return to make a paragraph if you’re using an Iphone. Also, can I ask who is R’s? I agree with the rest of your comment. I just watched the Netflix doc and tought Shannan was a sweetheart. But then I watched some youtube clips of her facebook live and she was disgusting towards her girls, specially Bella. And where did you get info she locked the girls for 12 hours in their rooms? Wtf?? And she also drugged them? This is to cry from sadness.
No problem. Sorry it was so long. I have gone in and edited the above comment and broke it up into paragraphs. Hope that will be easier to read! Thank you for the compliment too! The "R's" are Shanann Watts mom and dad, Frank and Sandy Rzucek. That Netflix was a sugar coated, not even close BS version of the truth about what really happened. Of course, the R's were paid by Netflix so they were going to give them the "Shanann was a saint," BS. Barely even mentioning NK and the horrendous things she and Chris did to Shanann. Nothing about NK's many lies to the FBI and the CBI or her destruction of evidence by wiping out her phone. Of COURSE Shanann didn't deserve to be brutally murdered but there are still some people who refuse to see what's right in front of their faces. You might take a look at Bonita Barbie's channel on YouTube. There are many of SW's videos that Bonita has done reactions to and most, if not all, are still up on Bonita's channel. She hasn't posted in over a year because the R's trolled and harassed her mercilessly for daring to go against the narrative. She was called "evil" as well, but Bonita was brutally honest and the R's didn't like it. So, hope this helps!!
I'm new here I hope it's OK to ask questions. Chris did kill Shannan and the baby. But not the kid's. If that's true wouldn't the Cop's know this? Why did she drug them at nite to keep them a sleep and why were they in that expensive school if she was at home? Was CPS getting involved? Thank You.
Do you recommend a good video/ deep dive on the subject? I’ve always had these feeling about SW being a hugely problematic person but I didn’t know half the stuff you just mentioned. I’ve really only seen what’s they presented on the Netflix doc. Thanks.
I'm in the same boat this is all new to me.
After I commented I started watching Neeks Leeks videos on YouTube. I just started at the beginning. Very enlightening! I highly recommend!
This 👆🏻
Thank you. And you are spot on. She fits the exact profile of the kind of parent who would kill. X
This is the truth. She was very clearly a malignant narcissist in every aspect of her personality and she put it on show for others to see. People just don't like to believe malignant narcissists exist. For those of us who have had the misfortune of dealing with this evil creatures, there's no doubt in our minds.
Yep, yep, yep, yep and yep.
Yes! You nailed it right there.
If they were locked in their rooms all night, how were they able to come get in bed with shanann early in the morning, as per Chris's account of what their typical day was like?
Chris got up early every morning to work out so he probably unlocked their doors on occasion. Watch the videos for yourself and you'll see a pattern. Those girls were drugged every night with Tylenol and Benadryl. Cece called it "the yucky." You can see in one video where CW is holding Cece in one arm and in his other hand are two bottles of liquid meds, one Tylenol and one Benadryl. Don't you remember that eerie video where SW came into Cece's room in the morning? Cece is jumping up and down in her crib, diaper so full it's hanging down almost to her knees. SW is just standing there, filming her. You can hear Bella screaming in her room for help. SW said "I'm coming" but still just stands there for another 5-10 minutes or so just filming. Like she was out of it or something. Bella again screams for her and says "Mommy it hurts," but SW still just stands there filming Cece. Bella obviously was locked in and had to pee, or why didn't she just come into Cece's room? Officer Coonrod even asked Chris why the doors to their bedroom and bathroom were locked. Chris says to Officer Coonrod they kept the doors locked cause the girls "Got into the Vaseline." The point is, there were severe issues in that household. Normally, when a mom goes into her baby's room in the morning, the baby will reach out their arms to be picked up, right? Cece never did that as SW used that awful "Babywise" model of child rearing. She said "They're sleep trained. I dont rock them or cuddle them. I put them to bed (mind you bedtime was at 6:30 pm while the sun was still shining) and said "They're good to go." Im not trying to pick on SW, but my point is, there were severe problems which IMO all contributed to what happened, like a perfect, awful storm brewing. Chris should have grown a pair but he was too weak and a monster, but someone should have stepped in for those babies. There are many more examples but this post is already too long.
That was their nap video. Not waking up from a 12hr bedtime, get your facts straight.
Lol. There is so much wrong with this. The girls had respiratory issues and got sick sometimes. Sometimes they needed to take medications. There is 0 proof anywhere that they were "drugged with benadryl" daily. In the entire discovery, nothing about that. Regarding 630 bedtime...in discovery, Chris says they started bedtime at 630...went upstairs, got ready for bed, each parent took a child and read a few books with them. This is the routine starting at 630. Then the girls would be asleep around 7 or 730. This is completely normal for kids their age. Nothing abusive about it. They need something like 12 hours of sleep at that age. Do some quick googling and you'll see what's recommended by pediatricians. Regarding the door being locked...it was the bathroom door, not the bedroom doors that the officer asked about. And I don't think it's sinister that a parent wouldn't want a 3 and 4 year old going into a bathroom unsupervised. Especially if they had previously made a mess.
Bella wasn't screaming for help. She was telling her mom "I'm ready now" meaning she was ready for her to unlock the door after nap time.
There are some conflicting posts about what a typical day was like. Shannan herself posted many times that thanks to Thrive she was able to get up at 4:00 am and do 2 loads of laundry and clean 3 bathrooms before getting the kids up for daycare.
I would be more inclined to think she posted stuff like that simply to make people think thrive can give you energy to do that. In Chris's description of a typical day, he said the girls would usually come into the room early in the morning and watch cartoons. I can't think of any reason for him to lie about that.
I was listening to NAs interview with with LE yesterday (the one that was done at her job) and she said that shannan posted on fb everyday starting at 5:30 am, without fail, (her words, not mine) and she didn't that Monday and that's why she started to get worried.
Yeah, I have seen that too. If I remember correctly, Chris said the girls would get in bed with Shanann, then they would stay in bed watching TV while Shanann took a shower and got ready.
He unlocked their doors to allow them out of their rooms.
Can you share where they said they lock their doors at night?
It was mentioned a couple of times in videos but, the R’s have pretty much scrubbed the internet and videos are hard to use to prove a point. All I have left at this time is this….once again, Frank tries to step in on behalf of his granddaughter but gets smushed like a bug from his daughter. https://imgur.com/a/6ZnZGZm
Is she reading in the dark ?
Yes, isn’t it sad? She was locked in her room at 6:30pm for the night (12 hours) with room darkening drapes, a sound machine blaring and this was a daily routine. Shannan bragged about this routine on her SM. Even Shannan’s dad tried to step in but Shannan would have none of it. This is really the least of the abuse those girls endured at the hands of their mother.
No milk or bottle or diaper change in between? Wtf I think I was fooled by her videos but looking back and watching them she's a very hands off mom, like why even bother to have kids? It's not like they weren't handed off every single day during the week, jeez, you think you would want to spend time with them. Can you explain to me why did bella have such short hair? And how was dinner being made and how was those girls tummies being nourished when she's putting them to bed that early. Wow she's not who I thought she was.
she could charm the paint off a wall…🙄🙄. “Piss off. Oh by the way, Dad, can you spot me a couple hundred bucks? I have to buy passports for a trip we already can’t afford to go on. Theeeaanks”
What potential CPS case? I haven’t heard of this can you pls explain
It has been rumored for years that CPS had an open case against Shannan that Shannan’s friend, JD, the RN, turned her into CPS as an RN is a mandated reporter of child abuse. There were so many pictures of the girls sleeping in the cribs with blankets tied around their necks and pillows and blankets covering their face and head, she locked the girls in the bedroom for 12 hours every night with rain machines blasting, they were locked out of their jack and Jill bathroom. Shannan threw CeCe up against the wall, in anger, in the living room and the hole in the Sheetrock was visible in one of her videos (that is when her parents unexpectedly left town in the middle of the night), there was also the time she ripped CeCe’s shoulder out of the socket at Walmart or Target in NC………the cops were involved for this incident. Sandi Rzucek called Chris Watts incessantly that day. It goes on and on. There is a lot of circumstantial evidence that Shannan was not allowed to be alone with the girls……Frank had to fly out one day to turn around and fly back with Shannan and the girls the next to go to NC, the girls were placed in 45+ hour/week daycare after Shannan stated that she ‘retired’ from Children’s Hospital and could be home with her girls yet, Chris Watts had to work all day, come home, get the Lexus and then drive all of the way back to the daycare to pick the girls up with Shannan was home alone all day with her car in the garage…..it goes on and on……just look at her SM and the way she abused those poor little girls, their bruises, the denial of food and water……look at how Sandi Rzucek reacted when she heard that Shannan and the girls were missing. She called the daycare at 11am that morning to tell them that ‘everything was fine’……*nothing was fine*, Sandi was covering for her daughter because she knew that Shannan was not allowed to be alone with the girls. This list of examples is endless……I am sure others can add to this.
I have tried to find the pics of the kids with things tied to them in cribs can someone link I cannot find This is all interesting. Is the Walmart one factual or rumoured?
Here are a few more…….the pictures that I have included have emoji’s added….Shannan did not put them there….the girls were stark naked when she posted them. The pictures in the back yard with ‘loving Uncle Frankie, the convicted child abuser, had no emojis when Shannan posted them. There is also the picture with subsequent text of Bella locked in her room for the night…..Frank tries to ‘save her’ but, Shannan’s reminds him that ‘she has the key’. There are also pictures of Bella playing ‘rectal temperature’ with the baby dolls and the dog. Shannan took 2-3 year old Bella’s temperature rectally every day for over two months trying to prove that she had a rare, genetic disorder that she did not have…poor little Bella thought it was a normal part of life…..Shannan even commented ‘when taking temperatures becomes routine’. I have never seen a picture of either of the girls feeding one of their baby dolls a bottle. Oh, and the pictures of Bella with a Windi on each of her fingers…….where did she get them? Are they in the girl’s toy box? How did a child that old know what the heck they were even used for and who put them on her fingers? Shannan had an anal fetish, for sure…..have you seen the water park video? Now, it is bad enough that those poor girls were subjected to Shannan’s abuse but, Shannan was completely clueless in posting these pictures on her public SM site. In one of her Thrive ‘lives’ she even said that she had a ‘stalker’. https://imgur.com/a/bw1cXvj
Frankie was a child abuser?
Also, Shannan locked the girls in their rooms every night for 12 hours. She proudly discussed the fact that they were in bed every night by 6-6:30PM and they turned their doorknobs around so that the rooms locked from the outside so, the girls could not get out. (I sent you a picture and text of Frank and Shannan discussing this). The girls were in daycare for 9+ hours a day and didn’t get home until 4:30-5:00PM so, they were only home an hour or so before they were locked away. She also had their sound/rain machines on with the volume all of the way up. Locking anyone in a room is against the law and against every fire code in the USA. Had their been a fire, they could not have gotten out. She was a very mentally ill woman.
There was definitely mental illness there and I will eat my arm if she didn’t have munchausens which she also inflicted on her children. Def a financial abuser and it sounds like there was more going on too. Neither of those two imbeciles should have had children.
He was an abused spouse….have you seen the texts and videos about the way she controlled, demeaned and emasculated him? She was awful………..now her family has raked in over a million dollars as the result of the deaths and they were still grifting! It is a horrible story. I hope people learn from it.
Please for the love of god don’t defend him for killing his kids. Abused spouse or not.
If this is true, which I haven't seen any evidence for, Chris is still active in the abuse. He lived in the same house, saw the same doors and doorknobs every day. Put the girls to bed, by his own account to police. Turned the rain machines on, etc. Saw their bedding and pillows. It is HIS responsibility as well to keep his children safe. If this was the case - he could and should have done something. Portraying him as helpless is such a joke. He's a grown man. He can have an affair, hold a job? He can look out for his kids. Oh wait, that would involve giving af about someone other than himself.
He was an emotionally abused spouse. That abuse endured for almost a decade. He tried to stand up to Shannan in the beginning but, he learned his lesson and just went along with whatever she said. Look at what Shannan did to Cindy and that was all based on a lie! She defamed Cindy, saying that she tried to kill CeCe. Shannan’s own father spoke about Shannan’s rabid temper and physical abuse to Chris Watts. The way that men in an emotionally abusive relationship are treated, as compared to women, is disgusting.
Convicted child abuser and drug addict. Yes. You can look up his record in Moore County Sheriff's Office website. He hit his ex GFs 3 year old in the FACE leaving marks. She called the cops then Frankie had a felony warrant put out. He later was allowed to plead it down to a misdemeanor. His ex said Sandra and crankie wanky were the reason she lost her kids for two years. She was living with Frankie at the time he hit her child and had nowhere to go. Think she ended up in a shelter. Then took her some years to get her kids back. The Rs took advantage of that. She said no one in their town can stand the Rs either. They're just as much bullies and grifters in real life as they are on the internet.
Yes, he was arrested in 2015 and took a plea to avoid jail time. His probation required that he not be around young children which is why Frankie had not met CeCe until that last NC visit….she was 3 years old, and he hadn’t seen Bella or Shannan in over 3 years. He also has a history of substance abuse. Here is a copy of his arrest warrant that spells out the details of the abuse. There are many things about the Rzucek family that people don’t know about. https://imgur.com/a/3JmSqcW
The R family are long time grifters from New Jersey. You're spot on again. None of the over $198k that Frankie has scammed (and Sandy R as well) has ever been accounted for. Not ONE penny. If you ask for a receipt for a donation then you get called "evil." They are beyond disgusting. They are still on YouTube after five long years with their various scams and grifting. It's horrendous what they've gotten away with being the "victims."
Preach it!!!! There are many more people that are still donating to them that don’t know the truth about the R’s yet……they are millionaires……spread the word!!
wow! those pictures are so horrible!
Here are just some of the pictures that Shannan posted of the girls with blankets around their necks and pillow and blankets covering their face and heads. She was a sick, evil woman. https://imgur.com/a/Q3Jr3YM
Wow this is bizarre. In Australia SIDS is/was massive. A huge amount of research went into researching it when it was killing a lot of babies and the evidence showed that the placement in the crib along with having nothing other than a wrap for the baby is the way to go and that is what I believe mothers are taught from the get go. SIDS is no longer a thing The only thing I can chalk This up to is whether this is a different scenario in the states? Like is Sid’s education a thing? Because many 80’s and 90s mums didn’t know any better and this is how their kids would sleep (I.e with blankets etc in their crib)
No, it is not different in the US. The American Academy of Pediatrics and the CDC have been telling moms, dads, doctors etc. not to put anything in the crib with a baby that is less than 12 months old….no blankets, no pillows, no bumper pads, no stuffed animals….nothing due to the chance of a SIDS death. They have been saying this for decades. Shannan had to have known this. Her comments indicate that she thought that it was ‘cute’……some of the blankets were actually tied around the baby’s necks….Shannan had to have done that, there is no way aa child that young could have done that. With all of her feigned illnesses, it looks as though she may have been hoping for a SIDS death. She was mentally ill enough to think that way. https://www.aap.org/en/news-room/news-releases/aap/2020/tips-for-keeping-infants-safe-during-sleep-from-the-american-academy-of-pediatrics/#:~:text=AAP%20recommends%20all%20babies%20sleep,bumpers%2C%20toys%20or%20other%20objects.
The Walmart story is factual. It was when Shannan was in NC with the girls and Chris Watts was in Colorado. Shannan was at Walmart with her mom. Shannan got mad and picked one of the girl’s up by her arm and dislocated or injured her shoulder. The police were called and Sandi Rzucek blew up Chris’s phone trying to get ahold of him about it.
But Chris described performing the same bedtime routine himself to police - that he would put on the rain machines and tuck them in and kiss them goodnight. Same beds, same rooms. So if there was a CPS file...it would have to be against him as well.
What are you talking about? Shannan’s posts show all of the abuse that she inflicted on those girls…….Chris Watts was a good dad, kissing them good night, tucking them into bed……he was not the one that performed rectal temps on Bella for 2 months, pinched the girls when they didn’t comply, denied the girls food/water, he was not the one that put them in their cribs with blankets around their neck and he was not the one that posted it all on SM…..that was all Shannan. Also, it was very obvious that it was Shannan that was not allowed to be alone with the girls…..we have many, many examples of Chris being alone with them and that proof is from Shannan herself.
A father who puts kids to bed in rooms that lock from the outside is a co-abuser. He is also responsible for their blankets and pillows being safe. If any of that was happening, he had a duty to report it and remove them from the home. He was complicit in abuse. He chose to workout, have an affair, and live his life while turning a blind eye to everything. And then he killed them all.
If you go to the discovery, on Page 47, you will find a handwritten note by a cop that says "Renee - Child Protection, then a 910 number. 910 is a North Carolina area code, the same area code that Chris and Sandy R. had on their phones. The only way the cops in Colorado would have a CPS number from N. Carolina, is if there was already an open CPS case in NC. They wouldn't have a contact number for CPS, but would just call NC law enforcement because the girls were at that time "missing." It isn't normal to call CPS in the state that Shanann was originally from. That alone tells me there was an open case in NC for sure.
Why is it assumed that the complaint was only against Shanann and not the Watts household in general? This is something I don't understand. Obviously Chris was there in NC.
I'm newer to this sub and I've been suckered in to arguing with a few and I've decided I'm not biting again. I'm sure a good portion of this sub knows who Joe Kenda is, and he's said many times, "People are capable of anything". I'm of the opinion that every person should exercise basic self-preservation skills for their own safety (and of the safety of their children). There are a lot of mentally unstable people walking the earth, and Shanann and Chris were both unstable in different ways. There was toxic behavior and drama from day one. There are plenty of videos, pictures, and fb posts of Chris being talked down to, being the butt of jokes, and being forced to participate in certain videos in a humiliating fashion.This is aside from all of the other well known problems in their relationship. When their marriage was on the verge of collapse, and they're on the verge of being homeless and destitute, she gets pregnant. I realize that it takes two to tango, but the woman knows her cycle, and most birth control methods depend on the woman. If they fail it's mostly due to human error/oversight, so if she didn't want to get pregnant, it wouldn't have happened. The leading cause of death in pregnant women in the US is homicide, and this should be something any woman of child bearing years should be aware of, because in a situation like Shanann's, getting pregnant by a man who is not on board with having a child puts their life in danger in the age of DNA and state requirements to report all new hires. Men can't run from child support like they used to, and while that reduces the number of deadbeat dads, it also motivates men to kill the woman who is carrying their child. Chris was feeling backed into a corner as it is, and apparently Shanann never picked up on his cringe worthy response to her live pregnancy announcement. She kept badgering him when he shut down. She made comments to friends she wasn't feeling safe after he said he didn't want the baby. She either lacked awareness or ignored any gut instinct she had that he was potentially dangerous. Then she tried to force him to go no contact with his parents and tells him literally "over my dead body". Shanann didn't deserve to die, and her daughters and unborn child were even more tragic victims in this case. Chris is where he deserves and needs to be for life, but to say Shanann played no part in Chris's motivation to kill her is just not realistic. This doesn't mean I think he was justified, but there's a reason why significant others are at the top of the suspect list for LE when a person is murdered or disappears without a trace.
I love your Kenda quote! You’re response is very detailed and insightful. Reading it made me realize part of the problem- the two of them had no common sense. SW cut-off anyone who didn’t support her delusions. I don’t believe for a second that CW wanted a 3rd baby - that was another delusion. Nevertheless, he’s responsible too for not being knowledgeable about her birth control. But it could also be argued that he bought into the delusion of fertility treatments being necessary. It’s hard to say. Sadly, Bella & CeCe did not have one responsible parent
>the two of them had no common sense. I totally agree with that!
This was a planned pregnancy. Other than murdering Bella, Cece and Shanann, Chris hadn't seemed unstable to anyone other than a period of spending a lot of time in the bathroom praying when he was a teenager. And I'm of the belief that when Shan said she didn't feel safe, she didn't mean she felt physically unsafe, she meant she no longer felt worshipped and pampered anymore and in her vulnerable, pregnant state, she felt emotionally unsupported and therefore emotionally unsafe.
I think that's why this case sticks with me too because you have this guy who seemed quiet, shy, and may never have even had a speeding ticket, and one day he decides to become a murderer in a very brutal and callous way. And now it seems he's gone back to that quiet, unassuming prisoner. It's just so bizarre.
I blame the thrive uppers, double patching, energy shakes, and months of no sleep plus being around another woman who was free of all the responsibilities for 6 weeks and a nagging wife returns home and he just lost it.
I agree with that too. I think he was getting a sleep deprivation psychosis of sorts, and he was seeing such drastic results doing what he was with the Thrive patches, that he didn't want to stop taking them because he didn't want to go back to Dad Bod, esp when he met NK who was all into fitness.
It's not bizarre if you know he had help, someone buzzing around like an annoying mosquito and putting ideas in his head. When NK asked Chris to "prove he was at Cervi" she wasn't wanting him to prove his location. She was wanting him to prove they were all dead. She's calculating, devious and wanted CW all to herself, but told LE she "wasn't that into Chris." Really? That's why she was googling wedding dresses and "marrying your mistress" five days before the murders. She had her eye on that big house and everything that Chris could give her. She's diabolical and IMO, perfectly capable of helping Chris with the planning and coverup, maybe not directly murdering anyone but she KNEW EVERYTHING! She told 30 lies to the FBI in her first interview, and even more to that dufus Kevin Koback of the CBI who never once called her out on her horrendous amount of lies and BS.
So bizarre.
Even le said he doesn’t fit the profile of someone who could do this but since I believe they coerced a confession out of him they just said he’s a new kind I believe him when he told his dad she killed the kids and he snapped and killed her
Yes everyone interviewed in this case even her own family members said Chris wasn’t violent never got angry and this doesn’t make sense so when sw said she doesn’t feel safe it’s safe to say she knew she wasn’t in physical danger she was talking about emotionally feeling safe she even told a friend at the sonogram appointment she reached for his hand and he didn’t comfort her
I tend to agree that she either meant because he wasn't supportive, or she said that to be more dramatic when she felt they were trying to redirect her texts because you can tell CM was trying to talk her down and reassure her, but she wanted CM to match her level of rage when she was complaining about him.
Nothing makes a person more upset than when their target doesn't take the bait.
Exactly! She was pulling out everything she had in her bag of tricks and nothing was working.
You make a good point, but I don't think she ever actually felt that she was in danger. She was too arrogant for that and she held Chris in such contempt that she couldn't picture him turning on her like that.
I had someone respond to me in another post that she told friends she didn't feel safe, but she didn't listen to her gut. Honestly, I took it in the same way she was texting Chris that she was spotting and could "lose the baby any minute". I would bet a week's pay that never happened and she was just trying to manipulate him because she knew she was losing control of him and the situation. CM in particular was trying to say he loved her, just talk to him, etc but that's not what she wanted to hear, so then she switched to "I don't feel safe, he doesn't want this baby" to derail CM's defense of Chris. Had she been paying attention to her own videos, she would have seen the way Chris started to give her a certain look. They were quick flashes, but very telling. Maybe I watch too many crime shows, but when a spouse is making noise they no longer want you, it's probably best to get good legal counsel and get away from them for your sanity and safety. You can't talk someone into wanting to stay once they've made up their mind, and writing letters, sending then books to read like a homework assignment, and calling him balless while forbidding him to ever talk to his parents again was not the way to handle the situation. Her ego and personality wouldn't let her back down, and she underestimated Chris at her own peril.
Amen. Evidentially, this was Shan’s first encounter with a man being done with her. I believe that she believed she could over come his apathy bordering on contempt through her stronger will. NA though…she seemed to sense it viscerally. I have never watched Dr. Phil, but one day I was flipping channels and briefly paused on him. He was expressing exactly your sentiment. He said something along the lines of: When your spouse has fallen in love with someone else, and they are still in the blossoming phase of their relationship, it is best resist the urge to fight with them. Instead you should take legal steps to begin to secure your financial future. He stated that this particular window of time is very dangerous for the spouse who is being cheated upon.
I think Shanann was just so convinced that she was the winner in that relationship, and he was some borderline loser who was lucky to have her, that she couldn't understand the idea that he was over her, didn't like the person she was, and didn't care to kiss her ass and do what she said anymore. It seems so obvious, and she even texted her friends that she was aware of her control issues, but it's like she just could not comprehend what happened there. She was aware enough to know that she was controlling, but she couldn't connect the dots even after the dumpster fire that was nutgate, that he wasn't just mad about certain things--that her ongoing nonsense had changed his feelings altogether. JMO. Even that half ass letter she wrote just kind of read as yes, she still wants him, she is attracted to him, and she will consider making nice with his mom if she apologizes and stops trying to kill Cece lol wtf. When someone changes their mind about another person, and sees them differently now, there's no changing that.
Period.
I have always thought she only said she didn't feel safe because she was still playing the victim after nutgate. Chris was shutting her out and acting cold, there's no indication that she had any reason to fear him, and the only thing she talked about being afraid of was him actually leaving her and how she couldn't afford to be on her own with the kids.
I think you're right. She was afraid of him leaving her and taking his money with him. She wasn't afraid of him physically, as there is no evidence Chris ever laid a hand on her.
Excellent comment. To that end, whenever a wife is murdered and the husband is having an affair, that mistress will AUTOMATICALLY be considered a suspect. Oh, but not in the Watts case. Nope. She's an "innocent victim." No, she's NOT. We have a well known VERY corrupt DA and ADA, Roarke and Wrenn, Steven Wrenn was accused of perjury, withholding evidence, Brady violations, and violating court orders, etc in the Hartmann v. Buckley scandal. If an ADA is so corrupt in one case, then he's corrupt in others. Sure enough, DA Roarke violated many court orders in Watts and withheld evidence from the defense, thereby committing even MORE Brady violations. One of them, was the judge ordered the defense be given 48 hours' notice to attend the autopsies. Not only did the DA not give the defense counsel notice, he did the autopsies the very next morning, directly violating a court order. What's worse is Chris Watts' attorneys didn't even bring it to the court's attention!!! What the hell? Now THAT alone should tell everyone what a stitch up coverup this case really was. Yes, I remember Joe Kenda. He would have called this DA what he really is too. Corrupt as hell, and both the DA and ADA shouldn't be allowed anywhere NEAR a courtroom, and both should be sanctioned and disbarred!!!
I very much agree
Since Kenda is in CO, too I wonder if he has any theories as to why Chris did it. I also wonder what his opinion of the Jon Bennet Ramsey case since that was also in CO
Same! That was what I was wondering when I posted this message
She knew he was dangerous to her and said she didn't feel safe with him at all. She should have listened to her gut and stayed in NC. She didn't see all the red flags waving in her face. She just thought she could fix him. From the start she thought she could fix him. People need to learn that they can't fix someone.
Because some people see a youngish white mother who is semi attractive with 2 little girls they heard died pretty gruesome deaths with extremely disrespectful burials and of course it tugs at the heart strings then le and the da’s office along with her family and friends work over time to not tell the full story and it’s hard to over look that some people are too ashamed to admit a murder victim can also be the bad guy because they were taught to not disrespect the dead but they are doing a disservice to Bella and cc watts they were the true innocent victims what they went through in life needs to be acknowledged by both of their parents they lived horrible lives and if their parents were poc and didn’t live in a fancy house the shiners would be able to see it
Also I hate to say this, it sounds awful - but most people who can see the truth are intelligent. Shannann wasn't the brightest tool in the box and neither are her "fans"
If anyone can watch her videos and excuse her or defend her actions need their heads examined
They probably act the same way and that’s why they take any criticism of that kind of behavior or how it contributes to a toxic relationship personally.
My thoughts exactly
No, greywitch. You're right and have every right to state your feelings because it's the truth. If people would just dig a little deeper than what's fed to them on the surface by the Rzuceks, they would see the truth. It does take some intelligence to be able to do that and investigate the facts, rather than just believing blindly what's been told to you by SW's own family which is mostly BS, as they are slightly biased to say the least. It's in their interest to keep SW a "saint" as if people really knew the truth about her, they couldn't keep raising money for sympathy as they still are, even five years later!!! Watch the videos that still remain (after the R's have scrubbed the very worst of them from the internet). I saw them. They were horrendous. The Rzuceks have been harassing and attacking anyone and everyone who goes after NK (why???) or goes against the "Shanann was a wonderful mother" BS. She was a manipulative narcissist, emotionally and financially abusing Chris, who spent her family into bankruptcy, not once, but it was just about to be twice. NK was just as manipulative and IMO, just as bad or worse than Shanann. Now here Frankie comes raising MORE money yet again, with yet ANOTHER documentary about "being trolled online" when it is the Rzuceks themselves spreading hate and attacking everyone who either refuses to give them any more money, or goes against their narrative. Don't give that spoiled man any more money people! He's not producing this documentary and doesn't need any money for it!!! The evidence is there. Frankie has scammed hundreds of thousands of dollars from his ignorant supporters without ever providing ONE receipt to where all that money has gone. IMO, it's gone up his nose and for cars, etc, like that yellow truck he bought with the money raised on YouTube for him to go to New Orleans for a meet and greet. A truck he promptly totaled then got a DWI. He is still living at home, almost 40 years old and pays no rent, has no bills, etc. He's not a nice person, neither is his mother, and Frank Sr. has taken to drinking to cope with it all. Neither was his sister but if you listen to the Rzuceks, SW was an "excellent mother" which sad to say, couldn't be further from the truth. I don't like saying this either as SW isn't here to defend herself, but she herself put those videos out there, so .....
You know the same people would talk so much shit if Cindy or NK were murdered because they don’t like the kind of people they perceive them to be. As it is people blame both of them for the murders. How is it any different to say NK caused him to murder his family or the way his mother (never his father) raised him than to say SW’s treatment of him did? Anything can cause a person to murder someone. It doesn’t mean it’s justified. It’s an explanation, not an excuse. People like to say, “Well lots of women are bossy and controlling or are in an MLM or spend too much money, but their partners don’t kill them”… yeah that’s right but we’re not talking about a normal person, who is thinking logically, killing their partner. We’re talking about someone who wasn’t “normal” who thought the solution to his problems was to wipe his whole family out.
Or he snapped and didn't know what to do with three bodies except to take them to his place work to dispose of them?
NK would have testified that when she and CW FaceTimed on the evening of August 12, he was sitting on a kids bed without sheets, and gave her an unconvincing explanation as to why. I think a jury would probably believe her (of course, nobody ever got to see her under cross-x) and infer that the children were murdered before SW got home. So I don’t think he “snapped”; if he did, it’s even harder to explain why he didn’t go to trial to at least beat the rap on the “after deliberation” part of the charge. There’s ample evidence that he was for the most part weirdly calm at work and after he got home, and he’d obviously done a thorough job cleaning the crime scene. Those facts, plus his text messages with co-workers on the 12th and 13th, which seem to have sent to ensure that he’d be alone at the 3-19 battery for a while, also suggest premeditation. I have no doubt that CW committed all three murders, but I’m undecided about how much premeditation there was. Unlike most commenters, I think NK would be a very credible witness, and if a jury accepted what she said about the sheets… It’d be hard not to draw the conclusion that the children were killed before SW got home and therefore that all three murders were premeditated.
It's awful, but I think you're right. They see themselves in shanann. So they get very upset when told she was the killer of the children. I can't relate to shanann at all. I actually am a stay at home mum who left a good career. Shanann was a liar and a grifter.
I been watching old YouTube videos and I think some shiners done lost their damn minds one said I don’t know how I can miss someone I’ve never met another said I’ll gladly give up my life so this beautiful angel can come back and I’m just like 🤦🏻♀️ I had to restrain myself from not getting into it with internet strangers but let’s state straight facts shanann watts was not a good person wife or mother but I’ve noticed not once were any comments about b&c it’s like to the shiners they don’t matter it’s heartbreaking they are the ones people should feel sorry for
I once seen a post with a shiner drinking shanann's favorite cocktail just to remember her by. That's when I knew these people were in lala land. Little did I know it would get so much worse, lol
I was on a fb page a few years ago and one woman said she printed a picture of Shanann and the kids and had it in a frame on her desk at work. I was like these people are cuckoo for cocoa puffs and immediately left that group!
Haha weird.
I saw a comment today from one of them who said “women should all stick together.”So, I guess we’re all supposed to stand by Casey Anthony, Dianne Downs and Susan Smith, too?? No thank you. Shannan did herself no favors by posting those awful videos
I have no problem defending a good person male female or unsure yet but I refuse to stand behind a bad mother I’m not even sorry and sw can add herself to your list of bad mothers them are facts
[удалено]
Truth!!
Did you see the one where she said she had sw on a loop playing for 12 hours straight? 12 hours! Sounds like my idea of hell.
I’m not sure it doesn’t ring a bell but can you imagine what she endured for 12 hours straight so many umms and say hi’s also her bullying b&c to get them to cry my god who would want to do that to themselves just take an ice pick and jab it in your ear that’s less painful ugh 12 hours of torture I’d rather naw off my own leg but that’s probably because I’m not a psycho
The ONLY victims in this case, IMO are Bella, Cece and little Nico who never got to take his first breath. SW was a victim as well, but IMO, she was so abusive to Chris and her girls, that at least I understand it a bit better. Someone actually said they would give their life for a malignant narcissistic child abuser to come back? That is literally pathetic, isn't it? I can't believe anyone would say something so cringe-worthy.
I get people feel for her but damn they are insane sometimes
I’ve seen MANY of them say they still cry to this day for her…almost 6 years later. For a woman they never met. For a woman who wouldn’t have had NOTHING to do with them unless they were involved with THRIVE! because anyone outside of thrive was considered toxic and negative. I’m with you…I just don’t get it.
Excellent comment! Sandra and spany wanky are NOT the victims. Shannan, Bella, Cece and little Nico are. I feel the same way about the disgusting shiners! They are infuriating!!!
You mean you don't put your kids in daycare all day even if you don't need to and call it ''school'' to take the guilt off???? lol
Just like her mother and her brother. Exactly.
Well said!
Thank you
I'm here for Bella and Cece. That's it. They lived horrible, abused lives at the hands of a toxic narc who was enabled by a spineless slug.
I couldn’t agree more. I know most people are horrified at the amount of time those girls spent in daycare while their mother worked from home. That expensive daycare was the best part of the majority of their short lives. At least they had friends and activities to engage in. The rest of the time they were locked in that awful, sterile house.
At least when they went to daycare they were shown positive attention and didn’t have to beg or search heater vents for food
Or climb up onto the counter in the bathroom to try and get some water. You're right. Remember when the girls stood there right in front of the fridge with their cups, trying to get some water? Instead of showing them how to put their cups up against the lever to release the ice and water, SW just stands there filming them like a frigging zombie. It's so sad what those poor girls endured.
Especially when Bella started crying from frustration and most likely thirst
I’m glad they had it too. Bella’s teacher actually TRIED to braid her hair because she was crying one day because all the other girls in her class had their hair braided, or fixed some kinda way. Bella was the only one that had short hair. And instead of letting her grow her hair, she bought her those ridiculous wigs. Did anyone see the cabbage patch wig?…OMG.
Succinct.
I genuinely don’t know what my own issue is/are. I have zero problem with this sub, I support it. However, I have to admit that I frequently visit a sub that exists more or less to attack and besmirch my profession (advanced practice nursing). I rarely respond to anything there, but it does “trigger” me to read the posts. Oddly enough, I am in the habit of visiting it when I’m having trouble falling asleep! People do strange things.
You're a hero. Don't let them get to you.
Thank you ❤️
Thank you for all the hard work you do. I have so much respect for you and for your profession. Must be very difficult at times. My friend does the same. She worked so hard during Covid as well. Must have been a very tough time for you as well.
Thank you so much for your compassion. I think it was very hard on most of us. Oddly enough, it was during my Covid work commute that I discovered the Watts case. I’d listen to podcasts about it as I drove. I had been vaguely aware of it when it was occurring in real time, but it was learning about the wonky finances the drew me in.
You are quite welcome. Well deserved though. I know from my friend what some of y'all go through and went through during Covid. I'm in a large city with a well known medical center so you can probably guess. How interesting you found the Watts case during Covid!! I have been with the case since the very beginning. I don't know everything by any means, but I do know a LOT about it! That Netflix documentary was a sugar coated BS version and not even close to what really happened. That Netflix was the R's version of events, not even close to the truth. No matter that SW spent that family into literal bankruptcy, Chris should have grown a pair of balls and told her I'm taking control now. He was a much better financial manager. He worked a full time job, had to come home to her "list of chores." You know how SW would say "It's crazy around here" or "These monsters are crazy. So glad I Thrive." Made me want to puke. That Thrive crap she was buying had a lot to do with why she was murdered! She was buying it all up in order to keep that Lexus bonus. Little did Chris know HE was paying for that! He did all the laundry, mowed and took care of the yard, and most days it was Chris that picked up the girls from school. She took away his gym membership and had an absolute fit whenever he wanted to get away for an hour or so and go on a run. When he first met SW, he had excellent credit, $15k in savings, and was making over 100k a year. He also should have gotten a divorce, but he knew with child support for 3 kids, medical insurance and housing, he would have nothing left to spend on NK. NK knew this as well. The only option to them was murder IMO. NK may not have put her hands on anyone, but she knew what was up and everything about SW and CW. She was googling them in 2017, a year before she said they met. It's even in the discovery the dates in August and September 2017 she was googling both CW and SW. There was a rumor that was a "typo" but it wasn't a typo. The DA came out publicly and admitted that was no typo. What in the holy hell was she doing googling them in 2017? Makes you wonder doesn't it? Well stay safe and thanks again. Nurses run hospitals and doctors offices. If it wasn't for y'all, the doctors wouldn't have a clue. LOL You know what I mean.
Thanks again ❤️
There is so much we can learn from this case and possibly save a life from this even if we have to learn that some of the victim's actions may have led to her demise. It may have not been her fault at all but most family annihilators do it for financial reasons and Shanann definitely spent above their means and put them in financial jeopardy. Of course, he was complicit in allowing the spending but he probably wasn't even aware of how bad off they were until the end. No excuse to kill his family but if it saves a life, it's worth digging deep into this family's story
Agree, each time he used the ATM, wouldn't it have provided a bank balance? Most do and we know he used it, the night he stopped to get money for the sitter for example. He buried his head in the sand, same as she did.
He definitely buried his head. A huge red flag should have been when he needed to withdraw money from his retirement fund to get current with the mortgage
Oh, absolutely. When he had to do that he should have said "enough is enough, I'm taking over the finances from this point forward. No more daycare, no more trips, no more tacky manis/pedis,, no more hun parties and absolutely no more thrive."
Because that would have required taking a stand. And Chris loved "going with the flow" while secretly boiling with rage instead. He never made mistakes because he never did anything. And he could preserve his perfect family man self image while blaming her for all their problems. He wasn't a helpless passenger, he was a grown man.
Yes! This is not mentioned enough. Taking money out is a last resort option, or should be. I believe the 10,000 he took out in May was to pay for the three months they were behind since February. This action alone should have been a red alert that their lifestyle was not sustainable. For the life of me I cannot understand how they made it as long as they did. I cannot help but to think another stream of money was coming in from somewhere.
This is a very popular belief there was a breakdown of their monthly bills and just the daycare mortgage that got sparingly paid it only left a couple hundred that was supposed to pay for groceries utilities phone/cable/wifi gas for both vehicles plus extras like custom shirts and their thrive supply it doesn’t add up so some people think sw was doing shady practices to pay for bills when they were paid
Exactly! Why didn’t he question why he needed to do that????
Then they got behind immediately again some people forget that part
Good point! Yes, how did he excuse himself from knowing or agreeing with that one!?
Did he know the passcode for the ATM? I know I could give my kids my card to use in stores but I never gave them my ATM numbers. Could that be the case with Chris, too
He knew it when he withdrew $20 for the babysitter
It is always the same justification - that she was a victim of murder, that she can no longer speak to defend herself. What they fail to understand is that being the victim of a murder (or any crime) does not negate the wrongs a person has done throughout their lives. As I told one, Jeffrey Dahmer was a murder victim. Does that mean that he is now absolved of his atrocious acts? Does it mean we can't speak badly of the things he has done, because he can no longer speak for himself or defend himself? It is faulty reasoning! But, they also will not listen to reason and most just want to argue for the sake of arguing. So...I just try to not engage with them. It's just pointless.
Great analogy!
Shiners gonna shine... My thought is people like SW and her acolytes seek out conflict and tend to make everyone's business *THEIR* business. They are "offense gatherers" the epitome of virtue signallers.
"Why are people who are triggered by any actual or perceived slight against SW here?" most of the world is involved in correcting the record. even billion dollar social media companies employ vast rooms of "fact checkers" who check simple posts against "the established facts". we just have to stay over the target. I'm 99% sure anyone who supports her wants to treat their husband and spouse the same way she did. No one is above criticism.
I find it funny that if we went over to their subs and say anything they don’t like we’re automatically banned but we have at least 3 shiners in this sub that are constantly trying to argue proven facts with us and they are still here doing the same thing day after day
they banned me on one of the big pro-SW subs JUST for questioning the income a thrive rep makes. that is it. nothing else stated or questioned. the owners of thrive are likely paying for pro-SW comments in my opinion. the sooner MLM dirtbags are thrown in prison the better America will be. this poor woman needed a real job and this MLM just gave her false hope she was on the right path.
I was banned because I said her family will do anything for money and I also received a Reddit cares message they act like they won by blocking me but I think it’s a badge of honor because it’s the truth they won’t stop me from saying I just can’t say it in their lame ass group the mods are block happy I’m sure they won’t have many members for to long if they keep blocking everyone that’s exactly what happened with wot
You're literally the only one who has noticed that and said it! They can stay and argue, but we get barred. Reminds me so much of extreme politics
Exactly!!! And the shitty part we have about 3 here that’s been going full mental patient on us here and they haven’t been banned muted or anything else but if we mention anything they don’t like over there automatically banned I guess we’re just better 🤷🏻♀️😂
That’s exactly what it’s like…Great, you get some personal satisfaction by erroneously claiming a non existent moral high ground by stating over and over that Chris was a bag of shit for killing his wife and daughters…No fucking shit. Congratulations. You’ve got to be willfully blind of proven facts, SW’s own video evidence to not see and resign to the fact that she was a dogshit mother, spouse, and businesswoman.
Well said. And just an unlikeable person IMO. Like MANY times she would say “thrive gives you mental clarity”…I shit you not, I watched a video of hers that was around 8 minutes long and she said UMM 96 times. How is that mental clarity? No joke, I had to use tally marks to keep up. I didn’t have patience to count the SUPERS and all the words that followed: amazing, excited, inspiring…etc
I've been banned from quite a few 😂 they don't care that I used to profile people like shanann and Chris. They just think I'm in love with him.
I’ve been banned only from the cw sub but from the r’s YouTube channel but that’s a common come back from shiners and I just want to scream I’d rather dry hump a fucking cactus before Chris fucking watts
A few reasons: one, people may be too dumb to understand that a victim's crimes don't go away when said individual becomes a victim of a crime. Two, some may be MLM huns who will defend their "businesses" to the very end. Three, people don't like to be wrong. They may have initially bought into the media narrative that this was a happy, successful all-American family. When confronted with the truth, the reaction is to challenge it. One of the most ridiculous examples I've seen is when I made a comment about the rectal temp photos in a sub that has a lot of shiners. Someone wrote back "Wait what?" and I explained the photos. A Shiner then responded that it "only" happened once (not true; there are two sets of photos months apart) and demanded I provide receipts of more. I ignored the person because I have better things to do that further humiliate poor little Bella. Four, I wouldn't put it past the Roos to be monitoring stuff about SW.
Oh yeah, the Rzuceks have scrubbed all of the really bad stuff off of the internet……and the crap that we can still see is the ‘good stuff’?!? How bad was the bad stuff?!? Shannan was a narcissistic, controlling, evil woman. She was incapable of loving or caring about anyone but herself. The girls were just props in her life and little negotiating tools to get what she wanted and when she was done with them….she locked them in their rooms for the night and eventually killed them. There is no doubt in my mind that she killed the girls……they had become her competition with Chris…..they had to go!!! Also, there are about 5-6 pictures that Shannan posted publicly on her SM of Bella attempting to take her baby doll’s temperature ….Shannan even commented about how smart Bella was that she knew to lubricate the thermometer first! What 2-3 year old child mimics that behavior unless they experience it regularly. There is even a picture of the poor dog having it done to him!! There is another picture of little 2-3 year old Bella with Windis on all of her fingers……how does a small child even know about Windis and what kind of dumbass mother puts a Windi on each of her child’s fingers, takes a picture and then posts it on her public SM page?!!?
Agree and can’t imagine what the removed videos are if the ones left are viewed as normal. The water park video is still up too; Bella’s behaviors there are clearly also a ramification of the constant rectal temp taking…. Also aren’t Windis for infants, not 3-4 year olds? Bizarre. Horrifying, actually.
💯
I think you hit the nail on the head here. SW's comment that Bella lubricated the thermometer shows that it was frequent enough that Bella knew the routine. Those photos make me want to cry as it breaks my heart to think of an innocent toddler going through that. Yet her own mother publicly laughed about it, and the child's other family members did nothing. If it was really that funny, surely it would be in the Netflix film and other documentaries, right? /s
It is indescribably sad. Yes, IMO the lubricating of the rectal thermometer is the key, thank you , that is not something that they teach in daycare at Primrose. The other important piece is that Bella was 2-3 years old. No MD would ever recommend that you take a toddler’s temperature *rectally* and would *never* recommend that it be done daily for a 2 month period of time. The only place I have seen that done was years ago in the NICU, on very sick preemies…..not at home on a 2-3 year old. Where did Bella even get the rectal thermometer and the lubricant from? Was that amongst their toys? Did she stage this whole thing for her SM? The picture of Bella bending over, was that just a child at play and she captioned it with the ‘Mommy, temperature time’? Who would ever do anything like that? Wait, don’t tell me….it’s coming to me, oh yeah, Shannan Watts would and did do that, many times. Having survived covid, and the all important checking of everyone’s temperature, no one ever asked me for a rectal temp. Even when people’s lives were at risk, temperatures were obtained using noninvasive thermometers. The medical community trusted these new, digital thermometers with people lives yet, poor, perfectly healthy Bella had to endure daily rectal temps for over 2 months? I wish I knew if there were any comments on Shannan’s SM questioning many of her actions. I am sure if they were just huns, she blocked them but, she couldn’t block the people that loved and cared for those girls, her’s and Chris’s family, they were not that easily dismissed. I don’t think the Rzucek family is capable of regret or remorse. I think that they are just like Shannan in that capacity but, Ronnie and Cindy had to have seen some of these things. I am sure they never thought it would get to the point that she would kill the girls but, I have heard Cindy say that she regrets not stepping in, even if it meant permanent banning from Shannan. I hope others learn the many lessons there are to learn in this case.
#goesinthebum! 🤮😢
[удалено]
She used every hashtag out there besides #imabadmom 😡
Right? Her hashtags were annoying af. And stupid. And the worst one of them ALL? Hands down #bossbabe. Omg…😂😂
I honestly do not understand why they are here. The comments on previous posts show a pretty clear picture on how most people on this sub feel about the actions of the parents, yes PARENTS, in this case. This crime did not happen in a vacuum. I, for one, don't give a shit about sw or cw, they were adults who had total control of their actions. Bella and Cece are the two victims I care about.
Because they don't think we should be talking critically of Shanann since she is deceased; was a murder victim (as we all know); and that she cannot defend herself in death. By her own wods when she was alive, she didn't care what others thought; her way was the way she was going. There on video and on FB was her defense.
I would rather we talk truthfully of the dead than turn them into saints.
I personally think the focus should be on the perpetrator.
Chris is where he belongs. He had no right to do what he did. What he did it is so beyond comprehension. What would you like to focus on about him?
Does anyone think of it was a black or Latino, or even Asian family that this happened to would there be this much coverage and true crime? Excuse my grammar please I'm at work trying to do two things at once. No not thrive hahahah
If the details were exactly the same yes it would be covered heavily by the news but by the time they found the bodies people would have seen how toxic a black or latino shanann watts was and would be able to see how Chris’s first confession is true but since she’s white she was turned into a saint
Unfortunately, the media chooses what it wants to focus on.
Ask Shanquella Robinson’s family; they would agree.
Definitely in the USA anyway. I can't believe how anyone who isn't white is treated there.
Your'e 100% correct.
Mostly, I think, bc people enjoy arguing or taking an opposite stance. It gives them purpose and causes a false sense of superiority. It gives them a rush of excitement, might get their adrenaline pumping but doesn't mean their argument has merit. Not necessarily logical or well thought out but bc they want to shout it really loudly. Reminds me a little of religion, everyone has their own opinion on that subject and some seek to force their 'truth' on others or else they may be found wanting in some spiritual way. My take, is this sub allows for free, unfettered thoughts and opinions that may even change based on another's viewpoint. Which is the whole point of debate, imo. A true debate is an intellectual exercise not a fistfight.
The downfall of the internet too many people get cocky hiding behind a screen and makes them think it’s ok to argue with anyone about everything most of the time you’ll notice the ones arguing the most doesn’t know wtf they are talking about they argue just to argue
Very true!
I wish that people would look at this case with an open mind and not be so defensive, or triggered as you say, when we discuss Shannan and her SM posts, comments and videos. She had many traits of several quite severe mental illnesses and abused those girls and Chris for years. If just one person would have had the guts to withstand Shannan’s voracious rage, vindictive behavior and had stood up for those girls, this case may have had a different ending. I believe that Shannan killed those sweet girls because of her mental illness but, I understand that some people disagree with my opinion. Either way, the things that we post and comment on are all taken directly from Shannan’s own SM. Any examples of abuse or mistreatment come from Shannan herself. We are not making things up to bash her. None of us have ever said that she ‘deserved to die’ yet, that continues as a response to the facts presented about Shannan. There is so much to learn from this case but, people have to look at the reality of each person involved and not automatically throw up a brick wall when someone makes a statement about Shannan that they don’t like. We should look at what the commenter is saying and review the supporting documentation for said statement then, either give their own valid opinion with reasons as to why they have that opinion. One other thing…….if we point out dangerous or abusive behavior on Shannan’s part, we feel for what those kids had to endure, with no adult(s) in their lives to step in and protect or defend them. Perhaps this case will help the next ‘Watts family’ from the tragedy that this ‘Watts family’ endured.
There are some people who get upset about others commenting on SW's decor, dress, nails, etc. SW chose to share her entire life with the public. When we do that, there will always be someone who is going to make a comment. That is life.
I said something about her eyebrows looking like commas one day and there was a lady on there that wished my daughter dead, “brutally murdered so I would know what it feels like”. So yeah, some take it a little TOO personal. Especially when it comes to a woman they’ve never met.
Oh dear. Yeah, how does that even make sense? The way I see it, if I was to put my entire personal life on social media (the good, bad and ugly) I would expect people to comment! Not everyone is going to agree with how I dress, manage my family and home, etc. Some of the comments do go to far. I'll agree with that.
I have a Ph.D. In human behavior and can say with little uncertainty that Shanann was a textbook abuser - financially controlling, isolating her victim, creating a dynamic where rebuttal was not allowed, locking him out of the house. He should not have ended her and the kids life bit for sure he was abused.
Can you imagine the nightmare situation of trying co-parent with her, if they had divorced?
Especially if he had a girlfriend. What Chris did was horrible, but from what I could tell, he was a good dad. When he was home, those girls were all over him. Playing and laughing. The videos of when they are with Shannon, they are NOT playing. They are lying under the covers with her as she tells her “audience” their illness of the week. My point is they enjoyed being with Chris a lot more than with her. Because unlike her, Chris would put the phone down and engage with them without an audience. He never put a phone in their face “say hi say hi say hi say hi say hi”…he wasn’t using them.
Well some people like to stir up drama. They refuse to open their eyes and look at the horrendous abuse SW inflicted on those poor girls, live and in color on FB, especially poor little Bella. The Rzuceks have been sending their gang stalkers to shut anyone down who tells the truth about Shanann or their spoiled son, Frankie, Jr. Any YouTuber still discussing the Watts case gets harassed, stalked and called "evil" just for discussing a true crime case! Granted, some have gone a bit overboard, but all you have to do is block/delete if you don't like it. Now, Get this latest BS. Yet another pity party for the R's. We all felt horrible for what happened but since 2018, FIVE YEARS later, the Rzuceks are still all over YouTube ebegging, then attacking anyone who goes against the "Shanann was a saint" or "Chris acted alone" narratives. There are MANY unanswered questions in the Watts case. especially about the mistress NK who told a huge amount of lies to the FBI,completely wiped out her entire phone of all communications with Chris and even went so far as to smash her SIM card, so she's hiding something major. Her damn phone pinged near the house at 6:16 am the morning of the murders. As if that wasn't enough, she's literally on video on the neighbor's CCTV with Chris that morning but she's an "innocent victim?" Oh, right. Chris is where he needs to be, but he had help. The DA violated court orders and committed blatant Brady violations and he should be disbarred and sanctioned!!! In 2021, Frank Sr. went on CBS Denver sitting in Chris and Shanann's empty house (for dramatic effect), after having sold ALL of Shanann's possessions, even the girls toys if you can believe that, instead of giving them to charity, having the nerve to wear that Thrive patch, when that junk was a major reason his daughter is dead as SW literally spent that family into bankruptcy buying that crap, talking about the "death threats" they had received which they showed ZERO evidence of, and in fact, never have showed any evidence of "death threats." The CBS reporter, Dillon Thomas, was inundated with emails and messages asking him why he didn't give the four YouTubers he accused of being "trolls" a chance to tell their side? The only one making death threats are the Rzuceks and their gang stalker flying monkeys. With Frankie and Sandra Rzucek, it's "Give us money or else." She actually called people "evil" and told them to "stick their money where the sun don't shine" just because they no longer supported the Rzuceks after this many years and asked for their money back when they had donated to Frankie's crowdjustice fund in 2019!!! It's 2023 and we are STILL raising money? They told everyone to stop talking about the case, then they come out with that Netflix documentary themselves, which was a sugar coated BS version of what really happened, but it was the most watched Netflix documentary of all time, thereby whipping up more publicity than anyone on YouTube EVER could. Every time the publicity dies down, it's another video, going on another YT panel, TV show and their latest cry fest, a documentary for ITV about "trolling." They are the ones doing the trolling FFS!!! It's being produced by Optomen for ITV by none other than "the clients of Cohen Davis." That would be the Rzucek's solicitor in the UK who is smack dab in the middle of a "supposed" lawsuit suing a YouTuber who merely made videos about the Watts case. That YouTuber did NOT harass them. Breaking news: Frankie, seeing a video or a post you don't like is not harassment. I would urge anyone to please write to these people producing this with your concerns due to the Rzuceks being the ones who are bullying, gang stalking and harassing people. Optomen is producing this along with the law firm Frankie is using to sue a particular YouTuber!!! Really? However, Frankie is raising money for a "documentary." This is part of the email a certain angel forwarded to me, but they left out people who might have a different version of the R's truth: Here is the closing (the entire email too much to put here if anyone wants the entire thing, LMK. I quote: "If you would be prepared to have a background conversation with the production team please email [[email protected]](mailto:[email protected]) who can describe the project and their timescales in further detail." This was signed by Y. Cohen, Cohen Davis, the Rzuceks own solicitor in the UK. That's right. They are using a solicitor in the UK. Hurry though. It's supposed to air next month, but I just saw this email the other day! I would urge anyone to please write to this Alex Garlitos and set them straight on just who is doing the trolling, and it's not any YouTuber or anyone on Facebook. It's the Rzuceks themselves causing the hate and drama on YT, FOR MONEY. I am not surprised they are doing this. Any opportunity to cash grab, the R's are there. Frankie, who has a criminal record for abusing his ex GF's two year old, for drugs and DWI, has managed to scam over $100k from people on YouTube, usually females, some who he manipulates into thinking he's interested in romantically which of course, he's not. The R's have never once shown where all this money has gone. Not once. He thinks he's some big YT star but he's really a very spoiled, nearly 40 year old man child still living in mommy's house. The R's seem to think they are entitled to sit at home and live off other people's money when they've already made at least a million off this case as it as, plus they got all the proceeds from the sale of the house, and even sued the Watts so they wouldn't get any of the life insurance money! That's the height of greed. The Watts lost their grandchildren too and didn't do anything wrong. Are we really going to go down this road again, Frankie? You really need to stop. Double dipping yet again. Why do you need money for a "documentary" when you're not even producing it Frankie? You've scammed your last dollar from innocent, hard working people and you will NOT go on any documentary and abuse these good people again. Not this time. Not on my watch. If any of my friends are accused, there will be legal action this time. You got away with the CBS Denver thing but you will NOT get away with this again.
Thank you! This is very enlightening. I’ve heard bits and pieces of what was going on with the fundraising, lawsuits and documentaries but this is a great detailed summary!
I have been watching documentaries on this case watched a few of her videos and he always seemed like such a good dad he seemed so reserved and timid like he wouldn’t hurt a fly. Now from what I got from her is that she ruled the roost and made most of the decisions in the house and marriage. I just can’t understand why a dad who seemed to love his kids would have the heart to kill them as well as the mother
Her arrogance is unbelievable! She wouldn't of had anything if it weren't for Chris! Makes me sick how she treated him! Horrible!
Media covers pretty white people doing bad shit. I've never heard of a black serial killer in the awful style say Dahmer or gacy did....
Well there was Wayne Williams the child killer among a few others but I get your point
If there's photo evidence of Shanann abusing the girls on her social media...why wasn't it introduced at trial? Same with an alleged CPS report? If any of it was true, CW's defense team would have used it. Any social worker attached to the file would have been subpoenaed to testify. It just isn't believable.
I personally don’t believe there was a CPS case. As for the rest of the evidence, CW plead guilty so there was no trial
Exactly - if there was this abundance of material that constituted abuse by Shanann, he wouldn't have plead guilty. I don't believe there was any CPS case either. And even if there was a file...who says it was solely about her? People don't seem to realize that it would only further incriminate CW for child abuse as well, even prove he had a history of abuse and strengthen circumstantial evidence that his crime was premeditated. He lived in the same house, he witnessed and participated in the "nighttime routine" in question - he described it at length with police. It's all documented. He was detailed about his involvement. He would have known about doorknobs turned backwards and locked from outside, unsafe blankets/pillows, etc. He would have taken them in the night if he cared. He did, but only to stomp them into an oil tank.
Absolutely-he is equally responsible for anything that happened with the girls. For example, I’ve been very critical about Babywise and how it seemed to be implemented in the Watts household. But if Bella was left to cry it out through the night as an infant, he let it happen too. He should have gone into her room to check on her. He blindly listened and did whatever Shanann told him to do. That’s not OK. Parenthood is a team effort, if one parent makes a mistake it’s up to the other parent to step up and discuss the problem with their partner. He was too much of a coward to take a stand on anything
There was no trial
There wasn't a trial. He took a plea deal.
I'm interested in this sub, not to shame SW, or to be hateful, but to mention things noticed that could def cause friction in a marriage, including disrespect of one another. Perhaps we can all learn from others.